What’s the point of DirectTV and Dish? Especially for TiVo users?

[Puppy76]

I’ve been curious about this for some time. Why do so many seem to use DirectTV? What’s the point? At least in my area, cable is cheaper, installation is easier (with no extra hardware needed), and you can use dual tuner Tivos. Satelite you’re pretty much locked in to just recording one show at a time on your Tivo.

DirectTV had that “DirectTiVo”, but as near as I can tell that’s being phased out, and even if not, it doesn’t support modern (for me must have) features like TiVo to Go.

So what’s the selling point? You get to pay roughly the same (or more in some areas). You have to have a dish. And you can’t use dual tuner Tivos…what a deal?

What am I missing?

[ZeoTiVo]

I don't know myself - I use extended basic cable because it is simple, works and instead of the extra cost to go digital I joined netflix for movies.

but here, you will need one of these
http://img.alibaba.com/photo/50345308/Permanent_Flame_Retardant_Coveralls.jpg

[Puppy76]

LOL! Yeah, I don't mean to be rude, I just seriously don't get what the appeal is. When it was first announced I assumed it would be cheaper than cable, which would have been cool. Now that I *NEED* Tivo, and *NEED* dual tuners, I don't see how satellite is feasable.

[Stanley Rohner]

DIRECTV is cheaper than cable TV for most people. A friend of mine at work told me it would cost him $16 more per month if he wanted to add HBO to his COMCAST service. If you have DIRECTV it's only $12 more per month. If you have multiple premium services with DIRECTV the cost is even less to add another premium service.

You can still buy DIRECTIVOs if you look hard enough. DIRECTV also has it's own non-TiVo DVR with dual tuners.

With DIRECTV you aren't forced to rent the receiver box like cable tv makes you do. Directv recently switched to a leased equipment program but I'm not sure how it works. I've had my receivers for about 10 years now and I've never had any trouble with any of them.

Satellite service has always been 100% digital quality.
It took cabletv about 10 years or so to catch up.

I don't really give a rip about being able to transfer programs between DVRs, transfer programs to a PC, or view digital pictures on my TV thru my TiVo

[xnevergiveinx]

satellite has been able to record 2 things at once for a while now.

in my area, satellite costs more and i'm not cool with the outages because it's raining etc.
i'm happy with my cable

[JoeyJoJo]

1) DIRECTV is cheaper where I am.
2) DIRECTV Tivos have been dual tuner for years, Standalone 2 days and counting.
3) Adelphia CS and PQ is awful compared to DTV where I live.
4) With some simple hacks you can have all the media features of a standalone.

YMMV

[bigpuma]

For me I switched to DirecTV as soon as I could. The cable company where I live was horrible and was more expensive. When I got a DirecTivo 3 years ago I couldn't be happier. I don't care about HMO or Tivo to go. I would probably use them if available but it's just not a big deal and dual tuners are a must now. I would be annoyed going back to a single tuner DVR.

That being said DirecTV is becoming less useful as they are moving away from TiVo software. I very well may move back to cable in the next year or so, especially with the series 3 coming out. It all depends on how the new HD MPeg-4 DVR works on DirecTV and what my local cable company offers.

[Olde Fortran]

Satellite is much cheaper for the same (almost) lineup of channels than the local cable company. ($35 vs $49 for cable.)

However, the real kicker was the day I bought the TiVo. My noisy mostly analog cable looked AWFUL after TiVo compressed and decompressed it. I couldn't stand it! I had to switch to an all digital service to get a TiVo'd picture that I could tolerate - after having the cable guys come out several times and listening to them tell me it was all TiVo's fault. Well admittedly it was partially TiVo's fault but it degrades a clean digital source far less.

Installation was $0. There's always some special going on if you look around. It's also more reliable. I've never had an outage.

What's this can't use a Dual Tuner TiVo nonsense? For the last several years the ONLY way to use a dual tuner TiVo was on direcTV. Later this year, the series 3 will catch cable up. For now, there's just the stopgap dual tuner series 2. And that has only existed for a couple of days so it obviously hasn't impacted service choices to any measurable degree yet

[Lee L]

I have DirecTv.

For years, the cable here sucked and was not cheaper than satellite. Over the years, they improved their system and it is decent now. However, for the same channel line up, it is still not cheaper, plus Time Warner here in Raleigh does not have Bravo.

Many also like NFL Season ticket which is only available over DirecTV.

I have 2 high definition DirecTiVo units, something that you cannot get anywhere now and have not been able to get for the past 2 years. When teh Series 3 comes out that will no longer be the case. I would love to have MRV but I want to record HD more so until Series 3, there is no choice yet.

I never need to worry about if my cable box IR blinker worked or if they updated the box and the serial connection died. Also, no need to worry about what quality, it records right off the satellite stream.

[Stanley Rohner]

satellite has been able to record 2 things at once for a while now.

in my area, satellite costs more and i'm not cool with the outages because it's raining etc.
i'm happy with my cable

if you're having outages whenever it rains your dish is not properly aligned.
it rained Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and Monday in my area and the satellite service never went out once. It normally only goes out during a very heavy downpour.

