7.2 killing my 810H

[deadenders]

My Pioneer 810H got the 7.2 upgrade last night. After the reboot it worked for about 15 minutes before glitching (freezing). At 1st I thought it was the Sat. signal. Switch TV inputs to view the Sat directly (I have one output to the TV, on to the Tivo) Sat was fine. By the time I switched back to the Tivo input the unit and completely frozen and would not respond to remote or anything. Pulled the plug to reboot. Now it locks up about every 15 mins or so. My Tivo is now useless. WTF??? Some upgrade.

[petew]

Have you upgraded the disk drive at all? If yes then the swap partition might be slightly too small. Typically this seems to manifest itself as problem booting, but it's conceivable that it could cause problems once the box was up and running.

If you haven't upgraded the box at all I'd suggest calling Tivo. The behavior your seeing isn't normal.

[wgary]

I haven't seen this with my Pioneer...

[nigebj]

I haven't seen this with my Pioneer...
Nor I. This sounds like a HD problem. As TiVo swaps partitions when it upgrades, it could be you are now using a defective part of the disk ?? Not sure there's a way to force a service change, or a step back if TiVo thinks it went well. I'd assume you could ask TiVo to provide a service update again, which would switch it back to the good partition (assuming that is the problem). Might be worth asking.

Of course if, like mine, your TiVo is never usually rebooted - then you're in teh classic HD failure situation, boot time is when you find out about the issues you never knew were there!

[deadenders]

It is an upgraded disk. A 250 if I recall. Not sure (off the top of my head) about how to go about changing the swap size.

[deadenders]

Any chance this could have something to do with a serial connection to a Direct TV box? The drive has worked fine and through many reboots for at long long time without any trouble so if find it a bit hard to belive it's the swap file.

[petew]

Any chance this could have something to do with a serial connection to a Direct TV box? The drive has worked fine and through many reboots for at long long time without any trouble so if find it a bit hard to belive it's the swap file.

There have been a few reports of limited swap space causing problems during a reboot. It's recomended that you allocate 1Mb per 1Gb of disk space, with the default being 128Mb, so you should have 256Mb on your 250Gb drive. With each release Tivo add new functionality which requires additional resources and it seems that some users that didn't increase swap space while upgrading were OK on earlier releases but 7.2 put them over the edge.

Of course it might be some other HD problem but it's certainly worth checking swap space first as some of the HOWTO guides ommitted this step. AFAIK the only way to rebuild the swap space is to redo the upgrade process.

[Semco]

I just got the message that I got TTG on my 810H but when I looked on the system page I'm still running 5.2. Hopefully I wont have the same issues that you did when I get the update.

[settsu]

I too got the message saying I now have TiVoToGo, but the Setup screen doesn't reflect the change TiVo says I should see (Account & System Info replaces System Info).

I was all excited for nothing... boohoo

[Tivortex]

Ah ha! This explains why I had to specifically re-enable networking the other day, through a menu I've never seen before. I've got an upgraded 300GB drive, sure hope I don't start having the problems described here, 'cause I just can not deal with that kind of frustration.

[Ba Boop]

I just got the message that I got TTG on my 810H but when I looked on the system page I'm still running 5.2. Hopefully I wont have the same issues that you did when I get the update.

You have to restart for upgrade to install. First thing I noticed is, it now lists the name of a DVD in the machine. Never did that before. It now see's my laptop and desktops transferred shows. Transfer from laptop back to Tivo. Wow!!! It really works. I have an upgraded HD and it seems fine so far...

[warner]

I have the exact same problem with my Pioneer 810h also (upgraded to 250 hdd). Right after the 7.2 upgrade, it is freezing constantly. After reboot, it will freeze again after 5 or 10 minutes. Prior to this I did not have a single problem. Does anyone have a solution to this yet? Can I rollback to the pervious version? I have absolutely no use for TTG.

[kerkules]

I've got the same problem in an upgraded (250 gig) 810. Can't record to DVD, causes it to freeze immediately. Also freezes after watching recorded or recording shows. Never had any problems before the update.

[vanreuter]

I have 2 810h's both with 300+ gig HD (from Weaknees) and only ONE unit is having this problem. Has anyone contacted tivo? Are THEY even aware of the problem? Are we 810H owners, who suffers through a year of crappy picture quality before a software upgrade, going to get the sh t end of the stick again? Are we the EDSEL owners of the 21st century?


GVB

[unconnoisseur]

Well, I seem to have 7.2 problems on my Pioneer 810H, but they're different. No upgrades.

1. Consistently hangs for a very long time if I view another Tivo or my server and then left-click to return.

2. More than 50% of burns end with "internal error". It kills the DVD-R as well. Restarting doesn't seem to help. Power off/on seems to help until I trip over the problem again.

Has anybody seen this behavior?

-unc

[JoshNJ]

I have the same issue on my upgraded-harddrive 810h. My unit worked perfectly fine before the software upgrade. Freezes like every 15-20 minutes.

[petew]

There have been a few reports of limited swap space causing problems during a reboot. It's recomended that you allocate 1Mb per 1Gb of disk space, with the default being 128Mb, so you should have 256Mb on your 250Gb drive.

I wrote this from memory and got the rule of thumb wrong, it's 1Mb of swap for every 2Gb of disk. So in theory for a 250Gb disk that would be 125Mb swap. Standard Tivo's have 128Mb which should be enough, however the DVD-recorder units have extra functionality so 128Mb may just not quite enough for a 250Gb disk. I don't own an 810H so I'm just analyzing the problem from my perspective as a software support enigneer, and it seems to be specific to 810H with 250Gb drives. So I'd suggest either using mfstools to rebuild your drive with more swap space or putting your old drive back and confirming that the 7.2 upgrade will work with a smaller disk.

