Heroes - "Better Halves" - 10/30/2006

[bobcarn]

It's interesting that Nasty Niki didn't tell Nice Niki about the $2-million in the attic a couple of episodes ago, when Nice Niki owed $30K to Linder... Both Nikis could have avoided the desert road trip and sleeping with Nathan.

Well, she is blonde... :p

[bobcarn]

...

Wonder if his powers are harder to use around other Heroes, or if they don't work on other Heroes at all. Freezing a room full of targets but not Evil Niki would sure make it easy for her to shred them. (and yes, there was still some real-time damage, so if it worked at all, it didn't work long.)

Well, afterwards, he didn't say "I tried but couldn't do anything. Why didn't my powers work?" Instead, he was upset that instead of doing something, he was hiding in the bathroom. Conduct very unbecoming of a hero.

I'm not sure that every little detail has some hidden significance. I think you have to just take things at face value sometimes.

[ScottE22]

By the way, everyone, the Shenkar in the soundtrack is Lakshminarayana Shankar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lakshminarayana_Shankar), not Ravi (Norah Jones's dad). With that first name, I can't blame him for going by his last name only.

Click here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FFE3zUKmyU) for video of him playing violin and singing with Peter Gabriel on his Secret World Tour. You'll recognize his voice from the Heroes soundtrack.


THAT'S the guy I was thinking of! I have Peter Gabriel's Secret World Live CD set and that guy is all over it. Good to know I'm not mis-remembering things...

BTW - if you grew up listening to Solsbury Hill and Red Rain and you don't own a copy of PG's Secret World tour CD you need to obtain one.

[jschuman]

Meanwhile, something someone posted got me thinking.

I thought it was really weird for Future Hiro to go back in time and say "The fate of the whole world depends completely and utterly on you very rapidly getting everyone together and saving some cheerleader somewhere, but even though I am doing this at great cost to myself, I won't tell you which one."

Seemed to me to be a whole lot clearer to say "Go to Odessa, Texas on November 6th and save Claire Bennett, a cheerleader who lives on Maple Drive, from a serial killer who wants to rip her head off at school that night. Bennett. Odessa. Got that?"

Soooo...... something significant is going on. Either Claire isn't the cheerleader they are supposed to save, or something. (And I am expecting that Little Miss I'll Take Credit is toast.)

Either that or Future Hiro should have spent some of the money he used for his makeover on Common Sense lessons.Perhaps it's the journey that is important. If Future-Hiro just told Peter where to go/what to do he wouldn't go through the steps necessary to get it done. And Future-Hiro didn't have time to tell him every last crucial step of the journey. So he got him started....

[jsmeeker]

Seemed to me to be a whole lot clearer to say "Go to Odessa, Texas on November 6th and save Claire Bennett, a cheerleader who lives on Maple Drive, from a serial killer who wants to rip her head off at school that night. Bennett. Odessa. Got that?"



That doesn't make for a very good marketing phrase.

"Save the cheerleader. Save the world" works much better.


I think they will track down the cheerleader via the painting of the train accident. They will remember it happening and someone will see an old newspaper lying around with the photo that matches the painting. It will say it was in Odessa. They go to Odessa and they will find the cheerleader. But the first cheerleader they find will be the cheerleaer that took credit for saving those guys in the train. That's the wrong cheerleader. Then, they'll find Claire.

Just my wild ass guess.

[TonyD79]

Also, I never heard of killing one personality in a split personality case. At least not physically, but you may be able to get rid of one or the other.

But you've heard of people flying, walking thru walls and stopping time?

[jpwoof]

Anyone got any theories on why Hiro could not freeze time when Nikki was in the room?

He was interrupted by Ando.

[DevdogAZ]

Well, the top one is "the shocker", not a gang sign.
That's not "The Shocker." Her index and middle fingers are not together. Instead, it's the ASU Pitchfork.

http://www.asuwebdevil.com/images/issues/s-fans31-1web.jpg

[jpwoof]

Do you think Micah's power is remote vision?

[TonyD79]

I'm intrigued by Hiro's inability to stop time during the shredding of the poker players. Other people have mentioned either his tiredness or the stress of being frightened, (either of which might be true), but he's been pretty good at knee-jerk uses of his power before, stopping time to save the little girl and time-traveling when the bomb went off.

Of course, he was prepped for the girl, and the bomb was a direct threat to himself.

But, the only other time so far that we've seen him using his power around another Hero was the future Hiro stopping time on the train with Peter, and everyone mentioned how weird the lighting looked. Hiro said something to the effect that it was really hard for him to maintain it (and we assumed it was because he had traveled so far in time.) And even so, Peter didn't freeze at all, which we attributed to his Mimic powers.

Wonder if his powers are harder to use around other Heroes, or if they don't work on other Heroes at all. Freezing a room full of targets but not Evil Niki would sure make it easy for her to shred them. (and yes, there was still some real-time damage, so if it worked at all, it didn't work long.)

Wouldn't that assume that he actually knows what he is doing? For example, do you think he HAS to close his eyes so tight? Even his friend told him he doesn't know how it works yet.

Suppose you just found out (like two days ago) you had some power. Do you think you would be perfect at it immediately. How about when you learned to walk or talk? It takes time to get fluent in any "power" even mundane ones like walking or talking.

In other words, there doesn't have to be any "meaning" other than he is still new to this.

And he doesn't have a sword yet.

[unicorngoddess]

I'm still sticking to my theory that if Hiro can't see something then he can't freeze it. I don't think it had anything to do with stress or tiredness. Like when he teleported to New York...he saw the picture of New York, focused on New York and then he was in New York. With the threat being on the other side of the door he didn't know what was there for him to freeze so he couldn't stop it.

[Rob Helmerichs]

I'm still sticking to my theory that if Hiro can't see something then he can't freeze it.
But he doesn't freeze things, he stops time.

[unicorngoddess]

But he doesn't freeze things, he stops time.

I was using the same term the person asking the question used:

Anyone got any theories on why Hiro could not freeze time when Nikki was in the room?

I'm assuming when the OP said "freeze" they meant freeze (or stop) time.

[Ghost_Dog1]

There are a couple Q.A. 's with show writers here. Spoilers?

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=8694
http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=8758

[Ghost_Dog1]

With Eden working with MR. Bennet does it open up the Question: Who Cleaned out Sylars apartment? Did MR.Bennet use Sylars map to identify Nathan,and Parkman?

[Rob Helmerichs]

I was using the same term the person asking the question used:



I'm assuming when the OP said "freeze" they meant freeze (or stop) time.
My point is, he's not just freezing time for the people in the room; he's freezing time for (presumably) the entire planet. Or more to the point, he's freezing time for himself. So whether or not he can see certain people should be irrelevant to whether or not he can freeze time.

[srs5694]

There was an interesting tidbit dropped in this episode that hasn't been discussed yet: After Claire's alleged bio-parents left, her (adoptive) mother told her that she'd been ill as a baby. Going on the dramatic principle that you don't put a gun on the mantlepiece unless it'll be used later in the play, this raises the question of how this illness might be related to Claire's powers. Also, in an earlier episode somebody referred to Sylar as "patient 0," which is a term that's generally used in the realm of infectious diseases to refer to the first case of that disease. Together, these two seemingly throwaway lines seem to suggest that the powers that have begun to emerge are at least partially linked to some sort of infectious agent rather than (or in addition to) an evolutionary mutation.

So far, I see no evidence that this will be an important plot point, but it could conceivably become one. For instance, perhaps HRG's organization knows about this and is concerned about the possibilities if the infectious agent mutates and spreads so that everybody acquires superpowers; or maybe the point of their trap-and-release operation is to figure out how the infectious agent works so that they can give whatever powers they want to whoever they want. Of course, this is all wild speculation.

[Ghost_Dog1]

There was an interesting tidbit dropped in this episode that hasn't been discussed yet: After Claire's alleged bio-parents left, her (adoptive) mother told her that she'd been ill as a baby. Going on the dramatic principle that you don't put a gun on the mantlepiece unless it'll be used later in the play, this raises the question of how this illness might be related to Claire's powers. Also, in an earlier episode somebody referred to Sylar as "patient 0," which is a term that's generally used in the realm of infectious diseases to refer to the first case of that disease. Together, these two seemingly throwaway lines seem to suggest that the powers that have begun to emerge are at least partially linked to some sort of infectious agent rather than (or in addition to) an evolutionary mutation.

So far, I see no evidence that this will be an important plot point, but it could conceivably become one. For instance, perhaps HRG's organization knows about this and is concerned about the possibilities if the infectious agent mutates and spreads so that everybody acquires superpowers; or maybe the point of their trap-and-release operation is to figure out how the infectious agent works so that they can give whatever powers they want to whoever they want. Of course, this is all wild speculation.


Yeah. Mom said "We thought there might be something wrong with your chromosomes."

[srs5694]

My point is, he's not just freezing time for the people in the room; he's freezing time for (presumably) the entire planet. Or more to the point, he's freezing time for himself. So whether or not he can see certain people should be irrelevant to whether or not he can freeze time.

I was contemplating that just recently. If Hiro is "freezing time" and leaving himself unaffected (like an Einsteinian time-dilation effect that doesn't touch Hiro himself), then the question becomes how far the time-freeze effect extends. A few meters? A few miles? A few AU? Does it cut off abruptly or just slowly fade away? Unless the effect is really big (many light-years or more), somebody's bound to notice the time-freezing. ("Gee, how come everybody across the street is frozen?") The bigger the area affected, the harder it is to believe -- but of course this is fantasy, so one uses a forklift to suspend disbelief about such things to begin with.

