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Old 10-16-2011, 04:45 AM   #211
lrhorer
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Originally Posted by WO312 View Post
Tivo HD with 2 TB WD, IIRC it is the WDEARS model.

For me, it's easier to just pull the plug until GC updates. Takes me 10 seconds.
Yeah, but you have to do it. If you have an old machine (an ancient 386 will do), you could load Linux on it in a matter of minutes, and run a pair of cron jobs that disables IP forwarding every 10 days or so and then enables it 5 days later. Point your Tivo to the Linux machine as the default gateway, and presto! Your internet connection to the TiVo will be shut down every ten days and then turned back on five days later with no input from you.
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Old 10-16-2011, 04:50 AM   #212
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Is there a way to change my swap to 2GB w/o losing recordings? No way I can lose my recordings.
Yeah, there are a couple of ways. It's easiest if you have a larger hard drive than the one in your TiVo. I know there is an option in MFS_Tools that allows increasing the swap size, but I don't know if it will allow a 2G swap. If so, then that's probably the easiest way. If not, then using tivopart, dd, and pfdisk, one can clone the existing drive while increasing the size of the swap partition.
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Old 10-16-2011, 12:39 PM   #213
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Thanks, irhorer, for all your responses. While I am extremely competent with Windows, I just don't know much about linux. In the old days I upgraded my Tivo's with the linux tools, but nowadays I find winmfs and jfms so much easier.

At this point, I'm just going to stick with unplugging manually. The only issue comes up when I go away for vacations, and I can just disconnect the tuning adapter for that. I also have a TWC DVR as part of my package, so I already have the SDV channels set up to record there as backup for when the tuning adapter doesn't tune on my Tivo. My only recent surprise was when I discovered that TWC had a regular digital channel on SDV. I thought they only did that for the HD channels. I need to see if I can get a list of the SDV channels here.

Edit: or, I may just decide to do the channel fix on a regular basis. Same results, but I can do it on my schedule. The only downside is I have to baby sit it a little to click a few times.

Last edited by WO312 : 10-16-2011 at 03:19 PM.
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Old 10-16-2011, 05:26 PM   #214
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I have one of my TivoHds on a timer. It cuts the power between 4:00-4:01AM This Tivo will usually go 3-4 months before it ends up with S03, so I have plenty of time to do a channel fix on my own terms.

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Thanks, irhorer, for all your responses. While I am extremely competent with Windows, I just don't know much about linux. In the old days I upgraded my Tivo's with the linux tools, but nowadays I find winmfs and jfms so much easier.

At this point, I'm just going to stick with unplugging manually. The only issue comes up when I go away for vacations, and I can just disconnect the tuning adapter for that. I also have a TWC DVR as part of my package, so I already have the SDV channels set up to record there as backup for when the tuning adapter doesn't tune on my Tivo. My only recent surprise was when I discovered that TWC had a regular digital channel on SDV. I thought they only did that for the HD channels. I need to see if I can get a list of the SDV channels here.

Edit: or, I may just decide to do the channel fix on a regular basis. Same results, but I can do it on my schedule. The only downside is I have to baby sit it a little to click a few times.

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Old 10-16-2011, 07:01 PM   #215
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Thanks, irhorer
That's LRhorer, not IRhorer, if you please.

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While I am extremely competent with Windows
A rather dubious distinction, since the operations of which I speak are trivial under Linux and all but impossible under Windows.

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I just don't know much about linux.
IMO, something you would do well to rectify for many reasons apart from a desire to fix your TiVo.

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In the old days I upgraded my Tivo's with the linux tools, but nowadays I find winmfs and jfms so much easier.
How is it "easier", when they won't do what you want, at all?

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At this point, I'm just going to stick with unplugging manually.
That's a little different issue. Hand managing a TiVo partition takes a little understanding of the hardware, not to mention being a tedious and error-prone process. I had to fix numerous errors (made by me) when rebuilding the partitions on my three TiVos by hand. They were easy to fix, but it was a bit annoying nonetheless.

Creating a Linux router is trivial, OTOH, and requires very little time and almost no understanding on the part of the user. Perhaps I should qualify that a bit. It takes very little of the user's time. It does take a while to load Linux (although a basic installation takes less time than loading Windows), but most of that time is not required of the user. The installer just asks a few simple questions. The rest of the time is all automated.

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The only issue comes up when I go away for vacations, and I can just disconnect the tuning adapter for that.
Or you could let the router take care of it for you. Again, it's a trivial pair of two line scripts and a simple edit to /etc/crontab to circumvent the issue.

