Battlestar Galactica 8/12/05 (S02E05) "The Farm"

[Jonathan_S]

Farms huh. Nasty.

I really though for a moment that Starbuck was dead. (Of course that is what they wanted me to think, but still...)

I liked how you could notice that the doctor called Kara "Starbuck" even though she hadn't told him that. Just enough to confirm (although I never really seriously doubted) that he was a Cylon.

Should be all sorts of interesting when the heavy raider with Boomer at the controls shows up at the fleet. Most of them aren't going to take kindly to Boomer's return, even with Adama (threat?/promise?) to the Chief that he'd see Boomer again.

And they've revealed yet another of the 12 humanoid cylons.

Hmm, and how did Boomer know that Leobon told Starbuck about Starbuck's destiny? I know another Leobon model would know (or would it be all other Leobon models?), but why would a Boomer model.

[Rob Helmerichs]

Hmm, and how did Boomer know that Leobon told Starbuck about Starbuck's destiny? I know another Leobon model would know (or would it be all other Leobon models?), but why would a Boomer model.
Because they communicate. They Have A Plan, you know--and I doubt they keep it a secret from each other!

And it's ABOUT FRAKKIN' TIME that somebody started to realize that the Spylons are more than just machines. I wonder how Adama's growing realization will affect the already horribly complicated social dynamics on Galactica? He already has at least one traitor on the bridge (Dualla)...

[danieljanderson]

I can't believe that no one in the resistance took a shot at Boomer!

I can't believe that Adama has a soft spot for Spylon Boomer. That's the only way she is going to make it on board Galactica.

[latrobe7]

I can't believe that no one in the resistance took a shot at Boomer!

My sentiments exactly, they can't trust her. They have to assume that everything she does is Cylon manipulation. Gee, shows up just in time with the location of Starbuck and the ship they need. Hmm, wonder how she came upon either one of those.

Anders should have shot her right in the head. What does he care if Helo would be pissed?

[GadgetFreak]

Should be all sorts of interesting when the heavy raider with Boomer at the controls shows up at the fleet. Most of them aren't going to take kindly to Boomer's return, even with Adama (threat?/promise?) to the Chief that he'd see Boomer again.


I don't think they are headed to the fleet. Starbuck was supposed to bring the arrow to Kobol, wasn't she?

[GadgetFreak]

When Starbuck wound up in the hospital, I thought they were preparing to make some Starbuck model Cylons. The farm was pretty creepy.

She said she didn't know what the second scar was, but didn't she overhear the doctor say that they had tested her ovaries? Or would that not explain the scar?

I was also a little confused at Boomer's conversation. I guess she openly told the resistance that she was a cylon? And she seemed pretty adamant when telling them cylons could not get pregnant...to the point that you have to doubt that she is.

[vman41]

So cylons are a cross between humans and something else that makes them infertile, like mules.

Did Baltar have any lines this episode?

[hefe]

So they brought back the previews at the start of the episode...

[appleye1]

And it's ABOUT FRAKKIN' TIME that somebody started to realize that the Spylons are more than just machines.

I agree. I don't think they're "machines" at all. They're more like imperfect humans with excellent telepathy abilities.

And I noticed that it appears that, judging from the scars on her chest, that Galactica Boomer was autopsied. What suprised me was that her head was intact. If I was chopping up a Cylon to see what made it tick, the skull is the first thing I'd crack. What with shooting them out the airlocks and doing half-*** autopsies, they don't seem to be too concerned with figuring out how to identify Cylons.

[Jonathan_S]

I don't think they are headed to the fleet. Starbuck was supposed to bring the arrow to Kobol, wasn't she?Initially. But unless the show wants to stick with a permanently split fleet, eventually the two parts (the ones a Kobol, and the ones that stayed with Galactica) will reunite. And that's when the Boomer situation gets really interesting.

(Although it might be kind of interesting just when they get back to Kobol.)