Another explanation is that Hiro isn't freezing time per se; rather, he's speeding up his own time-frame to the point that everything else appears frozen, but in reality time is passing much more slowly for the rest of the universe. (A sort of anti-time-dilation effect for Hiro alone.) This would make his time "freezes" undetectable except by observing Hiro himself or his actions. assuming no other power or technobabble way to detect from a distance a person who's operating in an abnormal time field. Personally, I prefer this latter explanation; it's simpler and easier to swallow.

[unicorngoddess]

My point is, he's not just freezing time for the people in the room; he's freezing time for (presumably) the entire planet. Or more to the point, he's freezing time for himself. So whether or not he can see certain people should be irrelevant to whether or not he can freeze time.

Well, I guess we'd have to determine if he's stopping time for his immediate surrounding area or for the whole planet. Because if it's gonna be for the whole planet, it can't just stop there. He'd have to be stopping time for the entire universe.

[Graymalkin]

I think it would be much easier for Hiro to accelerate himself to FTL speeds than to freeze the entire universe. In other words, he's moving so fast that everything else relative to him is standing still.

This seems to be a different power from the one that allows him to move back and forth on the timeline, as he did in the first episode (moving six weeks into the future and then back again) and in the fifth episode (when his future self visits Peter).

[JYoung]

Well, I guess we'd have to determine if he's stopping time for his immediate surrounding area or for the whole planet. Because if it's gonna be for the whole planet, it can't just stop there. He'd have to be stopping time for the entire universe.

And the Universe is really, really, really, big (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcBV-cXVWFw&eurl).

[danterner]

So far, I see no evidence that this will be an important plot point, but it could conceivably become one. For instance, perhaps HRG's organization knows about this and is concerned about the possibilities if the infectious agent mutates and spreads so that everybody acquires superpowers; or maybe the point of their trap-and-release operation is to figure out how the infectious agent works so that they can give whatever powers they want to whoever they want. Of course, this is all wild speculation.

I wish more shows today used Chekhov's "gun on the mantel" precept - I'm looking at you, Lost. :)

As for the plot you are describing - it sounds reminiscent of The 4400.

[unicorngoddess]

I think it would be much easier for Hiro to accelerate himself to FTL speeds than to freeze the entire universe. In other words, he's moving so fast that everything else relative to him is standing still.

This seems to be a different power from the one that allows him to move back and forth on the timeline, as he did in the first episode (moving six weeks into the future and then back again) and in the fifth episode (when his future self visits Peter).

So then if he is moving faster than the speed of light then it wouldn't effect anything outside of his immediate area since everything is still going normal speed. Hence if something's going on in another room and he's not in that room to try to stop it, time will not stop (or appear to stop) unless Hiro is actually in that room moving at his ultra fast speed to try to stop something from happening.

[thatmeowgirl]

I have searched online for the last 40 minutes and have found just one single reference to the concept that there might possibly HAVE ONCE BEEN a law prohibiting the use of real currency in filmed productions. But I can't find it, and I've searched through the US Treasury site too. The only mention of any restriction on reproduction is related to printing, in color or black & white, and specifically requires the reproduction to be 50% or less or 150% or more of the original size of the currency.

I doubt very much there is a law prohibiting the use of real currency in filmed/televised productions (though welcome anyone who's able to quote the specific law involved if there is one); if there's any reasoning to using prop money at all, it's simply because it's less worry to control on stage.I don't have the exact law, but I work in the industry, have worked on many productions and have never been permitted to use real currency. Not saying I didn't use it on some small productions when I first started but on larger productions have not been permitted to use it. I'm sure you will argue further but these are my experiences working within the art dept.

[thatmeowgirl]

The idea of fake money being really expensive cracks me up.

Does a fake dollar cost more than a dollar?
LOL. No. But fine reproductions do cost. They make all denominations, but each bill costs the same.

[unicorngoddess]

And the Universe is really, really, really, big (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcBV-cXVWFw&eurl).

That was a pretty cool video. I sent the link to my husband because for as long as I've known him he's always had a problem grasping the concept of the Universe being so big. Maybe that will help him out :)

[mcdougll]

So then if he is moving faster than the speed of light then it wouldn't effect anything outside of his immediate area since everything is still going normal speed. Hence if something's going on in another room and he's not in that room to try to stop it, time will not stop (or appear to stop) unless Hiro is actually in that room moving at his ultra fast speed to try to stop something from happening.

Geez people, what's the mystery? He said at the very beginning of the series that he could [paraphrasing here] bend the space/time continuum. Essentially, that means he can choose to affect time (stop it and move independently) or affect space (instantly move from one place to another). It's obvious to me that when he "stops time" it's for everything, not just within a certain radius. If a certain 'radius' were the case, you'd have people just outside of the radius looking in at the frozen stuff saying "WTF?" To me, it's not that his power 'affects the whole universe', it's that he has the ability to "slip out" of the normal time-space continuum's hold on him.

I'm actually stunned that no-one is nit-picking Hiro's "pick the cards out of the air, then toss them back and have them just stop at the right place" thing. I thought for sure that would generate at least a page of debate.

[mcdougll]

[snip]Also, it's a good thing Claire has healing powers. Otherwise with as clumsy as she is she'd be dead already. (Hand in garbage disposal, football tackle, stick through brain, burnt hands, etc.)

Maybe her power is why she's so clumsy. If you don't 'hurt' when you do something wrong, you never really learn to avoid doing it.

[mcdougll]

Anyone think that Mica created his mom's alter-ego, perhaps as a way to protect her? He seems to know a lot about it, and when he told his Dad that Mom also had a secret he looked a little sheepish like he felt guilty.

Now that's a theory I hadn't thought of. That could mean Niki isn't really "special" after all, Micah is. This would explain why this seemed to happen to her recently, as opposed to growing up with it.

Interesting.

[dimented]

Maybe her power is why she's so clumsy. If you don't 'hurt' when you do something wrong, you never really learn to avoid doing it.

Good point.

[rkester]

I think that Claire wants to share with her family, her dad in particular. And maybe she's clumbsy because she does want to share. I mean, when she grabbed that pan from the oven, she knew she could without the potholders and did it anyway.

It's like suicidal people who give lots of signs. They want to be known/seen/discovered.

And as far as Hiro and time. I think he is stopping all time everywhere. If he stopped time even in a city, they be out of sync after.

[mask2343]

I'm betting on Nikki's alter ego being Sylar.

(Hope I didn't smeek)

[choccy]

I'm betting on Nikki's alter ego being Sylar.

(Hope I didn't smeek)

Maybe. You at least skipped the whole discussion on the spelling of Niki :p

[rkester]

nikis other half is not sylar. :) no way. imho

[choccy]

Geez people, what's the mystery? He said at the very beginning of the series that he could [paraphrasing here] bend the space/time continuum. Essentially, that means he can choose to affect time (stop it and move independently) or affect space (instantly move from one place to another). It's obvious to me that when he "stops time" it's for everything, not just within a certain radius. If a certain 'radius' were the case, you'd have people just outside of the radius looking in at the frozen stuff saying "WTF?" To me, it's not that his power 'affects the whole universe', it's that he has the ability to "slip out" of the normal time-space continuum's hold on him.

+1 on slipping out of time. He's not freezing the universe, he just chooses to stop going along for the ride.

I'm actually stunned that no-one is nit-picking Hiro's "pick the cards out of the air, then toss them back and have them just stop at the right place" thing. I thought for sure that would generate at least a page of debate.

That was a pretty cool effect. You could argue that when he held the card, it was out of time along with him.. and then when he threw it, it had residual 'out of time' with it, which eventually wore off until it came to rest back 'in time' with everyone else, apparently frozen to Hiro :)

[danterner]

Maybe her power is why she's so clumsy. If you don't 'hurt' when you do something wrong, you never really learn to avoid doing it.

Hm... this reminds me of familial dysautonomia (Riley Day Syndrome (http://www.wireheading.com/painless.html)), a rare genetic disorder. Unfortunately for those individuals afflicted with RDS, super-healing doesn't come with the package. Still, a lot of what we've seen happen to Claire thus far isn't necessarily her being clumsy. All of her 'suicide' attempts were intentional. Her broken neck when tackled by Brody was just her being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Her stick-in-the-neck (again, courtesy of Brody) was the result of her fighting him off. The car accident was no accident. Running into the burning train was intentional. Etc. I'm not even sure that the ring falling into the disposal was an accident. I kind of had the impression at the time that she was deliberately looking to test what would happen when hand met disposal. And the muffin thing wasn't that she was clumsy and forgot mitts; I think it was that she just didn't care about being burnt because she knew it would heal right up.

Edit: I just took a closer look at the link I included to RDS. It's an interesting read and does talk about RDS, but the article isn't really about what I thought it was at first glance :-)

[dimented]

And as far as Hiro and time. I think he is stopping all time everywhere. If he stopped time even in a city, they be out of sync after.

Would explain daylight savings time. :D

[wprager]

Something like that makes more sense. It's always bothered me that "Dad" went out and met the Cop only to be back home later in what appeared to be the same day. The Cop's in LA and the "Dad" is in Texas. If the Cop is a prequel to everyone else, then his storyline really does start to make sense.

Like I mentioned before, perhaps he's not flying commercial. He let Nathan get away without following him, so I am assuming that he cannot fly himself (unless, of course, they were purposefully putting Nathan into a stressful situation to see what he could do). Still, he could have some other ability that lets him travel from Texas to Dallas and back in an afternoon. Maybe that had something to do with the second pair of glasses with the cracked lens (e.g. he flies/runs really fast and hit a bug going 500 mph).

[wprager]

OK people.. for some reason this is SO bugging me!

Here is the correct way to spell the various character's names (from IMDB (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0813715/fullcredits)):

Micah Sanders
Niki Sanders

(IMDB page may contain spoilers!)

