Need help planning my TiVo/Home Theater system

[jimhokie]

Here's my current situation...a Series 1 (Sony SVR-2000) and Series 2 TiVo (Humax), plus a VCR/DVD player connected to a tube TV, playing the sound through the TV speakers, with non-digital cable service and no cable box...so 20th century.

Here's what I want to do: Get a large plasma HDTV, upgrade to digital cable, replace the Series 1 TiVo with a Series 3 HD TiVo (keeping the Series 2 in the mix as well for general purpose, non-HD TiVo viewing), get an AV receiver to set up a home theater system using a pair of Polk Monitor 70's I recently bought for my stereo as my mains, network the TiVos to my computer network to play music and view pictures and videos from my computer through the TV/receiver. I also have 2 pairs of outdoor speakers I would like to drive from the same receiver (only one pair at a time though using a selector switch).

So my most burning question is what features do I need in an AV receiver, and does anyone have suggestions for specific models? I'm thinking a decent middle of the road model--something to do justice for my Polk Monitor 70's, but not necessarily top of the line for cost reasons.

Other questions:
Are there any decent quality, not-super expensive wireless speaker suggestions for my rears? My room set-up makes it a challenge to run wires inconspicuously to the rears.

I'm thinking with the Monitor 70's, I won't particularly need a sub--the bass these things put out makes my pant legs vibrate. Am I right here?

Will I want an upscaling DVD player instead of the Humax TiVo's built in DVD player and the VCR/DVD player? Or will the Series 3 TiVo accomplish this? (I understand the Series 3 TiVo can be used instead of having to rent a digital cable box.)

Any other suggestions for things I haven't even thought about?

Any answers. comments, suggestions to help me get my mind around this project will be greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
Jim

[RonDawg]

As far as receiver features, keep in mind that the lower cost models, if they provide any HDMI ports at all, often will make them pass-through, meaning they don't extract the audio signal from the HDMI cable. More expensive models will extract the signal from the cable, saving you from another connection simply for the digital audio. More expensive models may allow you to add those additional speakers without the need for a separate switch.

As far as not needing subs, modern multi-channel receivers are set up to divide the multichannel signal to an external sub, and in this mode may not work properly with your existing speakers. Of course, all but the cheapest receivers have various "modes" and when playing music, you can use your existing speakers for this.

As far as an "upscaling" DVD player...save your money. Unless you buy a really crummy HDTV, the built-in scaler will do as good a job if not better than any but the most expensive of DVD players. Your money may be better spent on a Blu-Ray unit.

As far as the Series 3, note that in order to get digital cable channels (including HiDef) you will need CableCards. Also a considerable limitation of the S3's is that they are not compatible with On-Demand, Pay Per View, and Switched Digital Video. Many cable operators will let you phone in Pay Per View requests, and there is an "SDV Tuning Resolver" supposedly coming out in the next year, but until the Series 4 comes out your only recourse with On-Demand is to use Amazon's Unbox service.

I'll leave specific model recommendations to others here.

[ah30k]

Also, as for the outside speakers... Most modern amps now have 'zone 2' which will let you drive a second set of speakers with using a second source. For instance, you can have an NCAA game on in the TV room with your main speakers being driven by the S3 and the outside speakers driven separately using your S2 tuned to your favorite commercial free Music Choice channel.

For the receiver, I went with an upscaling unit that can route any input out to the HDMI port upscaling any of it to 1080i/720p. It can also pass through 1080p.

Make sure you have plenty of HDMI inputs as they will only proliferate in the future.

I'm pretty happy with my Pioneer Elite receiver.

I spent extra money years ago on an upscaling DVD player and have maybe used it two or three times over the last four years. If I had to do it over again, this is where I would have saved some money. Of course the big question now is do you go with a Blu-Ray.

[ZeoTiVo]

Of course the big question now is do you go with a HD-DVD.

not anymore. Blu-ray has the momentum now that is unstoppable. Heck Best Buy is offering deals to help out people who bought a HD-DVD player.

If anything I would be looking for a deal on a PS3 since it has the most up to date Blu-ray player at the lowest price point, and looks to be able to do the full Blu-ray 2.0 spec when that comes down.

Personally I would go with a BOSE 3.1 setup if wired rear speakers were an issue. I have a pair of cheap wireless speakers, mostly for outdoor use and they do alright by me but somedays some interference hits and they just get annoying

[ah30k]

Yes,BluRay not HD-DVD - brain-fart on me. I meant as opposed to upscaling DVD player.

[RonDawg]

For those interested in making their own high definition discs from their TiVo, HD-DVD is actually a better choice, at least for the time being. The discs are faster to produce, and with the abandonment of the format the players are currently dirt cheap, so it's not like you really need to make a choice between the two.

[pilotbob]

So my most burning question is what features do I need in an AV receiver, and does anyone have suggestions for specific models? I'm thinking a decent middle of the road model--something to do justice for my Polk Monitor 70's, but not necessarily top of the line for cost reasons.


I see you got some good info, but I didn't see any Reco's. I personlly like Onkyo. They are well made.. maybe not High End like a pro installer would use, but certainly higher than some of the Samsung/Yamaha stuff... at least in my opinion.

All Onkyo's that I have seen have a second stero output... Mine does, it has Speakers A and Speakers B... you can play one at a time, or both together... so you could wire your outdoor's to Speaker B.

Another feature you might want to find is video switching. Some of the less expensive systems, Onkyo included will do video switching for the same format. For example, it might have Component 1,2,3 inputs and Component output... but, it won't be able to move video from Component 1 input to HDMI 1 output.

