Will it/won't it? (TiVo + Virgin HD)

[ptruman]

Righty ho, not long ago I upgraded to a shiny new 1080p LCD telly, and have a PS3 for BD playback.

I have Virgin Cable TV for my SD feed, and TiVo has been playing happily with that for about 6 years.

I'm now considering getting the V+ HD box, however these gives me obvious questions...

a) V+ has both HDMI and SCART output. Does it allow for output on BOTH, or only one (selected in menu?)

b) If it's both, does it 'downscale' anything HD for SCART transmission, or does it only allow SD content over SCART?

In a nutshell, if I plug a new V+ HD box in, is TiVo going to get cut off of my loop?

[OzSat]

TiVo works fine on a V+ box - it will also record the HD channel although not in HD quality.

You can record to TiVo while still having the HDMI connection active.

The only problem is you can not record on TiVo if you are using V+ for something else.

[RichardJH]

TiVo works fine on a V+ box - it will also record the HD channel although not in HD quality.

You can record to TiVo while still having the HDMI connection active.

The only problem is you can not record on TiVo if you are using V+ for something else.

If you have the HDMI output active in HD the only scart output is via the VCR scart and then it is only in composite which I found gave a poor picture via Tivo on an HD TV.

True the HDMI and TV scart will both be active when V+ is only set to SD and then the TV scart outputs RGB.

A real nuisance if you do want to watch HD programming in 720 or 1080.

My solution so as to get the best out of both Tivo and V+ was to get a second standard cable box and leave that dedicated to the Tivo.

[ptruman]

Hmm, the issue for me is a few fold.

1) V+ box uses standard IR, so I can use the interactive stuff from my Pronto (bonus)

2) *IF* I replace the existing box with a V+, I don't lose any space (can't have both)

3) I can't really have myself and/or t'missus having to flick in/out of HD modes just to suit TiVo.

I've not seen any mad difference in Composite/RGB on my existing setup, so if I run HDMI and the VCR out

a) does the VCR output see whatever is on HDMI (albeit in SD) ?
b) does TiVo still get to control the channels?

[RichardJH]

Hmm, the issue for me is a few fold.

1) V+ box uses standard IR, so I can use the interactive stuff from my Pronto (bonus)

2) *IF* I replace the existing box with a V+, I don't lose any space (can't have both)

3) I can't really have myself and/or t'missus having to flick in/out of HD modes just to suit TiVo.

I've not seen any mad difference in Composite/RGB on my existing setup, so if I run HDMI and the VCR out

a) does the VCR output see whatever is on HDMI (albeit in SD) ?
b) does TiVo still get to control the channels?

a) Yes the VCR scart outputs whatever is playing on the V+ box. Handy if you want to record anything that you are playing from iplayer or catch up TV.

b) Yes but you need to remember that if you are watching something that you have recorded on the V+ the Tivo will not be able to take control.
This is because the the V+ although it has 3 tuners the Tivo can only control the front end viewing tuner which is also used when playing back a recording from the V+ hard drive. The other 2 tuners are for recording only.

So in effect you can record 3 channels at the same time 2 on V+ and 1 on Tivo.

I know it works because that is how my original setup was BUT because of the difficulties of finding a non recording Tivo slot to enable the watching of V+ recordings I gave up and went for the 2nd box.

That is IMHO the best option and the second box can be hidden away because only Tivo needs to know its there.

I hope this helps

Richard

[ptruman]

I still see the snagette of if you watch anything through the TiVo though it'll only be in SD - so you can't select BBC 1 HD from the TiVo UI and watch it in HD....hmmm, I suspect some cunning macro bobbins maybe in order...

[RichardJH]

I still see the snagette of if you watch anything through the TiVo though it'll only be in SD - so you can't select BBC 1 HD from the TiVo UI and watch it in HD....hmmm, I suspect some cunning macro bobbins maybe in order...

If you are happy to use the composite VCR output to feed the Tivo then you can leave the V+ box set to HD output via HDMI. Use the Tivo UI to switch to BBC1 HD and then switch the TV to the HDMI input and watch your programme in HD.

If you are wanting to use a macro to actually switch the V+ between HD and SD I wish you luck. I didn't have a lot of luck because of the way the the V+ UI asks for a confirmation input after a time delay that I wasn't able to match to my Harmony remote

[ptruman]

I have a Philips Pronto RU990 that (so far) has been spot on for all my needs - only being foxed when LG provided new F/W for my TV which altered the startup time, meaning I had to adjust some delay parameters.

