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Old 03-04-2014, 01:42 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Phantom Gremlin View Post
Okay, is this statement on the level or are you being sarcastic? I haven't been here in a while (everything has been working flawlessly), so I haven't followed the Roamio developments.
Last I read, TiVo is getting out of the hardware business, so Roamio is the last horse out of the gate...

http://arstechnica.com/business/2014...ardware-plans/
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Old 03-04-2014, 01:45 PM   #32
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Last I read, TiVo is getting out of the hardware business, so Roamio is the last horse out of the gate...

http://arstechnica.com/business/2014...ardware-plans/
I thought that was refuted. Did you read the article you linked to? If that's in there please quote it hear. (I only read the first paragraph and I thought it confirmed the refutation.)
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Old 03-04-2014, 07:44 PM   #33
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Okay, is this statement on the level or are you being sarcastic? I haven't been here in a while (everything has been working flawlessly), so I haven't followed the Roamio developments.

The reason I ask is one of my working TiVo HD boxes got updated to this problem code, and TiVo sent me the email about giving me a replacement Premiere box for my broken HD.

The problem is that my TiVo HD boxes work fine (or at least used to) so I don't want to change anything. The other problem is that Premiere boxes had a lot of ongoing teething problems that I'm never sure were fully solved. So I've avoided upgrades and just kept my working boxes.

So what should I do:

1) should I restore my HD to a version of the old software (copied from another HD I have)? Would that fix the problem? Would a straight "dd" copy from a good HD drive, followed by "clear and delete everything" work? Of course I would need to re-pair my CableCARDs.

2) is the Premiere reliable?

3) is the Roamio reliable (not sure if they will allow me to upgrade at extra cost, I haven't called Tivo yet)?

Are there shows on that HD you want to save that you can't copy off to computer?

There's a trick you might be able to try.

Do you already have any experience with WinMFS?

Do you have a (temporarily) spare harddrive around that's at least as big as the one in the HD?
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Old 03-05-2014, 05:14 PM   #34
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The upgrade broke my ability to download programs from the tivo to any of my computers.
I have a series 3 with a DVR expander.
They think "Maybe" I can get the data to the new roamio with a crossover cable when the box arrives.

Any suggestions? I stand to lose over 500 programs, some of which will not ever be on again.
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Old 03-05-2014, 05:48 PM   #35
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I'm just amazed at the calmness with which this is being tolerated.

You can't do MRV or Tivo to Go with most channels on the Premiers and Roamios, can you? On ANY channels with TWC right?

Why would taking a box away from you that does these things, for one that doesn't, be tolerated? Maybe I've missed something?
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Old 03-05-2014, 07:08 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Wil View Post
I'm just amazed at the calmness with which this is being tolerated.

You can't do MRV or Tivo to Go with most channels on the Premiers and Roamios, can you? On ANY channels with TWC right?

Why would taking a box away from you that does these things, for one that doesn't, be tolerated? Maybe I've missed something?
+1
In general I scoff when someone proposes a class-action law suit but I wonder if this snafu might be a realistic candidate. I have a Tivo HD that fortunately hasn't been affected, but I wouldn't want to be forced to replace it with a Premiere or upgrade to a Roamio at additional cost. Neither option suits my usage as well as the THD. And there's the matter of the 1 TB internal upgrade I would lose. As I already stated, I'm amazed that the design of the HD is so bad that there's no acceptable way to undo the 11.3 error.
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Old 03-05-2014, 07:48 PM   #37
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Even though I think TiVo is doing a good job addressing this mistake, a Roamio at a small price or Premiere for free, I am still happy with my TiVoHDs so I am grateful to not have to deal with the swap. Both of mine are still on 11.0.

Mistakes are made but not all companies offer fair solutions like TiVo is doing here. After almost 14 years doing business with TiVo, I am impressed with how TiVo treats its customers, far better than most in my experience.
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Old 03-05-2014, 08:17 PM   #38
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I'm just amazed at the calmness with which this is being tolerated.

You can't do MRV or Tivo to Go with most channels on the Premiers and Roamios, can you? On ANY channels with TWC right?

Why would taking a box away from you that does these things, for one that doesn't, be tolerated? Maybe I've missed something?
The treatment of TWC to its customers is the same with all digital programming. Now with a premiere/roamio users who were restricted for all but OTA content can at least stream (MRS). That was not possible before.

How can an old S3 do these things?
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Old 03-05-2014, 08:19 PM   #39
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I'm amazed that the design of the HD is so bad that there's no acceptable way to undo the 11.3 error.
It may not be that there is no way to do this, but this may be the cheapest (for whatever reason) or offer the least impact financially (say there was a bunch of old P* that would never sell anyhow).
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:03 PM   #40
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It may not be that there is no way to do this, but this may be the cheapest (for whatever reason) or offer the least impact financially (say there was a bunch of old P* that would never sell anyhow).
If there is a way to do it, Tivo should offer that to those who would prefer to keep their THD's. I suspect there would be takers even if it meant shipping their THD back to Tivo for a week or two, with Tivo covering shipping both ways of course.

