Noticed something the other night....

[berkchops516]

I was about to go to bed and saw that my tivo was recording something, went to check what it was recording and didn't see it in the "now playing" list so i switched to live tv.......it was recording an infomercial about the new producers movie. Thought it looked interesting so i didn't stop it from recording, i went to watch it today and i couldn't find it anywhere. On the channel guide it was listed as "Paid Programming" I just recently got my tivo and i am wondering if this is normal....and does tivo buy these "paid programming" time slots for those showcase things?

[jrinck]

What channel was it on?

It's probably a showcase, which gets somewhat randomly shown on Tivo Central. Those get broadcasted on a certain channel and saved in the deep recesses of the hard drive, inaccessible to the user.

[JimSpence]

That was definitely a showcase recording. Go to TiVo Central and then select Showcases. There you should see an entry for whatever it recorded. This is normal behavior and before you ask, the showcases are using reserved space on the hard drive. DirecTV used to use ch 581 or 582 for this, but recently I find my DVRs tuned to 6xx.

[megazone]

On my units there is a Gold Star promo for The Producers in TiVo Central, that's what the content was for.

And yes, the broadcasts are usually labeled 'Teleworld Paid Programming' and their used for the video content in promos and showcases.

[timr_42]

What channel are these on now? I used to get them when they were on Discovery, but havn't got them in a long time. :confused:

[JimSpence]

See my post above.

[berkchops516]

it was channel 3 on NY Cablevision

[megazone]

What channel are these on now? I used to get them when they were on Discovery, but havn't got them in a long time. :confused:Just search for 'Teleworld Paid Programming'

I've seen them, variously, on Discovery, A&E, TLC, PAX, and probably others.

[Tivo II Jack]

I have three Tivos running and at certain times, all three will switch to channel 31 and show that they are recording something but no recording is listed. From reading here it seems that they are recorded as Tivo showcases, something I have only even looked at by accident.

I can be sitting here watching TV and these ARROGANT jerks take it upon themselves to reach into my living room and change the channel on my TV. I also have a cable box w/DVR and if I happened to be recording to there at the time, these uninvited home invasions will ruin that recording.

It hasn't happened yet, but the first time it does I will cancel my two Tivo subscriptions, (third is lifetime subscription).

What do they think gives them the right to autorecord their advertising onto my equipment and who can I contact to put a stop to this??

[LiveBlues]

I have three Tivos running and at certain times, all three will switch to channel 31 and show that they are recording something but no recording is listed. From reading here it seems that they are recorded as Tivo showcases, something I have only even looked at by accident.

I can be sitting here watching TV and these ARROGANT jerks take it upon themselves to reach into my living room and change the channel on my TV. I also have a cable box w/DVR and if I happened to be recording to there at the time, these uninvited home invasions will ruin that recording.

It hasn't happened yet, but the first time it does I will cancel my two Tivo subscriptions, (third is lifetime subscription).

What do they think gives them the right to autorecord their advertising onto my equipment and who can I contact to put a stop to this??

I'm pretty sure that it won't interrupt a recording in progess to start recording it. It will just wait for an opportune time to do it. I find it amusing that after you go off on your rant, you then state that it hasn't happened yet.

[mick66]

It hasn't happened yet,



WTF?
Why spread such ignorance?

[megazone]

What do they think gives them the right to autorecord their advertising onto my equipment and who can I contact to put a stop to this??The user agreement that you agreed to when you signed up for the TiVo service. Didn't read it? Too bad.

And you can't stop it, there is no opt-out. Cancel your subscriptions if it bothers you.

[ZeoTiVo]

Please stop the hysteria

[MikeMar]

Will somebody please think of the CHILDREN!

[mrjam2jab]

Saw it last night. Was like an hour info-mercial. Even had the "The preceeding program was...." at the end. Was a bit about Harmony remote...and networking the TIVO...

