Best Buy, TiVo form an alliance [Text View]

Malcontent

07-09-2009, 10:06 AM

http://news.cnet.com/Best-Buy%2C-TiVo-form-an-alliance/2100-1041_3-6249861.html

TiVo, the Silicon Valley company that popularized the digital video recorder, and Best Buy, the national electronics chain, are forging a broad partnership.

On Thursday, the companies plan to announce that Best Buy will heavily promote TiVo products in its 1,100 stores in the United States. TiVo will develop a version of its set-top box, to be sold in Best Buy stores, that will let the retailer advertise its products and services to TiVo subscribers on their home televisions.

The companies did not disclose financial details other than to say that Best Buy was making a multiyear commitment to advertise TiVo devices. Tom Rogers, TiVo's chief executive, said it was "a huge step above any kind of marketing that has ever been done for TiVo before."

As part of the deal, the companies also said that Best Buy would finance an effort to bring TiVo's software and search tools to Best Buy's own brand of consumer electronics, like its Insignia high-definition TVs.

ZeoTiVo

07-09-2009, 10:12 AM

very interesting - could this be the start of lower sub prices due to advertising? And porting what part of TiVo software to HDTVs? I would assume the interactive advertising and search your guide like the Beta of TiVo search does.

ETA -cool, from the bottom of that article is a quote on how the ads are envisioned. now this is the kind of advertising I have wanted (well actually I wanted extended Victoria's Secret ads but this is a close second ;))

As part of the deal, Best Buy also plans to use TiVo to offer advice and guidance on products like HDTVs and digital cameras and provide ways to buy these products via the television remote control. TiVo currently offers its users ways to order pizzas, buy products on Amazon and get movie tickets from Fandango from their TV sets.

blacknoi

07-09-2009, 10:21 AM

I was going to post this (as I saw the article on Engadget.com) but thought it would already be up here.

This is an interesting story and I really want to see what the final product will look like. Will it be littered with intrusive ads, etc?

Amnesia

07-09-2009, 10:32 AM

The engadget (http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/09/tivo-and-best-buy-alliance-to-yield-co-branded-dvr-tivo-softwar/) version of the story says that we shouldn't expect to see these hit the shelves until early next year.

innocentfreak

07-09-2009, 11:02 AM

Official press release...

Tivo Press Release (http://tivo.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=395)

I don't know if I really see the benefit yet unless the boxes cost less or their is a discount on the subscription fees.

RoyK

07-09-2009, 11:17 AM

.... Will it be littered with intrusive ads, etc?

Since the interface is already littered with intrusive ads that would be a safe assumption.....

moyekj

07-09-2009, 11:20 AM

Wow, a marriage of 2 things I detest: Best Buy and Tivo ads.

One can only hope this means Tivo may let up on ads on current boxes but I doubt that will be the case - in fact I wouldn't be surprised if many of the software updates designed for maximizing ad placements on the Best Buy boxes make it to current models as well...

parzec

07-09-2009, 11:31 AM

I always thought a DVR built into a TV would be an excellent idea -- will be interesting to see what they do with it. I assume that BB will sell boxes/sets with lifetime service included in the price of the unit at a reduced rate, in return for the BB ads. Most people can't justify monthly service fees for what to them seems like just guide data. I think a "plug and play" no-subscription concept will help Tivo survive.

Amnesia

07-09-2009, 11:45 AM

Really? I always thought a TV+DVR was a terrible idea.

What happens when you want to get a new TV? Or a new DVR? Now you need to replace them both...

fyodor

07-09-2009, 11:50 AM

Really? I always thought a TV+DVR was a terrible idea.

What happens when you want to get a new TV? Or a new DVR? Now you need to replace them both...

Well, you can always get an external DVR and just use the TV like a TV. In that respect you're no worse off than you would have been if you purchased a separate TV and DVR.

As a general rule though, integrated consumer electronics devices tend to be kind of crappy.

innocentfreak

07-09-2009, 11:53 AM

Really? I always thought a TV+DVR was a terrible idea.

What happens when you want to get a new TV? Or a new DVR? Now you need to replace them both...

Well if it becomes common place than you will always have one in the next set. At the same time it is one more thing to go bad.

