No MRV - Looks like Dish or Dir TV [Text View]

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 01:45 PM

I posted a few months back. I have 4 Series 2 networked in my rental house. I am (hopefully) about 6 - 8 weeks out from closing on my new house. Installers are in today putting in the in-ceiling speakers, touchscreens, etc. Sadly, I was hoping MRV would be implemented before I needed to make a decision on cable, TIVO or Satellite TV. Which way should I go? Dish or Direct TV?

Kablemodem

03-26-2007, 02:30 PM

If you want HD and TiVo, cable is your only choice.

MichaelK

03-26-2007, 02:32 PM

I'd wire the house to be flexible and not make ANY decision untill you need to.

Who knows- for all we know MRV shows up in 7 weeks....

You can now get network content on the S3- it's just a matter of time till you can sent tivo content to the S3. (In my humble opinion)

sinanju

03-26-2007, 02:36 PM

I don't understand the premise. What satellite company DVR is going to give you Series 2-style multi-room viewing?

Verizon is the only provider I'm aware of that will do something like that.

davecramer74

03-26-2007, 02:42 PM

id go dish. Their HD dvr does MRV to one extra room. They also have the pocket dish :http://pocketdish.com/700_tech_specs.jsp

On top of that, they have the best HD lineup of anyone right now. I tried getting them but couldnt get line of sight for my dish...

MichaelK

03-26-2007, 02:55 PM

I'm guesing the OP is saying he will suck it up and go with DBS and their crappy proprietary dvr's if he cant get mrv on the S3 (most likley becasue the s3 is 600 a pop)

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 03:00 PM

hornblowercat

03-26-2007, 03:01 PM

I'm guesing the OP is saying he will suck it up and go with DBS and their crappy proprietary dvr's if he cant get mrv on the S3 (most likley becasue the s3 is 600 a pop)

I guess that's exactly what he said. Well, people make stupid choices all the time.
But when the day comes and we do get MRV he probably will say "Why did I do this?"

And the day will come. I have faith.

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 03:01 PM

If you want HD and TiVo, cable is your only choice.

I know, but the MRV is the selling/buying point for me. We love the MRV and if I can't have it, why spend the money - I know the interface is the bomb, but the price difference and dealing with cable in-general is not worth it without the MRV.

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 03:02 PM

I'm guesing the OP is saying he will suck it up and go with DBS and their crappy proprietary dvr's if he cant get mrv on the S3 (most likley becasue the s3 is 600 a pop)

hit it right on

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 03:04 PM

I guess that's exactly what he said. Well, people make stupid choices all the time.
But when the day comes and we do get MRV he probably will say "Why did I do this?"

And the day will come. I have faith.

You have more faith than me - I don't believe until I can see it. AND - you are most likely right - I will regret it, but I would dish out a chunk of change for the faith. Call me the ultimate non-believer.

hornblowercat

03-26-2007, 03:07 PM

You have more faith than me - I don't believe until I can see it. AND - you are most likely right - I will regret it, but I would dish out a chunk of change for the faith. Call me the ultimate non-believer.

lol, for you the glass is half empty, me half full. :)

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 03:09 PM

lol, for you the glass is half empty, me half full. :)

sadly, for me the glass is just plain empty :)

Fofer

03-26-2007, 03:19 PM

id go dish. Their HD dvr does MRV to one extra room.
Dish's DVR also has the unique ability to source two rooms, with distinct outputs. So you could be watching one (HD) show in one room, while watching one (SD) show in another... while it's recording something else. I think that flexibility is better than MRV, quite frankly. No need to wait for anything to buffer, no need to maintain multiple SP's.

I've wired my house to share the output from my S3 to every TV, but they all have to watch the same recorded shows at the same time.

Still, I anxiously await MRV (and TiVoToGo) on the S3... and hope it's not too hobbled with restrictions about what content can be served about.

davecramer74

03-26-2007, 03:26 PM

I guess that's exactly what he said. Well, people make stupid choices all the time.
But when the day comes and we do get MRV he probably will say "Why did I do this?"

It seems to me it would be stupid to spend 600 bucks on something that wont do what you want it to do. Why not wait? Whats it matter if he puts satellite in. You can use the same wiring for cable tv.

I thought id add that dish has no commitment and their hd dvr is free right now. It should be a no brainer here. Get dish, once they S3 is doing waht your looking for, dump dish and put cable in.

jmoak

03-26-2007, 03:55 PM

Whoever you go with, homerun drop two coax cables (rg6) and a cat5 cable to each tv location.

You'll be fixed up no matter who you choose today or tomorrow.

Good Luck!
:)

GoHokies!