[tbone526]

Boomer wasn't shot immediately because Helo identified her as "with us." Probably by the time he got around to actually telling everyone she was a Cylon, he was able to control the situation a little better. Although I too was surprised that the resistance would agree to work with her. In a longer episode we probably would have seen a lot more of the interaction and discussion about this whole topic, but presumably they figured that would take too much time out of this one hour episode.

I was a little confused by Adama's conversation with the Cheif, when they discussed the concept of "loving" Galactica Bommer, and then Adama's sobbing over her body in the morgue. Didn't Adama say something to the effect that Boomer had served with them for two years and she had been "more than a machine" to them? I have a hunch he'll be getting away from the "strictly toaster" viewpoint.

I don't think it will take long for Adama to get everyone together, but will he "play the religion card" to do it? Don't forget, at the end of the mini, he basically promised everyone he could lead them to Earth, got them all into the spirit of it with the repeated "so say we all", kind of like an old fashioned revival meeting. Or did the Prez already tell everyone that Adama lied about knowing where to go?

Discussing info from previews for next week's episode as well as other information previously discussed about upcoming plot points:

Previews for next episode showed the President ordering Caprica Boomer tossed out an airlock, but then some argument about the point. Could Boomer be the "friendly Cylon" that they use from here on out?

Are we about to the point where the Pegasus shows up with Michelle Forbes as Admiral Cain? If I can't have Boomer, then put me under Michelle Forbes command.

[Rob Helmerichs]

Next week's previews:

Previews for next episode showed the President ordering Caprica Boomer tossed out an airlock, but then some argument about the point. Could Boomer be the "friendly Cylon" that they use from here on out?
What interested me about that scene is that they seem to be setting it up where the sweet little school-teacher who accidently became President is going to be the hard-line anti-Cylon, while the hard-ass military commander will be the one who judges Cylons on their individual merits, and might be willing to work with the right Cylons.

I've suspected (along with other folks, of course) almost since the beginnings that there are anti-human and pro-human factions among the Cylons (although even the pro-human ones seem to be more interested in using us than working with us). It would be very interesting if anti-Cylon and, well, not pro-Cylon but less-anti-Cylon factions emerged among the humans as well, and then if the moderate humans and the moderate Cylons joined forces or at least collaborated to an extent. Then you'd have three sides to the war--the hard-line Cylons who want to wipe out the human race; the hard-line humans who want to wipe out the Cylon race; and the moderates who want to co-exist (but each on their own terms, which probably means another war if they win this one).

Dang, this show is good!

[ovr8ted]

Our God tells us to "be fruitful, , , ". So I guess this means that those that follow The Bible are Cylons :eek:

Another human model exposed, which will bring more interogation onboard Galactica no doubt. We should expect more tales of the future from that, and I would hope another autopsy, as mentioned previously.

Agreed, it is funny how Boomer showed up at just the right time, with the right equipment. Hmmmm. Doesn't matter, I'm always happier when Boomer is part of the script ;) Although I'm surprised Kara didn't blow her head off this time.

And what gives with Kara's romance :mad: , she is supposed to be untouchable feelings wise, except to Lee. This overnight love affair with promises bothers me, leave that for daytime tv.

As always, this show rocks! Spread the word.

[Rob Helmerichs]

And what gives with Kara's romance :mad: , she is supposed to be untouchable feelings wise, except to Lee. This overnight love affair with promises bothers me, leave that for daytime tv.
Well, I think it's interesting--she's always been kind of, well, sexually careless. Now, she has begun to form what could develop (under other circumstances) into a healthy relationship. Does this represent a growth in her character? I think so--she certainly hasn't shown any interest in her sexual partners after the fact in the past.

Starbuck, for all her bluster, is actually one of the most interesting characters on the show. She has very plausibly changed very dramatically (her sexual and religious attitudes being the most obvious examples) in a very short time. It will be very interesting to see what affect this has on her place on Galactica when she finally gets back--and I suspect that's why they've kept her away so long, so that she can be a different person when she returns.