I would say the TV should at least have a DLB maybe with an hour though since it won't actually be recording shows with trickplay along with the Tivo Guide and it won't do actual recordings. It will pull suggestions from your Tivo account and then flag shows in the guide it recommends. Then again this is what I would do and who knows with Tivo.

modnar

07-09-2009, 12:36 PM

I wonder if Best Buy will still carry the non-BB branded TiVo products.

modnar

07-09-2009, 12:38 PM

Increased marketing in 1,100 stores can only be a good thing for TiVo.

modnar

07-09-2009, 12:40 PM

I wonder if Best Buy will still carry the non-BB branded TiVo products.

From: http://tivo.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=395
As part of the agreement, TiVo and Best Buy plan to investigate development of a unique user interface for TiVo DVRs purchased at Best Buy...
My interpretation is that any set-top TiVos sold at Best Buy would have the Best Buy unique interface.

bkdtv

07-09-2009, 01:18 PM

Amnesia

07-09-2009, 01:34 PM

To me, this article suggests that the next-generation TiVo will launch early next year.I don't know---Best Buy isn't generally known for cutting-edge products...

Joey Bagadonuts

07-09-2009, 02:02 PM

Great, more ads cluttering up the menu. So much for "TV the way you want it".

Dmon4u

07-09-2009, 02:52 PM

Funny, 7 BB stores are within 75 miles of me. None of these have ever carried the XL model. I wonder if there will finally be greater availability of these and other upcoming models, now ?

ZeoTiVo

07-09-2009, 02:56 PM

To me, this article suggests that the next-generation TiVo will launch early next year. I just don't see them rebranding the existing TiVo hardware.

Fingers crossed for a new TivoHD based on the BCM7410 or BCM7420 SoC...

doubtful - though you can be sure that when a new model comes out BB will have first crack at it.

as to the best Buy unique TiVo - this is what that will be about
As part of the agreement, TiVo and Best Buy plan to investigate development of a unique user interface for TiVo DVRs purchased at Best Buy which would provide Best Buy a platform to more effectively market its digital content services, to regularly offer consumers trusted advice and guidance on the digital home experience, and to provide an ongoing dialogue with customers about Best Buy's various retail offerings.

Further I doubt we will see any TiVo software into BB electronics before 2011

samo

07-09-2009, 03:08 PM

Here is my speculation. No insider knowledge, just educated guess.
The BB TiVo will BB branded just like DirecTivo with "powered by TiVo" logo.
The deal most likely be like deals with Comcast and DirecTV - Tivo gets a dollar or so per sub and BB handles all the sales, marketing and subscriptions.
Because BB has no vested interest in blocking any of the TiVo features (like movie downloads or MRV), most likely BB Tivo will have full set of features.
Knowing BB, most likely ads will be intrusive and in your face, but subscription cost if any will be substantially lower than TiVo. Hardware cost will be lower as well. Perhaps it will be lifetime type of service (most likely non transferable) with one time purchase cost just like any other CE product.
BB most likely will offer extended warranty at reasonable price.
Overall it would be a great deal for people who claim that ads don't bother them.

daveak

07-09-2009, 03:19 PM

I've understood that TiVo would like to have others make hardware with their software on it. So a Best Buy branded box (an Insignia DVR?) would not be a great surprise, just based on what current TiVo Box? Or future (not too distant I hope) Series 4 type?

So DirecTV and Best Buy could each have their own box with TiVo software... Now how far along is TiVo with any of the cable guys? I've heard of some (dumbed down?) boxes with TiVo software on it? Any that would even be worth owning?

Any chance TiVo is thinking a Series 4 type box will only be made and sold by others? Or am I just way out there? In other words - Will they exit the hardware business by the time the Series 4 architecture is complete?

Amnesia

07-09-2009, 03:56 PM

Now how far along is TiVo with any of the cable guys? TiVo software is running on Comcast Motorolas DVRs in some areas (including greater Boston).

rainwater

07-09-2009, 03:59 PM

People are misintepreting the press release. TiVo isn't going to put TiVo DVRs inside of Best Buy (aka Insignia) tvs. They will probably release a Insignia branded DVR. Eventually, they want to provide their interface on Insignia/Dynex televisions so that users will have access to online content like Netflix. My guess is they may end up porting their HME api to TVs in the future so they can be the provider of these services.

morac

07-09-2009, 05:42 PM

Hopefully this leads to less things like this (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=369547) occurring.

magnus

07-09-2009, 07:12 PM

+1

Really? I always thought a TV+DVR was a terrible idea.

