DVR Expander DEAD after less than 48 hours

[plasticphilosoph]

Check this out.

My My DVR Expander shipped from TiVo at the end of last week and it arrived on Tuesday. I plugged it in, it married to my TiVo HD, and it gave me lots of wonderful recording space.

This morning, I woke up to find that my TiVo was stuck on the "powering up" screen. Uh oh! I figured it was a loose cable as people here have reported, but the cables were fine. I noticed the drive light wasn't on, though, when I was checking out the cables.

Ok, so I unplugged the drive, plugged it back in, tried a different power outlet, etc, but to no avail. The thing just doesn't power on. No light, no spin-up, no fan noises (is there a fan? I dunno). It's completely dead. I have no idea if something is wrong with the cable or something internal, but to me as the user, the distinction isn't that important.

So I call TiVo. They agree. But despite that I got the device from the TiVo store, they want me to go to Western Digital to get it replaced. Uh.. ok. But the WD 800 number is closed. So support.wdc.com has some cool interaction where I can put in my serial number and see how the warranty works, etc, and it tells me there is no warranty and my serial number is not eligible for an RMA.

In the meantime, I divorced the drive from my TiVo so I can actually use the TiVo to record things tonight, and I've lost whatever recordings I've accumulated since Tuesday.

Some hardware is just going to fail, and I pulled the short straw here, but dude, why can't TiVo own up and just ship me another one? If I had purchased this thing at Best Buy or Amazon or wherever, take your pick, and it died a day later I could certainly send it right back for an exchange. In the future I won't be so stupid. Don't buy anything but TiVo hardware from TiVo.

[Joybob]

Plug it into your PC and see if it's alive?

[sfhub]

Probably a power supply problem. Try plugging the bare drive into an Antec MX-1 and see if the TiVo HD will allow it to be married.

[acvthree]

So, are you saying that Tivo doesn't cover the warranty and neither does WD? Is this effectively an "as is" product?

[Ralph Wiggum]

The Tivo site has to have a 30 day return, right?

There's no way they can say no to taking it back. Talk to a supervisor.

[plasticphilosoph]

Oh, sorry, I'm not saying this product is as-is, because my story's not over. Tomorrow, at the request of more than one TiVo service rep, I will call WD during their business hours and hopefully get this dealt with neatly and quickly. I'll post an update afterwards.

[andrews777]

Oh, sorry, I'm not saying this product is as-is, because my story's not over. Tomorrow, at the request of more than one TiVo service rep, I will call WD during their business hours and hopefully get this dealt with neatly and quickly. I'll post an update afterwards.

Another thread here had a similar discussion in it. Tivo ultimately owned up to being responsible for the drive.

The thing that annoys me with this is that Tivo support was supposed to be one of the benefits for overpaying for a "sanctioned drive."

Brad

[hkancyr]

You gotta be kidding me. I just installed this drive in my THD today. One of the reason I got it is because of TiVo support. I thought it was supposed to be bullet proof too, because Tivo sanctioned it. I'll check on mine tomorrow to see if it's still running.

[jlib]

...I will call WD during their business hours and hopefully get this dealt with neatly and quickly. I'll post an update afterwards.They will just tell you it is out of stock (they don't have any refurbished units to send you yet). TiVo should handle DOA situations, which yours essentially is, and replace it with a new one.

[mr.unnatural]

Hard drives installed in a consumer product are generally the responsibility of the OEM product manufacturer and not the drive manufacturer. The same goes for any drive that came with the Tivo. If the drive dies it only carries whatever warranty Tivo decides to provide and not the normal drive manufacturer's warranty. The same goes for most PC manufacturers like Dell or HP. If the drive dies you have to get it replaced from them and not WD or whatever brand of drive it came with. That's why the drive's serial No. isn't accepted when you check the warranty status at the drive manufacturer's website.

[mather]

I really think Tivo should have gone with an external drive with a fan. Is the expander passively cooled? I just don't think it is good for long term reliability.

[Ralph Wiggum]

I just hope this is an isolated experience. If there's a pattern of these being defective, I'm going to pretty ticked at having wasted cash and losing recordings.

[plasticphilosoph]

Ok, here's the follow-up.

I called WD, and as people predicted they told me they couldn't do anything. The guy at WD first asked me to exchange the device at the store where I purchased it, and then told me it was an OEM drive that they could not exchange or service. No big surprises there I guess.

Then I called back TiVo. After waiting on hold for 45 minutes, I told the rep what WD said and what he told me was pretty awesome: he said that Western Digital originally manufactured the equipment, so they are the OEM and I should call them back! I almost died. I started down the path of getting into an argument with him about the definition of OEM, but then I thought better of it and just pressed him to resolve this. It wasn't that pretty. I refused to get off the phone until everything was taken care of--he tried to get WD in a three-way call but couldn't (I kind of wish that worked, I wanted to see what would happen), and he continued to refuse to replace this thing. At some point he suggested that I order another. Oh, and he *is* the supervisor (yeah, I bet).

