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Old 05-23-2012, 03:59 AM   #1
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Glee "Goodbye" 5/22/12

It ended the way it had to with regard to Rachel and Finn, but I really wish they'd stop screwing with the Kurt character. He and Rachel belong in New York, and his rejection is just nonsensical.
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Old 05-23-2012, 08:02 AM   #2
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I really liked this episode. I was a little surprised that Kurt did not make it in to NYADA (but Racheal did). I liked that we got some callbacks to the beginning: The original Glee Club singing "Sit Down Your Rockin' the Boat" and (LOL!) Burt singing "Single Ladies"!

We got to see a lot of closure tonight (and some open endings), but what about Mercedes and Mike Chang? They never got their chance to wrap up their story line.
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Old 05-23-2012, 09:22 AM   #3
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This wasn't quite up to the level of some of the more recent episodes for me, but still OK.

My biggest gripe was with the commencement ceremony. I wish they didn't have to turn the whole thing into a New Directions performance. I would have preferred had they interweaved the performance with scenes of a more traditional ceremony. Plus, yes, this is Glee, so the show is about them, but I wouldn't have minded some tacit acknowledgement that yes, there are other students going to McKinley High... read off some non-glee kid names.

I too enjoyed the callbacks to the early days, the "Sit Down You're Rockin' The Boat" and "Single Ladies." (I loved the amused yet horrified look on Kurt's face during that!) They should've found some way to at least insert a bar or two of "Don't Stop Believin'" somewhere in this episode as well, since that's how it all started.

I am still enjoying the Sue the softy. It'll be interesting to see what they do next season with her character, especially since (casting spoiler for next season)
Spoiler:
I'm pretty sure NeNe Leakes isn't returning. She is over on NBC's "The New Normal.")

If you want a character they keep screwing with, it's not Kurt - it's his stepbrother, Finn. I mean, the guy has been seriously psychologically messed up dealing with learning more about his dad. They finally get him to a better place, deciding to do something with his life, and he gets the girl. Now, he doesn't get into The Actor's Studio (not surprising, really), doesn't get to go to NY, doesn't get Rachel, and decides to go into the army because of his dad.

I'm a little troubled by some of what I've read Ryan Murphy says is coming for next season. I'm hoping that this is like a lot of what Ryan Murphy says... complete nonsense.
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Old 05-23-2012, 09:46 AM   #4
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My biggest gripe was with the commencement ceremony. I wish they didn't have to turn the whole thing into a New Directions performance. I would have preferred had they interweaved the performance with scenes of a more traditional ceremony. Plus, yes, this is Glee, so the show is about them, but I wouldn't have minded some tacit acknowledgement that yes, there are other students going to McKinley High... read off some non-glee kid names.
I thought that as well, but I know that if they were to do that, there would be screams of, "Why did they waste our time with these non-New Directions students that just took time away from the other storylines?"

Quote:
I am still enjoying the Sue the softy. It'll be interesting to see what they do next season with her character, especially since (casting spoiler for next season)
Spoiler:
I'm pretty sure NeNe Leakes isn't returning. She is over on NBC's "The New Normal.")
Sue was a "softy" at the end of Season 1 - Figgins was just about to disband Glee Club by cutting its budget when Sue threatened him somehow. Of course, by the end of the Season 2 premiere, she was right back to "I hate Shuster and will try to get Glee Club closed," totally forgetting that she's the only reason it was still there in the first place.

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We got to see a lot of closure tonight (and some open endings), but what about Mercedes and Mike Chang? They never got their chance to wrap up their story line.
What Mercedes and Mike story lines? And speaking of story lines, did they ever say where Puck was headed? If he's still headed out to LA, he and Mercedes can be a separate storyline within the show. As for Mike, I wouldn't be surprised to see Harry in the "Bombshell" chorus on Smash next season.

So let me see if I have this straight:
Rachel - NYADA
Kurt - not sure, but probably NY (but not NYADA, at least not yet)
Santana - apparently going to New York
Finn - he may or may not be in the Army (he never actually said that he had enlisted yet), although it's possible that they transfer him from Fort Benning to, say, Fort Harrison in Brooklyn
Mercedes - in LA, as a backup singer for an independent record label, and taking extension classes at UCLA
Puck - ?
Mike - going to the Joffrey Academy of Dance in Chicago
Brittany - fifth-year (so far) senior
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Old 05-23-2012, 10:51 AM   #5
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I thought that as well, but I know that if they were to do that, there would be screams of, "Why did they waste our time with these non-New Directions students that just took time away from the other storylines?"