What happens when you want to get a new TV? Or a new DVR? Now you need to replace them both...

SNJpage1

07-09-2009, 08:11 PM

If they are going to do this then why did BB stop offering the 500 g dvr expander in it's stores?

Bierboy

07-09-2009, 09:59 PM

Really? I always thought a TV+DVR was a terrible idea.

What happens when you want to get a new TV? Or a new DVR? Now you need to replace them both...

Exactly....and the reason TV/VCR combos never took off.
If they are going to do this then why did BB stop offering the 500 g dvr expander in it's stores?

Because they now offer the 1TB?

kmill14

07-09-2009, 10:21 PM

Since the interface is already littered with intrusive ads that would be a safe assumption.....

Pretty funny that the guy who rants most against TiVo's ad initiatives spends an awful lot of time on the medium far and away the most riddled with ads.

You can't go anywhere on the internet now adays without getting tortured with more intrusive ads, yet here you are fighting through or ignoring those ads to rip another device that isn't even close to the same level of annoyance.

wmcbrine

07-09-2009, 10:26 PM

You can't go anywhere on the internet now adays without getting tortured with more intrusive ads,Uh, yeah, you can. AdBlock, dude. I see way more ads on the TiVo than on TCF. Not that your argument makes much sense anyway.

RoyK

07-10-2009, 06:19 AM

...You can't go anywhere on the internet now adays without getting tortured with more intrusive ads, yet here you are fighting through or ignoring those ads to rip another device that isn't even close to the same level of annoyance.

I certainly can -- and do. It's rare that I see an ad when I surf unless I'm specifically shopping for something.

It's most unfortunate that I can't block the ads on TiVo like I can with my browser.

atmuscarella

07-10-2009, 08:54 AM

Really? I always thought a TV+DVR was a terrible idea.

What happens when you want to get a new TV? Or a new DVR? Now you need to replace them both...It really depends on how they do it. Having a full blown DVR built into a TV, that required a subscription wouldn't make any sense to me.

However if the TV was using integrated TiVo software for the TV's menu system that provide the ability to access many of the Internet features a TiVo has at no cost, that would make sense. Then I could also see it having an option to add TiVo DVR functionality by paying for a superscription and adding an external eSata drive.

ZeoTiVo

07-10-2009, 09:29 AM

It really depends on how they do it. Having a full blown DVR built into a TV, that required a subscription wouldn't make any sense to me.

However if the TV was using integrated TiVo software for the TV's menu system that provide the ability to access many of the Internet features a TiVo has at no cost, that would make sense. Then I could also see it having an option to add TiVo DVR functionality by paying for a superscription and adding an external eSata drive.

the press release seemed to me to be about the features you describe above minus any DVR functionality. TiVo CEO also noted that any TiVo software in other BB electronics is some way off - so really even BB and TiVo do not really know what they are doing with that yet.

Squeege96

07-10-2009, 10:56 AM

Either way, I see this as a strong step for TiVo as a whole. The fact is that TiVo really needs to take advantage of any means they can to get consumers not to take the DVR product offered by their MSO/Cable company. For those who are currently "renting" a DVR, there is a significant Cost of Change to go to TiVo. I think if they can use BB to better educate consumers to the additional benefits that TiVo offers (MRV, TTG, External storage, Better interface, etc.), then they might be able to take some additional marketshare.

And while yes, I am not a big fan of the ads, I would rather have that to keep TiVo in business. My brother-in-law has 4 ReplayTV boxes that he bought about the same time that I bought my first TiVo. We both bought lifetime on our machines. (I must admit, I was jealous of the Component and optical outputs that RePlay offered.) Now, 6 years later, I have transferred 2 lifetime Series 2 purchases to HD boxes, and my brother-in-law is kicking himself. He basically has 4 replay machines that get minimal use, and while his units techically sit get "service", there are no updates, upgrades, or future enhancements.

All a matter a perspective, I guess...