Was like staying at a hotel and getting the channel that advertises the local amusement area... :-)

[jmoak]

I can be sitting here watching TV and these ARROGANT jerks take it upon themselves to reach into my living room and change the channel on my TV. "Those ARROGANT jerks" will ask you (by putting a message on your screen asking if it's ok to change the channel) before they change the channel on your TV. If you miss the warning, you can always change it back. "Those ARROGANT jerks" do not "lock up" your tv or anything.I also have a cable box w/DVR and if I happened to be recording to there at the time, these uninvited home invasions will ruin that recording.Only if your using your cable dvr to feed your tivo dvr. (which is kinda redundant, but each to his own) Also, your cable dvr has to be dumb enough to change the channel while it's recording without a "You sure you want to cancel this recording?" warning, which may explain why you have a tivo in the first place.(;))It hasn't happened yet, but the first time it does I will cancel my two Tivo subscriptions, (third is lifetime subscription).Good for you. A man gotta do what a man gotta do, eh?What do they think gives them the right to autorecord their advertising onto my equipmentThe service agrement you agreed to when you signed up for tivo service.

[Tivo II Jack]

I find it amusing that after you go off on your rant, you then state that it hasn't happened yet.

Looks like I wandered into a flock of Tivo sheep. If the Tivo shepherd tells me I must allow them to change my channel whenever they want, I shall not be annoyed, I shall simply blend with the flock and bow down to the shepherd. As for finding my "rant" "amusing", if I were throwing rocks at you and missing, would you only get annoyed when one bounced off your sheepish head? You think this is not annoying in any way, Scroll down to the scenario about watching a movie.



WTF?
Why spread such ignorance?

Are you the shepherd's pet or simply the best follower in the flock?



"Those ARROGANT jerks" do not "lock up" your tv or anything.Only if your using your cable dvr to feed your tivo dvr. (which is kinda redundant, but each to his own)

And you must be the techno-sheep. I have four feeds going into my HDTV. One direct from each of the cable boxes and one from each cable box that goes through a Tivo first. The channels are controlled by the cable box and bypassing it leaves you in a channel house of mirrors. This setup allows me to watch and/or record programs in HD. The Tivos are the unnecessary part of the equation, but since one has lifetime subscription and the other costs a pittance of 6 bucks a month I keep them for some of the Tivo advantages. They are the slo-mo and better ability to search a recording as well as two week vs one week advance programming. I rarely watch anything with Tivo's inferior picture unless I want to look at something in slo-mo or I need to do a quick search



"Those ARROGANT jerks" will ask you (by putting a message on your screen asking if it's ok to change the channel) before they change the channel on your TV. If you miss the warning, you can always change it back.

OK techno, picture this. I am sitting home at about 2AM and happen to see that a movie I want to watch is on the TNT HD channel and starts in a few minutes. OK, I make myself comfortable and begin watching the movie. Forty five minutes into the movie and during a commercial break, I decide to make myself a sandwich confident that when I get back I can simply rewind to where I was if the commercials had ended. I am not there when it asks if I want to change the channel, so it does. The cable box will just do as it was told because the Tivo sends the cable box the command to change as if it came from me.

I sit down glad to see the ads are still running but after a minute or so, I realize what has happened. Since the channels on the Tivo and the cable box have changed, there is no rewinding and the 45 minutes I spent watching the movie are for nothing.



Now lets look at the "agreement" that rules this flock.

12. Advertising and Promotions. The TiVo service is advertiser supported. The hard disk drive of your TiVo DVR contains reserved space in addition to the advertised recording capacity. TiVo reserves the right to send content (including advertising and promotional material) to such reserved portions of your TiVo DVR's hard disk drive as part of the TiVo service. In order to send such content, you agree that TiVo may tune your TiVo DVR to a particular channel at a particular time.