Sue was a "softy" at the end of Season 1 - Figgins was just about to disband Glee Club by cutting its budget when Sue threatened him somehow. Of course, by the end of the Season 2 premiere, she was right back to "I hate Shuster and will try to get Glee Club closed," totally forgetting that she's the only reason it was still there in the first place.


What Mercedes and Mike story lines? And speaking of story lines, did they ever say where Puck was headed? If he's still headed out to LA, he and Mercedes can be a separate storyline within the show. As for Mike, I wouldn't be surprised to see Harry in the "Bombshell" chorus on Smash next season.

So let me see if I have this straight:
Rachel - NYADA
Kurt - not sure, but probably NY (but not NYADA, at least not yet)
Santana - apparently going to New York
Finn - he may or may not be in the Army (he never actually said that he had enlisted yet), although it's possible that they transfer him from Fort Benning to, say, Fort Harrison in Brooklyn
Mercedes - in LA, as a backup singer for an independent record label, and taking extension classes at UCLA
Puck - ?
Mike - going to the Joffrey Academy of Dance in Chicago
Brittany - fifth-year (so far) senior
You forgot:

Quinn - Attending Yale

Speaking of Quinn, what was the deal with Quinn & Puck? Was she trying to start a relationship with him or just closing the door on that part of her life with forgiveness?
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:36 PM   #6
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I'm a little troubled by some of what I've read Ryan Murphy says is coming for next season. I'm hoping that this is like a lot of what Ryan Murphy says... complete nonsense.
I haven't seen that...have any links?

Finn is a master of self-sabotage, and he'll do ANYTHING to avoid being happy. There's no reason he can't follow Rachel to NYC, work for a year while honing his applications, attend a bunch of open calls, and maybe land a couple off-off-off Broadway parts. I'm surprised they didn't have Burt step up in his capacity as a congressman to help solve the thing with his father, because it feels like an unnecessary distraction.

I just don't get the creative direction of this show any more. But then, I'm one of those people that feels the decision to abandon the NYC spinoff with Rachel, Kurt and Finn was absurd.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:55 PM   #7
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Next year could be a real mess if they try to split stories between the new New Directions and the graduates. I think they would have been better off with a spin off or just focus on the Glee club with maybe guest star episode from the graduates here and there, but to try to cram it all in one show seems too much.
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Old 05-23-2012, 04:37 PM   #8
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I think what pisses me off the most about the show is that they seem to just create drama out of no where. Last week with Beast being abused by cooter. Where was that even HINTED at before? It's like the writers have nothing left to write with current material so they just make up some BS plot point that's self contained within the episode.
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Old 05-23-2012, 06:07 PM   #9
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Ah, the Marti Nixon effect.

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Old 05-23-2012, 06:12 PM   #10
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Ah, the Marti Nixon effect.

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Noxon. And yeah... I know Joss is all defensive of her, or at least was when Buffy was still on, but I think she's not particularly a good writer (to put it mildly). I personally believe that she singlehandedly screwed up season 7 of Buffy.
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Old 05-23-2012, 08:35 PM   #11
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I think what pisses me off the most about the show is that they seem to just create drama out of no where. Last week with Beast being abused by cooter. Where was that even HINTED at before?
No, it wasn't hinted at, because it was a major plot point a few episodes ago.
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Old 05-23-2012, 09:03 PM   #12
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I think what pisses me off the most about the show is that they seem to just create drama out of no where. Last week with Beast being abused by cooter. Where was that even HINTED at before? It's like the writers have nothing left to write with current material so they just make up some BS plot point that's self contained within the episode.
Bieste.

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No, it wasn't hinted at, because it was a major plot point a few episodes ago.
Yeah, it was a huge portion of "Choke."
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Old 05-24-2012, 11:08 AM   #13
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I just don't get the creative direction of this show any more. But then, I'm one of those people that feels the decision to abandon the NYC spinoff with Rachel, Kurt and Finn was absurd.
I think the problem with the spinoff is, what room is left for dramas? Okay, Fox's recent track record with dramas isn't spectacular, but you could have said the same thing about comedies a few years ago.

You could also ask when Fox would air it, assuming it would air along with Glee in a two-hour block, but I don't think Fox wants to air them on Mondays (overlap with Dancing With the Stars?), Tuesday seems to be "anchored" by New Girl now, and Wednesday and Thursday are X Factor / Idol.

