Stargate Atlantis 09/22/06 "The Return"

[Anubys]

Much better cliff hanger than last season!

Did Dr. Weir put on a lot of weight or did they just make it look this way?

I very much enjoyed this one...

[MikeSh]

I watched the 1st half tonight before I headed for work. I'll watch the rest in the morning from my D*Tivo. I'll have to take a good look at Weir.

MikeS.

[lawilson2]

Excellent episode but I wish they went into more about the ancients that returned. Guess time didn't allow it. I had thought that the replicators were posing as the returned ancients, feigning being on a broken down ship, etc.

Nice cliffhanger for next season. Good to see Jack doing some more work. He seems to really like the Atlantis show more than SG1 lately.

[MrGreg]

I had thought that the replicators were posing as the returned ancients, feigning being on a broken down ship, etc.

I still think that's the case.

[drew2k]

I had thought that the replicators were posing as the returned ancients, feigning being on a broken down ship, etc.I still think that's the case.O'Neill told SGC that more than half the city was already lost. Why would the replicators go to the trouble of faking being Ancients just to get the humans to leave so they could take over the city peacefully and then bomb it to oblivion? That makes no sense to me.

I'm just curious what kind of military career Sheppard will have after he heroically saves the city, Woolsy and O'Neill next season. Promotion?

[jerobi]

Good stuff. Hopefully these replicators will end up destroying a few existing plot devices and get the Atlantis team back to that "stranded" feeling.

I mean, IF the team can save the city. Gee golly I hope so.

[geekmedic]

Is Atlantis on for another season? I've heard that SG-1 is being canned after the finale.

I really loved the Stargate series. Hate to see SG-1 being retired. Hopefully another network will pick it up for new episodes.

Any idea when SciFi is going HD?

[PJO1966]

I still think that's the case.

Same here... why else would the show the replicators in the "previously on" bit.

[Peter Miller]

Is Atlantis on for another season? I've heard that SG-1 is being canned after the finale.

I really loved the Stargate series. Hate to see SG-1 being retired. Hopefully another network will pick it up for new episodes.

Any idea when SciFi is going HD?

SG-1 was canned, ATL was renewed for a 4th season.

SG-1 just got too expensive to produce. (actor's salaries go up each year) That's the reason why SG-1 was canned and ATL was renewed even tho both have about the same ratings numbers.

[Rob Helmerichs]

But there is still a half-season of SG-1 left, in case you were wondering...

[windracer]

I guess Robert Picardo and RDA were still in Vancouver from the "200" shoot so they wrote them into this one. :D

So the Ancients didn't request their puddle jumper back?

How long did it take in the pilot episode for them to gate from the SGC to Atlantis? 30 minutes using Rodney's gate-pipe macro seems long.

[flyers088]

I guess Robert Picardo and RDA were still in Vancouver from the "200" shoot so they wrote them into this one. :D

So the Ancients didn't request their puddle jumper back?

How long did it take in the pilot episode for them to gate from the SGC to Atlantis? 30 minutes using Rodney's gate-pipe macro seems long.

I thought they had a ZPM so they just gated there from SGC. With no ZPM to use on either side they had to come up with a new plan.

[Rob Helmerichs]

I thought they had a ZPM so they just gated there from SGC. With no ZPM to use on either side they had to come up with a new plan.
I think the question was, why does it take 30 minutes to gate to Earth using the chained gates when using a regular gate takes nowhere near that long (it seems to be virtually instantaneous, since they're able to have real-time conversations).

But since in Rodney's method each gate along the way has to receive the "information" comprising the travellers, dial the next gate, and then pass it on, it doesn't seem unreasonable that it would take a half hour to make one's way through the entire system. Heck, just dialing all those gates one by one would probably eat up a pretty good chunk of time...

[windracer]

I thought they had a ZPM so they just gated there from SGC. With no ZPM to use on either side they had to come up with a new plan.
I understand why they had to do it. I was just wondering why the new method still took 30 minutes? I realize we're talking two galaxies here and some untold number of gates linked together so 30 minutes compared to 3 weeks is pretty good.

[Rob Helmerichs]

I would, however, like to know why the entire population of Atlantis didn't die a horrible death when they returned to Earth without a puddle-jumper, and hit the transfer point half-way, with an unfinished and unenclosed space station, thus having to breathe vacuum while waiting for the second sequence of gates to start up.

[stark]

They mentioned that the Atlantians loaned them a ZPM so they could gate directly to Earth.

[drew2k]

I think the question was, why does it take 30 minutes to gate to Earth using the chained gates when using a regular gate takes nowhere near that long (it seems to be virtually instantaneous, since they're able to have real-time conversations).

