Journeyman 11/19/2007 (S01E09) "Emily" [Text View]

dswallow

11-19-2007, 11:16 PM

That was just so frustrating how Jack "forgot" everything he'd figured out and come to accept.

It looks like Dan's facing some consequences for what he's done... but I have to wonder why they think they weren't supposed to have done what they did to prevent the second kidnapping/murder. It just seems arbitrary how Livia suddenly was saying how they were now doing stuff they weren't supposed to do.

Rob Helmerichs

11-19-2007, 11:28 PM

... but I have to wonder why they think they weren't supposed to have done what they did to prevent the second kidnapping/murder. It just seems arbitrary how Livia suddenly was saying how they were now doing stuff they weren't supposed to do.
Yeah, the timing of his appearance would lead one more logically to the conclusion that he was supposed to stop the kidnapper. That was uncharacteristically weak writing for this show.

I do like, however, how three-dimensional all the characters are. Even if Jack doesn't remember how three-dimensional he really is. :D

Sadara

11-19-2007, 11:44 PM

I don't think it was weak writing. I honestly think that they are trying to show their are unwritten rules to this and you have to be very careful what you do, no matter what your moral compass is trying to tell you.

And I agree it was utterly frustrating for his brother to have forgotten. Some how some way the brother has got to "get it".

Next weeks previews look very interesting!!!

bobjohnson

11-20-2007, 02:17 AM

I clearly missed something. When did Dan tell his brother that he could time travel?

I guess I need to spend less time surfing the web and more time paying attention. :o

busyba

11-20-2007, 02:36 AM

I clearly missed something. When did Dan tell his brother that he could time travel?

If memory serves, it was in the first episode after his first jump, where he ran into the Olivia who hadn't met him yet.

spikedavis

11-20-2007, 03:00 AM

That was great!!! And the preview for next week looks incredible. I'm not going to be able to deal if this show is cancelled.

atrac

11-20-2007, 03:04 AM

Triple home run for NBC tonight! Another solid episode and yes, absolutely can't wait until next week.

They really had me fooled when it appeared Dan's son had also jumped!

I loved it when Livia took out the drug dealer. Good stuff!

JYoung

11-20-2007, 03:32 AM

I'm not sure how Jack could file a 5150 on Dan without Katie knowing.

appleye1

11-20-2007, 06:25 AM

I'm not sure how Jack could file a 5150 on Dan without Katie knowing.I think as a cop he gets special authority doesn't he? He might have to notify her, but I don't think she can prevent it. And if he's smart he will wait until after he commits Dan before he tells her!

danplaysbass

11-20-2007, 07:26 AM

Wow, great episode! This show better not get canceled. I do, however, fear the inevitable...stupid strike.

betts4

11-20-2007, 08:04 AM

Is there some reason why Kate would still remember about the leaping, I mean time travelling, but Jack wouldn't?
I mean, I understand why Jack doesn't, but does the change mean that no one would remember?
I was also wondering why Livia made such a fuss. It would seem that Dan's trip was not just to save Emily but also the other girl and to stop the guy from doing it again. Logical.

I loved the windows screen on the computer and the chat room bit. I don't remember screens and text looking that bad on the internet, but I didn't use it till mid 90's.

Rob Helmerichs

11-20-2007, 08:18 AM

Is there some reason why Kate would still remember about the leaping, I mean time traveling, but Jack wouldn't?
I mean, I understand why Jack doesn't, but does the change mean that no one would remember?
No, what changed was losing the interaction between Jack and Dan over the serial kidnapper, which is what started to convince Dan that Jack might not be insane. That had nothing to do with Kate, who has known almost since the beginning that Dan is not insane.

ElJay

11-20-2007, 08:44 AM

I hope they resolve this Jack/Dan stuff soon. I thought it would (finally) happen this episode, but obviously they zapped that idea. I like the show, but the conflict for the sake of conflict between these characters is getting old.

I loved the windows screen on the computer and the chat room bit. I don't remember screens and text looking that bad on the internet, but I didn't use it till mid 90's.