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My only recent surprise was when I discovered that TWC had a regular digital channel on SDV. I thought they only did that for the HD channels.
I would be very surprised if this were the case. First of all, SD channels take up very little bandwidth. With industry norm rate shaping, there are 12 SD streams in a single QAM dedicated to SD material. After dicounting the more popular channels, that's probably nearly enough to deliver almost all the SD channels on your system. Add to that the fact industry norm rate shaping puts two HD channels and one SD channel per QAM, and I seriously doubt there is only 1 SDV SD channel.
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Old 10-16-2011, 07:10 PM   #216
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I have one of my TivoHds on a timer. It cuts the power between 4:00-4:01AM This Tivo will usually go 3-4 months before it ends up with S03, so I have plenty of time to do a channel fix on my own terms.
Gak!! I would never shut down a system that often:

Code:
TiVo_HD:/# uptime
 00:05:38 up 47 days, 7 min, load average: 3.76, 3.57, 3.41

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Old 10-16-2011, 10:26 PM   #217
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Well, excuuuse me, LRhorer. If you want that to be perfectly clear, I would suggest you have a name of Lrhorer or LRhorer instead of lrhorer.

I'm not going to bother to reply to the rest of your post, but thanks anyway.

Have a good evening, LRhorer.

Although I do have to add, just what the hell does unplugging my Tivo from the internet have to do with hand managing Tivo partitions??? Do you even know what I'm talking about??

Please don't answer those questions.
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Old 10-16-2011, 10:27 PM   #218
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I have one of my TivoHds on a timer. It cuts the power between 4:00-4:01AM This Tivo will usually go 3-4 months before it ends up with S03, so I have plenty of time to do a channel fix on my own terms.
Interesting. So doing a hard reboot daily keeps the S03 away? What does it do for GC??
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Old 10-17-2011, 01:29 AM   #219
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Although I do have to add, just what the hell does unplugging my Tivo from the internet have to do with hand managing Tivo partitions???
You are the one who asked if the swap space could be increased to 2GB without losing programs. It has nothing to do with internet access, but it was suggested it might be a way to clear the issue being discussed.

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Do you even know what I'm talking about??
What in my responses suggests I do not? In one post, you asked if the swap space could be increased without losing videos, which reportedly may eliminate the issue. In the very next post you said you could unplug the internet connection manually, which evidently temporarily circumvents the issue. Either or both can be readily and easily addressed on a box running Linux. The former requires some small understanding of the Apple partitioning scheme and a couple of third party utilities, plus some small amount of tedious work. The latter requires nothing but a pair of tiny, trivial scripts and a simple modification to /etc/crontab. The rest is automatic, and you needn't worry about going on vacation or which channels are SDV.

If third party utilities are able to handle increasing the swap to 2G, then they may be sufficient to permanently alleviate the issue. If not then you are left with choosing one of the four remaining options.

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Please don't answer those questions.
If you don't want questions answered, then don't ask them. I am here for no other reason than to try to assist with this issue. It is not an issue which affects me in any way, and I am not being compensated for my help, good or bad as it may be. The participants of this thread, including you, may take my advice, or leave it. They are all also welcome to seek additional or more detailed help as they deem necessary, or not, and once again this includes you.

Last edited by lrhorer : 10-17-2011 at 01:46 AM.
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Old 10-17-2011, 05:28 AM   #220
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My TiVo has now been unplugged from internet for >72 hours, and GC has not updated. Guess I'll give it another day. ???

Here's the big question: Suddenly this process that used to complete in a short time now takes multiple days. What caused this?

I'm thinking it has something to do with tuning adapters, but I can't prove it at the moment. There is some interaction between the tuning adapter and the database. The TA changes the way TiVo gets the channel map, so maybe the tuning adapter management code mishandles some database lock or something like that.

One time I unplugged both the TA and the internet, and the GC happened within a few hours. I haven't tried that again. Anybody else try unplugging the TA?
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Old 10-17-2011, 06:05 AM   #221
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I found another forum with a thread on this exact same subject.

We are not alone!

Tivocommunity has an automated spam filter which prohibits me from showing you the URL of this other thread.

Go to google, and type in

"force garbage collection & guide indexing"

and you'll find it immediately.
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Old 10-17-2011, 01:59 PM   #222
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My TiVo has now been unplugged from internet for >72 hours, and GC has not updated. Guess I'll give it another day. ???

Here's the big question: Suddenly this process that used to complete in a short time now takes multiple days. What caused this?

