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Old 04-08-2007, 05:05 PM   #2461
doubleagent
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Anyway to reset the cable cards without erasing my now playing list?
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Old 04-08-2007, 05:09 PM   #2462
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Reset them how? Just eject and reinsert them will reset them. But if you are looking for brand new internal settings then I don't know. You can reverse them in the sockets (put #1 in #2 and 2 in #1) and that will invalidate the cards and Comcast could re-authorize them with a new HOST id.
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Old 04-08-2007, 05:11 PM   #2463
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That's my goal. Trying to force comcast to do it over the phone and cancel the appointment by telling them they screwed up and lost all my channels.
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Old 04-08-2007, 05:13 PM   #2464
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Good luck with that. Some areas won't do that without a tech to do it. Luckily in the Seattle area we can.
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Old 04-08-2007, 05:20 PM   #2465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doubleagent
Called comcast to add hbo to my cable cards and the hits did not work. Made an appointment to replace the cards. Called back a second time to speak with someone else about updating the data fields and she told me it wouldn't matter because they are like "memory sticks". Can anyone verify that my cards need to be replaced? They would not perform a cold hit for me over the phone.
That seems to be how Comcast operates these days with their conditional access system. Any changes needing to be made usually require a truck roll to replace the cards.
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Old 04-08-2007, 08:30 PM   #2466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregor
That seems to be how Comcast operates these days with their conditional access system. Any changes needing to be made usually require a truck roll to replace the cards.
http://techdigs.net/content/view/46/42/

This makes me think after the 8.1 update my data ID changed and I could give them that number to get my premiums added.

I restarted my tivo today and confirmed that it is a dynamic number.
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Old 04-08-2007, 10:09 PM   #2467
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I am 99 percent sure software updates wont force the data number to change. (if it did we'd see massive widespread reports of issues)

BUT pulling the cards and reinserting MIGHT be doing it on some systems.

And pulling the cards and switching slots certainly will force a new number.

There's more about generating new ID's in the upgrade forum- early on there was some occaisional issue with the 3rd part drives so those guys probably know for sure what forces a new number to generate.
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Old 04-08-2007, 10:44 PM   #2468
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Pulling the card and reinserting it into the SAME slot is not supposed to cause any problems. But pulling the card and inserting it into a different slot will require reauthorization even if you then pull the card out and put it back in the original slot.
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Old 04-08-2007, 11:48 PM   #2469
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I think the qualification is *if* your head-end is using the Host/Data pairing info, then it will require reauthorization.

Some areas aren't using that info yet (despite having collected the info), which could lead folks to come to the wrong conclusion about what types of changes require re-entry of that info.
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Old 04-09-2007, 09:08 AM   #2470
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I pulled them out and inserted them into the other slots. I took note of the numbers and then put the cards back into the original slots. Numbers did change but all my channels still work. I want to call and give the new data ID but I have a feeling it still will not help.
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Old 04-09-2007, 11:40 AM   #2471
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I talked to someone today and she took my information but when she tried to give it to dispatch they refused. I'll be waiting for them now.
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Old 04-09-2007, 02:21 PM   #2472
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The M Card...

Everyone seems to be using two cable cards for the TiVo S3. I found this on the Engadgets site recently:

The Series3 is designed to replace a cable box, not control it. The S3 supports OTA broadcasts (both ATSC and NTSC) in addition to analog cable, but to fully appreciate the unit a pair of CableCARDs are needed. If our experience is representative, getting them installed will test your patience. The S3 supports CableCARD 1.0, and it's our understanding a single M-Card (CC 1.0+) will replace 2 CableCARDs once they become available.

