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Old 07-14-2014, 06:17 PM   #61
dcline414
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Originally Posted by trip1eX View Post
Take your pick. I bet most can't get all those with one antenna position.
Quite possibly true if located far enough out that an omnidirectional antenna can't get them all.

In Atlanta the NBC affiliate is VHF while all others are UHF. I discovered that a BIG (8' long, 6' wide, 4' tall) VHF/UHF antenna couldn't be positioned in such a way that it picked up everything... at least not on the Tivo (the built-in TV tuners work better). We ended up with a dedicated VHF antenna, the combination VHF/UHF antenna, a pretty expensive preamp that can combine the signals, and a distribution amp to run to the TVs directly as well as the Tivo.

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Where is the great need in the market for a 6 tuner OTA dvr with so few OTA channels? I'm not seeing it.
I don't think anyone would ever need 6 OTA tuners. However the BASE Roamio has the ability to be either a 4-tuner OTA or 4-tuner cable DVR, and thus is much more versatile, i.e. for lifetime service.

If all else were equal (streaming, HDD, inputs/outputs, etc) I would DEFINITELY be more likely to buy lifetime service on a device that I could use whether I had cable or not, even if that meant giving up two [cable] tuners.

But the responses in this thread have made it very apparent that most here view cable, OTA, and Tivo's value much differently than I do.
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Old 07-15-2014, 06:55 PM   #62
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I don't think anyone would ever need 6 OTA tuners. However the BASE Roamio has the ability to be either a 4-tuner OTA or 4-tuner cable DVR, and thus is much more versatile, i.e. for lifetime service.
There was a time 10 or 11 years ago wherein there were 5 shows on different broadcast networks at the same time that either I or my SO wanted to see. I had to use all 3 TiVos I owned at the time and 2 VCRs.

Add padding, local sub-channels, multiple users (with wildly differing tastes) and minis into the mix and you can easily get to a situation where 4 OTA tuners is not enough.
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Old 07-16-2014, 11:05 AM   #63
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There was a time 10 or 11 years ago wherein there were 5 shows on different broadcast networks at the same time that either I or my SO wanted to see. I had to use all 3 TiVos I owned at the time and 2 VCRs.

Add padding, local sub-channels, multiple users (with wildly differing tastes) and minis into the mix and you can easily get to a situation where 4 OTA tuners is not enough.
But if TiVo ever manages to finish implementing single-tuner overlap by moving the required copying to a background task where it won't cause glitches (or if the new Haxe-based code is somehow efficient enough to avoid the glitches), that great high-end feature will help a lot.
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Old 07-16-2014, 04:29 PM   #64
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But if TiVo ever manages to finish implementing single-tuner overlap by moving the required copying to a background task where it won't cause glitches (or if the new Haxe-based code is somehow efficient enough to avoid the glitches), that great high-end feature will help a lot.
IMNSHO, the scheduler problems in the single-tuner overlap code are a far more serious issue.
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Old 07-16-2014, 06:10 PM   #65
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You don't need to maintain copies of the same data that may be needed for two overlapped recordings of video from a single tuner -- you just need a mechanism like reference counting or hard linking blocks of data at some level sufficiently granular to provide ways two recordings can own the same blocks of data for the overlapped portion of the recording.
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Old 07-16-2014, 10:58 PM   #66
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You don't need to maintain copies of the same data that may be needed for two overlapped recordings of video from a single tuner -- you just need a mechanism like reference counting or hard linking blocks of data at some level sufficiently granular to provide ways two recordings can own the same blocks of data for the overlapped portion of the recording.
That certainly would be my preferred method for implementing this feature. Unfortunately, it probably requires changes to the FS and definitely more code changes than the way they did it.

Plus, as I indicated before, the scheduler problems were far more serious than the "glitch" and they would be there no matter what method was used for the actual recording.
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Old 07-16-2014, 11:54 PM   #67
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I've used all 4 tuners when scheduling things. Especially when there is a special event going on. Tivo can see how often we are hitting all four tuners with their data mining. They can use that to decide if they need to offer a 6 tuner model. With minis taking up tuners, i can see an advantage to 6 tuners for OTA. 6 tuners would be the main reason for them to do it because you can get all the other features by getting add-on accessories.

