<<new and confused>>

[imtiedup]

I've had comcast hddvr for a long time now and after hearing about tivo2go it's time to dump them.

First let me say that, yes I have read forums first, called tech support, and talked to sales at store, need expert advice.

I can't decide between the tivohd and the series3hd box.

Here is what I 'dream' of doing:
1. I have windows home server setup with 8tb of storage available, will double that when my raid card arrives. Also have a few vista64 and one vista32 bit machines in the house. Xbox 360 in every room.

2. I HATE running out of storage room, and heard that I can now use my computer to store all my tivo shows in hd. Do both the tivohd and series3 have this ability?

3. Can I use my xbox360s as extenders to watch what tivo stores on my server?

4. If not 360's can I use pc's to watch what is stored locally on the server from the tivo? (Main theater room uses uber highend pc as dvd player etc for the front projection, everything but tv now)

5. Currently I use the optical out of the dvr to my receiver. That being said, I hear that series3 is thx certified, but is there really any difference as I am using optical and not analog out?

6. Don't care about remote, use crestron system, nor do I care about faceplate information, extra hdmi cable etc... Other than 'internal' storage capacity am I going to regret buying a bunch of tivohd's vs. the series3?

Finally, I am not shy about 3rd party apps or mods. Frankly I like tearing things apart. Is there any advantage to either system when it comes to major mods etc?

thanks so much in advance for any advice

[RonDawg]

2. Yes. You will need to download TiVo Desktop which is available for free, and recently has been made to work with Vista, though I'm not sure about the 64 bit version.

Or, you can buy an external storage solution. Currently the only offical TiVo external storage solution is the Western Digital My DVR Expander. I have one and it's great, but some people feel that $199 is too much to pay or that 500GB is too little. If you are one of those people, you may want to get the S3 instead. There is an unofficial way to get those to recognize other eSATA solutions. The THD will only work with the My DVR Expander.

3. Not to my knowledge. TiVo Desktop only works on Windows computers. There is a paid version called TTG Plus that will allow you to encode the video to be playable on many portable players.

4. Yes, as long as it's a Windows computer.

5. I'll let someone else chime in here as I've never owned an S3.

6. The S3's known limitation over the THD is: no M-card support for the foreseeable future, if ever. There may be others but that's the only one I can think of.

The THD's known disadvantages as compared to the S3 are the smaller included hard drive, no THX, no OLED display, cheaper remote, and will only accept the My DVR Expander as an external storage solution.

As far as modding, aside from the external storage there is no particular advantage to either when it comes to modding as far as I know.

[flatcurve]

First of all, impressive...

I'll say this in regards to points 2,5 and 6 in no particular order:

-It sounds like cost is not an object for you. If you're interested in increasing the capacity of the units, I recommend doing it internally instead of going with an external storage solution. It's simpler and more relilable. So in those regards, the 160GB TivoHD vs the 250GB Series 3 shouldn't be an issue, because both will take an internal 1TB drive no problem.

-Both units work with TivoToGo (the content transferring feature you talked about). Bear in mind that not all content can be copied to your computer with TTG (DRM), so it might be worthwhile to get as much storage on them as you can. This is a content provider issue, and not something Tivo has any control over.

-And as far as I know, the main reason the TivoHD is not THX certified is the cost of doing so. The quality is basically comparable, although I'm not an audiophile.

[imtiedup]

Thank you so much for all the input. As I have 6 comcast boxes to replace, cost is going to be somewhat of an issue which is why I was even considering the tivohd instead of series3.

As to the thx, I kind of figured that there wasn't an actual difference as optical out is optical out.

I am concerned about the drm issue, hence reading another site at the same time that seems to deal with it, though it is a bit above my head at the moment.

90% of what I watch is simple network primetime hd, at least that is what I mainly save to watch later. Has anyone noticed wether or not these shows seem to have the drm transfer issue?

Also:
Is it actually true that the tivohd cannot accept just any esata extension drive and has to have the 500gb specific one mentioned?

I 'think' I found a tool that will allow me to take the internal drive out of either unit and replace it with a 1tb drive, though still waiting for an answer on that thread on the other forum, which is why I 'think' and not 'know' LOL

[Gregor]

Thank you so much for all the input. As I have 6 comcast boxes to replace, cost is going to be somewhat of an issue which is why I was even considering the tivohd instead of series3.

As to the thx, I kind of figured that there wasn't an actual difference as optical out is optical out.

I am concerned about the drm issue, hence reading another site at the same time that seems to deal with it, though it is a bit above my head at the moment.

90% of what I watch is simple network primetime hd, at least that is what I mainly save to watch later. Has anyone noticed wether or not these shows seem to have the drm transfer issue?

Also:
Is it actually true that the tivohd cannot accept just any esata extension drive and has to have the 500gb specific one mentioned?