[bigpuma]

i'm not cool with the outages because it's raining etc.
i'm happy with my cable

I guess it depends on where you live but in the 4.5 years I have had DirecTV it has never once gone out. On the other hand back when I had cable it would go out once or twice a year for a few hours. Now I did have an especially bad cable company, at least I hope I did.

[phox_mulder]

I have 2 TiVo's that can record 2 things at the same time,
one that can record 2 High Definition programs at the same time.
I can record HBO and Showtime at the same time, or Showtime HD and HBO HD at the same time.

Show me someone that can do this with one box via cable.
Last I heard, you needed a TiVo connected to a digital cable box and you could record one thing at a time.
If you wanted to record something else, you had to get another TiVo,
if the channel was digital (HBO or SHO), you had to get another digital cable box, now you have 4 boxes sitting next to your TV just to record 2 programs at once.

Local (non HD) channels from DirecTV look better than I can get them from an antenna, and better than I've seen at neighbors houses that have cable.

Right now, I couldn't live without DirecTV.

This could change with the Series 3.


phox

[atmuscarella]

For the most part it depends on where you live on how much of what you said is true. Regarding the new Series 2 DT - it is brand new so up to this point it was not a factor in picking cable over satellite. In my area:


My friends with cable have quality problems I don't have with dishnetwork
Basic cable cost $15-20 a month more than dishnetwork's basic package (without locals and with 1 dual tuner receiver).
OTA reception is very good so not having locals from satellite is fine


And then there are also plenty of people (like myself) that live where cable isn't available.

So it really comes down to where you live and what you want if cable or satellite is the better deal for someone.

Thanks,

atmuscarella

[durl]

In my area, satellite is less expensive and, from what I've seen while at friend's houses, has better PQ than cable.

Around here, cable bills go up pretty much every year. As best I can tell, a friend of mine pays about $65 for what I can get for $45.

[Guindalf]

My cable company wouldn't know what a DVR was if it came up and bit them on the nose!

If you need more, they have no HD at all. They have poor quality analog basic and extended channels and don't become digital until you get their STB, which only has one output. They are more expensive for the same programming. only some of the locals and some of the digitals are even in stereo. In a nutshell, they suck!

I have no choice but to have satellite. I have dual tuners (three receivers, so I can record up to six show at once), High def (locals to come with MPEG-4 later), PPV movies, stereo everything and a PQ that, while maybe not perfect, is a DARN sight better than the local cableco's offering!

[bigcat]

In my area, satellite is less expensive and, from what I've seen while at friend's houses, has better PQ than cable.

Around here, cable bills go up pretty much every year. As best I can tell, a friend of mine pays about $65 for what I can get for $45.

Interesting that it seems cable costs are different around the country for the same service, sounds like a monoply problem to me! I my area cable would be 50% more for the same lineup as Dish.

[Gene Jockey]

When I moved here, I signed up with the local cable company. Then when I went to sign up for NHL Centre Ice so I could watch all the Red Wings games, they didn't have it. So a few days later, I was on DirecTV. Coupled with my two dual-tuner DirecTivos, I never miss a game and can always catch Hockey Night In Canada.

If my local cable company upgrades so I can get HD locals through them, I would probably switch back and get an S3 Tivo.

[tazzftw]

You do realize that DirecTiVos have had dual tuners for quite a long time now, and that the regular DTs have officially been out for...... 2 days.

[moyekj]

You do realize that DirecTiVos have had dual tuners for quite a long time now, and that the regular DTs have officially been out for...... 2 days. And the DT quality is worse since it only accepts analog inputs which it then must re-encode to digital as opposed to DirectTivos not needing to re-encode. I don't understand the appeal of the DT units at all - wait until S3 at this point.

[TiVoPony]

I personally dropped DIRECTV a few months ago. Basic cable with a DT box makes a very nice solution in my house...it's more TV than we can watch. And the DT has all of the networking features as well.

We're Blockbuster subscribers too...so we have all the movies we need, right down the street.

Of course, when I dropped DIRECTV they asked me why I was leaving (I'd been a long-time customer). They then explained that they had this new box that did everything a TiVo did...and more. Did you know that their new non-TiVo DVR is the only one with a "Season Pass Manager"? Or that only the new non-TiVo box can record two things at once, even while you're watching a recording? Neither did I! :rolleyes:

The call got even more interesting when they asked me what a TiVo box could do that their new box can't. He didn't know who he was asking. :D

In the end...basic cable and TiVo DT in my house. :)

Pony

[gschrock]

For me it was pretty simple. At the time, the only way to get a dual tuner tivo was with directv. I got 3 of them for a total of $200 when I first signed up (3 years ago or so now I think). Standalone tivos weren't cost effective at the time (and I'd probably debate with whether they are now). At the time they would have been $200-$300 each at least, and then have a $10 monthy fee on top of it for EACH of them (I realize it's somewhat different now, and I didn't personally feel paying another $200-$300 for lifetime on each unit would have been reasonable). Directv charged 1 $10 fee covering all the tivos. Figure the extra receiver fee is a wash with digital cable box rental (Something that always pisses me off about cable commercials talking about extra receiver fees, THEY HAVE THE SAME THING!). Programming price was about even between cable and sat, although I think sat was slightly cheaper.