But since in Rodney's method each gate along the way has to receive the "information" comprising the travellers, dial the next gate, and then pass it on, it doesn't seem unreasonable that it would take a half hour to make one's way through the entire system. Heck, just dialing all those gates one by one would probably eat up a pretty good chunk of time...Are the travelers dematerialized for a full 30 minutes during the journey? Or 15 minutes for each leg of the journey to the mid-way point? Sheppard said it felt weird, but I would guess he wouldn't really be aware that 15 minutes or 30 minutes of time has passed ...

[drew2k]

I would, however, like to know why the entire population of Atlantis didn't die a horrible death when they returned to Earth without a puddle-jumper, and hit the transfer point half-way, with an unfinished and unenclosed space station, thus having to breathe vacuum while waiting for the second sequence of gates to start up.I had a different question you just reminded me of ... When is the code given to SGC to lower the iris? Didn't see it happen in this episode during Sheppard's run. (I really hope they had tried it with something inanimate before Sheppard tried it.)

[zordude]

They mentioned that the Atlantians loaned them a ZPM so they could gate directly to Earth.


This was my understanding as well. They didn't use the Macro to leave, they dialed direct.

Z

[zordude]

Are the travelers dematerialized for a full 30 minutes during the journey? Or 15 minutes for each leg of the journey to the mid-way point? Sheppard said it felt weird, but I would guess he wouldn't really be aware that 15 minutes or 30 minutes of time has passed ...

When I saw the shell of the future space station, it looked to me like you would step out of the gate on one side, and walk across the space station and then dial again to use the 2nd half macro.

Z

[Rob Helmerichs]

When I saw the shell of the future space station, it looked to me like you would step out of the gate on one side, and walk across the space station and then dial again to use the 2nd half macro.

Z
Right, but time would have to pass while in transit each leg. Gate 1 would dial Gate 2 and send the travellers; Gate 2 would receive the travellers; shut down the incoming wormhole from gate 1, dial Gate 3, and pass on the travellers; etc.

Presumably, the incoming wormhole at SG Command would contain a gate code as well so the iris wouldn't engage.

And as I pointed out before, there is no enclosed station at the halfway point yet, so all those unprotected travellers during the evacuation must have had a very uncomfortable journey, having to walk across an open shell of a station in zero gravity to get to the other gate...

[drew2k]

Right, but time would have to pass while in transit each leg. Gate 1 would dial Gate 2 and send the travellers; Gate 2 would receive the travellers; shut down the incoming wormhole from gate 1, dial Gate 3, and pass on the travellers; etc.I find it interesting the show started with a discussion of aging regarding the Ancients and the near-speed-of-light travel, as we earlier found that it takes 15 minutes for each traveller to pass to the mid-point of the two galaxies. Since the traveller is dematerialized for each leg of the trip, the net effect is each traveller has aged 30 minutes less than everyone else when they finally reach their destination.And as I pointed out before, there is no enclosed station at the halfway point yet, so all those unprotected travellers during the evacuation must have had a very uncomfortable journey, having to walk across an open shell of a station in zero gravity to get to the other gate...Not according to another post - the Ancients loaned a ZPM from their ship to power the stargate, so everyone walked directly from Atlantis to SGC, bypassing the "Carter-McKay Bridge".

[nedthelab]

SG-1 was canned, ATL was renewed for a 4th season.

SG-1 just got too expensive to produce. (actor's salaries go up each year) That's the reason why SG-1 was canned and ATL was renewed even tho both have about the same ratings numbers.

I guess the money was going to the actors and not to the wirters or production values, as uch as I like the show it has falling off and I am REALLY tired of a never ending arc with a new and similar villian the first 8 years dealt with....may it RIP

[Anubys]

I think Rodney said something along the line of 34 gates comprising the gate-bridge...assuming about 1 minute per gate, the 30 minutes seems reasonable as each gate receives the data, dials the next gate, sends the data through...etc.

and yes, the Ancients re-powered Atlantis with ZPMs...so the evacuation was done directly from Atlantis to Earth...

they had full power...as the replicators were attacking, the Atlantians even attempted to raise their shields...

[Mr2sday]

That's right, the CARTER-mckay bridge.

Now atlantis can have all the tech the Aurora class ship had to offer--namely a couple of ZMP's. Kill off the ancients-- it's just too hard with them alive. Although I could see one living helping the SGC ala the azgard on the promethius. When the wraith finally get to atlantis there can be a real battle. A fully functional Atlantis vs. a wraith fleet. Now that is a battle worth watching.

Oh yeah, I'm assuming the ancients get killed by the "replicators" and Weir+Sheppard go back and kill all the replicators. Either that or the replicators give up when they realize that something is wrong with their lives.

