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Old 10-15-2010, 07:05 PM   #6691
richsadams
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Originally Posted by valkyriesound View Post
OK.. found most of my questions...

But I'm still unclear:
1. Can I use my original expander in a replacement of the internal drive situation with PLUG and Play working?
2. Can I use WINMFS to copy the recordings off of my INTERNAL and EXTERNAL Expander (one at a time) to preserve all my recordings? I doubt there is much on the internal drive and most recordings are probably span BOTH drives currently. Saving my recordings would be great.

Thanks for your help.
Unfortunately it sounds like a failing hard drive, and the most likely candidate is your WD My DVR Expander. Have a look here to see if some of the suggestions help...

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...44#post7553444

You could also try running a couple of TiVo's built-in diagnostic and repair programs called "Kickstarts". Here's a link and a recommend order in which to try each one...

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...23&postcount=2

To answer your questions...

1. If you upgrade the internal hard drive you lose the plug and play ability to add an external drive, however if you follow the directions in the FAQ of this sticky (first post) you can "marry" them using winMFS...it involves connecting both drives to a PC at the same time.
2. Your basic question is can I save my recordings? Yes, if they aren't copy protected you can transfer them (via TiVo Desktop or KMTTG, etc.) to your computer and subsequently back to your "new" TiVo after an upgrade. Recordings are striped across both the internal and external drive, so there aren't any recordings on one or the other, the exception being recordings made prior to connecting the expansion drive. The next logical question is can I combine recordings on the two drives onto a single, new drive and unfortunately the answer is no.

That's probably not what you wanted to hear but hope that helps and best of luck!

Last edited by richsadams : 10-15-2010 at 07:12 PM. Reason: Add absolute URL's
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Old 10-15-2010, 07:15 PM   #6692
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Originally Posted by A J Ricaud View Post
It appears I have a failing H.D. on a S3. It re-booted twice while my wife was watching a recording. I ran KS54--failed the extended SMART test with an error 7.

I also ran the tests on hda, which passed, and hdb and hdc. It said hdb could not be accessed or didn't exist and no hdc. Can someone fill me in on what these mean?

The S3 has an external drive attached. I suppose that you have to run the manufacturer's diagnostics to see if that is the culprit, right?
See my answer to the valkyriesound's post above...looks like you're probably both in the same boat...but misery loves company right?

Best of luck!
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Old 10-15-2010, 11:35 PM   #6693
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Thanks, richadams, I re-ran KS54. " hdc" checked out OK. I ordered a WD10EARS from Dell and will be using WinMFS after moving some stuff and divorcing the ext. drive.
This is the second S3 HD replacement for me. Can't complain too much though, I have 4 originals.
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Old 10-16-2010, 01:40 AM   #6694
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Hey.. thanks for the help.

Big question- I see a method for copying the recordings to the new drive with winMFS for the internal drive. What I'm wondering is if this can be done for the external drive? Otherwise I can copy off just the settings but I'll loose all recordings...

I can't use the Tivo transfer method to save my recordings because stupid Time Warner has copy protection flags on EVERYTHING!

Thanks
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Old 10-16-2010, 02:01 AM   #6695
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Originally Posted by valkyriesound View Post
Big question- I see a method for copying the recordings to the new drive with winMFS for the internal drive. What I'm wondering is if this can be done for the external drive? Otherwise I can copy off just the settings but I'll loose all recordings...

I can't use the Tivo transfer method to save my recordings because stupid Time Warner has copy protection flags on EVERYTHING!

Thanks
Glad to help. Have another look at my answer to your #2 question above. There are no "internal" or "external" recordings. All recordings are spread across both drives. So the short answer is still an unfortunate no to the first part of your big question and yes to the second part.

Read the FAQ carefully and follow the upgrade instructions to the letter and you'll do fine.

Understood about the copy flag issue...very frustrating. However keep in mind that you can transfer any broadcast channel recordings (NBC, ABC, CBS, etc.) as those channels cannot be copy protected.

Happy upgrading!
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Old 10-16-2010, 02:02 AM   #6696
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Originally Posted by A J Ricaud View Post
Thanks, richadams, I re-ran KS54. " hdc" checked out OK. I ordered a WD10EARS from Dell and will be using WinMFS after moving some stuff and divorcing the ext. drive.
This is the second S3 HD replacement for me. Can't complain too much though, I have 4 originals.
Sad, but hard drives don't last forever, although it looks like some you have are doing quite well.

Happy upgrading...again!
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Old 10-16-2010, 08:50 AM   #6697
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Question Can you "marry" an additional 2TB drive, after an existing 2TB is full?

With a TiVo HD, with a 2TB drive already in-place, and filled up, can you "marry" another 2TB drive, and not lose the recordings on the in-place drive?