Also, the cable quality in my area was pretty pathetic. Analog channels would gain more static the higher the channel number was. Try watching hockey with a staticy screen. Channel choice was better with Directv, and cheaper (significantly). As far as outtages because of rain, well, I do sometimes get them, if it's a very heavy rainstorm. I'd say it happens a handfull of times a year. I've had cable outtages that last days, and for me at least up to that point, I'd say I'd expect at least a couple of significant cable outtages during any given year (as in for at least an hour or two). So for me at least, directv won that.

As far as the home media options, it's a complete non-issue for me. At best I've had a handul of times I'd have liked to have them. And if I really wanted the features I'd have wanted, I'd hack the tivo. I had one of the tivos hacked at one point, but didn't use it enough that at one point I got rid of the hacks.

Now, I'm not trying to say that satellite is the way for everyone. I haven't seen directv's new non-tivo dvr to have any opinion on it. Maybe some areas it's cheaper to have cable, especially if you bundle internet with it (I use dsl, so it's non-issue for me (and also find the cable anti-dsl ads very deceptive, my favorite is when they play modem connection sounds in them)). But up till now, you couldn't get two tuner tivo's, and I'm guessing even now, you're going to need two digital boxes if you want to record digital cable (will that even work? I don't know honestly). Personally, I feel that while tivo mostly develops good software, I find their pricing structure to be a tough sell these days (I'm not looking to get in an argument over that, there have been other threads where people have been hashing that out, it's just my *personal* opinion). I honestly have to admit, if I had to switch back to cable at this point, I'd probably give the cable company's dvr a try to see if it'd work well enough for me before I'd buy a tivo, simply because of cost.

Everyone has to weigh the options. Would I still make the same decision now as I did 3 years ago? Don't know, but if I didn't, I wouldn't guarantee I'd have a tivo at all. Might be a cable box. Might be a pc. But at this point, there's nothing compelling on the cable side to make me even consider switching. Maybe that'll change, maybe it won't.

[xnevergiveinx]

I guess it depends on where you live but in the 4.5 years I have had DirecTV it has never once gone out. On the other hand back when I had cable it would go out once or twice a year for a few hours. Now I did have an especially bad cable company, at least I hope I did.

then the dish at work must have not been installed correctly. if it rains a lot, the signal gets all digital choppy like
same thing with the music, that is satellite also, but a different system. it will just die if the weather gets bad

[Olde Fortran]

then the dish at work must have not been installed correctly.

Some people are sloppy. They'll just eyeball it and then lock it down after the first hint of a signal. Also, I've seen some dishes around here mounted to things that are obviously going to move over time. I've seen one in a tree and another one clamped to a gutter with a Vice Grip :D

[Lee L]

The call got even more interesting when they asked me what a TiVo box could do that their new box can't. He didn't know who he was asking. :D

In the end...basic cable and TiVo DT in my house. :)

Pony

That had to be a funny conversation!

[ZikZak]

I use Dish Network becuase they're much cheaper than cable, and the picture quality is far better. I already had my standalone when I decided to switch, so between Dish & DirecTV I chose Dish because I liked their channel lineup better.

[aztivo]

I can tell you that I droped D* about a month ago. For the same basice line up plus all the HD i only pay $52 a month that is about what it cost for just the TC now and no HD or HBO.. I do have 2 SA one life time that I am on my 3rd year of and one at 6.95 a month so it just makes more sence to go cabel plus I cant wait the the S3

[vertigo235]

That had to be a funny conversation!

Or not so funny, I guess it depends on who you are...

[jautor]

if you're having outages whenever it rains your dish is not properly aligned.
it rained Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and Monday in my area and the satellite service never went out once. It normally only goes out during a very heavy downpour.

For me, living in a sub-tropical environment like Houston, it's a great predictor of very heavy (read: 1+ inches/hour) rain. If the picture starts breaking up, the sky is going to let loose in about 5 minutes... Usually, the picture is back by the time it's really coming down! The worst I've seen it in 9 years was about a 20 minute outage. 5-10 minutes, 3-5 times per year I'd say is a fair number for my location.

But the really important point, which the cable bigots never mention - IT COMES BACK BY ITSELF!!!! :D I originally got DirecTV because the idiot cable co had disconnected my service by mistake (instead of my neighbor's), and it took them 4 days to get someone out to fix it - even though I diagnosed the problem for them.

But that said, I switched because the cable service was lousy in my area in 1997 - it's 'fine' now... And I certainly will be doing the comparisons again once the Series3 comes out.

Jeff

[lew]

Directv has the NFL ticket, is cheaper than many cable systems and many of us still have two tuner DTivos.

Cable companies are now offering dual tuner DVRs. They offer bundle pricing with phone and internet. They tend to have less expensive HD offerings than DTV.

I suspect DTV is going to start losing subscribers.

