Can't see Tivo in Vista

[Restorer]

I recently upgraded to Vista Ultimate OEM. But although my networked Tivo still works fine (I can telnet, ftp and do naughty things) I cannot see it anywhere in the Network and Sharing Centre or in the system tray.

Can any of you Vista experts help?

[TCM2007]

It's not a Windows share, so I wouldn't expect to see it appear there?

[Pete77]

Presumably you can access the Tivo and Tivoweb through your http web browser application at the IP address that you have always used though?

As a Tivo's hard drive does not run a Windows compatible operating system then Windows itself is not going to accept it as being a networked drive. You will only be able to communicate with it via telnet, ftp and http as was also the case in Windows XP.

I also can't quite think why it would actually make sense for you to pay the horrendous upgrade prices being charged by Microsoft for Windows Vista? The only cost effective way to get the product is if it comes bundled on an OEM basis with a new PC. Microsoft only charges PC manufacturers a mere fraction of what they charge end users for the various flavours of Vista. Or perhaps you have also got a new PC at the same time but neglected to mention this in your post?

[iankb]

I also can't quite think why it would actually make sense for you to pay the horrendous upgrade prices being charged by Microsoft for Windows Vista? The only cost effective way to get the product is if it comes bundled on an OEM basis with a new PC.If you don't mind reinstalling your software, you can buy an OEM copy of Vista, and install it as a new OS on an existing PC. You don't have to buy a new PC. The only restrictions, as with any OEM version, is that you cannot transfer it to a different motherboard once authenticated. This is certainly the cheapest option if building a Media Center PC using Vista Home Premium. And you don't even have to buy a throw-away hardware item at the same time as an OEM copy anymore.

[mikerr]

As a Tivo's hard drive does not run a Windows compatible operating system then Windows itself is not going to accept it as being a networked drive. Never heard of samba ? windows compatible file-sharing for linux...
Someone did have samba working on S1 tivos, but I can't find any links right now.

I think the OP just means that XP used to put shortcuts to frequently used ftp sites in network-places if you used explorer's ftp interface.

[Pete77]

If you don't mind reinstalling your software, you can buy an OEM copy of Vista, and install it as a new OS on an existing PC. You don't have to buy a new PC. The only restrictions, as with any OEM version, is that you cannot transfer it to a different motherboard once authenticated. This is certainly the cheapest option if building a Media Center PC using Vista Home Premium. And you don't even have to buy a throw-away hardware item at the same time as an OEM copy anymore.

OK a fair point but I bet the manufacturers can buy OEM Vista licenses in bulk far, far more cheaply than I can possibly buy just one of them as an individual? The pricing of new PC hardware would appear to suggest that hardware manufacturers probably aren't paying Microsoft more than say £20 or £30 a time at most? In particular note that a new PC with Windows Vista Ultimate often seems to cost little more than a PC with the base version of Windows Vista.

Also is it worth going for using Vista before say the start of 2008 due to all the older hardware non retro compatibility issues not yet being solved?

Having said that Microsoft have just released some patches for V1 and V2 of the Dot Net Framework and also V3 of the said Dot Net Framework for XP that have made a complete and utter horlicks of failing to install properly on my XP Home machine and for which I cannot find any obvious solution at the present time. Even the Windows Install Clean Up route has not worked out this time round. And there always seems to be a nightmare issue to solve every time Microsoft provides a patch for the Dot Net Framework. Its almost like a return to Windows 3.11 days, except that XP Home does seem to manage to otherwise carry on as normal despite the Dot Net Framework now not being properly installed on my machine.

[Pugwash]

I bought Vista 64 business edition because it handles huge amount of ram better, and was better than running XP Pro 32-bit on my AMD64.
I don't know why you'd want to see the TiVo as a network share either though.

[Restorer]

I also can't quite think why it would actually make sense for you to pay the horrendous upgrade prices being charged by Microsoft for Windows Vista?

Well wtf has it got to do with you what I spend my money on?