I'd be using an identical drive, and fitting it inside the case, using the eSATA header on the mainboard, like others have done.

I know this has probably been asked and answered somewhere in this huge thread. But I'd prefer a "fresh" answer.

Even if I can't save my recordings, is it possible to make a 4TB (2TBx2) TiVo HD and not run into problems? I seem to recall that some vendors used to offer this, and then suddenly didn't...
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Old 10-16-2010, 05:59 PM   #6698
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S.o.l.?!

I just tried to upgrade my Tivo HD with a new Hitachi 1TB harddrive. I connected both the Tivo and new harddriveto my desktop (Windows 7). I thought something was wrong b/c my computer wouldn't recognize the drives in explorer or by MFS. So, I went into Disk Management and assigned them a drive letter (did not format). MFS still did not recognize the drives, so I ran MFS as an administrator - now it's recognized. However, when I tried to backup the Tivo drive, it says that it's not a Tivo drive. I plugged the drive back into my Tivo and now I just get a gray blank screen.

After googling my issue, I found a post that said DO NOT use disk management on windows to recognize the drive. Am I SOL now or is there a way to fix my original Tivo drive? TIA.
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Old 10-16-2010, 06:13 PM   #6699
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I just tried to upgrade my Tivo HD with a new Hitachi 1TB harddrive. I connected both the Tivo and new harddriveto my desktop (Windows 7). I thought something was wrong b/c my computer wouldn't recognize the drives in explorer or by MFS. So, I went into Disk Management and assigned them a drive letter (did not format). MFS still did not recognize the drives, so I ran MFS as an administrator - now it's recognized. However, when I tried to backup the Tivo drive, it says that it's not a Tivo drive. I plugged the drive back into my Tivo and now I just get a gray blank screen.

After googling my issue, I found a post that said DO NOT use disk management on windows to recognize the drive. Am I SOL now or is there a way to fix my original Tivo drive? TIA.
Are you using WinMFS, if so, use fix bootpage.
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Old 10-16-2010, 06:17 PM   #6700
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Are you using WinMFS, if so, use fix bootpage.
Just saw that option! Used it and now it's backing up. Such a useful thread. Thanks!
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Old 10-18-2010, 09:18 PM   #6701
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I just upgraded my TivoHD by installing an internal 1TB drive and I didn't see this quirk in the otherwise excellent FAQ or in the replies I read.....

I just replaced my old WD 1TB "green" PC backup drive with a WD 2TB "green" drive and decided to use the old 1TB drive in my TivoHD. Since it was formerly used as a backup drive, it had very few hours on it. During the upgrade, everything worked as expected EXCEPT that WinMFS would not recognize the 1TB drive until I deleted the NTFS partition and left the drive unassigned (as if it was new). Perhaps it would be a good idea to cover this in the FAQ so others who use previously formatted drives in the Tivo don't have to scratch their heads like I did.

Paul
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Old 10-18-2010, 09:33 PM   #6702
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Originally Posted by pgoelz View Post
I just upgraded my TivoHD by installing an internal 1TB drive and I didn't see this quirk in the otherwise excellent FAQ or in the replies I read.....

I just replaced my old WD 1TB "green" PC backup drive with a WD 2TB "green" drive and decided to use the old 1TB drive in my TivoHD. Since it was formerly used as a backup drive, it had very few hours on it. During the upgrade, everything worked as expected EXCEPT that WinMFS would not recognize the 1TB drive until I deleted the NTFS partition and left the drive unassigned (as if it was new). Perhaps it would be a good idea to cover this in the FAQ so others who use previously formatted drives in the Tivo don't have to scratch their heads like I did.

Paul
Windows should not recognize the Tivo drive, if it had, you have to run 'Fix Bootpage' on WinMFS.
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Old 10-18-2010, 09:51 PM   #6703
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You misunderstand. The issue is that WinMFS does not recognize a formatted drive as a destination drive.... just an unformatted unallocated one. The upgrade / transfer process works fine if you use a brand new destination drive. But if you do as I did and use a previously used drive as the destination, you need to delete the partition(s) and put it back to unallocated status before WinMFS will recognize it as the destination drive.

Paul
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Old 10-18-2010, 10:00 PM   #6704
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You misunderstand. The issue is that WinMFS does not recognize a formatted drive as a destination drive.... just an unformatted unallocated one. The upgrade / transfer process works fine if you use a brand new destination drive. But if you do as I did and use a previously used drive as the destination, you need to delete the partition(s) and put it back to unallocated status before WinMFS will recognize it as the destination drive.

Paul
Yes, I know. Just wanted to note the previous post. Basically, remove all previous partition on a non-Tivo drive.

