Simulcast Digital (Time Warner Houston)

[blibman]

When I use my converter box, it uses a digital feed for most of the channels below 100. With the cable card, I am getting just the analog versions. Is this configurable by the cable company? I'd obviously prefer the digital feeds (better quality and takes less disk space).

Thanks.
Brian

[btwyx]

Is this configurable by the cable company?Yes, but they may not understadn when you ask.I'd obviously prefer the digital feeds (better quality and takes less disk space).The quality of digital is not necessrily better, there's cruddy analog and there's cruddy digital. I get both and the digtial is less cruddy than the analog, if the analog were any good, it'd be easier for it to be better than the digital they send me.

Its easier to mess up analog, they have absolute control over how bad digital is.

[andyf]

I have TW Houston and all my channels with the S3 are digital.

[blibman]

Did you have to ask TW to set your lower channels to digital? Mine are obviously analog (picture not as sharp, Tivo uses a "quality level").

Thanks.

[bluetex]

I think I'm just the opposite of the OP. My old cable boxes (HD/SD) both had really awful lower chan's. Now that I've moved to S3, all the lowers are pristine with the CCs.

My S2 without a box looks horrible. My S2 with a box looks marginally better.

Jeff

[andyf]

Did you have to ask TW to set your lower channels to digital? Mine are obviously analog (picture not as sharp, Tivo uses a "quality level").

Thanks.

They were analog for a few days, but then one day I turned on the TV and they were all digital. Friends at work noticed the switchover was around middle September. I remember because cable went out for a day, roadrunner and all. When it came back on we were all digital.

[bluetex]

They were analog for a few days, but then one day I turned on the TV and they were all digital. Friends at work noticed the switchover was around middle September. I remember because cable went out for a day, roadrunner and all. When it came back on we were all digital.


Ya know, I remember that day too. Maybe the OP's neighborhood hasn't experienced that changeover yet.

[blibman]

I noticed that my travel channel, which is <100 was digital today. Of course, I was watching a show and it started stuttering. I looked at the signal strength and it was bouncing up and down from 71 to 99. I went to other channels and they were fine. I tuned to it on another tivo that uses analog and the picture was fine, except for a "blip" every few seconds. I wonder if the analog tuner just minimizes the effect of the "blip" and the digital tuner just goes crazy?

B

[andyf]

If you're getting to see the signal strength on your lower channels then they're digital. You can only get a signal strength for digital channels.

[BigFrank]

Time Warner in Rochester claims that their cable cards aren't capable of tuning the digital channels below 99 (and their above 99 equivalents).
This is from 2nd tier service. Our cards are from Scientific Atlanta. I'm not sure if they are right, or this is merely an education issue (or they do it on purpose to discourage CableCard users).

I'm getting the digital channels every where else though.

One thing I'm finding tho - I doubt I would be heartbroken to give up the cable HD Tier and the digital tier and get ONLY the regular analog cable. I get all the local HD channels (including FOX which our local Time Warner doesn't carry in HD) OTA so I wouldn only be missing INHD1 and 2, Discovery Channel HD and TNT HD (which sucks as they always broadcast 4:3 programs stretched out in a really bad way). I would probably miss HBO HD too. On the plus side I would probably save like $30 a month

[btwyx]

Time Warner in Rochester claims that their cable cards aren't capable of tuning the digital channels below 99Comcast support tried to tell me that, and its total BS. That'd be a defective card if it were true.

[SCSIRAID]

Time Warner in Rochester claims that their cable cards aren't capable of tuning the digital channels below 99 (and their above 99 equivalents).


Thats a crock. Cablecards dont TUNE anything.. they are encrypt/decrypt devices. They couldnt care less what 'channel' the stream comes from.

[moyekj]

Thats a crock. Cablecards dont TUNE anything.. they are encrypt/decrypt devices. They couldnt care less what 'channel' the stream comes from. Agreed, it's just a question of the cards being programmed to map to the correct frequencies for digital simulcast channels just as the digital set top boxes are. When I get my CCs tomorrow I will be checking and if they are not mapped to simulcast channels I plan on raising the issue to my cable co. I don't want to record any analog channels with the S3, I have other DVRs for that purpose.

[blibman]

So, I went to Settings, Channels, Signal Strength. I'm not sure which cable card is being used but if I channel up/down, the only ones I get signal strength for are 24 35 42 48 49 52 54 57 62 65 67 68 69 71 73 74 100+--so the others must all be analog. This is Time Warner in Houston, inside loop 610.

Andyf, you said you have verified that all of your stations below 100 are digital?

Thanks.
Brian

[rtmoore4]

Hate to say it Andyf, but you're incorrect. TWC-Houston does not have digital channels below 99. If that were true, you would not be able to tune a station in on an old analog TV without having a converter box. Don't believe me, though, go try it for yourself. I think you'll find they all work just fine on a good 'ole basic, analog TV.

I'm actually not aware of any cableco in the country who has made the switch to "all digital". They keep saying they are "digital", and you may be paying for "digital", but the truth is only channels 100+ are digital. There are still just too many paying customers who don't have, don't want, or can't afford cable boxes for the cablecos to make the switch to all digital.

[blibman]

Sorry, rtmoore4, you're not correct. TWC Houston DOES "simulcast" at least some of the channels below 100 in digital (that means they come in BOTH analog and digital). They rolled it out in early 2006, along with the new onscreen guide. With my HD convertor, I thought I got all of the channels, but a TWC rep told me "some". If you look at the list in my message #14 in this thread, you will see the ones I am getting with my Series3. It is pretty easy to tell because the picture is very sharp. Also, if you try to record any of these channels, Tivo will not ask for a image quality.