[JimSpence]

So just where did they get all of those gates to make the chained gate?

[windracer]

If memory serves they were taking space gates from planets that were no longer inhabited due to wraith cullings ...

[jimmymac]

and yes, the Ancients re-powered Atlantis with ZPMs...so the evacuation was done directly from Atlantis to Earth...

And when Sheppard and the thers retake Atlantis next season and rid it of Replicators (including those posing as Ancients) they will have all those ZPMs

[jschuur]

I noticed everyone's been calling them replicators now, even in the show. In the first episode they appeared, it was established that they were the Asurans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asuran_%28Stargate%29) and not related to the replicators from our Galaxy.

This is going to get might confusing soon for the casual viewer.

[balboa dave]

I noticed everyone's been calling them replicators now, even in the show. In the first episode they appeared, it was established that they were the Asurans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asuran_%28Stargate%29) and not related to the replicators from our Galaxy.

This is going to get might confusing soon for the casual viewer.But it hasn't been established that they're not related. There's more discussion in this (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=311312) thread about the episode "Progeny."

[tai-pan]

Really? That's good because SG-1 was a cliffhanger too. Though I honestly thought it was the last episode so I didn't really care what happened.

[murgatroyd]

Now atlantis can have all the tech the Aurora class ship had to offer--namely a couple of ZMP's.

What's a Zed MP? ;)

(Sorry, couldn't resist.)

Jan

[Rob Helmerichs]

What's a Zed MP? ;)

(Sorry, couldn't resist.)

Jan
Well, see, there's this line of Military Police.

And Zed is the last guy in line.

Sheesh, Jan, get with the program! :D

[Anubys]

And when Sheppard and the thers retake Atlantis next season and rid it of Replicators (including those posing as Ancients) they will have all those ZPMs

every time they get something (ancient ship, for example), they manage to blow it up right away...so they can make it so the only way to retake Atlantis is by depleting all but one ZPM or something like that...

[Graymalkin]

They always got to be on the brink of disaster, don't they? Sigh.

[jking]

Same here... why else would the show the replicators in the "previously on" bit.

Replicators were still part of the show, even if they weren't posing as the Ancients, so it's perfectly reasonable that they would be on the "previously on" bit.

Personally I liked this episode better the first time when it was the SG-1 Season 1 finale... the team bucks orders and takes off rogue to do the job only they can do... blah, blah, blah. It would have been better if they had put in a scene explaining how dropping a nuke wouldn't work but the powers that be wouldn't listen to them, therefore giving the team a more legit reason to try to take back Atlantis on their own.

[Sherminator]

Same here... why else would the show the replicators in the "previously on" bit.For that reason and to remind you that they still exist for the last half of the show.

[IndyJones1023]

Same here... why else would the show the replicators in the "previously on" bit.
I thought it was to remind the audience that there are new replicators that have been established in the Pegasus galaxy. Especially since SG-1 and the Jafa destroyed ALL the replicators in our galaxy.

[mrpantstm]

Personally I liked this episode better the first time when it was the SG-1 Season 1 finale... the team bucks orders and takes off rogue to do the job only they can do... blah, blah, blah. It would have been better if they had put in a scene explaining how dropping a nuke wouldn't work but the powers that be wouldn't listen to them, therefore giving the team a more legit reason to try to take back Atlantis on their own.

I was gonna say, someone else must think this was SG Atlantis version of 'Within the Serpent's Grasp'? I mean, it's almost a copy and paste with the respective characters and crises being changed.

1) Get kicked out of Atlantis / SGC being closed down.
2) Don black ops gear.
3) Sneak onto heavily fortified alien ship (since technically Atlantis is a ship) with no real plan except to go kick ass.
4) ???
5) Profit!! errr season finale!!

People get paid to write these episodes?

On the other hand, it was a good midseason finale and the next episode should be good since Atlantis seems to always get more screwed over than SG1 ever did.

Oh yeah, why are all Ancients such jerks?

'Hi, we saved you/unlocked you from your induced slumber/whatever.'

'Yeah, thanks. Anywho, gtfo of our base apes.'

:rolleyes: jerks :mad:

:D :p

I really :rolleyes: when they said 'oh they can stop the replicators with a command in their base code.' I thought the replicators had said they had gotten around that or at least they'd be prepared for it. Really weakest part of the episode to me.

[Anubys]

I thought it was to remind the audience that there are new replicators that have been established in the Pegasus galaxy. Especially since SG-1 and the Jafa destroyed ALL the replicators in our galaxy.

the small expedition of replicators that went to explore a nearby galaxy survived...hence, the replicators from our galaxy have not been eradicated...

what expedition, you say? never heard of it?

sure, but the writers can easily come up with that, IMO... ;)

[PJO1966]

I think I just realized I didn't finish watching the show... doh!