There are a bunch of different IRC clients, but I've never seen one that looked that primitive in the mid 1990s. The "chat room" they showed looked like something displayed on a TRS-80, not a Windows 95 box. If you scroll to the bottom of this page (http://www.ircbeginner.com/ircinfo/mirc.html), you'll see a screen shot that is much more typical of what the experience would look like on IRC a decade ago. I think it's rather annoying that they went through the effort to write Windows 95 into the story and even show the splash screen for it (plus perhaps a real shot of the user interface from a distance), but then they gave us a chat screen that looks nothing like an application running on Windows 95.

betts4

11-20-2007, 10:15 AM

No, what changed was losing the interaction between Jack and Dan over the serial kidnapper, which is what started to convince Dan that Jack might not be insane. That had nothing to do with Kate, who has known almost since the beginning that Dan is not insane.
Thanks, that makes some sense, actually I like that Jack thinks Dan is a bit off, I just wish Jack wouldn't be so intense about it. It's too bad it couldn't be seen as a gradual thing and not so smack in the face.

There are a bunch of different IRC clients, but I've never seen one that looked that primitive in the mid 1990s. The "chat room" they showed looked like something displayed on a TRS-80, not a Windows 95 box. If you scroll to the bottom of this page (http://www.ircbeginner.com/ircinfo/mirc.html)
And thanks also. That's the style I remember. The other one looked like a pong game. Could it be a licensing thing or such?

Kamakzie

11-20-2007, 10:52 AM

Kamakzie

11-20-2007, 10:54 AM

If you scroll to the bottom of this page (http://www.ircbeginner.com/ircinfo/mirc.html), you'll see a screen shot that is much more typical of what the experience would look like on IRC a decade ago.

That's what IRC still looks like today as well :D

jwjody

11-20-2007, 10:59 AM

I thought this was a really good episode. Like most I feel this will get canceled and we'll lose a great show.

Something I didn't understand...a few episodes ago when Dan needed money for the card game in his past Livia jumped to his closet in the future and got the satchel of money. It seems someone has a hand in their jumping when it's needed. If that's the case then why not make Dan jump back to the present after they found Emily in the park. Technically his tracking was over because Emily had been saved.

J

Fool Me Twice

11-20-2007, 11:06 AM

I was also wondering why Livia made such a fuss. It would seem that Dan's trip was not just to save Emily but also the other girl and to stop the guy from doing it again. Logical.
Livia has obviously been burned by the unintended consequences of her own independent actions. The both have an instinct of some kind that guides them, and both knew that Dan was not supposed to save the other girl. It seems wrong to not help someone when you're able to, but this unknown entity guiding them seems to have some sort of utilitarian plan and is not above sacrificing some lives for its "greater good".

What's not clear is why Dan was given the extra time to follow his own plan. That was a bit of cheating by the writers, I think. (Unless I missed something.} They should have had him postpone his "official" mission in order to have the extra time to complete his own.

unicorngoddess

11-20-2007, 11:36 AM

My theory was maybe he wasn't suppose to help the second girl because she could've grown up to be bad. But then I thought, well Emily wasn't doing too good after he saved her and he kept being sent back to put her on the right track.

And I think if someone just told me that the guy that I helped put away for kidnapping only did 6 years and was just recently released I would be a little bit more paranoid.

danplaysbass

11-20-2007, 12:33 PM

No spoilers but next week looks like it will be awesome!!

headroll

11-20-2007, 12:37 PM

No spoilers but next week looks like it will be awesome!!
+1

TAsunder

11-20-2007, 01:14 PM

Great episode. I don't think it was weak writing that livia was adamant about dan not going "off the rails". She seems to be a little more resigned to her fate than Dan. I do think that the writers are flip flopping a bit, though. It seemed in early episodes that he literally could not change events other than the ones on the rails, now they are opening it up quite a bit. Perhaps his early attempts were just coincidentally futile only.

teknikel

11-20-2007, 01:15 PM

I love this show and this episode was good.