But mainly I want MoCa, streaming, and a normal sized box with fan airflow that actually makes sense. People don't have unlimited room to stick wierd size boxes in their cabinet. We need to be able to stack the PS3 on top of the Tivo for the love of all that is holy!

But I would bet they make a 6 tuner OTA. Maybe that is why they are running a promotion right now to clear out the 6 tuner cable-only models.
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Old 07-17-2014, 12:51 AM   #68
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IMNSHO, the scheduler problems in the single-tuner overlap code are a far more serious issue.
Yes. Even though I did not once suffer the scheduler problems, once I was fully informed about how bad it was for those who did suffer it, I quit ranting over the function's removal.

As with a great many things, I advocated for the ability to turn the function on and off. I can never quite figure out TiVo's thinking on things. Just when I think they are going to change things and force us to take everything they change, they surprise me with letting me turn off the extra column in the My Shows list, as opposed to it being "the new and only view".

We can toggle the free space indicator, but can't choose to have the "HD Recordings" folder as an option. As some have pointed out, having a "SD Recordings" folder would be of more use to them.

I can only hope that the debut of the extra column is "just the beginning", which leaves some hope of each user being able to have their TiVo "their way". Letting us add and name folders, and deciding what goes into them, would be a dream come true (especially if they quit wasting so much horizontal real-estate on the sides, resulting in less truncation).
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Old 07-17-2014, 11:34 AM   #69
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IMNSHO, the scheduler problems in the single-tuner overlap code are a far more serious issue.
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Yes. Even though I did not once suffer the scheduler problems, once I was fully informed about how bad it was for those who did suffer it, I quit ranting over the function's removal.

As with a great many things, I advocated for the ability to turn the function on and off.
I also did not see the scheduler problems, but I trust you guys are right about that being the more serious issue. I was just trying to do a little cheerleading to let TiVo know that there are still people out here who would very much like to have single-tuner overlap, a feature that every high-end DVR should have. And if they actually get it working properly, why would anyone want to turn it off? Choice is great, but I really don't see the need in this particular case.
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Old 07-17-2014, 07:25 PM   #70
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And if they actually get it working properly, why would anyone want to turn it off? Choice is great, but I really don't see the need in this particular case.
Would you rather wait however long it takes for TiVo to make it work perfectly (which might be never, without TiVo rewriting their code from the ground-up), or have the ability to enable/disable a function that works "good enough" (for those who don't mind a momentary video glitch), as-is, for those who don't use their TiVo in a way that the scheduler bug would occur?

I was OK with the "blink and you might miss it" glitch, and not affected by the scheduler issue. So, I'd turn it on, if it was an optional function.
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Old 09-13-2014, 12:28 PM   #71
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Well it seems this question has been answered, but in a different way than I was hoping for.

Still, a $50 Roamio OTA will work with a stream, so for the same price as a basic you can get 4-tuners and streaming if you don't need cable support.
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Old 09-13-2014, 10:13 PM   #72
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Why remove OTA capability from a higher end model anyway?
Because if you are rich enough to be able to afford the high end model, you can afford cable.
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Old 09-14-2014, 10:48 AM   #73
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Because if you are rich enough to be able to afford the high end model, you can afford cable.
There isn't a correlation between the financial ability to afford cable and the desire to have it.

I have Comcast running to my house right now for internet only, but am OTA for my televisions by choice. I realize that my situation my well be unique, but the return on outlay is what drove my decision.
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Old 09-14-2014, 11:37 AM   #74
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There isn't a correlation between the financial ability to afford cable and the desire to have it.

I have Comcast running to my house right now for internet only, but am OTA for my televisions by choice. I realize that my situation my well be unique, but the return on outlay is what drove my decision.
I got tired of paying the cable and dish companies over a thousand dollars a year to have channels that I never watched.
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Old 09-14-2014, 01:06 PM   #75
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I got tired of paying the cable and dish companies over a thousand dollars a year to have channels that I never watched.
You were paying thousands of dollars a year to have channels that you could watch anytime you wanted.
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Old 09-14-2014, 02:45 PM   #76
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You were paying thousands of dollars a year to have channels that you could watch anytime you wanted.
Yeah, Like paying that money to watch channels that were a little less interesting than watching paint dry.
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Old 09-14-2014, 02:55 PM   #77
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Yeah, Like paying that money to watch channels that were a little less interesting than watching paint dry.
You have to paint something before you can watch it dry. And you have to have paint.
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