Did you all miss that word particular in the agreement?? It doesn't say at random times, it doesn't say whenever the Tivo shepherd decides to reach into your sheep pen and disrupt your viewing, it says "at a PARTICULAR time". Since Tivo sells ads at prices determined by the number of subscribers it doesn't matter at what time they send these things out and it doesn't matter if I actually watch them or not. Compare it to a magazine that also gets paid for ads based upon their number of readers. I might read the magazine, but it doesn't guarantee I will read your ad. That said, each subscriber should be able to log onto their account and in the Showcases section, enter a preferred time, a PARTICULAR time to send these ads.

[jmoak]

Jeeze, Jack! It was not my intention to upset you or to belittle you in any way. I must have somehow misunderstood or misinterpreted your post somehow when I replied. I was just trying to explain what was going on with your problems to the best of my ability.

Judging from the tone your latest reply, I seem to have inadvertently hit a nerve. I apologize for any undue frustration I may have caused you.

I still don't quite understand, but to try to do so may cause more frustration and ill will.

Please forgive me and I will refrain from any further replies.

I wish you the best of luck with your setup.

[ChuckyBox]

I am sitting home at about 2AM and happen to see that a movie I want to watch...
I can't help you with the politics, but when the movie starts, or when you get up to make your sandwich, you can push the "Record" button on the cable DVR. When the TiVo tries to change the channel, the cable DVR will object, and your buffer will be preserved. Pushing "Pause" may have a similar effect.

The same basic situation can occur any time you are watching live TV with a TiVo -- if you walk away, the TiVo may change channels to record something. Again, the solution is to hit the record button, but in this case it's the TiVo's record button. If it creates a conflict, the TiVo will tell you and you can make a decision about what to do.

But the real solution, in your case, is to not have one DVR controlling another DVR, which just seems like it would inevitably lead to conflicts.


That said, each subscriber should be able to log onto their account and in the Showcases section, enter a preferred time, a PARTICULAR time to send these ads.
TiVo has to buy broadcast time from a cable network in order distribute the content. Buying enough blocks of time to accommodate the various preferences of 1.2 million SA subscribers would be impractical.

[Tivo II Jack]

Jeeze, Jack! It was not my intention to upset you or to belittle you in any way. I must have somehow misunderstood or misinterpreted your post somehow when I replied. I was just trying to explain what was going on with your problems to the best of my ability.

No, I guess I will be the one apologizing, your reply just was the last of several others who were just wisecracks and I guess I read too much into it. Sorry

[Tivo II Jack]

TiVo has to buy broadcast time from a cable network in order distribute the content. Buying enough blocks of time to accommodate the various preferences of 1.2 million SA subscribers would be impractical.

Understood, I was assuming it was something Tivo transmitted to the recorder themselves but it actually is being broadcast via cable TV, that is why it always comes on at the exact same time.

[Fixer]

12. Advertising and Promotions. The TiVo service is advertiser supported. The hard disk drive of your TiVo DVR contains reserved space in addition to the advertised recording capacity. TiVo reserves the right to send content (including advertising and promotional material) to such reserved portions of your TiVo DVR's hard disk drive as part of the TiVo service. In order to send such content, you agree that TiVo may tune your TiVo DVR to a particular channel at a particular time.
Here's a challenge to TiVo Corp. or anyone here who happens to be a manager at a store that sells TiVos: Take the part of the "agreement" mentioned above, and print it out in bold, easy to read letters. Also state that the "service" costs $13 a month and that the box will not record anything at all, even timer based recordings, unless this is paid. Now, tape it to the shelves where the TiVos are located. So, TiVo, are you willing to take my challenge?? ;)

The user agreement that you agreed to when you signed up for the TiVo service. Didn't read it? Too bad.

And you can't stop it, there is no opt-out. Cancel your subscriptions if it bothers you.

LOL!!! I think you and Zeo should be on the same TiVo marketing team. It looks as though you two have indentical agendas in mind.



...

[ZeoTiVo]

LOL!!! I think you and Zeo should be on the same TiVo marketing team. It looks as though you two have indentical agendas in mind.



...

it is interesting how you always like to point a finger at us as being poredictible when YOU in fact are the one who will always post some diatrabe explaining how TiVo is bad and then try and drag our user names into your nonsense.