I'm in Middlesex County, NJ. I just called Comcast and was told they have one card to handle both channels -- when I asked if it was the M Card, the CSR did not know the answer, but assured me it was compatible with the TiVo S3. I like the idea, mentioned in an earlier post, of picking up the card(s) at the local Comcast office, so I'll pay them a visit withing a day-or-two.
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Old 04-09-2007, 02:57 PM   #2473
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The M-Card was always in the S3 plan but TiVo had to back away from it because there were no opportunities to test with it. I imagine once they become available there will be some internal TiVo testing and perhaps a software update before they are advertised to be supported.
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Old 04-09-2007, 05:04 PM   #2474
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Well I called the corporate number and someone from delaware is supposed to be calling me tomorrow morning. I'll post either way to let you guys know if they actually do want I want.
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Old 04-09-2007, 05:10 PM   #2475
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I just sent an email to a woman at the FCC notifying them that Comcast is charging their customers more than the $1.50 they are reporting.

...and I cc'ed the CEO of Comcast and several VPs.

53 minutes after sending the email, I got a call from Comcast corporate saying that they are investigating the problem and will get back to me this evening or tomorrow morning.

I might actually get this additional outlet charge straighted out for all of us once and for all.
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Old 04-09-2007, 06:40 PM   #2476
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpBE
I just sent an email to a woman at the FCC notifying them that Comcast is charging their customers more than the $1.50 they are reporting.

...and I cc'ed the CEO of Comcast and several VPs.
please share with us the letter and addresses you sent it to; the more people who make noise on this, the faster it'll be fixed.
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Old 04-09-2007, 09:12 PM   #2477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike in NJ
Called Comcast on Thursday to get them to fix the account - I was being billed for two "additional outlets" at $7.95 each. The CSR said she adjusted those charges off the bill and made corrections to properly account for the cablecards. She promised that the cards would continue to work properly. Wrong... Starting Friday, a bunch of digital channels have now become "black screens" (no sound or video).
I got S3 in late November here in Atlanta, and all has been well with two $1.50 Cable card fees. Just got my bill for this month, and as of 4/3 they showed two additional "Digital Service A/O" charges for $5.99 in addition to the Cable Card charges. Called once, and the guy was saying "each cable card costs $5.99", I then asked why they are changing the pricing, and why I am now being charged $7.49 per card (5.99 + 1.50). He went to get a supervisor, and we got cut off. The next guy I talked to said "What the...?" and put in a request to get the additional charges removed. Hopefully my cable cards don't get fried like yours. (all fingers crossed...)
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Old 04-09-2007, 10:21 PM   #2478
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Angry Spoke too soon...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayssss
I got S3 in late November here in Atlanta, and all has been well with two $1.50 Cable card fees. Just got my bill for this month, and as of 4/3 they showed two additional "Digital Service A/O" charges for $5.99 in addition to the Cable Card charges. Called once, and the guy was saying "each cable card costs $5.99", I then asked why they are changing the pricing, and why I am now being charged $7.49 per card (5.99 + 1.50). He went to get a supervisor, and we got cut off. The next guy I talked to said "What the...?" and put in a request to get the additional charges removed. Hopefully my cable cards don't get fried like yours. (all fingers crossed...)
OK, I spoke too soon. About 10 minutes after getting off the phone, both of my cable boxes stopped working. Tivo S3 was working fine. Called back and was told that they needed to charge me the $5.99 per cable card. Escalated to a supervisor, and he started saying the same thing, but I came back and said that the Rate Schedule they publish shows "Digital Service - Additional Outlet" with a price of $5.99. I asked what his definition of an "Additional Outlet" was. He said "a cable box". I told him that the definition of outlet is (from the site named dictionary followed by a dot and com - damn anti-spam measures):
...
2. Electricity.
a. a point on a wiring system at which current is taken to supply electric devices.
b. Also called outlet box. the metal box or receptacle designed to facilitate connections to a wiring system.
...

I told him that there was only one wire going from the wall to my Tivo, but there are two cable cards in the Tivo. Only one outlet in the wall. He verified that he understood the exact configuration I have, and said he would check things out and call me back tomorrow. We'll see...
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Old 04-10-2007, 08:26 AM   #2479
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Based on what you've told us, it sounds to me like you are indeed supposed to have two additional outlet fees... Not one for each CableCARD, but due to the fact that you have a total of three digital outlets (two cable boxes and one Series3 TiVo). Comcast typically includes one digital outlet with digital cable service, but requires a fee for any additional digital outlets.

