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Old 07-14-2008, 03:28 PM   #1561
BrianAZ
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Originally Posted by jebbbz View Post
You can also check to see if both tuners are set to the same channel when you turn on your TV. When the channel loss takes place the two tuners are both set to the channel that the TiVo was sending to the TV at the time the problem arose.
I considered this, but if you have a fair amount of recordings, it's likely that the tuners will change to start new recordings by the time you check.
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Old 07-14-2008, 03:54 PM   #1562
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I considered this, but if you have a fair amount of recordings, it's likely that the tuners will change to start new recordings by the time you check.
I see your point. July is sort of the off season so I don't have as much set to record and that possibility slipped my mind.
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Old 07-14-2008, 09:13 PM   #1563
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Just FYI I emailed Cox and asked for a current list of channels that are or are going to SDV. Below is the response I got. I called Cox to ask if the new HHD Channels were going to SDV and they could not answer that.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

SDV is a new technology that allows Cox to maximize it?s video bandwidth, by only sending that channel signal a customer has tuned to as opposed to the entire line-up. In order for customers to be able to receive and view switched video channels, customers must have a device cable of two-way communication.

Currently only digital and advanced set top receivers are two-way capable. This means that beginning July 1, CableCARD customers will lose access to the switched channels.

Cox has 77 switched channels throughout our entire footprint. The following channels are currently switch digital.

109 * Cox Real Estate 2/Phx Only GoScout HOMES 110 * Daystar
112 * Inspiration
113 * EWTN
114 * BYU TV
125 * CSPAN 2
126 * CSPAN 3
133 * DIY - Do It Yourself
144 * Fox Reality Channel (REAL)
155 * BET on Jazz
156 * Great American Country (GAC)
157 * FUSE
158 * G4
159 * Logo
163 * Fit TV
170 * Fox College Sports Atlantic
172 * Fox College Sports Pacific
173 * Fuel
405 *
TV Chile

410 *
de Pelicula

411 *
de Pelicula Classico

412 * CineLatino
413 * VeneMovies
417 * History en Espaqol
418 * Discovery en Espaqol
422 * Discovery Familia
423 * Toon Disney en Espaqol
424 * Boomerang en Espaqol
425 * Sorpresa
430 * MTV Tr3s
432 * Bandamax
433 * VideoRola
434 * mun2
438 * ESPN Deportes
439 * Fox Sports en Espaqol
440 * GoITV
444 * CNN en Espaqol
445 * Canal Sur
449 * EWTN Espaqol

601* to 607 * which includes:
ESPN GamePlan and ESPN GamePlan/ESPN Full Court

650 * to 659* which includes:
NBA League Pass Preview
NBA League Pass
NBA League Pass PPV/MLS Direct Kick 650 * to 659* NHL Center Ice MLB Extra Innings NHL Center Ice / MLB Extra Innings 670 * to 680 *
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Old 07-15-2008, 09:34 AM   #1564
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Just FYI I emailed Cox and asked for a current list of channels that are or are going to SDV. Below is the response I got. I called Cox to ask if the new HHD Channels were going to SDV and they could not answer that.
*
Not to be mean, but your UserID does not show Location, so I'm wondering WHICH cox your info relates to - COX Fairfax, VA - where I live, Arizona, or maybe one of the other COX systems somewhere in the US?
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Old 07-15-2008, 02:10 PM   #1565
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Not to be mean, but your UserID does not show Location, so I'm wondering WHICH cox your info relates to - COX Fairfax, VA - where I live, Arizona, or maybe one of the other COX systems somewhere in the US?
That looks like the Arizona list & date if I recall.
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Old 07-15-2008, 06:03 PM   #1566
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So sorry thought I had it in my userid.....it is for Phoenix,
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Old 07-16-2008, 01:29 PM   #1567
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Cox-Phoenix Channel Loss Specific Thread

Hi Everyone,

Since this thread has gotten so huge and covers a wide range of topics, I've started a thread specific to the channel loss issue in Phoenix. You can find it here. I'm hoping that by giving the issue it's own thread, it'll be easier for us all to discuss and receive any updates.