Were the bricks at the rave moving because of the bass thumping or was Emily pushing on them?

I thought when Zack/Zach got the headache he was going to take a journey. But once they continued to look for him I realized he was still there.

Also, in the middle of the ep. I was thinking, "Wow, they are going to resolve this Dan/Jack conflict much sooner than I ever expected". Not.

Now, I will pose the question for discussion again, what is the catalyst to go back? And does Livia get there first?

Is it to change that person's future? If so, is there a specific change that is to take place?

Does someone have a map of all the timelines? e.g. was Kelso's Kuts the result we were looking for here (actually, I was worried that maybe since her business had to do with kids that maybe she found ways to also abuse them. And that was the bad consequence. But that had nothing to do with the capture of bad guy [can't remember his name]) or could something else have happened and TPTB would be satisfied?

Are those to be saved picked randomly?

I'll spare you my other questions for now. Any ideas?

5thcrewman

11-20-2007, 01:41 PM

The realtor was getting a real 'Emilio Lizardo' look going as he aged!:D

ethos42

11-20-2007, 01:51 PM

Livia keeps saying "Follow your instincts"

Wasn't it his instincts that said he had to save the other girl?

I like the show, but there's a lot of creative liberty taken when they just don't feel like explaining what's going on.

ZooCaretaker

11-20-2007, 02:00 PM

Livia has obviously been burned by the unintended consequences of her own independent actions.
It's curious that since she returns to the 40's after her journeys, that she would even be aware of unintended consequences.

unicorngoddess

11-20-2007, 02:04 PM

It's curious that since she returns to the 40's after her journeys, that she would even be aware of unintended consequences.

I thought of that too. What does it matter for her? None of this has ever happened in her timeline before. Which brings me back to wondering what good a time traveler from the past can do.

Also, its no fair. She told Dan he should invest in old currency and he said it was really expensive...but she doesn't have to worry about that because her currency is already from the past.

Bryanmc

11-20-2007, 02:46 PM

I thought of that too. What does it matter for her? None of this has ever happened in her timeline before. Which brings me back to wondering what good a time traveler from the past can do.

Also, its no fair. She told Dan he should invest in old currency and he said it was really expensive...but she doesn't have to worry about that because her currency is already from the past.

Yeah, but it'd be just as expensive for her because everything costs 10 times more in her future. :D

HarryFenton

11-20-2007, 02:53 PM

At the end of the episode, when Dan realized that he never had the conversation with Jack about the $20 bill OR the psycho real estate guy, why didn't Dan just bring up the $20 bill incident again? That was the reason that Jack started to believe him; it would have given him pause all over again and he would have to rethink it.

Also, in the prior episode when Jack was at the bar spending the evidence bill, Jack should have already suspected.

Finally, however, why is the FBI agent still talking about the Dylan McCleen case? After Jack dumped the balance of the money at the convenience store on the dead hippy, why didn't that make the case go away? They would have discovered most of the money right at the store and also at the previous poker game. A final bill from the McCleen stash would be old news after that change of events, so the FBI guy wouldn't be looking for McCleen.

Regarding Lydia, how does she always appear so put together in modern clothing? Why isn't she in 1948 wear? Other than the "really old newspaper" that she hands to the pushcart guy, there's nothing to indicate that she's pulled out of the past (or pulled out of her life - or sleep - by some inconvenience).

Also, is she definitely dead in the 2007 world? She's mid-30's in 1948, she could be mid-90's in 2007. Finally, if all the stuff happens to her in the future, how does she remember any of it it the past and when she jumps to a point before the present she shared with Dan? Dan doesn't have that problem because of history; but shouldn't he also "forget" things that were erased? Does he live outside of time that he has an independent memory of events?

unicorngoddess

11-20-2007, 03:02 PM

Regarding Lydia, how does she always appear so put together in modern clothing? Why isn't she in 1948 wear? Other than the "really old newspaper" that she hands to the pushcart guy, there's nothing to indicate that she's pulled out of the past (or pulled out of her life - or sleep - by some inconvenience).