There are good reasons some of us prefer THD's to the later models. Roamios won't mix OTA and cable, and Premiere's have slow UI issues and slightly poorer OTA sensitivity.
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Last edited by dlfl : 03-05-2014 at 09:08 PM.
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:31 PM   #41
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You can't do MRV or Tivo to Go with most channels on the Premiers and Roamios, can you? On ANY channels with TWC right?
WTH are you talking about? A Premiere or Roamio has the exact same transfer capabilities in that area as a stock Series 3 plus they support MRS and h.264, which the Series 3s do not.
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:43 PM   #42
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WTH are you talking about? A Premiere or Roamio has the exact same transfer capabilities in that area as a stock Series 3
I guess I forgot for an instant what forum I was on when I posted that. Sorry.
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Old 03-06-2014, 12:16 AM   #43
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I guess I forgot for an instant what forum I was on when I posted that. Sorry.
Even allowing for that, your statement was overly broad. If you had limited it to TWC and the like, it would have been OK, but at least here, Comcast only copy prohibits premium channels.

That brings up one other possible advantage for the Premiere and Roamio - Comcast is supposedly rolling out VOD system wide.
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Old 03-06-2014, 12:32 AM   #44
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your statement was overly broad
No. Wrong place, but accurate. With the new merger it will be a considerable understatement of the crippled functionality of newer Tivos.
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Old 03-06-2014, 03:54 AM   #45
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Are there shows on that HD you want to save that you can't copy off to computer?

There's a trick you might be able to try.

Do you already have any experience with WinMFS?

Do you have a (temporarily) spare harddrive around that's at least as big as the one in the HD?
Yes I do have files that I can't copy off. Reason being that they were recorded under Frontier FiOS and their settings didn't allow that. Now I'm with Comcast and copying is much more liberal.

I've run WinMFS, but that was almost 4 years ago.

Is there a way I can transfer old files from my broken TiVoHD to a replacement Roamio?
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Old 03-06-2014, 04:01 AM   #46
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No. Wrong place, but accurate. With the new merger it will be a considerable understatement of the crippled functionality of newer Tivos.
Are you saying that if/when Comcast acquires TWC, the successor company will be more like "pure evil" TWC than "semi evil" Comcast in terms of CCI bytes that allow copying? Can today's Roamio transfer files to a computer under Comcast (assuming CCI allows it)?

I'm thinking (hoping?) that since Comcast is the acquirer, their policies will prevail. Of course, I wish this merger *wouldn't* go thru, but I'd be willing to bet even money that it does occur.
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Old 03-06-2014, 04:10 AM   #47
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The upgrade broke my ability to download programs from the tivo to any of my computers.
I have a series 3 with a DVR expander.
Can you transfer a newly recorded program from the bad TiVo to anywhere else? Is your problem only with old programs?

I got hit with this upgrade. But I just now checked and I am still able to transfer a program that was recorded less than 24 hours ago. But that's TiVo->TiVo, I haven't fired up kmttg to see if that still works.

So far I haven't noticed anything wrong with my box. I wonder how insidious the slow corruption will be? BTW I don't have an expander, my two WD expanders broke, what a waste of money they were.
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Old 03-06-2014, 08:25 AM   #48
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I'm thinking (hoping?) that since Comcast is the acquirer, their policies will prevail. Of course, I wish this merger *wouldn't* go thru, but I'd be willing to bet even money that it does occur.
I would not count on that. A merger often gives way to "best practices", whatever that means. Both companies are reviled, so my estimation is that would be a cost/financial measure on the CC1, and not customer experience...
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Old 03-06-2014, 11:02 AM   #49
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I would not count on that. A merger often gives way to "best practices", whatever that means. Both companies are reviled, so my estimation is that would be a cost/financial measure on the CC1, and not customer experience...
With the way Comcast currently works, there may not be any changes.
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Old 03-06-2014, 11:32 AM   #50
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Has anyone tried calling who didn't get 11.3, and successfully got offered a free premier or a discounted roamio, by mentioning the email in the original post?

I know Tivo would know your software versions, but wondering if anyone tried and had any success?
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Old 03-06-2014, 11:56 AM   #51
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Wow, what a statement about ethical behavior...let's see if I can take advantage of Tivo's trying to do the right thing for those affected even though I'm not. Great idea.........on the other hand, maybe not.
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Old 03-06-2014, 12:14 PM   #52
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Wow, what a statement about ethical behavior...let's see if I can take advantage of Tivo's trying to do the right thing for those affected even though I'm not. Great idea.........on the other hand, maybe not.
If you are upfront about it (and how could you not given they know your software revisions), and they willingly offer it to you, how would that be unethical?

I was equating it to more of a call to the cable company or a call to the cell phone company, asking to reduce your bill. They have no obligation to do it, but if they do you luck out.

Kinda the same scenario here. If you call, and they give it to you, that's their decision.