Here's a thought: set one half-hour of each Glee episode in Lima, and the other in New York - spinoff in everything but name.
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Old 05-24-2012, 01:49 PM   #14
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Here's a thought: set one half-hour of each Glee episode in Lima, and the other in New York - spinoff in everything but name.
I read that they will alternate episodes. One full episode in Lima and one full episode in NYC, etc.
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Old 05-24-2012, 03:10 PM   #15
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Spoiler:
Ryan Murphy said that he will find something for everyone to do next year, as long as they want to come back.

So maybe we haven't seen the last of Puck, Quinn or Mercedes.

He did say that he couldn't promise everyone 22 episodes, but that everyone had a job as long as they want one.

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Old 05-24-2012, 05:12 PM   #16
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I came about |---| that far from boohooing on that last song... I wasn't familiar with it, but it was awesome. I'm such a softy for crescendo songs.
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Old 05-24-2012, 05:23 PM   #17
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I read that they will alternate episodes. One full episode in Lima and one full episode in NYC, etc.
The only problem with that is, a lot of fans will be expecting "New Directions" songs in every episode, which is hard to do if they're only in half of them.
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Old 05-24-2012, 05:56 PM   #18
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I've mostly enjoyed this show, but it might be time to give it up. Or at least save up the new recordings until there's a consensus if next season sucks or not.

That said, I'll likely tune in to The Glee Project again which starts June 5.
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Old 05-24-2012, 07:30 PM   #19
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I have long felt this show won't be long-lived. I'll be surprised if it goes past four seasons.
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Old 05-24-2012, 10:28 PM   #20
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I have long felt this show won't be long-lived. I'll be surprised if it goes past four seasons.
And if it does, where does it go?

As I like to say, the show would probably have to pull a 21 Jump Street and move the show to college - i.e. have the rest of the students graduate and go to Lima University, along with Will and Sue after McKinley burns down in (all together now "a cheerleading accident gone horribly, horribly wrong."
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Old 05-29-2012, 09:35 PM   #21
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How about being bold and actually staying in high school and use new characters. Doesn't mean the gone ones can't show up. Just less of them. Like real life.
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Old 06-03-2012, 04:24 AM   #22
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but I wouldn't have minded some tacit acknowledgement that yes, there are other students going to McKinley High... read off some non-glee kid names.
As I was watching, the thing that got me was I was thinking was "Chang... Puckerman... Hummel... Hudson... Berry..." Traditionally, don't most graduation ceremonies go in alphabetical order?
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:53 AM   #23
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How about being bold and actually staying in high school and use new characters. Doesn't mean the gone ones can't show up. Just less of them. Like real life.
It's pretty hard to pull off. People generally like the TV shows for the characters. Lose all the characters, and the appeal goes away.

But there are exceptions. Friday Night Lights did it well. Of course, that show really wasn't about the kids so much. And by that time, the show had a fairly unusual arrangement in the way it was aired.
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Old 06-03-2012, 12:33 PM   #24
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As I was watching, the thing that got me was I was thinking was "Chang... Puckerman... Hummel... Hudson... Berry..." Traditionally, don't most graduation ceremonies go in alphabetical order?
Ours diidn't. We picked who we wanted to walk with. Top 10 (and walking partners) were first.
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Old 06-03-2012, 12:47 PM   #25
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My high school graduation had people in alphabetical order. In college, it was any order you wanted.
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Old 06-03-2012, 01:35 PM   #26
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In college, we handed our name to the presenter and he read it.
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Old 06-03-2012, 03:13 PM   #27
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In college, we handed our name to the presenter and he read it.
Yep, and I imagine the larger HS classes would do it that way too. It would make sense, then, that the glee kids all came up together.
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Old 06-03-2012, 03:36 PM   #28
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I just watched this. In fact, I just watched most of the second half of the season, in a mini-marathon. (A few pre-finale spoilers are below before I comment on the finale episode in the last two paragraphs.)

I quit Glee somewhere around the 1/3 mark of the season this year. I really liked the first season in spite of the show giving in to some of its worst instincts from time to time (fake pregnancy, Sue growing ever more cartoony, etc.). I tolerated the second season even as those bad instincts overwhelmed the show most of the time (too many tribute episodes, needless guest stars, way too much Sue, and complete lack of characterization). This season started with more of the same, and it was just too much. I couldn't even enjoy the music anymore. So I stopped watching, but didn't kill the SP.

