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Old 06-20-2012, 09:24 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeyis4dcats View Post
"Hey, act all guilty and stuff."

"Ok. So I'm guilty?"

If you read any of the interviews the actress has done, she watched dozens of murder confessions on youtube.
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in the confession scene? No, if you read the interviews she's done she watched dozens of murder confession videos on youtube.
What does that have to do with it? ALL actors receive direction on how to act in TV/movies (regardless of how many "murder confessions they watch on YouTube"...that's why there are people called "directors"...it's just naive to think otherwise.
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Old 06-20-2012, 09:28 PM   #62
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Simply do not agree. She could easily see taking the credit card as not hurting them, but just helping her on her trip. Just another way for her family to provide for her. Frankly, I don't see that taking the credit card would hurt her family unless she abused using it...it's not nearly as illogical and unconvincing as you claim.
OK. If it's believable for you and you can ignore the fact that using the credit card would have led her parents right to her then the writers did a good enough job.
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Old 06-20-2012, 09:29 PM   #63
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What does that have to do with it? ALL actors receive direction on how to act in TV/movies (regardless of how many "murder confessions they watch on YouTube"...that's why there are people called "directors"...it's just naive to think otherwise.
Because the actress has said she had NO IDEA, NO INKLING, that she was the killer. It would be impossible for her to be directed to act guilty or suspicious without the actress becoming curious as to why.
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Old 06-20-2012, 09:32 PM   #64
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What does that have to do with it? ALL actors receive direction on how to act in TV/movies (regardless of how many "murder confessions they watch on YouTube"...that's why there are people called "directors"...it's just naive to think otherwise.
When are you talking about?

I commented that it would be impossible for her to "act guilty" all series long as some are claiming to have intuited, since the actress was not in any way portraying her character in that manner.

If you are talking about the confession scene, the actress has stated her performance was based upon dozens of videos she watched for inspiration and method.
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Old 06-20-2012, 09:35 PM   #65
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OK. If it's believable for you and you can ignore the fact that using the credit card would have led her parents right to her then the writers did a good enough job.
I also agree it would seem to go against type for her character to take the card. More than likely just a red herring thrown out by the writers they hoped would be overlooked, like all the other plot holes.
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Old 06-20-2012, 10:01 PM   #66
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"Hey, act all guilty and stuff."

"Ok. So I'm guilty?"
Heh. Well put.
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Old 06-20-2012, 10:08 PM   #67
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Because the actress has said she had NO IDEA, NO INKLING, that she was the killer. It would be impossible for her to be directed to act guilty or suspicious without the actress becoming curious as to why.
I gotta disagree here--on a show like this, during the first season pretty much every single person was a suspect... It seems logical that there were plenty times with just about every actor on the show where a director could have said "Play this ambiguously like you could be hiding something"... The whole point was that we had to try to figure out who killed Rosie so especially early on there were plenty of scenes where people were acting suspicious or shady and it turned out they didn't commit the crime.

With a mystery show like this, I think it's totally plausible for directors to give direction that lends itself to an endgame without giving the endgame away. Plus they shoot every take in several ways to have coverage so the actors could just think it's part of the routine.

So it's completely plausible that people got a suspicious vibe from Terry early on without the actress having been TOLD specifically to play those scenes knowing she was the killer. I don't see how those things are congruent at all.
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Old 06-21-2012, 09:49 AM   #68
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I gotta disagree here--on a show like this, during the first season pretty much every single person was a suspect... It seems logical that there were plenty times with just about every actor on the show where a director could have said "Play this ambiguously like you could be hiding something"... The whole point was that we had to try to figure out who killed Rosie so especially early on there were plenty of scenes where people were acting suspicious or shady and it turned out they didn't commit the crime.

With a mystery show like this, I think it's totally plausible for directors to give direction that lends itself to an endgame without giving the endgame away. Plus they shoot every take in several ways to have coverage so the actors could just think it's part of the routine.

So it's completely plausible that people got a suspicious vibe from Terry early on without the actress having been TOLD specifically to play those scenes knowing she was the killer. I don't see how those things are congruent at all.
EXACTLY.
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Old 06-21-2012, 10:22 AM   #69
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Man, you people must think the actor who plays Terry is a complete idiot...
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Old 06-21-2012, 01:10 PM   #70
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I gotta disagree here--on a show like this, during the first season pretty much every single person was a suspect...
Here is an example - the teacher. In order to pull off his character and the misdirection of the plot - he HAD to act guilty. And he did, quite well. So I am supposed to believe the conversation with the director went like this:

D: Act guilty
A: So, I'm guilty
D: Well, no, well, sort of, but, well, never mind.