With that being said, I'm glad to see Tivo being very customer-friendly as the situation is one they created.
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Old 03-06-2014, 01:19 PM   #53
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Can you transfer a newly recorded program from the bad TiVo to anywhere else? Is your problem only with old programs?

I got hit with this upgrade. But I just now checked and I am still able to transfer a program that was recorded less than 24 hours ago. But that's TiVo->TiVo, I haven't fired up kmttg to see if that still works.

So far I haven't noticed anything wrong with my box. I wonder how insidious the slow corruption will be? BTW I don't have an expander, my two WD expanders broke, what a waste of money they were.
No. I cannot see the series 3 from any version of TivoDesktop or from my series 2 box. I can ping it and it can talk to Tivo corporate. I cannot login via the web either.
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Old 03-06-2014, 02:11 PM   #54
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Yes I do have files that I can't copy off. Reason being that they were recorded under Frontier FiOS and their settings didn't allow that. Now I'm with Comcast and copying is much more liberal.

I've run WinMFS, but that was almost 4 years ago.

Is there a way I can transfer old files from my broken TiVoHD to a replacement Roamio?
Since I don't know how this "upgrade" broke things or exactly what it broke, I have no idea if this will work or not.

You'll need to get another hard drive at least as big and copy the TiVo's drive to it.

I do not know, in this particular case, if it would be better to use

mfscopy

in WinMFS or do a lower level byte for byte "Xerox" with

dd_rescue

or

ddrescue

from a Live Linux cd to do the copying, but the idea is you make a copy and do all the experimenting on the copy and leave the original untouched.

Once you have the copy, you put it in the TiVo to make sure it works, even though it'll have the same problems.

Then you take it back out of the TiVo, hook it back to the PC, go into WinMFS, select that drive, and click on

mfsinfo

to find out if it's set to boot from partitions 2, 3, and 4, or from 5, 6, and 7.

Then you use either option 1 or option 2 of bootfix or fixboot or whatever it's called (still in WinMFS) to make the other set the primary--this should switch you back to the 11.0m installation you had before.

Option 1 sets it for 2, 3, and 4, regardless of where it was, and option 2 sets it for 5, 6, and 7, regardless of where it was.

Then you can use

mfsinfo

again to make sure the change happened and that things still look okay.

Then you put it in the TiVo to see if it boots up to 11.0m


Another experiment is to make the copy and restore an 11.0m image to the copy, which will overwrite some if not all of the partitions that come before the MFS pairs, and then see if when you boot that in the TiVo and let it go through the fixing the TiVo Service Number mismatch (that'll be the Green Screen 3 hour thing) and then go through Guided Setup, see if the shows are still there, since theoretically the MFS partitions shouldn't be overwritten by the new image, except for the parts at the beginning that identify them as partitions, which should be the same as what gets overwritten.
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Old 03-06-2014, 06:57 PM   #55
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Then you use either option 1 or option 2 of bootfix or fixboot or whatever it's called (still in WinMFS) to make the other set the primary--this should switch you back to the 11.0m installation you had before.
Very interesting. I didn't know I could do that.

Of course, if TiVo pushes *another* update, then the original 11.0m will be lost!
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Old 03-06-2014, 09:05 PM   #56
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Very interesting. I didn't know I could do that.

Of course, if TiVo pushes *another* update, then the original 11.0m will be lost!
As I say, I have no idea if it will actually work or if the "update" hosed enough stuff not in those 3 partitions that it won't, but if it does, make a truncated backup immediately.
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Old 03-06-2014, 09:38 PM   #57
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Since I've been looking to buy used equipment, I'll need to keep an eye on the version number too.
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Old 03-15-2014, 10:02 AM   #58
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Should I call even though I haven't rec'd the email?

My Series 3 OLED w/ 500GB WD expander up at our place in the mountains was working fine in January, but I just discovered it has stopped working.

Swapping power supplies with another Series 3 OLED didn't solve the problem.

I only get the initial "welcome powering up" screen then a grey screen & all indicators on the front panel stay lit.
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Old 03-15-2014, 01:10 PM   #59
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I've only seen HD models reported as getting the 11.3 code by accident. If it's not power supply then I would expect hard drive (and especially with the external expander).

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Old 03-15-2014, 04:15 PM   #60
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Should I call even though I haven't rec'd the email?

My Series 3 OLED w/ 500GB WD expander up at our place in the mountains was working fine in January, but I just discovered it has stopped working.

Swapping power supplies with another Series 3 OLED didn't solve the problem.

I only get the initial "welcome powering up" screen then a grey screen & all indicators on the front panel stay lit.
If you still had the original 250GB drive in there, it's probably dead or dying, but hook it to a PC and run WD's own long test to see if the drive itself is okay or not.

Within the past few months I got good deals on 2 lifetimed 648s because their original hard drives had gone bad or were in the process of doing so, and seen reports here at TCF of other 648 owners seeing the same thing, so I suspect it's a trend.

But as far as we know the mistaken push out of 11.3 was only the 652 version to some S3 HDs.
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