Living with multiple rooms (without explicit MRV support)

[Neil Weinstock]

I'm contemplating an S3 purchase with the upcoming rebate, but there's one thing I can't quite figure out.

How do you manage multiple rooms? Right now I'm living with an old S1 in our bedroom (the hard disk grinding drives me nuts), and no DVR in our family room, because for now in our newish house we do most of our watching in the bedroom. But that will change at some point, and I'd like to have support for both rooms on the DVR.

Frankly, having two separate DVRs sounds like a huge pain in the neck to me, because you have to manage your season passes twice, delete programs twice, etc. This assumes I want the same programs recorded in each room, which is reasonable assumption in this case. I've never had S2 MRV, so I don't know if they have clean ways of managing this.

The only solution I can think of is to put the S3 in the family room, and wire an HDMI extender to the bedroom with an IR repeater. I guess that would do it, but I don't look forward to fishing that cable.

How do folks actually handle this situation?

[bonnie_raitt]

Is your house wired for cable (outlets in each room)? If so, you could use an Avcast video distribution system Works OK if you secondary screens are not too big. I have S3 in media room and broadcast it to the kitchen and bedroom.

[sfhub]

If you don't mind installing extra CAT6 wiring you can look up "baluns"

[maytagman]

tonight was my first visit to the forum, i/m building a new house and want to set up a system to have mrv, the longest distance would be around 50 feet, does someone make a package that would also send the ir signal also? i'm shure someone has already done this any suggestions would be appreciated

[golubian]

tonight was my first visit to the forum, i/m building a new house and want to set up a system to have mrv, the longest distance would be around 50 feet, does someone make a package that would also send the ir signal also? i'm shure someone has already done this any suggestions would be appreciated

A better place to research this is over at www.avsforum.com -- specifically, in the Home A/V Distribution and Networking series of threads.

There are a lot of different ways to do what you want. My experience with installers locally in Houston was that they were not much interested in setting up what I wanted at a reasonable (yet still expensive) price. Rather, they were interested only in selling those products that they sell, and totally uninterested in setting up anything else. Cost was no object to them, and they were more than prepared to sell me essentially commercial grade equipment that cost five times more than what I really needed.

What you are looking for is some kind of matrix switcher. There's not much at the low end of the price spectrum as these devices are most often designed for commercial applications (think sports bar with twenty different screens capable of showing any of ten different feeds).

For home applications -- and what I eventually went with -- an excellent and relatively affordable product is put out by Neothings. With one of these boxes you can simultaneously and independently distribute up to eight different video signals to up to eight different zones (depending on what configuration you go with). I installed an 8x4 switcher (eight sources, four zones) and it works like a charm. They make two versions of the product -- the Avalon, which is all digital audio, meaning that you need a receiver in every room where you have a TV; and the Borrego, which distributes analog sound as well, meaning that if you're just interested in watching TV, it will output sound through the TV speakers. The 8x4 runs about $1250. The signals are distributed over component cabling, which is easy enough if you're doing a new constructing and can install the cabling while the walls are open.

There are other decent products out there, too. I considered the Audio Authority AVAtrix, which I think runs over Cat5 and costs about $3k. In the AVS forum, both the president of Neothings (Bill Paul) and a terrific marketing rep from Audio Authority (Trent) are frequent contributors. They'll respond both to posts and to any questions you might email them directly.

I also considered the Key Digital Fatboy 8x4, which is priced between the Neothings and the Audio Authority products. I've heard a lot of bad things about how IR remotes work with that, which is why I ultimately abandoned it (that, plus the fact that I think the Neothings product is better and about $750 cheaper).

Neothings designs its products for residential, as opposed to commercial, uses. This explains its extremely competitive pricing. And the thing works like a dream -- quick and flawless signal switching, and the picture quality it outputs is just unbelievable.

Using the Neothings Borrego, I have two S3s, an HDTV cable box and a five disc DVD changer all installed in the central location and then plugged into the switcher. The switcher then outputs to four zones (the central location TV, an upstairs study, the master bedroom and my kids' playroom). The installer I used has also put in a Xantech IR system so everything can be controlled remotely. I put Harmony 880s in each room, each programmed to tell the matrix switcher which inputs to select and where to output them. This allows me to watch Tivo 1 in the bedroom while my wife watches Tivo 2 downstairs while the kids watch a DVD in the playroom. With the push of a button I can switch to Tivo 2. My kids can pause the movie in the playroom and then come downstairs and pick it up immediately on the big screen.

It's truly MRV, although it takes an enormous amount of research and insanity (not to mention money) to pull this off. The sad thing is that before my recent switch to HDTV, I was able to achieve much of this setup with a multichannel modulator and an IR repeater system, all for about $750.

Anyway, go over to AVS Forum and you'll find what you need.

[bonnie_raitt]

Avcast requires coax to each location. You can distribute and control each source for about $100 ea. Downside is the resolution. It's fine for 32" TV but will suck for 4-10 ft screens.