No more Mica or Nikki, please! :eek:

Oh, and HRG is actually credited as "Horned Rim Glasses".

And let's not forget Sylar (it's not Sylas or Silar or Cylon -- although I'll forgive that last one :) )

[balboa dave]

Hiro freezing time and space is just how we as viewers perceive it. Hiro himself accelerates. "First gear" looks to us like he has stopped time. When he touches something, it accelerates to his speed, but when he lets it go, it goes back to normal speed. Like the playing cards. "Second gear", he accelerates enough to exceed the speed of light, so is (fictionally) able to traverse time and space. The closest comic book analogy would be the Flash. A Flash that runs at full speed all the time.

[Graymalkin]

Yeah, IMDB's listing of the person playing Sylar is a definite spoiler.

[jking]

The fact that Hiro was able to stop time for everyone except himself and Peter in the subway, though, indicates that he has some type of control over time and space, rather than simply being able to step outside of it.

[3D]

nikis other half is not sylar. :) no way. imho

Agreed. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Sylar leave a message on the proffessor's answering machine, and wasn't it a male voice?

[bobcarn]

Did anyone bring up Claire's brother yet in this thread? When Claire was badgering her mom about the chromosomal damage she supposedly had, her mom said something like "You're such a hypochondriac. Honestly, you're just like your brother." To me, that opened the door that the brother could also be adopted, and potentially "special" also.

[jking]

Did anyone bring up Claire's brother yet in this thread? When Claire was badgering her mom about the chromosomal damage she supposedly had, her mom said something like "You're such a hypochondriac. Honestly, you're just like your brother." To me, that opened the door that the brother could also be adopted, and potentially "special" also.

This is probably a smeek, but my first thought when I heard that conversation is that possibly Claire's "sickness" is what originally got HRG into his current line of work. Maybe he knows that Claire's body is eventually going to give out on her and what he's been trying to do is study all the others like her to try to help her. Maybe he's trying to "Save the Cheerleader" along with everyone else. Heck, maybe he's the one who gives Hiro the idea in the future.

[dimented]

Hiro freezing time and space is just how we as viewers perceive it. Hiro himself accelerates. "First gear" looks to us like he has stopped time. When he touches something, it accelerates to his speed, but when he lets it go, it goes back to normal speed. Like the playing cards. "Second gear", he accelerates enough to exceed the speed of light, so is (fictionally) able to traverse time and space. The closest comic book analogy would be the Flash. A Flash that runs at full speed all the time.

Then how do you explain him going forward in time to the day of the bombing and then back to japan in the current time?

[dimented]

Yeah, IMDB's listing of the person playing Sylar is a definite spoiler.

Yea, it definitely proves who it is not.:)

[dimented]

This is probably a smeek, but my first thought when I heard that conversation is that possibly Claire's "sickness" is what originally got HRG into his current line of work. Maybe he knows that Claire's body is eventually going to give out on her and what he's been trying to do is study all the others like her to try to help her. Maybe he's trying to "Save the Cheerleader" along with everyone else. Heck, maybe he's the one who gives Hiro the idea in the future.

Wow. I don't know why, but I really like this theory for some reason.

[getreal]

Yikes! With the amount of over-analyzing of some details and theorizing about the physics/science of the super-powers, methinks some of you folks need to just sit back, relax, suspend your disbelief, and enjoy the story. 'Cause it's all make-believe, after all!

I can just imagine if "Bewitched" or "I Dream of Jeannie" were brand new series, people would be all over theorizing about how their powers would "actually" work.

I'm all for discussing the storylines and interpersonal relationships, etc., but at some point we all need to just suspend our disbelief and accept that the producers have artistic license to do things like freeze frame and shoot with a blue filter to indicate a frozen moment in time. It's artistic expression.

In the classic old Batman series with Adam West, all of the bad guys lairs were filmed with the camera sitting crooked. It wasn't that they actually hid out in places that were at a 12° angle -- it was just SHOT that way to emphasize the fact that these guys were "crooked".

And the Dick Tracy movie with Warren Beatty was filmed using primary colors (reds, yellows, blues) to enhance the printed comic book feel.

It's all in the artistic expression. That's all.

[PeternJim]

That sort of depends on whether he is "stopping time" or whether he is uncoupling the effect that time has on himself. I sincerely doubt that he is actually affecting every molecule of the universe -- or even locally, since the inertia of everything else would get messy real quickly.

I've been using the phrases like "stopping time" or "freezing" but using them to mean that he is only actually affecting himself and the things he has contact with (including the air he breathes and walks through) (Hmm.. wonder if he stood in one place too long if he would pass out from having used up all the oxygen within immediate breathing distance?)

The local effect would explain why he can move people and things without the "burning up from air friction" issue.

I doubt he is having any effect whatsoever on time itself. Just stepping outside it for a bit.

[PeternJim]

Like I mentioned before, perhaps he's not flying commercial. He let Nathan get away without following him, so I am assuming that he cannot fly himself (unless, of course, they were purposefully putting Nathan into a stressful situation to see what he could do). Still, he could have some other ability that lets him travel from Texas to Dallas and back in an afternoon. Maybe that had something to do with the second pair of glasses with the cracked lens (e.g. he flies/runs really fast and hit a bug going 500 mph).


Do we really think Dad has any powers at all? I don't. At least, none I've seen hinted at. The only thing I see as seriously unexplained is how his little group is finding these people specifically, like his getting into Mohinder's cab, and his pal being in the bar ahead of the cop. But that could just be good surveillance on people they were already watching. Time will tell.

[jking]

Yikes! With the amount of over-analyzing of some details and theorizing about the physics/science of the super-powers, methinks some of you folks need to just sit back, relax, suspend your disbelief, and enjoy the story. 'Cause it's all make-believe, after all! ...

I agree a little bit. I've even thought the same thing at times. You have to figure though, the type of people who take time out of their lives to hang out on a forum about TV are the same type of people who over-analyze stuff. It's in our nature, or else we wouldn't be here. ;) :p

[PeternJim]

The fact that Hiro was able to stop time for everyone except himself and Peter in the subway, though, indicates that he has some type of control over time and space, rather than simply being able to step outside of it.

Except that Peter seems top be a proximity mimic and can duplicate other people's powers, so this isn't the slam dunk it looks like. It seems to explain why Hiro went back to Peter rather than to his buddy or someone else.

This one could go either way. If Hiro, at the very beginning of figuring out his powers, can already manipulate people and things when he touches them, it is entirely possible that at a later time and skill level, he will be able to extend the "field" or whatever around anything or anyone nearby that he chooses.

[getreal]

I agree a little bit. I've even thought the same thing at times. You have to figure though, the type of people who take time out of their lives to hang out on a forum about TV are the same type of people who over-analyze stuff. It's in our nature, or else we wouldn't be here. ;) :p

I also agree a little bit.

But some folks analyze, and some folks over-analyze. Just my humble opinion.

I like to log on and read up on the discussion, then log out and get some work done. But trying to skim across hundreds of nit-picky pseudo-scientific speculations gets a bit frustrating. I love the storyline talk, though, but that's just me.

I'm trying to reserve judgment on the evil-intentions of Horned-rim glasses Step-dad and the Pixie girl and Sylar.

Oh well, you can't spell "analyze" without "anal" ... :cool:

[PeternJim]

I can just imagine if "Bewitched" or "I Dream of Jeannie" were brand new series, people would be all over theorizing about how their powers would "actually" work.

If they claimed that witchcraft was a result of genetic manipulation, probably so -- and deservedly so.

If they claimed it was because Samantha's parents were witches, then, maybe not so much.

Ya make the rules, ya play by the rules. We were fine overlooking (but still making fun of) the stuff that the castaways on Gilligan's Island managed to pack for a 3 hour tour, but if the castaways on that other show... ummm.... you know, the one where the plane went down......ah, well, the name escapes me..... start inventing stationary bike-powered electrical equipment or a full Broadway stage set, well, they DON'T get a pass.

[Fool Me Twice]

...but if the castaways on that other show... ummm.... you know, the one where the plane went down......ah, well, the name escapes me...Lost. The name is Lost. Interesting thing about Lost: it's a lot like Heroes. I think there should be some discussion here about how much Lost and Heroes are alike.

Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost.

[danterner]

Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost. Lost.

I just literally sprayed soda from my nose after reading that spoiler. Thank you for a good laugh at the end of a hard day!

[scooterboy]

I'm betting on Nikki's alter ego being Sylar.

(Hope I didn't smeek)
Well if you had read the entire thread, then you'd know if you're smeeking, wouldn't you? :)


Please please please - I'm begging all of you - please don't turn the Heroes threads into smeekfests like the Lost threads have become! If you want to post something so others can read it, show that same courtesy to those who posted before you and read the thread first!

Please?

[rkester]

I gotta say, the Heroes threads have definitely become very interesting reads as the show has grown. I discuss with my brother, then come here and see what you guys thought. Sometimes you guys are thinking along the same lines, sometimes you guys are totally on other tangents.

Very cool to be able to get such a broad audience of ideas and thoughts and then mull it all over in your head. And the great thing about the forums, you can just read thru at your pace. :)

I hope to see some of the ideas we've read here come to fruition soon! :)

[PeternJim]

Sometimes you guys are thinking along the same lines, sometimes you guys are totally on other tangents.

Well, then, post your tangent!