Also, her hair is so straight. I didn't think long straight hair like that was the style in the late 40s.

busyba

11-20-2007, 03:21 PM

"You're a fed. If you want his phone records, browser history, bank records, etc..., why don't you just take them without asking? Isn't that what you guys do these days?" :D

And of course, he goes ahead and does just that. :)

HarryFenton

11-20-2007, 03:36 PM

More about Livia being alive in 2007. Can they travel to a time period outside of their lifespan? The earliest that Dan goes back to is 1975; in real life Kevin McKidd was born in 1973. So if Livia travelled to 2007 to get the McCleen money out of the closet, she would still be alive today, on the theory that you can't travel outside of your lifespan.

Not sure what a traveller to the future like Livia can do, but maybe if she travels to different times in the future, she sees an outcome and goes back and changes it in her present. The only difference is that if she does something in her present to get caught, she can't leap back out of harms way, unless that's why she was "stuck" in the future with Dan.

busyba

11-20-2007, 03:40 PM

HarryFenton

11-20-2007, 04:32 PM

busyba

11-20-2007, 04:36 PM

From Kevin Falls interview:

"“The rule we have now is that Dan only travels within his own lifetime,” Falls also wrote about how far back in time they are willing to let their central character go. “That goes back to the early 70s. The other time traveler has a secret that we'll get to in the first 10 episodes. For Dan, it's only within his lifetime.”"

That sounds less like a rule about the limitations of Dan's time traveling than it does a rule about the limitation of what the writers are going to write.

JYoung

11-20-2007, 04:53 PM

I think as a cop he gets special authority doesn't he? He might have to notify her, but I don't think she can prevent it. And if he's smart he will wait until after he commits Dan before he tells her!

Consulting Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5150_%28Involuntary_psychiatric_hold%29), it looks as if since Jack is a California Peace Officer he can.

Of course, it would absolutely enrage Katie, not to mention Dan.

ruexp67

11-20-2007, 06:05 PM

I didn't like this show at first, but I gave it a shot and it has really grown on me.

This episode was great. I held my breath when Zach "Journied."

There are a LOT of unanswered questions. Livia also seems able to control her journies. Perhaps Dan will learn some control too.

Fool Me Twice

11-20-2007, 06:08 PM

Finally, however, why is the FBI agent still talking about the Dylan McCleen case? After Jack dumped the balance of the money at the convenience store on the dead hippy, why didn't that make the case go away? They would have discovered most of the money right at the store and also at the previous poker game. A final bill from the McCleen stash would be old news after that change of events, so the FBI guy wouldn't be looking for McCleen. I think we're supposed to suspect that he's no mere FBI agent--that he knows more about Dan's business than he's let on, or that he's being pushed by some other group/agent/entity to keep the pressure on Dan.

Regarding Lydia, how does she always appear so put together in modern clothing? Why isn't she in 1948 wear? Other than the "really old newspaper" that she hands to the pushcart guy, there's nothing to indicate that she's pulled out of the past (or pulled out of her life - or sleep - by some inconvenience).
Maybe Moon doesn't look good in period clothing? ;) Or maybe she spends more time in the future that the past? Or maybe she simply "refuses" to live in the past even when she's there? Or maybe she's a quick-change artist? (I do wish they'd address it.)

Gunnyman

11-20-2007, 06:15 PM

Is it too much to ask for the writers to have Dan pull Livia aside and say "ok tell me EVERYTHING you know about this stuff, how can I control this etc etc"
will explaining things a little more clearly cost the show some viewers or
something?

MickeS

11-20-2007, 06:22 PM

That sounds less like a rule about the limitations of Dan's time traveling than it does a rule about the limitation of what the writers are going to write.

Yeah, it could be the accountants deciding it because of budgets reasons. :)

I haven't seen a good reason otherwise to make that restriction.

Bryanmc

11-20-2007, 07:15 PM

Also, her hair is so straight. I didn't think long straight hair like that was the style in the late 40s.

