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Old 08-18-2008, 05:02 AM   #1
danjw1
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Series 3 and the MCard?

Does the series 3 support using a single mcard with both tuners?

I am concerned because I am returning my tivo for a warranty replacement and they said they would send me a series 3 instead. I asked if the m-card would work properly, and the csr said yes. But, I was just checking the cable card faq thread and it says it doesn't. Do I need to have Tivo send me an HD so I don't have to pay a monthly few for a second cable card?

Thanks,

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Old 08-18-2008, 05:06 AM   #2
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The m-card will work on the S3, but only as a single tuner. Therefore you would need 2.

However, the S3 may be worth the extra cost for the added benefits (storage, remote, etc.).
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Old 08-18-2008, 07:51 AM   #3
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I have an S3 running with 2 M-cards with no problems.
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Old 08-18-2008, 07:58 AM   #4
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if it was me - I would ask for another TiVo HD
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Old 08-18-2008, 08:01 AM   #5
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i agree a TiVo HD with one M-Card so you reduce the chance of having the cards not communicating with each other

one card should elimate that problem
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Old 08-18-2008, 08:47 AM   #6
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I wouldn't accept a S3 for a warranty replacement for a TiVo HD. They are just trying to dump the remaining S3 stock they have most likely.
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Old 08-18-2008, 11:01 AM   #7
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i agree a TiVo HD with one M-Card so you reduce the chance of having the cards not communicating with each other

one card should elimate that problem
The cards do not communicate with each other, only back to the head-end of the cable system.
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Old 08-18-2008, 01:31 PM   #8
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Dan, I've checked and it's not our policy to replace a TiVo HD with a Series3 product. I believe the call agent was mistaken in what he told you. If you can send me a private message with your case number or contact info we can use that to look into this.

Thanks!
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Old 08-18-2008, 02:48 PM   #9
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Pony,

Back to the real question: Is M-Card support in the S3 ever going to arrive? Have you forgotten, or is it technically impossible?

Here, TWC charges over $200/year for the second S-Card. I would have replaced my S3 long ago with an THD were it not for my lifetime service & the hope you might add support RealSoonNow. The Owner's Manual and the silkscreen on the back indicate it was planned, so maybe it's coming -- just like the Blue LED for network transfers didn't work -- and then one day it did...

Why not take a page from the Netflix playbook & lay it out. Something like "the chipset doesn't work reliably with SA M-Cards", or "we've been chasing down pixelation & didn't think M-Cards are that big of a deal", or "sorry you're screwed by TWC -- we can transfer lifetime to a THD if that would help", etc.

Thanks.
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Old 08-18-2008, 03:35 PM   #10
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Pony,

Back to the real question: Is M-Card support in the S3 ever going to arrive? Have you forgotten, or is it technically impossible?

Here, TWC charges over $200/year for the second S-Card. I would have replaced my S3 long ago with an THD were it not for my lifetime service & the hope you might add support RealSoonNow. The Owner's Manual and the silkscreen on the back indicate it was planned, so maybe it's coming -- just like the Blue LED for network transfers didn't work -- and then one day it did...

Why not take a page from the Netflix playbook & lay it out. Something like "the chipset doesn't work reliably with SA M-Cards", or "we've been chasing down pixelation & didn't think M-Cards are that big of a deal", or "sorry you're screwed by TWC -- we can transfer lifetime to a THD if that would help", etc.

Thanks.
We're not going to get an answer, but ditto. My provider can't get my 2nd cc to work in my S3 (after it working for a year and a half) and I honestly don't think it's broken, but they are incompetent. Lifetime on it keeps me from going the Tivo HD route. I still hold out a tiny bit of hope, but bringing new (if you can call it that) features to a discontinued model seems extremely unlikely.
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:20 PM   #11
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Here, TWC charges over $200/year for the second S-Card.
What! You mean they charge you over $17 per month for a second card in the same device? I hope that you have reported this to the FCC and your local Franchise Authority. I know that the FCC never set any rates for these cards but I would think that rate is excessive and violates the intent of cablecard support.
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:27 PM   #12
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What! You mean they charge you over $17 per month for a second card in the same device? I hope that you have reported this to the FCC and your local Franchise Authority. I know that the FCC never set any rates for these cards but I would think that rate is excessive and violates the intent of cablecard support.
In many cases, the 2nd card itself isn't that much. However, they will try to charge you with an outlet fee. So technically, they can get around the guidelines set by the FCC even if they are ripping you off.
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:31 PM   #13
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That's right: $8/month additional outlet + $6.95 HD fee (per cablecard) + $3.10/month cablecard rental + 8.7% tax/franchise fee = Total: $19.62/mo or $235/year.