[ddockery]

For me it's simple. In order of importance to me

1) DirecTV has the MLB package, cable does not
2) Dual tuners (I've had my DirecTiVo for about 4 years i think)
3) Just recently (for me) HD TiVo
4) Picture looks better than TiVo'd cable
5) DirecTV is cheaper

Lately, the prices have come closer together, but unless my cable company picks up MLB (unlikely) and offers a massive DVR, I'm not changing any time soon. And frankly, while it sounds cool, I doubnt I'd use Tivo To Go etc much. If I really want it on my PC I'll get it there. n the future if the PCI DirecTV tunres become a reality, I may build my own DVR box.

[DavidO]

The call got even more interesting when they asked me what a TiVo box could do that their new box can't. He didn't know who he was asking. :D


You know when they say "they'll record this call for quality purposes," I really hope DTV executives could hear that conversation.

[peteypete]

I personally dropped DIRECTV a few months ago. Basic cable with a DT box makes a very nice solution in my house...it's more TV than we can watch. And the DT has all of the networking features as well.

We're Blockbuster subscribers too...so we have all the movies we need, right down the street.

Of course, when I dropped DIRECTV they asked me why I was leaving (I'd been a long-time customer). They then explained that they had this new box that did everything a TiVo did...and more. Did you know that their new non-TiVo DVR is the only one with a "Season Pass Manager"? Or that only the new non-TiVo box can record two things at once, even while you're watching a recording? Neither did I! :rolleyes:

The call got even more interesting when they asked me what a TiVo box could do that their new box can't. He didn't know who he was asking. :D

In the end...basic cable and TiVo DT in my house. :)

Pony

Pony that's hillarious! Did you ask, "well, does your new box pay me a salary, because then it would start to do some things Tivo does!"

I think basic cable with a DT Tivo would be a package for the non-digitally inclined, and I think it's really good that Tivo's going after that market big time.

[Tivo Basic Mike]

I personally dropped DIRECTV a few months ago. Basic cable with a DT box makes a very nice solution in my house...it's more TV than we can watch. And the DT has all of the networking features as well.

We're Blockbuster subscribers too...so we have all the movies we need, right down the street.

Of course, when I dropped DIRECTV they asked me why I was leaving (I'd been a long-time customer). They then explained that they had this new box that did everything a TiVo did...and more. Did you know that their new non-TiVo DVR is the only one with a "Season Pass Manager"? Or that only the new non-TiVo box can record two things at once, even while you're watching a recording? Neither did I! :rolleyes:

The call got even more interesting when they asked me what a TiVo box could do that their new box can't. He didn't know who he was asking. :D

In the end...basic cable and TiVo DT in my house. :)

Pony

Like we expect you to say something good about Directv after what they did to Tivo. Come on Pony Just tell us what we all want to know WHEN (and not that second half stuff) THE SERIES 3 WILL BE RELEASED AND HOW MUCH IT WILL COST? :D

[Billy66]

Of course, when I dropped DIRECTV they asked me why I was leaving (I'd been a long-time customer). They then explained that they had this new box that did everything a TiVo did...and more. Did you know that their new non-TiVo DVR is the only one with a "Season Pass Manager"? Or that only the new non-TiVo box can record two things at once, even while you're watching a recording? Neither did I! :rolleyes:


Pony

Hi Mr. Pot, this is Mr. Kettle.

Your CSR's are known for misinforming at quite a high rate as well. :)

To the OP, dual tuners have been around for almost 6 years for us with Sat. That's all you need right there. Also, no quality settings to worry about, everything is recorded at source quality. That's close to 3-1 in hours. So a 100 hour Dtivo is equivalent to 300 hours of SA if you consider quality.

[FlWingNut]

I'm surprised nobody's pointed out the D* 5.99 DVR fee that covers all the DVRs in the house as a reason to stay with D* vs going to SA. Yes I know many of you have lifetime, but I've got three boxes with dual tuners, no loss of PQ, and pay only the mirror fee and the one DVR fee. It's an integrated solution which is still cheaper, with more channel choices, than I'd get from my horror of a cable company (Brighthouse).

[aztivo]

I guess PQ is all subjective because D* compresses the hell out of their PQ

[aus1ander]

I used Dish Network for 2 years. I subscribe to America's Top 60, which includes pretty much every channel I want except I don't get FX or Bravo. I pay 29.99/mo and get locals from my cable company (8 bucks/mo). For me, this is over 10/mo cheaper than my cable provider for the same service over analog cable, with a couple of extra channels I never watch. I own all my own equipment, which I paid up front for and received service credits for 15 months which made the equipment essentially free.

The lack of a DT to record multiple satellite channels at once is not a big deal for me. Since my locals are delivered by OTA analog, a DT Series 2 would resolve all the conflicts in the major network schedules. I'm not going to get a DT Series 2, though, since I already have two TiVos that work fine for me. The majority of cable shows re-air multiple times through the week, which automatically resolves almost all conflicts.

The one big-downside to satellite TV is maintaining the dish and equipment. If the installer does a crappy job of installing the dish, it can go out of alignment over time and getting it reoriented can be a pain. My dish was installed on a pole to clear the roof, and I had to tie it down with ropes to keep it from vibrating in the wind. Luckily the new place I'm moving to has a central dish and provides signal for both Directv and Dish Network.

I personally prefer Dish Network since they go out of their way to try to control subscription prices. Though the recently raised prices from 26.99 to 29.99 for the same service, they told existing customers that the new rates will be locked in for 3 years.