Pssst.... Livia knows she's a time traveler. So she's probably always going to be prepared to jump and isn't going to be "too" 40s.

Enrique

11-20-2007, 08:18 PM

When I was watching the show I was thinking Jacks name should be Jackass more then just Jack, He so pisses me off.

I was mad at the wife in this ep too (I mean come on your husband save people's LIVES!! he is not out ****ing some woman)but when she said how she misses him and gets mad over that I get were she is coming from.

scottykempf

11-20-2007, 10:53 PM

Is this the first episode where Jack journeys and doesn't ask someone "What's the date? What's the year?" That always annoys me. Is it so hard to find a paper from that day with the date on it?

TonyD79

11-20-2007, 10:59 PM

No, what changed was losing the interaction between Jack and Dan over the serial kidnapper, which is what started to convince Dan that Jack might not be insane. That had nothing to do with Kate, who has known almost since the beginning that Dan is not insane.

Yes, because he buried her re-vitalized wedding ring under the rock they put in the patio years earlier and had her dig it up.

TonyD79

11-20-2007, 11:04 PM

That sounds less like a rule about the limitations of Dan's time traveling than it does a rule about the limitation of what the writers are going to write.

Not much of a difference, there.

See, this is not a documentary. There are no real rules except what the writers set up. ;)

Anyway, watch the almost Quantum Leap type opening. No dates outside of his lifespan.

Actually, I like the vagueness. No need to spell out rules or whys or hows. It is better to keep it a mystery for a long time. Back to Quantum Leap. They kept the God aspect/reason out until the final episode.

busyba

11-21-2007, 12:23 AM

I was mad at the wife in this ep too (I mean come on your husband save people's LIVES!! he is not out ****ing some woman)but when she said how she misses him and gets mad over that I get were she is coming from.

I think her frustration stems from the fact that Dan is traveling all over time to help improve the lives of total strangers, yet he is unable to stick around long enough to attend to his own son who is clearly having problems of his own.

busyba

11-21-2007, 12:27 AM

Not much of a difference, there.

See, this is not a documentary. There are no real rules except what the writers set up. ;)
True, but my point is that the quote from the writer doesn't sound like a statement on the nature of the "technology" of time travel in their universe, it sounds like a policy statement on the kind of stories they decided to stick to.

It's the difference between saying "Dan can only travel within his own lifetime", and saying, "we've decided for now to only do stories where Dan travels within his own lifetime, but that might change later."

In Quantum Leap, the one or two times that Sam leaped outside of his own lifetime, they came up with a "scientific" reason behind it because they said within the show that Sam could only leap within his lifetime. On Journeyman, if someday Dan leaps outside of his own lifetime, they won't have to explain it in-story, since there was nothing in-story that had said he couldn't.

teknikel

11-21-2007, 01:46 AM

On Journeyman, if someday Dan leaps outside of his own lifetime, they won't have to explain it in-story, since there was nothing in-story that had said he couldn't.

We don't know how long Livia will live so she may have already jumped out of her lifetime.

That makes me think that time travel forward is bogus. I am sure there is some equation that makes this possible but how can you go from the past to the future the first tiime unless all timelines are happening simultaneously? From the present POV the there is not future to go to. That assumes that time is linear.

head hurts again. done.

BitbyBlit

11-21-2007, 03:25 AM

That makes me think that time travel forward is bogus. I am sure there is some equation that makes this possible but how can you go from the past to the future the first tiime unless all timelines are happening simultaneously? From the present POV the there is not future to go to. That assumes that time is linear.

Technically, we're all already traveling forward in time. And it is physically possible to travel forward in time in such a manner that time passes quicker for others than oneself. So traveling forward in time as Livia has done is not only not bogus, it is actually possible.

However, once in the future, getting back to the past is the hard part. But if we accept that Dan can travel into the past, we can also accept that Livia can travel back into the past, allowing her to return to around the same time that she left.