I'm thinking it has something to do with tuning adapters, but I can't prove it at the moment. There is some interaction between the tuning adapter and the database. The TA changes the way TiVo gets the channel map, so maybe the tuning adapter management code mishandles some database lock or something like that.

One time I unplugged both the TA and the internet, and the GC happened within a few hours. I haven't tried that again. Anybody else try unplugging the TA?
Yes, I have found that unplugging the TA usually causes a fairly quick GC. Can't remember how long though.

Another way is to do the channel fix. When in the channel lineup screen, press "enter". This causes something similar to guided setup and includes a GC. But it can take a long time for the GC to complete, and it does it during the "preparing to connect" phase of downloading data.
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Old 10-17-2011, 02:50 PM   #223
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Smile Thanks for the Help

I have an original OLED S3 with 1TB and a Motorola TA. On Friday Oct 14th, I started getting the "Program info will run out" message for the first time. I found that the last GC was Oct 5th and the last indexing and cache were about that old, though I don't remember exactly.

Based on comments here, I rebooted, which caused the indexing and cache to be updated, but not the GC. The program info message went away.

On Saturday, the 15th, I set my router to deny Internet access to the TiVo. The calls for update started failing with "Service not found".

This morning, the 17th, GC had completed. I have just turned Internet access back on and forced an update successfully.

Thanks,
Doug
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Old 10-17-2011, 06:40 PM   #224
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I have an original OLED S3 with 1TB and a Motorola TA. On Friday Oct 14th, I started getting the "Program info will run out" message for the first time. I found that the last GC was Oct 5th and the last indexing and cache were about that old, though I don't remember exactly.
Do you have a Tuning Adapter?
If so; when did it go on line?

Stock HDD or upgraded?

Make a trouble ticket with TiVo.
Point them to this thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pninen View Post
I'm thinking it has something to do with tuning adapters, but I can't prove it at the moment. There is some interaction between the tuning adapter and the database. The TA changes the way TiVo gets the channel map, so maybe the tuning adapter management code mishandles some database lock or something like that.

When did the T/A go on line?

Stock HDD or upgraded?

Make a trouble ticket with TiVo.
Point them to this thread.
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Old 10-17-2011, 07:36 PM   #225
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This is ridiculous.

My tivo says it hasn't connected since 10/7 and program data runs out today...but there are things in the to do list until 10/20 and I know for sure it connected since 10/7.



Starting a reboot process again for the umpteenth time.
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Old 10-18-2011, 07:59 AM   #226
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This is ridiculous.

My tivo says it hasn't connected since 10/7 and program data runs out today...but there are things in the to do list until 10/20 and I know for sure it connected since 10/7.



Starting a reboot process again for the umpteenth time.
I don't think rebooting is going to help anything. For a (relatively) quick fix, do the channel fix.

This is how mine first started back in May or so. If you don't get the GC to update, you will eventually get the S03 error, which is not fun to fix. Or at least was not for me. Maybe there are easier ways to fix now - I'd have to go back and read recent posts to know for sure.
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Old 10-18-2011, 09:24 AM   #227
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This thread has been a wealth of information, thank you.

I, too, just used the "block Tivo at the router" trick to get GC to update. But it appears now that the 26+ hours between regular Tivo contact to the mothership is not enough time for GC to update on its own. GC last completed on Friday, October 14, at 9AM, and not again since.

Now I know that I can set the router to allow Tivo access to the mothership only three days a week (which would be one way to fix the problem). But that only addresses the symptom, not the cause.

How do you get GC to once again complete within the time between two guide updates? Or is that just not possible?

BTW, only one of my two identical TivoHDs is exhibiting this behavior. Both are used equally often. Baffling.

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Old 10-18-2011, 09:35 AM   #228
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T
BTW, only one of my two identical TivoHDs is exhibiting this behavior. Both are used equally often. Baffling.
[NG]Owner
When did the problem start for you?

Are both TiVos' connected to a Tuning Adapter?
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Old 10-18-2011, 09:47 AM   #229
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When did the problem start for you?

Are both TiVos' connected to a Tuning Adapter?
I think I may have been one of the first to bring this issue up. Here's my initial post about this from over two years ago. Since then, I've been able to take care of the issue by either rebooting the Tivo, or just letting the Tivo "run out" of guide data. At some point after that "run out" date the Tivo resets itself without any reboot. I presume that GC updates itself at that point (I never checked because I never knew to at the time).

TWC. Cisco Tuning Adapters on both since acquisition. Both have shown this issue intermittently over those two years. Now affecting the basement TivoHD. Family Room HD doing fine. Both upgraded twice, first to 500GB then to 1TB. Behavior only started after second upgrade.