I just remodeled my home and put 2 coax, 2 Cat5e, and 1 telephone in each location. Avcast only require 1 coax connection. I have PJ in media room (10' screen) and distribute my S3, S2, and DVD player to kitchen and bedroom. I can use regular remote to control all 3 from either secondary location.

Excluding cabling costs, it will run you about $100 per source.

[Neil Weinstock]

So I guess that's what people are actually doing, putting a Tivo or bank of Tivos in one place, and then using *some* sort of distribution system to get the picture around the house.

The AvCast system looks nice, and quite remarkably cheap. They seem to claim that they've stopped production, which is too bad. The biggest downside, of course, is that it's standard definition, mono audio. So as a means of distributing an S3, well I guess I'd have HD on the one direct-connected TV, and SD on the other.

It'll be nice when there's a reasonably priced equivalent of the AVCast for HD. For now, it looks like hi-def distribution will require pulling some cable, be it HDMI or CAT5 or 6 or whatever. I might pick up an AVCast system just for IR distribution, and could be good for supplying a kitchen TV.

Home media architecture still has a *long* way to go....

[golubian]

The AvCast system looks nice, and quite remarkably cheap. They seem to claim that they've stopped production, which is too bad. The biggest downside, of course, is that it's standard definition, mono audio. So as a means of distributing an S3, well I guess I'd have HD on the one direct-connected TV, and SD on the other.

It'll be nice when there's a reasonably priced equivalent of the AVCast for HD. For now, it looks like hi-def distribution will require pulling some cable, be it HDMI or CAT5 or 6 or whatever. I might pick up an AVCast system just for IR distribution, and could be good for supplying a kitchen TV.

Exactly right. The problem gets much more difficult, and expensive, if you want the ability to distribute HD. If it's standard definition all you really need is a modulator plugged into the coax.

[wdwms]

The AvCast system looks nice, and quite remarkably cheap. They seem to claim that they've stopped production, which is too bad. The biggest downside, of course, is that it's standard definition, mono audio. So as a means of distributing an S3, well I guess I'd have HD on the one direct-connected TV, and SD on the other.

It'll be nice when there's a reasonably priced equivalent of the AVCast for HD. For now, it looks like hi-def distribution will require pulling some cable, be it HDMI or CAT5 or 6 or whatever. I might pick up an AVCast system just for IR distribution, and could be good for supplying a kitchen TV.


Been using AvCast for almost 2.5 years now to distribute our S1 w/in the house. It DOES support stereo and the quality is fantastic (SD of course).

-t

[AbMagFab]

Exactly right. The problem gets much more difficult, and expensive, if you want the ability to distribute HD. If it's standard definition all you really need is a modulator plugged into the coax.

Better yet, buy another S3 HD Tivo. Ultimately cheaper and more functional.

And you've got to believe they'll enable MRV at some point, for at least some of the programs.

[wdwms]

Better yet, buy another S3 HD Tivo. Ultimately cheaper and more functional.

And you've got to believe they'll enable MRV at some point, for at least some of the programs.

I beg to differ:

https://www.audioauthority.com/indexh.php?ret=https://www.audioauthority.com/index.php?p=productMore&iProduct=10

$600 and no monthly fee... no extra cable card fees.. one time and you're done, and you can expand to other rooms as needed. Granted you need two ethernet runs, but it will work. I'm eyeing this up for my house.. To compare

Tivo S3 $500 (avg price) - $300 for 3 years of service + $270 cable card rental for 3 years (2x @ $3.75 per month). That is $1070. Above is only $600 + a box of ethernet cable and some sweat equity..

-t

[wdwms]

Cheaper option for HDMI:

http://sewelldirect.com/Grandbeing-2x2-HDMI-Switch-2-Sources-2-Displays.asp

It is a splitter for $300, then just run HDMI to the other TV, and control IR via AVcast (long runs may need HDMI amp)

-t

[AbMagFab]

I beg to differ:

https://www.audioauthority.com/indexh.php?ret=https://www.audioauthority.com/index.php?p=productMore&iProduct=10

$600 and no monthly fee... no extra cable card fees.. one time and you're done, and you can expand to other rooms as needed. Granted you need two ethernet runs, but it will work. I'm eyeing this up for my house.. To compare

Tivo S3 $500 (avg price) - $300 for 3 years of service + $270 cable card rental for 3 years (2x @ $3.75 per month). That is $1070. Above is only $600 + a box of ethernet cable and some sweat equity..

-t
You're not comparing apples to apples. With another S3, you have 2 more tuners to record things with. And you can watch different things on the different TV's (don't know about you, but that's one reason I buy more TV's - silly, I know).

And the S3 is $400 right now, and for all we know will stay that way.

Nice try though.