[latrobe7]

Anybody thinking about collaborating with rebel-Cylons or a good-guy-Boomer; please shake yourselves. The only good Cylon is a dead Cylon. Galactica Boomer proved that. No matter how much she thought she was human, or wanted to be human, or wanted to side with the humans; she was still at the command of her deeper programming that seems automatic, unconscious and beyond her will. How could a Cylon prove their loyalty? Galactica Boomer blew up a whole frakkin’ basestar, then turned around an shot Adama.

[hefe]

Another interesting thing is that they showed that Roslyn was intentionally playing the "religion card" to manipulate the believers.

[Thom]

In the promo at the end of this episode
Boomer, who is about to tossed out an airlock by Roslin, says "I know where the Temple of Athene is."
I bet the Temple of Athene is the place where Six showed Baltar their "baby" in Baltar's internal vision (which occurred in a prior episode while Baltar was stuck on Kobol).

[devlindark]

this show has so many dynamics it's amazing and keeps you on your toes.

My observation is that the Cylons have evolved to this human like form, yet they are starting to develop a concense of their own - did you hear the convo with the doctor
when she said to him "is that regret I hear in your voice" and he responded "if it is it's none of your conern"

This is where they begin to evolve and have their own Ideas and feelings ect ect
I am sure we will see this take shape over the rest of this season and seasons to come

Man this show rocks!!!!


sorry I have no Idea how to do the spoiler stuff

[Charlutz]

And what gives with Kara's romance :mad: , she is supposed to be untouchable feelings wise, except to Lee. This overnight love affair with promises bothers me, leave that for daytime tv.

She's already hooked up with Baltar and Lee. Maybe she had some feeling for the guy after he saved her life, but just getting a little action is not out of character for her at all.

[Charlutz]

Boomer wasn't shot immediately because Helo identified her as "with us." Probably by the time he got around to actually telling everyone she was a Cylon, he was able to control the situation a little better. Although I too was surprised that the resistance would agree to work with her. In a longer episode we probably would have seen a lot more of the interaction and discussion about this whole topic, but presumably they figured that would take too much time out of this one hour episode.

You're assuming a lot. I just figured they didn't tell the resistance she was a cylon. Maybe they told Anders and one or two others, but they didn't have to. I also suspect none of the resistance had seen the Boomer model cylons walking around either because nobody freaked out when she walked up.

[latrobe7]

She's already hooked up with Baltar and Lee. Maybe she had some feeling for the guy after he saved her life, but just getting a little action is not out of character for her at all.

Starbuck is a player - she hit's it when she wants with who she wants as frequently as she wants. She gets around.

[tbone526]

She's already hooked up with Baltar and Lee. Maybe she had some feeling for the guy after he saved her life, but just getting a little action is not out of character for her at all.

He (Anders) didn't save her life. They tried to kill each other with each one thinking the other was a Cylon.

Question: what more will develop after the doctor's comments about Starbuck's fingers being broken, indicating previous abuse? I would say it's there to give us more insight into her character, since nobody else was around to hear the discussion. Or will the Cylon's use it as part of more mind games with her in the future?

You're assuming a lot. I just figured they didn't tell the resistance she was a cylon. Maybe they told Anders and one or two others, but they didn't have to. I also suspect none of the resistance had seen the Boomer model cylons walking around either because nobody freaked out when she walked up.

True. The story could have played out either of those ways, or many others. We just didn't see that portion of it.

Starbuck is a player - she hit's it when she wants with who she wants as frequently as she wants. She gets around.

A woman like that could hurt a man.....if he's lucky. ;) :up:

[questfortruth]

Spoiler Alert:

*I'm wondering if the extra scar on Starbuck, means that the Cylons have implanted a homing device on her...or even the same device that allows them access to Baltar's mind?*

[vman41]

Well, I think it's interesting--she's always been kind of, well, sexually careless. Now, she has begun to form what could develop (under other circumstances) into a healthy relationship. Does this represent a growth in her character?