I 'think' I found a tool that will allow me to take the internal drive out of either unit and replace it with a 1tb drive, though still waiting for an answer on that thread on the other forum, which is why I 'think' and not 'know' LOL

The only DRM programming I've seen has been from premium channels like HBO or Showtime.

You can use other drives with a Tivo HD, but you'll have to put the internal drive from the Tivo into a PC and 'marry' it to whatever drive you'll use. IIRC, WinMFS will do this for you.

[scandia101]

3. Not to my knowledge. TiVo Desktop only works on Windows computers. There is a paid version called TTG Plus that will allow you to encode the video to be playable on many portable players.


That would actually be called TiVo Desktop Plus not TTG Plus

[Mars Rocket]

There's no real functional difference between the THD and the S3 other than the size of the internal drive. The THD supposedly has more RAM, but so far this hasn't made any difference in usability or speed. The THD *does* support a larger drive system (2.2TB limit for an S3, much larger for a THD), but at this point in time this is irrelevant and since larger drives aren't available nobody knows what the limit on a THD really is - it could potentially support 8TB or more.

[greg_burns]

3. Can I use my xbox360s as extenders to watch what tivo stores on my server?

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5694740#post5694740

[RonDawg]

I am concerned about the drm issue, hence reading another site at the same time that seems to deal with it, though it is a bit above my head at the moment.

90% of what I watch is simple network primetime hd, at least that is what I mainly save to watch later. Has anyone noticed wether or not these shows seem to have the drm transfer issue?

This will vary by cable provider, but the only time I run into DRM issues is with content downloaded from Amazon Unbox. There is a possibility of premium channels (HBO/Showtime/etc.) being flagged but I do not subscribe to those channels.

[imtiedup]

Thank you all, you have really been awesome in answering my questions.

I receive my prom modded box back early this week and can't wait to dig into it.

One other question I had is this:
If a show is flagged with drm(HBO/Showtime), will it transfer to the pc with drm intact, or does it refuse to copy in the first place? (figuring virgin box with only prom mod)

I don't really plan on ever burning the media etc, just want it on the pc for playback throughout the house on the 360's or vs.2 extenders when they are available.

[btwyx]

If a show is flagged with drm(HBO/Showtime), will it transfer to the pc with drm intact, or does it refuse to copy in the first place?If its got its flag set it will not transfer. (figuring virgin box with only prom mod)If you've prom modded the TiVo I have no idea.

[btwyx]

"4. can I use pc's to watch what is stored locally on the server from the tivo? "

4. Yes, as long as it's a Windows computer.Or a Mac.

[wiedmann]

One quick comment (you may already know this): Tivo Desktop will not install on WHS. I haven't spent a lot of time to trick it into running there because I have an XP computer that saves to the shared drive, so there might be a workaround, but it's not straightforward.

[bkdtv]

There is a TiVo Server for WHS, but doesn't currently have any way to automatically download recordings from your TiVo.

http://www.wegotserved.co.uk/windows-home-server-add-ins/

I too would like to see a WHS add-on that could automatically download selected recordings from the TiVo.

[wiedmann]

There's also Galleon, which I do have running on my WHS machine. But to be honest, I haven't been able to get it to be completely stable with TTG and TTCB yet. Tivo desktop seems to more reliably transfer shows to/from the tivo.

[imtiedup]

If it doesn't work on WHS, then I could always install tivotogo on my vista64 box, and just have it save to the WHS drives. I think I have them mounted correctly, because when I choose 'save file' on my 64box the WHS drive shows up as an option.

Brings up another question:
When using the 360 to watch the shows, do they first have to be converted at all? I'm guessing from what I have read that when I use tivotogo that it sends the files over as .tivo files, relevent posts on the subject aren't very clear. I do NOT want to drop quality at all from the original HD format I recorded. As the two primary viewing rooms both have 120" projected screens any drop in quality becomes quite apparent.

[leiff]

If your doing alot of TTG, be aware s3 is much faster than THD

[imtiedup]

If your doing alot of TTG, be aware s3 is much faster than THD

Thanks, didn't know that and already paid for prom moded THD.

Not sure I'll be doing a lot of TTG, but mainly just saving everything to the server for MRV on the 360's. I am going out today to get 2 1tb drives for the THD, so I have a little bit of storage to begin with. Then I can just set the tivo to transfer everything to the server that I want to keep. I get the impression from the forum that quality on the 360 will be identical to what I recorded on the tivo itself which is awesome. Saves me from dumping a ton of money on a pc with tuner cards, which aren't working all that well yet anyhow.

[bkdtv]

Brings up another question:
When using the 360 to watch the shows, do they first have to be converted at all? I'm guessing from what I have read that when I use tivotogo that it sends the files over as .tivo files, relevent posts on the subject aren't very clear. I do NOT want to drop quality at all from the original HD format I recorded. As the two primary viewing rooms both have 120" projected screens any drop in quality becomes quite apparent.You don't have to convert the files, but I believe you do have to remove the TiVo wrapper.