When you introduce time travel into the picture, the notions of past, present, and future change. Dan and Livia are still living their lives, and have what they perceive to be a past, present, and future. Their past, present, and future just happen to not follow the same order as most other people's.

Rob Helmerichs

11-21-2007, 08:12 AM

WinBear

11-21-2007, 09:54 AM

This also leads to the question that if Livia is still alive, wouldn't there possibly be an older version of her running (ok, lounging in a retirement center) around SF? That might be interesting for Dan to travel to a nursing home of some kind in the 90s and have young Livia, post-plane crash Livia and very old Livia in the same scene.

MickeS

11-21-2007, 10:53 AM

This also leads to the question that if Livia is still alive, wouldn't there possibly be an older version of her running (ok, lounging in a retirement center) around SF?

Well, no... the only version that existed in the 40's would still be the only version in all future timelines. So theoretically, if you travel into the future, you should disappear from the present and on, until you reappear in the future. Just like Dan disappears from the present when he travels to the past.

Rob Helmerichs

11-21-2007, 10:57 AM

Well, no... the only version that existed in the 40's would still be the only version in all future timelines. So theoretically, if you travel into the future, you should disappear from the present and on, until you reappear in the future. Just like Dan disappears from the present when he travels to the past.
I think what he means is, she does all her time traveling, then retires (back in her original timeline, the 40s) and lives on to the present, or at least until she dies. Which means that just as there are two Dans when he travels into the past, there are two Livias when she travels into the future.

PajamaFeet

11-21-2007, 11:01 AM

I think the unintended consequences Livia keeps warning Dan about are more than just changing his current timeline like we saw in this episode, a la Jack not having come to accept that Dan really is time traveling. I think Livia did not "stick to the plan" when she jumped to the late 80s, and that's why she got stuck there for so long.

DevdogAZ

11-21-2007, 11:18 AM

MickeS

11-21-2007, 11:23 AM

Why doesn't Dan just come up with some kind of "proof" for Jack the same way he proved it to Katie in the pilot episode? I'd think that at this point, it's so frustrating for him to keep dealing with Jack that he'd figure out a way to prove it once and for all.

Yeah I agree. However, the way they've been showing their relationship, they made it believable that the characters would interact this way just to piss each other off. There's a lot of resentment between them, and they seem to take some pleasure in making the other angry.

Mike20878

11-21-2007, 11:37 AM

Also, in the prior episode when Jack was at the bar spending the evidence bill, Jack should have already suspected.

Finally, however, why is the FBI agent still talking about the Dylan McCleen case? After Jack dumped the balance of the money at the convenience store on the dead hippy, why didn't that make the case go away? They would have discovered most of the money right at the store and also at the previous poker game. A final bill from the McCleen stash would be old news after that change of events, so the FBI guy wouldn't be looking for McCleen.

I still don't think Jack spent the evidence bill. It was more probable that it was a continuity/prop error. They needed a bill for Jack to spend and they had the one from the evidence bag handy. They focused on it only to emphasize that Jack was thinking about what happened in 1995. If the show blog were actually up to date maybe they would settle this for us.

Regarding the FBI investigation, the bill found in present day was still found so despite previous discovery of the cash I'm sure the case is still open. The random appearance of Dylan McCleen money at a convenience store robbery would not have led them to John Richie.

I don't think I usually rewind much when watching this show but I did it a few times tonight. They finally confirmed Dan's phone is an iPhone. They have never really been definitive about it until now.

And I was on the edge of my seat just watching the previews for next week!

Mike20878

11-21-2007, 11:43 AM

Oh, this is promising...

According to Futon Critic (http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch.aspx?id=journeyman&view=listings)
ADDITIONAL NOTES:
three additional scripts ordered on 10/10/07

busyba

11-21-2007, 01:38 PM

Oh, this is promising...

According to Futon Critic (http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch.aspx?id=journeyman&view=listings)ADDITIONAL NOTES:
three additional scripts ordered on 10/10/07

Too bad there's nobody around to write them. :D

JohnB1000

11-21-2007, 02:05 PM

Great show again. Loved it.