Of course, they aren't currently charging the HD fee (per cablecard). They canceled that last October when they removed *all HD* from cablecard because of SDV (even though only a few of the HD channels are actually SDV, but that's a different thread...)
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Old 08-18-2008, 05:42 PM   #14
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Back to the real question: Is M-Card support in the S3 ever going to arrive? Have you forgotten, or is it technically impossible?
The page that used to state that they were examining single M-Card support for the S3 is no longer on TiVo's site. Add that to the fact that it's been almost 2 years since the S3 came out and that (new) S3's are no longer for sale and I think it's pretty clear that they've given up supporting a single M-Card in the S3.
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Old 08-18-2008, 06:50 PM   #15
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Pony,

Back to the real question: Is M-Card support in the S3 ever going to arrive? Have you forgotten, or is it technically impossible?
As I explained in April, this is a risky development proposition. I will never say never, because there are very few absolutes (except death and taxes of course). But it's very, very unlikely.

From earlier this year:
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Likewise, features such as QAM remapping and M-Card S3 support do not target a significant portion of our subscribers, both are in fact very small numbers of subscribers. That doesn't mean that they automatically get set aside, or that TiVo is ignoring or doesn't care about those customers. But it is a consideration when trading off those features against others (M-Card for S3 is technically possible, but also technically very complex. We've learned that there is a lot of risk inherent in that development).

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Old 08-18-2008, 07:12 PM   #16
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As I explained in April, this is a risky development proposition. I will never say never, because there are very few absolutes (except death and taxes of course). But it's very, very unlikely.
Sorry, I was travelling in April & missed that posting.

This is very disappointing news. As I say above, the charge here is over $200/year for the second cablecard. It's disappointing to have bought an $800 machine (plus lifetime xfer charge), and after 1 year have TWC move all HD to SDV, then the next year see the $200/year additional charge is for the lifetime of the unit. (Not to mention that TWC has marked almost all the channels CCI=02.) My original S1 was a constant joy I hated to retire. My S3 -- seems more like I was trapped...

I know it's not all TiVo's fault, but...
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Old 08-18-2008, 07:51 PM   #17
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As I explained in April, this is a risky development proposition. I will never say never, because there are very few absolutes (except death and taxes of course). But it's very, very unlikely.
I, for one, will certainly keep this in mind next time I decide whether to support TiVo as an early adopter. The S3 has clear printing on the back that certainly could have left one with the impression that full M-card support was coming. Oh well. I guess I'll wait until the second generation of the Tru2Way TiVo comes out in 2012...
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:40 AM   #18
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That's right: $8/month additional outlet + $6.95 HD fee (per cablecard) + $3.10/month cablecard rental + 8.7% tax/franchise fee = Total: $19.62/mo or $235/year.
Good grief, that's horrible! I feel for you. And you didn't even include the fee for the truck roll...

High cost is the main reason I haven't gotten any CableCARDs for my S3, but since TiVo continues to offer woefully inadequate support for clear QAM recording, I'm left with a questionable TiVo experience and certainly not anything I can recommend to my friends and family. For those of us who only want to record clear QAM channels, it's a rock and a hard place.
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Old 09-18-2008, 03:44 AM   #19
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Mcard works dual tuner with Series 3

Comcast installed one Mcard in my series 3. I asked for two to utilize dual tuner capability but was told that I only needed one. While the Comcast technician was in my home I tested the series 3 and the installer was right!! I am able to record two HD channels with only 1 Mcard.
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Old 09-18-2008, 08:20 AM   #20
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Comcast installed one Mcard in my series 3. I asked for two to utilize dual tuner capability but was told that I only needed one. While the Comcast technician was in my home I tested the series 3 and the installer was right!! I am able to record two HD channels with only 1 Mcard.
Hmmm....are you positive? From what I've read on these fora, no one has ever been able to record two HD channels with a single M card (and no card in the other slot) in the S3. Is yours is an actual, original S3 (the first HD TiVo released two years ago)? Not the TiVo HD or XL (which are also classified under the Series 3 "umbrella").
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Old 09-18-2008, 08:24 AM   #21
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I wouldn't accept a S3 for a warranty replacement for a TiVo HD. They are just trying to dump the remaining S3 stock they have most likely.
I would jump at the chance to have my TiVoHDs replaced with the S3.
The S3 is better, especially with the audio. My S3 boxes audio come right up in a split second with channel changes, but my TiVoHD boxes take one to two seconds for the audio to come up.