[Jerry_K]

I beg to differ:

https://www.audioauthority.com/inde...ore&iProduct=10

$600 and no monthly fee... no extra cable card fees.. one time and you're done, and you can expand to other rooms as needed. Granted you need two ethernet runs, but it will work. I'm eyeing this up for my house.. To compare

Tivo S3 $500 (avg price) - $300 for 3 years of service + $270 cable card rental for 3 years (2x @ $3.75 per month). That is $1070. Above is only $600 + a box of ethernet cable and some sweat equity..


That solution will not give you surround sound, nor will protected content be transmitted over the component connection. And you still have only two tuners.

HDMI distribution is the way to go. And two Tivo's will always be better than one TiVo. You can never have enough TiVo's

[golubian]

I beg to differ:

HDMI distribution is the way to go. And two Tivo's will always be better than one TiVo. You can never have enough TiVo's

For what it's worth, here's an interesting and technical post from AVS Forum discussing the relative merits of component and HDMI distribution systems. The poster is the CEO of Neothings (maker of the matrix switch I mentioned above).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=10355852&&#post10355852

The most interesting and important point he makes regarding the preference for component over HDMI is:

<<By nature of how HDMI works, the source device has two way communications with the display to decide on a resolution to use. However if that source device is going to feed 16 random displays, what resolution should it output? Another expensive solution exists by processing every image for every display, but along with that you will lose the 1:1 pixel mapping that people believe they will get by going digital in the first place. Another reality to this requirement is ongoing HDCP issues. With each new HDMI device introduced to the system, the odds of having all devices communicate properly with full repeater support are not impressive.>>

[ah30k]

You're not comparing apples to apples. With another S3, you have 2 more tuners to record things with. And you can watch different things on the different TV's (don't know about you, but that's one reason I buy more TV's - silly, I know).

And the S3 is $400 right now, and for all we know will stay that way.

Nice try though.But with two TiVos you can't change your viewing location. Two tuners is enough for me (maybe not everyone) but I'd like to watch some shows in the main living room and then later go down to the basement so that I don't disturb anyone who is sleeping with the volume. You can't do that with two TiVos. Nice try though :)

IF MRV ever gets going, your solution would work better for me. Right now, distribution from one TiVo around the house is the only solution.

[Jerry_K]

ah30k

HDMI cables and IR repeaters will turn any number of TiVo's up to 9 (the unique controlling code limit) and any number of TVs into a big HD network. I use two HDMI cables and two repeaters on two Tivos and two TVs (really two TVs through switch boxes and AVRs)

[ah30k]

ah30k

HDMI cables and IR repeaters will turn any number of TiVo's up to 9 (the unique controlling code limit) and any number of TVs into a big HD network. I use two HDMI cables and two repeaters on two Tivos and two TVs (really two TVs through switch boxes and AVRs)Uh, yes, I agree. Thanks though. AbMagFab was saying that multiple TiVos was better than distribution and I was saying that multiple TiVos alone will not solve my problem.

[Jerry_K]

ah30k,

It is a whole lot of work to get the functionality I have with a remote click on the Series2 DirecTiVo units. My lovely wife cannot use it either. To many settings to make.

[ah30k]

ah30k,

It is a whole lot of work to get the functionality I have with a remote click on the Series2 DirecTiVo units. My lovely wife cannot use it either. To many settings to make.I'm sorry. I really have no idea what you are talking about.

[Jerry_K]

ah30k,

What I meant was that I can go to Now Playing in my DirecTiVos and search all four of the units for recordings. Click on the recording, wait a few seconds and it starts playing on whatever TV I am watching.

With the HDMI cabling solution I have to set the switches and AVR to accept a different input, then switch remote controls to control the remote Series 3, (only two distinct settings on the remote so need another for the third setting) at that point I can browse the Series 3 in another room now playing list and begin playing the selected program.

That sequencing is just too arcane for my lovely wife to do easily.

[ah30k]

But we are in the S3 forum not the DirecTiVo forum.

I agree that MRV would be best, but it is just not available yet.

[Jerry_K]

Suffice it to say that the workaround on Series 3 is a Pain in the A$$.

[Neil Weinstock]

Well, this discussion has gotten more interesting.

I have to say that as much as true MRV would really be a solution, it also means buying a second S3 (which, including subscription fees, is really pretty expensive), and also resuming having a Tivo in our bedroom. I don't know about the S3, but the disk grinding on my S1 drives me crazy at night. What I really want is a diskless set-top client from Tivo that uses Flash for its live buffer, and works in MRV mode with another S3. But that's for another post.

Thanks for the additional ideas on video distribution. I guess I need to decide between HDMI, HDMI over CAT5, and component over CAT5. My next step, though, is to see if I can figure out how to pull the cables through this crazy house. If I can't figure that out, the rest doesn't matter (or I resort to the AVCast system for now, and hold off on HD until some working wireless solution comes along.) Actually, even the AVCast gives me some cabling issues, given the ugly manner in which the coax was originally strung through this house.

So damn complicated. *sigh*

[AbMagFab]

Well, this discussion has gotten more interesting.