[rkester]

Actualy I think almost every idea Ive had has been covered here or in previous Heroes threads. I still think its awesome to be able to get all these thoughts from others so easily. But it can be overwhelming too. I mean, the Heroes threads are kicking posts out at a rate higher than the Lost threads do now. And 300 posts is alot to go thru and read everything if you are obsessive about it. :)

[drew2k]

This is probably a smeek, but my first thought when I heard that conversation is that possibly Claire's "sickness" is what originally got HRG into his current line of work. Maybe he knows that Claire's body is eventually going to give out on her and what he's been trying to do is study all the others like her to try to help her. Maybe he's trying to "Save the Cheerleader" along with everyone else. Heck, maybe he's the one who gives Hiro the idea in the future.
I love this idea. HRG has shown nothing but affection for his daughter, and even his apparently underhanded attempt to reunite Claire with her bio-parents could be seen as an act of protection. HRG is then either an evil man but a GREAT actor, able to convince his daughter of his love for her, or he's a good man on a mission to protect his daughter by learning about others like her ...

[choccy]

Yikes! With the amount of over-analyzing of some details and theorizing about the physics/science of the super-powers, methinks some of you folks need to just sit back, relax, suspend your disbelief, and enjoy the story. 'Cause it's all make-believe, after all!

Like I said last week (and I have the feeling I'll be repeating again next week ;) ), we're here to talk about the show, all aspects of it, including theorizing how these events may come about even though they are totally fictional. It's like talking about how you think the transporters, holodeck or warp drive may work on Star Trek.

If all we did was sit back, relax and enjoy then this thread would be nothing but an endless stream of "i love this show" and "i hate this show", and would end a few hours after the shows original air time.

[rkester]

My bro and I have discussed a similar idea bout Claires dad. We think he may be a good guy at heart. has her best interests in mind to some degree. but maybe has just gotten so used to the idea that he has the authority to do what he wants to anyone, and thats gone to his head a bit. I mean, no matter how nice of guy you are, if you have the ability to take anyone from any location quietly and return them elsewhere and they never know, thats gotta give ya a gawd complex.

I keep hoping he turns out to be good. But I have a feeling he will only become a "micheal". willing to do ANYTHING to help his kid even if it means bad bad things.

[getreal]

If all we did was sit back, relax and enjoy then this thread would be nothing but an endless stream of "i love this show" and "i hate this show", and would end a few hours after the shows original air time.

I couldn't disagree more, although I wasn't aware of people theorizing about the intricate workings of a holodeck. :cool:

I was just venting about the volume of pseudo-science posts. But I'm not setting rules here or trying to be a moderator. I just needed to get my little rant off of my chest. So now I'm good. :p

But there is still plenty of interesting and thought-provoking discussion about the interpersonal relationships and powers of the characters which still appeals to me -- outside of the stuff about molecules of air frozen in time or "anti-graviton particles". LOL!!

Has anybody even discussed Einstein's theory of relativity here and how that would affect time travel? If so, I'm glad I missed it.

[busyba]

although I wasn't aware of people theorizing about the intricate workings of a holodeck. :cool:
Really? Then you just weren't paying attention. :)

[stellie93]

I gotta say, the Heroes threads have definitely become very interesting reads as the show has grown. I discuss with my brother, then come here and see what you guys thought. Sometimes you guys are thinking along the same lines, sometimes you guys are totally on other tangents.

Very cool to be able to get such a broad audience of ideas and thoughts and then mull it all over in your head. And the great thing about the forums, you can just read thru at your pace. :)

I hope to see some of the ideas we've read here come to fruition soon! :)

:up: :up:

[painkiller]

From what I've been noticing, I get the distinct impression that "Dad", aka HRG guy, knows far more of what is likely going on with some of these 'heroes' than just Claire.

I pin him as something like a scientist, certainly someone who has been involved in a project that has actually resulted in these people. He just wants to find out exactly who they are.

So he's on a "quest" to gather them all up for something/some purpose.
He already "has" Claire. He tried to capture the flyer (person running for office).
Now he knows definitely there are others.

He seemed to know that Claire wasn't really telling him what was happening to her fully - he certainly noticed the bottom of her legs & feet when she got back home from the coroner's office.

I don't think any of these folks displaying these powers are results of - ahem, natural selection. Rather I would think they have been influenced/manipulated to become that way on purpose.

He knows. HRG, that is. My question is - who else knows? (that we haven't seen yet)

[Delta13]

Yeah. Mom said "We thought there might be something wrong with your chromosomes." This cracked me up when Claire's mother said it. I was trying to imagine a doctor saying, "You got a real funny cough there. We probably should check your chromosomes." :)

For what, exactly? And do what, exactly? It just made me laugh, but in a good way.

Skipping the Einstein presentation I had all laid out for this response - you're welcome getreal - the only thing I will say is that if you can bend the space/time continuum, then you have an effect on time.

My theory for why Hiro doesn't spill the beans to Peter about who the cheerleader is and where is because he doesn't know. In his timeline, they never found and saved her. But they know of her, and apparently realize (a little late) that they need her.

*Sigh* These people are the result of genetic mutations, all coming about at this moment in time to save the human race. Mohinder prattles on about it incessantly in the voiceovers, how could we miss it? It's not a disease, it's evolution!

And the evolution WILL be televised! :D

[Roadblock]

I love the show, but I find the Mohinder plotline super boring - and hate, hate, hate the voice-overs from his character.

His voice-overs are approximately 10,000x better than the narrator's.

[Roadblock]

Which superpower makes it night-time in Vegas while it's day-time in Texas?

[Graymalkin]

Oh, it's always nighttime in Vegas. ;)

[Zevida]

You guys have got to give up trying to make HRG some kind of noble good guy just trying to save someone or something. He is so obviously EVIL, it's not even funny! I don't care what his intentions, he has been involved in kidnapping and mind-wiping and that's just not cool on any level. The show has pretty much smacked us over the head with the fact that he is the Bad Guy and you guys are just making it way, way too complicated.

/rant

[Rob Helmerichs]

Zevida, I think you underestimate the show. I think (hope?) that it is much more interesting than pure and simple good vs. evil.

[ruexp67]

There was an interesting tidbit dropped in this episode that hasn't been discussed yet: After Claire's alleged bio-parents left, her (adoptive) mother told her that she'd been ill as a baby. Going on the dramatic principle that you don't put a gun on the mantlepiece unless it'll be used later in the play, this raises the question of how this illness might be related to Claire's powers.

I assumed the "illness" was a lie that HRG told to mom while he was busy ordering tests and doing research on her.

[dimented]

Zevida, I think you underestimate the show. I think (hope?) that it is much more interesting than pure and simple good vs. evil.

+1

Some of the most interesting stories out there have bad guys that are kind of good and good guys that are kind of bad. If you want cut and dry Good Versus Evil then go watch superman. I like the intricacies of a story line that is not quite so black and white.

[pkscout]

Zevida, I think you underestimate the show. I think (hope?) that it is much more interesting than pure and simple good vs. evil.

I would agree.

I think that assuming Niki survives we're likely to see a number of shades of grey developing in her character (maybe a melding of the two personalities), and I think Dad is also in that grey area. I thought the comment about the precog (when he said "cool") made it clear he's interested in the science of these folks, and I think he really cares about Claire (he flinched when he heard "save the cheerleader, save the world). He's just in a moral grey area regarding methods.

Dad hasn't, to our knowledge, killed anyone or held anyone captive too long. And he's only wiped the smallest amount of memory necessary. Well, except for the football player, and that was just Dad taking vengance on the kid that tried to rape his daughter. His response was pretty tempered really.

My thoughts anyway.

[getreal]

Dad hasn't, to our knowledge, killed anyone or held anyone captive too long. ... His response was pretty tempered really.

Ditto.

What if the HRG step-dad just wants to be the leader of the mutants?
Nah -- there's surely a lot more to it than that.

And future Hiro with his little soul patch and black outfit and sword ... popping in on Peter Petrelli to instruct him to answer Isaac's phone and to give a message to current-Hiro ... apparently on Hiro's first time around with the whole nuclear holocaust thing, he must not have saved everybody and so he went back in time once (or more times) in order to give it another shot and correct things he missed the first (few) times.

[busyba]

You guys have got to give up trying to make HRG some kind of noble good guy just trying to save someone or something. He is so obviously EVIL, it's not even funny! I don't care what his intentions, he has been involved in kidnapping and mind-wiping and that's just not cool on any level. The show has pretty much smacked us over the head with the fact that he is the Bad Guy and you guys are just making it way, way too complicated.

/rant
Watch the first 3 seasons of Babylon 5 and you'll realize that "good" and "evil" aren't always so easliy identifiable.

[choccy]

From what I've been noticing, I get the distinct impression that "Dad", aka HRG guy, knows far more of what is likely going on with some of these 'heroes' than just Claire.

I pin him as something like a scientist, certainly someone who has been involved in a project that has actually resulted in these people. He just wants to find out exactly who they are.

So he's on a "quest" to gather them all up for something/some purpose.
He already "has" Claire. He tried to capture the flyer (person running for office).
Now he knows definitely there are others.

He released the cop after he examined him, so, I'm not so sure gathering them up is his purpose.

[dimented]

Ditto.

What if the HRG step-dad just wants to be the leader of the mutants?
Nah -- there's surely a lot more to it than that.

And future Hiro with his little soul patch and black outfit and sword ... popping in on Peter Petrelli to instruct him to answer Isaac's phone and to give a message to current-Hiro ... apparently on Hiro's first time around with the whole nuclear holocaust thing, he must not have saved everybody and so he went back in time once (or more times) in order to give it another shot and correct things he missed the first (few) times.

Like a "Do over"? ;)

[Zevida]

Watch the first 3 seasons of Babylon 5 and you'll realize that "good" and "evil" aren't always so easliy identifiable.

I've seen almost the whole series of Babylon 5.

I'm not denying that there are shades of grey and that "good" characters can do "bad" things (heck, I'm a huge fan of Jack Bauer and he practically lives in grey-land) and that "bad" characters can do "good" things. But I think at a character's core, they are one or the other, and I believe that HRG is a "bad" guy who is perhaps using some not-too-terrible methods at times; or, who believes he is in the right.