[ihatecable]

I was gonna say, someone else must think this was SG Atlantis version of 'Within the Serpent's Grasp'?Ditto!

[Sirius Black]

I thought the replicators from our galaxy were 'toys' of that female human form replicator(?). The Atlantis replicators have a different origin story (built by the Ancients).

and the comparison to In the Serpents Grasp is right on the mark. I think the end result may be different, however. I like the idea of a surviving Ancient to help McKay realize he isnt' as smart as he thinks he is.

[jeetkunedo]

I thought the replicators from our galaxy were 'toys' of that female human form replicator(?). The Atlantis replicators have a different origin story (built by the Ancients).
The replicator "bugs" in the Milky Way were created as toys by an android who was created by an ancient. Those bugs then evolved into human-form replicators with the benefit of thousands of years in the time-bubble created by the Asguard.

The human-form replicators in Pegasus were built by the ancients as well. :)

[Sirius Black]

The replicator "bugs" in the Milky Way were created as toys by an android who was created by an ancient. Those bugs then evolved into human-form replicators with the benefit of thousands of years in the time-bubble created by the Asguard.

The human-form replicators in Pegasus were built by the ancients as well. :)

Does anyone find it odd that all the super-advanced 1000s of years ahead of us civilizations are responsible for some of the most dangerous technology and creatures being unleashed upon the galaxy.

The Asguard did the time bubble which made them indirectly responsible for the human-form replicators but the replicators wouldn't have existed in the first place if it weren't for the Ancients. The Ancients were responsible for the wraith. The only "advanced" civilization that are thus far not dangerous are the Nox.

[IndyJones1023]

Does anyone find it odd that all the super-advanced 1000s of years ahead of us civilizations are responsible for some of the most dangerous technology and creatures being unleashed upon the galaxy.
Kinda like humans on Earth, huh?

[Sirius Black]

Kinda like humans on Earth, huh?

Not quite on the same scale but I suppose because all of those races are, their cores, 'human', that's true.

I think my point was, however, I would have expected a super advanced civilization to have evolved beyond meddling with genetics (Wraith) or being arrogant about technology (replicators). I've read way too much Michael Crichton.

[mrpantstm]

Not quite on the same scale but I suppose because all of those races are, their cores, 'human', that's true.

I think my point was, however, I would have expected a super advanced civilization to have evolved beyond meddling with genetics (Wraith) or being arrogant about technology (replicators). I've read way too much Michael Crichton.

Just because they are super advanced does not keep them from falling victim to hubris. :)

[MickeS]

Not quite on the same scale but I suppose because all of those races are, their cores, 'human', that's true.

I think my point was, however, I would have expected a super advanced civilization to have evolved beyond meddling with genetics (Wraith) or being arrogant about technology (replicators). I've read way too much Michael Crichton.

Or watch too much Star Trek. :) Based on human history, where many if not most technological advances have been made in order to create better ways to kill people, I'd say that the more advanced a civilization is, the more likely they are to have created more advanced technology to destroy others too. :)

[Jonathan_S]

I guess Robert Picardo and RDA were still in Vancouver from the "200" shoot so they wrote them into this one. :D

So the Ancients didn't request their puddle jumper back?

How long did it take in the pilot episode for them to gate from the SGC to Atlantis? 30 minutes using Rodney's gate-pipe macro seems long.
Since they used a ZPM for the evac from Atlantis to Earth, presumably they didn't take a jumper for that run. (Unlikely that the Ancients would let them take one.)

Presumably the X-302s that were stationed in the jumper bay got shoved aboard the Daedalus before it pulled out with the bulk of the supplies.

So that jumper on earth was either one that was taken there earlier, either by flying it through the gate, or loading it onto the Daedalus. Or it was SG-1's time jumper with the time travel engine pulled out for separate analysis. Even though it probably doesn't matter, I kind of wonder which it was.

Right, but time would have to pass while in transit each leg. Gate 1 would dial Gate 2 and send the travellers; Gate 2 would receive the travellers; shut down the incoming wormhole from gate 1, dial Gate 3, and pass on the travellers; etc.

Presumably, the incoming wormhole at SG Command would contain a gate code as well so the iris wouldn't engage.
Still, that would make me nervous. Normally the SGC can confirm to the offworld team that the Iris is open. But with the bridge, the people are already on the way long before the last link to Earth establishes and the GDO asks the SGC to open the iris.

I suppose that the macro could code for the penultimate gate to rematerialize the travelers if the SGC doesn't sends a confirmation. But since they were talking about doing this without ships, that would be pretty hard on the travelers. :D
I suppose that gate could try to keep them in the buffer, but how long can they stay in the buffer without a problem?

