Mode 0 - The pros & cons?

[gwailofilms]

Hello there.

I got my Tivo a couple of weeks ago and am absolutely loving it. The only thing I'm not so keen on is the horrible "soft" picture it gives during "Watch Live TV". It's bad enough that it gives my girlfriend a headache watching it.

I had been reading that converting to Mode 0 would eliminate the problem. Then I read lots of confusing things about "white flashes" and "Option 2" and my brain stopped working. :confused:

Could one of you knowledgeable chaps please hit me with a nice, plain English, list of pros and cons of Mode 0, so I can make an informed decison as to whether it's worth my time and money?

Thanks you,

Gwailo

[Pete77]

Can I suggest you use the Advanced Search function and enter the phrase Mode 0 while searching only in the Tivo UK forum section.

I find it odd you would only have this problem on Live Tv and not with recorded shows as well though???

[gwailofilms]

Can I suggest you use the Advanced Search function and enter the phrase Mode 0 while searching only in the Tivo UK forum section.
Originally, I did and came across lots of threads full of people arguing about unrelated matters. Digging further through the list, though, I found some very useful discssions. Thank you.

I find it odd you would only have this problem on Live Tv and not with recorded shows as well though???
Recorded shows, even in Basic quality, look fine. The live feed however looks slightly out of focus. Text is particularly eye-straining. Using the "AUX" pass-through eliminates the problem, but also precludes the use of pause & rewind functions etc..

I suppose I should note that I'm using a 4:3 CRT TV and a, to my knowledge, regular unmodded UK Tivo.

I'll try some things like connecting to the other SCART on my TV and using a new cable to see if that makes any odds.

Out of interest, can Tivo output an S-Video signal through the SCART?

[davisa]

Mode 0 cons - none I've seen. Don't get any white flashes.

[blindlemon]

What are you using as your programme source? White flashes are normally only a problem if you are using the internal analogue tuner.

I use Sky/freeview and hardly ever see a white flash :)

TiVo can output component via the SCART if you do the RGB/Component hack, but you lose the ability to passthrough the AUX and VCR feeds.

[gwailofilms]

Well, changing to the other SCART on the TV and hooking the Sky > Tivo > TV chain up with a pair of swanky gold-plated cables I didn't even know I had has rectified my soft Live TV problem. Mde 0 can go on hold until I need to upgrade the drive, I think.

Thanks for all contributions.

[mikerr]

If you are happy with basic quality (!) then you have no current need for mode 0.

Since you are on CRT, its best to do the mode 0 change when you go to LCD/Plasma,
as you will be crying out for it then.

The scalers inside many LCDs and plasmas seem to be optimised fro DVD resolution
(mode0 is DVD resolution, normal best mode isn't)
So mode0 makes more of a positive change than the few pixels difference would suggest
when used with LCDs & plasmas.

[Pete77]

I use Sky/freeview and hardly ever see a white flash :)
Saw a few white flashes on BBC1 last night during Jekyll but didn't notice any during Dr Who. I watched both Live (which means I am watching in Mode 0, which is unusual for me since as you know I record most things in Basic) primarily because my Tivo has just become Full and I was feeling too lazy to go through the complicated process of pruning the increasingly small quantity of dead wood in the 600 hours of pograms I have on my Tivo that I can't bring myself to delete but mainly will never get to watch. Most of the re-run of This Life in Nov/Dec is about to get the axe as I already saw them the first time round and caught at least 10 or so of the re-runs live at the time they were shown.

Some tv needs to be watched live like Grand Prix. If you let some stuff record you never get round to watching it later I find.................

Also I find I spend an awful lot on the internet and this forum which gets in the way of me watching television....................................

[iankb]

So mode0 makes more of a positive change than the few pixels difference would suggest when used with LCDs & plasmas.And if you compare Mode-0's VBR against Best's CBR, you can get up to twice the recording capacity if you use the right VBR settings.

Mode-0 isn't just about picture quality.

[Pete77]

And if you compare Mode-0's VBR against Best's CBR, you can get up to twice the recording capacity if you use the right VBR settings.

Mode-0 isn't just about picture quality.

But what about Mode 0 with VBR against Mode 4 (Best) also recorded in VBR with precisely the same bit rate settings?

Which is more efficient of those two in terms of recording capacity?

[mikerr]

The point is that an unhacked tivo doesn't use VBR at all.

You have change the settings via tivoweb - which is part of the mode0 procedure anyway.

[Pete77]

The point is that an unhacked tivo doesn't use VBR at all.

You have change the settings via tivoweb - which is part of the mode0 procedure anyway.

Yes but having Tivoweb does not make it compulsory to use Mode 0. So my query remains as to which obtains greater recording capacity using VBR at the same Bit Rate settings? Is it Mode 4 or Mode 0?

[TCM2007]

But what about Mode 0 with VBR against Mode 4 (Best) also recorded in VBR with precisely the same bit rate settings?

Which is more efficient of those two in terms of recording capacity?

With precisely the same bitrate settings, they will be, well, precicely the same! the answer is in the question...

[blindlemon]

Maybe not... as the resoluition is different and we are talking about VBR not CBR recording.

I guess it depends on the VBR algorithm as to whether it uses more bits for a higher resolution, all other parameters being equal, or whether it uses the same number of bits regardless, thus reducing the picture quality as resolution increases....

[aerialplug]

Pros: If it works for you, it really improves the sharpness of the picture, especially if you have a big screen.

Cons: If, like me you get grey flashes at th bottom of the screen during some "busy" images wheatever settings you use for mode 0, I'd rather a slightly softer image.

[Pete77]

Maybe not... as the resoluition is different and we are talking about VBR not CBR recording.

I guess it depends on the VBR algorithm as to whether it uses more bits for a higher resolution, all other parameters being equal, or whether it uses the same number of bits regardless, thus reducing the picture quality as resolution increases....

I guess the answer is to test it recording the same program shown at say two different times on BBC Three in the two different Modes, both using VBR.

[TCM2007]

Maybe not... as the resoluition is different and we are talking about VBR not CBR recording.

I guess it depends on the VBR algorithm as to whether it uses more bits for a higher resolution, all other parameters being equal, or whether it uses the same number of bits regardless, thus reducing the picture quality as resolution increases....

If the assumpotion that the first bitrate figures is the targetted average, then it shouldn't make any difference so long as the source material allowed the average to be hit. But Pete is right, the only way to be sure is to try.

[Pete77]

But Pete is right :eek: :eek: :eek: :p ;) :D