I would think an outside observer would see you with the very limited agenda.


PS - it is very clearly marked on the outside of the TiVo box that you must subscribe for the TiVo to work. The Dollar amount is not there as it may change and indeed for a second TiVo it would be 6.95 a month.

TiVo also lists the website where you can get full details and supports a 30 day money back policy. Your challange is simply repitition of what TiVo has already done but in bold print. Perhaps if other consumer electronics did this for similar policies and TiVo did not your post would hold some merit, as it is your post does not hold any merit - but that is just repitition on my part now to say your post holds no merit

[Fixer]

...it is very clearly marked on the outside of the TiVo box that you must subscribe for the TiVo to work. The Dollar amount is not there as it may change and indeed for a second TiVo it would be 6.95 a month.Sure, I know that, but the following ISN'T on the box, or in any of the hardcopy documentation in the box:
The TiVo service is advertiser supported
My cell phone plan is NOT advertiser supported.
My premium cable channels are NOT advertiser supported.
My XM "first party", XM owned channels are NOT advertiser supported.
My broadband internet connection is NOT advertiser supported.

So, explain to me why TiVo is the ONLY premium service that I pay for, that IS ADVERTISER SUPPORTED????? If their product is truly what television is meant to be, and they really want me the have "TV my way", then they should be able to sell it to the masses on it's own merits, and not rely on "advertiser support".

BTW, my challenge still stands. Post that part of the agreement in plain view of the product, so folks see the whole picture BEFORE they buy. I dare them... ;)

...

[megazone]

And they're not going to take your dumbass dare, and no one really cares. And I do recall the advertiser information being in the printed documentation.

So you challenge TiVo. Big deal. Most people really don't care about something so easily ignored as the ads on a TiVo, they have better things to do with their lives.

[Fixer]

And they're not going to take your dumbass dare and no one really cares.
Oh, I don't expect them to, but I thought I'd throw it out there anyway. ;)

See, that's the thing with any "religion" and those they want to "convert". The leaders always tout the "goodness" of their "belief" and others should accept this and follow the way of "righteousness". What they absolutely refuse to discuss is the "apocrypha" of their "doctrine". If the information was made available before "indoctrination", how many people do you think they can entice into the "fold"??

And I do recall the advertiser information being in the printed documentation.
I keep all of the TiVo manuals and other "from the box" hardcopy documents in a file. I've gone through them again, and have seen no such thing. The only time this was presented to me was when I registered online. If I had registered by phone, would a hardcopy have been mailed to me? :confused:

So you challenge TiVo. Big deal. Most people really don't care about something so easily ignored as the ads on a TiVo, they have better things to do with their lives.I'm going to key in on this phrase: Most people really don't care about something so easily ignored as the ads on a TiVo. You're right. As it stands right now, the ads are indeed easy to ignore and aren't really all that intrusive. However, the fact they do it to begin with can potentially lead to a much less user friendly enviroment. Here's a scenario for you:

Advertising Exec: Hello, TiVo Ads and Marketing? I'm with "In Your Face Advertising", and we represent "Unwelcome Products Inc.". We recently purchased advertising time and space from you, which is transmitted to users of your service. It has come to our attention that our ads are "easily ignored" and can be skipped over with undue ease. This leads us to conclude that our efforts are going unnoticed and that our time and money is being wasted. Is there any way you can make your ad system more intrusive to the user?? If you can not accommodate us, we will be forced to find another avenue to promote our product.

TiVo ad department goon: Don't worry Mr. "In Your Face Exec". We will implement a change in the next software rollout. You can be rest assured that your efforts will no longer be "easily ignored".

:eek:

Simply put, new customers need to be made aware. That's all I am asking. I know all of this has been mentioned plenty of times before, but it is good to stir the embers every so often to keep the fire burning. ;)

...

