Direct & Dish Condo Dishes

[phecksel]

I'm on our local planning commission and we have a big condo development coming before us in a couple of weeks. One of the things I had requested was they wire and set up a single dish (or two?) for each condo building, rather then let each owner run their own dishes. Is this advisable or logical? I did love the developers initial response, we'll just forbid installing a dish in the association agreement :) I don't want to burden the developer, but also don't want a potential 50+ dishes on each building.

[rminsk]

It should work fine. I am currently feeding about 20 lines from my current dish supporting about 8 condos. If the condo units are very large you may have to get a distribution amplifier. Do not let your typical DirecTV installer touch your setup. Every time a DirecTV "technician" comes out I end up having to fix his work. There are installation companies that specalize in this sort of installation.

[phecksel]

I need to suggest to the Developer how to solve the problem of a single dish. How would the wiring be done? two home runs from central access point? what size dish should be planned, and is there anyway to get one sat dish for both vendors? Can the wiring be set up to work with either supplier or even cable?

[JimSpence]

Do you plan to have access to all of the DirecTV sats? Including the MPEG4 ones? If so, then you need to make sure that whatever you do can handle multiple sats.

Same goes with Dish Network.

[goony]

Can the wiring be set up to work with either supplier or even cable?As long as it is RG6 cabling, you should be able to have a patch panel (secured) that could send Dish, DirecTV or cableco to a particular dwelling. As said before, there are companies that specialize in this kind of thing - well marked/labeled/colored patch panels would make it a breeze to feed whatever was needed.

Good idea for the two runs - some people have dual-tuner DVRs that need 2 feeds; if they need more (for satellite) they can use a multiswitch inside the dwelling. If these things haven't even been built yet then it might be a good idea to spec 2 or 3 RG6 cables from each room faceplate back to a 'wiring point' (where the 2 feeds from outside will meet) as well as a 2 runs of CAT5E (for Ethernet) or a single CAT5E and "two pair" for phone wiring.

As to the size of the dish, it could be larger than the 'standard' ones to help prevent rainfade.

I also salute your having the foresight to accomodate both DBS and cable - some just are jerks and don't permit satellite at all. If I ever have to move, the non-prevention of DBS access will be a large factor in my decision.

[crvboy]

Just check to make sure your directives aren't in violation of the FCC. The FCC has stated that condo associations/home owner assocations cannot forbid dishes with the exception for safety reasons.

http://ftp.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/consumerdish.html

[mdupont_2000]

Not sure about where you are (or if it is an FFC reg) but here you can't forbid someone from getting a dish as long as it's not in a "common" area. I live in a condo and I can put a dish on my deck since I'm the only one who can access it.

[phecksel]

Not sure about where you are (or if it is an FFC reg) but here you can't forbid someone from getting a dish as long as it's not in a "common" area. I live in a condo and I can put a dish on my deck since I'm the only one who can access it.
I appreciate all the answers, and I'm not trying to restrict anybody, but what I am trying to do is limit the number of installed dishes. A 50 unit condo will begin looking diseased with 50 dishes installed. If there's anything that can be done to "help" the condo owner, and at the same time limit the number of dishes, I would much prefer to do that. I'm not the developer, nor will I be one of the condo owners, but I am on the planning commission, and we have final approval of the project plans. Looking for a win/win for everybody. As a D-Tivo owner, I believe people should have the choice, but this is a beautiful project, and hope it can remain that way. I'm not happy my own dish is located in the middle of my front yard, but I had absolutely no choice on the location. Funny thing, Dish said I couldn't a signal. Even though I wanted D* from the beginning, rather then waste an installers time, looked at a satellite photo to identify the single location I could get a signal.

[ewolfr]

phecksel,

Keep in mind that there will never be 50 dishes installed on the building. There will always be a certain number of people with balconies that just plain face the wrong way and will never be able to get a signal from the sats even if they wanted to.

[JimSpence]

I think both DirecTV and Dish have groups that can help with multiple dwelling unit (MDU) setups. I see no reason why one dish for each provider couldn't be setup.

[phecksel]

I think both DirecTV and Dish have groups that can help with multiple dwelling unit (MDU) setups. I see no reason why one dish for each provider couldn't be setup.
DOH! Why didn't I think of that :) Talked to the architect yesterday, and he agrees this may be something to help them market the condos.

[Lee L]

Just make sure that whatever you install, it has everything that the provider has available and room for expansion since the minute something is out there on another sat that the MDU system does not provide, people can put up their own dish, no matter the local law, ordinance, covenant, whatever.