ZeoTiVo

07-10-2009, 11:03 AM

Either way, I see this as a strong step for TiVo as a whole. The fact is that TiVo really needs to take advantage of any means they can to get consumers not to take the DVR product offered by their MSO/Cable company. For those who are currently "renting" a DVR, there is a significant Cost of Change to go to TiVo. I think if they can use BB to better educate consumers to the additional benefits that TiVo offers (MRV, TTG, External storage, Better interface, etc.), then they might be able to take some additional marketshare.

yep. TiVo has slashed its marketing budget from 9million down to 1 million. To find a coop marketing deal like this that lets them dramatically boost direct marketing of their product while not spending huge amounts for it is a big deal for TiVo.

I can not wait though for the threads on how Best Buy staff try and sell TiVo DVRs.

Squeege96

07-10-2009, 11:10 AM

I can not wait though for the threads on how Best Buy staff try and sell TiVo DVRs.

Ha! I can see it now: "TiVo will not only record Live TV, but it will clean your house and make you coffee, too!"

I can't tell you how many times I have heard AWFUL advice being given by BB employees to customers...

morac

07-10-2009, 11:33 AM

I can't tell you how many times I have heard AWFUL advice being given by BB employees to customers...

From which of the 7 types (http://gizmodo.com/5311140/the-seven-types-of-employees-you-meet-at-best-buy)? :)

chestnu1

07-10-2009, 12:33 PM

Depending on where they go with this it could be very interesting.

NotVeryWitty

07-10-2009, 12:56 PM

I would be much more excited if this deal was with Amazon. While Amazon does not currently have a private label for consumer electronics, I suspect it's only a matter of time.

I would happily put up with Amazon ads (so long as they were no more intrusive than the current ads on Tivo) if it meant a free or substantially reduced service rate. I buy very little from Best Buy, but much more from Amazon.

Amnesia

07-10-2009, 01:12 PM

Best Buy isn't just a place to buy things---it's a brick-and-mortar store were people can actually see products in action and ask real-time questions to employees. Not to mention that the products are on display so that people who are in the store to buy something else can see the units and get interested.

Amazon has low prices. That's about it.

Best Buy is definitely a much better fit for this.

morac

07-10-2009, 06:12 PM

TiVo already has a deal with Amazon, though not the same as the one with Best Buy.

http://www.amazon.com/tivo

Johncv

07-10-2009, 07:08 PM

I am under the impression that there more going on between Best Buy and TiVo that both sides are letting on. This article from Seeking Alpha point to some intriguing ideals.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/148140-best-buy-s-digital-land-grab

The part that has me curious is near the end:

“...there's one final tidbit that could differentiate Best Buy's future digital offering from other direct-to-TV content plays that are likely to emerge over the coming months: Best Buy and Sonic Solutions/CinemaNow content will leverage Widevine Technologies Inc. 's digital rights management (DRM) technology to secure content across multiple devices.

By doing so, Best Buy could enable a consumer to buy a title once, either through its online store or through a CinemaNow-connected device, and watch it on multiple platforms. That means the consumer could, theoretically, choose to watch the title on an Insignia big-screen TV, download it to a PC, or possibly even take it along with a portable DVD player or other mobile device. There are lots of interesting possibilities here.

Best Buy declined to comment on this story.“

Interesting possibilities. Comment anyone.

ZeoTiVo

07-10-2009, 08:08 PM

I am under the impression that there more going on between Best Buy and TiVo that both sides are letting on. This article from Seeking Alpha point to some intriguing ideals.

yep, the bigger news is that TiVo has another partner for its software side of the house and TiVo does not have to worry about making the hardware. However that is new ground so I would not expect to se any fruits of this even in 2011 but off in 2012 instead. However those fruits could be great for TiVo doing a software only deal and finally getting traction with its core competence.

bicker

07-11-2009, 07:46 AM

Given that the alternative to TiVo is not having TiVo, and that TiVo making money actually fosters the chances of having TiVo, this has to be viewed as good news for people who enjoy having an alternative option to the cable-company provided DVR.

Bierboy

07-11-2009, 08:05 AM

Best Buy isn't just a place to buy things---it's a brick-and-mortar store were people can actually see products in action and ask real-time questions to employees.....

....and get answers that make absolutely NO SENSE.

davezatz

07-11-2009, 08:37 AM

I always thought a DVR built into a TV would be an excellent idea -- will be interesting to see what they do with it.