I just don't see why everyone is giving him the benefit of the doubt already. He has kidnapped at least two people and he has been responsible for both partial and complete loss of memory - and I don't care what that person did to his daughter, it is a total violation of that person's right as a human being and IMO beyond any sort of physical pain he could have applied.

I'm not wishing for transparency or lack of depth to the character - I just don't get why everyone is so excited about it being a misdirection and that he's really a good guy. I will have a very hard time accepting any transformation into a good guy based on his actions to date - it will require some pretty creative explanations on the part of the writers.

[dimented]

I've seen almost the whole series of Babylon 5.

I'm not denying that there are shades of grey and that "good" characters can do "bad" things (heck, I'm a huge fan of Jack Bauer and he practically lives in grey-land) and that "bad" characters can do "good" things. But I think at a character's core, they are one or the other, and I believe that HRG is a "bad" guy who is perhaps using some not-too-terrible methods at times; or, who believes he is in the right.

I just don't see why everyone is giving him the benefit of the doubt already. He has kidnapped at least two people and he has been responsible for both partial and complete loss of memory - and I don't care what that person did to his daughter, it is a total violation of that person's right as a human being and IMO beyond any sort of physical pain he could have applied.

I'm not wishing for transparency or lack of depth to the character - I just don't get why everyone is so excited about it being a misdirection and that he's really a good guy. I will have a very hard time accepting any transformation into a good guy based on his actions to date - it will require some pretty creative explanations on the part of the writers.

But most of us did not give him the benefit of the doubt right off the bat. His character has earned that over the past couple of weeks. We all thought he was bad after the first episode but are slowly starting to think he may be good. That comes from how his character acts. With me it is just a vibe he gives off and his reactions to some things. I am not totally convinced yet they he is good. And in no way do I think he is 100% good. I am just starting to think he may lean a slight more on the good side then the bad side.

[DevdogAZ]

I've seen almost the whole series of Babylon 5.

I'm not denying that there are shades of grey and that "good" characters can do "bad" things (heck, I'm a huge fan of Jack Bauer and he practically lives in grey-land) and that "bad" characters can do "good" things. But I think at a character's core, they are one or the other, and I believe that HRG is a "bad" guy who is perhaps using some not-too-terrible methods at times; or, who believes he is in the right.

I just don't see why everyone is giving him the benefit of the doubt already. He has kidnapped at least two people and he has been responsible for both partial and complete loss of memory - and I don't care what that person did to his daughter, it is a total violation of that person's right as a human being and IMO beyond any sort of physical pain he could have applied.

I'm not wishing for transparency or lack of depth to the character - I just don't get why everyone is so excited about it being a misdirection and that he's really a good guy. I will have a very hard time accepting any transformation into a good guy based on his actions to date - it will require some pretty creative explanations on the part of the writers.
It's almost like you have family members or close friends who have had their memories wiped and so you're taking it more personally than you probably should. I mean, realistically, he didn't do anything of consequence to Officer Parker, and the rapist deserved whatever he got.

[Zevida]

We all thought he was bad after the first episode but are slowly starting to think he may be good. That comes from how his character acts. With me it is just a vibe he gives off and his reactions to some things.

Too funny - as for me, it is also the vibe he gives off. Complete clinical detachment from the heroes as human beings and an eagerness to do whatever it takes to get whatever he wants. An interest in the heroes abilities as a science experiment (the "cool" reaction). I tend to think these as the charicataristics of someone who is lacking in the morals department.

I did not take his reaction to the threat to Claire as fear for his daughter but rather fear for his experiment.

[Zevida]

It's almost like you have family members or close friends who have had their memories wiped and so you're taking it more personally than you probably should. I mean, realistically, he didn't do anything of consequence to Officer Parker, and the rapist deserved whatever he got.

I cannot understand how anyone can think that mind-erasing is something that is acceptable. Obviously I've never known anyone with their memory erased (or have I :confused: :D ), but I think it is a primal violation of a person's identity. I am also strongly opposed to vigilante justice, so I think the rapist deserved to be punished, it was not HRG's decision to do so.

Did everyone else miss the entire storyline in Buffy where *spoilers* Willow was changing Tara's memory so that their fights would be forgotten and what a big deal it was that Willow was molding their minds to fit her vision of what the world should be? Same thing! */spoilers*

[dswallow]

I cannot understand how anyone can think that mind-erasing is something that is acceptable. Obviously I've never known anyone with their memory erased (or have I :confused: :D ), but I think it is a primal violation of a person's identity. I am also strongly opposed to vigilante justice, so I think the rapist deserved to be punished, it was not HRG's decision to do so.
Mind-erasing isn't necessarily a bad thing.

If you could erase violent or traumatic experiences, for example -- a rape, from the victim's memory, they certainly could get on with their life a lot more easily.

[unicorngoddess]

Did everyone else miss the entire storyline in Buffy where *spoilers* Willow was changing Tara's memory so that their fights would be forgotten and what a big deal it was that Willow was molding their minds to fit her vision of what the world should be? Same thing! */spoilers*

That's one of my favorite episodes! Everyone ends up with amnesia and Buffy calls herself (joan?) Xander went by Alex and Anya and Jiles thought they were a couple. *sigh* I miss Buffy.

I don't think HRG had to have EVERYTHING erased. Just that past 48 hours or so would have been sufficent to protect his interest (good or evil) but I think the reason he had everything wiped out was because he was doing it partially for his cause and partially to avenge what he did to Claire. So I do think he has some fatherly feelings towards Claire.

[3D]

I am also strongly opposed to vigilante justice, so I think the rapist deserved to be punished, it was not HRG's decision to do so.

So do you also think that Claire is bad for trying to kill the rapist via car accident?

[Supfreak26]

Too funny - as for me, it is also the vibe he gives off. Complete clinical detachment from the heroes as human beings and an eagerness to do whatever it takes to get whatever he wants. An interest in the heroes abilities as a science experiment (the "cool" reaction). I tend to think these as the charicataristics of someone who is lacking in the morals department.

I did not take his reaction to the threat to Claire as fear for his daughter but rather fear for his experiment.


Funny how people can watch the same show and see totally different things.

When HRG was first introduced, I thought him to be a bad guy. No question about it. But his actions since being introduced have convinced me that he's not as evil as the show first portrayed him. Some examples:

1. He didn't harm the cop. He only erased his memory so he wouldn't remember his visit with HRG. I'm thinking they just wanted to draw blood or something. If he was evil, he would've had every opportunity to do something bad to him.

2. He could've had flyboy if he really wanted him. He gave him every opportunity to escape. Maybe they just wanted to see him fly? If he really wanted to kill him he could've.

3. His "cool" reaction to the news of Hiro. He actually seemed a little giddy for a moment.

4. His genuine love for his daughter. He shows no sign of conflict with her being one of the Heroes. To me, he seems like he's trying to encourage her to share her secret with him so he can help her grow with it.

He's no saint. But neither is our future-telling-drug-addicted Hero. Nor is our crooked politician flyboy. Nor is our Kitty Pryde-wannabe prison escapee.

I'm thinking he's going to be a leader of some sort to our heroes down the road.

As for him emptying the QB's head, he deserved it. Scum like that deserve a lot worse.

[danterner]

I think that HRG's erasing of Brody's mind was a little more nuanced than some are making it out to be. HRG definitely was acting as Vigilante Dad - you hurt my daughter, I hurt you. But, in addition to that, there was also a little bit of sympathy for Brody in his actions: by erasing Brody's memory completely, he was giving Brody a second chance to develop a non-rapist personality. He said as much to Brody when talking to him, as I recall. Whether its his right to do that is up for debate (as evidenced in this thread). All things considered, I think the way HRG treated Brody tips his scale closer toward Good and away from Evil.

[TAsunder]

So niki's neck is not super powered since she couldn't just sit there and whistle while dl choked her. Therefore is her whole neck to head area her achilles heel like it might be for claire?

[choccy]

So niki's neck is not super powered since she couldn't just sit there and whistle while dl choked her. Therefore is her whole neck to head area her achilles heel like it might be for claire?

It wasn't her neck, it was her internal organs. DL strangled* her from the inside!

* strangled.. I assume. Someone else in this thread suggested that. I wasn't sure what he was doing. He may have held her heart until it stopped beating for all we know.

[classicX]

Well if you had read the entire thread, then you'd know if you're smeeking, wouldn't you? :)


Please please please - I'm begging all of you - please don't turn the Heroes threads into smeekfests like the Lost threads have become! If you want to post something so others can read it, show that same courtesy to those who posted before you and read the thread first!

Please?

Um... not when the thread is already 12 pages long. You expect every new person who has just seen the latest episode to spend an hour reading the entire thread before joining the discussion?

I don't.

[drew2k]

[...] You expect every new person who has just seen the latest episode to spend an hour reading the entire thread before joining the discussion? [...]If an hour is what it takes ... ;)

[Zevida]

If you could erase violent or traumatic experiences, for example -- a rape, from the victim's memory, they certainly could get on with their life a lot more easily.

I think you are way, way off base here and I'll just leave it at that.

So do you also think that Claire is bad for trying to kill the rapist via car accident?

Yes, I have serious problems with Clarie because of that. However, she has demonstrated remorse and she knows she did something wrong. Just like "good" Niki knows that the actions of "bad" Niki are wrong. Both women have made bad choices but seem to be inherently good.

[smak]

HRG may do bad things, and be a bad guy in certain aspects, but i don't think he is THE bad guy of the story.

Somebody is going to set off a nuke in NYC, and i'm assuming that he is THE bad guy of the current season.

