HR10-250 diplexing problem

[McTivo]

My HR10-250 setup has worked flawlessly for a year now. I have an OTA antenna on the roof next to the dish. The OTA signal comes down into my living room in one cable that carries both satellite and OTA via diplexing. I have other cables that carry the satellite signal exclusively and feed the Sat Input 2 on the HR10-250 and a couple other SD receivers in other rooms.

All of a sudden, the past few days, I am having all sorts of problems with the HR10-250 Sat Input 1 (the one that is diplexed with the OTA signal). On most transponders, I don't get a signal at all on Sat Input 1, even though Sat Input 2 is over 90 (some transponders are at a signal strength around 60). I'm also experience weird inconsistency with my OTA signals as well. I've checked all of my connections in the house, but I haven't yet gone up to the roof to check those connections. Any ideas or help would be appreciated.

Thanks and happy holidays!

MJC

[Droford]

My HR10-250 setup has worked flawlessly for a year now. I have an OTA antenna on the roof next to the dish. The OTA signal comes down into my living room in one cable that carries both satellite and OTA via diplexing. I have other cables that carry the satellite signal exclusively and feed the Sat Input 2 on the HR10-250 and a couple other SD receivers in other rooms.

All of a sudden, the past few days, I am having all sorts of problems with the HR10-250 Sat Input 1 (the one that is diplexed with the OTA signal). On most transponders, I don't get a signal at all on Sat Input 1, even though Sat Input 2 is over 90 (some transponders are at a signal strength around 60). I'm also experience weird inconsistency with my OTA signals as well. I've checked all of my connections in the house, but I haven't yet gone up to the roof to check those connections. Any ideas or help would be appreciated.

Thanks and happy holidays!

MJC
I have almost the same setup and I just started having the same problem, but its only affecting my OTA channels, and only my Tivo box (perfect OTA signal on a regular directv HD box that I also have hooked up).

Good to know someone else is having the same problem I guess.

[JimSpence]

You need to check the ouside connections for corrosion. It could also be the outside diplexer.

[McTivo]

You need to check the ouside connections for corrosion. It could also be the outside diplexer.

Thanks. I haven't had a chacne to get up on the roof yet to take a look, however now Tuner 1 is working perfectly. If it were corrosion with the outside connections or the outside diplexer, would it make sense that the problem comes and goes? Or does that sound more like it might be a hardware failure inside the box?

Thanks again for the help.

MJC

[greywolf]

Bad diplexers are all too common. The connections can be fine but the diplexer might not be doing its job and be cutting off the Sat signal at too high a frequency.

[JimSpence]

Depending on the weather, rain etc, the problem could very well come and go.

[wje]

If the problem happens again, swap the tuner 1 and 2 connections at the HR10. If the problem moves to tuner 2, then it's upstream of the DVR. Most likely an intermittent connection, or flakey diplexer.

If the problem stays on tuner 1, it's the HR10. It could be the internal splitter or tuner 1 itself; I've had one box with a dead tuner. (dead out of the box... great quality control from DTV)

[TyroneShoes]

It may also be simply a case of the logic controlling the multiswitch in the LNBF becoming scrambled. A reboot and a signal check should eliminate that possiblility. Since that's easy, I would do that first.

[McTivo]

OK...

If you look back at my first post in this thread, you'll get some background on my problem. Over the past six weeks, I've replaced the diplexer on the roof twice. Each time, the problem goes away for 2-3 weeks, then it reappears. Of course, it reappeared yesterday (the day before the Super Bowl).

What could be causing my diplexers to die after 2-3 weeks of use? I'll go to Radio Shack today and buy another replacement diplexer, but this will get old after awhile. I could call DTV for service, but the techs that came out and installed it over a year ago were so bad and incompetent that I don't think I want them to come back. On top of that, I'm moving this summer, so I only have a few more months of use for this set-up anyway.

Any ideas are appreciated!

Thanks,
McTivo

[pudge44]

I'm considering using the same setup. I want to put an indoor OTA antenna (Zenith Silver Sensor) in my attic, and run RG6 from the attic down the side of the house and into the living room where my 5x8 multiswitch and HR10 reside.

My problem is I already have four lines coming in through the wall (from the dish) and another going out (from the multiswitch to an upstairs TV). If I get the drill out to run another line in from the antenna I'm not sure my marriage will last. So I want to diplex the antenna line onto one of the four lines from the dish.

Some questions --
Have people had success with this setup?
What type of diplexer should I use (frequency ratings)?
When I separate the lines again on the other side, do I run the antenna signal directly into the HR10, or into the multiswitch first? I only have one TV that needs the OTA signal.


Thanks!

[SpankyInChicago]

OK...