As it happens I had some spare cash for PC upgrade and decided to get the OEM version along with a dual core CPU and some dual channel RAM. That OK with you, ars*hole?

Seems you can't ask a simple question anymore on this forum without getting these kind of posts.

In XP Tivo appeared as a tray icon and you could check it was working OK and get to its properties and check IP addresses etc. I just wanted to know how to do this in Vista. I guess you can't.

[TCM2007]

What do you mean by a "tray icon"

My router shows the TiVos on a network map, but XP only shows it as an FTP site if I've manually addeded it.

[Pete77]

Well wtf has it got to do with you what I spend my money on?
It was only that you told us that your decision to spend the money on Windows Vista had then given you issues with some of your previous operating system functionality disappearing.

Its just that I have been using Windows since Windows 3.11 and in my experience any Microsoft attempt at offering an operating system Upgrade to a previous version Windows version always goes much less smoothly than starting from scratch on new PC or reformatting your whole hard drive and reinstalling your applications and data on the new operating system. So that hassle combined with the high cost of the single user upgrade would tend to put me off doing it personally and make me wait till I needed to get a new PC or replace a broken hard drive. However perhaps my very bad experiences with Windows Me have led me not to expect all new Microsoft operating systems to be better than their immediate predecessors, especially immediately after their launch (or indeed ever in the case of Windows Me).

I'm sorry that my comments seem to have upset you so much but I do think it would help to not then start using extremely rude expletives (asterisk or not) in response.

[TCM2007]

There's been a warning about taking threads off topic at the top of the forum for a while now.

[mikerr]

In XP Tivo appeared as a tray icon and you could check it was working OK and get to its properties and check IP addresses etc. I just wanted to know how to do this in Vista. I guess you can't.

If you're talking about this: http://www.routertech.org/images/cms/conicon.jpg its for checking the PC's ip address, not tivo.

I can't think of anything else on xp that would show you tivo's ip address, unless you had some software for your router on, or the 3rd party tivo widget maybe?

[Pete77]

There's been a warning about taking threads off topic at the top of the forum for a while now.

I don't think anything in this thread qualifies as Off Topic in the accepted sense though.

[ndunlavey]

Well wtf has it got to do with you what I spend my money on?

Applause!

[Pete77]

I will not be posting further in this thread in view of the deliberate attempt at provocation by the previous contributor.

[Restorer]

Wow, Nick, you have the power!

Back to my question. Yes it is the connection icon I am on about. In XP I had one for the PC and one for the Tivo. It showed that the Tivo was connected and it took you to Network Connections where could change the IP address via Properties.

Just wondered why the connection doesn't show up in Vista in the same way and whether I have missed something.

[6022tivo]

I will not be posting further in this thread in view of the deliberate attempt at provocation by the previous contributor.

lol

Ermm I am thinking you are talking about a little utility program that will link to your tivo on the taskbar??? Maybe.

Tivo never showed up as standard in XP or Vista. a 3rd party utility I think?

[Ian_m]

OK a fair point but I bet the manufacturers can buy OEM Vista licenses in bulk far, far more cheaply than I can possibly buy just one of them as an individual? The pricing of new PC hardware would appear to suggest that hardware manufacturers probably aren't paying Microsoft more than say £20 or £30 a time at most? No they don't get it cheaper, since the US court case was lost by MS, where you paid more for Windows licences if say you had a Netscape installed, more if you had AOL startup on desktop MS have adopted one flat price model (might be discount at 20,000 units).

I think Vista Ultimate is about £115 OEM and that price is the same if you buy one or 20,000 copies. It used to be in Windows 2000 days Windows 2000 started at £23 (I think), £32 with Netscape going to £80 if lots of stuff bundled and after court case everyone just pays £86. :mad:

It causes real problems in with us as we cannot buy Vista cheaper than our customers can thus when we say £200 for Vista Ultimate installation, they say "B*gger that I can get it for £115 myself", which they then do and then occupy our support for ages as they can't get it to work and assume as we supplied the hardware we will support the OS that they didn't buy from us !!!!