-smak-

[Zevida]

HRG may do bad things, and be a bad guy in certain aspects, but i don't think he is THE bad guy of the story.

I can agree with that.

[dswallow]

HRG may do bad things, and be a bad guy in certain aspects, but i don't think he is THE bad guy of the story.

Somebody is going to set off a nuke in NYC, and i'm assuming that he is THE bad guy of the current season.
Maybe setting off the nuke in NYC is what they have to do in order to save the world.

:p


...just sayin'...

[busyba]

Maybe setting off the nuke in NYC is what they have to do in order to save the world.
You obviously haven't been paying attention...

Save the cheerleader, save the world.


DUH!!!


:p

[LordFett]

You expect every new person who has just seen the latest episode to spend an hour reading the entire thread before joining the discussion?
Or you could just keep up with it from the start. If you can't be bothered to read the thread what makes you think we can be bothered to read your response?

[bruinfan]

wow... more smeek debate...

read the thread... save the forum...

from smeeking.

I'm betting on Nikki's alter ego being Sylar.

(Hope I didn't smeek)
well you did... like 10 people have said that before you. and you'll never know if it's true until you read the thread :cool:
Um... not when the thread is already 12 pages long. You expect every new person who has just seen the latest episode to spend an hour reading the entire thread before joining the discussion?
yes.

smeek prevention reduces thread size by at least 30%. and if noone smeeked, the incidence of people saying "hope i'm not smeeking" would decrease by over 90%. source: natl journal of tcf behavior patterns

read the thread. save the forum

[bruinfan]

when the thread gets over 5 pages long, there should be a multiple choice quiz that can only be aced if you've read the thread. once aced you will be allowed to post.

moderator, set that up, huh? :p :cool:

[marksman]

Or you could just keep up with it from the start. If you can't be bothered to read the thread what makes you think we can be bothered to read your response?
That is ridiculous.

Some of people's position on smeeking are absurd. The rest of the world does not have these stupid smeek rules. People are not required to read an entire thread before posting. People complaining about smeeking are 100 times worse and more disruptive then someone actually repeating something already discussed.

[Rob Helmerichs]

That is ridiculous.

Some of people's position on smeeking are absurd. The rest of the world does not have these stupid smeek rules. People are not required to read an entire thread before posting. People complaining about smeeking are 100 times worse and more disruptive then someone actually repeating something already discussed.
No, people who smeek are 87.3 times worse.

And my statement is obviously more scientific, because I didn't use a round number.

[choccy]

That is ridiculous.

Some of people's position on smeeking are absurd. The rest of the world does not have these stupid smeek rules.

Totally not true. I don't use the word 'smeek' outside of TCF since it means nothing to anyone else, however, if someone starts talking to me about something I've already written to them about, but they didn't read it, I won't get in to a discussion with them about it until they've read what I already wrote. Why should I waste my time repeating myself over and over?

People are not required to read an entire thread before posting. People complaining about smeeking are 100 times worse and more disruptive then someone actually repeating something already discussed.

And people are not required to read, comment on or discuss your smeek'd posts either, but they tend to reply rather than leaving you hanging out in the wind. I suppose that's their bad though.

[srs5694]

Regarding the whole "good vs. evil" thing and various characters, IMHO, that's a simplistic dichotomy. In reality, few (perhaps no) people are "pure good" or "pure evil." A better approach is to think in terms of individual actions and motivations. In the case of HRG, he'd get a negative score for mind-wiping Brode and kidnapping or attempting to kidnap at least two people, a positive score for protecting his daughter, and a big question mark concerning his motivations and as-yet-unrevealed backstory and future actions. In this sort of view, characters can be overwhelmingly "good" overall but still have strong "evil" deeds to their names, or vice-versa, or have large dollops of both "good" and "evil" scores. Trying to pigeonhole such characters (or real people) as "good" or "evil" is, IMHO, an exercise in futility. Both real life and good drama are more complex than that.

[drew2k]

Let's see...

Nathan is a politician.

He cheated on his wife.

It probably wasn't the first time he cheated.

He used his brother's "suicide" for political gain.

He lied to his brother (initially) about his power.

He took money from Linder. Subtract 1.

I don't think I've seen one positive for Nathan yet, so he must be evil.

Oh wait! He gave Hiro a lift from the diner back to the strip... I guess he's not so bad after all!

[cyke93]

ive become a fan of this show .. but my disdain for nbc (for canceling american dreams) is still fresh in my memory.. i will not give nbc the pleasure of my season pass and my viewership.. instead.. ill just catch the show on their website


i knew from the start that chick was working with the bad guys .. her showing up at isaac's was not surprising

[dswallow]

Let's see...

Nathan is a politician.

He cheated on his wife.

It probably wasn't the first time he cheated.

He used his brother's "suicide" for political gain.

He lied to his brother (initially) about his power.

He took money from Linder. Subtract 1.

I don't think I've seen one positive for Nathan yet, so he must be evil.

Oh wait! He gave Hiro a lift from the diner back to the strip... I guess he's not so bad after all!
He's been reasonably decent eye candy, so far, too.

[dimented]

ive become a fan of this show .. but my disdain for nbc (for canceling american dreams) is still fresh in my memory.. i will not give nbc the pleasure of my season pass and my viewership.. instead.. ill just catch the show on their website


i knew from the start that chick was working with the bad guys .. her showing up at isaac's was not surprising

Then don't get pissed when they cancel it. :rolleyes:


If you like the show support it so the rest of us that enjoy it can keep enjoying it also.

[Figaro]

No, people who smeek are 87.3 times worse.

And my statement is obviously more scientific, because I didn't use a round number.
:up: :up: :up:

[unicorngoddess]

Um... not when the thread is already 12 pages long. You expect every new person who has just seen the latest episode to spend an hour reading the entire thread before joining the discussion?

I don't.

Yes, I for one do expect that. I mean, would you walk up to a group of people at a party and try to jump right in on their conversation? No. Chances are you'd make a fool of yourself, especially if you start with someone that the group already discussed like an hour ago.

Personally, I'll take a whole day if I have to (and I have before) to read a whole thread before posting my comments. IF I don't feel like reading a dozen pages of posts then no harm done to me. I just tell myself I'll join next weeks' discussion.

To me I think its just a matter of common courtesey.

[dimented]

Yes, I for one do expect that. I mean, would you walk up to a group of people at a party and try to jump right in on their conversation? No. Chances are you'd make a fool of yourself, especially if you start with someone that the group already discussed like an hour ago.

Personally, I'll take a whole day if I have to (and I have before) to read a whole thread before posting my comments. IF I don't feel like reading a dozen pages of posts then no harm done to me. I just tell myself I'll join next weeks' discussion.

To me I think its just a matter of common courtesey.

+1 :up: :up:

If you don't care to read what we say in the first 12 pages, why should we care to read what you say in the last!

[DevdogAZ]

ive become a fan of this show .. but my disdain for nbc (for canceling american dreams) is still fresh in my memory.. i will not give nbc the pleasure of my season pass and my viewership.. instead.. ill just catch the show on their website
You do realize that NBC gets no pleasure or satisfaction from you setting up a SP and watching their shows on your TV, unless you're a Nielsen family. Watching on their website, on the other hand . . .

i knew from the start that chick was working with the bad guys .. her showing up at isaac's was not surprising
Yes, it wasn't surprising to anyone since she'd just gotten off the phone with HRG who told her to pick up the painter.

[Big_Daddy]

Wow. Well I finally caught up on all of these 13 pages of posts, in addition to the actual show itself.

This is getting interesting. I was disappointed to see the little hottie Eden working with Claire's dad, but he's clearly being set up so as not to be the obvious "villain." The grayness of the characters (rather than a simple good/bad dichotomy) is rough, but improving.

I'm not a fan of the Niki storyline. But I'm somehow finding using her as the Heroes equivalent of the Incredible Hulk interesting. At least the equivalent of the crafty, smart, and self-serving gray Hulk, that is.

The cop does seem detached from the rest of the storyline. I don't think he's in another time period - sorry guys - but likely they're setting him up to provide insights into the Sylar storyline when the crew recognizes who the cheerleader is, and who the threat to her may be.

Oh, and thanks to Jyoung for posting the link to that great video.

[TAsunder]

It wasn't her neck, it was her internal organs. DL strangled* her from the inside!

* strangled.. I assume. Someone else in this thread suggested that. I wasn't sure what he was doing. He may have held her heart until it stopped beating for all we know.

I remember him having his hands on her neck. But maybe they were "inside" her neck. The internal organ squishing makes sense, though, thanks. Phew... the sword, claire's tree brain, and niki's neck, I was definitely getting a highlander vibe there.

[unicorngoddess]

The cop does seem detached from the rest of the storyline. I don't think he's in another time period - sorry guys - but likely they're setting him up to provide insights into the Sylar storyline when the crew recognizes who the cheerleader is, and who the threat to her may be.


Yeah, I realized this the other day myself. While the cop guy was strapped to the table he does ask HRG about Claire.

Also, thanks for taking the time to read the whole thread. See, some people are capable of doing it. :)

I remember him having his hands on her neck. But maybe they were "inside" her neck. The internal organ squishing makes sense, though, thanks. Phew... the sword, claire's tree brain, and niki's neck, I was definitely getting a highlander vibe there.

I think he reached through her chest and up, out and around the neck. My opinion on that was so it would make it impossible for her to remove his hands from her in any kind of way.

[Figaro]

http://www.samruby.com/Heroes/Vision/VisionAvengers.gif
"First Kitty Pryde, now this. Why is everyone stealing my gig?"

[johnperkins21]

I think he reached through her chest and up, out and around the neck. My opinion on that was so it would make it impossible for her to remove his hands from her in any kind of way.