Perhaps these should be added to the first post, if its not already.
FAQ: What do I do now that Windows has recognized my Tivo drive(s)? A: Run 'Fix Bootpage' on WinMFS.
FAQ: How can I get a previous used drive to be used in Tivo? A: Remove all partitions on that drive.
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Old 10-19-2010, 07:27 PM   #6705
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Intellipark is alive and well on a WD10EARS w/a build date of Sept. 2, manuf. in Malaysia--had to run wdidle on for it to even boot. Now running fine.
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Old 10-19-2010, 09:37 PM   #6706
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Intellipark is alive and well on a WD10EARS w/a build date of Sept. 2, manuf. in Malaysia--had to run wdidle on for it to even boot. Now running fine.
Good to know. Thanks for the datapoint!
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Old 10-20-2010, 12:36 PM   #6707
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I'm just jumping in here as I want to replace my original Series 3 drive. I read the upgrade FAQ and see almost no WD drives listed. As I scan through posts, I see some alphabet soup of WD part numbers. I would prefer a WD drive.

Any reason folks are not going with the WD A/V drives (1TB Drive is model WD10EVDS)? Seems like these would be ideal for this purpose yet folks are going for some other models.

Thanks.
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Old 10-20-2010, 05:08 PM   #6708
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I'm just jumping in here as I want to replace my original Series 3 drive. I read the upgrade FAQ and see almost no WD drives listed. As I scan through posts, I see some alphabet soup of WD part numbers. I would prefer a WD drive.

Any reason folks are not going with the WD A/V drives (1TB Drive is model WD10EVDS)? Seems like these would be ideal for this purpose yet folks are going for some other models.

Thanks.
Those are WD drives, like 10EVDS,10EVCS, 10EARS etc. Hard drives are a part, aren't they?
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Last edited by ThAbtO : 10-20-2010 at 05:13 PM.
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Old 10-20-2010, 06:25 PM   #6709
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Those are WD drives, like 10EVDS,10EVCS, 10EARS etc. Hard drives are a part, aren't they?

Not sure what you mean. Yes, they are all WD drives. But is there a difference? Any reason to go with one over another?
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Old 10-20-2010, 06:42 PM   #6710
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They actually are their model numbers, hardly any difference between the models.
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Old 10-20-2010, 07:40 PM   #6711
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Upgrade orig internal S3 drive, not lose shows?

I have an S3 with the original (250 gig?) internal drive, and an external 1 TB drive.

Is it possible to upgrade the internal 250 to a 1 TB dive (for a total of internal+external of 2 TB) without losing the shows?

Some places on the MFS site seem to suggest this is doable, others seem to say this is not supported.
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Old 10-20-2010, 08:20 PM   #6712
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Intellipark is alive and well on a WD10EARS w/a build date of Sept. 2, manuf. in Malaysia--had to run wdidle on for it to even boot. Now running fine.
For anyone else like me who only read a little of the FAQ before jumping in, just wanted to added that my WD10EVDS required wdidle before it would boot, too.

I was expecting it to probably hang on soft-reboots w/o the wdidle, but didn't catch that it might not boot without it.

Your post being on the "Last Page" totally saved my night. Thanks!
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Old 10-20-2010, 08:37 PM   #6713
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For anyone else like me who only read a little of the FAQ before jumping in, just wanted to added that my WD10EVDS required wdidle before it would boot, too.

I was expecting it to probably hang on soft-reboots w/o the wdidle, but didn't catch that it might not boot without it.

Your post being on the "Last Page" totally saved my night. Thanks!
Glad I could help. This site has saved me many times.
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Old 10-20-2010, 09:06 PM   #6714
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I'm just jumping in here as I want to replace my original Series 3 drive. I read the upgrade FAQ and see almost no WD drives listed. As I scan through posts, I see some alphabet soup of WD part numbers. I would prefer a WD drive.

Any reason folks are not going with the WD A/V drives (1TB Drive is model WD10EVDS)? Seems like these would be ideal for this purpose yet folks are going for some other models.

Thanks.
You have been given incorrect information by another poster here.

All those drives have different model numbers because they are DIFFERENT. Look up the model numbers with the search tool on Western Digital's website and you will be able to find the correct information, which will show that each drive is different, and the differences can be very important.

Why on earth somebody here would advise that, basically, a 1TB WD drive, no matter what the model number, is the same, is beyond me.

There are cases where WD will take the same drive and assign it a different model number, but they are few and far between. This usually involves whether it is sold as a "retail boxed drive kit" or a "bare OEM drive".

I use 2TB WD20EADS drives in all of my TiVos. There are other model numbers, such as, WD20EARS, WD20EVDS, and a few others with different letters after the WD20 part. They are all different drives. Some are in completely different drive categories and have very different intended uses. There's the GP line, the AV-GP line, the Caviar line, etc. The cache size can vary dramatically between lines, as well as the RPM speed.