I have to say that as much as true MRV would really be a solution, it also means buying a second S3 (which, including subscription fees, is really pretty expensive), and also resuming having a Tivo in our bedroom. I don't know about the S3, but the disk grinding on my S1 drives me crazy at night. What I really want is a diskless set-top client from Tivo that uses Flash for its live buffer, and works in MRV mode with another S3. But that's for another post.

Thanks for the additional ideas on video distribution. I guess I need to decide between HDMI, HDMI over CAT5, and component over CAT5. My next step, though, is to see if I can figure out how to pull the cables through this crazy house. If I can't figure that out, the rest doesn't matter (or I resort to the AVCast system for now, and hold off on HD until some working wireless solution comes along.) Actually, even the AVCast gives me some cabling issues, given the ugly manner in which the coax was originally strung through this house.

So damn complicated. *sigh*

I have 2 S3's now, and they're both silent. I upgraded one of the drives to a 750GB DB35, and it's completely silent. And it only costs $400 (AR) and $6.95/month. Hardly expensive.

Multiple client devices is far superior to "video distribution", especially with MRV.

[sfhub]

I think if you need the tuners, multiple S3s would be a nicer solution. However if you don't need the tuners, video distribution is a much more scalable solution, especially since it can handle HD-DVD, BluRay, Cable STB, etc. etc.

[ah30k]

Multiple client devices is far superior to "video distribution", especially with MRV.Could you remind me again please how to watch an S3 show in another room without video distribution? You keep claiming this, but I must have missed how it is actually done.

Remember the OPs statement that he's rather not manage two SP lists, two Now Playing Lists or delete shows from two DVRs.

[Jerry_K]

Don't forget the surround sound, video is only half of the HD equation.

[AbMagFab]

Could you remind me again please how to watch an S3 show in another room without video distribution? You keep claiming this, but I must have missed how it is actually done.

Remember the OPs statement that he's rather not manage two SP lists, two Now Playing Lists or delete shows from two DVRs.

Um, get another S3. That's the point.

I have multiple TV's, and I want to be able to watch *different* things on each TV. Ergo, multiple boxes.

With MRV, you get the added ability to transfer shows across S3's, which would certainly be nice. But without it, multiple S3's are still far superior to the old-school video distribution model.

The equipment just isn't that expensive anymore, so video distribution just isn't worth it. It's silly.

[ah30k]

... I have multiple TV's, and I want to be able to watch *different* things on each TV. Ergo, multiple boxes ....The equipment just isn't that expensive anymore, so video distribution just isn't worth it. It's silly.The OP and I both are interested in sharing the same shows in different locations for reasons that we don't feel are silly at all. Please don't answer our question about how to share programs with a non-answer of 'just get two boxes' and they tell us our desires are silly.

[Jerry_K]

ah30k

Then the use of the term MRV in a TiVo sense is silly. You should start a trhead asking about HD distribution of a SINGLE Series 3 to multiple viewing devices, for example I could feed my Computer for viewing.

[ah30k]

uh, isn't that exactly what post #1 in this thread says?

How do you manage multiple rooms? Right now I'm living with an old S1 in our bedroom (the hard disk grinding drives me nuts), and no DVR in our family room, because for now in our newish house we do most of our watching in the bedroom. But that will change at some point, and I'd like to have support for both rooms on the DVR.
Frankly, having two separate DVRs sounds like a huge pain in the neck to me, because you have to manage your season passes twice, delete programs twice, etc.

Obviously MRV (with multiple units) would be best for managing multiple rooms, but distribution is the only current way to meet the need with an S3.

[Jerry_K]

How could a single unit with MRV activated possibly put video and audio out to a remote device?

[ah30k]

Edited my previous post for clarity.

The point is that some are touting multiple S3s as a superior solution to distribution while I claim that that solution fails to meet the basic needs for multi-room viewing. Video/audio distribution DOES meet those needs.

Multiple S3 relies on the user to maintain two SP lists, ToDo lists etc. For instance, if I am sitting in front of unit #1 and decide that I want to record a show, I need to record it on unit #1 then run do the other TV to record it on unit #2.

[CrispyCritter]

The point is that some are touting multiple S3s as a superior solution to distribution while I claim that that solution fails to meet the basic needs for multi-room viewing. Video/audio distribution DOES meet those needs.No, I think you need to go a step further: Video distribution meets YOUR basic needs. Many evenings we have 3 TVs on, watching 3 different shows at once. My needs aren't met by your video distribution.

We indeed have the same SP on multiple TiVos, given the lack of MRV on the main S3. For a while we had both an S2 and an S3 connected to the HD TV, simply to get MRV from the other household TiVOs, but we decided to just duplicate the SPs instead.