[ZeoTiVo]

See, that's the thing with any "religion" and those they want to "convert". The leaders always tout the "goodness" of their "belief" and others should accept this and follow the way of "righteousness". What they absolutely refuse to discuss is the "apocrypha" of their "doctrine". If the information was made available before "indoctrination", how many people do you think they can entice into the "fold"??



that is correct and few will buy into your "advertising is ruining TiVo" religion.
YOU refuse to acknowledge how unintrusive ads on TiVo are to the majority of people and instead want every one to acknowledge your religous hatred of "Evil TiVo ad execs out to lie and cheat their way to riches" and the slippery slope.
YOU refuse to acknowledge the very contradiciton of your assertions - TiVo is indeed a subscription service and if they let ads get intrusive they loose the subscriptions. This is not some blind defense of an incoprporated company, just common business sense.

[Fixer]

YOU refuse to acknowledge how unintrusive ads on TiVo are to the majority of people...Really?? It seems as though I said this earlier:
You're right. As it stands right now, the ads are indeed easy to ignore and aren't really all that intrusive.

Moving on...
...and instead want every one to acknowledge your religous hatred of "Evil TiVo ad execs out to lie and cheat their way to riches" and the slippery slope.
The writing is on the wall. Some of the early adopters of HMO should understand. They basically paid to "beta test" an option that TiVo later released as part of the original subscription. These folks were then told, "sorry, no refund". Some managed to get a few bucks worth of credit out of TiVo, but that was it. Talk about a slap in the face of your most staunch supporters. IMO, TiVo "gave" HMO away to appease the folks that frowned upon their "advertiser supported" agenda. They made it seem like we were getting a "good value" for $13 a month. As far as I'm concerned the HMO features suck, and didn't add any value to my box at all.

In response to the "...Evil TiVo ad execs out to lie and cheat their way to riches" statement: "Money grubbing" companies such as Microsoft are currently offering FULL refunds of EPG subscription fees to everyone who has paid, and has decided to "give" the EPG away. Will they add an "ad supported" feature in the future? It's quite possible, but I'd have less of an issue with it since one would be getting the EPG for free.

YOU refuse to acknowledge the very contradiciton of your assertions - TiVo is indeed a subscription service and if they let ads get intrusive they loose the subscriptions. This is not some blind defense of an incoprporated company, just common business sense.
My cell phone plan is NOT advertiser supported.
My premium cable channels are NOT advertiser supported.
My XM "first party", XM owned channels are NOT advertiser supported.
My broadband internet connection is NOT advertiser supported.

So, explain to me why TiVo is the ONLY premium service that I pay for, that IS ADVERTISER SUPPORTED????? If their product is truly what television is meant to be, and they really want me to have "TV my way", then they should be able to sell it to the masses on it's own merits, and not rely on "advertiser support".

...

[ZeoTiVo]

The writing is on the wall. Some of the early adopters of HMO should understand. They basically paid to "beta test" an option that TiVo later released as part of the original subscription. These folks were then told, "sorry, no refund". Some managed to get a few bucks worth of credit out of TiVo, but that was it. Talk about a slap in the face of your most staunch supporters. IMO, TiVo "gave" HMO away to appease the folks that frowned upon their "advertiser supported" agenda. They made it seem like we were getting a "good value" for $13 a month. As far as I'm concerned the HMO features suck, and didn't add any value to my box at all.

umm, no - HMO was included into the standard TiVo subscription because they were selling it to only a small part of the subscriber base and they made the decision to take it as a marketing cost to give TTG away and it was easier to bundle HMO into plan then advertise TTG for free but only after paying for HMO.

I was in those threads on HMO myself as someone who had paid for it about 4 months before it went free. You should check my accolyte standing against those threads, I certainly was not saying TiVo did the right thing there. I also was saying they should have done an automatic prorated rebate of HMO fees without having to call in.