Don't forget the slip she made while she was shagging Baltar some episodes back.

[Rob Helmerichs]

You're assuming a lot. I just figured they didn't tell the resistance she was a cylon. Maybe they told Anders and one or two others, but they didn't have to. I also suspect none of the resistance had seen the Boomer model cylons walking around either because nobody freaked out when she walked up.
No, because she was saying "we" in front of everybody, when she clearly meant "the Cylons".

I wonder if there wasn't a scene cut out. It seemed odd at the time that they went fronm Helo vouching for her to her opening talking as a Cylon without explanation.

[5thcrewman]

Don't forget the slip she made while she was shagging Baltar some episodes back.
I'm not so sure that was a slip. I saw it as an equally likely attempt to mind-eff with Gaius.

[Idearat]

I get tired of seeing another cliche. How many TV shows have had one of the good guys wake up in a hospital, alone, not knowing how they got there? They are cut off from everyone else but their doctor, given some excuse as to why. Then we're supposed to be surprised that the doctor isn't real and all the good guy's friends aren't really dead. Yawn.

I just hope in two weeks we don't have 2 very different people switch minds and bodies and see how funny they act in the other body. Or an entire episode where everything seems to change for the better or worse dramatically, only to find it's a dream, or some time warp thing.

[latrobe7]

Spoiler Alert:

*I'm wondering if the extra scar on Starbuck, means that the Cylons have implanted a homing device on her...or even the same device that allows them access to Baltar's mind?*

Well, in the podcast, he dropped this kind of BIG spoiler:
They took her ovaries. But maybe they did leave something too...

[WinBear]

Hmm, I hadn't considered the scar as being a way to implant a homing device or a mental cylon. I was thinking either 1) they impregnated her, which shouldn't require a scar, 2) they harvested some of her eggs, or 3) they repaired the cyst on her ovary that Simon mentioned early on.

[questfortruth]

Well, in the podcast, he dropped this kind of BIG spoiler:
They took her ovaries. But maybe they did leave something too...

shades of the early X-files...very nasty.

[windracer]

I still get puzzled over some of the small, seemingly inconsequential, changes between the original series and the new one.

Currently, it's the change from "triad" to "pyramid." In the original series, the game with the ball Starbuck was playing with the professional "pyramid" player was called triad. Pyramid was the card game Starbuck was always playing in the officer's lounge (not sure what they call it in the new series, but I've seem 'em play it).

The other one is the pronunciation of "till-eeum" instead of "tie-leeum."

[zalusky]

Nobody mentioned this but I thought the character tidbit of all her fingers being broken was interesting. Was it child abuse or self inflicted due to abuse?

[Anubys]

Hmm, I hadn't considered the scar as being a way to implant a homing device or a mental cylon. I was thinking either 1) they impregnated her, which shouldn't require a scar, 2) they harvested some of her eggs, or 3) they repaired the cyst on her ovary that Simon mentioned early on.

given that he gave her an OBGYN exam and their interest in reproduction, the one and only thought I had when I saw the scar was that they removed her ovaries...

I don't think there's any doubt that Boomer is a cylon...she clearly was talking about "we" when talking about what the cylons are doing (I'm confirming what Rob said)...

[hefe]

Nobody mentioned this but I thought the character tidbit of all her fingers being broken was interesting. Was it child abuse or self inflicted due to abuse?
Except for where it was mentioned in post #22. ;)

[Droobiemus]

Wow, yet another great episode!

I really liked how the farm subplot was shot. All the scenes with the Doctor were shot so creepily, that you just knew the entire time that something wasn't quite right. But the writing was so ambiguous that you weren't sure if it was the doctor or the overall situation Starbuck was in.

