Sky+ Discussion

[iankb]

... how does it all work with Sky+The TiVo really needs 100% control of the STB, and so it works much better with a standard digibox, or a Sky+ working in digibox mode only. The problem is that, with only one output on Sky+, you can't really watch a live Sky channel, or watch a Sky+ recording, without corrupting any recording that the TiVo is trying to make.

A mirror sub with a standard digibox is probably the best solution if you wish to use both Sky+ and the TiVo.

[Automan]

Part of the Sky "masterplan" to force punters to go Sky HD :)

My V2 does not seem to have suffered to much with just one old recording playing a bit glitchy.

The new PIN feature seems to be the main cause of complaint for homeowners with no young children.

Sky+ now makes you enter the pin number every time you want to play a 15 or 18 item before the watershed.

Also it is now required for every manual recording at any time.
This even includes radio recordings...

I also BTW prefer the old menu colours.

Automan.
Seems a lot of people have had problems with Sky+ since the latest software update.

Some are reporting that all their recordings have gone - Chris Moyles said this as well on the air this week.

Lock ups and other problems are also being reported.

Looks as if the problems are with Pace V2.


I've not had problems with V1.

[mrtickle]

Part of the Sky "masterplan" to force punters to go Sky HD :)


Either that, or a materplan to drive customers away! I didn't hear Chris Moyles but if he complained, at least that goes a tiny way to balancing out all the guideline-breaching free advertising that he's given Sky+ on the BBC so far.

[dr snuggles]

TiVo can be upgraded to 800GB, can have a network card and transfer shows to your PC. However direct show transfer cannot be discussed in this forum. Google for database of deals TiVo.

The TiVo can control Sky+ and change channels directly using its infrared blaster and wands.

Get a Harmony or MX-500 remote to control the lot.


Hi Cyril!
Can you please explain exactly (in detail) how to enable Tivo to control Sky plus 160!
I have tried lots of different codes but nothing seems to work!

Cheers in advance!

JD

[sanderton]

Grundig 20018 from memory?

[ozsat]

I see that many Sky+ users found that it gave error messages for their 'Little Britain' recordings.

[gregh]

hi all,

I possibly have a chance to get a Sky+ box from the refer a friend scheme.

The biggest pro is that I can loose my Tivo box, and reduce the under the TV clutter!

Has anyone done a recent comparison on Sky+ vs Tivo?

The biggest thing that put me off last time was series links, if I understand it correctly, using Top Gear as an example, Tivo will record the current series of Top Gear, and then when it re-starts in 2006 it will carry on recording that.

How does Sky+ currently cope with long term series links?

regards,

Greg

[nva]

Hi gregh, I bought Sky+ this summer after my Tivo blew up, and have been suffering ever since. Sky+ relies on Series Links, which operate like Tivo's Seasons Pass, but are reliant on broadcasters issuing a Series Link, so where Tivo would keep your Seasons Pass between one series and the next (days, or weeks, or months), Sky+ doesn't. It is so bad that if, say, a series on BBC1 misses a week (eg because of Wimbledon, or Children In Need), you lose the request! If this happens and you don't spot it, it makes the whole feature a waste of time. I think this is because the software is totally different, Tivo is far, far better. I have written to Sky about their system's weakness, to no avail. I've now had my Tivo repaired, and am looking to see if I can hook it up with Sky+. Has anyone succeeded in doing this? My aim is to then record the series I'm most upset at "losing", onto Tivo, and one-offs on Sky+.

[Raisltin Majere]

The biggest pro is that I can loose my Tivo box,


:eek: :confused: :eek:

[lor]

I use both Tivo and an original Pace Sky+
Both work great together. The only problem is that you cannot watch a programme that has been recorded on Sky+ while the Tivo is recording something. If you are already watching a programme when Tivo starts to record the programme you are watching will instantly stop as Tivo takes control. Now when I want to watch Sky+ recorded programmes I just have a quick check that the red light is not lit on the Tivo. If it is then have to wait a bit.
Chris

[sanderton]

Quite a big problem, that!