If you look back at my first post in this thread, you'll get some background on my problem. Over the past six weeks, I've replaced the diplexer on the roof twice. Each time, the problem goes away for 2-3 weeks, then it reappears. Of course, it reappeared yesterday (the day before the Super Bowl).

What could be causing my diplexers to die after 2-3 weeks of use? I'll go to Radio Shack today and buy another replacement diplexer, but this will get old after awhile. I could call DTV for service, but the techs that came out and installed it over a year ago were so bad and incompetent that I don't think I want them to come back. On top of that, I'm moving this summer, so I only have a few more months of use for this set-up anyway.

Any ideas are appreciated!

Thanks,
McTivo

Try buying a different brand of diplexer. If you want to drive out to Bartlett, I've got a couple of brand new Channel Master diplexers I'd give you. If you want to pay about $10 each for them you can go to Tristate Electronic in Mt. Prospect any buy the Channel Master brand of diplexers there.

[Vin]

I'm considering using the same setup. I want to put an indoor OTA antenna (Zenith Silver Sensor) in my attic, and run RG6 from the attic down the side of the house and into the living room where my 5x8 multiswitch and HR10 reside.

My problem is I already have four lines coming in through the wall (from the dish) and another going out (from the multiswitch to an upstairs TV). If I get the drill out to run another line in from the antenna I'm not sure my marriage will last. So I want to diplex the antenna line onto one of the four lines from the dish.

Some questions --
Have people had success with this setup?
What type of diplexer should I use (frequency ratings)?
When I separate the lines again on the other side, do I run the antenna signal directly into the HR10, or into the multiswitch first? I only have one TV that needs the OTA signal.


Thanks!
If you only need OTA on one TV and you're planning on using an indoor antenna, why do you feel the need to diplex at all? Why not put the Silver Sensor where the TV is that needs the OTA signal and run the cable directly into the HR10-250's antenna input?

If it's because you can't get reception with the SS this way and you feel that placing it in your attic will work better than you'll need a diplexer that passes power on one leg like this one (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?main_cat=203&CAT=&PROD=SPDX100).....separate the two signals with another diplexer before going into the 5x8.

[Mr. Bill]

I would not buy RatShack diplexers.

I have Eagle Aspen from Solid Signal and they are 5 bucks each. I diplex OTA to 4 different locations, inc. an HR10, with no issues at all.

[20fan]

I would not buy RatShack diplexers.

I have Eagle Aspen from Solid Signal and they are 5 bucks each. I diplex OTA to 4 different locations, inc. an HR10, with no issues at all.

Ratshack wanted over $23.00 each for diplexers in my area. I didn't find out until she rang them up (because I never expected them to be so much), you can imagine I told them they could keep them. Currently using a very cheap indoor antenna and the reception shows it. This is on a HD- HTL that was moved to the bedroom when the HR10-250 arrived. Where would be a good place to get the Eagle Aspens? Is Solid Signal a web company?

[pudge44]

If you only need OTA on one TV and you're planning on using an indoor antenna, why do you feel the need to diplex at all? Why not put the Silver Sensor where the TV is that needs the OTA signal and run the cable directly into the HR10-250's antenna input?

If it's because you can't get reception with the SS this way and you feel that placing it in your attic will work better than you'll need a diplexer that passes power on one leg like this one (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?main_cat=203&CAT=&PROD=SPDX100).....separate the two signals with another diplexer before going into the 5x8.

Yeah, I want to put it up in the attic to get better reception. I do all right with it sitting on top of th TV, but my TV's not in an entertainment center so it looks pretty ungainly up there. Doesn't do a whole lot sitting on the floor behind the TV. Up in my attic, there's a vent that's aimed right at the towers. I'm thinking I might do real well up there.

[McTivo]

I would not buy RatShack diplexers.

I have Eagle Aspen from Solid Signal and they are 5 bucks each. I diplex OTA to 4 different locations, inc. an HR10, with no issues at all.

What is the difference between PowerPass diplexers and regular diplexers? The diplexers I am currently using are the RCA D920s. 14 months ago, when the D* installers installed a Winegard antenna on the roof, they said that it drew power from the coax and need the "PowerPass" diplexers, so they installed the Eagle Aspen D-2100LX diplexers. Well, that antenna was not the right antenna for me, so I picked up an old-fashioned antenna from Radio Shack and swapped it with the Winegard. The Radio Shack antenna works great, but after I first hooked it up I noticed that the HDTivo was hissing. That's when I switched from the Eagle Aspen diplixers (the PowerPass ones) to the RCA diplexers (non-PowerPass). The hissing went away and everything worked great for a year.

