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Old 04-02-2010, 12:56 AM   #1
Phasers
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TiVo Premiere is the worst piece of CRAP I have ever seen.

To copy my post from the 'bugs' thread:

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Mine is completely unusable (XL). I plugged it in 3 hours ago and after literally 7 or 8 reboots I was finally able to complete guided setup.

It downloaded a software update took another 30 min to install it, then rebooted (SLOOOOOW btw).

Anyways got to the main TiVo menu, switched to the classic menu. Been stuck in a reboot loop ever since. It reboots to a grey screen, if I hit tivo button it shows classic menu text only over the grey background. Soon as I select another option, it reboots again. It is currently on its 5th- edit: 6th, edit: 7th reboot.

I'm seriously about to return it...

(btw i'm OTA only, no cable or cable cards)

WHY DO EACH OF THESE REBOOTS TAKE OVER 10 MINUTES?
So total, I have had over 15 reboots, can't use the damn thing. And to think I just shelled out over $800 to upgrade my series 3 and add lifetime.

I'm so friggin pissed right now
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Old 04-02-2010, 01:01 AM   #2
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Some small percentage of all DVRs -- TiVoHD, Series3, Premiere, Moxi, etc -- are defective or damaged in distribution. Sounds like you got a dud.
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Old 04-02-2010, 01:05 AM   #3
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I'm still waiting for a proper pairing of my cable card, so I haven't been able to use my TiVo much yet, but I agree with much of your thread... I haven't had any reboot issues, but everything is very slow. This is my first TiVo box, so I don't know what is normal to expect, but close to 10 minutes every time it boots up just seems ridiculous. What exactly is it doing??? So far this feels like one of most sluggish devices that I have ever used.
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Old 04-02-2010, 01:14 AM   #4
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You shouldn't need to reboot the TiVo on a regular basis. Reboots should only occur during software reboots and when enabling external storage.

I have timed my reboots at six minutes. TiVo checks all of its code to make sure it is unmodified and that is responsible for the bulk of the bootup time.

As far as performance, all TiVos are slower for the first 48 hours or so while the initial guide databases are created and indexed in the background. Search results and browse TV will not show complete results until that is done.
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Old 04-02-2010, 01:22 AM   #5
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I'm so friggin pissed right now
No... seriously... what's the real problem? No way you can be 'so friggin pissed' over not being able to record 'Dancing with the Stars' or 'Oprah' tonight...

You lost your job today?
One of your kids was in a serious car accident?
You got diagnosed with cancer?

No way you can be so upset over what is obviously a hardware problem with your Tivo... which you can easily return and get a new one...
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Old 04-02-2010, 02:16 AM   #6
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My first TiVo HD couldn't make it through guided setup; it kept rebooting at different points. I realized something must be wrong with it so I contacted amazon, returned it and got a new one. No problems after that.
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Old 04-02-2010, 09:47 AM   #7
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Definitely sounds like you got a dud out of the box. After seeing the complaints on the board, I was starting to get seriously worried about the two boxes that were sitting in my dining room waiting for me to hook them up. I hooked up the first one last night and have really not had any problems. Its on antenna. The only reboots have been the two during setup and they told me it was going to reboot. Of course, I still haven't called Verizon to get cable cards, but so far so good.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:08 AM   #8
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I set mine up last night. It took a total of about two-hours from start to finish - and I love it. I've been in the TiVo camp since 1999 and this one is a winner. Sluggish at first last night - but this morning it flew as I set season passes, searched, and all the usual functions you'd use with a TiVo. It's only going to get better with furture updates, but for now - it's really nice.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:24 AM   #9
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Ahh, the trials and tribulations of the "instant gratification" personality type.

Doesn't work to troubleshoot with the company upon purchase if things don't work --nay, nay, the device = crap, and nobody can tell them otherwise.
Doesn't go through a logical procedure of tech support, instead, goes off half-cocked like a pistol with a hair-trigger.
Doesn't ask questions in the forum like "Hey, is this you guys' experience?" to compare. No, the new device must suck, and their lives are ruined.

If I were the OP, sure, I'd be disappointed. But I'd also be calm, get a grip, and go through the normal steps of finding out what the issue might be, or whether or not I'm the only user to have those issues.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:28 AM   #10
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Ahh, the trials and tribulations of the "instant gratification" personality type.