[Tippy]

I'm about to try to distribute the video/audio signal from my S3 to another TV in the house. Isn't is as simple as running a set of 5-wire component cables out of the S3 to another TV (the first TV having the HDMI input from the S3). Wouldn't this produce the same HD signal on both TVs? And, could I not just get an IR repeater (or possibly a RF remote) to operate the Tivo in the other room? I know the signal (TV channel or program) would be the same in both rooms, but that is not an issue for me.

I'm planning on doing the same with two other Tivo/TV combinations with just simple AV component wires from the main Tivo to the second TV.

Am I missing something or can it be as simple as my solution?

[ah30k]

The only glitch in this plan is that when the content is protected a bizarre rule kicks in that says:

if (Content Protected & HDMI Connected & HDCP Not Enabled)
{
Disable all analog output (including component)
}

This can bite some people and force them to turn on the non-watched HDMI TV just to get output out on the watched Component TV. There are ways around this by using HDMI switches or surround receivers that fake out the HDCP protocol.

[Bodie]

I'm about to try to distribute the video/audio signal from my S3 to another TV in the house. Isn't is as simple as running a set of 5-wire component cables out of the S3 to another TV (the first TV having the HDMI input from the S3). Wouldn't this produce the same HD signal on both TVs? And, could I not just get an IR repeater (or possibly a RF remote) to operate the Tivo in the other room? I know the signal (TV channel or program) would be the same in both rooms, but that is not an issue for me.

I'm planning on doing the same with two other Tivo/TV combinations with just simple AV component wires from the main Tivo to the second TV.

Am I missing something or can it be as simple as my solution?

Its worked for me for a couple of years, even (:eek: for the AV-philes) splitting the component AV signals (which gets around the HDMI protected content flags ;)).

[mattack]

What I meant was that I can go to Now Playing in my DirecTiVos and search all four of the units for recordings. Click on the recording, wait a few seconds and it starts playing on whatever TV I am watching.

Wait, you mean you have hacked-in MRV, right?

So "out of the box", you'd have the exact same experience with the DirecTivos and the S3s..?

[Neil Weinstock]

I can certainly see the benefits of multiple Tivo's for some folks. And, compared to a fancy whole-house distribution system, it is indeed cheaper.

For me, though, I simply want to be able to watch my recorded shows in the bedroom or living room. We're rarely watching both TVs at the same time, and in those cases it would be OK for one person to watch live TV straight off the cable, sans Tivo. Oh, and I don't need multi-channel for the bedroom, simple stereo is fine.

What's depressing is that almost any sort of hi-def multi-room sharing in this configuration is going to be major pain in the butt for me. The Audio Authority system looks nice, but $600 just so I can share one device between two rooms? And I'll need to thread two cables, etc. etc. Simply running an HDMI cable to the bedroom seems problematic based on what I'm reading.

Frankly I'm discouraged that any of this is worth the trouble right now. I'm probably going to end up passing on the rebate offer and wait for the next one, unless a some majorly obvious straightforward solution presents itself in the next week.

Thanks for the good discussion.

[AbMagFab]

I can certainly see the benefits of multiple Tivo's for some folks. And, compared to a fancy whole-house distribution system, it is indeed cheaper.
Just to clarify, it's not "fancy", it's very old-school to do video signal distribution that way nowadays.

The two main options are:
1) Peer-to-peer with something like a Tivo, so you have local devices that talk to each other and transfer what they need.
2) Server-based, where everything is on the server, and you have local devices that pull what they need from the server.
(or some combo of the above two)

To distribute the *signal* instead of the *media* was only useful when you couldn't digitally store the media. Now, that's a non-issue, and *signal* distribution is only for those who haven't made it to the 21st century.

[ah30k]

To distribute the *signal* instead of the *media* was only useful when you couldn't digitally store the media. Now, that's a non-issue, and *signal* distribution is only for those who haven't made it to the 21st century.Oh my God, here we go again...

Please tell me how to watch a show that has been recorded on one S3 on another television please? You keep dodging this question.

You solution seems to be to beat feet up the steps from one room to the other and set up dual recordings of the same show. How 21st century is that!

[Chris Fox]

What's depressing is that almost any sort of hi-def multi-room sharing in this configuration is going to be major pain in the butt for me. The Audio Authority system looks nice, but $600 just so I can share one device between two rooms? And I'll need to thread two cables, etc. etc. Simply running an HDMI cable to the bedroom seems problematic based on what I'm reading.


I don't own a S3 or the baluns mentioned below, so I can't verify this firsthand. In order to watch a single S3 on 2 televisions, I would hook the HDMI connection to closest TV and the component connection to the other TV.

If pulling cables for component video+ digital audio is too hard, consider something like Muxlab Component Video / Digital Audio Balun 500050. It will send all of the signals over a single CAT5 connection and reatils for $99 each (you'll need 2). I've seen them on ebay for much less.

If you also need IR or analog (which it sounds like you do), there are other balus that add in IR. However, they require a second CAT5 connection. I can't think of the name offhand (I'd check the AVS Forms), but I remember them running about $125 each.