[FlWingNut]

I guess PQ is all subjective because D* compresses the hell out of their PQ

And is still better than analog cable...and let's not forget, if you run it thru a SA Tivo, it has to be encoded/decoded...

[BuckNakd2]

I had comcrap when I got my first Tivo. A sturdy and reliable series 2 that I'm still using today. But comcrap kept raising prices and dropping channels from their lineup (they follow the get less for more business model) so I was forced to search for an alternative. I tried digital cable but the pq was no better and the guide sucked! One third of the screen was a guide and the other two thirds was filled with advertisements. Again the comcrap business model, pay more for digital and get the pleasure of viewing ads.

When Tivo came out with an HD model my search was over. The HR10-250 had dual tuners, better pq, and that wonderful Tivo interface. Unfortunately though, the honeymoon ended a few months ago. Directv's lack of updates has made me begin to sour on my newfound love. The software is outdated and unbelievably slow! I've had frequent reboots and shows that appear in the now playing list but aren't there when I try to play them. I love my HD Tivo but I find myself justifying it's flaws when talking to family and friends.

I dread the thought of going back to comcrap but directv has fallen so low due to their indifference to HD Tivo users.

All I want is quality service with a reliable product! Is that too much to ask? Lets face it, we are willing to pay several hundred dollars for a decent dvr and some of us early adopters even paid $1,000. So is the $10 to $15 difference between cable, directv, and dish even an issue?

So which is the best? None of 'em! It's just a matter of choosing the lesser of the evils.

Verizon just signed a franchise agreement with my city last week so FIOS is coming soon. Maybe I'll give them a try. Maybe I'll wait for the series 3. Maybe I'll break out the aluminum foil and dust of the old rabbit ears. One thing's for sure, this will be an interesting year as the dust settles on all the options. I just hope there is a Tivo in my future.

[aztivo]

And is still better than analog cable...and let's not forget, if you run it thru a SA Tivo, it has to be encoded/decoded...
while this is true I am wondering what the satalite people will point to when the s3 comes out... BTW Digital records fine on the SA I will agree that analog sucks

[junebughunter]

I use DirecTV because

Comcast HD-DVR in one room and basic digital receivers in the other three rooms, with the Stars package and internet servce = $155 a month

DirecTV HD with more channels (I think it's called premium plus?), standalone TiVo, Clearwire internet and 3 extra receives = $100 a month, and only $50 a month for the first 3 months with all movie channels, installation was free, and I got a $100 rebate for the $99 HD receiver.



The actual HD picture is not as good as the Comcast HD picture on some of the HD channels, but the HDNET channels and DiscoveryHD look great all the time.


I was also extremely pissed off, when I ordered DirecTV they told me that HD local channels were available. I didn't find out until later that they were in fact not. This wasn't a simple mistake either, two sales reps explicitly told me they were available, one of which even went into telling me the channel number for each and every channel.

[Barryrod]

I still have signal during Hurricanes down here in S. Fl. the past couple of years...That is until power went out.

I did recently start losing signal every day, during the day. Did not matter too much except for weekends. Tried to re-align the duel LNB dish and could not get a signal higher than 70. I installed a new triple LNB dish and now all transponders are ~95+. I figure my LNB was dying and when heated during day it got worse????


Anyway....We had Cable here at the house when we bought it 8 yrs ago. 6months we lost cable. Called it in and waited. Next day call back to find tkt was closed. This went on every day for a week before they finally figured out the ticket were being closed as associated with scheduled outages in the area during fiber optic upgrades and they finally sent a tech out. Turns out the cable did not follow my fence line like it was surveyed to be...It diagonally crossed my backyard in the middle, and I was removing a stump in the middle of the yard. They ran new cable along fence line and buried it 2 WEKS LATER... When they did they found that the installed ran it over a root that protruded a bit and they left it exposed and you can guess what happened when I mowed.. Yep, ate it right up. They spliced it and I took a chainsaw and cut a trench in the root and all good. Cable quality was never great after that and I was fed up with the increases in price every 2-3 months so I got Dtv and never looked back.

[FlWingNut]

while this is true I am wondering what the satalite people will point to when the s3 comes out... BTW Digital records fine on the SA I will agree that analog sucks

By "satellite people" do you mean the people that use it, or the people that sell it? For my situation, I have no need, right now, for a S3. I don't have HD, I already have three dual-tuner DVRs (which I own) and I'm not paying Tivo's SA prices.

As for what the DBS companies might say...who knows? Let's see the thing actually hit the market first.

[bidger]

So what’s the selling point? You get to pay roughly the same (or more in some areas). You have to have a dish. And you can’t use dual tuner Tivos…what a deal?

What am I missing?
As others have informed you, dual tuners have been around on the D-TiVos for years. The $4.99/mo. DVR service charge was very attractive, now it's $5.99/mo., still less than half a SA TiVo. Unlike a 40 hr. SA which really only has about 11-14 hrs. capacity at Best or High recording quality, a D-TiVo only has one recording quality: Best, and if it says ~70 hrs., it's all at the best quality. You can record HD with DD5.1 now, rather than having to wait. That came in handy for me to see the final Season of "Arrested Development" in HD, along with the past NFL Season.