Doesn't work to troubleshoot with the company upon purchase if things don't work --nay, nay, the device = crap, and nobody can tell them otherwise.
Doesn't go through a logical procedure of tech support, instead, goes off half-cocked like a pistol with a hair-trigger.
Doesn't ask questions in the forum like "Hey, is this you guys' experience?" to compare. No, the new device must suck, and their lives are ruined.

If I were the OP, sure, I'd be disappointed. But I'd also be calm, get a grip, and go through the normal steps of finding out what the issue might be, or whether or not I'm the only user to have those issues.
Yes sir. It's completely unreasonable for a customer to shell out hundreds of dollars for something, plug it in, and expect it to work.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:29 AM   #11
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Return it before the 30 days are over.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:44 AM   #12
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Yes sir. It's completely unreasonable for a customer to shell out hundreds of dollars for something, plug it in, and expect it to work.
Actually, it's completely unreasonable for a customer to buy something, plug it in, and if it doesn't work instantly, call the product crap rather than going through the logical steps of

1)Calling customer service/tech support
2) (Since the customer in this case understands and is a member of Internet forums) Checking with your pals on the Internet forum to see if there might be something you did incorrectly when setting up, or to see if others are having the same experience
3)Taking a deep breath, and acknowledging that EVERY product sold to man has at least a 1% defect rate, which sucks, but doesn't make the product crap. Heck, I guarantee you that a percentage of them get drop-kicked in shipping; would that be Tivo's fault?

I've called products crap before --but I haven't done so without checking into a few more variables than "It didn't work for me, therefore it must be CRAP". Perhaps it's because I worked in retail in a former life, but I think the OP's conclusion is decidedly premature, as well as a poor way of getting help.

Tivo also has a customer support line for a reason --they know that like everyone else, they won't have a 100% perfection rate. The sign of a good product and company is more than what happens when you open the box --it's what happens when you contact Tivo, and it doesn't look like the OP even tried to do this before making a broad, blanket statement.

P.S. RoyK, I understand your situation (having read about it), which I believe is different than the OP's, and you have a right to be disappointed. However, you've also gone through the steps required; it doesn't appear like this is what happened here, and I don't think it compares.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:54 AM   #13
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... However, you've also gone through the steps required; it doesn't appear like this is what happened here, and I don't think it compares.
I had the exact same experience with not one but two TiVoHDs. The first wouldn't boot. The second crashed on the first day and wouldn't boot after that. I know exactly how the OP feels and he's justified in feeling that way.

To the OP - send it back to where ever you got it.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:55 AM   #14
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surprise, sometimes tech churns out a lemon. Just contact Tivo and have them send you a new one. Don't call it a piece of crap just because you got a bad one - it's obviously not supposed to be like that.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:04 AM   #15
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I'm still waiting for a proper pairing of my cable card, so I haven't been able to use my TiVo much yet, but I agree with much of your thread... I haven't had any reboot issues, but everything is very slow. This is my first TiVo box, so I don't know what is normal to expect, but close to 10 minutes every time it boots up just seems ridiculous. What exactly is it doing??? So far this feels like one of most sluggish devices that I have ever used.
I was having issues with pairing and it was solved with something called a "Staged Hit". I have no idea what that is, but it worked for three different cablecards here. This is what the Comcast CSR suggested, and it worked.

Insert the cablecard. Let it sit. It might need a firmware update. If so, it will start automatically and will run for maybe 15-40 minutes. Just let it sit.

The cablecard also needs to download channel data from your provider. This is the acquiring channels screen. Let it sit.

After that, in my case, Comcast cablecards come programmed to recieve digital locals. So after the acquiring part is done, I can test channels and get those locals through the card. I can't get other digital cable channels, CNN, ESPN, etc. At this point, I also lose some lower analog channels for some reason while the cablecard is inserted. It needs pairing now.

Call Comcast and give the SN and Host ID, and ask for a "Staged Hit".

I did all that for three cablecards and my TiVos are all running like a top.

