Mode 0 recoding - is it really there?

[rickynumber18]

I configured my TiVo to use Mode 0 sometime ago (following one of the online tutorials) and I began recording in 'Best Quality' but I'm starting to wonder if Mode 0 is really "there" as I genuinely can't see any difference. I wear specs as my long distance vision is pretty bad so it might just be that I can't "see" the difference. Is there anything I can do to make a check to see if I really have got it working as it's supposed to be? Maybe in TiVo logs or in TivoWeb+.

I have a 32" Hanspree TV that's pretty good. I also have a Liteon upscaled DVD player (using HDMI) and I CAN see a clear improvement when using that to play my DVD's. Perhaps it's just my SCART cables, maybe I need something a bit better. Any advice would be great. Thanks!

[TCM2007]

If you have network access, copy a programme onto your hard disk and see what resolution it is.

[blindlemon]

Check the tvlog just after starting a "Mode 0" recording and you should see a line similar to the following:-

Apr 6 01:23:58 (none) InputState[156]: StartRecording 0
Apr 6 01:23:58 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[155]: using VBR, bitRate=7500000, maxBitRate=9000000

with whatever bitrates you have set for your Mode 0 quality.

[rickynumber18]

Many thanks Blindlemon. From what I can see within my tvlog my Mode 0 isn't actually switched on even though I followed an online manual to the letter, or so I thought. I have several 'InputState' commands, none of which resemble your version. Ditto 'TmKMediaSwitch', most of my lines report...

Apr 5 10:44:10 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[158]: Drift = 5

Back to the drawing board I guess.

[blindlemon]

Did you start a recording? Are you looking at the beginning or end of the log?

These lines only occur just as a recording starts. Even if Mode 0 isn't enabled, you should still see the first line and the 2nd should be something like

Apr 6 01:23:58 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[155]: using CBR, bitRate=5960000, maxBitRate=5960000

[Automan]

Just did a search in tvlog on one of my ones for bitRate=

All say
Apr 6 04:00:00 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[143]: using CBR, bitRate=5960000, maxBitrate=5960000

So my one is not modified so why do I get a green bar down the image side when I backup 4:3 items to dvd?

Automan.

[mikerr]

The green stripe is always present in the recording, even on normal resolutions,
but its normally in the overscan area on most TVs, so not visible on screen.

On Mode0 the picture is shifted slightly, so the green stripe is visible onscreen
(until you apply LJ's modified fgpa.o (http://www.ljay.org.uk/tivoweb/tivo_fpga.html) to shift it offscreen again)

BTW the green bar will be visible on a computer,
but probably not when the DVD player outputs it back to TV (overscan area).

[rickynumber18]

Did you start a recording? Are you looking at the beginning or end of the log?

These lines only occur just as a recording starts. Even if Mode 0 isn't enabled, you should still see the first line and the 2nd should be something like

Apr 6 01:23:58 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[155]: using CBR, bitRate=5960000, maxBitRate=5960000

Hi Blindlemon. Thank for the info. I've spent the last few days, when I can, trying experiments to trigger a line at the bottom of the log, somewhat like the one you've shown (quoted above) and I just can't do it.

I've re-run all the Mode 0 installation instructions and everything seems to work well (except for the iicsetw file - but I doubt that's the issue). I've set my TiVo to 'Best' and tried recording after recording, inspecting my /var/log/tvlog/ each time. I don't know what I'm doing wrong!

[blindlemon]

Can you upload the complete log?

[rickynumber18]

Hi Blindlemon. Is the upload done via TivoWeb+ or FTP (FileZilla in my case)?

[Pete77]

Hi Blindlemon. Is the upload done via TivoWeb+ or FTP (FileZilla in my case)?

Show the log in Tivoweb then cut and paste it here using CTRL+C and CTRL+V?

[Automan]

Show the log in Tivoweb then cut and paste it here using CTRL+C and CTRL+V?

Or while the log is displayed press Ctrl+F and enter the search string bitRate=

Automan.

[rickynumber18]

Hi all. I finally found THE line in my log; "Apr 13 16:57:48 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[158]: using CBR, bitRate=5960000, maxBitrate=5960000" - which I guess means that my Mode 0 isn't active, even though I followed the online tutorial from A-Z and all worked well. I used the middle version (1.5kb) of the .tcl file (there's three available; 80KB, 1.5KB and 1.6KB - 1.6KB didn't work for me).

I think the issue must with the "iicsetw" file, as I can neither find TiVoWeb start up editor or get Joe to work properly following the tutorial. It seems to miss some bits out. Would the "iicsetw" be causing the problem?

I've spent so many hours working on Mode 0, I'm wondering if it's really worth it.

[Pete77]

I think the issue must with the "iicsetw" file, as I can neither find TiVoWeb start up editor or get Joe to work properly following the tutorial. It seems to miss some bits out. Would the "iicsetw" be causing the problem?

I've spent so many hours working on Mode 0, I'm wondering if it's really worth it.

Its much more likely that you failed to use the Enter key after entering each and every value in each box followed by then also backing out to the previous Resouces screen and Selecting Update Resources at the end of the process. This is the usual glaring error made by most of those who failt to get Mode 0 operational.......

