CableLabs and eSATA - A short rant

[hookbill]

This should be a cut and dry issue. If other DVR's can use an eSATA what the heck is the hold up. It isn't fair. I understand, a little about the TiVo to Go thing and HD but this is just bs as far as I'm concerned. I want my eSATA. and I want it now. I truly expected it to be active by November. Damn government agencies. And from what I hear this one is really backed by the cable companies.

What really bugs me is my 800.00 S3 is capable but not allowed to do what a pos like the SA 8300 can. Not that it did it well of course but it could do it.

That's all I have to say. Your comments are welcome.

[missiontortilla]

This should be a cut and dry issue. If other DVR's can use an eSATA what the heck is the hold up. It isn't fair. I understand, a little about the TiVo to Go thing and HD but this is just bs as far as I'm concerned. I want my eSATA. and I want it now. I truly expected it to be active by November. Damn government agencies. And from what I hear this one is really backed by the cable companies.

What really bugs me is my 800.00 S3 is capable but not allowed to do what a pos like the SA 8300 can. Not that it did it well of course but it could do it.

That's all I have to say. Your comments are welcome.

I was hoping that it would be enabled by Christmas as well. Easier to justify the cost of the eSata drive to the wife when guised as a Christmas present. However I was glad to see TiVo released 8.0.1c, although it had no new features, I can finally watch NBC in HD! If I had to choose between eSata and the ability to record NBC, I choose NBC.

[samo]

Just out of curiosity, how do you know that "S3 is capable but not allowed "?
Capable is not a same as working. How do you no that "not allowed" isn't just an excuse TiVo uses to cover for delay on activating e-sata? Everybody else including Cable, Dish and DirecTV have activated e-sata. What makes TiVo implementation so special that it is "not allowed"?

[hookbill]

Just out of curiosity, how do you know that "S3 is capable but not allowed "?
Capable is not a same as working. How do you no that "not allowed" isn't just an excuse TiVo uses to cover for delay on activating e-sata? Everybody else including Cable, Dish and DirecTV have activated e-sata. What makes TiVo implementation so special that it is "not allowed"?

Well, because if you look in the "Frequently Asked Questions" that Megazone has put together he says the reason is because CableLabs has to give the OK. I believe him.

[samo]

Well, because if you look in the "Frequently Asked Questions" that Megazone has put together he says the reason is because CableLabs has to give the OK. I believe him.
Actually Megazone quotes TiVoPony as source of information. TiVo marketing does not sound to me as definite source. But at least we established that it is TiVo that blames CableLabs for the delay. Now your post makes sense to me. Thanks, my curiosity is satisfied. :)

[CrispyCritter]

Just out of curiosity, how do you know that "S3 is capable but not allowed "?
Capable is not a same as working. How do you no that "not allowed" isn't just an excuse TiVo uses to cover for delay on activating e-sata? Everybody else including Cable, Dish and DirecTV have activated e-sata. What makes TiVo implementation so special that it is "not allowed"?If you read the CableCard license from CableLabs, it states that any cablecard content output method has to be by a CableLabs approved method. TiVo has to abide by the license and CableLabs has not yet approved TiVo's output method via e-SATA.

None of the other DVR providers you named are using cablecards, so none of the them have to get their e-SATA implementation approved by CableLabs.

[hookbill]

If you read the CableCard license from CableLabs, it states that any cablecard content output method has to be by a CableLabs approved method. TiVo has to abide by the license and CableLabs has not yet approved TiVo's output method via e-SATA.

None of the other DVR providers you named are using cablecards, so none of the them have to get their e-SATA implementation approved by CableLabs.

Yeah, which is just more reason to cut the cr*p and get on with giving us the eSata. Geeze, talk about discrimination. You DVR's, drink out of this faucet, TiVo S3, use the one in the back.

[HiDefGator]

How about "dvrs we ordered and sell - we trust". Third party dvr known for being the most hackable dvr on the market - we don't trust.

[hookbill]

How about "dvrs we ordered and sell - we trust". Third party dvr known for being the most hackable dvr on the market - we don't trust.

I'm confused. Are you saying that the S3 is more hackable then let's say the SA 8300? If so why and how? I mean the SA 8300 was designed by a bunch of gang bangers on a street corner in Atlanta. Just kiidding, I know it was really desigined by a 4 year old on steroids. Anyway how the heck is that any less hack proof then the S3?