Come on. Be real. The director(s) of the show tell the actors exactly how to act. Their job isn't to know the plot and "improv" their way through every episode leading their character to the end. They are told the scene, given the script, and instructed on how it should play out. And in this show, the acting (and writing) was phenomenal. Imagine the cast of CSI playing these roles instead of the actors that did. Same show? Not even close.
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Old 06-21-2012, 01:25 PM   #71
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So you don't think telling Terry "Act guilty" might not open up in her mind at least the slightest possibility that she might be, y'know, GUILTY?

Because she insists she didn't have a clue.
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Old 06-21-2012, 03:30 PM   #72
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So you don't think telling Terry "Act guilty" might not open up in her mind at least the slightest possibility that she might be, y'know, GUILTY?

Because she insists she didn't have a clue.
And, of course, actors ALWAYS tell the truth....
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:55 PM   #73
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And, of course, actors ALWAYS tell the truth....
Why would she be lying? What she says makes the writers and/or producers look bad, which is not conducive to future employment.
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Old 06-21-2012, 05:06 PM   #74
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How would one be able to tell if she's lying or not, she's an actress!
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Old 06-21-2012, 05:08 PM   #75
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Why would she be lying? What she says makes the writers and/or producers look bad, which is not conducive to future employment.
She even makes herself look bad..."I did this job for two years, and I didn't have a clue what I was doing!"
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Old 06-21-2012, 10:15 PM   #76
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Here is an example - the teacher. In order to pull off his character and the misdirection of the plot - he HAD to act guilty. And he did, quite well. So I am supposed to believe the conversation with the director went like this:

D: Act guilty
A: So, I'm guilty
D: Well, no, well, sort of, but, well, never mind.

Come on. Be real. The director(s) of the show tell the actors exactly how to act. Their job isn't to know the plot and "improv" their way through every episode leading their character to the end. They are told the scene, given the script, and instructed on how it should play out. And in this show, the acting (and writing) was phenomenal. Imagine the cast of CSI playing these roles instead of the actors that did. Same show? Not even close.
The teacher may have been told to look guilty, because the show wanted him to look guilty at a certain point in the timeline.

The show NEVER wanted the sister to look guilty (Seriously, did anybody anywhere think it was going to go down anything like that?) therefore she wouldn't have been directed to look guilty at any point of the series.

If you tell 10 cast members to play this take looking a little guilty, then they probably all are going to think there's a 10% chance (or whatever) of them being guilty.

I think the fact that she says no such thing should lead us to believe she was never told to act like that.

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Old 06-21-2012, 11:05 PM   #77
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The show NEVER wanted the sister to look guilty (Seriously, did anybody anywhere think it was going to go down anything like that?)
Well, yes, I did read someone who predicted it was Terry, and had a lot of evidence to back it up. But he only figured it out a couple episodes before the last.
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Old 06-22-2012, 08:53 AM   #78
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I think many of us thought Terry was involved; especially early on with the Ames thing.
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Old 06-22-2012, 12:54 PM   #79
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Just completed marathoning my way through both Seasons. Thumbs UP re: the show.
I don't foresee another Season, though. This was perfect. Clear resolution, and a (relatively speaking) happy ending. The case was figured out, Rosie wasn't a parent-hating teen prostitute. Stan didn't kill anyone. He stands trial in a year for the kidnapping/assault charges against the teacher. The family came together (minus Terry, who came apart). Great twists. Time for all to "move on".

I'm glad I didn't follow it week-by-week, being exposed to the poison in the threads by the haters. I could take in the complete story without outside influences, and found it to be compelling from start to finish.
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Old 06-22-2012, 01:48 PM   #80
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I'm glad I didn't follow it week-by-week, being exposed to the poison in the threads by the haters. I could take in the complete story without outside influences, and found it to be compelling from start to finish.
I marathoned through the first season before reading the threads here, then I read the threads as I worked my way through the second season over a few weeks. Although I had some problems with the show, I kind of wish I hadn't started reading the threads here. There was a hatred of the show that built up here (and elsewhere), and it had a negative influence on how I viewed the show, even though I was still enjoying it.

The same thing happened with Battlestar Galactica. The show had its ups and downs, but I really liked it. I think I stopped reading the BSG threads on here at some point, because most of the discussion was about how poor the writing was and how the show had no direction. Many of the complaints were valid, but when you're still enjoying a show it's kind of a bummer to read about how badly it sucks week after week.
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Old 06-22-2012, 02:14 PM   #81
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I think both with this show and BG, a lot of it has to do with what matters to you. Long-term structure and story are very important to me, and both of those shows are ones that not only don't care about that, but seem actively contemptuous of people who do. If you're into moment-to-moment characterization, acting, directing, etc., then cool. It seems to me that BG and The Killing are both shows whose structures are inherently tied to big-picture storytelling, and obviously the people who wrote those shows disagree with me.