You're actually luckier than some (Miami rings a bell), because although it contradicts what's posted on their website, Comcast is sometimes counting each CableCARD as an additional outlet, meaning you'd have a total of four digital outlets, and would have to pay three $5.99 fees.

The only thing I can see you possibly arguing away is one of the $1.50 CableCARD fees, since in theory the first one should be covered within the outlet fee.

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Old 04-10-2007, 09:15 AM   #2480
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bizzy
please share with us the letter and addresses you sent it to; the more people who make noise on this, the faster it'll be fixed.
I'll give them the chance to make things right before we bombard them with emails. Here's the text of the email:

Quote:
To: ******@fcc.gov
Cc: {bunch of Comcast executives)

Ms. ******,

In your filing, "NCTA Status Report 12/22/06" (http://www.ncta.com/DocumentBinary.aspx?id=532), it says, "Comcast does not charge monthly lease fees for CableCARDs except in the case of a device that requires a second CableCARD. Second CableCARDs in the same device are billed at $1.50/month. Installation fees may apply, along with monthly programming service fees."

This statement is consistent with Comcast's own web page which states, "If you have a multi-card device on the same outlet (i.e. TiVo Series 3 or two Digital Cable Tuners connected to the same personal computer), you will be charged an additional regulated fee of up to $1.91 for the second CableCARD." (http://www.comcast.com/customers/faq...s.ashx?ID=2651).

However, Comcast's actual policies do not match the information provided on its own web site and submitted to the FCC. Customers who have a dual-CableCARD Tivo box are being charged an "Additional Outlet" charge of approximately $6-$10 per month, in addition to the $1.50 fee. Comcast's computer system apparently doesn't allow a dual-CableCARD device to function correctly without the "Additional Outlet" charge. If the charge is removed, the second CableCARD will no longer be able to receive all of the channels the customer is paying for.

I personally have been in contact with Comcast about this issue since January. I have talked to over 20 Comcast representatives, and had technicians come to my house four times. However, it seems that noone is able to provide a solution. I am also aware of several dozen other dual-CableCARD Tivo owners that are also being improperly billed by Comcast, not to mention the countless number who are probably unaware that they are paying too much.

In order for Comcast to bill their customers appropriately according to their published information, they would need to update their computer system and stop overcharging their users. But since this would require an effort by Comcast and a potential loss of (improper) revenue, it seems that they have no incentive to correct this problem.

Do you know of any process that could help encourage Comcast to stop overcharging their dual-CableCARD customers? The pricing information that they advertise and submit to the FCC is incorrect, and they seem unwilling to make the effort to honor those rates. Is there anything that you or anyone else at the FCC can do to make sure that Comcast stops overcharging their customers? Any assistance you could provide would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

-******
***-***-****
If I don't hear anything back in the next day or two, I'll let you know who it was sent to so we can put on a little more pressure.
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:36 AM   #2481
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I think your letter doesn't make it clear that you expect one outlet charge (and the $1.50 for the second card) and are being charged for two outlets. It sounds more like you expect to be charged for no outlets (just $1.50 for the CableCard) and are being charged for one.
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:02 AM   #2482
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I think your letter doesn't make it clear that you expect one outlet charge (and the $1.50 for the second card) and are being charged for two outlets. It sounds more like you expect to be charged for no outlets (just $1.50 for the CableCard) and are being charged for one.
the first outlet is covered with your digital cable sub, right?
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:08 AM   #2483
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Here in S FL, Comcast is charging me (with the following equipment list)
Sony TV with 1 CC - $1.75
SA 8300 Box $9.95
2nd SA 8300 Box $9.95
DVR Service $4.95
Series 3 w 2 CC $5.50