[Automan]

A nice chap at the Digitalspy has posted some screens of a Sky+ on EPG4
http://forum.digitalspy.co.uk/board/showpost.php?p=6842558&postcount=10

You will see the planner is now green button rather than zero and a recording can be booked from an onscreen hotlink.

Also, display only favourite channels plus an increase from 20 I think to 50?

Automan.

[ozsat]

The screenshot says "set reminder" rather than "set record" - which are different options.

I hope it does a "set record" rather then "set reminder" - as I never use reminders as it defeats the whole object a recording.



Edit: Further screenshots imply that these selected programmes are actually put into a list to act upon before recording.

[MikeMcr]

Nice idea but I wonder if you will get the hotlink when watching from a recording or it only works from live tv. I suspect the later.

[steveroe]

Sky Digi Online is reporting two new features (http://media247.co.uk/skydigital/newsarchive/2006/01/sky_confirm_pla.php) on the way:

Sky have confirmed to Sky Digi Online that they are planning to launch two new services later this year.

SMS to record programme
This service will give Sky+ customers the ability to send a text message to Sky to record programs for you. This can be done by sending a text message to Sky or by booking a Sky+ recording via Sky by Mobile application.

Launch date: Spring 2006


Add programmes to Sky planner direct from trailer
This new feature will allow Sky customers to add programmes during a programme trailer to the Sky personal planner. By pressing the 'green' button during a trailer, the advertised programme will automatically be added to the personal planner on your Sky Guide.

Launch date: First half of 2006

Both services are currently in testing.

[Automan]

I like many other Sky+ owners have EPG4
The favorite channel list now has limit of 50 from 20
You can display the TV Guide only showing your favorite channels
Entering the Sky+ planner is now more of a pain, now TV Guide and Green button

Operation of the menus does seem faster than the last release.

I am yet to see an onscreen prompt to add / record a program so no comment on that feature.

Automan.

[Automan]

I have just also noted that Sky Reminders work prompting you to press the green button.

This takes you to a list of showings of the program also with the option to record or just mark for a reminder at showing time.

However not sure if these are availble from a recording rather than Live TV.

Also all the Sky movie channels now seem to be Dolby Digital capable :)

Automan.

[blindlemon]

I heard the other day that Sly+ is unable to play back a recording if the satellite feed is out due to bad weather....

Can this really be true, or is it just another urban myth started by a TiVo enthusiast?;)

[Raisltin Majere]

Dunno. But i heard that as well. Don't understand why that would happen though?

[blindlemon]

...back to undergarments again ;):D

[Automan]

Yes, the box needs to check your subscription to the channel the program was from is valid.

Can't say I ever get any reception problems and thus have not had an issue with this.

Automan.
I heard the other day that Sly+ is unable to play back a recording if the satellite feed is out due to bad weather....

Can this really be true, or is it just another urban myth started by a TiVo enthusiast?;)

[blindlemon]

Fantastic! If I had a valid subscription to the channel when I recorded it, I'd want to be able to watch it whenever I liked.

Of course, that's yet another benefit of my TiVo: I can record something from Sky Box Office and watch it again, and again, and again.... :D:D

(oh yes, and it may just happen to find its way onto my PC too....;))

[ozsat]

I think on Sky+, defaulting to set record would have been better.

I have just also noted that Sky Reminders work prompting you to press the green button.

This takes you to a list of showings of the program also with the option to record or just mark for a reminder at showing time.

However not sure if these are availble from a recording rather than Live TV.

Also all the Sky movie channels now seem to be Dolby Digital capable :)

Automan.

[Automan]

The new Green Sky Reminders do only work when watching LiveTV

Thus with Sky+ it's a waste of time and with Tivo its just another annoying on-screen DOG.

Automan.

[Michael Gwynn]

So we have to have both? OK - sounds fine to me.....

Kevin


sounds fine to me, too

[MAPR]

I have just been recommended to buy a (refurb) TIVO as I am moving to a new build flat where I can't get a 2nd feed for my Sky Plus.