[dirtypacman]

No problems here with a non-upgraded 810H running 7.2

[wander2166]

This is crazy I also have a pioneer 810 with a 250 gig hd.I did not have any problems before this stupid upgrade.....I called Tivo and after waiting on hold for 20 min. they told me to call pioneer ,which I thought was crazy being the software is made by tivo. Anyways I called pioneer and the genius there I had two options either call tivo or erase all my settings formatting everything on the hd and re-install the update software.Nice choices .Now I am really pissed I call tivo back and sit another 20 min. on hold ,once a rep came on I explained the problem and they said to call pioneer so I told them what pioneer said.I asked them to explain to me how they can justify not having a fix and also charge me for a service I can't use.They said they were sorry....We'll guess what Tivo sorry doesn't cut it.
Any suggestions ?
Thanks

[azitnay]

As the rest of this thread states, test your hard drive. It's most likely failing.

Regardless, when you cracked your case and upgraded your hard drive, you lost your right to complain to TiVo when something goes wrong.

Drew

[jules5671]

I have the same issue with my Pioneer 810 constantly crashing after about 15 mins. That makes 6 of us on this thread so I highly doubt it's a hard drive issue. If anybody finds a solution please let me know. This is so annoying!

[wander2166]

No........It is a new HD.
Just because I opened my Tivo doesn't mean that I shouldn't get the services I pay for.
It only voids the warranty.

[dirtypacman]

It only voids the warranty.


LOL which in all intents and purposes voids the service contract.

I understand your frustration but it looks like the issue may be with the upgraded hard drive. And this is something tivo can only be so helpful with. There software was most likely made and tested for units that are factory sealed.

If you buy a computer from Dell and then replace the Hard Drive and then your operating system does not work properly who's fault should this be.

Dell / Windows / or yourself?

With all that said ... I suggest :

a) you most likely have the stock hard drive it came with- you can either put that back in

or

b) take another shot at re-doing your upgrade

[Lensman]

Hey, my 810H with a Weaknees upgrade just started freezing every couple of days. I'll go home and check to see if it was recently upgraded to 7.2.

I was worried that it was a failing hard drive and was going to buy another drive today. Thank goodness for this forum!

[warner]

I want to add that my 250 gig drive is from Weaknees also. Along with the constant freezing, I just realize I can't seem to get into the Wishlist or Season Pass Manager screen. Nothing happens when I press Select over those items.

[azitnay]

Has anyone reporting the freezing problem in this thread actually pulled their drive and run manufacturer diagnostics on it? It would be nice to get a confirmation one way or another.

Drew

[vanreuter]

[QUOTE=azitnay]As the rest of this thread states, test your hard drive. It's most likely failing.

The upgrade has a glitch in it. I have 2 810H's from Weaknees with 300 gig Hd's. One
is fine, the other isn't. Tivo sent the upgrade. Tivo is responsible for what happens. All the 810h's were ok, PRIOR to the software upgrade. If you don't have an 810,. what could you possibly know? Whatever the problem, there is a solution, and it's software based. Dirtypacman, you don't have an upgraded HD, so your input isn't helpful. This is a software glitch that should have been beta-tested with 810H owners. Only a loud and constant outcry to TIVO will solve this problem. Wise-acres who don't have the same unit or situation should find another thread.


GVB

[wander2166]

After reading up on the freezing and calling tivo and pioneer....I decided that the only thing to do was re-do the upgrade I had made from an 80 gig to a 250 gig.
I copied my 250 gig hd and then expanded the drive once I restored it to the drive.
After the 7.2 update came down recording capacity was 170 hrs.
After I re-did the upgrade recording capacity was 326 hrs.
It has something to do with the swap file the 7.2 update creates.

After doing this I have no more freezing.....No help from tivo or pioneer.
:up: :up:

[petew]

Wise-acres who don't have the same unit or situation should find another thread.


Agreed some of us trying to help on this thread don't have the same equipment otherwise we'd just try our suggestions and post the results. But what we do have is professional and personal experience with similar issues and we're trying to offer constructive advice.

So for those that are interested:

Firstly. As previously stated by opening your box and replacing the disk you void any warranty and right to support from Tivo or Pioneer. Though you may be able to get some help from weaknees if you purchased your upgrade from them.

Secondly. It does seem to be more than just a coincidence that upgraded systems are failing. Tivo and/or Panasonic would have tested the upgrade with the standard configurations, so until someone can demonstrate that the same problem occurs with the original disk drive, Tivo would be right to assume that the upgrade caused the problem.

Thirdly. Tivo's are designed to swap. That is the amount of memory needed is larger than the memory available. To solve this problem the Operating System "swaps" the contents of real memory to and from the disk drive as necessary. For this to work correctly the portion of the disk dedicated to "swap" needs to be large enough. As new functionality has been added to Tivo the amount of memory needed will have increased, also the amount of memory needed is affected by the size of the disk drive. So adding a larger disk will increase the amount of memory needed. If the maxiumum memory needed is even 1 byte less than that available your Tivo will operate normally, however if anything changes to push that requiremnt over the amount available problems will occur. So if someone is willing to be adventurous I would suggest taking out the disk and first run diagnostics on it. Then assuming you're willing to either sacrafice your recordings or have a spare large disk, use mfstools to backup and restore your disk using the -s 256 option to mfsretore which will create the larger swap space. I can't guarantee this will fix the problem but IMHO it's worth a shot.