Or did you perhaps enter Alt Bitrates values instead of Bitrates values?

[rickynumber18]

Hi Pete. I haven't altered 'Alt Bitrates' at all. This wasn't mentioned in the online tutorial.

Where is this process done and is there perhaps another tutorial I failed to come across?

[Cainam]

Hi all. I finally found THE line in my log; "Apr 13 16:57:48 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[158]: using CBR, bitRate=5960000, maxBitrate=5960000" - which I guess means that my Mode 0 isn't active, even though I followed the online tutorial from A-Z and all worked well. I used the middle version (1.5kb) of the .tcl file (there's three available; 80KB, 1.5KB and 1.6KB - 1.6KB didn't work for me).

I think the issue must with the "iicsetw" file, as I can neither find TiVoWeb start up editor or get Joe to work properly following the tutorial. It seems to miss some bits out. Would the "iicsetw" be causing the problem?

I've spent so many hours working on Mode 0, I'm wondering if it's really worth it.

I am not sure which tutorial or .tcl file you are using, but just to confirm,there are really 3 separate things here

1) Mode 0 - this sets the resolution that Tivo records at

2) Bit rates - this says how many bits Tivo uses to store the information for the resolution you have chosen. As you are increasing the bitrate with Mode 0, you really should change the bit rate option at the same time to get a good picture (but this is not actually compulsory)

3) IICSETW is something very different. If you choose to output in RGB (does not matter what resolution or bit rate) the picture looks awful - way too bright. You can use IICSETW to reduce the intensity and make it look correct.

So there are really 3 different things to check in your setup :)

Regarding bitrates - if I remember correctly, in the default resolutions that Tivo has set up, they all have the maximum and average set to the same thing. So VBR is not possible. But in the scripts that are knocking around to enable Mode 0 they set the 2 values differently so that VBR is possible.

Out of interest, have you turned on the "Save Disk Space" option in "Messages and Setup"-"My Preferences"-"Save Disk Space" (i.e. the option to use VBR)?

I could be that the .tcl script is setting the bit rates correctly, but because you have not told it to use them in the save disk space option you are still using CBR.

Try turning on the Save Disk space option, then starting a new recording and look in the log like last time. If it now say you are using VBR (like in Blindlemon's example) you know the .tcl script has worked and that you are using Mode 0!

[Pete77]

Hi Pete. I haven't altered 'Alt Bitrates' at all. This wasn't mentioned in the online tutorial.?

"Alt Bitrates" are in the Resouces Editor alongside "Constants" and "Bitrates" but you don't need to alter them as they have no impact on the Tivo recording resolution. It is the Bitrates settings that you needed to alter and hit Enter after amending each individual one and then Update Resources back on the main Resource Editor page at the end of the process. After that you needed to reboot the machine.

Also as mentioned above by Cainam:-

Out of interest, have you turned on the "Save Disk Space" option in "Messages and Setup"-"My Preferences"-"Save Disk Space" (i.e. the option to use VBR)?

As he says having done all of the above with Birates you then need to turn on Save Disk Space as well. Only after that will VBR come in to operation and Mode 0 fully working as intended. Probably no harm to do another reboot after enabling "Save Disk Space".

[blindlemon]

OK, here's another thought.

Have you got the "smooth video" option enabled? If you have then you will be using AltBitrates - so all the changes that the scripts make to Bitrates will be ignored and you will still be using the old settings...

(Not using "Save disk space" will just force the TiVo to use CBR at the higher bitrate, so you would be seeing 7500000/7500000 rather than 5960000/5960000.)

[Pete77]

Have you got the "smooth video" option enabled? If you have then you will be using AltBitrates - so all the changes that the scripts make to Bitrates will be ignored and you will still be using the old settings

I knew something caused those Alt Bitrates to be used so best to amend them to Mode 0 settings as well to be on the safe side then? Any reason why your script doesn't do that Blindlemon? Or do you leave "smooth video" as an easy way to revert to the old bitrates settings?

[rickynumber18]

Hi. Thanks for all this info, which I'm working my way through. I've changed my 'Save Disk Space' option from 'off' to 'Save Disk Space' (SCART and RF). I do use "smooth video" to tidy up my RF input. I've turned this off for now. I hope this is a good start. I'm going to reboot and try another recording.

FYI; the tutorial that everyone seems to be using is at www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=286938

[rickynumber18]

Within the tutorial above there are three .tcl script files. 80KB, 1.5KB and 1.6KB. I can run the first two but have never had any luck with the third. My # bash prompt always reports that it can't find the .tcl file. I don't think there's much wrong with the 1.5KB version and it works so I've left well enough alone.

[blindlemon]

I do use "smooth video" to tidy up my RF input. I've turned this off for now.Bingo!

You will see Mode 0 now :)

[blindlemon]

I knew something caused those Alt Bitrates to be used so best to amend them to Mode 0 settings as well to be one the safe side then? Any reason why your script doesn't do that Blindlemon? Or do you leave "smooth video" as an easy way to revert to the old bitrates settings?I wrote the script for my own use and as I don't use "smooth video" I never needed to set the AltBitrates and couldn't be bothered with all the extra typing/cut-n-pasting required.