Is it correct I can use my Sky plus box with one LNB input as a normal digibox and then connect the TIVO. Is it a simple as that - Will the TIVO be able to control the Sky plus box, or do I need to buy a normal digibox? Is there anything else i need to know using the TIVO with a single feed Sky +!

thanks very much!

[katman]

I have just been recommended to buy a (refurb) TIVO as I am moving to a new build flat where I can't get a 2nd feed for my Sky Plus.

Cant find the link at the moment but there is a set of gizmos to overcome just a problem. One fits at the LNB and shifts one LNB feed up by 2GHz so that it sits above the normal LNB feed. A second unit at the receiver end down shifts the feed again so that you have two feeds for the SKY+ box.

No personal experience but will try and find the link.

Regards

Keith

[MAPR]

Cant find the link at the moment but there is a set of gizmos to overcome just a problem. One fits at the LNB and shifts one LNB feed up by 2GHz so that it sits above the normal LNB feed. A second unit at the receiver end down shifts the feed again so that you have two feeds for the SKY+ box.

No personal experience but will try and find the link.

Regards

Keith

thanks, but this is a large development and they will not allow any access at the LNB end (the dish is actually on another building to the one I will be living in.)

[katman]

thanks, but this is a large development and they will not allow any access at the LNB end (the dish is actually on another building to the one I will be living in.)

In which case someone needs to tell them about SKY+ and the fact that it needs two cables. I am surprised that the SMATV contactor didnt make provision for two feeds to each flat. Its VERY shortsighted.

Having said that I looked at a showhouse about five years ago and adjacent to the TV Aerial socket was a SINGLE 13A socket. I dont know ANYONE who doesnt have a VCR or Satellite receiver at the main TV location meaning a double 13A socket at the minimum.

[Automan]

Those clever folks over at the DigitalSpy have written a utility (and setup a website) for a utility to backup / upgrade your Sky+ hard drive.

http://www.artisswebdesign.co.uk/copyplus/index.php

Automan.

[ozsat]

Sky+ decided that tonight's Coronation Street was in two parts and only the first part was a part of the series.

Not really a Sky+ problem - but wrong data from ITV.

[KALF]

How do I record 1 pgm on Tivo from Sky+ while watching another Sky channel ?

Sorry for being a simple person.

Can I do this without a Tivo account?

[KALF]

I am trying to get access to Sky+ pgms that I have recorded - but since getting Sky HD it means fiddling with cables and not being able to record on HD other pgms while watching the old recordings on Sky+.

So I thought I would do the bulk "Copy" from Sky+ onto Tivo and then watch them via the Sky HD (getting round the encryption).

I do not have a Tivo account anymore.

Unfortunately, although I can see what is playing on the Sky+ box from Tivo I can't get TIVO to record. (I can do a manual record on channels that were set up while I still had a Tivo account)

Can anyone suggest either

a) a more elegant solution to be able to watch the remaining pgms on Sky+ but still record new pgms on SkyHD box
or
b) enable Tivo to record the old pgms from Sky+ without getting paying the £10 per month with Tivo.


Thnaks

[sanderton]

You can do a manual record - it doesn't matter which channel TiVo thinks its recording so long as it's one it will access from the SCART socket, it will just record whatever it is presented with on the SCART AUX input (not VCR input). You'd need to set up a manual recording long enough to capture all the shows in one go if you were to use the bulk copy.

How do I record 1 pgm on Tivo from Sky+ while watching another Sky channel ?

You can't; Sky+ can only output one thing at a time.

[KALF]

You can do a manual record - it doesn't matter which channel TiVo thinks its recording so long as it's one it will access from the SCART socket, it will just record whatever it is presented with on the SCART AUX input (not VCR input). You'd need to set up a manual recording long enough to capture all the shows in one go if you were to use the bulk copy.

Thanks for that .. when I try to record by pressing the record button then it does record anything.

When I record using the planned future recording ... the scart isn't an option and it records a black screen.

I don't have a Tivo account.

[Automan]

Also beware that most recordings made on Sky+ from Sky premium channels will no longer playback anyway if the viewing card in the box has changed from the one used / inserted when the box made the recordings.