Try it for yourself using the signal strength display. Tell us what channels below 100 you are getting in digital.

BTW, all my signal strengths tonight were in the 97-99 range.

Brian

[btwyx]

I'm actually not aware of any cableco in the country who has made the switch to "all digital".As pointed out and as it says in the title, they're simulcast. I get *ALL* my cable channels as digital. The analog ones are there, I got them switched. They haven't switched yet, they're preparing for it.

[andyf]

So, I went to Settings, Channels, Signal Strength. I'm not sure which cable card is being used but if I channel up/down, the only ones I get signal strength for are 24 35 42 48 49 52 54 57 62 65 67 68 69 71 73 74 100+--so the others must all be analog. This is Time Warner in Houston, inside loop 610.

Andyf, you said you have verified that all of your stations below 100 are digital?

Thanks.
Brian

Yes, I have verified all channels are digital. Both from the signal strength screen and in diagnostics which will show no tuning information if the channel is analog.

[Houtech]

blibman,

Time Warner Houston was supposed to have all the lower analog channels simulcast in digital by now, but the rollout stopped for some reason. Only the channels you mentioned are simulcast in digital. The easy way to tell if you are watching a lower channel in digital or analog is to look at your stereo receiver (if you are using a seperate receiver for your surround sound). If the channel is analog, the receiver will show the audio as 48 pcm, if the channel you are watching is digital, it will show dolby digital 2/0.

[blibman]

Sounds like I need to call and talk to a Tier 3 tech.

[andyf]

So, while I have TW Houston, I live quite a way north of Houston in Spring. Maybe it's area by area?

[TiVoMonkey]

If TW-Houston has some hubsites with bad cable plants hanging off, they'll probably put off doing the simulcast conversions until they can fix the problems. This is because of the frequencies that they use for the digital QAMs that carry the analog channels as digital.

When they switched in my area, I suddenly didn't get a lot of the former analog channels on my digital cable box, because the signal strength was so low. They had to come to my house and replace the aging RG58 in the ground with RG11.

If a lot of the Houston area is bad, they may be fixing problems before a bigger rollout, because they don't want a lot of people suddenly not getting all of the channels on their digtal set tops.

[jeffrypennock]

So, while I have TW Houston, I live quite a way north of Houston in Spring. Maybe it's area by area?
It IS happening area by area. I've got the handful of digital simulcasts listed above but not on all my channels yet, here in Galveston.

[rtmoore4]

Blibman,

Ok, so I'm confused. If what you say is true regarding simulcasting digital channels, then where are they putting the digital channels below 99? The analog frequencies for these lower channels are jammed right up next to each other. If they were going to embed a digital channel in between, they would have to shift an analog channel up to make room, right?

As an example, if they wanted to make channel 24 digital also (as specified here), they would have to kill channel 25, or at least move it to 26. Clearly that isn't the case, so I must be missing something fundamental.

[btwyx]

As an example, if they wanted to make channel 24 digital also (as specified here), they would have to kill channel 25, or at least move it to 26. Clearly that isn't the case, so I must be missing something fundamental.They could broadcast 24 on 98-17 (or anywhere else handy) and tell the cable card to map it to 24. Physcial channel 24 would be analog 24, digital 24 comes from somewhere else in the digital stream.

On my system they do analog to 80, then digital to 120. In those 40 physcial channels they pack about 400 digital channels which run from 1 through 1000, and are a mix of SD, HD and audio. If you scan those channels you find all sorts of things all over the place. CNN is on channel 56, but when I looked I found it on 119-7 I think.

One fundamental thing you're missing is a digital channel needs less bandwidth than an analog channel.

[SoBayJake]

Blibman,

Ok, so I'm confused. If what you say is true regarding simulcasting digital channels, then where are they putting the digital channels below 99? The analog frequencies for these lower channels are jammed right up next to each other. If they were going to embed a digital channel in between, they would have to shift an analog channel up to make room, right?

As an example, if they wanted to make channel 24 digital also (as specified here), they would have to kill channel 25, or at least move it to 26. Clearly that isn't the case, so I must be missing something fundamental.

The digital channels can reside anywhere else in the spectrum. The digital box gets a "mapping" of the analog to digital channels. When you tune in channel 24, it "knows" there's a mapped digital channel on say, 608. So instead of showing you the analog channel 24, it presents you with channel 608, but "hides" that fact from you, and it looks like you are just watching channel 24.

[Roderigo]

Ok, so I'm confused. If what you say is true regarding simulcasting digital channels, then where are they putting the digital channels below 99? The analog frequencies for these lower channels are jammed right up next to each other. If they were going to embed a digital channel in between, they would have to shift an analog channel up to make room, right?

As an example, if they wanted to make channel 24 digital also (as specified here), they would have to kill channel 25, or at least move it to 26. Clearly that isn't the case, so I must be missing something fundamental.
I think the part you're missing is that the channel numbers that your cable box and cablecard host use are all virtual channel numbers - the channel number itself doesn't tell the box how to tune (vs an analog cable ready device - where the channel number is all that's necessary to tune).

Thus, the cable company can keep analog 24 at the correct spot such that an analog tv can tune to it, but can also put a digital signal at some other frequency, and tell the cablebox/cablecard to show the user channel 24, but really tune to some other frequency.