Hope this helps...

Chris

[Jerry_K]

Aw jeez, just carry the Tivo into the other room.

[Chris Fox]

Just to clarify, it's not "fancy", it's very old-school to do video signal distribution that way nowadays.

The two main options are:
1) Peer-to-peer with something like a Tivo, so you have local devices that talk to each other and transfer what they need.
2) Server-based, where everything is on the server, and you have local devices that pull what they need from the server.
(or some combo of the above two)

To distribute the *signal* instead of the *media* was only useful when you couldn't digitally store the media. Now, that's a non-issue, and *signal* distribution is only for those who haven't made it to the 21st century.

If Tivo would come up with a low cost client, then this would be closer to a true statement (and not just an opinion). No tuners/recording, only playback; kinda like an AppleTV.

When you factor in the monthly Tivo fees + cablecard fees + additional outlet fees, you start talking about alot of money for larger setups. Lets say you have 6 HD capable TVs in your house and you want to be able to watch at least 3 cable TV shows at once:

You could go "old school" and buy 3 S3s plus an AV distribution matrix that was at least 3x6. But that requires Season pass management and some pretty smart control system to manage which TV was watching each S3. And the matrix+wiring costs up front may be siginificant.

You could buy 6 S3s and pay a rediculous set of monthly fees. This assumes that MRV will be available at some point, but you could then watch something different on all 6 TVs.

To me the ultimate solution would be to buy 3 S3s and 3 client boxes. All 6 TVs could watch something different, and you'd only pay for 3 sets of fees (and hopefully lower up front cost for the boxes). And perhaps a smaller Tivo fee for the client boxes, but no additional cable outlet charges.

I personally use MythTV to do this now and it is a great platform for me and my wife. Currently I have 1 "server" with 4 tuners and 900 GB of storage, plus one "client". I plan to add another server with at least one more tuner and 750 GB of storage, along with 2 more clients. Unfortuantely, it is a long way from Tivo in terms of setup and maintenance, so I wouldn't recommend to everyone.

Chris

[larrs]

Point me in the direction of how I can put (even SD is OK) video and audio out from my S3 via a coax connection to a second TV and I'll be happy.

[hiker]

Point me in the direction of how I can put (even SD is OK) video and audio out from my S3 via a coax connection to a second TV and I'll be happy.Go to froogle and search for rf modulator. I saw one there for $7.99.

[larrs]

Go to froogle and search for rf modulator. I saw one there for $7.99.

Gracias!

How about remote control options? Any RF remotes that really work well, or maybe a good IR repeater?

[ah30k]

I use this http://electronics.pricegrabber.com/remote-controls/m/988570/ but seem to be having some minor trouble with sensitivity. I think the problem may actually be in the S3 remote. Has anyone noticed a relatively small cone of IR emmission from the S3 remote? I used to be able to point my S2 remote just about anywhere and it would work. I seem to really need to aim the S3 remote closely (I often miss with my power button where only my TV or amp will turn off but not the other).

[bonnie_raitt]

Point me in the direction of how I can put (even SD is OK) video and audio out from my S3 via a coax connection to a second TV and I'll be happy.

http://www.crossbarmedia.com/

[hiker]

Weaknees has a device that will convert your S3 remote into RF here (http://www.weaknees.com/rf-remote-details.php).

[MichaelK]

So I guess that's what people are actually doing, putting a Tivo or bank of Tivos in one place, and then using *some* sort of distribution system to get the picture around the house.
...
The biggest downside, of course, is that it's standard definition, mono audio. .......

nah- I just bought 2- slap on some huge ESATA hard drives (best buy had 750gb ones on sale for 200 recently) and you have a very forgiving system. It IS a pain to set up 2 sets of everything but you can get HD at both tv's and with the terabyte of storage you have a lot of leeway if you don't get around to cleaning out the now playing list for a while. In fact- it's almost not needed at my house. If it's getting deleted due to lack of space it's likely because we'd never watch it or because it was watched and my kids never got to delete it.

At some point this year (I know that's a big window) tivo is likely to enable MRV for at least for content that isn't encrypted by cablecard. So all OTA and rebroadcast locals and analog cable at least will have MRV. So you'll only be stuck dealing with dups of digital cable stuff at that point. And who knows maybe we get lucky and tivo gets some sort of approval for MRV for cablecard protected stuff at some point....

[MichaelK]

If Tivo would come up with a low cost client, then this would be closer to a true statement (and not just an opinion). No tuners/recording, only playback; kinda like an AppleTV.

When you factor in the monthly Tivo fees + cablecard fees + additional outlet fees, you start talking about alot of money for larger setups. Lets say you have 6 HD capable TVs in your house and you want to be able to watch at least 3 cable TV shows at once:
....

You could buy 6 S3s and pay a rediculous set of monthly fees. This assumes that MRV will be available at some point, but you could then watch something different on all 6 TVs....