You might also go ahead and have an antenna installed for TV reception since they are similarly protected. If you are willing to do it right, you can get one or 2 discrete flat panel antennas and pick up everything.

[Stanley Rohner]

Just check to make sure your directives aren't in violation of the FCC. The FCC has stated that condo associations/home owner assocations cannot forbid dishes with the exception for safety reasons.

http://ftp.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/consumerdish.html

You can provide all the http links you want but if the agreement each condo owner signs says - no dishes can be installed - than no dishes can be installed.

[Sparty99]

You can provide all the http links you want but if the agreement each condo owner signs says - no dishes can be installed - than no dishes can be installed.
I'm not going to get into a big legal argument, but I don't think that's the case. The developer/association owner cannot prevent you from putting up a satellite dish, even if it is in their assocation rules (such a prohibition is basically illegal).

I am the first person at my condo association to have a satellite installed and began the proceedings to gain approval before I moved in. After reading the FCC rules and consulting with their lawyers, the association realized they had no choice but to allow me to get the dish.

[Lee L]

You can provide all the http links you want but if the agreement each condo owner signs says - no dishes can be installed - than no dishes can be installed.


This is absolutely not the case. If you sign an agreement that says that no non-whites are allowed to move in (some older communities still have these in their covenants by the way) is that legally enforceable? (and I am not equating them morally, just using an example of a covenant that is overridden by federal law)

[crvboy]

You can provide all the http links you want but if the agreement each condo owner signs says - no dishes can be installed - than no dishes can be installed.

Which is exactly the reason why the FCC created that ruling. It doesn't matter what you sign, the FCC says that an assocation cannot prevent a owner from installing a dish.

[ElFrendi]

that is exactly the problem I have right now with these condo dish in my building unit-- since I cannot install my own dish I have to pay a monthly fee to use this dish so I can have access to the directv signal--well, I can deal with this fee but the problem that I have now is that I cannot have a dual lnb connection to my tivo so I am just stuck with just one and I am not able to record and watch. Is there any way I can bypass this without having a dual lnb?

[classicsat]

I think what phecksel is saying, is they want to provide the option of a satellite feed in each unit, so the resident has no need to put a dish on their balcony, next directly forbid dishes.

[Lee L]

I think what phecksel is saying, is they want to provide the option of a satellite feed in each unit, so the resident has no need to put a dish on their balcony, next directly forbid dishes.


I agree, however, the way I read the OTARD, they have to provide everything or anyone with an exclusive control area facing the right direction can put up a dish or antenna to get what is not available in teh MDU system. Plus, I am not really sure they can charge a monthly fee but I guess the FCC would have to decide that one.

[JimSpence]

I think a monthly fee could be charged. Afterall, the MDU equipment needs to be maintained.
Of course, a one time upfront charge could also be used for this.

[Lee L]

I think a monthly fee could be charged. Afterall, the MDU equipment needs to be maintained.
Of course, a one time upfront charge could also be used for this.


It can certainly go either way. On the other side, I could argue that the fact that there are not 50 dishes on the building is of no benefit to me since I do not mind them and is only of benefit to the rest of the building membership at large, so why should they not bear the cost?

[Aquatic]

The cost should be part of the sales price of the condo... it's an "incentive" so to speak for buyers to consider when evaulating the condo for purchase. That would make it an upfront cost, split across all 50 units. Most condos have some sort of association dues/fees associated as well, so maintenance costs can also be split across the units as well. I know the other argument..."I have my own dish, why should I pay for someone elses?" Okay.. I don't have any school age children---why do I have to pay property taxes that include public school funding? Same argument, but in the condo case, it's a microcosm of a neighborhood/school district, etc.

If it's allowed for in the planning and construction--actual maintenance should be VERY minimal anyway--conduit, cable and multiswitches. I like the idea of running 2 Cables to each unit, and having each owner MUX it as needed. I guess even better would be that every unit has a "unit wiring closet" with a distibution amp set up to send the incoming signal to the different rooms that were cabled. If they screw up antyhing in their unit, it's their dime to fix. If the signal's not getting there tho.. the building has to pick up the tab.

[Fezmid]

You can provide all the http links you want but if the agreement each condo owner signs says - no dishes can be installed - than no dishes can be installed.
As another user said, this is blatantly false. A better analagy than his "no non-whites" comment is that of an apartment lease that says, "Landlord is allowed to enter the apartment at any time for any reason, without notice." Sure, he can put it in the lease and you can sign it as a tenant, but (in Minnesota, at least), it's unenforcable. If the landlord enters your apartment, you can sue him for $50 for each violation.

In this case, the FCC laws trump the association rules and regs.

[JimSpence]

See this FCC document for info.
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html