TiVo Community
TiVo Community
TiVo Community
Go Back   TiVo Community > TiVo TV Talk > Now Playing - TV Show Talk
TiVo Community
Reply
Forum Jump
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-30-2012, 08:22 AM   #1
doom1701
I blue myself!
 
doom1701's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 24,110
Star Trek TNG: Sins of the Father (S3E17)

I actually watched this about two weeks ago, and if I don't post about it soon I'm going to totally forget about it.

What I find most interesting about this episode is how it portrays Klingons so differently from what we see in Star Trek VI. Of course, this is because STVI was released about 2 years later. But it's a little unfortunate that the Klingons that we see in STVI couldn't show up a little early--instead, we get the same two dimensional (for the most part) Klingons that have always been in the show.

That said, it was a pretty good episode. The weakest link, IMO, was Michael Dorn--his "dramatic" acting had a tinge of high school drama to it. But getting past that, it was an interesting political intrigue story, gave some background on Worf's character, and it gave Patrick Stewart yet another chance to shine.

While Discommendation now has more of an emotional impact with me, I will say that, when I first saw this episode in high school, I felt the ending was a major let down. All this buildup, and they just turn around?
__________________
Tim
doom1701 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 06:15 PM   #2
gchance
4 8 15 16 23 42
 
gchance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Olivehurst, CA
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by doom1701 View Post
I actually watched this about two weeks ago, and if I don't post about it soon I'm going to totally forget about it.
I really wish you'd post these threads more often, I just finished BoBW Part 1.

Quote:
The weakest link, IMO, was Michael Dorn--his "dramatic" acting had a tinge of high school drama to it. But getting past that, it was an interesting political intrigue story, gave some background on Worf's character, and it gave Patrick Stewart yet another chance to shine.
Michael Dorn wasn't necessarily bad, but put next to Tony Todd, his deficiencies came out. I think as Worf got featured more and more, Michael's acting got better and better.

Greg
__________________
"Too bad she died, would have been an excellent companion." - Anubys

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

5k:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
10k:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
13.1M
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
26.2M
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
gchance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 08:18 PM   #3
JYoung
Series 3
 
JYoung's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 24,326
I have to admit that it originally took me a minute to actually understand the ending and what it meant to Worf (and Kurn).

This episode is kind of unusual as it's starts out as a followup to "A Matter of Honor" and I'm enjoying Kurn being the first officer and busting everyone's chops.

Then it takes a left turn into Klingon intrigue and Worf's family history.

Also, this is relevant as I've been listening to and reading about The Ron Jones Project.
This is the first major Klingon episode not scored by Ron Jones, and you can tell as Dennis McCarthy did a better job of obeying Berman's "sonic wallpaper" directive than Jones did.
And I think the episode suffers a bit because of it.

(Although to be fair, I do think that Berman was correct in overriding Jones for the climax of "Booby Trap".)
__________________
Member of the TiVoShanan Fan Club!

"I aim to misbehave"
JYoung is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 12:30 PM   #4
Fish Man
Phish Food
 
Fish Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: 0.7 miles from the Abita brewery!
Posts: 8,261
Quote:
Originally Posted by doom1701 View Post
While Discommendation now has more of an emotional impact with me, I will say that, when I first saw this episode in high school, I felt the ending was a major let down. All this buildup, and they just turn around?
I was 28 years old, a bit out of high school but I also found the ending to be a letdown. The very dictionary definition of "deus ex machina", is what I thought at the time.

The ultimate resolution to this problem depicted in subsequent episodes was a fantastic recovery, I also thought at the time.

And, to this day, I'm not sure if they actually planned that far ahead, or if the subsequent episodes that resolved the issue of Worf's father being accused of treason and Worf's discomendation were an inspired job of covering for the somewhat lame deus ex machina that they used to resolve this particular episode.

That being said, this isn't a bad episode, and I now hold it in higher regard than I did the first time I saw it since we now know how this open-ended "discomendation" was ultimately resolved later.

I do, however, feel that the acting of all the Klingon characters was a little overplayed. (I. Am. --- ACTING!) It may be that none of the actors or the director had really figured out how to play a Klingon in this context.

This is one of the episodes on the Blu Ray sampler! HD!
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Fish Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 12:48 PM   #5
doom1701
I blue myself!
 
doom1701's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 24,110
I wonder if my feelings on discommendation now are based on the ultimate resolution. Viewed strictly as a stand alone, it is pretty lame.