A question asked above but answered with a misunderstanding is this. How does Katie keep aware of what Dan has done but Jack doesn't. Surely time should have changed for her also and all the memories forgotten.

Truth is I don't care, it doesn't effect my love of the show. I was glad Jack forgot everything otherwise that would have seemed inconsistent.

BitbyBlit

11-21-2007, 02:54 PM

A question asked above but answered with a misunderstanding is this. How does Katie keep aware of what Dan has done but Jack doesn't. Surely time should have changed for her also and all the memories forgotten.

Her memories of the past (if she even had any related to what Dan changed) are changing. However, since she already believes that Dan can time travel, she just believes Dan when he tells her what he changed.

Rob Helmerichs

11-21-2007, 03:10 PM

Too bad there's nobody around to write them. :D
Of course, they had three weeks to get them done before the strike started. And if three different writers wrote them...

Philosofy

11-21-2007, 03:28 PM

OK, how about this one: what if Dan, meeting Livia in a year before their "first" meeting, goes up to her (like at the rave) and just say "Hey, I'm a time traveler, too, but I lost my rulebook. Do you know what's going on?"

GadgetFreak

11-21-2007, 03:52 PM

Is this the first episode where Jack journeys and doesn't ask someone "What's the date? What's the year?" That always annoys me. Is it so hard to find a paper from that day with the date on it?

Actually, he did ask the hippies what year it was. I think it was the first time that the person he asked did not look at him strange. And the person he asked got they year wrong -- his friend corrected him!

PajamaFeet

11-21-2007, 04:08 PM

Actually, he did ask the hippies what year it was. I think it was the first time that the person he asked did not look at him strange. And the person he asked got they year wrong -- his friend corrected him!That was the Winterland episode from last week.

I had a harder time figuring out what year it was this ep for some reason. Maybe it's the fact that Dan wasn't asking right away, and I didn't notice that he had been???

JohnB1000

11-21-2007, 04:19 PM

Her memories of the past (if she even had any related to what Dan changed) are changing. However, since she already believes that Dan can time travel, she just believes Dan when he tells her what he changed.

While you might be right we really haven't seen evidence of that. She just seems to remember what he's talking about each time we see them discussing it.

Rob Helmerichs

11-21-2007, 04:55 PM

I had a harder time figuring out what year it was this ep for some reason. Maybe it's the fact that Dan wasn't asking right away, and I didn't notice that he had been???
...which is why he usually asks. Hollywood Storytelling 101...set the scene!

Mike20878

11-21-2007, 05:22 PM

Didn't he actually ask Livia what year it was?

trainman

11-21-2007, 05:58 PM

DevdogAZ

11-21-2007, 06:01 PM

When Dan traveled the first time in this episode, he had been jogging while listening to an iPod. I was waiting for someone in the early 1990s to notice his magical music-playing device, but it never happened.
Didn't he never acknowledge that he had jumped during that sequence? He found the girl hiding behind the wall and told the cops she'd been missing for years. It was almost as if he didn't realized he was in the past and that she'd probably only been missing for days or weeks at that point.

TAsunder

11-21-2007, 06:12 PM

Didn't he never acknowledge that he had jumped during that sequence? He found the girl hiding behind the wall and told the cops she'd been missing for years. It was almost as if he didn't realized he was in the past and that she'd probably only been missing for days or weeks at that point.

The device was in his pocket so it just looked to them like he had white earbuds.

I think that him saying she was missing was a slip up. He does that from time to time. He didn't seem to actually recognize her until someone showed up with the photo.

jk5598224

11-23-2007, 04:53 PM

This is absolutely the best new show this season!

wprager

11-23-2007, 05:06 PM

It's curious that since she returns to the 40's after her journeys, that she would even be aware of unintended consequences.

Maybe it's something she did back in the forties that had consequences in the future -- like her future with Dan. Or maybe something she did in the '80s had consequences on Dan's future with Katie.

Or maybe it was just loose writing.