Chris

seriously- if someone had the money to buy 6 HDTV's (probably 6-15k depending on when they bought them)- is 48 bucks a month in tivo fees going to kill them.

[MichaelK]

Gracias!

How about remote control options? Any RF remotes that really work well, or maybe a good IR repeater?

the harmony 690 works great but it's like 200 bucks so maybe it's best just to buy a second tivo at that point.

Be careful with the ir repeaters- many plasma's and some LCD's screw them up becasue they emit IR contamination. In those cases you have to buy a "plasma proof" model and you're spending some cash again.

so for a repeater I'd suggest only buying somethign you can return to be sure it really works for you.

weakness has an adapter that goes in the battery compartment of a regular tivo remote (which you can buy and will work an S3) and then makes it RF to a receiver you could put with your s3. It is a neat idea- i just couldn't get it to work with my LCD. But they were really good about letting me return it. So that's maybe an option to try. (edit juist saw someone posted it above- AND looks like it can work in an S3 remopte now- thats cool for sure)

[Solman]

I wanted to send my signal to the 6 TV's in my house from a Tivo (HD), Tivo series 2, Panasonic DVD recorder, and straight cable. Everything I found was ridiculously expensive, then I found that source selectors are common in the gaming areas. I first bought an x-box and found it really deteriorated the signal-Not surprised at a price of $50. I then ran into a switch box at Best Buy that looked great and ran 4 components and priced at $100 (BB does not have it on their website. It was also important to me to have it remote controlled so I could change the source from any room in the house with me RF remote. The LED displays the name of the component and that can be modified by inputting the name of your component. The inputs are a choice of Component, composite, and s-video. I now have all my components wired to the LR TV (HDMI for HD Tivo) and to the selector switch. Picture and sound is great to ALL six TVs. I have a choice of watching any component in the LR and anything elso on the other TVs. Because one of the four choices is straight cable, I can watch a different cable channel on all 7 TVs or one component in the LR and a different component to the other 6 TVs.

The name of the switch is "Psyclone source selector system PSC01 HD AV" and comes with the remote. It was $100 at BB but I see it is under $50 on Ebay. I have had it since January and it is still looking great. It goes well with my other components and even has blue lighting that matches my Sony tivo 3000.

[wdwms]

Solman,
Sounds good, but I don't understand how you are carrying the signal to the different TVs in the house.. what are you using?

-t

[Solman]

I have a small (8 x 8) room adjacent to my LR where all my coax drops come to. Coax is fed to all the rooms. This will work for anyone who has a central area where all drops come to. My sony computer also has a TV tuner that I didn't include in the count and that is also fed from the switch. It works kinda neat-Sony allows you to have a small video box anywhere on the screen, or a larger box that takes about 25% of the screen, or you can use the entire screen. That allows me to watch any component while working on the computer and I can have total control of my components with my RF remote. I do have a 10-way signal Amp that I have amplifying the signal when it comes out of the selector box. I payed Adelphia (now TimeWarner) $95 for the amp. I was very skeptical of what I could get For $100 with the selector switch, but I am very pleased and am hoping it will last-I have only used it for 6 months.

[wdwms]

So how are you converting the out from the Psyclone to coax? I assume you are running coax to all the other TVs?

[Solman]

Terk sells a modulator that converts componate/composite cables to Rf (coax) It is called a mini-modulator-sells less than $50. That feed goes to the cable amp.

[wdwms]

Terk sells a modulator that converts componate/composite cables to Rf (coax) It is called a mini-modulator-sells less than $50. That feed goes to the cable amp.

Ahh ok, that makes sense. I use the system by Avcast to broadcast my S1 (composite and L/R audio over coax). But i want to add my S3 to it.. and was thinking of using a switcher much like you did.

I don't need to switch more than two devices and I only need composite, so the psychlone may be a bit overkill for my needs.

-t

[Solman]

I would recommend that if your running cable that you use a 3rd source as a straight cable line that way each TV can broadcast different cable channels from each other-otherwise you will be watching the same device on each TV.

[larrs]

http://www.crossbarmedia.com/

Now, that is C-O-O-L, and the price is great.

[larrs]

Weaknees has a device that will convert your S3 remote into RF here (http://www.weaknees.com/rf-remote-details.php).

Excellent. Man, this thread is saving me some hefty dough!

[larrs]

seriously- if someone had the money to buy 6 HDTV's (probably 6-15k depending on when they bought them)- is 48 bucks a month in tivo fees going to kill them.

That's not the point for me. I have 4 HDTVs in my house and 1 S3, with three other Tivos and 1 SA8300HD. I would opt for more S3's (at the current $399), but I have an issue with not having MRV. I hate having a ton of dupes on the different Tivos.

[MichaelK]

That's not the point for me. I have 4 HDTVs in my house and 1 S3, with three other Tivos and 1 SA8300HD. I would opt for more S3's (at the current $399), but I have an issue with not having MRV. I hate having a ton of dupes on the different Tivos.