Automan.

[KALF]

Also beware that most recordings made on Sky+ from Sky premium channels will no longer playback anyway if the viewing card in the box has changed from the one used / inserted when the box made the recordings.

Automan.


I have the same card in the SkyHD box as I had in Sky+ and I have been able to swap it back successfully (so far!!)

[sanderton]

Thanks for that .. when I try to record by pressing the record button then it does record anything.

When I record using the planned future recording ... the scart isn't an option and it records a black screen.

I don't have a Tivo account.

The record button will make a 30 minute timed recording; it's not like a VCR.

I note on another thread you have the Sky box plugged in to the VCR SCART; that won't work, it has to be the AUX SCART.

Choose any channel to record which on your TiVo's normal setup would be a channel on the set top box.

[sanderton]

I have the same card in the SkyHD box as I had in Sky+ and I have been able to swap it back successfully (so far!!)

I am surprised by that, they are supposed to be married to the box they are inserted in.

[KALF]

The record button will make a 30 minute timed recording; it's not like a VCR.

I note on another thread you have the Sky box plugged in to the VCR SCART; that won't work, it has to be the AUX SCART.

Choose any channel to record which on your TiVo's normal setup would be a channel on the set top box.

I have changed the scart from the sky+ to the Aux on my Tivo.

However when I press "record" when Tivo is set to Aux then picture reverts to the Tivo menu.

I tried to record using the manual planner - but there is no option to record the Aux channel.

Any ideas?

[sanderton]

Don't post a question and PM it too!

Is your TiVo set up for terrestrial analogue TV only, or to use a set top box for Freeview or Sky?

If the former, re-run guided setup using an option which uses a settop box.

To record from the AUX input you set the recording on any channel number which is a channel on the STB - it doesn't matter which one. There isn't one labelled "AUX".

You need to be in a position so when watching Live TV you're seeing the output of the Sky box.

[KALF]

It all worked when I re-activated my Tivo acct!

Tho the Sky+ mass "Copy" function hasn't worked and I am transferring pgm by pgm .. still, the overall objective is being achieved


Thanks

[Automan]

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/article/ds38943.html

Seems Sky still rule the waves....

Automan.

[cwaring]

It's easy to win a one-horse race :p

[ALanJay]

It's easy to win a one-horse race :p

Especially when none of the other "pseudo" competitors even provide details of the number of units they sell.

The interesting thing about HD is how this launch compares to the numbers in otehr countries in Europe France / Germany etc

I saw recently that premiere in Germany has cut its HD output from 3 to 2 channels.

[Automan]

As you may know "Life On Mars" was not on BBC1 this week for a football match (also shown on BBC HD).

Anyway to confirm I had a series link set to record this and even with a 14 day gap between episodes the next episode is now set to record.

Also you can now set Sky+ and Sky HD boxes to make a recording from http://www.sky.com (under TV Guide) as well of course from virtually any make and model mobile phone.

As long as my box does not start recording "Dossa and Joe" I will be happy :)

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2002/05/24/bbc_hijacks_tivo_recorders (if you don't recall that landmark in UK Tivo history).

Automan.

[TCM2007]

That's been the case for about two years hasn't it? (14 day serie slinks that is)

[Automan]

Yes, but it's the first time I have actually seen it work :)

Automan.
That's been the case for about two years hasn't it? (14 day serie slinks that is)

[Automan]

And 250,000 Sky HD boxes after just one year.

Just imagine where Tivo would be in the UK with that kind of market share?

http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-bin/shownews.php?id=9192 for source article.

Lastly how long will commercial TV survive with 20% plus of Sky customers having the option to skip them?

Automan.

[healeydave]

Yeah but lets face it, they have a captive audience, being the only main stream UK Satellite option.

Not only that, but we are in a time in the UK where digital tv is being forced down people throats due to the analog switch-off campaign and for many Digital TV adopters, they are the only option! (if there's no Cable or Freeview available)

I would also note that a good proportion of the Sky+ adoption over the last 12 months is simply people replacing their existing kit and not necessarily going out and purchasing a PVR technology!