Here's the big clincher for me: the Lifetime Service I paid for on my 1st D-TiVo is on the account, not the unit as with SA TiVos. I've retired that unit and stepped up to S2 D-TiVo and the D* HD-TiVo because of that nifty fact. It wasn't a one-time transfer, it's there for as long as I'm a D* customer. Finally, I like the fact that the cartoonish aspects of TiVo are subdued on a D-TiVo.

I've used both S1 and S2 SAs and D-TiVos and I much prefer the D-TiVos. The only major advantage a SA offers, IMO, is the ability to record different inputs. For awhile I was enamored with the PC-to-TiVo transfer, but now that I have an MCE PC, the three hour process to change the one and half hour MST3K .avi eps to .mpeg and then dl them to the TiVo is a lot less appealing now that I can just rip them to "My Videos" in four minutes. I don't do MP3s or take a lot of digital photos, so those features are wasted on me. I don't have any portable devices, other than a CD player, so that's not a concern for me.

I'd really like TiVo to make their S3 announcements so I can decide if I want to follow or not. If TiVo is going to be able to offer some compelling content in HD, that might be enough to persuade me. But, IMO, they haven't been able to do that with SD content to this point, so maybe I'm asking too much. To my mind, that's when TiVo turns the corner, become more of a content provider. If I have to rely on satellite or cable for that, why would I pay TiVo $800 + $12.95/mo. to record that content when I can get a machine from my provider? Yeah, I'm aware of the "Mercedes/Ford" analogies, but that's lost on the average consumer.

[Olde Fortran]

while this is true I am wondering what the satalite people will point to when the s3 comes out... BTW Digital records fine on the SA I will agree that analog sucks

I guess I would point out that channels 0-99 - which is what I watch about 98% of the time are still analog on most cable systems and probably still will be by the time the S3 comes out. So, 98% of my viewing would, according to you, suck.

[Guindalf]

Like we expect you to say something good about Directv after what they did to Tivo. Come on Pony Just tell us what we all want to know WHEN (and not that second half stuff) THE SERIES 3 WILL BE RELEASED AND HOW MUCH IT WILL COST? :D

Do you REALLY expect an answer to this? If so, you're dumber than a brick! You're not going to get anything from Pony until his superiors say it's ok to release the information. So why bother to bug the heck out of the man? We'll find out when TiVo wants us to know and not before. Pony is just a human being working for a company. He and the other TiVo people help us out a LOT when we have problems, so don't they deserve to be able to come to this forum and join in without some blockhead asking the same old questions?

[TiVoPony]

Do you REALLY expect an answer to this? If so, you're dumber than a brick! You're not going to get anything from Pony until his superiors say it's ok to release the information. So why bother to bug the heck out of the man? We'll find out when TiVo wants us to know and not before. Pony is just a human being working for a company. He and the other TiVo people help us out a LOT when we have problems, so don't they deserve to be able to come to this forum and join in without some blockhead asking the same old questions?

It's really ok. I understand that the DT appeals to some people, and the S3 to others...and both are excited. The S3 folks have less info, so they're going to ask more. And he had a big grinning smiley there. :)

No harm. Not to worry. I've had far worse pestering, and the blockhead queue is usually full...no need to line up anyone else! :)

Pony

[Olde Fortran]

So why bother to bug the heck out of the man?

Oh yeah, I'm sure he's so bothered by I want it I want it I want it, when can I have it, I gotta have it now, is it cheap, I don't care, I want it, can I have it soon, when can I have it, is it soon, ooooh I need it, can I have a beta? can I pay double? oh when can I have it? I want it. Poor guy. He probably has to go take laughing breaks. :D

[Guindalf]

True. I think I over-reacted a little. But I defend myself by saying I used to be in a "position of power" myself as a computer magazine editor. It was a pain to be somewhere public because people would pester you with the same old questions and you really didn't want to answer them or smile, but you had to!

Anyway, Pony. Just PM me with the release date and we'll say no more about it ;)

:D

[ZeoTiVo]

Oh yeah, I'm sure he's so bothered by I want it I want it I want it, when can I have it, I gotta have it now, is it cheap, I don't care, I want it, can I have it soon, when can I have it, is it soon, ooooh I need it, can I have a beta? can I pay double? oh when can I have it? I want it. Poor guy. He probably has to go take laughing breaks. :D


yah this is a problem product managers want to have :)

[btwyx]

I went with D* because I got totally peed off at the cable company. I stayed because of the DirecTiVo and then The HD DirecTiVo.DirectTV had that “DirectTiVo”, but as near as I can tell that’s being phased out, and even if not, it doesn’t support modern (for me must have) features like TiVo to Go.The DirecTivo is so much better than an SA TiVO it not funny, dual tuners and direct digital recording (no quality/space tradeoff) will do that. With the HD DTiVo, no other TiVo (publically available) can record HD.

Now fast forward a couple of years, D*'s support for DTiVos is getting iffy, their signal quality is also getting iffy. They don't support the new TiVo features, but I'm not to worried about that so much, if the box actually worked correctly (it doesn't) and received all channels they sent (it doesn't anymore).