Pete

[petew]

After I re-did the upgrade recording capacity was 326 hrs.
It has something to do with the swap file the 7.2 update creates.

After doing this I have no more freezing.....No help from tivo or pioneer.
:up: :up:

Can you post the mfsrestore command you used to redo the upgrade?

[wander2166]

Ok, another successful Pioneer 810 upgrade. Thanks for tangent1138's
post for pretty much the steps I used.

Using the pioneer810-5.2.1a-01-2-275.bak file you can start at step 9.

Don't forget to do :
Messages and Setup -> Restart or Reset System -> Clear & Delete Everything
After you have rebooted the image on the 810.

1) Created Ptvupgrades's MFStools 2.0 cd with LBA48 support from here:
http://www.ptvupgrade.com/downloads/ptv-mfstools2-large-disk.iso

2) Found an old 2 GB hdd, added to my XP PC (which is NTFS) and
formatted 2 GB hdd as Fat32

3) Turned off PC, turned off TiVo, disconnected PC system hdd, removed
TiVo drive and hooked up drives as follows:

Primary Master - 2GB empty Fat32 drive = hda
Primary Slave - original TiVo drive (80 gb Maxtor) = hdb
Secondary Master - cd-rom drive = hdc

4) Booted PC to bios and changed boot sequence in bios to boot from the
cd drive first

5) Booted with MFStools 2.0 cd

6) At # prompt, typed the following commands to mount my fat32 drive:

mkdir /mnt/dos
mount /dev/hda1 /mnt/dos

7) At the next # prompt, typed the following to backup my TiVo drive:

mfsbackup -f 9999 -6so /mnt/dos/ptivo.bak /dev/hdb

8) Unmounted the drives and shut down the system

umount -f -a -r

Pressed Ctrl-Alt-Del to shutdown and reboot. When system started to
reboot, I powered down the PC.

9) Removed the original 80GB TiVo drive and replaced it with the Maxtor
250GB drive (Primary Slave, Maxtor L01P250)

10) Booted the PC again with MFStools 2.0 cd

11) At # prompt, typed the following commands to mount my fat32 drive:

mkdir /mnt/dos
mount /dev/hda1 /mnt/dos

12) At the next # prompt, typed the following to restore the backup TiVo
image to my new 250GB drive:

mfsrestore -x -s 127 -zpi /mnt/dos/ptivo.bak /dev/hdb

13) Unmounted the drives and shut down the system

umount -f -a -r

Pressed Ctrl-Alt-Del to shutdown and reboot.

14) I installed the new TiVo hard drive in the TiVo unit and powered up
the system. Did a Messages and Setup -> Restart or Reset System ->
Clear & Delete Everything. No errors or any problems. I went through a
normal system setup and once I was done, I checked the System Information
and found I have up to 293 hours.

[azitnay]

wander, did you let your unit upgrade back to 7.2? I only ask because you restored from a 5.2.1a image, and you didn't explicitly mention letting it upgrade in your steps.

I'm only asking because I'm under the impression that people started seeing this problem after 7.2 came down.

Drew

[petew]

After the 7.2 update came down recording capacity was 170 hrs.
After I re-did the upgrade recording capacity was 326 hrs.


Interesting.

SA Tivo's up to 4.x did not include the LBA48 support for large disks. So most upgrade instructions recommended MFSTools 1.2 which only initializes as much of the disk as a non LBA48 kernel can access. This would be consistent with a 170hrs capacity at 800Mb/Hr for DVD basic quality.

When using MFSTools 2.0 the full disk is initialized which would be consistent with 326hrs. So I wonder what else MFSTools 1.2 might be doing differently.

[DavidBillstrom]

810 without any upgrades, in fact haven't turned it off hardly in at least a year...

...started freezing sometime in the past 2 weeks (I was gone, but it was on). Came back to it frozen. Plug in/out power mains will re-start it without any apparent loss of data. Now doing it at least once a day.

Yes, saw a message about TTG and sure enough, this is now running 7.2 (but can't tell when it got it).

No other symptoms of bad disc, and the timing is suspicious...

Any suggestions?
David.

[unconnoisseur]

Does anybody care that my system is failing while I have had NO upgrade and perfect function for months (years?) prior to the upgrade to 7.2 and started havng the troubles I described above immediately after the upgrade?

I do NOT have a random freeze every 15 minutes. I have one precisely when I surf to another Tivo or Tivo server and try to return. Very reproducible.

And I have "internal error"s when I burn, about half the time -- only since the upgrade.

So, maybe it is a separate problem from the others who upgraded, but I don't want my problems to get lost in the shuffle here.

I guess nobody else has my particular troubles?

-unc

[petew]

And I have "internal error"s when I burn, about half the time -- only since the upgrade.



I would classify this as a different problem. I suggest you try calling Tivo/Pioneer since you have an unmodified unit.

[Praedicator]

Before receiving the upgrade my 810H reported 477 hours (upgraded w/ 400GB drive) and after receiving the upgrade it reports 531 HOURS!!

Just when I thought there couldn't be any bad news I had to re-run through guided setup because Comcast changed some chanel lineup info.

During the initial call-in for guided setup it took ~10 minutes to even dial but finally made the call-in and downloaded the data.

Now it's been stuck at the "Loading info- preparing to load..." stage for over 15 minutes!

WTF?!?

Is there anything that can be done? Should I go back to the original 80GB drive and try to start over?