Sky are in a position now to basically offer a Sky+ box as the main set-top-box whether the customer intended to go that route or not.

None of us expected anything else if we are honest. They have such an enviable Unique market place at the moment, they could make even a crap product a success! (sorry make that ARE making a crap product a success) :-)

I honestly believe even a monkey in charge of making Sky+ / HD a success wouldn't have any trouble!

[iankb]

I honestly believe even a monkey in charge of making Sky+ / HD a success wouldn't have any trouble!Is that the same monkey as designed them? :rolleyes:

I also note that Sky had a significantly-increased number of cancellations during that period. One wonders how well they would have done overall if people hadn't had to move from Virgin.

[aerialplug]

I would also note that a good proportion of the Sky+ adoption over the last 12 months is simply people replacing their existing kit and not necessarily going out and purchasing a PVR technology!


True - and I'd probably cancel the Sky+ service if I was able to, but I'm contractually obliged to maintain it for a year.

What really hacks me at the moment are the multiplay logos appearing during popular programmes telling people they can watch the programme using the multiplay facility. However, as the person is already watching the programme, why tell them they can use multiplay... ?

Ok, I see the logic of advertising the service's presence - but up until now, red dot reminders have only appeared when the adverts finish and quickly go away (if you've got that option enabled). Sky however seem to think the multiplay DOG is extra important and make it re-appear during the programme.

[AMc]

I heard an analyst from Jupiter on Radio 2 on Monday around 7pm talking about Digital TV, Video on Demand and DVR. He said even the most committed users that they had interviewed only watched 40% of their viewing from playback or VOD which means they spend 60% watching 'live TV' (yuk!). He must be talking primarily about Sky+ a V+ users. There's still a marketing opportunity for never watching an advert and never being forced to watch "what's on" again.

[edited out ancient news story from the BBC]

And the product marketing manager for SkyHD wasn't a monkey when I met him just before they launched ;).

[aerialplug]

One thing that I really found frustrating is that the SkyHD user interface isn't in HD. If they used HD, they'd be able to give the EPG the resolution needed to show a decent number of programmes along the timeline, not the clumsy EPG that's currently on offer on all Sky platforms.

[iankb]

One thing that I really found frustrating is that the SkyHD user interface isn't in HD. If they used HD, they'd be able to give the EPG the resolution needed to show a decent number of programmes along the timeline, not the clumsy EPG that's currently on offer on all Sky platforms.Although MCE has its faults, it makes a lot more use of the screen real estate than a Series 1 TiVo, even on a CRT TV with no HD. While it does look much clearer on an LCD or plasma, it's use of variable font-sizes, better graphics, and PIP, is still viewable on a CRT.

Nothing that a Series 3 TiVo couldn't do, but maybe the more advanced (and expensive) graphics chip and CPU used within a PC is the answer there. However, given the low-cost of recent PC motherboards, and the onboard graphics, maybe a more modern interface isn't that expensive. Maybe it is the software-based font-antialiasing provided by Windows ClearType that makes the difference, and a Linux-based computer can't handle that. However, while I hate to say it, my TiVo Series 1 interface is looking very dated and inefficient, even if still quite superior to Sky+ and bottom-end Freeview-based DVR's.

While the economics of a 50MHz RISC processor in the TiVo once made sense, the cost of the PC architecture has fallen so much now, it must be possible for future TiVo's to invest in more CPU-intensive interface, or be an alternative software product or operating system for running on the PC architecture. Maybe they should be developing MCE plug-ins that could add all of those intelligent features that MCE doesn't have.

[iankb]

And the product marketing manager for SkyHD wasn't a monkey when I met him just before they launchedSure it wasn't a monkey in a suit? Did he have a beard? ;)

Actually, while I hate to admit it, there is nothing wrong with Sky's marketing of the products that they have. Only the decision that somebody makes as to what is a marketable product. I suspect that the bean-counters are ultimately responsible for that decision, and they're probably still using quills and parchment by candlelight.