The S3 is making the cable company look palatable again (something which I would have said was impossible). The S3 has all the basic technology that's needed, dual tuners and direct digital recording.

So I may not be sticking with D* much longer if they don't come to their senses. But at the moment there is no alternative to D*.

[reh523]

NFL Package.

Enough said.

[jfh3]

The call got even more interesting when they asked me what a TiVo box could do that their new box can't. He didn't know who he was asking. :D




Don't leave us hanging ... what was the DTV reps response when you got done?

[jfh3]

1) DirecTV has the MLB package, cable does not.


Not true for all cable systems. MLB EI just came on my local Comcast this year, so it'll be safe to drop DTV when the Series 3 comes out. :)

[jfh3]

You know when they say "they'll record this call for quality purposes," I really hope DTV executives could hear that conversation.

Wouldn't matter.

With the R15, DTV executives have shown us they don't care about quality.

[bidger]

Wouldn't matter.

With the R10, DTV executives have shown us they don't care about quality.
Ummm...I think you mean the R-15.

[jfh3]

Ummm...I think you mean the R-15.

Yes, I did.

I guess next time I try to be funny, it would help to get the punch line right ...

[cwerdna]

For me, I was so glad to get DirecTV and DirecTiVo after moving back to the Bay Area. I was stuck w/cable when I lived in WA because of buildings and trees being in the way.

Advantages at the time: dual tuners, better PQ than what the cable feed I got in WA and FAR better quality than the cable feed at this house [not sure about now, but when this house had cable, the PQ was AWFUL], no PQ and sound quality loss when recording, DirecTivo is more space efficient for the given quality, DirecTV was cheaper than cable

cons: none of the home media features :(, need to have a landline

Now w/the DirecTV price hikes, the price advantage is almost gone. My DirecTV + DirecTivo monthly fee is almost equivalent to expanded basic cable prices here but I got more channels on DirecTV.

It pains me to see that DirecTV isn't offering DirecTivo anymore (other than the high def unit). The lack of home media stuff does irk me. I would like TivoToGo, being able to ditch the landline and Tivo Central Online.

BTW, I've had no wind or rain fade probs (loss of signal or signal too weak causing dropped frames/pauses) as long as I've had DirecTV (since November 04).

[ADent]

Dual Tuner TiVo with all shows recorded in the equivalent of Best, but using the space of Basic for $54.98 ($48.99 TC+ + $5.99 TiVo fee).

Comcast here is $45.69 for the analog setup, which does not include a bunch of minor channels DTV TC+ carries (BBCA, ext Discovery channels, etc). Digital Classic is $55.64, requires a STB, a STB fee and until 2 days ago prevented recording one, watching one digitally unless I got two boxes and two fees.

So $45.69 + $12.95 = $58.64 for less channels, one tuner (until two days ago), less recording time. Or $55.64 + $12.95 = $68.59 for one tuner. Two tuners would be $55.64 + $12.95 + $9.95 (ext digital outlet fee) + $12.95 = $91.49.

$54.98 is much less than $91.49 for approximately equal service/channels.

DTV is a very reliable service. Rain fade is probably 5 min a year here, and snow fade I can fix in 60 sec (about once a year ). Cable would go out much more often and be out for longer.

Lastly Boomerang is not avaible on Comcast on any level and the kids love it (and we watch along sometimes too). No commercials to FF thru.

[Tivo Basic Mike]

Do you REALLY expect an answer to this? If so, you're dumber than a brick! You're not going to get anything from Pony until his superiors say it's ok to release the information. So why bother to bug the heck out of the man? We'll find out when TiVo wants us to know and not before. Pony is just a human being working for a company. He and the other TiVo people help us out a LOT when we have problems, so don't they deserve to be able to come to this forum and join in without some blockhead asking the same old questions?


Hey Goon I forgot this was your forum! If I want to ask a question I will ask it you did not have to waste your time replying to me.

[Arcady]

Another thing that I don't think anyone has mentioned is that once you hack your DirecTiVo boxes to support MRV, they are way faster on the network than SA boxes. I can transfer a one hour show in like 8 minutes, instead of the glacial speed on my SA boxes. Also, you can use an unsubscribed box as a playback-only device - I keep a SD Dtivo in the living room next to my HD TiVo so I can transfer shows to that room (hopefully a 6.2 update is coming for the HD box so I can activate MRV on that) and I can also use it as a storage device for shows I want to archive. And I do all this for a single $5.99 a month fee - with the 8 Dtivos I have set up, it would cost over $60/month for SA boxes. I have one lifetime SA unit, but that's going on ebay this week - I never use it.

[tivocat99]

For me, living in a sub-tropical environment like Houston, it's a great predictor of very heavy (read: 1+ inches/hour) rain. If the picture starts breaking up, the sky is going to let loose in about 5 minutes... Usually, the picture is back by the time it's really coming down! The worst I've seen it in 9 years was about a 20 minute outage. 5-10 minutes, 3-5 times per year I'd say is a fair number for my location.
I found the same thing in Dallas when I had Dish. Other than the storm outages I loved it.