Thanks,
Brian
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Old 07-16-2008, 04:13 PM   #1568
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Its kind of funny, that Fairfax has over one million people and it seems that the only people that ever contribute to this thread are from the Phoenix area. It would be nice to hear from Cox Fairfax customers once in a while. Where are the Tuning Resolvers/Adapters?
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Old 07-16-2008, 04:40 PM   #1569
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Its kind of funny, that Fairfax has over one million people and it seems that the only people that ever contribute to this thread are from the Phoenix area. It would be nice to hear from Cox Fairfax customers once in a while. Where are the Tuning Resolvers/Adapters?
Well, people usually only come to Internet forums if they're experiencing problems with their service.

Also, this thread is not really about SDV but about CableCards.

- Dennis
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Old 07-16-2008, 05:20 PM   #1570
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SDV is about cable cards inability to communicate 2 way....I know there are a lot of people around here that get upset if a comment doesn't fit their limited definiton of what a thread is about, but since I started it 2 years ago, I figure I know whats its about.
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Old 07-16-2008, 06:12 PM   #1571
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Except that SDV is not about cable cards but rather is about the box (TV or TiVo) you plug the CC into. Cable cards handle authorization and decryption, not communications, neither one-way nor two-way.
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Old 07-17-2008, 01:14 PM   #1572
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still following the thread

I'm in Northern Virginia, but have apparently avoided the recent cluster of problems because i have 2 S Cards instead of the one M Card I used to use.

Since the menu options are different with S Cards installed than with M Cards, I have absolutely no idea what version I'm running, but can only assume that my cards did not receive any firmware update as nothing changed on my end.

I still deal with the occasional frozen channel and choppy audio at times, but no missed recordings. About once a month I have to reboot to resolve an issue, but I'm now 5 weeks from my last reboot and still going.

I don't have any confidence my luck will last, but for the time being, I'm pretty content.

I'll be giving FIOS TV a try if I get back to the point where a Cox DVR is the only way to get programming.
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Old 07-17-2008, 11:38 PM   #1573
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Had cox over yesterday. Replaced out two of my cards. I'm not having any channel drops so far; still getting some SD channel stuttering. Thankfully the new cable cards have also fixed the copyright issue I had (so far). That was the most annoying issue for me, so at least that is taken care of. The Technician wanted to hook up the cox dvr to show me the problem was with Tivo. I told him not to bother and I knew the Cox DVR would probably work fine...but that I was still not switching to it.
I told him it wasn't my Tivo box because the Moto cards I had in it worked fine for 18 months before switching to cox. He told me to get a Moto card and see if Cox would activate for me. hahaha...if only...
What's a motocard?
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Old 07-17-2008, 11:53 PM   #1574
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Motorola card. Won't work in a cable system that uses Cisco/Scientific Atlanta distribution equipment. Techs should know that.
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Old 07-18-2008, 08:02 AM   #1575
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Cox OKC told me that it would be a flat $1.99 per card/mo and I could pick them up at any location when it was convenient for a self install.
That's interesting. Cox OKC told me you couldn't self-install. You had to have a tech do it. My multi-stream card went out completely. When they came out, the "tivo expert" on the phone told the tech that since my Tivo HD had the new software update I had to have two single stream cards instead of the multi-stream. $15 installation charge. Waived. Only one card worked and they had to come back out two days later with several more single stream cards to find one that worked. The bill came a few days ago with a $15 installation charge. Unbelievable. But, no hang ups or loss of channels since the install.
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Old 07-27-2008, 01:22 PM   #1576
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On the off chance people are still checking this thread for news on the upgrade loop and channel loss problems, I posted this over on the special Phoenix/Tucson thread (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...php?t=399534):

"My update: Channel loss has hit me only a couple of times a week for the last two weeks. Thursday night was the last time I noticed it. This thread technically only covers such channel loss but I thought I would pass on something else. At the time the firmware upgrade took place many people noted that their TiVos were stuck in an upgrade loop. For me, there were certain problem channels (TCM on 199, for example). Tuning to them would trigger a false upgrade cycle that would repeat until I could tune away from the problem channel just as the "upgrade" finished. I checked just now and my upgrade loop problem seems fixed. Cisco/SA have not sent me any new firmware (I have the 0301) nor have I received the 9.4 update from TiVo. I guess that leaves Cox as having changed something in their local system that fixed the problem. Given the coincidence of the upgrade loop problem and the channel loss problem I have some hope that the latter problem will soon be history, too."
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Old 07-30-2008, 10:45 AM   #1577
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My sister in Phoenix just upgraded to HD with a new Pioneer plasma display and a TiVo HD. Cox came out yesterday to do her cable card installation. As usual, she didn't get an actual Cox technician, but just some subcontractor.