03-26-2007, 04:28 PM

Well see how well that Dish DVR works when the dust settles from the patent infringement case. You couldn't pay me to do business with those thieving SOBs.

MRV with the S3 is going to come, and then you'll feel like quite the fool for being left out.

PanamaGixxer

03-26-2007, 05:30 PM

hornblowercat

03-26-2007, 06:43 PM

Hopefully, something will happen in the next month or so - sadly, it will happen the day after I decide. My issue is that I am installing a Control4 System in my house with all components centrally located (TIVOs/Cable Boxes, Receiver, Audio Distribution, Video Distribution, two Sony 777 DVD players, Xbox 360, PSP3, DVR for Security Cameras, Control4 Equipment, etc.) - best case would be to have the final decision made so that all the programming can be done at one time (Lighting Control, Music Sever, TIVOs (or whatever), etc..). This will cost me less than another programming trip in the future to change my mind.

From what Jim Denny, a VP said at CES it would appear that MRV will not happen that soon. I got the feeling around Fall this year.

It's a bit long but worth sitting through if your interested.

I tried to put the link up here but it wouldn't work. Try going to this post (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4778639&&#post4778639) and then click the link there. It seems to work fine that way.

kb7oeb

03-26-2007, 08:59 PM

Some think dish plans to offer a MRV style option because the new boxes have ethernet built in but so far none are activated. Dish does not yet offer a dual HD output DVR and might be able to with an ethernet equipped HD DVR and HD receiver

I've also read the SA8300 has the ability to do MRV to non-DVR cable boxes but no company (that I know of) has actually enabled the feature.

MichaelK

03-27-2007, 03:57 PM

....tv.

I thought id add that dish has no commitment and their hd dvr is free right now. It should be a no brainer here. Get dish, once they S3 is doing waht your looking for, dump dish and put cable in.

I'd vote Dish than for sure.

Directv will force a 2 year commitment one you and some out of pocket for HD - Dvr's.

2 years is an eternity right now with everthing HD in such flux. WHo knows what comes along in 3 months never mind 24.

And If I have to out of pocket- I'd prefer to risk it with S3's- if you get cable triple play you can frequently save enough the first year to buy 1+ s3's.

MichaelK

03-27-2007, 03:59 PM

Whoever you go with, homerun drop two coax cables (rg6) and a cat5 cable to each tv location.

You'll be fixed up no matter who you choose today or tomorrow.

Good Luck!
:)

I'd second that except I'd go farther.

I'd do 2+2

maybe even 2 coax plus 3 cat5/6....

Pulling an extra cable or 2 is like nothing if you are already doing a few. there's all kinds of X over cat5 Baluns so who knows what you might want to run on cat5 at some point. Lan, phone, vga, s-video, usb, components, etc, etc.

davecramer74

03-28-2007, 01:38 AM

I'd vote Dish than for sure.

Directv will force a 2 year commitment one you and some out of pocket for HD - Dvr's.

2 years is an eternity right now with everthing HD in such flux. WHo knows what comes along in 3 months never mind 24.

And If I have to out of pocket- I'd prefer to risk it with S3's- if you get cable triple play you can frequently save enough the first year to buy 1+ s3's.
Report Post

ya, thats my opinion. If your not going cable, id go dishnetwork.

Ill add, i called them tonight for shits and giggles, that no commitment is 49.99 charge. they have u sign up for 18 months and they will waive that 49.99. So basically, pay the 50 bucks. comcast charges 99 for an install unless u haggle them.

the moral of the story is, dont commit to anything. Your wiring will support everything. If iptv or fios enters the game, they rewire you free of charge.

PanamaGixxer

04-12-2007, 05:47 PM

Direct TV is the winner. I want the NFL package. My installer also informed me that given I have a Knox video switch in my plan, I can basically watch any of the 4 DVRs on any of the 5 TV's that I will be using the switch for. I feel better - basically, a "type" of MRV.

HiDefGator

04-12-2007, 06:26 PM

I'd go with DTV. They are the only ones claiming to have the ability to do 100 HD channels late this year. The cable company will get to 100 HD channels by doing SDV, which will not work with the current S3's out there. I hate to say it but the S3 is a dead end play today.