I do however have an issue with my LG TV and TiVo on AV1, whereby something TiVo does/sends stops my LG responding to it's remote - I normally have to power TiVo off (standby) before it'll wake back up - so the option of a macro may be a must, unless I can sort out what's upsetting AV1...

[RichardJH]

I have a Philips Pronto RU990 that (so far) has been spot on for all my needs - only being foxed when LG provided new F/W for my TV which altered the startup time, meaning I had to adjust some delay parameters.

I do however have an issue with my LG TV and TiVo on AV1, whereby something TiVo does/sends stops my LG responding to it's remote - I normally have to power TiVo off (standby) before it'll wake back up - so the option of a macro may be a must, unless I can sort out what's upsetting AV1...

interesting that you have an LG TV as well (mines a plasma 32").
I have 2 Tivos on AV1 and AV2 and originally had a problem sorting out means of direct input switching by using macros on my Harmony remote but kept finding that it didn't always work correctly especially if the last input was either TV or Radio. The TV remote only has a single input button to choose and then scroll through inputs.

However I realised that the remote codes downloaded from the Harmony website included direct input options that are not on the LG remote and they worked fine.

[RichardJH]

I do however have an issue with my LG TV and TiVo on AV1

Try switching TV scart control to "OFF" in the Tivo menu :-
Messages & Setup/Recorder & Phone setup/Scart Settings

That should sort your AV1 problem.

[ptruman]

I shall try killing SCART control - think I did already but I'll try again :)

My LG LCD has discrete codes for each input - although they are not public - I used my Pronto to capture some original remote keys, downloaded the CCF, pasted the code into CCF2IR, and then once I had the Device ID, ran "makehex" and HEX2CCF to generate buttons sending codes 0 thru 255, and mapped them all.

The only "fun" bit was finding the "reset settings" button which has no confirmation :(

[ptruman]

Righto, new V+ box installed.

I have it set to HDMI 1080 (not wide), and SCART AV2 is connected to TiVo, and yes, I can switch between HDMI and AV and it is downscaling BBC HD etc.

However, what I cannot (currently) resolve it this :

Any 16:9 program via HDMI is working in the right scale, and anything 4:3 also displays ok - but when I switch to TiVo, it's only 4:3, and won't switch....so, do I :

a) have a duff SCART lead betwixt TiVo and the TV (this hasn't changed, and was working before)
b) have a duff SCART lead between V+ and TiVo (this MAY have changed)
c) lump it and manually switch?

[RichardJH]

V+ AV2 is composite only so AFAIK it doesn't carry the switching line.

How did you get on with the AV1 TV issue that you had ?

[Trinitron]

Isn't HDMI fixed at 16:9? Is the V+ box sending the same output to the scart, giving you 4:3 output in 16:9 format?

[ptruman]

No, there are two 1080 options - 1080 and 1080 "wide" - the latter fixes 1080 at 16:9, regardless of format - i.e. over HDMI, 4:3 will appear "stretched".

In normal "1080" the HDMI shows 4:3 in 4:3, and 16:9 and in 16:9 - but the AV2 output (to TiVo) is showing 4:3 (compressed) and I have to manually flip TV size.

[ptruman]

V+ AV2 is composite only so AFAIK it doesn't carry the switching line.

How did you get on with the AV1 TV issue that you had ?

So far I've not noticed an issue - but then I've been too busy pratting around with the V+ box and complaining about lack of W/S switching....(still, if that's the only major downside, I can add the proportion buttons to the remote)

Given we were out after the box was put in, and then I didn't get to play with it properly till nearly 11:00pm, I suspect the reason it wasn't changing channels is as I left the IRDA wands in (duh!)

[ptruman]

...and the only other fun thing I've now found (which is fairly obvious) is that if I'm using the V+ remote, and switch channels, TiVo has no idea where it is - so I've macro'd a "sync" button to change channel + and - via TiVo, which controls the V+ box, so it knows where it is, with only minor interruption to the channel being viewed.

[OzSat]

Isn't HDMI fixed at 16:9? Is the V+ box sending the same output to the scart, giving you 4:3 output in 16:9 format?Unlike the Sky box - if a 4:3 image is to be displayed on HDMI - the stb will put in the black left/right bars - so it appears 4:3.

[incognito56]

I can't get the TiVo to change the channels on the V+ Box. What codes are people using?

[mikerr]

V+ Box: Scientific Atlanta 20009 Slow

..though some use the code 20020 instead.

[tonywalk]

Unlike the Sky box - if a 4:3 image is to be displayed on HDMI - the stb will put in the black left/right bars - so it appears 4:3.

???? Mine doesn't. Original Thomson Sky HD box.