What happens in someone else dials in to earth and blocks the bridge from completing. Again, you either need to hold in buffer or rematerialize in deep space. Ouch.

And don't even think about what would happen if you accidentally got two groups trying to cross one segment of the bridge in opposite directions. (I suppose the midpoint station is close enough to both Atlantis and Earth to receive FTL communication from them, and they could use that to ensure that you didn't try to have people coming and going through the same gates at the same time).

But that bridge is just an ugly, scary, hack that seems really dangerous to use.


And incidentally, when worried about the replicators using the bridge, why wasn't one of the X-303 battlecruisers directed to pick up one or more of the gates? Breaking the bridge would ensure that the replicators couldn't use it; but it could be fixed later by replacing the missing gate.

[MickeS]

Why does every thread about this show always have to turn into a discussion about how the stargates work? :D

[jeetkunedo]

Not quite on the same scale but I suppose because all of those races are, their cores, 'human', that's true.

I think my point was, however, I would have expected a super advanced civilization to have evolved beyond meddling with genetics (Wraith) or being arrogant about technology (replicators). I've read way too much Michael Crichton.
When I was watching this, I couldn't help thinking that almost every advanced civilization in SG has been a victim of their own arrogance. The Gua'uld with Humans, the Tolans with Gua'uld, the Ancients with Wraith, the Asguard with Replicators.... have I forgotten anyone? ;)

[Tangent]

To avoid the smashing of faces against a closed iris, maybe the macro doesn't engage each gate sequentially as the traveller arrives at each one. Maybe it starts a cascade dialing sequence and then signals the "OK to transit" only after the last wormhole is established and an "Iris open" signal is received.

[drew2k]

To avoid the smashing of faces against a closed iris, maybe the macro doesn't engage each gate sequentially as the traveller arrives at each one. Maybe it starts a cascade dialing sequence and then signals the "OK to transit" only after the last wormhole is established and an "Iris open" signal is received.The entire bridge journey is 30 minutes, and a Stargate can maintain a stable wormhole for 35 minutes, I believe. Doesn't leave much margin for delays at the mid-point station if the traveler has to wait for confirmation that the iris is down before commencing on the trip.

[Rob Helmerichs]

Also, each incoming wormhole has to be disconnected before an outgoing wormhole can be established. So it has to be one gate at a time.

[Tangent]

Whoops, that's right. Maybe the macro is set so the last gate before the SGC or Atlantis checks for an "iris open" signal and if it doesn't get one it sends the traveller back up the line to the midway station.

[Rob Helmerichs]

But again, the last gate would have to shut down its incoming wormhole (thus dumping the passengers out in space) before re-opening an outgoing wormhole back towards the station.

The simplest solution would be to program the SGC gate to lock the iris open when it gets the incoming code from the Pegasus station.

[mrpantstm]

The traveler is stored in the "buffer" for however long the writers need. :D :p

[Anubys]

The traveler is stored in the "buffer" for however long the writers need. :D :p

no, the buffer degrades within about 48 hours or until a new wormhole is established...

don't you know ANYTHING? :rolleyes:

:D :D :p

[drew2k]

So anyway ... How are the stargates along the bridge powered?

[jking]

So anyway ... How are the stargates along the bridge powered?

Probably the same way that normal gates in orbit of a planet are powered. I seem to remember something said in the first ep or two of Atlantis, when they first discovered the space gates, that they gather power from space somehow. I don't know, whatever the writers felt at the time was as good of an explanation as any. ;) Anyway, that still doesn't explaing how the more primitive Milky Way gates use the "power of space" :rolleyes: , and I believe I remember them mentioning in this ep that some of the gates for the bridge were gathered from the Milky Way.

And incidentally, when worried about the replicators using the bridge, why wasn't one of the X-303 battlecruisers directed to pick up one or more of the gates? Breaking the bridge would ensure that the replicators couldn't use it; but it could be fixed later by replacing the missing gate.

Upon the return of the Ancients, Atlantis now has enough Z(ed)PM power to be able to dial Earth without the need to use the bridge.

[mrpantstm]

Anyway, that still doesn't explaing how the more primitive Milky Way gates use the "power of space" :rolleyes:

What I find interesting is the Ancients didn't build space gates in the milky way galaxy although they were clearly able to in the pegasus galaxy. Why does it seem like when the Ancients came to the milky way they took a big technological step backwards?

Or did the Asgard, Tolans, Nox and Furlings take all the good stuff when the Ancients ascended? :D

(or maybe the SG FX team said, you know what would be cool, putting a gate in space. Just floating there. And other neat stuff. We can do that now.)