I dont disagree with that dup problem. My peronsal solution to that is add on 750gb external drives untill MRV shows up. But that doesn't mean settign up season passes is any easier- on thursday nights during baseballs season I might have 4 things going on at once that I want- so then I have to figure out what to put on what tivo and then can only watch some things on certain boxes.

I was just responding to the point about money- the original premise I reploed to was a little odd I thought that someone would have the 10 grand to plunk down on 6 HDTV's but would balk at 48 a month in tivo fees- that's all.

The 6 HDTV thing just seems a little over the top TODAY- how many people today have that? Maybe in the months and years to come that becomes more common- but at some point I'm farily sure tivo comes out with some version of MRV (probbaly criples for cablecard encryted content)

[snowbunny]

Is there a technical reason that one couldn't do S2 <-> S3 transfers (MVR)?

I used to think that the Way It Worked was simply to transfer the video file over Ethernet from one unit to the other. Granted, there may be a different video format between the two series, but couldn't one format be converted to another?

[MichaelK]

conversions are not likely (without making a pitsop on a pc perhaps).

but SD MRV between the 2 should work fine. (with the stipulations that cablecard protected content is likely to have additional restrictions.)

[mc_dvrme]

Hopefully someone in this thread can help me with the following. I have a question about using AVCAST and FIOS. I currently have a Series II and COMCAST, non-digital cable. I use the AVCAST system to distribute the TIVO to the other tv's in the house, using channels 75-80 to broadcast the Tivo output and the IR signal to the other TV's. Will this setup work if I move to FIOS (I also plan to get a Series 3 or HD, but I don't believe that affects my question)? Can I "broadcast" over the same channels on a digital system?

[wdwms]

Hopefully someone in this thread can help me with the following. I have a question about using AVCAST and FIOS. I currently have a Series II and COMCAST, non-digital cable. I use the AVCAST system to distribute the TIVO to the other tv's in the house, using channels 75-80 to broadcast the Tivo output and the IR signal to the other TV's. Will this setup work if I move to FIOS (I also plan to get a Series 3 or HD, but I don't believe that affects my question)? Can I "broadcast" over the same channels on a digital system?

The "broadcast" you are referring to is analog. That is, the signal coming out of your S1 currently is analog and its redistributed in your house as analog on channel 80, or whatever you selected. Hooking up the Avcast to a S3 or TivoHD won't matter, even if the signal going into the new Tivo is digital, the output to the Avcast would be analog, and hence distributed through the rest of the house as analog.

Now how Fios is distributed to the rest of the TVs in the house I'm not sure of. This could go two ways: 1. The verizon techs would install a converter to convert the digital channels to analog only w/in your house; that way tv that don't have a digital tuner could tune them in. 2. You need a verizon cable box at every TV.. Best you ask Verizon about this.

Both options above would most likely require you to use a filter like you use now to "clear" the channels for the Avcast.

I used to use Avcast; however with an S1 and and S3 I upgraded to a Channel Plus which allows you to broadcast 2 devices on 2 channels and send/receive IR.

-t

[lrhorer]

The OP and I both are interested in sharing the same shows in different locations for reasons that we don't feel are silly at all. Please don't answer our question about how to share programs with a non-answer of 'just get two boxes' and they tell us our desires are silly.
No offense, but you are being just a bit obtuse, here. Two TiVos recording the very same thing on both boxes will result in the very same utility as distributing the video to two sites, PLUS you have the option to watch different things on both TiVos at the same time. This is not an option with the distributed video system. The only downside with the two TiVos is the additional monthly fees compared with the one time cost for the distribution equipment, but with the prices being bandied about... One can purchase a very long TiVo subscription for $750.

The previous poster is perfectly correct: Purchasing two TiVos will allow the user to do every single thing - should he so choose - he can do with one TiVo and the distribution system (note of course he will also have to duplicate his DVD player and other video devices, as well). If he chooses, he can also do more, relegating certain programs only to a specific TiVo rather than both. Of course when MRV comes along, there will no longer be a reason to duplicate the video offerings on all the TiVos, and he will effectively greatly increase his storage limits.

[ah30k]

No offense, but you are being just a bit obtuse, here.First of all a big F you for calling me obtuse.

Two TiVos recording the very same thing on both boxes will result in the very same utility as distributing the video to two sites, PLUS you have the option to watch different things on both TiVos at the same time. This is not an option with the distributed video system. The only downside with the two TiVos is the additional monthly fees compared with the one time cost for the distribution equipment, but with the prices being bandied about... One can purchase a very long TiVo subscription for $750.What you fail to get is that I do not want to maintain two identical ToDo lists. I record many shows on a whim and have no desire to run up to the other TV to record the same thing. I can't understand why that is so f'in hard to understand. I also don't understand your math. You seem to imply your method saves $750 where I figure your method wastes $750 (two units).

Of course when MRV comes along, then this whole discussion goes away.