Yes, I realised a while ago that this would be an easy way to "turn off" Mode 0 ;)

[rickynumber18]

Hi guys. I wish one of the many threads had said something about disk space / RF smoothing. Just my luck. Anyway...reboot finally done...

My script now reads "Apr 13 19:15:59 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[158]: using VBR, bitRate=4800000, maxBitRate=9000000" - this isn't quite what Blindlemon suggested as 7500000 and 9000000 (see #3 above). Does this matter?

[Pete77]

Yes, I realised a while ago that this would be an easy way to "turn off" Mode 0 ;)

Does enabling Smooth Video do anything else apart from using Alt Bitrates instead of Bitrates though?

I have been looking at the price of finished auctions for high end 36" widescreen sets on Ebay and see that some now go for under £100. I'm vaguely tempted as I can't see quitting Tivo just yet after all this time and getting to know everything about them. But then there is all that complication with picking one up and moving it in as they are so damn heavy. I know that I could now find my 29" set a new home via www.freecycle.org instead of having to cart it to the knackers yard. Perhaps its just as easy to wait for a tolerable 42" 24fps capable HD set to get cheaper or until they start to become available for interesting prices on Ebay.

I suppose if Tivo insists on launching a PC based system that can cope with HD on Freesat and/or Freeview that serious consideration to going HD will then have to be given though.

[Pete77]

My script now reads "Apr 13 19:15:59 (none) TmkMediaswitch::Trace[158]: using VBR, bitRate=4800000, maxBitRate=9000000" - this isn't quite what Blindlemon suggested as 7500000 and 9000000 (see #3 above). Does this matter?

4800000/9000000 are the settings that were favoured by iankb for Mode 0 to minimise white flashes while 7500000/9000000 are the settings favoured by blindlemon. In theory the 4800000 variant will also give you a few more recording hours than 7500000. How many white flashes you get or don't depends on the tolerances of your Tivo and which channels you watch most (BBC Three is especially bad for the white flashes problem). Opinions seem to vary on whether reducing VBR reduces the possibility of white flashes.

[rickynumber18]

Be careful of offering TVs on www.freecycle.org. I offered a 26" recently and got so many e-mails I couldn't cope. A few were really really pushy and one was so annoyed that I gave it to another Freecycle'r first, that to this day he keeps adding me to mailing lists to overwhelm my spam! That's my only bad experience though, other than the TV it's worked really well for shifting stuff.

[rickynumber18]

Thanks Pete. I installed the white flash "fix" as part of the Mode 0 tutorial. I guess I'll leave the setting be at 4800000 for now. Since I can't get Blindlemon's 1.6KB version of the .tcl file to work anyway I don't have much choice. I guess the 1.5KB version I've used belongs to iankb.

[Pete77]

Be careful of offering TVs on www.freecycle.org. I offered a 26" recently and got so many e-mails I couldn't cope. A few were really really pushy and one was so annoyed that I gave it to another Freecycle'r first, that to this day he keeps adding me to mailing lists to overwhelm my spam! That's my only bad experience though, other than the TV it's worked really well for shifting stuff.

Worthwhile items rather than junk are rare as hen's teeth on freecycle so when one comes up the chances of getting it are very small. Having said that there are plenty of 4:3 tvs being offered and its ony widescreen CRTs that are rare and generally fought over. I haven't seen any flat panel widescreens offered at all. There was a 32 Sony Wega offered recently only 9 miles from me with a very nice cabinet (enclosed with glass doors which I much prefer to the open platforms) but although I replied within a few minutes of the daily update email it had long gone. I suspect the best technique once an item has gone as the one offering it is not to reply. If you reply people take it more personally that you haven't let them have the item. There are always a few nutters out there. My other problem is that I'm at the junction of about 6 different Freecycle areas rather than right in the middle of one but that is really too many Freecylce emails to keep on reading.

You stand a much better chance of getting something offered on Freecyle in the week than at the weekend. To be honest its a rubbish outdated system using Yahoo groups. An online database would be far better.

[Pete77]

Thanks Pete. I installed the white flash "fix" as part of the Mode 0 tutorial. I guess I'll leave the setting be at 4800000 for now. Since I can't get Blindlemon's 1.6KB version of the .tcl file to work anyway I don't have much choice. I guess the 1.5KB version I've used belongs to iankb.

You don't need to use his tcl. You can alter all the settings manually to his recommended settings in Resources Editor but remembering to press Enter after altering each one and then also Update Resources at the end followed by a reboot.

[rickynumber18]

I live in the borders of three, maybe even four FC groups so I understand about the e-mails. I've offered loads of good stuff too heavy for eBay (a bath, furniture and even a toilet!) but never had any issues other than with the TV. It's really put me off using it again. I've just glad that some of the "nut cases" can't get hold of your address unless you give it out.

Thanks for the extra info. Hopefully now I'll see some improvement in the picture even with my awful long distance version!