And out of all the episodes that have centered on Starbuck throughout the entire series, this one is by far my favorite. Though I'm wondering now if we're going to be seeing Starbuck cylons walking around. Or if Starbuck is going to be stuck with a child she doesn't want (I hope not, 'cause in TV terms, when a kid is brought to the show, overall quality tends to drop).

I'm surprised no one's mentioned the religious card that the President played with the rest of the fleet. While faith is a powerful token, people are not going to be pleased when/if they learn that she played on their emotions and religious beliefs to help get her back in power. I also like how they're starting to get into what seems like a government vs. religion standoff. It'll be interesting to see how Adama handles it and how far both parties are willing to go to gain control.

[hefe]

Another interesting thing is that they showed that Roslyn was intentionally playing the "religion card" to manipulate the believers.

I'm surprised no one's mentioned the religious card that the President played with the rest of the fleet.

*knock knock knock*

Hey, is thing on?

:D

[Droobiemus]

Mention it in great detail, then. :p

[oski87]

Everyone recognize creepy Cylon doc actor from Odyssey 5? If memory serves, he played a similarly creepily-calm slightly cryptic alien

[Anubys]

*knock knock knock*

Hey, is thing on?

:D

did you hear a knock?


nah... ;)

[Thom]

Everyone recognize creepy Cylon doc actor from Odyssey 5? If memory serves, he played a similarly creepily-calm slightly cryptic alien

He was also on the recent (and short-lived) Eyes. (A short lived show about a Private Investigation firm, with the boss played by Tim Daly.)

[questfortruth]

Since the "spoilers" are already flowing out in the open:

*If the spylons cannot reproduce, and are experimenting with human females in order to rectify the situation...then how can Caprica Boomer (and, presumably, Baltar's Six) be pregnant?

Only the "male" spylons are infertile? Does that make sense to anyone?*

[hefe]

Since the "spoilers" are already flowing out in the open:
No, they're not.

[ccwf]

Our God tells us to "be fruitful, , , ". So I guess this means that those that follow The Bible are Cylons :eek: Remember that many of the events in this series parallel those in Exodus and other books of the Pentateuch. At the start, the Jews did not follow the Bible; they followed Moses out of polytheistic Egypt. The Bible didn't come until later. ;)

[oski87]

My first thought on the brokern fingers-- all 10 fingers broken above the knuckle. Dad was a piano player. Lid over keyboard....

[questfortruth]

No, they're not.

Guess I must have misinterpreted the explicit, detailed references to the episode on this page :o

*Anyhow, if the cylons can't mate among themselves, and that's their goal, then it explains my prior query.*

[getbak]

He was also on the recent (and short-lived) Eyes. (A short lived show about a Private Investigation firm, with the boss played by Tim Daly.)

Aha. That's where I recognized him from.

[danieljanderson]

How did the Doc justify a pelvic exam to Starbuck. Seemed like an odd thing to do. But, then again, I'm not a woman.

[Fish Man]

Our God tells us to "be fruitful, , , ". So I guess this means that those that follow The Bible are Cylons :eek:


The fact that God tells them to be fruitful doesn't necessarily mean that they follow the "Bible" as we know it, per se.

I do find it very interesting that the Cylons are monotheistic while the humans are polytheistic.

All polytheistic religions on earth are, for all practical purposes, dead in modern times.

All of the widely followed religions today, Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam are all monotheistic.

Since learning that the Cylons are monotheistic, I've always thought it would be quite a shock to the humans in Galactica's universe if they were to find earth and discover that all the major religions there resemble that of the Cylons!! :D

[EchoBravo]

While faith is a powerful token, people are not going to be pleased when/if they learn that she played on their emotions and religious beliefs to help get her back in power.Hell, you're assuming the average blind follower will have the, um, faculties to realize that they've been played. In my experience, they haven't yet... I mean they won't.

[Charlutz]

No, because she was saying "we" in front of everybody, when she clearly meant "the Cylons".