The first thing he does is spend a great deal of time in the box on the side of the house, apparently messing around with the signal amplifier, and then putting a wall wart power supply for the amplifier in the house and tying it into the cable. The weird thing about this, is that she already has one of those wall warts tied into the cable in another room, so it's not clear what was up with that. I wasn't there, and my sister didn't stand out in the heat and watch what he was doing, so it's not clear what was going on other than the tech spent a great deal of time doing whatever he was doing.

The second issue was that in addition to putting a cable card into the TiVo HD (which, surprisingly, actually went relatively smoothly), the tech was also supposed to install one into her new TV. However, all he had was M-cards, and both of the 2 remaining cable cards that he had on hand after installing the first one in the TiVo came up with an error message when put into the TV. The tech concluded (in error) that the TV wouldn't work with an M-card and needed an S-card. Of course, for those of us in the know, M-cards are backwards compatible, and should work fine in the place of an S-card in a single tuner device such as her TV. Luckily, I had previously told my sister that they were backwards compatible, so she didn't accept the tech's misinformation, and made him go find another tech in the area to get some more cable cards to try. When he ultimately came back, he got one to work, but had my sister not known to push him on the issue, she would have bought the story that the m-cards won't work in the TV. It stinks that Cox has techs out in the field who don't have a clue what they are talking about, spreading misinformation.

But here's the real killer. After the install was complete, and everything seemed to be working, and my sister had run through guided setup again, she discovers that the HD channels of the premium channels that she subscribes to come up blank - on both the TiVo and the TV. Again, knowing that's not right, she calls up Cox tech support to get it resolved, figuring that they just forgot to add those channels to the list of channels that should get authorized by her cable cards. Of course, the misinformed Cox rep who took her call was very rude to her, and said that she can't get those channels without having Cox's box. Ultimately, my sister insisted to talk to a manager after being insulted by the rep several times. In contrast, the manager was very polite and nice, and, in fact, discovered that indeed the problem was that they just forgot to authorize those channels, and it took only a minute or so to resolve the problem. Bottom line - if the first line tech support doesn't give you the answer you want to hear, it's most likely that they are grossly misinformed and you simply need to escalate the issue to a manager who has a clue.

But... the story isn't over yet... After finally getting all that sorted out, she comes to find that the cable box in the other room (which is connected to one of her Series 2 TiVos) stopped working. Sure enough, as much as my sister made herself abundantly clear when she called Cox to order the new service, and having repeated herself multiple times to the rep, including summarizing exactly what she wanted at the end of the call just to be sure they didn't screw it up, what happenned? They screwed it up and disabled her cable box. So she had to contact Cox again to get it reauthorized and working correctly.

On the plus side, now that everything is working, my sister is loving her new TiVo HD and HDTV. But the story won't be over until she gets the next Cox bill in the mail, which, if her experience is like mine, the bill will be all screwed up and she will once again have to call Cox to get it sorted all out.

The gross incompetence is overwhelming. The CSR that takes the original order screws things up on the order. The tech doesn't understand that M-cards are backwards compatible for single tuner devices. And the CSR that takes her call when her HD premium channels don't work doesn't have a clue that she really is supposed to get those channels. Not exactly a positive customer experience...

Of course, to add insult to injury, now she still has to deal with the cable card 161-38 error issue in the Phoenix area that causes temporary loss of channels and partial if not completely lost recordings, which again is a Cox issue (an incompatibility problem between the local Cox infrastructure and the firmware on the SA cable cards).