The reason I kept harping on the shortcomings of The Killing (and, for that matter, BG) was that if you're going to have a show centered on a single over-arching plot, then that over-arching plot should be central to the show. And when the over-arching plot falls short, it's cause for serious disappointment. And when the showrunner publicly expresses contempt for people who expect the show to live up to its format (which happened explicitly with BG, and implicitly with The Killing), then I guess I take it a little personally that they basically tricked me into watching a show under false pretenses ("They have a plan"; "This is a show about a murder investigation") and then tried to blame me for being disappointed when it turned out to be something else.

But if you were looking for something else altogether and were happy with what you found, then good for you. I hope my disappointment doesn't devalue your satisfaction...any more than your satisfaction devalues my disappointment. We obviously had very different experience with this show (these shows), and that's all right, because we're different people. If I've somehow given the impression that I think there's something wrong with you for liking the show, I apologize. But likewise, I hope you'll accept that there's nothing wrong with me for being disappointed.

I think "poison" and "haters," however, are very unfair ways to characterize somebody who honestly disagrees with you.
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Old 06-22-2012, 03:14 PM   #82
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... I guess I take it a little personally that they basically tricked me into watching a show under false pretenses ("They have a plan"; "This is a show about a murder investigation") and then tried to blame me for being disappointed when it turned out to be something else.
<snip>
... I think "poison" and "haters," however, are very unfair ways to characterize somebody who honestly disagrees with you.
First, I wasn't directing my comments towards you, or anyone specific, so ... nothing personal. I have not read all of the posts throughout the show threads, so I was not aware of your specific complaints about the show.

My use of the term "haters" is just that it has become a common interwebs term. I suppose I could've used "flamers", but that term now seems "so last century".

My use of "poison" is more personal for me, as I mean that when negative (poison) gets into my brain by exposure to outside influences (negative things people say or write), it starts to destroy my "innocence" and infect my thoughts. I couldn't use "viral", as that seems to now have positive connotations -- e.g., you WANT your video to "go viral".

Anyway, as I said, I feel that I got more enjoyment out of this particular series by avoiding the threads until after I could gauge my own unspoiled/unsoiled thoughts about it.

It was indeed about a murder investigation at its core, and how the death of a "nobody*" can have such far-reaching consequences in so many ways.

Each red herring was presented believably, and it was encouraging to see that the central investigators had enough of an open mind to pursue new leads and change their hypothesis of the crime.

Bravo!

* By "nobody", I am referring to Jaime's use of that term while arguing with Ames, just before Terry pushed the car into the lake.
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:26 PM   #83
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Rob, I often agree with your criticisms, but sometimes the shortcomings being discussed don't take that much away from my enjoyment of the show, at least if I'm not reading the threads. Getreal's description of "poison" is what I sometimes experience too. With the negatives constantly being pointed out each week, it starts to "infect my thoughts" and take away from my enjoyment of the show. It also has a tendency to infect the forum, and the show discussions become less about the story and more about the problems with the show.
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Old 06-25-2012, 01:19 AM   #84
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Just finished the 2nd season after a 4 day marathon. After Episode 8 Entertainment Weekly kindly told me who the killer was so that made my watching of the last 5 episodes quite different. I was very surprised when it appeared to be Jamie and wondered if I misread something (after seeing the headline and a picture and trying to burn it from my memory).

I am admittedly a forgiving TV watcher and I thoroughly enjoyed the whole thing. In a strange way I think my enjoyment was enhanced by knowing who the killer was and trying to figure out how it would end up that way.
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Old 06-25-2012, 11:05 AM   #85
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Really enjoyed the ending. I was in the same boat as someone else here mentioned ... when Jaime was revealed it was too early and I knew that something else was up, but I just didn't know what.
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Old 06-25-2012, 12:26 PM   #86
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I liked how the series wrapped up. But I think it will be difficult to come back for a third season for a few reasons.

1. There were a lot of ticked off people after season 1 that didn't come back for season 2. Those that did got a good story, but they came back for the closure. Will they want to start over again with a new story?

2. Other shows with similarly overarching story lines were not able to jump start a new one after the first was done. Twin Peaks comes quickly to mind.

3. While the chemistry between Holder and Linden was wonderful and the most interesting part of the show, it was born of them being thrust together as she was leaving as he was being promoted. I don't know if it's sustainable and interesting going forward.

I will not look at The Killing as 2 seasons where the showrunner lied to us about closure at the end of season 1. I will look at the 26 episodes as 1 good long season of an interesting show that I enjoyed watching.

Yes there were red herrings that led nowhere and loose ends that didn't tie neatly together at the end, but Lord knows there were enough of those in other shows like Lost, that I was still able to watch and enjoy.
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