He was inside of her only halfway up his forearms (at the most), giving credence to the "squeezed her heart/lungs" argument in my mind. Anyone got a screencap?

[DevdogAZ]

He was inside of her only halfway up his forearms (at the most), giving credence to the "squeezed her heart/lungs" argument in my mind. Anyone got a screencap?
I thought his arms went in her abdomen, came back out through her chest and his hands were choking her neck from the outside. I guess he could have been squeezing something on the inside with his elbows ;) or the fact that his arms were inside her made her unable to fight back.

[johnperkins21]

I thought his arms went in her abdomen, came back out through her chest and his hands were choking her neck from the outside. I guess he could have been squeezing something on the inside with his elbows ;) or the fact that his arms were inside her made her unable to fight back.

His hands definitely were not on her neck, from the back or otherwise. Imagine trying to do that, go through someone's abdomen, up and around to grab the back of their neck. Unless it's a small child or "little person" you'd have to be right up against them, and he was clearly leaning back with her on top. I think a photo would prove it one way or another.

[srs5694]

I thought his arms went in her abdomen, came back out through her chest and his hands were choking her neck from the outside. I guess he could have been squeezing something on the inside with his elbows ;) or the fact that his arms were inside her made her unable to fight back.

I just checked (I've still got it on my TiVo). It's not surprising there's confusion here, since there were continuity glitches in the scene. There were a series of intercut shots from different angles. Some showed DL reaching into Niki's chest with his right hand (presumably squeezing her heart in an attempt to kill her, or perhaps crushing her spine) and others showed him strangling her with his right hand. They went back and forth between the two types of attack, but no shot showed DL reaching into Niki's chest with his hand coming out to then strangle her, and I don't believe that would have been possible unless DL had Elastigirl-type powers. At the time I first saw it, I interpreted it as a double attack: Reach into chest with one hand and strangle with the other; but pausing on the individual shots clearly shows it was the right hand used for both attacks.

[unicorngoddess]

I just checked (I've still got it on my TiVo). It's not surprising there's confusion here, since there were continuity glitches in the scene. There were a series of intercut shots from different angles. Some showed DL reaching into Niki's chest with his right hand (presumably squeezing her heart in an attempt to kill her, or perhaps crushing her spine) and others showed him strangling her with his right hand. They went back and forth between the two types of attack, but no shot showed DL reaching into Niki's chest with his hand coming out to then strangle her, and I don't believe that would have been possible unless DL had Elastigirl-type powers. At the time I first saw it, I interpreted it as a double attack: Reach into chest with one hand and strangle with the other; but pausing on the individual shots clearly shows it was the right hand used for both attacks.

That could be it. I clearly saw his arm go through her chest, but I also clearly saw his fingers wrapped around her neck.

[LordFett]

I will try and post a screencap tonight when I get home. I too thought he went in her chest and came out to choke her neck on the outside, but I didn't look that close.

[johnperkins21]

I could have sworn that it was two separate acts. The first was he was choking her. Then, the kid walked in, and he took his hands off her neck. Finally, he stuck his hands into her chest and squeezed either her heart or lungs until she collapsed (with both hands). I could be misinterpreting what I saw, but that's how I recall it.

[choccy]

I could have sworn that it was two separate acts. The first was he was choking her. Then, the kid walked in, and he took his hands off her neck. Finally, he stuck his hands into her chest and squeezed either her heart or lungs until she collapsed (with both hands). I could be misinterpreting what I saw, but that's how I recall it.

Now you mention it.. I seem to recall he was choking her but with little success, and then Micah came in to the room distracting her, and that's when he changed tactics and reached inside of her to do whatever it was that he did.

[Jericho Dog]

Sorry, I haven't read all 13 pages......

So, HRG is Claire's DAD????

Holy Frak!
:D

[johnperkins21]

Ok, now I've watched it on NBC.com and see what the deal is. He did both. After fighting with her, and Micah comes in the room, he sticks his hand in her. The camera cuts away, and comes back with his arm in her abdomen, hidden by her breasts, with his wrist exposed and his hand choking her.

I definitely remembered it differently, but here are the two shots.

edit: sorry, not exactly sure how to post images inline.

[unicorngoddess]

Yep, that second image is the way I remembered it. I was pretty sure he did it so there would be no way she could break his hold on her.

[choccy]

Are those images in the right order? :)

[Figaro]

Sorry, I haven't read all 13 pages......

So, HRG is Claire's DAD????

Holy Frak!
:D
No he isn't. He is actually Satan. If you had read the thread you would know that.

[johnperkins21]

Are those images in the right order? :)

Yes. There was actually a full on choking scene right before heroes1.jpg, but that didn't seem to be part of the confusion.

You could always go to NBC's online version (http://www.nbc.com/Video/rewind/full_episodes/?show=heroes) and select part 6 to re-watch it. That's what I did.

[bobcarn]

I've seen almost the whole series of Babylon 5.

I'm not denying that there are shades of grey and that "good" characters can do "bad" things (heck, I'm a huge fan of Jack Bauer and he practically lives in grey-land) and that "bad" characters can do "good" things. But I think at a character's core, they are one or the other, and I believe that HRG is a "bad" guy who is perhaps using some not-too-terrible methods at times; or, who believes he is in the right.

I just don't see why everyone is giving him the benefit of the doubt already. He has kidnapped at least two people and he has been responsible for both partial and complete loss of memory - and I don't care what that person did to his daughter, it is a total violation of that person's right as a human being and IMO beyond any sort of physical pain he could have applied.

I'm not wishing for transparency or lack of depth to the character - I just don't get why everyone is so excited about it being a misdirection and that he's really a good guy. I will have a very hard time accepting any transformation into a good guy based on his actions to date - it will require some pretty creative explanations on the part of the writers.
Well, good and bad are really shades of grey. Do I think he's good? No. Do I think he's bad? I don't know yet. I think the only way he can possibly be thought of as "good" with the little information we have is if we compare him to Nikki. Now here we have someone who's been assumed to be one of the good guys, and we find out she not only planned a heist, but slaughtered and buried her gang, then slaughtered other people who may have been witnesses. By comparison, the memory-wipe of a violent rapist ain't so bad.

I cannot understand how anyone can think that mind-erasing is something that is acceptable. Obviously I've never known anyone with their memory erased (or have I :confused: :D ), but I think it is a primal violation of a person's identity. I am also strongly opposed to vigilante justice, so I think the rapist deserved to be punished, it was not HRG's decision to do so.

And you would most likely make a very fine hero.

You're absolutely right. What he did was a violation. I couldn't do something like that myself. But while I can't condone what he did, or even think of doing it myself, I can definitely sympathize with why someone would do that. People who abuse other people's rights forfeit many of their own.

[bobcarn]

Lost. The name is Lost. Interesting thing about Lost: it's a lot like Heroes. I think there should be some discussion here about how much Lost and Heroes are alike.


Interesting. I never really thought the two shows were alike. One is interesting and fun and exciting, and the other is.... lost.

I watched Lost a couple weeks ago. I found I still had no clue as to what was happening. I felt like I did the first time I watched it when it premiered. They've concentrated on character development, and neglected to give us any kind of story. Sure the characters are all richly developed and multidimensional, but if anyone can tell me exactly what the heck is happening on that island, please do.

I'll bet you there's not a single fan out there who could.

[Sadara]

:eek:

Totally smeeking here, but it's more about the 13 pages of post than about the show. I will never be able to catch up to all this. I finally watched the show last night and will only say I loved it and obviously the show it catching tons of interest...... 13 pages of posts!! Wow!!

[TAsunder]

OK so now I'm more confused than before. Did he kill her by squeezing her neck or not? Because if he did, that just doesn't make sense if she's super hulk lady, unless her neck muscles are for some reason not super powered. I'm too lazy to look for myself. I demand you all do my work for me and agree with me even if I'm wrong.

[Rob Helmerichs]

Sure the characters are all richly developed and multidimensional, but if anyone can tell me exactly what the heck is happening on that island, please do.

I'll bet you there's not a single fan out there who could.
Well, if they had explained exactly what the heck is happening on that island, the show would be over. But they've made a lot more progress than some people are willing to admit.

[unicorngoddess]

but if anyone can tell me exactly what the heck is happening on that island, please do.

I'll bet you there's not a single fan out there who could.

The show is essentially about the mystery of the island. The characters' backstories are all just leading up to the big mystery that is the island. I'm of the opinion that the island itself is the main character.

[TAsunder]

Well, if they had explained exactly what the heck is happening on that island, the show would be over. But they've made a lot more progress than some people are willing to admit.

That's just poor planning then. Why should the show be over after the mystery is revealed? I hope Heroes doesn't take that approach. The mystery can be revealed and there can still be immense conflict left. In the case of Heroes, Sylar could be revealed to be Bob Dole and working as a secret op for the Canadian Government. The nuke could be averted and everyone could be fully trained in their powers. I'd still want to watch. If it is true that Lost would be over once the mystery is revealed, then the show is crap now and we should stop watching.

[jpwoof]

Promo trailer with some spoilers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qI2abeXxGbk

(1) Hiro teleporting with visual effects
(2) Matt, making the water boil? not sure if it's in the same scene
(3) HRG asking Isaac for help...
(4) Claire's secret discovered by her brother
(5) etc,

[choccy]

Lost [...] the show is crap now and we should stop watching.

QFT :)

[pkscout]

I'm confused. I thought this was the Hero's thread. Yet all I seem to be seeing is posts about Lost. Aren't there a few threads somewhere about Lost where you all can chat?

[dswallow]

I'm confused. I thought this was the Hero's thread. Yet all I seem to be seeing is posts about Lost. Aren't there a few threads somewhere about Lost where you all can chat?
They've been looking for a hero so they won't be lost anymore.