[mikerr]

I expect dell are only paying around £30 (i.e. less than 30% single unit price), but they are ordering in millions.

Maybe microsoft doesn't count 20,000 as a "large enough" order for a discount ? :eek:

Back to the OP's question, you get one icon in task tray per network interface (i.e. one icon per network cable running into the PC)

You'd only get two if you had two network cards...

Are you sure it wasn't some 3rd party app you installed?

To change the tivo ip, you would need telnet access to the tivo (or the app would)- as tivo doesn't support auto-configuration (DHCP)

[ericd121]

I don't think anything in this thread qualifies as Off Topic in the accepted sense though.Topic of Thread - Can't see Tivo in Vista

Off Topic Posts

#3 Pete77
"I also can't quite think why it would actually make sense for you to pay the horrendous upgrade prices being charged by Microsoft for Windows Vista?" etc.

#4 iankb
(In response to Pete77's Off-topic Post)
"...you can buy an OEM copy of Vista...You don't have to buy a new PC."

#6 Pete77
(Continuing the Off-Topic Conversation he started)
"...I bet the manufacturers can buy OEM Vista licenses in bulk..." etc. etc. etc.

#7 Pugwash
(Adding to the Off-Topic Conversation Pete77 started)
"I bought Vista 64 business edition because it handles huge amount of ram better, and was better than running XP Pro 32-bit on my AMD64."

#8 Restorer
(Measured response to Pete77's Off-topic Post in a thread Restorer started)
"Well wtf has it got to do with you what I spend my money on?"

#10 Pete77
(Pete goes even further Off-Topic)
"...waffle...Windows 3.11...waffle...Microsoft...waffle...Windows Me...waffle..."

#11 TCM2007
(Admin response to Off-Topic Posts)

#13 Pete77
(Pete states his unique opinion in response.)

#14 ndunlavey
(Approbation of Restorer's previous post)

#15 Pete77
(Pete responds and withdraws.)

#18 Ian_m
(In response to one of Pete77's Off-topic Posts)
"...Vista Ultimate is about £115 OEM..."

#20 ericd121
(This Off-Topic Post pointing out the posts that "[qualify] as Off Topic in the accepted sense")
----------------------------------------------------
This thread is a classic example of how Pete77 drags a thread off-topic;
12 off-topic posts in a 20 post thread.

I want to make it clear that the only person I disapprove of in this matter is Pete77;
everyone else is just responding to his pollution of the thread.

Anyone who is watching Big Brother will recognise Pete's tactics as being the same as Charley's:-
Invade a conversation
Start a Fight
Act hurt when people you've p!ssed off react to you.

Pete77 is the Charley of TCM.

[TCM2007]

Pete77 is the Charley of TCM.


:D :D :D

[ColinYounger]

Apologies to Restorer. This is all my fault. I pondered yesterday that Pete seemed to have controlled himself and wasn't polluting threads.

Evidently, I tempted fate too much. <sigh> This (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5328086) thread is just as bad - virtually every post has an off-topic 'hook'.

[PaulWilkinsUK]

Sorry .. can't help it...

WAAAAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAHAAHAAAAAAA :) :D

[Restorer]

Oh well. Ask a simple question .........

[JudyB]

Oh well. Ask a simple question .........
This may be a daft question, but are you sure that you hadn't installed any extra software for your Tivo on your XP system?

I have never seen a connection icon for our Tivo on my XP system, so I did a search on Google and found a few threads on here about problems with "Tivo Desktop" and "Tivo Server" and system tray icons. There is also some discussion about which versions work correctly on Vista.

If you had installed something like this and the version you have does not work on Vista then this might explain your problems. If something has stopped working due to the upgrade then the Event Viewer (system or application log) may give some idea about this, but unfortunately the only detailed links I can find are to troubleshoot when you know which driver or app has failed.