Add to all that the issue of SDV which is right around the corner, which will start causing my sister to lose channels. It was supposed to be first deployed in the Phoenix area earlier this month, but due to some sort of technical problems at Cox (surprise, surprise), has been delayed. And you have to believe that when the tuning adapters first hit the street they will have their share of "issues" that will need to get resolved.

This shouldn't be this hard or complicated. For the technically unsavvy, who don't know how to wade through the misinformation or have any tolerance for all the ouststanding issues, this is a nightmare. If I wasn't already a die-hard TiVo fan, and the TiVo HD was my first TiVo purchase and I experienced all of the above, I would be returning it to TiVo and demanding my money back, like so many other people are doing. My wife's tolerance of the issues with our own TiVo HD (same issues as my sister, as we are also in the Phoenix area) are reaching the breaking point. I have to keep telling my wife that "they are working on it", but her patience is wearing thin. She's not happy that we spent all this money to "upgrade" to the TiVo HD, only to "downgrade" our service. This is a terrible black eye for TiVo, and the reputation of TiVo in general. Yes, a lot of it isn't TiVo's fault (at least not directly), but TiVo is taking the brunt of the blame that their product doesn't work with the established cable system. Until this gets all sorted out, and the installation of a new HD TiVo (be it this series or the next) is as smooth and simply as it was for Series 1 and Series 2 TiVos and it all simply just works right (again, like it was for the Series 1 and Series 1 TiVos), I doubt I'll be recommending TiVo to anybody unless they are really prepared to deal with all of the above issues.
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Old 07-30-2008, 12:35 PM   #1578
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My sister in Phoenix just upgraded to HD with a new Pioneer plasma display and a TiVo HD. Cox came out yesterday to do her cable card installation. ... The gross incompetence is overwhelming. The CSR that takes the original order screws things up on the order. The tech doesn't understand that M-cards are backwards compatible for single tuner devices. And the CSR that takes her call when her HD premium channels don't work doesn't have a clue that she really is supposed to get those channels. Not exactly a positive customer experience...
I certainly hope that your sister is reporting this to upper-level management. There's no excuse for it!

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Of course, to add insult to injury, now she still has to deal with the cable card 161-38 error issue in the Phoenix area that causes temporary loss of channels and partial if not completely lost recordings, which again is a Cox issue (an incompatibility problem between the local Cox infrastructure and the firmware on the SA cable cards).

Add to all that the issue of SDV which is right around the corner, which will start causing my sister to lose channels. It was supposed to be first deployed in the Phoenix area earlier this month, but due to some sort of technical problems at Cox (surprise, surprise), has been delayed. And you have to believe that when the tuning adapters first hit the street they will have their share of "issues" that will need to get resolved.
So I have to ask... why on earth did your sister go with a TiVo HD?!! Despite my being a big fan (after several years of great service with a Series 2), had I known about these issues, I would've waited to get a TiVo HD until the issues are resolved... or at least minimized...

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This shouldn't be this hard or complicated. For the technically unsavvy, who don't know how to wade through the misinformation or have any tolerance for all the ouststanding issues, this is a nightmare.
Well, I have just enough technical knowledge to realize how much I don't understand regarding how all this works. But the technically savvy are still dealing with the same horrible service and I would think if you have a complete understanding of what's going on you might be even more frustrated since you realize just how incompetent some of the Cox reps and techs are!

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If I wasn't already a die-hard TiVo fan, and the TiVo HD was my first TiVo purchase and I experienced all of the above, I would be returning it to TiVo and demanding my money back, like so many other people are doing. ... I have to keep telling my wife that "they are working on it", but her patience is wearing thin. She's not happy that we spent all this money to "upgrade" to the TiVo HD, only to "downgrade" our service.
I'm with your wife on this one!!

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This is a terrible black eye for TiVo, and the reputation of TiVo in general.

As well it should be!