As far as I can deduce from this structure and what's "explained" on the bill reverse, they are charging a $1.00 Extra Outlet fee for each SA box and each CC in the TiVo. The remainder of the charges are for the SA hardware and the remote control rentals.
Now I'd like to dump the 2 SA boxes, and the single CC in the Sony and replace them with one digital box (no recorder service) which, I understand is supposed to be included with digital service. After that change (according to what I've read here and looking at their FAQ) I should have the following monthly equipment charges:
Digital STB $0.00 (Included in the digital service package)
Remote control $0.50 (I'm sure they'd stick me for this)
Tivo - 2 CCs $4.50 ($1.00 extra outlet charge and 2 CC rentals - some might expect to be charged for only 1 CC but I'm not optimistic on that front)
So the monthly total should drop to $5.00 for equipment. I'm sure I'm barking at the moon to expect this sort of sanity though.
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:10 AM   #2484
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bizzy
the first outlet is covered with your digital cable sub, right?
Yeah, but it's still a charge. It's just included in the package pricing.
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:26 AM   #2485
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Yeah, but it's still a charge. It's just included in the package pricing.
It's not an "Additional Outlet" charge. I should have zero "Additional Outlet" charges.
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:29 AM   #2486
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpBE
It's not an "Additional Outlet" charge. I should have zero "Additional Outlet" charges.
But if you had a second Series 3, you'd have an additional outlet charge; if you had a third you would have another additional outlet charge. But only one outlet charge per receiver.

It would've been clearer to have specifically pointed out that you have one outlet included with the base digital package and are also being charged for a second outlet but only have one receiver, which should only require a single outlet, then go into the CableCard issue related to the outlet charge.
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:33 AM   #2487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dswallow
But if you had a second Series 3, you'd have an additional outlet charge; if you had a third you would have another additional outlet charge. But only one outlet charge per receiver.

It would've been clearer to have specifically pointed out that you have one outlet included with the base digital package and are also being charged for a second outlet but only have one receiver, which should only require a single outlet, then go into the CableCard issue related to the outlet charge.
Where they are coming from (if you have a premium station) is that you have the ability to access two premium channels at one time. So, I can see why they tack on an A/O if you have premium content like HBO. For example, I can record HBO on one channel and SHO on another. Personally, I get charged the A/O of $2.75/mo for my TiVo and I'm not going to make a big deal over it. It is still cheaper than their STB charge.

Edit: And in my case, Comcast does say:

Charge for reception of premium services or package on additional outlets (per outlet)

And for cableCARDs: Additional cards, same device $1.50/mo (which they have not started charging yet.

Last edited by pl1 : 04-10-2007 at 10:39 AM. Reason: sp
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:36 AM   #2488
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I'm not sure that logic holds up, given that their own DVR has the ability to record two premium channels at once, yet is only considered a single digital outlet.

Drew
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:40 AM   #2489
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pl1
Where they are coming from (if you have a premium station) is that you have the ability to access two premium channels at one time. So, I can see why they tack on an A/O if you have premium content like HBO. For example, I can record HBO on one channel and SHO on another. Personally, I get charged the A/O of $2.75/mo for my TiVo and I'm not going to make a big deal over it. It is still cheaper than their STB charge.
No, it's rather clear in their pricing. If the additional outlet fee was appropriate for a second CableCard in a single device, there wouldn't be a separate fee for a second CableCard in a single device.

And, as mentioned, their own dual tuner devices are considered single digital outlets.

It's pretty clear what their intent is, but somehow their billing system hasn't gotten the message and isn't recognizing the second CableCard in a single device fee as authority to allow mirroring of the full subscription.
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Old 04-10-2007, 10:40 AM   #2490
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azitnay
I'm not sure that logic holds up, given that their own DVR has the ability to record two premium channels at once, yet is only considered a single digital outlet.Drew
I agree. It's not fair. I think many people have already argued with them about that. Of course, their own unit is not using cableCARDs, YET!.
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