I would probably have DirecTV now except that (1) I currently rent, so I would have to have visible wiring running throughout the apartment in order to have it in more than one room, and (2) I need cable Internet for work anyway, so it's just simpler right now for me to have cable. I hate Charter though, so once my living situation changes, I will probably switch over to DirecTV.

[Marco]

Just to beat a dead horse.

Three reasons to go with DirecTV over cable:

NFL Sunday Ticket.
NFL Sunday Ticket.
NFL Sunday Ticket.

And the fourth:
Uptime.
There's been some misinformation in here about rain fade.
We lose picture due to heavy rain maybe, oh, four times a year, 30-45 minutes at a time TOPS. When I had cable, my service would go out several times a year too ... but you could count on it being HOURS, sometimes even over a day, before it came back. That was very annoying.

[jmfpdx]

I was pleased to find this thread, and hope that my question is appropriate here.

I've been sniffing around the TiVo Community Forums, looking for advice and reports of user experience. My search has to do with the reliability of feeding a Satellite signal into a TiVo box, and assuring TiVo will perform full control on the Satellite box, for channel changing, and all that goes with TiVo's operation of the Wish Lists, etc.

I have the Humax DRT-800 with DVD burner. A wonderful unit... except that the tuner doesn't pick up very well my wife's preferred broadcast channels. So, we're thinking seriously of getting a Satellite TV account. From the research I've done so far on the two choices of Satellite service, I'm leaning toward the Dish Network, rather than DirecTV.

If anyone has experience/opinion to share regarding the two Satellite services, I'd be quite interested to hear.

But onto my issue of assuring TiVo control of the Satellite box...

While researching in the TiVo Community, I ran across a thread that goes into considerable detail on the subject of feeding satellite signal into TiVo boxes:

/showthread.php?p=1340519&&#post1340519

But it's from way back in 2003. I haven't found more recent thread on this issue, so I wonder if that means the problems have been resolved... or? Are there still technical hurdles for assuring that a TiVo box can send Serial or IR controls to the Satellite tuner box?

Finally, I have a more technical question about feeding the signal from a 2-tuner Satellite box into my single tuner Humax TiVo box... but I'll save that for later... or if there is a more appropriate thread for either or both of these questions, please direct me.

Thanks, John in Portland, OR

[Arcady]

There's no such thing asa two-tuner satellite box that isn't a DVR. Just get the DirecTiVo and be happy.

[goony]

There's no such thing asa two-tuner satellite box that isn't a DVR.For DirecTV, that is a true statement.

For Dish Network, they have a dual-tuner non-DVR recevier - the model 322 (http://www.dishnetwork.com/content/products/receivers/standard/index.shtml).

[Olde Fortran]

/showthread.php?p=1340519&&#post1340519

But it's from way back in 2003. I haven't found more recent thread on this issue, so I wonder if that means the problems have been resolved... or

The last post in that thread was a few days ago so it should be fine.

[jmfpdx]

The last post in that thread was a few days ago so it should be fine.

Thanks for the replies here. Thanks for the confirmation that the Dish 322 is a 2-tuner (non-DRV) unit.

I'm generally tech-savvy, so I don't know why, but I find it rather awkward to find my way around the various threads/forums.

You said the last post was just a few days ago, in the old thread that I referenced previously. I went looking, and now I can't find that thread! Can you point me more specifically, please?

Sorry to be such a dunce...

What I'm trying to verify is whether or not I'll be able to use/control my Humax DTC 800 TiVo with the Dish 322 that was referenced in a prior note.

If anyone here can inform/enlighten me about that, I'd be most appreciative. My wife is eager for me to get Dish service in time for Mother's Day... but I'm resistant until/unless I can verify that our TiVo unit will still be fully functional!

[classicsat]

You can use a TiVo with tuner 1 of a 322, with the TiVo and 322 colocated, so they can use both IR and A/V connections. Tuner 2 cannot be used becasue it is UHF onl, and on the coax RF out, non-standard.

[classicsat]

Another thing that I don't think anyone has mentioned is that once you hack your DirecTiVo boxes to support MRV, they are way faster on the network than SA boxes.

If you have a 240 standalone, you can hack it to enable higher speed USB2.0.

[Olde Fortran]

You said the last post was just a few days ago, in the old thread that I referenced previously. I went looking, and now I can't find that thread! Can you point me more specifically, please?


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=1340519&&#post1340519

[WELZIAK]

In our area, the same cable channels which cost $68 a month (no premiums either!) cost $34.99 with Dish Network. Dish's are popping up all over our area and it's easy to see why.

[ozlow]

I’ve been curious about this for some time. Why do so many seem to use DirectTV? What’s the point? At least in my area, cable is cheaper, installation is easier (with no extra hardware needed), and you can use dual tuner Tivos. Satelite you’re pretty much locked in to just recording one show at a time on your Tivo.

DirectTV had that “DirectTiVo”, but as near as I can tell that’s being phased out, and even if not, it doesn’t support modern (for me must have) features like TiVo to Go.

So what’s the selling point? You get to pay roughly the same (or more in some areas). You have to have a dish. And you can’t use dual tuner Tivos…what a deal?

What am I missing?

NFL Ticket!