I certainly wouldn't worry about going with Dish because of the patent lawsuit. It will not be resolved this year. When it is resolved Dish will end up paying Tivo a buck a month which wil not affect you as a customer.

bizzy

04-12-2007, 06:30 PM

enjoy your HR20

davecramer74

04-12-2007, 09:01 PM

Direct TV is the winner. I want the NFL package.

you didnt mention anything about the NFL in your original post, haha. Ya i had directv for a few years because of the nfl package. But with them adding thursday games on the NFL network, sunday night and monday night, im getting enough football off espn/local channels. Only thing i miss is being able to watch my seahawks.
As for the hr20-700 my buddy's got one. He hated the thing but after a few patches, he says its running like a champ now. He definately had some major growing pains though. i was over there on easter and i liked the looks of it at least. I didnt get to check it out much. Also, it sounds like dtv is poised to take the lead in the hd offerings. So not a bad choice. Did you get a deal on the hd dvr or they make you pay 299 for it?

zob

04-12-2007, 09:25 PM

MRV, to me stands for multi-room viewing. For my purpose I have acquired an RF modulator for $20 and an infrared to RF remote converter for $40. For $60 I can watch any program I need and control it to on any TV in every room in the House. You might be trying to watch different channel from different TVs, that can't be accomplished on the S3 as of now. But I don't need to do this.

I personally had a Dish DVR which worked fine for several years for me. When I got my HI Definition TV I got tired of watching crappy compressed video and turned off my service. Multi-room viewing only works when you have separate receivers for each room on satellite with an additional $5 per unit rental charge for each unit, per month. If you have a receiver with dual tuners then it acts as two receivers. But you will get charged for the rental of the extra tuner.

This is just my opinion others will probably see it differently

Jerry_K

04-12-2007, 09:49 PM

With two HDMI cables, series three units have MRV today. It just isn't over the ethenet cable.

GoHokies!

04-12-2007, 10:20 PM

I certainly wouldn't worry about going with Dish because of the patent lawsuit. It will not be resolved this year. When it is resolved Dish will end up paying Tivo a buck a month which wil not affect you as a customer.
If you're lucky, and don't mind supporting criminals with your money, that is.

Panama, enjoy your buggy DVR and overcompressed "HD" signal.

Fofer

04-12-2007, 11:31 PM

With two HDMI cables, series three units have MRV today. It just isn't over the ethenet cable.

I'm out of the loop. Care to elaborate? Or share a link?

wierdo

04-13-2007, 01:26 AM

MRV as in viewing the output of one S3 in more than one room, not in viewing/transferring shows recorded on one S3 on/to another.

Fofer

04-13-2007, 02:40 AM

How does "two HDMI cables" accomplish that, though? The S3 has a single HDMI output.

(That said, I have component going to another room, so I'm already aware of this form of TiVo sharing.)

I like this because shows start immediately, no buffering needed. And I don't have to manage two sets of SP's.

But MRV is different. You get 4 tuners, can watch different things in each room, and ethernet can go for longer distances than HDMI or component (without any signal boosting needed.)

Still, I'm confused. What does "two HDMI cables" accomplish?

Redux

04-13-2007, 06:13 AM

the day will come [when we do get MRV]. I have faith.Maybe. Probably too late for many of us. I'm a big Tivo supporter, but I'm about to make other plans.

aaronwt

04-13-2007, 08:32 AM

Does DirecTV or DIsh have MRV? If not what is wrong with the Series 3 then? I know I would like MRV. At some point if they don't implement it I will need to get a fourth S3 unit. I'm using an HR10-250 in my main viewing area to cover the rest of my recordings, since I need at least 4 tuners to record everything I watch. But I'm going to completely dump DirecTV soon, and if MRV isn't implemented by the fall season I'll need to get a 4th box.

PanamaGixxer

04-13-2007, 09:55 AM

I figured I would get a few - good luck with bad service and crappy DVRs, but I feel TIVO has failed me not the other way around. I have 4 TIVOs now and our favorite part of the TIVO system is MRV. TIVO has not met my needs with MRV - basically, I have been spoiled and want it all with TIVO. I have only had bad luck over the years with cable (in SC (Florence), CA (Benicia), TN (Jackson), TN (Memphis) and NJ (Sayreville)) - paying $600+ per S3 and crappy cable without MRV does not interest me. I know I could use the video switch with S3s, but why pay the extra (plus the NFL Package) for crappy cable.

Again, I know I am the bad guy, but my 6+ years with TIVO was fantastic and I have numerous friends who have TIVO because of me. In my opinion, TIVO is the best non-HD option.

Sorry for having a non-TIVO friendly opinion at this time and for those who don't wish me luck (F off) and good luck to all TIVO owners!

aaronwt

04-13-2007, 10:04 AM

Fortunately Comcast in my area has much better picture quality than DirecTV. DirecTV downrezs the 1080i content to 1280x1080i. Comcast here passes it at 1920x1080i.

classicsat

04-13-2007, 10:05 AM

I'd go with DTV.