[wander2166]

I backed up my 250 gig HD then did a restore and expand of that .bak file.

The end result was a backup image file of my original 7.2 software then restored and expanded.

The instructions I listed said if using 5.2 image to skip to step 9.
I was doing a backup and restore so I did all the steps and worked for me.

[yekim]

I backed up my 250 gig HD then did a restore and expand of that .bak file.

The end result was a backup image file of my original 7.2 software then restored and expanded.

The instructions I listed said if using 5.2 image to skip to step 9.
I was doing a backup and restore so I did all the steps and worked for me.


So let me see if I got this right... you just backed up your existing Tivo (7.2, the version that was causing you to crash), and then restored that same version and now it works??? How long has it been stable, etc....?

[wander2166]

Yes.......that is correct.
By doing a backup then restore it fixes the swap file that the 7.2 update changed.

[dirtypacman]

Dirtypacman, you don't have an upgraded HD, so your input isn't helpful.


GVB


Hmmm based upon earlier suggestions and my post of

"b) take another shot at re-doing your upgrade"

Seems like my input was helpful :cool:

[JoshNJ]

how can there be no way to fix this problem without losing everything on the tivo, i don't want to lose 2 years worth of season passes/preferences/60+ hours of tivo'd shows

[vanreuter]

Tivo made 810H owners wait almost a year for a software patch to fix the pixilation problem, how long (if ever) will they take to even admit to this one? We are (and we have been) the Orphans of TiVo...:)

George

[petew]

how can there be no way to fix this problem without losing everything on the tivo, i don't want to lose 2 years worth of season passes/preferences/60+ hours of tivo'd shows


If you have or can borrow a second disk with at least the same capacity then you can copy all your recordings from the current disk to the new one. It will take many hours but it does work, most of the how-tos include information on this step.

[JEMoritz]

I also have an upgraded 810H, which I purchased direct from Weaknees, 315 hours, not sure what size the HD is. Got 7.2 and it immediately started locking up every 15 minutes. Not a HD problem, it was replaced 6 months ago and was working perfectly before the 7.2 upgrade. If I don't have the original 80g hard drive, what can I do? How can I get the upgrade to download again? Thanks!

[JEMoritz]

This is what Weaknees suggested: :(

We can test and reformat the drive - we really don't think this is a swap issue. We would also replace the drive if necessary. The charge is $179.

Thanks, WeaKnees

[nigebj]

Tivo made 810H owners wait almost a year for a software patch to fix the pixilation problem, how long (if ever) will they take to even admit to this one? We are (and we have been) the Orphans of TiVo...:)

George
Pioneer made you wait that long to resolve pixelation - not Tivo - this was the only device with this issue, which originally Pioneer were trying to avoid even resolving.

And, there are many orphans who are much worse off than us - DirectTV Tivo with no HMO, Series 1 owners, etc. We should count ourselves lucky 7.2 IS here. That said, it does seem to be problematic for many users here.

My machine, touch wood, seems to be fine and stable - it was an early 810 as well, which if anything would be one I'd expect to have issues, if at all. It has also been upgraded, by me (pretty much following the PTVUpgrades instructions with the v5 software), so it's not a general 'stock'/'upgraded' issue apparently.

[petew]

if anyone with the problem is feeling brave they could try looking at the Tivo logs.

Adapting wanders instructions:

3) Turned off PC, turned off TiVo, disconnected PC system hdd, removed
TiVo drive and hooked up drives as follows:

Primary Master - 2GB empty Fat32 drive = hda
Primary Slave - original TiVo drive (80 gb Maxtor) = hdb
Secondary Master - cd-rom drive = hdc

4) Booted PC to bios and changed boot sequence in bios to boot from the
cd drive first

5) Booted with MFStools 2.0 cd

6) At # prompt, typed the following commands to mount my fat32 drive:

mkdir /mnt/dos
mkdir /mnt/var

mount /dev/hda1 /mnt/dos
mount /dev/hdb9 /mnt/var

7) Copy the log files from the Tivo disk to the PC disk.

cp /mnt/var/log/* /mnt/dos

8) Then shutdown, remove the Tivo disk and make the spare drive primary slave and boot to windoze and examine the contents of the spare drive. The file that will probably be most interesting is messages.

[petew]

Stolen from this thread http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=3222742#post3222742 in the help forum.

I had a similar problem after the upgrade. One of mine would reboot itself after about 5-10 minutes. It had a 320GB drive.

You may have an inproperly sized swap file. The 7.2 update uses the swap file more that previous versions. And I noticed that you have a 300 GB drive. The swap file needs to be about 1MB for each 2GB of hard drive space. So on your 300GB drive, you need at least a 150MB swap file. But the tools used to expand large drives are not able to create swap files larger than 127MB correctly. If you got the 300GB drive from weaknees, you may want to contact them asking for a new drive.

Search for tpip in the Upgrade Center for more info. This is the tool to help you make a properly sized swap file, after you have restored from a backup image.

Good luck.

[Praedicator]

Is tpip included on any of the boot CDs? I read in one of the forums that tpip 1.1 is on the PTV boot CD, is that true?

When I upgraded from 80GB to 400GB for my 810H I did not run tpip, so my swap file is probably toast and causing all of these problems with 7.2.

From what I gather in this thread doing the following "might" work:

• Pull the 400GB drive from the 810H
• Put the that drive and ANOTHER 400GB drive into a PC w/ mfstools
• Run mfsbackup/mfsrestore from the original drive to the new drive
• Run tpip to recreate the appropriate swap file
• Put the new 400GB drive in the 810H and 7.2 will finally work properly

Can anyone confirm or refute this?