I still have the Eagle Aspen diplexers, but I fear that I don't need the PowerPass capabilities that this model offers. Am I right? Are there any other brands of diplexers that aren't PowerPass? What about the Channel Master diplexers SpankyInChicago mentinoed?

Thanks for everyone's help!

McTivo

[Mr. Bill]

Sorry, I do not know the difference about the terms as you are using them.

I do know that there is another type of diplexer called dual-port passive. They are used only at the top end of an installation (near the dish) when you have an antenna that is drawing power through the same coax as the dish uses. They are built to handle the voltage switching back and forth from 13 volts to 17 volts that happens between a satellite receiver and the LNB as it changes to different LNBs/sats when you are changing channels.

If you have the dish/OTA typical setup, with an antenna that is non-powered or is powered via it's own separate connection to a power outlet, then you want a passive diplexer. SolidSignal.com is a web retailer and a very good one. They are a sponsor over at AVS. Eagle Aspen is a very good manufacturer of splitters, diplexers, tone generators and multiswitches.

You want the Eagle Aspen Single Port Power Passive Diplexer, Manufacturer P/N: D-2100LX. 5 bucks.

Now, I see that you said you have that model, so maybe your antenna is powered off the dish's coax?? If it is, get the DO-2100LX. I don't know what else it could be.

Hope that helps. ;)

Update: You may want to give Solid Signal a call -- they have great phone info. Or, try the AVS 'HDTV Reception Hardware' forum. They deal with OTA integration issues you have and there is a member there, SolidSignal, who works at their HQ and often chimes in (as does Greywolf from upthread here).

[Philly Bill]

So. I want to put an antenna in the attic. The Silver Sensor works great downstairs, but I don't want to look at it.

But I want two antenna inputs to the HDTIVO so I can record 2 OTA shows at the same time.

I guess no one recommends running the antenna feed into the multiswitch (also in the attic)?

If not, do I put a diplexer on each of two feeds coming out of the multiswitch, then hook a feed and antenna lead to each (split antenna with a splitter) and then two more diplexers on the TV end?

If I decide to keep the Silver Sensor DOWNstairs, can I just put a splitter on it and run a feed into each antenna input?

[pudge44]

So. I want to put an antenna in the attic. The Silver Sensor works great downstairs, but I don't want to look at it.

But I want two antenna inputs to the HDTIVO so I can record 2 OTA shows at the same time.

I guess no one recommends running the antenna feed into the multiswitch (also in the attic)?

If not, do I put a diplexer on each of two feeds coming out of the multiswitch, then hook a feed and antenna lead to each (split antenna with a splitter) and then two more diplexers on the TV end?

If I decide to keep the Silver Sensor DOWNstairs, can I just put a splitter on it and run a feed into each antenna input?

Phil, I'm pretty sure the HR10 has only one antenna input, and that it splits the OTA signal internally to allow dual tuner OTA recording.

[SpankyInChicago]

What is the difference between PowerPass diplexers and regular diplexers? The diplexers I am currently using are the RCA D920s. 14 months ago, when the D* installers installed a Winegard antenna on the roof, they said that it drew power from the coax and need the "PowerPass" diplexers, so they installed the Eagle Aspen D-2100LX diplexers. Well, that antenna was not the right antenna for me, so I picked up an old-fashioned antenna from Radio Shack and swapped it with the Winegard. The Radio Shack antenna works great, but after I first hooked it up I noticed that the HDTivo was hissing. That's when I switched from the Eagle Aspen diplixers (the PowerPass ones) to the RCA diplexers (non-PowerPass). The hissing went away and everything worked great for a year.

I still have the Eagle Aspen diplexers, but I fear that I don't need the PowerPass capabilities that this model offers. Am I right? Are there any other brands of diplexers that aren't PowerPass? What about the Channel Master diplexers SpankyInChicago mentinoed?

Thanks for everyone's help!

McTivo

The ChannelMasters pass DC power on the sat leg and block DC on the antenna leg. This should be what you need. Unless your antenna is powerd or has an amp, you need a DC block on the antenna leg.

[SpankyInChicago]

Phil, I'm pretty sure the HR10 has only one antenna input, and that it splits the OTA signal internally to allow dual tuner OTA recording.

This is correct.

[Mr. Bill]

.................
I guess no one recommends running the antenna feed into the multiswitch (also in the attic)?.....................

We do that with my setup described upthread and have no issues -- but our multiswitch is in the wire closet below the antenna's attic location.

[Philly Bill]

Phil, I'm pretty sure the HR10 has only one antenna input, and that it splits the OTA signal internally to allow dual tuner OTA recording.

Ah. Cool then. I did not know. Dad just said he could record two OTA at the same time. I just assumed there were two inputs.

Thanks!