I wonder if there wasn't a scene cut out. It seemed odd at the time that they went fronm Helo vouching for her to her opening talking as a Cylon without explanation.

Good point, but I still think it's a leap that all 50 of the resistance team know she is a cylon and there wasn't any confrontation. You could very well be right that a scene got dropped. Not a major issue either way since they've deaparted Caprica.

[Charlutz]

He (Anders) didn't save her life. They tried to kill each other with each one thinking the other was a Cylon.

I meant later -- she shacks up with him just to let off a little steam. Then she gets captured during the raid and he is the first one coming out of the woods to free her from the farm, and then she develops real feelings for him.

[WeBoat]

Everyone recognize creepy Cylon doc actor from Odyssey 5? If memory serves, he played a similarly creepily-calm slightly cryptic alien


He also did an episode of stargate a few seasons ago. Played a Jaffa leader who ended up being a Gould in disgise.

[Anubys]

it's clear that there must be a connection with "our" earth...after all, we're supposed to be the descendents of the 13th tribe...so enough of the religion must be similar...

the OS went with ancient Egypt, this one is more Greek mythology...but the concepts of religion, exodus, Gods...etc. should be rooted in reality somehow...

[hefe]

Guess I must have misinterpreted the explicit, detailed references to the episode on this page :o
The thing is, even if someone violates the no spoiler rule, or at least untagged spoilers, that doesn't open it up for eveyone. There are folks that want no hint of a spoiler whatsoever. I'm not quite so strict in my own feeling, but for those that are, we should respect that. General forum rules and etiquette are that ideas based on pure speculation are OK for open discussion, but anything that comes from actual inside info, or previews of unaired episodes (or podcasts, for BSG) or interviews and articles with people connected with the show should be considered a spoiler.

BTW, the board has actual spoiler tags for this purpose, you needn't play with font colors...

[devlindark]

No, because she was saying "we" in front of everybody, when she clearly meant "the Cylons".

I wonder if there wasn't a scene cut out. It seemed odd at the time that they went fronm Helo vouching for her to her opening talking as a Cylon without explanation.


She also specifically said she wasn't able to access that information yet
pertaining to the Baby Farms

[questfortruth]

The thing is, even if someone violates the no spoiler rule, or at least untagged spoilers, that doesn't open it up for eveyone. There are folks that want no hint of a spoiler whatsoever. I'm not quite so strict in my own feeling, but for those that are, we should respect that. General forum rules and etiquette are that ideas based on pure speculation are OK for open discussion, but anything that comes from actual inside info, or previews of unaired episodes (or podcasts, for BSG) or interviews and articles with people connected with the show should be considered a spoiler.

BTW, the board has actual spoiler tags for this purpose, you needn't play with font colors...

Agreed- I went back and edited my posts- and I just discovered the spoiler tags.

[markz]

Agreed, it is funny how Boomer showed up at just the right time, with the right equipment. Hmmmm. Doesn't matter, I'm always happier when Boomer is part of the script ;)

I've always thought Boomer had just the right equipment!

[Rob Helmerichs]

No one's mentioned the religious card that the President played with the rest of the fleet. While faith is a powerful token, people are not going to be pleased when/if they learn that she played on their emotions and religious beliefs to help get her back in power. I also like how they're starting to get into what seems like a government vs. religion standoff. It'll be interesting to see how Adama handles it and how far both parties are willing to go to gain control.
I think you're underestimating the complexity of Roslin's thinking. She sincerely believes in the religious angles she's "playing," even if she hasn't fully thought out the consequences, and isn't terrible comfrotable with them. I think the only reason she called it "playing the religion card" to her advisors is because they're politicians, and if she said "I'm going to fulfil my role as savior of humanity," they would have thought she was insane, if they even were capable of understanding what she was saying. She was just putting it in terms they could accept and work with.

So it's not The People she's conning by playing the religion card, it's her advisors she's conning by claiming that's what she's doing.