My only complaint with the S3 boxes are the cable card slot locations. The back is not a good place for the cablecard slot in a SetTopBox.
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Old 09-18-2008, 08:37 AM   #22
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Record two premium digital channels and see what happens.
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Old 09-18-2008, 09:34 AM   #23
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IIRC, some have noticed it works until you repeat guided setup (for your new channels). I could be wrong though...
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Old 09-18-2008, 01:20 PM   #24
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Likewise, features such as QAM remapping and M-Card S3 support do not target a significant portion of our subscribers, both are in fact very small numbers of subscribers.
I expect the majority of S3 owners would prefer to use an M-Card, especially since Comacast is charging excessive fees for a 2nd Card. I pay $5.10 a month ($61.20 per year) for my 2nd Cablecard. TiVo could make a lot of its dedicated client base (early adopters who bought the S3) happy by saving them this money.
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Old 09-18-2008, 01:33 PM   #25
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I expect the majority of S3 owners would prefer to use an M-Card, especially since Comacast is charging excessive fees for a 2nd Card. I pay $5.10 a month ($61.20 per year) for my 2nd Cablecard. TiVo could make a lot of its dedicated client base (early adopters who bought the S3) happy by saving them this money.
If you are being billed that way by Comcast, you need to call them back. They have a CableCARD package especially for the TiVo. The first card is free with the digital package and the second card is around a buck and a half.

Refer to this when you call:

http://www.comcast.com/customers/faq...s.ashx?Id=2651

The line item on my bill reads: "Add'l Digital Outlet(s): Cable Card Same Outlet Charge - $1.50"
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Old 09-18-2008, 01:55 PM   #26
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As I explained in April, this is a risky development proposition. I will never say never, because there are very few absolutes (except death and taxes of course). But it's very, very unlikely.
While the numbers on M-Card support are small, they represent the folk who are willing to pay a pretty high premium for TiVo product right out of the chute. While there is an up-front expense for providing that support, there is some value in ensuring that crowd will be there, wallet in hand, for your next big release.

Some time in the future, folk may look at how the early adopters were handled -- no M-Card, long wait for TTG, etc, and decide to wait a year following the next product introduction, just to see how things shake out.

Its not a big deal for most, on its own, but it is added to the equation when considering the Series 4, whatever that will be.
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Old 09-18-2008, 02:10 PM   #27
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If you are being billed that way by Comcast, you need to call them back. They have a CableCARD package especially for the TiVo. The first card is free with the digital package and the second card is around a buck and a half.

Refer to this when you call:

http://www.comcast.com/customers/faq...s.ashx?Id=2651

The line item on my bill reads: "Add'l Digital Outlet(s): Cable Card Same Outlet Charge - $1.50"

I spoke with a Comcast CSR once about this, as I have seen other indviduals being charged $1.79. I will give it another shot after reading your link. Thanks.
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Old 09-18-2008, 04:46 PM   #28
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I spoke with a Comcast CSR once about this, as I have seen other indviduals being charged $1.79. I will give it another shot after reading your link. Thanks.
I called again, and this time the CSR was either smarter, reasonable, or better informed . . . probably all 3. In any case, my 2nd Cablecard fee is reduced to $1.79.

On a separate note, Pony, I have 2 TiVo (1 THD & 1 S3), and it would be very helpful if the S3 could use a M-Card. This way I could have cablecards for both boxes, without paying for a additional port, not to mention saving the 3rd Cablecard fee altogether.
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Old 09-18-2008, 05:33 PM   #29
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While the numbers on M-Card support are small, they represent the folk who are willing to pay a pretty high premium for TiVo product right out of the chute. While there is an up-front expense for providing that support, there is some value in ensuring that crowd will be there, wallet in hand, for your next big release.

Some time in the future, folk may look at how the early adopters were handled -- no M-Card, long wait for TTG, etc, and decide to wait a year following the next product introduction, just to see how things shake out.

Its not a big deal for most, on its own, but it is added to the equation when considering the Series 4, whatever that will be.
I've got 2 S3s, bought 1 the first day out. Both have 2 S-cards at $4/mo each. They work, and work well. I'm OK with them working as they are, it's just not a huge deal for the S3s to work on an M card (assuming Verizon had any).

Besides, V would charge me for a visit, and it would take some period of time to recognize any savings.

I would hope Tivo can find better things to work on.
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Old 09-20-2008, 01:42 PM   #30
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Record two premium digital channels and see what happens.
I was, past tense, able to record two HD digital programs at the same time-- but TIVO sent a message for me to go through Guided Setup again. Now for some reason I can only record one program. What's up with that? Obviously it's not that the SERIES 3 can't record two programs with one m-card... it's the software/Guided setup that blocks the capability.

I'm think I'll try resetting the TIVO and start over. I have only one Comcast M-card.
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