Eventually I just said hey, look, I'm done with trying to get this replaced, at this point I just want to return it and be done with it. He got me an RMA and a shipping label. I was very close to being satisfied, but then he refused to refund the original 2-day shipping I paid. I don't know why. Great job TiVo! You saved yourself $14! In response to that, I got the same rep to cancel my second TiVo (the first one is prepaid).

In summary, my advice is DO NOT ORDER THIS DEVICE FROM TIVO. If you're going to get stuff like this, get it from a reputable retailer that isn't going to refuse to be helpful if things go wrong.

And of course, try not to get the defective ones. =) Especially in cases where defective==data loss.

[theguru1974]

Wow. I'm kind of worried now when mine arrives should something bad happen. Can I hear some "mine's still working after x days of use" posts to help reassure me this isn't a dud product?

Eric

[SeanTivo]

Thanks for that info.

I ordered one a few days ago when they showed up as back in stock on the Tivo
web site. After hearing how they treated you I'm now on hold with customer support waiting to cancel my order.

The cancel order link on the web site doesn't work. It gets stuck in the "Loading..."
mode.

I'll wait for one of the Best Buys near me to get them in stock before I buy one. I can't stand crappy customer service like you described. In fact, now that I'm thinking of it, I'm still waiting for a call back from an engineer that was promised to me 3 seperate times on a HDMI issue that appeared after the "upgrade" to 9.1.

I gave up waiting and just went to component.

[msrolla]

So far it's been three days and no problems. Drive is quiet and is not generating a lot of heat. Using e-sata cord that came with it, too.

I know it isn't much, but at least it's past the 48 hour mark.

[DaBuzz]

Nice to see the reason Tivo is locking TivoHD customers into this one specific drive (that is overpriced) is so they can provide a great customer service experience when things go wrong ... oh wait ... :(

[Joybob]

Nice to see the reason Tivo is locking TivoHD customers into this one specific drive (that is overpriced) is so they can provide a great customer service experience when things go wrong ... oh wait ... :(

Would it be possible to take a 3rd party drive/enclosure, use a firmware hack to change the HDD name to that of the Tivo DVR expander and then use that to trick the Tivo HD into thinking it is utilizing an 'official drive'?

Or is there some root kit or flag on the drive that allows the Tivo to identify it?

[EVizzle]

Passively cooled? My other WD externals get quite warm during use and have a fan. I am pleased that it will be quiet, but the heat concerns me.

[rkleim]

Tivo -

I have had tivos since 2000, and have always defended you to the max when people rag on you. But I have never heard of such as this, I know I bought this drive from you since you implied support for it. I willingly paid more for it, and if there are problems then I am ready to work with you. But this blanket and repeated refusal to stand behind the product you sell, for the first time, makes me really wonder about you as a company. All those other problems I have lived with silently waining on a system upgrade, all that loyalty to you, what is it all for? This is not one isolated incident of a misinterpretation, but rather it seems to be a deliberate act by policy - a policy that will make your loyal customers leave in droves. I also just bought an extender, and if it goes bad (which it shouldn't), I will be expecting you to stand behind it.

Oh, BTW, when it arrived, it was in a large box with a miniscule amount of bubble wrap around it which had come off totally. The HD was literally bouncing around inside your box. It was still in the WD box, so I kept it, especially since i knew (foolish me) that you would stand behind your sale. Perhaps I should have refused the shipment?


I am expecting a resolution to this man's problem ASAP. You reputation is really at stake when you make policies like this. I will anxiously await hearing from him what you have done.

And for those thinking of ordering, perhaps wait for now. Or use an alternative source. Surely the nitwit who dreamed up this way to screw his customers will be put in his place soon. I still think TIVO must be a great company, and this is just an abberition, everybody gets bad employees - but what you, TIVO, do - that's what defines you as a company.

- Richard Kleim

[hkancyr]

Mine is still running well. I guess my power supply is OK.
It is passively cooled, plenty of vents along the sides. It seems warm but not dangerously so. I have plenty of other external HDD's that run a lot hotter than this thing and I don't even have it in a well ventilated area.
I have a feeling that if you don't get an early failure this thing will go the distance.

[BobCamp1]

Would it be possible to take a 3rd party drive/enclosure, use a firmware hack to change the HDD name to that of the Tivo DVR expander and then use that to trick the Tivo HD into thinking it is utilizing an 'official drive'?

Or is there some root kit or flag on the drive that allows the Tivo to identify it?

Not necessary. Take the internal drive out and marry it to any other drive you want using WinMFS. Put the internal drive back into the Tivo and the new drive on the eSATA connector.

See the sticky post on the top of this forum for more information.

[TiVoPony]

Check this out.

My My DVR Expander shipped from TiVo at the end of last week and it arrived on Tuesday. I plugged it in, it married to my TiVo HD, and it gave me lots of wonderful recording space.

This morning, I woke up to find that my TiVo was stuck on the "powering up" screen. Uh oh! I figured it was a loose cable as people here have reported, but the cables were fine. I noticed the drive light wasn't on, though, when I was checking out the cables.