[busyba]

They're just holding out for a hero.

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/5652/bonnie20tyler2020holding20out20for20a20herofg1.jpg

[choccy]

That's what'll happen for sweeps. All the Heroes will get together and save the cast of Lost. The artist will paint a map, Peter will fly them there. Claire and Niki will help fight off the various bad things on the island while Micah builds a device to teleport them all back to civilization. The cop will weed out the 'evil' people and Hiro will freeze time and dispatch of them with his handy sword.

Save the flopping show, save the network. :D

[TAsunder]

I watched the replay prior to Doctor Who. He choked her. Come on hulk lady, flex your flippin neck muscles. Sheesh...

[Delta13]

In the case of Heroes, Sylar could be revealed to be Bob Dole and working as a secret op for the Canadian Government. The nuke could be averted and everyone could be fully trained in their powers. I'd still want to watch.And then Bob Dole, while being led away in handcuffs, would look towards the camera and say, "I ... I can't win!" ;)

And then Peter would give him a Visa Check Card. Oops, shoulda spoilered that one!

[bruinfan]

:eek:

Totally smeeking here, but it's more about the 13 pages of post than about the show. I will never be able to catch up to all this. I finally watched the show last night and will only say I loved it and obviously the show it catching tons of interest...... 13 pages of posts!! Wow!!
not a smeek... smeeking is when you post what you think is an original thought or concept, but someone already posted before you. the more the subject has been brought up, the more flagrant the smeeking.

when you write to say general comments about the show, such as "i love the show". "i hate the show", "i want more mcboobies"... that is ok, and shouldn't fall under the definition of smeek.

That's what'll happen for sweeps. All the Heroes will get together and save the cast of Lost. The artist will paint a map, Peter will fly them there. Claire and Niki will help fight off the various bad things on the island while Micah builds a device to teleport them all back to civilization. The cop will weed out the 'evil' people and Hiro will freeze time and dispatch of them with his handy sword.
Like when laverne and shirley would show up in an episode of happy days... those were the best... yeah, i know it's different networks and they were actually spinoffs...

[danterner]

I recall some discussion, somewhere in the 14 pages of this thread, about what might happen if Peter were in a room with multiple Heroes at the same time. Here's a link to a Sci-Fi Wire article where Milo Ventimiglia discusses that: http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/index.php?category=1&id=38795 (minor spoilers).

[EvilMidniteBombr]

Come on people! It's been mentioned, you just have to put it together. Nikki might be Sylar, or at least have the same sinister powers. If that's the case, she might be able to stop the Heroes powers, just like the dude in the bar with the Cop.

I think the Mindsweeper dude in the bar was just able to block the cop's attempts at reading his thoughts. The more the cop concentrated the quieter it became in his head. Or Mindsweeper (I like that name :) ) is able to an area effect "cone of silence" that blocks attempts at telepathy.

[EvilMidniteBombr]

That's the thing that I really like about this show. The characters are very multidimensional and good and evil aren't clear-clut in some cases.

Nikki... All this time, I thought she was going to be one of the heroes, but she's not. At least, I certainly hope she's not. Her superstrength alter-ego is very much a villain. No two ways about it. Now, whether or not Nikki is still alive and her evil doppleganger died is another thing. But that doppleganger is definitely NOT a good guy. Actually, I liked DL by the end of the eppy. Not a lot, and he's definitely not a good guy (planning a bank robbery pretty much means you're not good), but he's not the killer we were led to believe.

Claire's dad... I can see where he's not exactly one of the good guys, but not necessarily one of the bad guys either. Or at least not one of the very bad guys. All we know is that he's kidnapped people, but then released them within a day or so with their memories wiped. It's not exactly a noble gesture, but not pure evil either. He did wipe that one kid's mind, but that kid was a habitual rapist. A really evil guy would've probably killed the kid. Also, he seemed to show concern over Claire when he heard the "Save the Cheerleader" line. So I don't believe he's a good enough character to be a hero, but it's still up in the air if he's bad enough to be a real villain.

Actually, the only real villains we've seen so far are Nikki's alter-ego and Sylas.

But look who she goes after. The most positive interpretation is that she is a VERY nasty vigilante.

I agree with Rob. I am not totally convince that Niki is evil. Yes her alter ego has killed a bunch of people. But they have all been in self defense (with the exception of the poker game, but do we know that she went there with the intent to kill?) and the victims have all been on the wrong side of the law. (More info in the graphic novel (http://www.nbc.com/Heroes/novels/novel_006.shtml) on NBC.com.) Plus, she seems to have done it all for Micah's sake. I think she is going to be one of those "the ends justify the means" type of heroes, at least at first, and assuming that she survived her fight with DL. If so, she will have to learn to control her violent other half. There are several heroes that have a very violent (and sometimes evil) past but still join the forces of good.

[EvilMidniteBombr]

Well, the top one is "the shocker", not a gang sign.

As for the bottom one, I'm not aware of which gang sign consists of attempting to lick one's own rended torso. ;)

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shocker_hand_gesture) under Similar Gestures...
The shocker should not be confused with a similar gesture used by professional wrestler Matt Hardy. Hardy's "V1" gesture is done with the index and middle fingers separated, forming a "V", and has no sexual connotation.

[EvilMidniteBombr]

I looked at the video of DL fighting with Niki several times and it is not at all clear on exactly what he was doing. At first his right hand is inside her torso up to his wrist. Then it abruptly cuts to his right hand around her throat. Then back to the torso, then back to the throat.

Maybe the scenes with his hand around her throat were meant to be the directors way of saying that he was strangling/suffocating her internally? Other than that, I gots no clue.

[Alpinemaps]

I watched the scene and there's at least once or twice where, if you look quickly, you can see the hand in her torso, and around her neck at the same time. It's *very* brief, though.

[Figaro]

EW article containing several spoilers for the season. (http://www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,1553770_3_0_,00.html)

I had to laugh when they said they insist on fast moving plotlines. Then they say that it will take all year for the Heroes to get together.

[tivogurl]

My point is, he's not just freezing time for the people in the room; he's freezing time for (presumably) the entire planet. Or more to the point, he's freezing time for himself.
Maybe he's speeding himself up so much that everybody else only looks like they're standing still. That's exactly how Time Stop works in D&D, which comic book fans are more likely to know about than average television writers. Moreover it doesn't require Hiro to stop time for the entire planet or universe.

[busyba]

The actor who plays Hiro has the following theory (in the 'Entertainment Weekly' article on the show) about how his powers are implemented:

"Actually, I believe there's a fifth dimensional fact that allows for parallel universes to exist at the same time, in the same location. Basically, he puts himself in the sixth dimension and comes back into the current reality.... but I havent really thought about it too much." :D

[dswallow]

The actor who plays Hiro has the following theory (in the 'Entertainment Weekly' article on the show) about how his powers are implemented:

"Actually, I believe there's a fifth dimensional fact that allows for parallel universes to exist at the same time, in the same location. Basically, he puts himself in the sixth dimension and comes back into the current reality.... but I havent really thought about it too much." :D
He should re-watch Buckaroo Banzai.

[betts4]

He should re-watch Buckaroo Banzai.

No matter where you go, there you are!!!

[Rob Helmerichs]

No matter where you go, there you are!!!
Laugh while you can, monkey-boy.

[LordFett]

Sorry, I haven't read all 13 pages......

So, HRG is Claire's DAD????
Sorry might be smeeking, but no HRG isn't claire's father, he is Satan.

[wprager]

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy.

And my favorite, the last line: "Big deal."

And now, back to the matter at hand: I may be smeeking, but does anyone else think that Claire's dad is ...
:)

[Figaro]

Interesting, IMDB says that Sylar was in this episode but I don't recall seeing that person. Don't go to IMDB unless you are ok with getting Sylar's identity spoiled.

[choccy]

Interesting, IMDB says that Sylar was in this episode but I don't recall seeing that person. Don't go to IMDB unless you are ok with getting Sylar's identity spoiled.

Personally, I would have spoilerized that entire sentence :)

[Figaro]

Personally, I would have spoilerized that entire sentence :)
Good for you. :p

[hapdrastic]

OK so now I'm more confused than before. Did he kill her by squeezing her neck or not? Because if he did, that just doesn't make sense if she's super hulk lady, unless her neck muscles are for some reason not super powered. I'm too lazy to look for myself. I demand you all do my work for me and agree with me even if I'm wrong.

Maybe she's just super strong and not super tough. Sort of the opposite of Claire, who can't die but who's only as strong as your average human.

[balboa dave]

A lot of people seem to think Niki's dead, but there's no direct evidence for that. I mean, she could be dead, but that just doesn't make sense from a storytellling point of view. I just think D.L. gave her his version of a choke hold to render her unconcious. Heroes also has a habit of revisiting scenes like this in the following episode to show a side we didn't see the first time around, so I hope we get the whole story tonight.

[Idearat]

A lot of people seem to think Niki's dead, but there's no direct evidence for that. I mean, she could be dead, but that just doesn't make sense from a storytellling point of view. I just think D.L. gave her his version of a choke hold to render her unconcious. Heroes also has a habit of revisiting scenes like this in the following episode to show a side we didn't see the first time around, so I hope we get the whole story tonight.

I didn't think she was dead at first, but while re-watching the voiceover mentioned something about death.

But if she is dead, we'll probably still see her in flashbacks or something similar since we were never introduced to what her particular power was. We get a peek at her son's comic book cover, but have never seen her in her full Hulk persona.

[Hunter Green]

Or you could just keep up with it from the start.
What about people who have DVRs so might not be watching the episode when it airs? Oh, nevermind, there's probably none of those folks around here.