Without much to watch this week, I queued up the first of the saved episodes. I had to delete a few along the way for space reasons, so I missed developments like Sue running for office (and I guess losing to Mr. Hummel?), and the introduction of the swim coach character, among other things. Somehow I made it through the first two or three episodes I had saved, which seemed as directionless as I remembered the show having become. (I fast-forwarded through more than a little.) The Ricky Martin episode, for example, was intolerable. Another guest star for no reason, and a great example of how little respect the show has for its characters (Mr. Shue the Spanish teacher doesn't know a lick of Spanish, really? And is so shameless that he shows up to a sing-off in full mariachi regalia? Please). Still, there seemed to be seeds of improvement. Sue actually seemed to exist in the same world as the other characters. The backstabbing and betrayals among the Glee club members, who actually had achieved a lot together and should have been well past all of that a season or more ago, actually did seem to have subsided, and so on.

So I was happy to find that the last half-dozen episodes built on those developments and were, generally, excellent. There were still problems -- Lindsay Lohan and Perez Hilton? gag -- but these were generally minimal. Some of the specific storylines were quite good, for example Coach Beiste's domestic issues and the friendship she developed with Puck as a result. I really appreciated that the show finally allowed the Glee club to become a tight-knit group unafraid to call themselves friends, and where it was obvious that we were done (for now, anyway) with plot constructions to blow the group up from within. The show finally felt like it was about the sense of inclusiveness that it talks about a lot but doesn't always show. The prom episode was silly but a lot of fun. Kurt's and Rachel's NYADA audition episode played out in a slightly unexpected, but believable, way. Sue became a character it was fun to have around again. (Stroke of genius to give her an enemy other than Will and -- OK, this was a stretch -- make her pregnant, which allowed them to soften her character and bring her back to some semblance of reality. It was nice to see her act like an educator and actually root for the kids.) And there were any number of terrific performance sequences throughout. I cringed at the choice of "Paradise by the Dashboard Light" as ND's "vintage" selection at Nationals, but doggone it if it wasn't fantastic. And it was fun to see the group win, even if it were an entirely inevitable development. Plus, lots of chances for Lea Michele to belt songs out to the rafters.

Which brings me to the finale. Earlier this year I would have expected an episode like this to flop, because it seemed the show had squandered any affection we could have felt for the characters by treating them so badly for so long. The emotion the episode had on screen wouldn't have felt earned. But the runup to the ep was generally so good that the whole thing felt genuine, and I was indeed sorry to see many of these characters (apparently) go. And I have to agree with Time critic James Poniewozik that the scene in the car between Rachel and Finn may be the best thing the show has ever done. It was written and played so beautifully that it almost felt like I was watching another show. I guess some people here were not fans of that development, but to me it felt inevitable. Directionless young men like Finn do join the army all the time (and in Finn's case, he has the extra motivation of trying to live out his dad's legacy there). And of course Rachel was going to end up in New York. If there was one thing even more inevitable than ND winning Nationals this season, it was that the season would end with Rachel walking the streets of Broadway in song. The last ten minutes of the finale, starting with the car scene, through the singing goodbye to the group on the train platform, to Finn sliding out of sight as the train pulls away, to Rachel tearfully and then optimistically belting out her song as she lands in New York, were just great. The show at its best.

Next season obviously will be very different than this year, but I'm back in. Here's hoping it can come back as well as it went out this season, knowing and embracing its strengths and keeping its weaknesses in check.
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Old 06-03-2012, 04:50 PM   #29
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Glad you gave the show another chance. The reality is that most shows have their ups and downs. What is silly to one viewer is way cool to another. A lot depends on expectations and mood of the viewer.

To me, the show never lost its way. It meandered a bit with some stories but that is the nature of series versus mini-series. The latter get to focus on story arc. The first cannot or they exhaust the arc too soon.
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Old 06-03-2012, 08:54 PM   #30
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In college, we handed our name to the presenter and he read it.
As did ours, but they still had us line up in alphabetical order. The pronunciation cards had our (non-phonetic) names pre-printed on them, with a number indicating what order you were to line up in.

I would think it would sound somewhat odd to hear them in non-alphabetical order. Also, the programs generally also list the names in alphabetical order, and people follow along to see when to expect their particular graduate will cross the stage.
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