[busyba]

Anybody notice who the poor schlub in the jumper was that Shepard zatted?

It was Siler.

Why does stuff like that always happen to him? :D ;)

[Sirius Black]

So anyway ... How are the stargates along the bridge powered?

They are powered by that great and mysterious thing known as "exposition". :)

I think the best explanation for the Carter-McKay Bridge is that "it works because McKay and Carter says it works". It goes back to that great and mysterious thing...

[Rob Helmerichs]

What I find interesting is the Ancients didn't build space gates in the milky way galaxy although they were clearly able to in the pegasus galaxy. Why does it seem like when the Ancients came to the milky way they took a big technological step backwards?
They had already built a fully-developed gate system in the Milky Way (before they went to Pegasus in the first place). They didn't need to build more gates. (Those suckers were built to LAST...)

[IndyJones1023]

So anyway ... How are the stargates along the bridge powered?
Nahquada (sp?) generators.

[mrpantstm]

They had already built a fully-developed gate system in the Milky Way (before they went to Pegasus in the first place). They didn't need to build more gates. (Those suckers were built to LAST...)

So it was the other way around, the Ancients started on Earth (or at least the Milky Way galaxy), went to Pegasus, started the wraith and than came back to Earth?

[classicX]

So it was the other way around, the Ancients started on Earth (or at least the Milky Way galaxy), went to Pegasus, started the wraith and than came back to Earth?

Yes.

And suffice it to say, the space gates used in the bridge are quite possibly old space gates from the Pegasus galaxy, which is why they work in the milky way galaxy.

[Jonathan_S]

But again, the last gate would have to shut down its incoming wormhole (thus dumping the passengers out in space) before re-opening an outgoing wormhole back towards the station.

The simplest solution would be to program the SGC gate to lock the iris open when it gets the incoming code from the Pegasus station.
Which opens up a 15 minute race condition vulnerability* since anybody in the Milky Way could dial in to Earth during that time and the Iris would be locked open.

Even if they just locked the iris open just before the expected time that still creates a smaller race condition, eventually someone would manage to dial in just before the macro tries from the last gate.

* (McKay said it was 30 minutes one way, so it should be about 15 from the midpoint station)

[Rob Helmerichs]

And suffice it to say, the space gates used in the bridge are quite possibly old space gates from the Pegasus galaxy, which is why they work in the milky way galaxy.
They used Pegasus gates for the Pegasus half of the run, and Milky Way gates for the Milky Way half. The implication is that the two systems are not compatible (although that doesn't explain why they can gate from SGC to Atlantis with just an extra symbol, supposedly because of the distance).

[mrpantstm]

Do the gates in the bridge necessarily have to be in space? Once in the milky way galaxy a traveler could gate to a gate on a world.

I suppose the reason to keep them in space is to keep someone from using the gate while the macro is going a la the race condition Jonathan_S mentioned.

[bonscott87]

I can see the 3rd series now...

Stargate: Midpoint Station 9

:D

[mrpantstm]

On the matter of the replicators.

So Jack used the Ancient knowledge to forge a weapon to defeat the replicators by interfering with their frequency. But in the pegasus galaxy the Ancient's decided to just bomb them?

And isn't the SGA team going into Atlantis on a wing and a pray? The weapon might take out one or two but wouldn't they defeat the weapon as the replicators in the milky way did? Or did those replicators only defeat it because they had absorbed Sam?

[Jonathan_S]

I can see the 3rd series now...

Stargate: Midpoint Station 9

:D
You mean a show where the station commander is constantly worried about a threat coming through the wormhole from the gamma quadrant pegasus galaxy?

:D

[Rob Helmerichs]

Do the gates in the bridge necessarily have to be in space? Once in the milky way galaxy a traveler could gate to a gate on a world.

I suppose the reason to keep them in space is to keep someone from using the gate while the macro is going a la the race condition Jonathan_S mentioned.
The bridge covers the space between the galaxies, where there are no planets. Once it gets to the Milky Way, it can go to SGC as easily as any other gate.

[mcdougll]

I can see the 3rd series now...

Stargate: Midpoint Station 9

:D

Soon to be followed by the 4th series, the much anticipated

Stargate Academy


:D

[WinBear]

Soon to be followed by the 4th series, the much anticipated

Stargate Academy


:D

You never saw Stargate Infinity (http://www.gateworld.net/infinity/)?

[busyba]

Yes.

And suffice it to say, the space gates used in the bridge are quite possibly old space gates from the Pegasus galaxy, which is why they work in the milky way galaxy.
Actually, if you look closely at the two gates at the midpoint station, the one on the Pegasus side was clearly one of the "new" Atlantis gates and the one on the Milky Way side was on of the "classic" SG-1 gates. I'm guessing all the gates on the Pegasus half of the bridge are the new ones and all the ones on the Milky Way half are the old ones.