I'd highly suggest doing your own research, and not take what is said in these forums on blind faith. My own recommendations, for the best suited drive is the AV-GP line (rated for 24x7 operation), followed by the GP Caviar line (not rated for 24x7 operation).
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Old 10-21-2010, 03:35 PM   #6715
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I'm just jumping in here as I want to replace my original Series 3 drive. I read the upgrade FAQ and see almost no WD drives listed. As I scan through posts, I see some alphabet soup of WD part numbers. I would prefer a WD drive.

Any reason folks are not going with the WD A/V drives (1TB Drive is model WD10EVDS)? Seems like these would be ideal for this purpose yet folks are going for some other models.

Thanks.
All of Western Digital's GP drives including the WD10EVDS, WD10EVCS, WD10EACS, WD10EADS, WD10EARS, etc. have been and are being used successfully to upgrade TiVo's and specifically the Series3.

TiVo's hard drive requirements are minimal so any extra speed (above 5400RPM) or cache (OEM TiVo Series3 HDD's have 2MB of cache) won't result in any performance enhancement. WD's A/V dedicated series of drives are a good choice as they have the benefit of lowered Auto Acoustic Management or AAM (128) which makes them very quiet howerver TiVo can't take advantage of or doesn't require the other features of those drives. Although the "standard" WD GP drives are quiet out of the box, the AAM can be lowered to equal the A/V drive's specifications by using a program called hddscan.

The reason these drives were removed from the recommended list for now is due to WD's proprietary Intellipark feature that allows the drives to spin down and park the heads when they are idle. Since TiVo drives are recording 24/7 the "feature" is never utilized but because of it these drives can hang at the initial boot, after a software update or a menu restart. To address this a special program, wdidle3.exe, has to be run to adjust or disable the timeout of the Intellipark feature. FWIW it appears that WD GP drives manufactured after mid September 2010 no longer require the adjustment.

Everything else you need to know can be found in the FAQ and if you follow the instructions to the letter you shouldn't have any problems upgrading your Series3 but if you have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Happy upgrading!

Last edited by richsadams : 10-21-2010 at 04:24 PM. Reason: Tyop…d'oh!
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Old 10-21-2010, 03:50 PM   #6716
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Rich, you are not allowed to take any more time away from the forum . It can get ugly in here without you .

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Old 10-21-2010, 04:04 PM   #6717
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I have an S3 with the original (250 gig?) internal drive, and an external 1 TB drive.

Is it possible to upgrade the internal 250 to a 1 TB drive (for a total of internal+external of 2 TB) without losing the shows?
Unfortunately the answer is no with respect to the recordings. However you can transfer any non-copy protected recordings to your computer using TiVo Desktop, KTTMG or one of the other third-party programs and then return them to your "new" TiVo after the upgrade.

After upgrading the internal drive your external drive can no longer be connected via plug and play, however you can use it if you marry or "bless" the external drive during the upgrade process.

All of the info for everything you want to do is included in the FAQ, but as mentioned in the previous post, don't hesitate to ask any questions that might arise.
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Old 10-21-2010, 04:07 PM   #6718
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Rich, you are not allowed to take any more time away from the forum . It can get ugly in here without you .

Robb
Understood. It'll never happen again...at least until next time.
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Old 10-21-2010, 07:39 PM   #6719
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Understood. It'll never happen again...at least until next time.
Now that you're back (I was wondering what was going on around here), could you answer this one for me, please?

http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/sho...65#post8186165
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Old 10-21-2010, 08:17 PM   #6720
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With a TiVo HD, with a 2TB drive already in-place, and filled up, can you "marry" another 2TB drive, and not lose the recordings on the in-place drive?

I'd be using an identical drive, and fitting it inside the case, using the eSATA header on the mainboard, like others have done.

I know this has probably been asked and answered somewhere in this huge thread. But I'd prefer a "fresh" answer.
Even if I can't save my recordings, is it possible to make a 4TB (2TBx2) TiVo HD and not run into problems? I seem to recall that some vendors used to offer this, and then suddenly didn't...
I don't know for sure but IIRC it can't be done due to a Kernal limit or Apple partition issue, but I can't recall if it's that or something else. FWIW if it were possible I don't know why you'd lose any recordings since you're just blessing a second drive.

Here's a post by someone that installed two 1TB drives inside his four TiVo HD's:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...22#post7348722

You might want to check with the OP to see if he ran into any issues.

Then it's probably best to check in with Spike at mfslive.org

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful, but if you get an answer one way or another, it would be great if you could post the details! TIA.
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