Kamakzie

11-24-2007, 02:05 AM

Screw you NBC! http://blog.zap2it.com/frominsidethebox/2007/11/nbc-gives-journ.html

http://www.petitiononline.com/jmf/

email NBC here pamela.black@nbcuni.com

emandbri

11-24-2007, 02:26 AM

That sucks!

We aren't a neilson family but but we watch chuck and heroes live but we never watch journeyman live. By the time we are done with chuck and heroes it is time for bed and even if it wasn't time for bed we simply aren't going to watch 3 hours of tv in one night

appleye1

11-24-2007, 04:25 AM

Screw you NBC! http://blog.zap2it.com/frominsidethebox/2007/11/nbc-gives-journ.html

http://www.petitiononline.com/jmf/

email NBC here pamela.black@nbcuni.comArghhh.

The bad thing is me personally watching the show does nothing. It's the dang Nielson viewers that need to watch the show!

Thanks for the info Kamikaze. I'm going to post it in my "Vote for Journeyman" thread and see if some kind of TCF support can be drummed up.

Philosofy

11-24-2007, 12:49 PM

Doesn't Monday Night Football always skew the Monday night ratings in the fall? What will Journeyman have to compete with after MNF? Oh, and why the hell does anyone watch David Caruso do a Jack Webb imitation every week? The guy is the worst actor on tv.

busyba

11-24-2007, 12:54 PM

Fans of Roswell sent in bottles of Tabasco sauce.

Fans of Jericho sent in nuts.

Fans of Journeyman should send in circa 2003 $20 bills. :D

Bierboy

11-24-2007, 01:09 PM

Signed the petition, but, since there are less than 1,000 signatures on it, I'm not encouraged. 10-20K would be a good start.

Kamakzie

11-24-2007, 01:11 PM

Fans of Journeyman should send in circa 2003 $20 bills. :D

Photo copied of course! :D

dianebrat

11-24-2007, 01:16 PM

*sigh*

It's a goner.. no doubt about it, they want Heroes ratings, and it will never happen.
And since no network will stick with anything anymore, not a chance in hell it will survive.

Typical networks nowadays, no thought about quality or follow-through, everything has to be a hit out of the box, no letting them grow and build, it's a sad state on the way networks think.

trainman

11-24-2007, 05:31 PM

Doesn't Monday Night Football always skew the Monday night ratings in the fall?

It used to be a factor when it was on ABC, but that effect has pretty much gone away now that it's on ESPN.

stellie93

11-24-2007, 06:54 PM

So the writers strike isn't settled and we have no new programming coming in the forseeable future, yet perfectly good shows are going to be dumped? :confused:

DevdogAZ

11-25-2007, 02:08 AM

Petition signed, but hopes are not high. Can't believe they'd ax the show in the middle of the strike and leave finished episodes on the shelf. That just seems spiteful.

DevdogAZ

11-25-2007, 02:25 AM

The article posted mentions that the decision will be based on the ratings from Nov. 19 and 26. According to the futon critic (http://www.thefutoncritic.com/ratings.aspx?id=monday), it doesn't look good. The only show on the four networks that did worse was K-ville, and that one's on the brink of being canceled too.

Kamakzie

11-25-2007, 08:06 AM

Gotta love network executives... :mad:

ElJay

11-25-2007, 04:23 PM

dianebrat

11-25-2007, 04:47 PM

NBC freaks out just like Fox does. It's almost like they're day traders in the stock market. They have little patience for anything; I'm amazed "30 Rock" and "The Office" have survived this long.

I don't think 10pm Monday is a good place for this show. I'm already recording three hours of other content that night before 10pm rolls around. If I didn't have a DVR I doubt I would ever watch it.

Perfect places for Journeyman?
10PM Wednesday, after Lost is over on ABC
10PM Thursday, after CSI is done on CBS
10PM Sunday competing against Shark on CBS.

There are plenty of places for it, but thinking that it will carry the Heroes audience is foolish, and as others have said.. it seems all the networks have staked out Monday as their "must win" night, I have both Tivos running all night Mondays.