[GGillian]

I'm in the same boat. 810 with an expanded HD is freezing up and requring reboot, since downloading 7.2. Also can't access the Season Pass Manager or the Upcoming Episodes -- the System Information screen shows GC and Indexing as "none yet." I wish TiVo would get a patch in place but unless someone with a stock HD has the same problem, they don't have to address it. They don't support the expanded hard drives.

TiVo CSR politely told me to talk to Weaknees. They were familiar with the problem but the only fix they offer is a new HD, 'special offer' of $179, and losing all my programming. If there's a way to fix the problem and save my saved shows, etc., I'd be grateful! Otherwise I'll drive it down to Weaknees and buy their fix, plus the Extended 2-year warranty...

[TXSTICK]

After I was upgraded to 7.2 on my 810h I did the following.

Hooked up org 80gb drive to hdb and 250gb maxtor to hdd, booted with lba boot cd, and used the following command

mfsbackup -f 9999 -so - /dev/hdb | mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -xzpi - /dev/hdd

I had a dos 32 drive on hda and cdrom on hdc, I was going to copy a backup to the dos drive first but changed my mind, I think it should work just going from hda to hdb, (hda org 80gb and hdb 250gb)

tried the drive and new drive only showed 89 hrs :(

next hooked 250gb backup up to the hda (set to master by itself) then ran

mfsadd -x /dev/hda (then tried drive still at 89 hrs) :(

and then hooked it backup and ran

sd-h400_unlock -w /dev/hda

set drive back to CS and installed.
Drive now shows 326hrs

After one day I now see some freezing going on now and then. :(

[petew]

Is tpip included on any of the boot CDs? I read in one of the forums that tpip 1.1 is on the PTV boot CD, is that true?

When I upgraded from 80GB to 400GB for my 810H I did not run tpip, so my swap file is probably toast and causing all of these problems with 7.2.

From what I gather in this thread doing the following "might" work:

• Pull the 400GB drive from the 810H
• Put the that drive and ANOTHER 400GB drive into a PC w/ mfstools
• Run mfsbackup/mfsrestore from the original drive to the new drive
• Run tpip to recreate the appropriate swap file
• Put the new 400GB drive in the 810H and 7.2 will finally work properly

Can anyone confirm or refute this?

See http://www.courtesan.com/tivo/tpip.html for tpip information and download if it isn't on your boot disk. If the swap header is the problem then running tpip on the existing disk without the backup/restore might fix the problem.

Of course if someone happens to have a spare disk lying around they could make a copy of their disk and then try tpip on the original before trying the procedure above on the new copy.

[GGillian]

I *seem* to have found a kludge that has stopped mine freezing up, at least for now, and given me the chance to write a bunch of stuff to DVD before letting weaknees replace the drive (or having a hacker friend play with tpip and risking losing my data). I deleted a bunch of less important stuff, and now the machine *seems* to be running smoothly, at least it's writing to DVD-R without freezing up. Does it make sense that the problems would be minimized by having less than 80 GB content on the HD?

[robomeister]

tpip is indeed on the PTVupgrade v4.0 and v4.01 Boot CDs. It is not on the Weaknees Boot CD (which I use to do all of my hard disc upgrades). I only use the PTVupgrade CD to run tpip.

I will volunteer to do some testing to determine the effects of bad swap files. I have an *extra* 320GB drive (waiting on a TiVo from Ebay to arrive :D) and I will do a restore from my *golden* image backup with v5.2 software.

I'll do the following:

1) restore v5.2 with -s 127 and force a connection to update to v7.2.
2) restore v5.2 with -s 192 (no tpip) and force a connection to update to v7.2.
3) restore v5.2 with -s 127 and let the TiVo update by itself (this will take a few days).
4) restore v5.2 with -s 192 and tpip to correctly format the swap file, then wait for the TiVo to update itself.

Anyone have any other test scenarios?

I anticipate that scenarios 1, 2 and 3 will fail in some way, and scenario 4 will work (which is how I've done my other disc upgrades). I can also post my exact commands, if that would be helpful to anyone.

One question for all who are having problems. Do you have Tivo Plus or Tivo Basic? I can test both of these, if necessary.

[deadenders]

Got lazy and ordered a drive from weakness. Low and behold it worked. It was at 5.2 so a few calls and it upgrades to 7.2. Now I'm having a new problem where I can see my network, tivo to tivo transfers work great, but I'm failing on the service connection. I have the old linksys wireless b adapter that was the "offical" one pimped by Tivo. The test connection works but when I try to connect to service I get an error when it's on "setting clock" saying that the ports that it needs are unavialble. Strange since it worked before. I tried port forwarding the upd and tcp numbers they asked for and it made no difference. Hmmm. So now I have to make daily calls over the phone, yet the network stuff work great. Oh back on topic I'm planing on trying out this tpip on my older drive and see if that fixes the problem.

[Ba Boop]

One possible cause of this problem could be the swap file, either one of insufficient size or incorrectly initialized. If you have upgraded to a large hard drive (greater than 250GB), you may have a swap file problem. For every 2GB of hard drive space, you need 1MB of swap file. In other words, a 300GB drive needs at least a 150MB swap file to recover successfully from a GSOD.

I mention this because I had a problem with my upgrade, from an 80GB to a 320GB. I used the weaknees.com online guide, which recommended a 127MB swap file. This was before I learned about the recommended swap file size.