Same here. I'd get some (likely one, maybe two) SD-DTiVos, hack them for MRV, and suck it up and use the HR20, or an H20 with a standalone TiVo.

Or else get cable and a Series 3, and likely a Series 2 DT. Quite frankly, if I had cable available to me, I'd go for that.

PanamaGixxer

05-15-2007, 06:52 PM

If you're lucky, and don't mind supporting criminals with your money, that is.

Panama, enjoy your buggy DVR and overcompressed "HD" signal.

The HD looks pretty good, maybe my naked eye is not really that good. I have been using the DVRs for 7 days now and they are pretty good. I have not had any hardware/software issues. My only issue has been learning the new interface, of course, it is very similar to TIVO, but still it will take a month or so. I still LOVE TIVO, but I think I will grow to love this solution too.

SORRY GUYS!

Jerry_K

05-15-2007, 06:56 PM

I have MRV over HDMI

Fofer

05-15-2007, 06:58 PM

I have MRV over HDMI

Explain. Do you mean, you're sourcing two TV's? That's technically different from MRV.

GoHokies!

05-15-2007, 07:12 PM

I still LOVE TIVO, but I think I will grow to love this solution too. SORRY GUYS!Until the dust settles from the court case and your DVR gets shut down. :)

vstone

05-16-2007, 11:10 AM

I don't understand the premise. What satellite company DVR is going to give you Series 2-style multi-room viewing?

Verizon is the only provider I'm aware of that will do something like that.DirecTV announced a MRV system in 03 or 04, roughly about the same time (I think) that they announced their in house HD Tivo replacement (the HR20). I don't know what, if anything, became of it. It was suppopsedly being developed by a differnt company than the HR20, which didn't make much sense to me, given their rationale for building their on HD DVR. I stopped following D* closely when I dropped them in 05 for overcompressing SD content.

gwar9999

05-16-2007, 11:53 AM

I know, but the MRV is the selling/buying point for me. We love the MRV and if I can't have it, why spend the money - I know the interface is the bomb, but the price difference and dealing with cable in-general is not worth it without the MRV.

Back in November I wanted to upgrade my analog setup (S1) to get HD. So I had the most flexibility: either satellite provider or digital cable. I stuck with cable (biding my time until Fios is available) and couldn't justify $800 for an S3 versus $15/mo for the cable HD DVR. So, thinking I could live with the cable DVR happily ever after I went that route.

Not long after... after finding too many annoying bugs that had me ranting about it daily (sometimes hourly) and quickly realizing that the only thing that this SA 8300HD POS has in common with a TiVo is that it has a harddrive inside. I sufferred through 2 months of using it as it screwed up just about everything it was supposed to do.

Needless to say, I probably waited 2 months too long but my wife got sick of listening to me complain and told me to just get the S3 already. So who was I to argue, eh? The S3 dropped $150 in price during the 2 months and I've been a happy camper ever since.

I don't know if the satellite DVR's are as bad as the SA that I was forced to use but, if you've been accustomed to the TiVo interface I am almost certain that you will miss some of it if you abandon TiVo. I know I certainly did.

Sure, it would be nice to have some of the missing S2 features in my S3 but even without them I'm still enjoying evyerthing else the S3 brings to the table. Although my cable company insisted their DVR was a TiVo I know now that it ain't a TiVo unless it's a TiVo.

jtown

05-16-2007, 02:28 PM

Penny wise, pound foolish. With the amount of money spent on the house and the amount being spent on setting up custom entertainment equipment, what's the BFD about spending $600 on a Tivo? It doesn't have MRV now but it almost certainly will in the future. We've just had two major updates filling in missing S3 features and the unofficial activation of eSATA.

Going with satellite (which also won't give you the level of MRV service you desire) seems a bit spiteful. Especially when you're forgoing a system which will very likely be providing the service you want in a future service update for one that definitely will not ever provide it.

PanamaGixxer

05-16-2007, 02:57 PM

Back in November I wanted to upgrade my analog setup (S1) to get HD. So I had the most flexibility: either satellite provider or digital cable. I stuck with cable (biding my time until Fios is available) and couldn't justify $800 for an S3 versus $15/mo for the cable HD DVR. So, thinking I could live with the cable DVR happily ever after I went that route.

Not long after... after finding too many annoying bugs that had me ranting about it daily (sometimes hourly) and quickly realizing that the only thing that this SA 8300HD POS has in common with a TiVo is that it has a harddrive inside. I sufferred through 2 months of using it as it screwed up just about everything it was supposed to do.