But I definitely saw no credible evidence that HMO was included in subscription to make people happy over advertising. That would be your belief which must be faith based since I know of nothing to prove it

[dgh]

My cell phone plan is NOT advertiser supported.
My premium cable channels are NOT advertiser supported.
My XM "first party", XM owned channels are NOT advertiser supported.
My broadband internet connection is NOT advertiser supported.

So, explain to me why TiVo is the ONLY premium service that I pay for, that IS ADVERTISER SUPPORTED?????


Didn't it seem a little comical to you that you had to work so carefully on those? Your phone plan is not ad supported. Some are. Your premium channels (where premium channel is defined as a channel without ads) are not ad supported. The ones that don't meet that definition are ad supported - by definition. Your XM - insert list of carefully selected adjectives - channels aren't. That seems to imply that some XM channels are. I didn't know that. Your Internet connection isn't - some are. And TiVo is. Some PVRs aren't. So... choose according to taste.

I guess my magazine subscriptions, newspaper subscriptions, power, water, credit cards, movies, DVDs etc. are all "non-premium" by your definition of premium (no ads), therefore I can't use them as examples of premium services with ads. ;)

IMO, TiVo "gave" HMO away to appease the folks that frowned upon their "advertiser supported" agenda. They made it seem like we were getting a "good value" for $13 a month.

That seems unlikely. After all, TiVo was advertising supported for years before HMO existed. It seems like the simple market conditions and competitive threats that drive all companies are a more likely explanation for the change in HMO policy.

As far as I'm concerned the HMO features suck, and didn't add any value to my box at all.

You seem to be debating your own opinion. They didn't get any appeasement out of you and you frown on their "agenda". Failure to do something you theorized generally suggests a problem with the theory.


"Money grubbing" companies such as Microsoft are currently offering FULL refunds of EPG subscription fees to everyone who has paid, and has decided to "give" the EPG away. Will they add an "ad supported" feature in the future? It's quite possible, but I'd have less of an issue with it since one would be getting the EPG for free.

Companies the size of Microsoft can, and often do, use their massive profitability in other areas to destroy a market they want before they take it over. Smaller companies will always be faced with that threat. As for your last statement, about having less of an issue if the EPG was free - you've said that before - but when you said it before I beleive you also said that that would be the day you got rid of your TiVo service. That's not much of an encouragement for TiVo to make that change.

Getting back to your other question:


So, explain to me why TiVo is the ONLY premium service that I pay for, that IS ADVERTISER SUPPORTED?????

Yeah! Why do you? It's your service - your choice. What makes TiVo special enough to you to make it the only premium service that you choose to pay for that also has ads?

[starvoyager]

turn off tivo suggestions go to:
messages and settings
than to settings
than to recording
than to tivo suggestions
click on No dont record tivo suggestions

now your done, now if we can find a way to get them to pay us for getting a tivo maybe we be somewhere?

[megazone]

The writing is on the wall. Some of the early adopters of HMO should understand. They basically paid to "beta test" an option that TiVo later released as part of the original subscription. These folks were then told, "sorry, no refund". Some managed to get a few bucks worth of credit out of TiVo, but that was it. Talk about a slap in the face of your most staunch supporters. IMO, TiVo "gave" HMO away to appease the folks that frowned upon their "advertiser supported" agenda. They made it seem like we were getting a "good value" for $13 a month. As far as I'm concerned the HMO features suck, and didn't add any value to my box at all.I paid for HMO on three boxes. I was utterly unsurprised when HMO because a free part of the service. In fact, I always expected it to happen eventually because I recognized that the basic DVR fuctionality would become commoditized and TiVo would need to roll more features into the 'basic' functionality of the box as a differentiator.

I never asked for nor expected a refund, and I think those who did are fools. If anyone took it is a 'slap in the face', that's their problem. To me it is just normal product evolution, and it happens all the time. Prices come down, extra features become standard, etc. That's just the way of the world.

[ThreeSoFar]

<ralph wiggums>

Trolls are funny!

</ralph wiggums>

[lajohn27]

<ralph wiggums>

Trolls are funny!

</ralph wiggums>


Aren't they tho?