But wait, it gets better. There is a problem with mfsrestore. If you use it to make a swap file greater than 127MB, the swap file is improperly initialized and you essentially have NO swap file. You need to run a program called tpip to properly initialize the swap file. Search for tpip in the Upgrade forum.

So, to summarize, if you have a drive greater than 250GB, make sure you have used mfsrestore and tpip to properly create a swap file.

Hope this helps
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

This was a response sent to me when my un-upgraded drive failed, in another thread, weeks befofe 7.2 came down the pipe. Maybe PTV does somthing different than Weakness for the swap file or maybe because my upgraded drive is only 180 gig. Some say size matters :) any way mine is still working fine Just finished burning season 2 of Entourage.

[Ba Boop]

Sorry I was posting to the bottom of page 1. Robmiester was the one who posted what I said, and here he is with the answer.

[petew]

One further posibility. At the end of this thread:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=258730


hp4atc reports clear evidence that a using a netgear WG111 can cause 7.2 to hang. Does this apply to anyone on this thread?

[warner]

hmmm, didn't even occur to me that the wireless ethernet could possibly be the culprit...though it could be separate and unrelated issues. I am almost certain that I am using the Netgear WG111. I'll have to verify when I get home tonight. For the time being, I took out my 250 gig and have switched back to the original 80 gig drive and 7.2 has been working great on it.

update: sorry, i'm using Netgear MA111 not WG111

[yekim]

Yes.......that is correct.
By doing a backup then restore it fixes the swap file that the 7.2 update changed.

Wander - has this been stable since you did the backup/restore?

Has anyone else tried this with success?

I don't have a phone line, so I have to drive 1 hour to a friends house to do this - only want to make sure others have had success before wasting a day. :rolleyes:

[deadenders]

Just wanted to let everyone know all my problems have been solved. The unit has been working great for a few days now.

[hp4atc]

I have 2 Tivo's -- one upgraded w/ 2 160 GB HD's from Weaknees and one Humax 80 hr unmod. Both experienced problems after 7.2. So I guess it's not just 810's OR just upgraded Tivos. After unplugging the USB adapters and power recycle, both run fine. Now I just have to hook up a phone line to get the service. I am afraid to hook up the USB again.

[Praedicator]

Backup/restore and reinitializing the swap file fixed all of the problems I was seeing with 7.2. Reinitializing the swap file would have been enough to fix the issue most likely, but now everything is running off a new drive and I'm happy.

If you're having problems after the 7.2 upgrade you may want to try running tpip, it sure worked for me!

[hp4atc]

I reported that the same problem ALSO occurs with my Dlink DWL122. Both adapters crashed both my Tivos -- one mod. one not.For grins, after getting Tivo to power up without the adapters and using Tivo feverishly for 3-4 days now either recording watching and recording to VCR in an effort to not lose our shows, I replugged in the WG111. My Tivo IMMEDIATELY rebooted and got stuck on "just a few minutes more...". Unplugged the USB adapter, power recycle and it worked fine. Had to plug in the phone line to get guide data. It connected and downloaded but as of 30 minutes later my guide still only goes out to the 15th??????????????

[kerkules]

Is tpip included on any of the boot CDs? I read in one of the forums that tpip 1.1 is on the PTV boot CD, is that true?

When I upgraded from 80GB to 400GB for my 810H I did not run tpip, so my swap file is probably toast and causing all of these problems with 7.2.

From what I gather in this thread doing the following "might" work:

• Pull the 400GB drive from the 810H
• Put the that drive and ANOTHER 400GB drive into a PC w/ mfstools
• Run mfsbackup/mfsrestore from the original drive to the new drive
• Run tpip to recreate the appropriate swap file
• Put the new 400GB drive in the 810H and 7.2 will finally work properly

Can anyone confirm or refute this?

Praedicator,

Did you perform the back/restore/tpip as listed in this previous post?

[Praedicator]

Praedicator,

Did you perform the back/restore/tpip as listed in this previous post?

Yup... it turns out that running tpip on the original drive would probably have done it as well.

After receiving the 7.2 upgrade my 810H would crash every ~10 to 15 minutes, but since recreating the swap file it's been up for days with no problems.

[bnm81002]

my unit still has the original drive in and reports 89 hours total, hopefully when I change the drive to a 200GB drive, there will be no problems

[kerkules]

Yup... it turns out that running tpip on the original drive would probably have done it as well.

After receiving the 7.2 upgrade my 810H would crash every ~10 to 15 minutes, but since recreating the swap file it's been up for days with no problems.

Has anyone tried just running tpip alone yet?

[JoshNJ]

my tivo has been crashing like crazy, hasn't recorded once since the upgrade last week, just unplugged my usb network adapter (wired) and the tivo is running nice and fast, i will see if it freezes again, but it wasn't running like this (quickly as normal) until i unplugged the adapter

seems like some kind of usb/network compatibility issue in 7.2

[JoshNJ]

It's been 9 hours and my tivo is working fine with the usb adapter unplugged. :-)

Obviously not a swap issue.

Now tivo just needs to get a patch out for the problem so I can leave it plugged in.

[yekim]

It's been 9 hours and my tivo is working fine with the usb adapter unplugged. :-)

Obviously not a swap issue.

Now tivo just needs to get a patch out for the problem so I can leave it plugged in.

I take back what I said earlier. I've tried two network adapters (one wired and one wireless), and neither work. It crashes after 80% or so loading data after a service connection.

Someone who has their 810h running great, can you please post your network adapter so I can give it a shot?