I watched the two parter where this is all tied up (I know, I'm way behind on "current" episodes yet somehow I found time to watch a two parter that doesn't come up for a couple of seasons), and while the episodes overall blew chunks, they did a good job showcasing Worf, his brother, and his return to honor.
__________________
Tim
doom1701 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 01:47 PM   #6
Fish Man
Phish Food
 
Fish Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: 0.7 miles from the Abita brewery!
Posts: 8,261
Quote:
Originally Posted by doom1701 View Post
I wonder if my feelings on discommendation now are based on the ultimate resolution. Viewed strictly as a stand alone, it is pretty lame.

I watched the two parter where this is all tied up (I know, I'm way behind on "current" episodes yet somehow I found time to watch a two parter that doesn't come up for a couple of seasons), and while the episodes overall blew chunks, they did a good job showcasing Worf, his brother, and his return to honor.
I'd never go so far as to say it "blew chunks". IMHO, apart from the "overacting" on the part of the Klingons that I mentioned in my previous post, I found it to be a good, riveting episode, right up to the end.
  • Act I: Suspense and tension.
  • Act II: Suspense and tension.
  • Act III: Suspense and tension.
  • Act IV: Suspense and tension.
  • Act V: http://www.sadtrombone.com/

Or, put another way:
  • Act I: He wins his case or he dies.
  • Act II: He wins his case or he dies.
  • Act III: He wins his case or he dies.
  • Act IV: He wins his case or he dies.
  • Act V: Oh, by the way, we forgot to mention: There's a third option where the council just folds their arms, turns their backs and says "harumph" and he doesn't have to die. (WTF?)

__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Fish Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 02:03 PM   #7
doom1701
I blue myself!
 
doom1701's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 24,110
I don't think this episode blew chunks. The two parter (Redemption Parts 1 and 2) did, though. Gave us Lursa and B'etor in Part 1, and some lousy technobabble in part 2.
__________________
Tim
doom1701 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 02:54 PM   #8
Fish Man
Phish Food
 
Fish Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: 0.7 miles from the Abita brewery!
Posts: 8,261
Quote:
Originally Posted by doom1701 View Post
I don't think this episode blew chunks. The two parter (Redemption Parts 1 and 2) did, though. Gave us Lursa and B'etor in Part 1, and some lousy technobabble in part 2.
Gotcha.

But the upside is, it gave us Klingon Kleavage!
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Fish Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 03:18 PM   #9
nataylor
Curiously Strong
 
nataylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 23,272
TC CLUB MEMBER
Quote:
Originally Posted by doom1701 View Post
I don't think this episode blew chunks. The two parter (Redemption Parts 1 and 2) did, though. Gave us Lursa and B'etor in Part 1, and some lousy technobabble in part 2.
But Redemption Part 2 had the great scenes with Data commanding his own starship. That's one of my favorite Data bits.
__________________
If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.
iOS Game Center: nataylor
nataylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 03:29 PM   #10
doom1701
I blue myself!
 
doom1701's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 24,110
Quote:
Originally Posted by nataylor View Post
But Redemption Part 2 had the great scenes with Data commanding his own starship. That's one of my favorite Data bits.
I thought I'd love it as well--but I didn't. If I remember correctly, at a critical moment, he decided that only he could operate whatever console had the magic happening. That's not a sign of a good captain.
__________________
Tim
doom1701 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 03:34 PM   #11
nataylor
Curiously Strong
 
nataylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 23,272
TC CLUB MEMBER
Quote:
Originally Posted by doom1701 View Post
I thought I'd love it as well--but I didn't. If I remember correctly, at a critical moment, he decided that only he could operate whatever console had the magic happening. That's not a sign of a good captain.
I don't think so. He's looking over someone's shoulder when the first officer orders the guy away to go make repairs. And at one point the goes to use an unoccupied science station. But he makes the first officer do the rest, even though he could have done it himself much quicker.

Data in Command

__________________
If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.
iOS Game Center: nataylor
nataylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2012, 06:51 PM   #12
Win Joy Jr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Maryland's Eastern Shore
Posts: 1,596
Discommendation was supposed to convey that a Klingon loses all, honor, house, or even being recognized as a member of their race. Given that Klingons held honor above all, a life without honor is a fate worse than death.

Remember, discomendation was not the first option. The entire council was aware of the issue, and we're only forced to act based upon public disclosure of the fact that someone betrayed the outpost.
__________________
"Is it summer yet?"
Win Joy Jr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Forum Jump




Thread Tools


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Advertisements

TiVo Community
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Skins by: Relivo Media

(C) 2013 Magenium Solutions - All Rights Reserved. No information may be posted elsewhere without written permission.
TiVoŽ is a registered trademark of TiVo Inc. This site is not owned or operated by TiVo Inc.
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:08 AM.
OUR NETWORK: MyOpenRouter | TechLore | SansaCommunity | RoboCommunity | MediaSmart Home | Explore3DTV | Dijit Community | DVR Playground |