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Yes, a lot of it isn't TiVo's fault (at least not directly), but TiVo is taking the brunt of the blame that their product doesn't work with the established cable system. Until this gets all sorted out, and the installation of a new HD TiVo (be it this series or the next) is as smooth and simply as it was for Series 1 and Series 2 TiVos and it all simply just works right (again, like it was for the Series 1 and Series 1 TiVos), I doubt I'll be recommending TiVo to anybody unless they are really prepared to deal with all of the above issues.
And this is the crux of the issue, with respect to TiVo and the way they're handling this mess. No matter how wonderful TiVo is when it works, you would not in good conscience recommend that anyone enter into this frustrating morass of unreliable service. Yet TiVo is still selling its HD units in the Phoenix/Tucson area, without so much as a word of caution, knowing full well the headaches that await the hapless consumer. ... Yes, there's a 30-day trial period, but I didn't worry about the few problems (some A/V synch issues) I experienced during that period, fully expecting that the issue would be promptly solved. And, not only is TiVo selling the units, but they're selling yearly and even lifetime service to the unwitting consumer!

And, don't worry, I feel Cox is also just as remiss in hooking customers up, again without warning them of these issues. But then, most of their reps and techs are so clueless that they're not even aware of the issues! So Cox's role in all this is even more reprehensible in that they're handling it so incompetently...
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Old 07-30-2008, 01:10 PM   #1579
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Cable Card Issues in OKC

I have had my S3 box for probably over a year now, and once I finally got the cable cards installed, I've experienced every kind of issue that is mentioned on this site...signal drop, change to a channel that doesn't appear on screen and turns black, change to a channel that takes a minute or two to come up, skips when the channel is tuned, audio skips as well, just over all poor performance with the cable cards.

I'm not sure what kind I have or how to find out, anyone know?

If I'm an OKC Cox customer, with an S3, what should I have as the newest and greatest cable cards, so I know what to ask for when I call and ask to be upgraded?
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Old 07-30-2008, 01:15 PM   #1580
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...If I'm an OKC Cox customer, with an S3, what should I have as the newest and greatest cable cards, so I know what to ask for when I call and ask to be upgraded?
Sorry Chris, I can't answer your question but hey--thanks a bunch for the belly laugh! Using "greatest" in the same sentence as "cable card" is quite a riot! (I do believe that's the first "big grin" I've used in a TiVo/cable card-related thread!)
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Old 07-30-2008, 01:23 PM   #1581
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I found the CableCard Menu and see that the SA CableCARD Diag Screen shows me an OS Build from 2005, thats quite old... how can I get new cards or update the OS builds?
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Old 07-30-2008, 01:24 PM   #1582
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So I have to ask... why on earth did your sister go with a TiVo HD?
She got a smoking deal on a new 50" Pioneer KURO Plasma HDTV (PDP-5010FD) on a closeout for almost 50% off MSRP (it has recently been replaced by the PDP-5020FD, which doesn't have a cable card slot). Being a long time TiVo fan (TiVo is big in my family), once she had the new TV on its way, she wanted a new TiVo that did HD. I explained to her all the outstanding issues and all the potential things that Cox could screw up, with the theory of having her prepared for a worst case scenario, and she still wanted to take the plunge to get a TiVo HD, accepting that things may not go smoothly, and that there may be issues that will need to get resolved. My sister and I are both early adopters of technology, so we know what comes with the territory, and what issues we might have to endure, so she was prepared for all that happenned. That being said, I would have advised most other people not to do it until things are more stable.

My point of writing the prior post is that regardless of my sister's tolerance of these sort of issues as an early adopter of technology, this is still a totally unacceptable customer experience that is giving both TiVo and Cox a really bad reputation.
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Old 07-30-2008, 01:43 PM   #1583
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She got a smoking deal on a new 50" Pioneer KURO Plasma HDTV (PDP-5010FD) on a closeout for almost 50% off MSRP ...

My point of writing the prior post is that regardless of my sister's tolerance of these sort of issues as an early adopter of technology, this is still a totally unacceptable customer experience that is giving both TiVo and Cox a really bad reputation.
Wow, a Kuro--that's supposed to be one of the best HD plasmas out there--kudos to your sister! Her situation is very different from most Phoenix/Tucson area TiVo HD consumers. She made an informed decision (thanks to you, not TiVo or Cox)--the rest of us were bamboozled! ...