[robomeister]

See my sig below. I only use the "TiVo approved" adapters, with the thumbs up at this link (http://customersupport.tivo.com/knowbase/root/public/tv2006.htm?) . The Linksys WUSB12 and the D-Link DWL-122. Both are 802.11b adapters. I've had good success with using the USB extender cable to help position the adapter for best signal path to my router (a US Robotics 8022). And the antennae on my router are pointed straight up for best performance, not at odd angles.

I've also been able to run Initial Guided Setup (after a Clear & Delete Everything) with the D-Link DWL-122. :up: :up: :up:

And I've found all of these adapters on Ebay. I love Ebay. :D

Hope this helps.

[TXSTICK]

I take back what I said earlier. I've tried two network adapters (one wired and one wireless), and neither work. It crashes after 80% or so loading data after a service connection.

Someone who has their 810h running great, can you please post your network adapter so I can give it a shot?


I am using the Dlink DUB-E100 with the 810h and it has worked great, even after the 7.2 upgrade. I did go back to the 80gb drive for now until we can get the freezing problem fixed with the 250gb upgrade.

:)

[Praedicator]

It's been 9 hours and my tivo is working fine with the usb adapter unplugged. :-)

Obviously not a swap issue.

Now tivo just needs to get a patch out for the problem so I can leave it plugged in.

That's very interesting... my 810H was crashing even though it uses the phone line, not a USB NIC.

After reinitializing the swap file I used a USB NIC from another TiVo to run through guided setup and had no problems. The 810H is back to the phone line for now but it'd be interesting to see if it crashes if I leave a USB NIC plugged in. Hrm, needs investigating...

[JoshNJ]

went almost 24 hours without a crash, and it happened once, reboot and its working fine again, with usb ethernet plugged in it crashes and is slow like crazy

[Praedicator]

Does anyone get blank grey screens during playback of recorded shows?

After upgrading to 7.2 I've noticed that a lot of the shows I've recorded have ~5 to 10 second grey screens during playback. There's no pattern to when it happens so I'm wondering if the cable signal is going out or if it's a TiVo issue.

Has anyone else seen anything like this?

[yekim]

See my sig below. I only use the "TiVo approved" adapters, with the thumbs up at this link (http://customersupport.tivo.com/knowbase/root/public/tv2006.htm?) . The Linksys WUSB12 and the D-Link DWL-122. Both are 802.11b adapters. I've had good success with using the USB extender cable to help position the adapter for best signal path to my router (a US Robotics 8022). And the antennae on my router are pointed straight up for best performance, not at odd angles.

I've also been able to run Initial Guided Setup (after a Clear & Delete Everything) with the D-Link DWL-122. :up: :up: :up:

And I've found all of these adapters on Ebay. I love Ebay. :D

Hope this helps.

My adapter is on this list (Linksys WUSB11 v3.0) but still crashes it. Anyhow, thanks for your list, I'll have to give one of those a try if I can find a cheap one.

Just to confirm, all your Tivo's listed are hacked/upgraded?

[dirtypacman]

Someone who has their 810h running great, can you please post your network adapter so I can give it a shot?


USB200M-- perfect since day 1

Make sure you do not get a Version #2 because they do have problems.

[yekim]

Has anyone tried just running tpip alone yet?

Can someone please post the tpip command to use? I've booted the PTV disk 4.01 (tpip installed), and using the following for reference:

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:ewYNJKF4Q2QJ:www.courtesan.com/tivo/tpip.html+tpip&hl=en&client=firefox-a

But I'm not clear if I need to grab the existing kernel off the disk or not. Thanks!

*edit* Ok I may have found the command. I just used

tpip -s /dev/hda -v

and it reported

Disk is from a Series 2 TiVo
Initializing swap partion (sic) (version 1) @ 158250049, size = 400MiB

It finished this in the blink of an eye, so now the question is - did it work?

*edit* Answer: No. It still crashes, freezes etc. I seemed to get further this time, I was able to make a service connection before it crashed. So, unless I did it wrong, it doesn't look like running just TPIP works. Anyone else confirm this? Any other advice?

[DejaVu7]

Hello All,
I wanted to post my results. I have an 810H upgraded with a 300GB HD and a Linksys USB adapter. When the 7.2 software came down, my Tivo would lock up periodically and the Tivo would report that there was not show scheduled for my season pass, i.e. the index was corrupt. Anyway before I lost all of my recordings, I tried Praedicator suggestion and ran just the tpip on the disk. It has been 4 days so far and all is well. Here are my exact steps:

1) Remove drive and booted up with the PTVupgrade CD.
2) Executed tpip: tpip --swapped -s /dev/hdd from this thread post3256345
3) Tpip reported that the swap was initialized.
4) Put drive back into Tivo and booted up with USB NIC attached.
5) Forced a connection and downloaded schedules.
6) Allow Tivo to sit for about an hour and found no lockups but I was still unable to search/schedule shows.
7) Forced another call and when it was completed rebooted the Tivo.
8) When the Tivo came back up the Scheduling was working again.
9) The unit has been working fine and recording ok. It plays previously recorded shows fine. I have not had time to test the DVD recording yet but will in the near future.

I hope this helps others out there. Thanks to Praedicator. -ron

[Praedicator]

Glad to hear you got everything up and running again!

An 810H with an upgraded HD is a beautiful thing :D

Everything in 7.2 is running a LOT quicker now that the swap file is properly initialized. Menus update a lot quicker and feel more responsive. My 810H has been up 24/7 since I upgraded the swap and there have been no errors related to the unit or service.

