HD Menus Look Lousy

[ed3120]

I just upgraded to a Tivo HD and I'm shocked at how crappy the menus look. Why are the fonts not smoothed? Why is there no option to render the menus at 1920x1080?

The device is obviously jam packed with features, but the first impression based off of the menu system is just lackluster. Does anyone else agree?

[slowbiscuit]

Uh, yeah. But you'll get a lot of argument either way, and it's been hashed to death.

[ed3120]

Uh, yeah. But you'll get a lot of argument either way, and it's been hashed to death.

An argument of people saying the menus look good?

[bkdtv]

An argument of people saying the menus look good?All text is rendered at SD resolution, upconverted to HD, and displayed on a HD background. That's the reason it doesn't look so hot.

The fonts do look a little better on the [discontinued] TiVo Series3. That box used an older CPU, which rendered fonts in a slightly different way.

TiVo could undoubtedly make the text look better on the TiVoHD, but that might require an unacceptable tradeoff in responsiveness. The current TivoHD is based on the same Broadcom BCM7401 CPU as the DirecTV DVRs, and it has relatively limited bus and memory bandwidth. New, faster Broadcom CPUs recently became available, and Moxi takes advantage of such a processor to provide a full 16:9 HD UI.

We know that TiVo is working on a new 16:9 HD interface, based on mockups leaked Youtube last fall. But it is unclear whether we will ever see a true 16:9 HD interface with high-definition text on the current TiVo hardware. You can expect a next-generation TiVo to use a much faster CPU when it is released in a year or two.

The device is obviously jam packed with features, but the first impression based off of the menu system is just lackluster. Does anyone else agree?There's no question the TiVo interface is simple. But simple isn't always bad.

Some other interfaces such as Vista Media Center are "modern" and make the text-based TiVo UI look outdated. They use high-resolution pictures and graphics to represent different functions, with all sorts of cool animations. But in terms of actual day-to-day usability, they can't compare to TiVo. These UIs seem very cool at first, but the images and animations get old after a few weeks, and then you realize you're stuck with a UI that is slower / less efficient to navigate.

Now, almost everyone will agree that TiVo should update the current UI to take advantage of 16:9 to show more information on the screen, as seen in the Netflix application today. We'd all like higher-resolution, anti-aliased fonts too.

[MichaelK]

I was also under the impression that the new search beta thing has HD text.

Am I not understanding and it's only 16:9?

If it is HD then why isn't it slowing the box down?

(not being difficult trying to understand the "forces" at play)

[bkdtv]

I was also under the impression that the new search beta thing has HD text.

Am I not understanding and it's only 16:9?

If it is HD then why isn't it slowing the box down?I don't think we can accurately judge the performance of HDUI while it is running remotely from TiVo's servers (although it is rendered by the TiVo).

Did you have a TiVo Series3 or TivoHD? The text in HDUI looks much better on the TiVo Series3 than it does the TivoHD. On my TivoHD, text in HDSearch looks better than the main TiVo menus, but it still doesn't look like HD-- that could be because of the poor aliasing, which may or may not be a limitation of its newer Broadcom SoC in the TivoHD.

[ed3120]

I understand that Tivos are built with CPUs that aren't capable of pulling off fancy graphics, but the menus are mostly text based with a picture or two here and there. This cannot take a lot of CPU power to process. I'm not expecting snazzy animations or anything, but displaying a simply static screen in 1920x1080 is not going to be difficult to process.

And I agree that the flashier menu systems out there look great at first, but are really just filled with useless fluff in the long run. The primarily text based interface of Tivo certainly does work well...I just wish it was presented in a more professional manor. This would not attract customers if it were on display at a Best Buy.

[tombonneau]

I was also under the impression that the new search beta thing has HD text.

Am I not understanding and it's only 16:9?

If it is HD then why isn't it slowing the box down?

(not being difficult trying to understand the "forces" at play)

I'm not sure why all TiVo menus can't look like the beta search (or even Netflix menus). That has the crispness that I was expecting.

[MichaelK]

I don't think we can accurately judge the performance of HDUI while it is running remotely from TiVo's servers (although it is rendered by the TiVo).

Did you have a TiVo Series3 or TivoHD? The text in HDUI looks much better on the TiVo Series3 than it does the TivoHD. On my TivoHD, text in HDSearch looks better than the main TiVo menus, but it still doesn't look like HD-- that could be because of the poor aliasing, which may or may not be a limitation of its newer Broadcom SoC in the TivoHD.


have series3's

what would the difference be if the thing is running on a server or running on the tivo- if the tivo si "rendering" both? (again not picking a fight- i just dont understand the difference between the server based apps (HME i guess?) and the tivo based stuff.


sounds like computing and data manipulation gets handled locally on the memory and cpu bound tivo or on a server someplace that has stones. But either way the Tivo takes care of drawing on the screen and handling user interaction?

(not to wonder too far off- but say I'm using the beta search and I hit the right arrow on my remote- does the local machine get the command and do something?- or - Does the local mahcing get the command send it to the server, the server does what needs to be done, and then sends back screen drawing instructions to the tivo?)

[spocko]

Some other interfaces such as Vista Media Center are "modern" and make the text-based TiVo UI look outdated. They use high-resolution pictures and graphics to represent different functions, with all sorts of cool animations. But in terms of actual day-to-day usability, they can't compare to TiVo. These UIs seem very cool at first, but the images and animations get old after a few weeks, and then you realize you're stuck with a UI that is slower / less efficient to navigate.


Agreed. Case in point: look here at the difference between the Netflix menus on the Tivo and and the other guys. The others are more graphical, especially the xbox, but I think the Tivo presentation to be the best in terms of usability.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/19/do-not-time-netflix-hd-streaming-shootout/

Back more on topic, I don't have a problem with the resolution of the Tivo menus today, but I think the stretching that occurs on wide screen displays is pretty ugly.