TiVo Community
TiVo Community
TiVo Community
Go Back   TiVo Community > Forum Extras > TiVo Search Feedback - Beta Release (Archive)
TiVo Community
 
Forum Jump
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old 05-04-2009, 12:24 AM   #1
tt881
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 21
TiVo Search vs. Privacy

It is not at all obvious why most (if not all) of the primary promoted features of the new TiVo Search could not be provided without requiring opt-in status (e.g., spilling of Now Playing contents back to TiVo) from users.

While lack of opt-in would obviously negate the ability to make suggestions on a history-associated basis, the other broad, new, search capabilities could still be made available.

Given the understanding that TiVo's revenue model is now heavily oriented toward the monetization of detailed user activity data, above and beyond the fees that users pay for TiVo equipment and services, is it being too skeptical to assert that the opt-in requirement in TiVo Search appears to be primarily designed to try encourage opt-in selections from persons concerned about their privacy who would not ordinarily be willing to opt-in?
tt881 is offline  
Old 05-04-2009, 12:27 AM   #2
dswallow
Save the Moderatоr
 
dswallow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Long Branch, NJ, USA
Posts: 49,218
TC CLUB MEMBER
Because that the information is transmitted to TiVo at all is why they want you to opt in in order to permit that to happen; that's all it is. It's basically necessary because of the high paranoid levels of some members of society and their propensity to sue everyone all the time as a pastime.
__________________
¯\_(ツ)_/¯****************
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
dswallow is offline  
Old 05-04-2009, 01:09 AM   #3
bkdtv
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DC Metro Area
Posts: 7,902
Keep in mind TiVo Search is not run from your box. It is run from remote servers. Your box only displays the server output.

Could a future version of the TiVo software include a version of TiVo Search that runs direct from the box, so a remote server would not need access to your lineup, season passes, To Do List, etc? Possibly. But that's not the current implementation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tt881 View Post
Given the understanding that TiVo's revenue model is now heavily oriented toward the monetization of detailed user activity data, above and beyond the fees that users pay for TiVo equipment and services, is it being too skeptical to assert that the opt-in requirement in TiVo Search appears to be primarily designed to try encourage opt-in selections from persons concerned about their privacy who would not ordinarily be willing to opt-in?
Resale of anonymous viewing information and other technology revenues amounted to less the one-nineth the subscription revenues in FY2009. While I'm sure TiVo would say that it's an important part of their business, it's also a small part of their business.

Last edited by bkdtv : 05-04-2009 at 01:17 AM.
bkdtv is offline  
Old 05-06-2009, 09:13 AM   #4
nrc
Cracker Soul
 
nrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Living in a four letter world.
Posts: 2,428
TiVo doesn't need you to opt in for their data gathering activity. They only need you not to opt out. What TiVo sells is anonymous, aggregated data. Their privacy policy states that even if you opt in, "TiVo will not sell or otherwise disclose your Personally Identifiable Viewing Information to Third Parties (as defined in Section 3.1) without your express consent."

TiVo Search is aware of what is in your now playing list and what you have scheduled. If you search for something that is already scheduled to record it will show that in TiVo Search. If you search for something that exists in your Now Playing it will offer the option to play the program now.

Since TiVo Search is running from TiVo's servers it needs to pass that information back to TiVo for those features to work. Maybe someday they'll offer a version that allows features that require that information to be gracefully dropped but I doubt that's a top priority.
__________________

Not entirely square
nrc is online now  
Old 05-06-2009, 09:47 AM   #5
JohnDiamant
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 14
I'd heard that the reason TiVo search beta ran on their servers instead of locally was *because* it is in beta (running from the server makes frequent code updates much easier). Hopefully, once the beta completes, the need for opt-in will also disappear.
JohnDiamant is offline  
Old 05-06-2009, 10:10 AM   #6
wmcbrine
Resistance Useless
 
wmcbrine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 9,111
AFAICT, the reason it runs on their servers is because it's an HME app. None of those run on the TiVo. Theoretically, they could, but the TiVo is underpowered. And TiVo Inc. likes to write their HME apps in Java, which isn't present on the TiVo boxes last I checked. There's only native code (C or C++), and TCL (using an interpreter built into tivoapp).
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wmcbrine is online now  
Old 05-06-2009, 10:27 AM   #7
dswallow
Save the Moderatоr
 
dswallow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Long Branch, NJ, USA
Posts: 49,218
TC CLUB MEMBER
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDiamant View Post
I'd heard that the reason TiVo search beta ran on their servers instead of locally was *because* it is in beta (running from the server makes frequent code updates much easier). Hopefully, once the beta completes, the need for opt-in will also disappear.
The content being searched by that app could never be copied onto everybody's TiVo to have the search be performed locally, evenif the TiVo's CPU, memory and disk I/O performance could allow it to do so in a timely manner; that necessitates sending the search elsewhere to be performed, and that's all the "opt-in privacy agreement" is about.

And as the app is HME, it runs elsewhere, and thus needs to save configuration info elsewhere, too, so any persistent data between invocations of the app needing to be maintained is kept around.
__________________
¯\_(ツ)_/¯****************
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
dswallow is offline  
Old 05-08-2009, 10:36 AM   #8
JohnDiamant
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 14
If the search app could run locally, it could send search terms which didn't include personally identifiable information (PII) to TiVo's servers and further filter the results locally by the PII. There's no need for all the searcheable data to reside locally. As an example, it could send channel line up designator to servers, but locally filter on channels I receive or favorites (since these are tied to a specific TiVo unit). On the other hand, if changing from server-based to local execution would require a complete application rewrite, that would be pretty unattractive to TiVo.
JohnDiamant is offline  
 
Forum Jump




Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Advertisements

TiVo Community
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Skins by: Relivo Media

(C) 2013 Magenium Solutions - All Rights Reserved. No information may be posted elsewhere without written permission.
TiVoŽ is a registered trademark of TiVo Inc. This site is not owned or operated by TiVo Inc.
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:07 PM.
OUR NETWORK: MyOpenRouter | TechLore | SansaCommunity | RoboCommunity | MediaSmart Home | Explore3DTV | Dijit Community | DVR Playground |