TivoHD with bad drive?

[lofar]

So i have some problems with one of the new TivoHD's i got a few weeks ago. It randomly reboots on me, mostly while fast forwarding, and it was reporting errors while downloading from Tivo specifically while expanding the package. I ran a kickstart 57 & 58 on it and it seemed to clear up for a few days and managed to download tivo data successfully but then last night it started acting up again. So i'm assuming based on what i've read here that it's just a bad HD.

So i was looking at getting WD5000AACS from newegg. My main question is since I suspect that there are problems with my current drive is it ok to copy it using WinMFS to the new drive or will it copy any corruption/problems along with it? In which case should I buy instacake to get a fresh image on it?

[flatcurve]

If the data on your current drive is corrupted due to a defect, then it will just be copied over to the new drive corrupted as well.

But I wouldn't jump the gun on the drive yet. It sounds like these are relatively new units, so I would definitely pursue warranty repair/replacement with Tivo. If it's a problem with the unit itself, you're better off replacing it now before you spend money on a new drive.

[lofar]

Yeah, however my cable company is retarded and if I replace the box I have to spend $60 for a truck roll to get them to re-pair the cable cards on a new box because obviously customers are too retarded to be able to read alpha/numeric codes over the phone. So i'd rather spend the $60 on a new drive, which I was going to do anyways at some point, and if that fixes it then great if not then i can persue getting the whole box replaced.

I prefer not to give my lame cable company any more money if absolutely possible.

[flatcurve]

If that's the route you'd rather pursue first, then I would recommend obtaining a new drive image.

[JYoung]

If that's the route you'd rather pursue first, then I would recommend obtaining a new drive image.

In that case, wouldn't he have to re-pair the cable cards anyways?

[jlib]

If the kickstart procedures cleared things up why not just perform those again right before removing the drive for copying?

[rocko]

In that case, wouldn't he have to re-pair the cable cards anyways?

Generally, cards don't need to be re-paried for a hard drive replacement. On some cable systems cards will work in completely different TiVos without re-paring.

[rocko]

Hard drive errors that cause rebooting does not necessarily mean the image it bad. I just had that situation with my S3 and tried copying the drive with WinMFS. Surprise of surprises, the new drive worked great. Subsequent test of the original drive returned sector errors so the drive was bad, for sure.

To make a long story short - it only takes few minutes to do a truncated backup and restore. It's worth a try before ponying up $20 for Instant Cake.

YMMV but it worked for me.

[flatcurve]

Generally, cards don't need to be re-paried for a hard drive replacement. On some cable systems cards will work in completely different TiVos without re-paring.

This is correct. In my experience, the pairing information is stored on the card itself and when you go through guided setup again, the cards are already activated and you don't need to change any settings. I would say that being able to move the cards to another unit is a rarity though.

[flatcurve]

Hard drive errors that cause rebooting does not necessarily mean the image it bad. I just had that situation with my S3 and tried copying the drive with WinMFS. Surprise of surprises, the new drive worked great. Subsequent test of the original drive returned sector errors so the drive was bad, for sure.

To make a long story short - it only takes few minutes to do a truncated backup and restore. It's worth a try before ponying up $20 for Instant Cake.

YMMV but it worked for me.

It would all depends on where the damage was on the drive. If it's in the media partitions, then yes, a truncated backup and restore would probably work. But there's no way to know where the damage is just by running diagnostics. It's more or less a crap shoot. I still advocate going the warranty route given the relative age of the unit.

[Roderigo]

Generally, cards don't need to be re-paried for a hard drive replacement. On some cable systems cards will work in completely different TiVos without re-paring.

This is semi-false. The cards will lose their pairing if you replace your hard drive. Period. However, the pairing is only required for copy protected channels. So, if your cable system doesn't have any copy protected channels, or you don't watch any copy protected channels, you wouldn't notice the lack of pairing.

Of course, there is a risk to have an unpaired card. At any point your cable company could turn on copy protection, and then you'd stop receiving those channels.


In my experience, the pairing information is stored on the card itself and when you go through guided setup again, the cards are already activated and you don't need to change any settings.
There is information stored on the card, but there's also information stored on the tivo drive. If the drive is replaced (assuming it's not a copied image of the original drive), the information on the tivo side would be lost, and the pairing would be broken. Guided setup doesn't impact pairing or authorizations.

[lofar]

Thanks for all the info guys..