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Old 10-18-2011, 01:54 PM   #230
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I'm curious whether the number of season passes might affect the problem? I noticed that after repartitioning my 2TB/2GB swap drive and adding 100 season passes to fill up the drive for testing purposes, the "loading" time took a very long time --approx 1 hour and started reminding me of the S03 issue. The connection completed successfully for me. My thought is during the loading phase, the TiVo must be trying to resolve all the season passes and wishlist entries against the channel guide it just downloaded, and this might temporarily require a large amount of memory or swap?

Should we take an informal poll of how many season passes we have in our systems? Before the S03 problem on my original drives, I had about 15 give or take.
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Old 10-18-2011, 02:11 PM   #231
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Basement TivoHD: 22
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Neither of these include AutoRecord Wishlists, as I am at work and can only see Season Passes online. I figure each one has at least 3-5 AutoRecording Wishlists to add to those totals.

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Old 10-18-2011, 03:34 PM   #232
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Can you check tuning adapter firmware versions? Who knows maybe they are different... (just being hopeful)

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This thread has been a wealth of information, thank you.

I, too, just used the "block Tivo at the router" trick to get GC to update. But it appears now that the 26+ hours between regular Tivo contact to the mothership is not enough time for GC to update on its own. GC last completed on Friday, October 14, at 9AM, and not again since.

Now I know that I can set the router to allow Tivo access to the mothership only three days a week (which would be one way to fix the problem). But that only addresses the symptom, not the cause.

How do you get GC to once again complete within the time between two guide updates? Or is that just not possible?

BTW, only one of my two identical TivoHDs is exhibiting this behavior. Both are used equally often. Baffling.

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Old 10-18-2011, 03:36 PM   #233
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On Monday, I set up tivoHD #2 with a 2.5 GB swap space to see if that makes a difference. So far GC keeps aborting after a few hours with eMfsTooFast exit codes. I will let it bake for a few days to collect some data.
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Old 10-18-2011, 08:12 PM   #234
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My last GC was with Channel line up fix on October 15 and my GC date never updates on its own. Monday morning Oct. 17 I was installing new Premiere Elite as a companion to my THD. TWC supplied TA USB cable for the new Cisco 1520 was bad so I unplugged the TA USB from the THD set up and switched it to the Elite. This was around 10:30 AM. I took the bad cable to local TWC office and they swapped it out. Returned and put the new USB cable to the TA THD set-up. This was about 12:30 PM. Next day I was checking System Info on the THD and it showed GC completed 7:52 PM Monday evening Oct. 17. I am pretty sure that unplugging the TA USB connection for that time caused the GC to complete. So I think that instead of running Channel fix for a while I am going to try disconnecting the TA USB to THD connection for a while. I have no idea how long I need to leave it disconnected but I think I will start with 2 hours and work my way down to shorter times to see whether this will be reliable.

Slow but steady progress.
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Old 10-18-2011, 10:16 PM   #235
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My first internet disconnect resulted in a GC update in 53 hours. I just had my second update, this one took 72 hours.

I agree with wtherrell - I've been thinking of trying the same thing. I'm thinking that leaving the TA disconnected overnight might be sufficient, and convenient for me. And better than waiting days for a GC update.
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Old 10-18-2011, 10:41 PM   #236
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Today I left the tuning adapter unplugged, and this afternoon GC completed.

I've seen this a couple of times now. Two or three days with internet unplugged while TA is plugged in does NOT produce a GC, but unplug the TA and GC completes within a day.

I'm pretty convinced that the TA is the source of all evil.
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:33 PM   #237
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I hope this problem is fixed in the fall update, if there is a fall update this year.


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Today I left the tuning adapter unplugged, and this afternoon GC completed.

I've seen this a couple of times now. Two or three days with internet unplugged while TA is plugged in does NOT produce a GC, but unplug the TA and GC completes within a day.

I'm pretty convinced that the TA is the source of all evil.

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Old 10-19-2011, 07:38 AM   #238
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I'm at 111 Season Passes right now.
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Old 10-19-2011, 10:43 AM   #239
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I hope this problem is fixed in the fall update, if there is a fall update this year.
I'm not sure we're going to see any more updates. All new efforts are on the Premier family, Series 4.

I hope I'm wrong.
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Old 10-19-2011, 10:44 AM   #240
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My experience:
Time Warner Cable
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2 TB HD from Weaknees

I got the warning message, GC date 10/2. I unplugged the internet and GC updated to current date on the second day (10/18).
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