They started to go down this path once before. Was supposed to launch in 2005, but didn't. Hm. Was looking forward to it, even with a small screen (26") and high price tag ($2500).

http://www.weblogsinc.com/common/images/1377385527338151.jpg?0.8860857577449384 (http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2009-07/tivo-and-best-buy-to-develop-dvr-tv/)

By doing so, Best Buy could enable a consumer to buy a title once, either through its online store or through a CinemaNow-connected device, and watch it on multiple platforms. That means the consumer could, theoretically, choose to watch the title on an Insignia big-screen TV, download it to a PC, or possibly even take it along with a portable DVD player or other mobile device. There are lots of interesting possibilities here.
Like iTunes and Amazon Unbox. What's new/different here? (Other than being TiVo, of course.)

LADYBUGBLUE2002

07-11-2009, 09:06 AM

I wonder how this will affect us Canada Best Buy options. Hopefully this opens a door to a HD version of Tivo that can be used up here as well, even if it takes a bit more time for it to occur.

Johncv

07-12-2009, 05:39 PM

They started to go down this path once before. Was supposed to launch in 2005, but didn't. Hm. Was looking forward to it, even with a small screen (26") and high price tag ($2500).

http://www.weblogsinc.com/common/images/1377385527338151.jpg?0.8860857577449384 (http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2009-07/tivo-and-best-buy-to-develop-dvr-tv/)

Unless it came with lifetime, I don’t think Humax would sold very many at $3000.00 which is probably why it was never brought to market. Most likely TiVo and Humax could not agree for term for lifetime on the thing.

Sure would like to know who the lucky person is who has the prototype. :rolleyes:

Like iTunes and Amazon Unbox. What's new/different here? (Other than being TiVo, of course.)

Not like iTunes or Amazon, what different here is that the DRM being use would allow, in theory, download to any device, iPod, PSP, cellphone, DVD, computer, etc., no matter who make the device. Please note the items in bold.

Johncv

07-12-2009, 05:52 PM

I wonder how this will affect us Canada Best Buy options. Hopefully this opens a door to a HD version of Tivo that can be used up here as well, even if it takes a bit more time for it to occur.

Ladybugblue, How dose cable in Canada operate, correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that you go to say Best Buy or Amazon and buy whatever cablebox/DVR you want and just hook it up. Or is more complicate then just using cable cards. What the process you go through in Canada?

classicsat

07-12-2009, 09:21 PM

I wonder how this will affect us Canada Best Buy options. Hopefully this opens a door to a HD version of Tivo that can be used up here as well, even if it takes a bit more time for it to occur.

It won't matter one iota. It is the content industry (namely cable providers) and regulators at fault for not allowing/using the technology that would allow 3rd party direct-tune equipment to be.

LADYBUGBLUE2002

07-12-2009, 10:39 PM

LADYBUGBLUE2002

07-12-2009, 10:40 PM

It won't matter one iota. It is the content industry (namely cable providers) and regulators at fault for not allowing/using the technology that would allow 3rd party direct-tune equipment to be.

I guess as much, but I am hoping. :)

bicker

07-13-2009, 05:50 AM

It is the content industry (namely cable providers) and regulators at fault for not allowing/using the technology that would allow 3rd party direct-tune equipment to be.And once you go there, then you reach the reality: That the fault rests with the miscreant consumers who would take service that they didn't pay for if it wasn't adequately locked down.

Full circle.

classicsat

07-13-2009, 10:24 AM

Ladybugblue, How dose cable in Canada operate, correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that you go to say Best Buy or Amazon and buy whatever cablebox/DVR you want and just hook it up. Or is more complicate then just using cable cards. What the process you go through in Canada?

Cable in Canada works the same as in the US, pre-cablecard.

The only difference is many providers let you buy the box retail (they have partnerships with retailers to shelf boxes) or from them. The catch though, is that in most cases, the box sold by a particular provider can only be used with that provider, but it is usually system wide, for instance a Rogers box bought in Toronto can work in London. A Rogers box will not work on Videotron though, despite both being Scientific Atlanta/Cisco systems. And, so long as the box is "clean" and for the same system, you can buy customer owned boxes off the second hand market and use them.

In short, you cannot buy what box you want, you must buy or rent what your provider offers themselves or through their retail partners.