ETA: Meh! I smeeked. :(

[busyba]

Soon to be followed by the 4th series, the much anticipated

Stargate Academy


:D
No, that's the 6th series. The 4th is one where an X404 gets stranded in another galaxy and has to work it's way back, and the 5th series is all about how Ra was overthrown back in Ancient Egypt. ;)

[Jonathan_S]

<Random thought>
When Weir is distracting Doctor Lee (so McKay can add himself to the access list for the Jumper) Dr. Lee says that his WoW mage is level 75.
I thought World of Warcraft topped out at level 60.
I wonder if the error was deliberate...
</Random thought>

[WinBear]

<Random thought>
When Weir is distracting Doctor Lee (so McKay can add himself to the access list for the Jumper) Dr. Lee says that his WoW mage is level 75.
I thought World of Warcraft topped out at level 60.
I wonder if the error was deliberate...
</Random thought>

He did mention having some sort of advanced copy of an expansion or something. I did notice this, but not being an active WoW player, I just kind of giggled at the whole thing like a good little fanboy.

[dylking]

He did mention having some sort of advanced copy of an expansion or something. I did notice this, but not being an active WoW player, I just kind of giggled at the whole thing like a good little fanboy.
So, we know this is set in the "near future", since burning crusades isn't out yet. What he said was that he was in the beta, so he had an edge (and could PL to 75 when it came out).

Yeah, I'm a gaming geek. I had to laugh at "what's your race? Mage." tho :)

[TreborPugly]

Do the gates in the bridge necessarily have to be in space? Once in the milky way galaxy a traveler could gate to a gate on a world.

I suppose the reason to keep them in space is to keep someone from using the gate while the macro is going a la the race condition Jonathan_S mentioned.

The string of stargates is in the VAST distance between galaxies. There's lots more space between the galaxies than the entire diameter of either galaxy. So they gathered up some stargates and strung them in a line between the galaxies. The first step is getting from Alantis to a gate out on the edge of the Pegasus galaxy, and the last step is getting from a gate out on the edge of the Milky Way in to earth.

So yeah, short answer is all the bridge gates have to be in outer space. There are no planets in the space between galaxies.

[ihatecable]

I think to rephrase his question would be can't a traveler going the last intergalactic gate go to another planet in the Milky Way before going to earth. I think the answer is yes but they opted to go to Earth because at SGC they can close the iris and not let any wraith or any other bad guys get though to the Milky Way

[Sirius Black]

<Random thought>
When Weir is distracting Doctor Lee (so McKay can add himself to the access list for the Jumper) Dr. Lee says that his WoW mage is level 75.
I thought World of Warcraft topped out at level 60.
I wonder if the error was deliberate...
</Random thought>


I assumed he was playing in the expansion beta (which hasn't started yet in a wide release way) but then he said he was a level 75 mage but the level cap in the expansion is 70.

[Sherminator]

They used Pegasus gates for the Pegasus half of the run, and Milky Way gates for the Milky Way half. The implication is that the two systems are not compatible (although that doesn't explain why they can gate from SGC to Atlantis with just an extra symbol, supposedly because of the distance).The explanation is that only the Earth and Atlantis gates have a compatibility layer which allows the wormhole to form between them.

[Sirius Black]

I thought the extra symbol to dial from Earth to Atlantis was like, as the show puts it, dialing a different area code. The 8th symbol is which galaxy you are dialing. I think this was mentioned on the first episode where Jack downloads the ancient archive into his brain and mentioned again in the "pre-pilot" for Atlantis.

[Rob Helmerichs]

I thought the extra symbol to dial from Earth to Atlantis was like, as the show puts it, dialing a different area code. The 8th symbol is which galaxy you are dialing. I think this was mentioned on the first episode where Jack downloads the ancient archive into his brain and mentioned again in the "pre-pilot" for Atlantis.
I suppose it's possible that dialing from one system to the other requires ZPM-level power regardless of the actual distance...

[Frankenstien]

When talking to Elizabeth, Shepard gives a quote "Life isn't fair, except in death." He attributes the quote to the Princess Bride.

I don't remember that one from the movie. Was he referring to the book?

[classicX]

When talking to Elizabeth, Shepard gives a quote "Life isn't fair, except in death." He attributes the quote to the Princess Bride.

I don't remember that one from the movie. Was he referring to the book?

The quote was from the book, but if it is as you quoted it, it is inaccurate.

"Life isn't fair. It's just fairer than death, that's all." -
William Goldman

[Frankenstien]

Thanks! :up:

[Anubys]

The quote was from the book, but if it is as you quoted it, it is inaccurate.