[Restorer]

Nope definitely no extra software. I'm certain I didn't dream this cos I remember the little window would pop up saying it had connected at 100mb. Beginning to think I might be losing my mind aaaaaaargh.

[ColinYounger]

The little window popping up and saying that it had connected at 100mb was your *local network connection* to your router. Nothing to do with TiVo!

Unless you connect your machine directly to the TiVo of course.

[Mike B]

The little window popping up and saying that it had connected at 100mb was your *local network connection* to your router. Nothing to do with TiVo!

Unless you connect your machine directly to the TiVo of course.


In XP Tivo appeared as a tray icon and you could check it was working OK and get to its properties and check IP addresses etc. I just wanted to know how to do this in Vista. I guess you can't.
Even if you did connect your PC directly to your TiVo, the system tray icon (see attached JPG file) would only show details for (and let you alter) the IP address your PC uses for that network adaptor. There is no way to change the settings on the TiVo AFAIK without using nic_config_tivo or editing the rc.net file directly.

[ndunlavey]

Unless you connect your machine directly to the TiVo of course.
Ah, yes ...

Resto - were you running with a network cable direct from your PC to your TiVo?

[Restorer]

Ah, yes ...

Resto - were you running with a network cable direct from your PC to your TiVo?

Well I knew I wasn't dreaming - but I must have had some kind of time warp. I used to run a crossover cable direct to the Tivo when I used a USB modem. I've had the Sky router now for 10 months though. Funny the old brain should only notice the icon missing when I installed Vista. It can't have been there for 10 months before either :o !

Well thanks for helping me get to the bottom of it :up: .

[ColinYounger]

I think we're more disappointed that there wasn't another cool gadget we could install. :)

[wolflord11]

I expect dell are only paying around £30 (i.e. less than 30% single unit price), but they are ordering in millions.

Maybe microsoft doesn't count 20,000 as a "large enough" order for a discount ? :eek:

Back to the OP's question, you get one icon in task tray per network interface (i.e. one icon per network cable running into the PC)

You'd only get two if you had two network cards

Dell and other OEM companies: Gateway etc only purchase a few Copies of an OS for the normal price. They then create a System Restore CD for each PC including not only the original OS, but their own Software etc. Have you ever noticed with say a Dell PC it has a Dell Wallpaper, Screensavers etc. The original OS does not come with this. OEM suppliers are in agreement with MS to do this.

Then, they purchase a License for each PC that costs around $25-$30 US each. Of course they buy in bulk. The minium is 25 licenses. And they come in 25 unit packs.

A normal person can also do this. Purchase 1 copy of an OS and multiple licences at a cost of $25 each. (min order 25 licenses).

That is why a PC from Dell etc costs alot less than having to fork out say $200 per PC for the software alone. Also its alot cheaper for places such as Schools, Universities etc to upgrade their OS's on each and every machine. If you had say 500 PC's would you rather pay $200 for each PC to upgrade: $100,000 or say 5 copies at $200, then $25 per license: Total: $13,375.

See how it works? :D

As for the OP, the question has been answered. The tray icon is for your network device that tells you when there is activity or a problem. If you had 2 Network cards, you could have 2.

The tray icon informs you of activity from the card to a broadband modem or router/switch etc. It does not tell you of activity from your PC to Tivo unless you have the PC and Tivo connected using a Crossover cable (not a standard ethernet cable)

[Restorer]

As for the OP, the question has been answered. The tray icon is for your network device that tells you when there is activity or a problem. If you had 2 Network cards, you could have 2.

The tray icon informs you of activity from the card to a broadband modem or router/switch etc. It does not tell you of activity from your PC to Tivo unless you have the PC and Tivo connected using a Crossover cable (not a standard ethernet cable)

I take it you haven't bothered reading the last few posts? :)

[wolflord11]

I take it you haven't bothered reading the last few posts? :)

Actually I did, that is why I started off with:

"As for the OP, the question has been answered" :D