Yes, they are a bit slow at first boot and for a while afterward. I've owned many TiVos, this is expected. As mentioned by bkdtv, after a day or two, when all the indexing and whatever goes through, they are zippy. Mine are running great. Menus are building much faster and switches between the HD and older interfaces are instant. Although I will be glad to see HD throughout the menus when that rolls out.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:10 AM   #16
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Actually, it's completely unreasonable for a customer to buy something, plug it in, and if it doesn't work instantly, call the product crap rather than going through the logical steps of

1)Calling customer service/tech support
2) (Since the customer in this case understands and is a member of Internet forums) Checking with your pals on the Internet forum to see if there might be something you did incorrectly when setting up, or to see if others are having the same experience
3)Taking a deep breath, and acknowledging that EVERY product sold to man has at least a 1% defect rate, which sucks, but doesn't make the product crap. Heck, I guarantee you that a percentage of them get drop-kicked in shipping; would that be Tivo's fault?

I've called products crap before --but I haven't done so without checking into a few more variables than "It didn't work for me, therefore it must be CRAP". Perhaps it's because I worked in retail in a former life, but I think the OP's conclusion is decidedly premature, as well as a poor way of getting help.

Tivo also has a customer support line for a reason --they know that like everyone else, they won't have a 100% perfection rate. The sign of a good product and company is more than what happens when you open the box --it's what happens when you contact Tivo, and it doesn't look like the OP even tried to do this before making a broad, blanket statement.

P.S. RoyK, I understand your situation (having read about it), which I believe is different than the OP's, and you have a right to be disappointed. However, you've also gone through the steps required; it doesn't appear like this is what happened here, and I don't think it compares.
I didn't want to reply but after reading this post....

I'm sorry sir, but RoyK shelled out $800 plus time and aggravation to setup his new Tivo. He has a right to be pissed.

This post has the typical attitude of Tivo to their customers, something I have experienced in the past. I find it amusing, after reading all the posts describing the premiere's functionality, how most of Tivo apologists will bend over backwards to defend the premiere despite the evidence.

No one should ever be told by a company, or by anyone on this board, that they should except less than stellar customer service and product quality. Some consumers (like RoyK) expect companies to live up to their promises and sadly most others accept poor quality and service, and keep coming back for more.

"Thank you sir! May I have another!", The cry of the Tivo apologist!
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:16 AM   #17
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I had the exact same experience with not one but two TiVoHDs. The first wouldn't boot. The second crashed on the first day and wouldn't boot after that. I know exactly how the OP feels and he's justified in feeling that way.
You and I will agree to disagree, then.

I've owned a lot of computer gear and other tech. equipment. I've had some crap, though I've been fortunate enough to not have too much of it. And, I admit the Tivo Premiere XL will be my first Tivo, though not my first DVR.

You won't be able to convince me that it's okay to expect a perfect ten out-of-box experience every time on every product. I also believe that Tivo has the right to be given a chance to make it right with the customer when a problem occurs, which apparently hasn't happened yet because it sounds like the customer hasn't called them yet.

Until I find out that more people are having this experience with this particular model of Tivo, I'll reserve my judgment on calling this very new product crap. I like to think that one experience, or even the OP's one, plus your two, does not make up the whole picture --I'll wait for a few more..
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:20 AM   #18
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I didn't want to reply but after reading this post....

I'm sorry sir, but RoyK shelled out $800 plus time and aggravation to setup his new Tivo. He has a right to be pissed.

This post has the typical attitude of Tivo to their customers, something I have experienced in the past. I find it amusing, after reading all the posts describing the premiere's functionality, how most of Tivo apologists will bend over backwards to defend the premiere despite the evidence.

No one should ever be told by a company, or by anyone on this board, that they should except less than stellar customer service and product quality. Some consumers (like RoyK) expect companies to live up to their promises and sadly most others accept poor quality and service, and keep coming back for more.

"Thank you sir! May I have another!", The cry of the Tivo apologist!
If you think tech rolls out with 100% perfection rate, you're dreaming. It happens to all tech, not just Tivo. He has a right to be upset that he can't use it right now, but that's how tech goes - and he'll get a new one ASAP when he calls them. Suck it up. He didn't say "my premiere isn't working!" he said "the premiere is a piece of crap" - which are two different statements.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:21 AM   #19
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This post has the typical attitude of Tivo to their customers, something I have experienced in the past. I find it amusing, after reading all the posts describing the premiere's functionality, how most of Tivo apologists will bend over backwards to defend the premiere despite the evidence.