For whatever reason the available capacity of the 810H with 7.2 has increased, must be new compression or something? Either way I'll take it!

[robomeister]

My adapter is on this list (Linksys WUSB11 v3.0) but still crashes it. Anyhow, thanks for your list, I'll have to give one of those a try if I can find a cheap one.

Just to confirm, all your Tivo's listed are hacked/upgraded?

Yes, all of my TiVos have been upgraded with larger drives. No hacking of the software, only the hardware.

In reading this forum, I've noticed many problems with wireless USB adapters. And many of these problems have been fixed by doing one of the following:
1) reseting the adapter by removing and re-inserting it
2) refreshing the network connection by going to the Phones & Network section of Settings and running through the setup for the adapter.
3) rebooting the Tivo.

There are some other more involved stories of changing the broadcast channel of their router from channel 11 to channel 1 and doing some other stuff. I tried this myself, and was not successful. As always, YMMV.

[osucowboy]

hello,
boy am I glad to find this board. I have a similar story and need help.

My 810 has not worked/connected since March because of a move to a new home. Last week I got it going again and requested the 7.2 in order to use a wireless network. After two weeks I still could not get the software and after many, many calls to both Tivo and Pioneer I was told that I needed to clear and erase everything by the Pioneer rep. I begrudgingly proceeded and cleared everything. I got the screen that said it should take an hour....that was two days ago. Now not only do I still have that screen but my remote is useless and I can't even power down and back up without the same screen appearing.

I have contacted Pioneer and they said I need to send it to them, along with my flat fee of $350.00!!!!!! whats up with that?

Anyway, Several questions come to my mind.

Any suggestions?
Can I exchange the hard drive and essentially start over?
Do you think this is a 7.2 glitch and maybe I had indeed gotten the software and it caused this malfunction?

I am depressed as I have only had this 1 1/2 yrs and have never cracked the case. I have had no problems prior to trying to get the new software.

Any help would be great.

Jeff

[azitnay]

Sounds like a hard drive problem... I wouldn't pay $350 to fix it when you can do it yourself (i.e. replace the hard drive).

Drew

[osucowboy]

thanks - I have already ordered from Weaknees and the nice customer service rep agreed that replacing the hard drive would fix my problem.

:)

[JoshNJ]

just to add to the thread my tivo has been fine for the past 10 days with the usb adaptor unplugged, plugging it back in makes it crazy, but it works long enough to get guide data updated. otherwise working great.

[yekim]

Mine has been running strong for 2 or 3 days now, after doing DejaVu7's process. Make sure you use the right TPIP command, the one I used before did not have the same effect.

[DejaVu7]

Yekim, glad to hear you are up an running again.
BTW, I did get a chance and burn a DVD of a recorded show and everything worked correctly. So all is good in my Tivo World gain, well at least until the next software update. :)

[JTnATL]

I've had an original 810 for a couple years. Received the 7.2 upgrade a couple months ago, but just now starting to have the freeze problem. Happened once over the weekend, was frozen yesterday and today when I got home from work.

[petew]

If the problem starting doesn't corespond with the upgrade or the addition of a wireless network adapter then it could well be the dfisk drive going bad.

[JEMoritz]

I had problems with the D-Link DWL-122, (ver. A1, refurbished, bought directly from Tivo), menus very slow, etc. Switched to the Linksys WUSB11 ver. 2.6. Seemed to fix the problem and increased the signal percentage too - from 78% to 97%.

[sweetspirit]

During the month of November, TiVo sent another unwanted and unasked for upgrade. Since both the 7.2 and the most recent software upgrade I've been unable to burn any DVD's. Prior to the upgrades I didn't have a problem AT ALL.

You who are still subscribed to this post - check more recent posts in DVD TiVo units. It looks like units made by other manufacturers are having the same problem. Across the board - TiVo fails to claim responsibility or offer help.

Someone suggested that many complain loudly to TiVo - then something might be done. Does anyone know - are these threads monitored by TiVo? Is there another way to contact someone there to find out if these threads are being read, stats maintained, and that someone MIGHT be working on resolution? We are, after all, paying every month for this service!!!!! :mad:

[Tivortex]

After the 7.2.1 update my 300 GB 810-H started freezing more and more often until it wouldn't get past the Welcome screen. Unhooking the wireless connector helped for a few days. Zapping it with tpip as suggested by DejaVu7s has got it back running properly again. Nice easy fix, my thanks to everyone on this forum who's smarter than me. Everyone that is.

[sweetspirit]

There are a LOT of threads about problems post software upgrade on the 810. In addition to "7.2 killing my 810", SOME of them are:
7.2.1 burning mystery - is the case solved?
TIVO upgrade causes DVD Failure? Pioneer 810 - Poll on this Thread
810 won't burn DVD's anymore
Pioneer 810 DVD-RW Media Problems

I have an UN-upgraded TiVo, and have numerous DVD "internal error" copying failures that did not happen pre-upgrade. Same with the freezing problems.

I, too, contacted both Pioneer and TiVo. As someone else said on this thread: TiVo said to call Pioneer, since it wasn't TiVo's "problem". Pioneer said to erase everything and start over because the problem was TiVo's software "upgrade". Calling TiVo back resulted in absolutely nothing. Net result? Customer screwed.

The thread I started in Nov, listed above, has a poll on it. Thus far only 23 people have found it. I wish that somehow everyone having this problem could find it. Then TIVO MIGHT do something about it!

[sweetspirit]

EEEKs. Think I posted twice, and trying to fix it. If this doesn't - sorry! Maybe I should change to "persistent newbie"?