"Life isn't fair. It's just fairer than death, that's all." -
William Goldman

they wrote a book from the movie?! :eek:

:D

[marrone]

The explanation is that only the Earth and Atlantis gates have a compatibility layer which allows the wormhole to form between them.
There was an episode (probably season 1) where they found a planet that had all sorts of energy, and tried to gate back to earth, but wound up falling asleep, since the energy was life forms, and by dialing so far, it used up too much energy (ie it killed the life forms). So the atlantis expedition decided not to try to use the gate anymore (in return for their lives).

So it stands to reason that any gate is capable...it just needs the power.

-Mike

[marrone]

I'm curious as to why the Atlantis expedition didn't try to take the city back initially...I mean, they had a bunch of armed guards there...why didn't they start shooting the ancients?

-Mike

[Stormspace]

I'm curious as to why the Atlantis expedition didn't try to take the city back initially...I mean, they had a bunch of armed guards there...why didn't they start shooting the ancients?

-Mike

Primarily because the ancients have the knowledge behind the technology on Atlantis, and it technically belongs to them. Rather than alienate the ancients and cut off all possiblity of getting that knowledge, the SGA wisely backed off.

[classicX]

There was an episode (probably season 1) where they found a planet that had all sorts of energy, and tried to gate back to earth, but wound up falling asleep, since the energy was life forms, and by dialing so far, it used up too much energy (ie it killed the life forms). So the atlantis expedition decided not to try to use the gate anymore (in return for their lives).

So it stands to reason that any gate is capable...it just needs the power.

-Mike

Ha! I totally forgot about that episode? Did those "life forms" have a species name? Furlings, anyone?

[marrone]

Episode is here (http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/109.shtml)

No mention of the mist-like creatures' race name. But there is a mention of a control crystal that is needed to make the DHD compatible to dial the milky-way galaxy. Not sure why that's needed.

-Mike

[classicX]

Episode is here (http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/109.shtml)

No mention of the mist-like creatures' race name. But there is a mention of a control crystal that is needed to make the DHD compatible to dial the milky-way galaxy. Not sure why that's needed.

-Mike

The control crystal is the AT&T Long Distance service. :D

IMO, It probably enables the 8th chevron, which they need to dial other galaxies.

[Stormspace]

The control crystal is the AT&T Long Distance service. :D

IMO, It probably enables the 8th chevron, which they need to dial other galaxies.

Not to be a pain or anything, :) but I'm certain the SG-1 gate doesn't have any crystals. A difference in Milky Way gates and Pegasus gates perhaps? That control crystal thing wasn't thought out very well.

[busyba]

Think of each galaxy's stargate network as a computer LAN. All traffic on the LAN can get out to the WAN only through a single computer which is the server to the WAN. The only way two different LAN's can communicate is between the server on each LAN that is connected to the WAN.

The ancients configured the stargate network in each galaxy to only be able to make inter-galactic connections between the Earth stargate and the Atlantis stargate. Note that even in the intergalactic stargate bridge they would still have to travel by foot (by jumper, really) to go from one network to the other.

Now, how exactly this was implemented wasn't really explained. It probably involved Heisenberg Compensators or Intertial Dampeners or something like that. :D

[IndyJones1023]

Tachyon fields. Maybe particles or bursts, but definitely tachyons.

[Jonathan_S]

Not to be a pain or anything, :) but I'm certain the SG-1 gate doesn't have any crystals.True, since the crystal is normally in the DHD, but the SGC's gate uses the dialing computer rather than a DHD.

[Stormspace]

True, since the crystal is normally in the DHD, but the SGC's gate uses the dialing computer rather than a DHD.

And here I was thinking it was just a matter of power. Cuz when Oneil made it dial the Asgard world it was just a matter of pushing enough energy into the gate with a naquida generator. Notice they haven't duplicated that for the SGA to get back from Pegasus or vice versa. :)

[classicX]

And here I was thinking it was just a matter of power. Cuz when Oneil made it dial the Asgard world it was just a matter of pushing enough energy into the gate with a naquida generator. Notice they haven't duplicated that for the SGA to get back from Pegasus or vice versa. :)

He did something to their dialing computer as well, if you recall.

[myriadian]

bahahahahahaha i love that someone suggested that they should have shot up the ancients when they took over the city!!! that is awesome!!!

but look, if the ancient lady can raise her hand and a console rises out of the floor that no one knew was there and suddenly she is in control of atlantis......i doubt shooting them would really be an option. i'm sure the city would react and obliterate the humans.

i can't believe that anyone would think it's a good idea to leave the holographic doctor there as liaison to earth. he's an annoying little noodle.

M.