If you agree to be a beta tester, you accept that working out the kinks comes with the territory. And, correct me if I'm wrong, beta testers usually don't pay for the privilege. I'm sure Phoenix/Tucson area TiVo HD/Cox customers never dreamed we'd be paying big bucks to be unwitting beta testers!! So yes, I agree with you completely--this is totally unacceptable!
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Old 07-30-2008, 02:03 PM   #1584
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For the S3 using Cox SA Cards what kind works the best? S-Cards or M-Cards?
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Old 07-30-2008, 03:17 PM   #1585
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For the S3 using Cox SA Cards what kind works the best? S-Cards or M-Cards?
I have a TiVo-HD, so I don't know if the situation might be different for Series 3 TiVo's. My experience was that when using 2 s-cards (as I initially did) caused moderate to severe audio/video synch problems, making some shows virtually unwatchable. The M-card has caused intermittent signal drops resulting in partial recordings. At its worst, this signal-drop problem (for me) is a different yet equally aggravating evil as the A/V synch problem. However, a lot of the time the signal-drop isn't as bad as the A/V synch problem. So that's why I've decided not to go back to two S-cards. ... PLUS, some have reported the same signal-drop problems with the S-cards, though it appears to be much less common...

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Old 07-30-2008, 03:19 PM   #1586
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For the S3 using Cox SA Cards what kind works the best? S-Cards or M-Cards?
From various accounts I have heard you are better of with S-Cards if you can get hold of them since they are more mature (hardware & firmware), and you need 2 regardless of the type for an S3. Also keep in mind when S3s were first released there were not even M-Cards available to test with at the time, so most/all testing was done using S-Cards.
Problem is SA/Cisco & Motorola have stopped producing S-Cards so they are getting harder to find as any new stock ordered by cable company are all M-Cards.
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Old 07-30-2008, 03:21 PM   #1587
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Originally Posted by saibari View Post
I have a TiVo-HD, so I don't know if the situation might be different for Series 3 TiVo's. My experience was that the using 2 s-cards (as I initially did) caused moderate to severe audio/video synch problems, making some shows virtually unwatchable. The M-card has caused intermittent signal drops resulting in partial recordings. At its worst, this signal-drop problem (for me) is a different yet equally aggravating evil as the A/V synch problem. However, a lot of the time the signal-drop isn't as bad as the A/V synch problem. So that's why I've decided not to go back to two S-cards. ... PLUS, some have reported the same signal-drop problems with the S-cards, though it appears to be much less common...
What version of the SA S-Cards are they? Meaning I'm wondering if I have some old out of date cards? How can I see all this information and what models are new etc...I have two S-Cards I guess, as I've never requested M-Cards. I did see the OS on the cards was from 2005...so I'm assuming I have old hardware.
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Old 07-30-2008, 03:23 PM   #1588
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Originally Posted by moyekj View Post
From various accounts I have heard you are better of with S-Cards if you can get hold of them since they are more mature (hardware & firmware), and you need 2 regardless of the type for an S3. Also keep in mind when S3s were first released there were not even M-Cards available to test with at the time, so most/all testing was done using S-Cards.
Problem is SA/Cisco & Motorola have stopped producing S-Cards so they are getting harder to find as any new stock ordered by cable company are all M-Cards.
Funny you'd think the newer cards would be better?
So the current S-Cards I have are probably better? Even with firmware or OS that is old?
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Old 07-30-2008, 04:07 PM   #1589
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Originally Posted by ChrisMc73 View Post
Funny you'd think the newer cards would be better?
So the current S-Cards I have are probably better? Even with firmware or OS that is old?
I'd say that if you're experiencing significant problems with your current cards, you should swap them out for new ones. My experience has been that this solves the problems... temporarily.

When the problem gets bad again (lots of partial recordings), I swap the card out again. Right now, after my last swap (last Friday) my signal-drop problem is minor (knock wood!)... hopefully it won't get worse, but prior to the swap I had no reception on some channels and the channels I did receive were severely tiled.

If, however, your current level of difficulties are tolerable (that is, they don't greatly affect your television viewing or recording), then I'd stick with what you've got...
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Old 07-30-2008, 04:14 PM   #1590
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Looking into ATT Uverse...
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