Files downloaded from the TiVo are in MPG format, but with an encrypted TiVo wrapper (hence the .Tivo extension). Installing TiVo Desktop on your computer provides the filter needed to decode that wrapper.

There are several different programs that will also remove the TiVo wrapper and give you the original MPG. A few of those are mentioned in the TTG/MRV sticky at the top of this forum. Most require you to manually open the .Tivo file and click "Decode" (i.e. remove TiVo wrapper) to get the MPG.

I use VideoRedo (14-day trial (http://www.videoredo.net/beta/VideoReDoTVS-3-1-3-545.exe)) because it is the only one I know of that will completely automate the process. The AutoProcessor add-on (http://www.videoredo.net/msgBoard/showthread.php?t=4712) for VideoRedo will automatically detect .TiVo recordings downloaded by Tivo Desktop, remove the commercials, and save them as MPGs to another folder of your choice. It will also delete the original .Tivo file.

The screenshot below shows the AutoProcessor add-on set to automatically detect all .Tivo files, remove the .Tivo wrapper, remove the commercials, and save the commercial-free MPGs to my network drive. These options are shown below under "Default Settings."

http://mysite.verizon.net/~fiosdvr/videoredo/autoprocessor.png

[greg_burns]

Brings up another question:
When using the 360 to watch the shows, do they first have to be converted at all? I'm guessing from what I have read that when I use tivotogo that it sends the files over as .tivo files, relevent posts on the subject aren't very clear. I do NOT want to drop quality at all from the original HD format I recorded. As the two primary viewing rooms both have 120" projected screens any drop in quality becomes quite apparent.

You need to remove the tivo imposed DRM from your .tivo files before the will stream to a 360. (At least that has been my experience. Honestly, never tried installing TivoDesktop on my Vista Media Center that is feeding my 360).

TivoDecode will remove the DRM will out affecting quality. (But it does have to rewrite the entire file which can be time consuming)
http://www.gmonweb.com/portal/CodingFun/Downloads/tabid/54/Default.aspx

[classicsat]

I'll just add that, it seems, the Series 3 has Crestron support, the THD doesn't.

[bizzy]

I like to ask Tivo support what a "Creston" is when I call. So far none of them had a clue.

[imtiedup]

You need to remove the tivo imposed DRM from your .tivo files before the will stream to a 360. (At least that has been my experience. Honestly, never tried installing TivoDesktop on my Vista Media Center that is feeding my 360).

TivoDecode will remove the DRM will out affecting quality. (But it does have to rewrite the entire file which can be time consuming)
http://www.gmonweb.com/portal/CodingFun/Downloads/tabid/54/Default.aspx

Is the same true when streaming on the media center computer itself, or just when streaming to the 360?

As to the crestron, grrrrrr, totally forgot about that before purchasing the
THD, suppose I'll just deal with ir repeater. Since installing the hardwired ir repeater system I have never missed a beat, but it's nowhere near as convenient as serial.

Omikron built my system and I will have it in hands Wed. Then it's really time to jump into this. Frankly I am quite excited about it.

[bkdtv]

Is the same true when streaming on the media center computer itself, or just when streaming to the 360?The TiVo files play fine on Media Center PC. But I'm fairly certain you need to remove the .Tivo wrapper for playback on the 360.

You can remote the wrapper automatically using the utility I linked above.

[RandyDtg]

The s3 displays what it is recording (for you, not if a suggestion) on its front panel. I'd get an s3 just for this. When my TV is off, I always get a kick out of being able to see what it is recording wihout having to fire up by big screen, like on my way out leaving for work.

Make sure you get a terabyte drive too.

[imtiedup]

The s3 displays what it is recording (for you, not if a suggestion) on its front panel. I'd get an s3 just for this. When my TV is off, I always get a kick out of being able to see what it is recording wihout having to fire up by big screen, like on my way out leaving for work.

Make sure you get a terabyte drive too.

Yes it is a neat feature, however all of my equipment is in a server closet so there is no way to see the display from any of the viewing rooms. It's much nicer and cleaner that way. No wires anywhere, and no equipment cluttering up my rooms, not to mention dead silence and no computer fans etc to listen to.

My promed unit arrives on Wed and I'm so excited about setting it up almost can't stand it.

[greg_burns]

My promed unit arrives on Wed and I'm so excited about setting it up almost can't stand it.

Why did you have it promed? What does that give you? Fill me in. :p

[classicsat]

The verb is PROMmed. It means replacing the boot PROM chip with a hacked one so the OS can be hacked.

[George Webster]

The only DRM programming I've seen has been from premium channels like HBO or Showtime.

I will add my two cents. If I understand correctly, the FCC will not allow DRM on content that is broadcast over the air (the major networks) even if that content is redistributed by cable or satellite providers.

[bkdtv]

I will add my two cents. If I understand correctly, the FCC will not allow DRM on content that is broadcast over the air (the major networks) even if that content is redistributed by cable or satellite providers.That's correct.

But cable companies can copy protect almost anything else.