Needless to say, I probably waited 2 months too long but my wife got sick of listening to me complain and told me to just get the S3 already. So who was I to argue, eh? The S3 dropped $150 in price during the 2 months and I've been a happy camper ever since.

I don't know if the satellite DVR's are as bad as the SA that I was forced to use but, if you've been accustomed to the TiVo interface I am almost certain that you will miss some of it if you abandon TiVo. I know I certainly did.

Sure, it would be nice to have some of the missing S2 features in my S3 but even without them I'm still enjoying evyerthing else the S3 brings to the table. Although my cable company insisted their DVR was a TiVo I know now that it ain't a TiVo unless it's a TiVo.

Thus far, I have no extreme issues with the Direct TV DVR - it does what I usually do, season passes (called something else) - watch recorded stuff, plus able to record two things at once or watch something and record something else. This is an upgrade to me because I never converted to "never" S2s or and S3. I will adapt - if this is the worse thing I have to deal with my life is going pretty darn good.

Jerry_K

05-16-2007, 08:29 PM

fofer,

I hook up my second Series three in the guest bedroom to a switch in the family room with an HDMI cable. Another from the Family room Series three to the guest bedroom TV. With a couple IR extenders I can control the Series 3 units from either postion and have two Series 3 feed to the TV.

So when I want to watch something on the Guest Bedroom Series 3 in the family room, I set the input to the Family room TV to be the output from the Guest Bedroom Series 3. Then I switch my remote code so that the extender controls the Series 3 in the Guest bedroom while I sit comfortably in the Family Room.

Fofer

05-16-2007, 08:39 PM

Gotcha. I do something similar with my Series 3, essentially sharing it's output with every TV in the house. HD in two rooms, and SD in the others (kitchen, gym, office, etc. where the TV's are much smaller.)

While this is a nice substitute for MRV, it's not exactly MRV. MRV would allow each room to watch and FF/RW independently of each other. This solution forces every room to watch the same thing.

Of course, there are also downsides to MRV, notably, the requirement of multiple boxes (think: cost/space/hassle/noise,) and the data transfer delay required for MRV'ed shows to buffer.

Jerry_K

05-16-2007, 09:16 PM

samo

05-17-2007, 01:43 AM

Until the dust settles from the court case and your DVR gets shut down. :)
Care to read OP posts before reply? He didn't go with Dish, he went with DirecTV.
But even if he went with Dish, taking in consideration recent Supreme court decision, it is very possible that after dust settles TiVo patent would be invalidated.
Even if TiVo gets to keep the patent AND Dish loses on appeal AND Dish doesn't make a deal with TiVo, they still can do what SA and Motorola did - get license from Replay and be immune to future TiVo patent claims.
You make it sound like 12 technically illiterate people could not be wrong about Dish stealing something from TiVo. That is clearly not the case. All that was proven so far is that TiVo had better lawyers.

GoHokies!

05-17-2007, 06:05 AM

Care to read OP posts before reply? He didn't go with Dish, he went with DirecTV.
But even if he went with Dish, taking in consideration recent Supreme court decision, it is very possible that after dust settles TiVo patent would be invalidated.
Even if TiVo gets to keep the patent AND Dish loses on appeal AND Dish doesn't make a deal with TiVo, they still can do what SA and Motorola did - get license from Replay and be immune to future TiVo patent claims.
You make it sound like 12 technically illiterate people could not be wrong about Dish stealing something from TiVo. That is clearly not the case. All that was proven so far is that TiVo had better lawyers.
I saw that. Even replied to it on the previous page, if you would take the time to read the whole thread.

Don't know what I was thinking with that last post. :confused:

The E* case isn't as complicated as you would make it sound, but that's a discussion for another thread. If it were so easy for them to get a license from replay, don't you think that they would have done it?

Jerry_K

05-17-2007, 08:46 AM

Charlie wouldn't want to spend very much to get that license. Licenses are usually tied to some steady stream of cash.

PanamaGixxer

05-17-2007, 02:24 PM

Actually my solution allows either TV to watch either Series 3 with complete control of the program. The only difficulty would be watching one Tivo on both TVs.

Believe me I would much prefer the real MRV that I have with my DirecTiVos. Much better.

The solution I now have allows me to watch any of the 4 DVRs (and my single DVD Player and 2 Sony 777 (400 DVD changers))on any of the 5 TVs I have connected through the HD switch - much better than MRV because there is no transfer. You basically watch anything like all the equipment is in the room. The switch solution would have worked with S3s as well, but I still went with Direct TV because of the cost difference between the DVRs. I guess I am still supporting TIVO because I am giving my 5 S2s to my family members who will activate their service.