New drive is due to arrive here today. I guess i'm going to start with a truncated backup and restore of the existing drive in the unit and see how that goes. If it still acts up, i may just warranty it or go further and try a instacake or just image it from my second TivoHD.

If that doesn't work I will warranty it and beg and/or threaten my cable company until they are willing to re-pair it without a truck roll.

[flatcurve]

This is semi-false. The cards will lose their pairing if you replace your hard drive. Period. However, the pairing is only required for copy protected channels. So, if your cable system doesn't have any copy protected channels, or you don't watch any copy protected channels, you wouldn't notice the lack of pairing.

Of course, there is a risk to have an unpaired card. At any point your cable company could turn on copy protection, and then you'd stop receiving those channels.

There is information stored on the card, but there's also information stored on the tivo drive. If the drive is replaced (assuming it's not a copied image of the original drive), the information on the tivo side would be lost, and the pairing would be broken. Guided setup doesn't impact pairing or authorizations.

I'd like to know what you're basing this assessment on. This may be the case with your particular cable system but I have replaced the hard drive on the S3 in the shop here several times and have not lost any of the premium channels or pairing information ever, and I know those channels are copy protected.

We've also never had anybody come back to us after installing one of our drives or using InstantCake claiming that they had a problem with pairing after the upgrade. (We do still include a disclaimer in the instructions that they may need to call their cable company just in case)

That being said, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your statement, I just want to know what you're basing it on.

[lessd]

I'd like to know what you're basing this assessment on. This may be the case with your particular cable system but I have replaced the hard drive on the S3 in the shop here several times and have not lost any of the premium channels or pairing information ever, and I know those channels are copy protected.

We've also never had anybody come back to us after installing one of our drives or using InstantCake claiming that they had a problem with pairing after the upgrade. (We do still include a disclaimer in the instructions that they may need to call their cable company just in case)

That being said, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your statement, I just want to know what you're basing it on.

The pairing information comes from the hardware in the TiVo not the software on the hard drive. If your Cable Co. is using the pairing number as part of the encoding than moving the Cable card(s) to another TiVo will not work but changing out the hard drive will have no effect on the cable cards at any time. Its just like the TiVo service number, its part of the TiVo box hardware not the Hard Drive. The hard drive has to know what the Service number is that why you have to go a clear and delete all to use a image that did not come from your exact TiVo.

[jlib]

I am with Roderigo on this. Whenever I replace a drive with one imaged or upgraded from a drive in an already paired system the pairing is preserved. If I image a drive before the cards are paired (such as upgrading a new TiVo out of the box) and then subsequently reinstall the original drive later a new Data ID is generated and the Host/Data paring is lost.

It is true that some cable compaies do not enforce pairing in which case it would not make any difference. For the longest time Comcast in California was not collecting pairing information then suddenly realized they should and they hired a third-party company to call everyone up to get the info.

Everyone should write down all the numbers from the cable card configuration screens so they have a reference point for any changes that may occur.

[lessd]

I am with Roderigo on this. Whenever I replace a drive with one imaged or upgraded from a drive in an already paired system the pairing is preserved. If I image a drive before the cards are paired (such as upgrading a new TiVo out of the box) and then subsequently reinstall the original drive later a new Data ID is generated and the Host/Data paring is lost.

It is true that some cable compaies do not enforce pairing in which case it would not make any difference. For the longest time Comcast in California was not collecting pairing information then suddenly realized they should and they hired a third-party company to call everyone up to get the info.

Everyone should write down all the numbers from the cable card configuration screens so they have a reference point for any changes that may occur.

I may be misunderstand you but if i have a working Series 3 with cable cards and image a bigger drive using a image from another Series 3 TiVo that never had cable cards in it, when i put that larger drive into my Series 3 and do the clear and delete all, run guided setup the cable cards work just fine and Comcast does use pairing as i had to call them once when i mover the Cable cards to another TiVo (they were nice enough to connect me with the person who did the pairing so it only took about 10 minutes). The pairing information is derived from the TiVo hardware, not the hard Drive. I have done this many times for friends without any pairing problems. (C&D all takes away any pairing information on the hard drive anyway)

[lofar]

Well, replaced the drive and did a truncated backup/restore from the old one. System came back up fine, cable cards were ok and all premium channels are available. I watched it for about 6 hours last night and no reboots, so far so good but we'll see how it goes over the next week.