Ok, so I unplugged the drive, plugged it back in, tried a different power outlet, etc, but to no avail. The thing just doesn't power on. No light, no spin-up, no fan noises (is there a fan? I dunno). It's completely dead. I have no idea if something is wrong with the cable or something internal, but to me as the user, the distinction isn't that important.

So I call TiVo. They agree. But despite that I got the device from the TiVo store, they want me to go to Western Digital to get it replaced. Uh.. ok. But the WD 800 number is closed. So support.wdc.com has some cool interaction where I can put in my serial number and see how the warranty works, etc, and it tells me there is no warranty and my serial number is not eligible for an RMA.

snip...

I agree, this is a frustrating experience, and I apologize on behalf of TiVo. I forwarded your note, and I believe that the policy issue you ran into has been corrected. RMA's are in fact handled by WD directly, and they should have taken care of that for you in a clean and simple manner.

If you'll send me a private message with your contact information, I'd appreciate it so that we can ensure that your specific case is resolved appropriately.


Thanks,
Bob Pony

[Ralph Wiggum]

^Nice one TivoPony.

One of the reasons this board is great.

[Joybob]

Seriously though, the OP should at least hook it up to his PC to see what's up with the drive.

I refuse to believe a drive can die in 48 hours.

[jhimmel]

Seriously though, the OP should at least hook it up to his PC to see what's up with the drive.

I refuse to believe a drive can die in 48 hours.

You seem to be missing the point. The bare drive may or may not work, but the thing is not even powering up when plugged in. Who cares if it works in his PC. He paid for a drive in an enclosure, and top dollar at that.

By the way - I got one and mine (knock on wood) seems to be fine so far.

Jim H.

[Speed RacerX]

My My DVR Expander was bought from Best Buy (yeah, I paid the Best Buy Tax [extra $20] because regardless of the horror stories, I've always had excellent service from them) and it's still running five days later without nary a blip.

[rkleim]

Tivopony -

I was hoping for a resolution like this. You all are great!
- Richard

[NetJunkie]

Seriously though, the OP should at least hook it up to his PC to see what's up with the drive.

I refuse to believe a drive can die in 48 hours.

It's a hard drive. Sometimes they die....even at 48 hours. Sometimes in 5 minutes. If it's a defect it's a defect.

[dsm363]

I had the same issue except mine was DOA, would power on but was never seen by my S3. I spent literally 4 hours on the phone on my day off going back and forth from TiVo to WD and back. I finally complained enough to get a RMA (from TiVo since I ordered it from TiVo.com) since it was within 30 days and I was not 'entirely satisfied' with my purchase. I'm glad TiVoPony is aware of this and working to fix it. I've had TiVo for years and will continue to buy their products but have to admit, mistakes like these do piss people off and could be avoided.
Now if only they would fix the lag introduced into the 30 second skip on my S3 with 9.2J.

[jlib]

I had the same issue except mine was DOA...Why not send your contact info to TiVoPony also so these rogue CSRs can be tracked down and "re-educated."

[dsm363]

I can't remember the CSR's names but I guess they can look that up with my contact info like you suggest. At least it got taken care of.

[mchief]

I installed Wednesday and everything was great until last night. When I tried to watch a recorded program - nothing, black screen. All the recordings were blank. Tivo was working fine and the WD Expander had the light on, was still married, etc. I restarted the Tivo and bingo - everything was back to normal. Hope this is not a continuing problem.

[HDTiVo]

Wasn't the 9.X software also "Verified" by TiVo? :eek: :rolleyes:

[RoyK]

Wasn't the 9.X software also "Verified" by TiVo? :eek: :rolleyes:


If 9.x software was "Verified" at all it was by 3 baboons and a chimpanzee.

[plasticphilosoph]

I just wanted to post a follow-up to my customer service problem here. The original issue was that TiVo shipped me a dvr expander that was pretty much DOA and then gave me a hard time about it. See posts #1 and #13 in this thread.

After TiVoPony took notice of my issue, I did receive a call from a friendly rep at Western Digital, who seemed to indicate that there is some kind of arrangement between TiVo and WD for the support of these drives. He asked if there was anything he could do to make me happy with this botched transaction. I replied that I would really like a drive, but I don't want to buy it from TiVo, and that my plan was just to wait until I happened to see one in Best Buy or something. He said that he'd see what he could do and get back to me. I haven't heard from him since, and that was two weeks ago.

As for the device, it was returned via UPS with the RMA label I was provided. On the 8th, I got an email that it was received in Texas, and "If a refund or credit is in order, we will credit your credit card in 5-7 days." That was 12 days ago. I've seen no credit. No big surprise there.

So, I called today and wasted another half hour on the phone. The rep told me that he sees that my return has been processed, but that he doesn't see a pending credit for it. He's going to need to re-open the case and have someone "put it through manually." I should wait a week to see if I have the credit, and call back if necessary.

My plan is to wait a week, and if I don't see a credit I'm simply calling my credit card company and disputing the original charge. I'm done wasting time with TiVo's phones. This whole interaction is frustrating WAY beyond reason.