**********************

So wait a minute. If I buy a 4x8 multiswitch (and it has that 5th input for an OTA antenna)... if I hook the OTA antenna to the multiswitch, then take two lines (out of the 8 coming out) and run them to my HDTIVO, do I need to put a diplexer on the end to split out the antenna from the sat line on one? How do I get an antenna feed out of those two lines I just ran to it out of my multiswitch?

[slapshot]

Ah. Cool then. I did not know. Dad just said he could record two OTA at the same time. I just assumed there were two inputs.

Thanks!


**********************

So wait a minute. If I buy a 4x8 multiswitch (and it has that 5th input for an OTA antenna)... if I hook the OTA antenna to the multiswitch, then take two lines (out of the 8 coming out) and run them to my HDTIVO, do I need to put a diplexer on the end to split out the antenna from the sat line on one? How do I get an antenna feed out of those two lines I just ran to it out of my multiswitch?

Yes you need a diplexer on one of two lines going to your tivo,creating a third line which would go to the antenna input.

[joetoronto]

i think someone asked this earlier, why not just run the cable for the antenna directly into the tivo?

[Mr. Bill]

i think someone asked this earlier, why not just run the cable for the antenna directly into the tivo?
Because a lot of people ran there cable to a central wire closet, then out from there. And they don't have that extra cable running to all their TV locations.

And yes, we know that we are screwed if we want MPEG4/AT9 dishes and still keep OTA and 2-tuner capabilities at those locations.

[Philly Bill]

So wait a minute. If I buy a 4x8 multiswitch (and it has that 5th input for an OTA antenna)... if I hook the OTA antenna to the multiswitch, then take two lines (out of the 8 coming out) and run them to my HDTIVO, do I need to put a diplexer on the end to split out the antenna from the sat line on one? How do I get an antenna feed out of those two lines I just ran to it out of my multiswitch?


So a multiswitch doesn't have an input for an OTA antenna? At least the Zinwell I bought (4x8) didn't.. it had a POWER input. WTF is the power for? Will it work without it? So I guess I just hook a diplexer up to one of the 8 outputs, then run that line to the TIVO, and put another diplexer on the other end with one into the sat in and one into the OTA? Does it matter which one goes in where?

[Philly Bill]

<bump>

[greywolf]

Power is supplier by the receiver for an unpowered switch. A powered switch is a more reliable power source for longer coax runs. A diplexer is marked Sat and Ant in addition to the common leg. The dish coax goes to Sat and the antenna coax goes to Ant at the top. At the receiver end, Sat goes to Sat and Ant to Ant.

[Philly Bill]

I still have a question regarding this diplexer. I looked at Solid Signals site. The diplexer is:

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=SPDX100&xzoom=zoom#xview

The image however confuses me. I thought I'd put the 'top end' diplexer onto the 'out' from the multi switch run that I wanted to use (with another diplexer at the TV end) for my OTA.

This pic indicates that the diplexer goes BEFORE the multiswitch. Does that mean I need four of them? Or just one? If one, how do I know which line coming out of the multiswitch (or LINE(S) coming out) that should be split at the TV end?

Geeze I feel like a dumbsh*t sometimes but I don't really understand. I don't mind trial and error, but I hate to buy more stuff than I need. :)
http://www.solidsignal.com/images/signal_diplexer_01.gifhttp://www.solidsignal.com/images/signal_diplexer_02.gif

[JimSpence]

That diagram is trying to be generic and cover either case whether a multiswitch is used or not. In your case, just connect the first diplexer on the one line from your multiswitch that you need to use and the other goes near the receiver. In other words, on the left diplexer where it says "Satellite Connection", make that one of the outputs from the multiswitch.

[greywolf]

Bad diagram. Put the diplexer on the line from the multiswitch to the receiver. One way to tell which line is to disconnect all the lines out of the multiswitch and into the receivers. Short the center to shield on the line at the receiver you want to use. Take a multimeter to test the lines at the multiswitch to see which one has continuity or even take a nine volt battery with test leads to see which line causes a little spark when the leads are placed on the center and shield.

[Philly Bill]

Thank you. :)

[Philly Bill]

That diagram is trying to be generic and cover either case whether a multiswitch is used or not. In your case, just connect the first diplexer on the one line from your multiswitch that you need to use and the other goes near the receiver. In other words, on the left diplexer where it says "Satellite Connection", make that one of the outputs from the multiswitch.


Do I HAVE to use a short jumper of coax to go from the multiswitch to the diplexer? Do they make a female/female connector to screw onto the male connectors of the multiswitch (out) and diplexer (in)?

[Arcady]

I think you would need a male/male connector. A quick search on google turned up hundreds of results. here's one (http://shop.vetcosurplus.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=765)