[tonywalk]

...and the only other fun thing I've now found (which is fairly obvious) is that if I'm using the V+ remote, and switch channels, TiVo has no idea where it is - so I've macro'd a "sync" button to change channel + and - via TiVo, which controls the V+ box, so it knows where it is, with only minor interruption to the channel being viewed.

The one, and it is only one, gripe I have with my Tivos is the glacially slow channel changing. Its ok when doing normal recording, but unusable for channel surfing.

But then that's what the AUX button is for. Then I just surf using the Sky remotes.

[tonywalk]

I have a Philips Pronto RU990 that (so far) has been spot on for all my needs - only being foxed when LG provided new F/W for my TV which altered the startup time, meaning I had to adjust some delay parameters.

Interesting you have an RU990 (TSU7500) Pronto. I have the earlier-but-very-similar version TSU7000 (RU980). I found I didn't have enough hard buttons for fast direct control of my Tivos.

This was a few years ago. I have just (yesterday) bought a Harmony One (£86 from CCL) and preliminary testing seems to indicate that it will be a goer. It also enables me to directly select the individual inputs on my Toshiba TV which is a big plus over its remote control.

[poppadave]

Sorry, probably being a thickie here, but I'm not grasping this.

All the threads I've read say that when outputting SD or HD via HDMI cable with V+ set to HD output, all other outputs (scart and rf) are disabled. It used to be able to do this, but this facility was disabled a while ago with a "software update." To make them both work the V+ has to be set to output SD.

This thread seems to say different, ie:

If you are happy to use the composite VCR output to feed the Tivo then you can leave the V+ box set to HD output via HDMI. Use the Tivo UI to switch to BBC1 HD and then switch the TV to the HDMI input and watch your programme in HD.

and

TiVo works fine on a V+ box - it will also record the HD channel although not in HD quality.

You can record to TiVo while still having the HDMI connection active.

and
a) Yes the VCR scart outputs whatever is playing on the V+ box. Handy if you want to record anything that you are playing from iplayer or catch up TV.

So does everyone with V+ connected to tivo only output from V+ in SD? The first quote seems to say this is not true, even though everywhere else I've looked says otherwise. :confused:

One thread did mention the VCR scart, but said it only outputted when the V+ was told to archive something, not all the time, so seemed useless for tivo. (The thread was about a chap that wanted to watch tv in his bedroom via either aerial cable output or a wireless extender. He wasn't bothered about tv control, just wanted the picture upstairs.)

Like I said probably me=thickie...

[cwaring]

I think this was the case but has since been changed by software upgrade. Right idea, wrong way round ;) (Though that's only from memory. I'm still using my Tivo ;))

[poppadave]

:) I want to carry on using my tivo too. :)

Virgin have said I can have a V+ box for £50 with no monthly charge as I'm on TVXL.

I'm trying to decide if I should go for the deal so I can have some (limited) HD content using their on-demand service and the 4 upcoming channels, but still use tivo controlling the V+ box for my everyday recording.

Also does anybody know if V+ showing SD over scart is better quality or the same as a standard virgin box?

[mikerr]

V+ SD is noticablely better quality than my standard (old) DVB4200 cable box.

Newer boxes may be better quality though.

[cwaring]

Well, it looks like my Tivo might be being retired sooner than I thought.

I was just on the phone to VM discussing a change to my phone service and, out of the blue and with no prompting or hinting, was offered a V+ for absolutely nothing; free install, nothing extra on my bill and I don't have to keep my current box at a fiver a month.

Caveats: 1. I am a long, long-time customer and they know it. 2. I am on the XLTV pack and this did require a new 12-month TV service contract.

Now I knew that the V+ can control my Tivo and had intended to run the two side-by-side for a while, but this issue means that that might not be possible as I am quite often watching the Tivo while it is recording; mainly on an evening.

b) Yes but you need to remember that if you are watching something that you have recorded on the V+ the Tivo will not be able to take control. This is because the the V+ although it has 3 tuners the Tivo can only control the front end viewing tuner which is also used when playing back a recording from the V+ hard drive. The other 2 tuners are for recording only.

I will miss the Wishlist function but to be honest I haven't use it in some time anyway.

Plus, of course, the new VM/Tivo is due out at some point this year, with limited public trials (which, natually, I hope to get onto) possibly starting as early as July.

Incidentally, I don't have a HDTV so although I will get the HD version of some channels I won't be able to watch them!

[RichardJH]

Incidentally, I don't have a HDTV so although I will get the HD version of some channels I won't be able to watch them!

Yes you can you will get a nag screen that says you are not connected for HD.
On the V+ box the HD picture over scart is ok. Even the vcr output which is only composite is OK.

[cwaring]

Sweet!