No one should ever be told by a company, or by anyone on this board, that they should except less than stellar customer service and product quality. Some consumers (like RoyK) expect companies to live up to their promises and sadly most others accept poor quality and service, and keep coming back for more.

"Thank you sir! May I have another!", The cry of the Tivo apologist!
I can't defend something I've owned for less than twelve hours. What I'm defending is a model of retail. That model is

1)A customer has a right to a functional product.
2)If the product isn't functional, the customer has a right to call customer service. It is customer service's job to work to solve the problem, and, if they cannot, repair the product to meet expectations, replace the product to meet them, or offer a refund. If they fail to do this, then yes, they have failed the customer.

RoyK has this right, as my previous post stated. He went through ALL the troubleshooting process with Tivo. He also has a right to be upset. But his experiences are NOT the same as the original poster's as he claims.

In comparison, the original poster hasn't even CALLED Tivo yet, from what he/she has told us.

Also note that RoyK's failed products are not Tivo Premiere units, so the experience may OR may not be the same. Too early to tell.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:44 AM   #20
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What I'm defending is a model of retail. That model is

1)A customer has a right to a functional product.
2)If the product isn't functional, the customer has a right to call customer service. It is customer service's job to work to solve the problem, and, if they cannot, repair the product to meet expectations, replace the product to meet them, or offer a refund. If they fail to do this, then yes, they have failed the customer.
Like you, I wouldn't have jumped from opening the box to declaring it crap without passing through a few of your steps.

BUT....I repeat my drone from another thread: a Tivo is sold both explicitly and implicitly as an appliance, not as another piece of tech that may or may not work.

The OOTB experience is very important, and if the new Premiere is slow to start, that will affect the way people see Tivo. In my opinion, adding new features and changing the interface should never be an excuse for a machine becoming more complicated or less responsive at the user end.

Remember, Tivo became what it is because of its implementation of a revolutionary idea, not just the idea itself. In that, it's a lot like the iPod. Can you imagine the outcry if the new iPad takes a couple of minutes to boot and lags when you use the touchscreen?

(Note: I don't own a Premiere myself, so I'm only posting as a hypothetical and/or what I read here.)

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Old 04-02-2010, 11:44 AM   #21
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I also believe that Tivo has the right to be given a chance to make it right with the customer when a problem occurs ...
Exactly. It's sort of like leaving someone negative feedback on eBay without giving them a chance to rectify the situation.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:47 AM   #22
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whatever happened to SixSigma?
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Old 04-02-2010, 01:58 PM   #23
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So far the four I've setup have been excellent. Under an hour for each from plugging it in to finishing the Service update. all four boxes are noticeably faster than my S3/TiVoHD boxes. I'll try and setup two more tonight. One more on FIOS and one OTA only.
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:19 PM   #24
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Yes sir. It's completely unreasonable for a customer to shell out hundreds of dollars for something, plug it in, and expect it to work.
yeah - that would never happen with a Moxi box
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:22 PM   #25
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yeah - that would never happen with a Moxi box
you've got to be kidding me. that will happen with ANY device. There's not even 100% error-free rate on electric toothbrushes.
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:24 PM   #26
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I'm sorry sir, but RoyK shelled out $800 plus time and aggravation to setup his new Tivo. He has a right to be pissed.!
Royk did not have the problem in this thread = maybe if you spent more time figuring out ACTUAL facts versus just bashing on "TiVo apologists" you could make relevant posts that add actual value to the conversation.
Or what the heck - be like me and just make silly posts that have little bearing on anything really going on - I must admit that is way easier and way less aggravating.
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:25 PM   #27
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you've got to be kidding me. that will happen with ANY device. There's not even 100% error-free rate on electric toothbrushes.
all my electric toothbrushes have worked great so they do have 100% error free rate
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:27 PM   #28
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all my electric toothbrushes have worked great so they do have 100% error free rate
for you. you're not a mass of people.
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:31 PM   #29
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for you. you're not a mass of people.
just because my diet is working is no reason I don't count
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:43 PM   #30
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just because my diet is working is no reason I don't count
you're silly
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