This may not be an issue if you have enough inputs on your TV and can run many cables. But, if you have your reciever a fair distance from your TV you may just prefer to run a single HDMI cable from your reciever to your TV and you want the reciever to be able to do video format conversion/switching.

Also, plan on a nice programmable remote... I love my Harmony 880... the Harmony 1 looks good to. I have heard good things about the Pronto remotes, however they seem harder to program and maybe need a pro to do it.

Good luck... let us know what you end up with.

BOb

[pilotbob]

Any answers. comments, suggestions to help me get my mind around this project will be greatly appreciated!


You might want to take a look at Sonos.com for a great music distribution system. (That is on my short list.)

BOb

[kas25]

You might want to take a look at Sonos.com for a great music distribution system. (That is on my short list.)

BOb

Agree. I have about 6 Sonos units and love them.

[pilotbob]

Any other suggestions for things I haven't even thought about?


If you can... get a wired CAT5e/CAT6 drop to your equipment corner/closet. Then you can get a 4 port router for about $20. This way you can hard wire your TiVO, Blu-Ray, Game Console and don't have to frak around with wireless stuff.

(We have 0 problems with XBox live on our 360 since we went this route.)

BOb

[jkalnin]

My question may be dumb, but why would anyone buy a S3 Tivo over a TivoHD unit? For the price difference I don't see any real advantages to the S3 unit.

[ah30k]

My question may be dumb, but why would anyone buy a S3 Tivo over a TivoHD unit? For the price difference I don't see any real advantages to the S3 unit.It looks cooler ;)

Had many of the current S3 owners had the choice, they may have chosen differently. Most of us were early adopters who chose the S3 back when it was the only game in town.

[jimhokie]

Thanks much for all the info and suggestions above!

jklanin: Actually, I meant the TiVo HD version when I said S3. I was thinking the S3 was HD. I want to have the capability to record some shows in HD, retaining my S2 in the loop for additional space for non-HD stuff.

Which raises the next question...What do I need to burn HD recordings onto DVD? If the TiVoHD is connected to my network, can I burn from TiVo to a computer DVD burner? Is there a TiVo model that has a built in burner like my Humax S2? Or could I use that burner to record off the TiVoHD?

[ZeoTiVo]

you can only burn on a TiVo with DVD something that was recorded DIRECTLY by that TiVbo. any shows copied over can not be burned.

No HD style DVD burners yet in TiVo models

so yes, you go with your first thought of using TiVo desktop to copy the show to your PC and then burn it there.

[RonDawg]

My question may be dumb, but why would anyone buy a S3 Tivo over a TivoHD unit? For the price difference I don't see any real advantages to the S3 unit.

There are two significant ones that are not advertised by TiVo:

1. The S3 can use a greater variety of eSATA drives for additional storage. The TiVoHD can ONLY use the Western Digital My DVR Expander without going through the hassle of marrying the drives.

2. The S3's MRV transfer rate is much higher than that of the TiVoHD. Of course if you only own one S3 it's a moot point.

[GoHokies!]

Thanks much for all the info and suggestions above!

jklanin: Actually, I meant the TiVo HD version when I said S3. I was thinking the S3 was HD. I want to have the capability to record some shows in HD, retaining my S2 in the loop for additional space for non-HD stuff.
Jim,

Just to clarify on this point, the S3 and the TivoHD both do HD (the naming can be confusing).

Burning to DVD is going to have to happen on the computer for now, but that's a pretty easy task.

Keeping the S2 in the loop for SD work - may not be necessary. I did this when I first got my S3, but when I moved recently, I didn't bother setting up the S2 on the HDTV, it just wasn't being used. SD programming takes up a very little bit of space and the dual tuners on the S3 (in addition to the other 2 Tivos on other TVs in the house) were plenty of tuners for recordings. In the end, I found that the hassle just wasn't worth it.

As far as recommendations on a receiver, once you have a "short list" of units you're interested in, you may want to check out avsforum - there is an absolutely dizzing amount of information there. Not that you've gooten bad info here, there's just a heck of a lot more over there. I've got a mid range Yamaha that I'm perfectly happy with that got good reviews over there.

Finally (and most importantly), Go Hokies! :D You'll love watching Hokie football in HD on your new set. :D

[gatzke]

Late to this thread, but maybe somebody is still reading.

Don't do plasma, they aren't doing 1080P yet. Do a projector or LCD and get 1080P.

[BobB]

Don't do plasma, they aren't doing 1080P yet. Do a projector or LCD and get 1080P.

Couldn't disagree more - the best plasmas (like the Pioneer 5080) have FAR better picture quality than the best LCD sets on the market. I know this both from personal research and observation (and I work with professional video equipment) and from the trade reviews, which have consistently rated the Pioneer as the best TV picture on the market.

Too many people get hung up on 1080P because it's a simple number to grasp, despite the fact that it is only one factor (and not even the most important factor) in what makes some TVs look better than others. Black level and color saturation have significantly more effect on perceived picture quality, assuming the set does a good job with other things like scaling, which the Pioneer excels at.

Don't take my word for it. Google Pioneer 5080 and see how many A/V magazines have put it at the top of their recommended list.

[gatzke]

I guess I need to keep up with current tech...

When I was really shopping around about 1.5 years back 1080P plasma was not a realistic option, like $10k or more. Looks like Pioneer has a 1080P plasma now around $4k.

Back a year or two someone was claiming 1080P but it was really 1/3 (like claiming each individual pixel). I assume Pioneer is real 1080P

I agree, more goes into viewing than just resolution. But at the same time I did not want to lose out on content due to down-resing an image.

I still would rather go with a projector in a dark room. Nothing beats a 150" TV...