[BruceShultes]

One thing that I know is true, the SA 8300 HD marrys the eSata drive to the internal drive.

You cannot remove the eSata drive from the SA8300 HD after it has been installed and view the shows on some other device (i. e. a PC).

If the S3 is not designed to do the same thing, this may explain why Cable Labs has not been approved eSata.

However, I suspect it is much more likely that Cable Labs is dragging their feet. Remember that is controlled by the cable companies, who want to do anything possible to prevent losing the revenue from their own cable boxes.

[hookbill]

One thing that I know is true, the SA 8300 HD marrys the eSata drive to the internal drive.




I just assumed that would happen with the S3 as well. It would be one big happy hard drive. I didn't think it could work any other way.

So TiVo should set it up that way, and let's get it activated. If it isn't set up that way anyways.

[moyekj]

There is a good alternative to eSATA already. TTG & MRV (even if it's only for unencrypted content) are much more valuable features to submit for CL approval IMO.

[aaronwt]

Definitely!!

[dt_dc]

One thing that I know is true, the SA 8300 HD marrys the eSata drive to the internal drive.Technically, it's not married to the internal drive. It's married to the box itself. Just for curiosity ... I replaced the internal drive on my 8300HD (and the box happily did whatever it needed to do ... took a while but it worked) and the (same) external drive still worked.

[Justin Thyme]

It formatted it properly? Was it the same size drive?

[vstone]

The SA8300HD STB, as currently used, is not a Cablecard unit. Therefore Cablelabs does not have to approve its use of eSATA.

[jeffk]

Exactly, the Tivo3 isn't a cablecards unit, so they don't have to abide by the same rules. Fair, no, but what are you gonna do.

Also to the comment about most hackable dvr. Well hate to break it to you but if you have a Motorola box you can pull video off of it with a firewire cable and some software on the PC very easily. But again, cablelabs isn't involved. Until the cable companies start using boxes with cablecards themselves, there won't be a level playing field [and even then i'm sure they'll pull some crap].

[chipvideo]

This is one of the reasons I am going to cancel my premium movie channels. I can't get enough HD movies on my box, so I will just use my BD and HDDVD instead. Lost revenue for comcast.

[GoHokies!]

I was hoping that it would be enabled by Christmas as well. Easier to justify the cost of the eSata drive to the wife when guised as a Christmas present. However I was glad to see TiVo released 8.0.1c, although it had no new features, I can finally watch NBC in HD! If I had to choose between eSata and the ability to record NBC, I choose NBC.

Glad to hear you got that worked out.

I agree with the "lets get this done now" sentiment - the longer non-cablecard cable boxes are allowed to be used by the companies, the longer this BS is going to go on.

[dt_dc]

It formatted it properly?Yes ... pretty cool, just came right up.Was it the same size drive?Yes it was. That was the thing ... I could never get a larger (internal) drive to work. I could swap a new internal drive of the same (or smaller) size ... but not a larger one. Not sure what was going on with that ... but ... I was really just playing around for curiosity's sake.

[dt_dc]

Also to the comment about most hackable dvr. Well hate to break it to you but if you have a Motorola box you can pull video off of it with a firewire cable and some software on the PC very easily. But again, cablelabs isn't involved. Until the cable companies start using boxes with cablecards themselves, there won't be a level playing field [and even then i'm sure they'll pull some crap].BTW, Firewire (with DTCP protection for encrypted content) is a CableLabs approved digital output. Ie, anyone can build a CableCard box with Firewire output that works the same as the Motorola box without getting any additional / extra approvals from Cablelabs.

[Roderigo]

Damn government agencies. And from what I hear this one is really backed by the cable companies.

Cablelabs is not a government agency. It's a research/development lab created and funded by the Cable Industry.

from http://www.cablelabs.com/

Cable Television Laboratories, Inc. (CableLabs®), a nonprofit research and development consortium, is dedicated to helping its cable operator members integrate new cable telecommunications technologies into their business objectives.

[hookbill]

Cablelabs is not a government agency. It's a research/development lab created and funded by the Cable Industry.

from http://www.cablelabs.com/

I was mistaken. But they are funded by the darn cable industry. I guess that's even worst.

I liked it better when the cable industry was regulated by the government.