[latrobe7]

I think you're underestimating the complexity of Roslin's thinking. She sincerely believes in the religious angles she's "playing," even if she hasn't fully thought out the consequences, and isn't terrible comfrotable with them. I think the only reason she called it "playing the religion card" to her advisors is because they're politicians, and if she said "I'm going to fulfil my role as savior of humanity," they would have thought she was insane, if they even were capable of understanding what she was saying. She was just putting it in terms they could accept and work with.

So it's not The People she's conning by playing the religion card, it's her advisors she's conning by claiming that's what she's doing.

Good one. I, for one, hadn't thought about it that way. Your idea is bolstered by the fact that she just lost one of her most trusted advisors and confidants, Billy, because he thought she was going over the top...

[Anubys]

Good one. I, for one, hadn't thought about it that way. Your idea is bolstered by the fact that she just lost one of her most trusted advisors and confidants, Billy, because he thought she was going over the top...

isn't it interesting that this considerably important and unexpected turn didn't get mentioned on these threads much?

[Anubys]

I'd like to mention something about spoilers in this thread:


I don't read spoiler text. But given the talk about spoilers, I went ahead and read them...when I made my remark about taking her ovaries, it was pure speculation on my part...I didn't know that this was true.

[latrobe7]

isn't it interesting that this considerably important and unexpected turn didn't get mentioned on these threads much?

Yeah, I think it was just so out of left field that no one quite knew what to make of it, so it was overlooked. It was unexpected, and in the podcast:
it's made apparent that it was something that had to be written in because the actor who plays Billy had another opportunity and was going to leave the show. Turns out his opportunity didn't pan out and he will be back.

[kdmorse]

Actually - the most annoying spoiler for me was the title of the episode, which my tivo showed me before I even began watching - oops. Without knowing the title, there would have been a great deal more mystery regarding the motives of the hospital Starbuck woke up in. Knowing that title, it was pretty obvious from the beginning.

Similarly, there are spoilers in the titles of episodes in the rest of the season. So if you don't want even little hints, don't look the the upcoming episode titles, and avoid the places where your TiVo lists titles for you. At least one of those titles answers a question that's been asked repeatedly here.

-Ken

[pantherman007]

[QUOTE=Droobiemus]Or if Starbuck is going to be stuck with a child she doesn't want [QUOTE]


I'm thinking that's a possibility, but with (of course) a nice, complicated twists:



1) The cylon doctor really did take out her ovaries as has been speculated.
2) Starbuck finds out she's pregnant, and with ovaries missing this is her last chance at a child.
3) Since she slept with the pyramid player guy, the baby could be his (which she'd probably want to keep). Or something the cylons implanted.
4) She'll be on Kobol or somewhere else before she discovers the pregnancy, meaning no way to get DNA from back on Caprica to confirm the father.

Add in Gaius an and the possibility of tryingto cylon test an unborn child, and we've got an interesting parallel to the Six/Gaius baby that might popup down the road.

Of course, I might be having flashbacks to the lizard-baby from V...

[jradford]

My first thought on the brokern fingers-- all 10 fingers broken above the knuckle. Dad was a piano player. Lid over keyboard....
Nice catch! Not sure of it's importance just yet, but very interesting, and I didn't put it together. :p

I do think it's possible that the way they portrayed Rosyln as "playing the religious card" might be a foreshadow of her not being 100% sure that she has a higher calling that can't be wrong. But the counter argument makes sense, as well.

From way earlier post: Not sure a full skull and brain cavity search with scar marks of Grace Park would have made for great TV as EJO kissed her dead carcass on the forehead. :D .

[7thton]

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes here, but this is the 2nd week in a row that I have had to stop reading the BSG discussions because someone is dropping unmarked and unhidden SPOILERS, usually from info Ron Moore gives on his podcast.

Can we get some better moderator or self-moderating behavior here? :down: :down: :down:

[Anubys]

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes here, but this is the 2nd week in a row that I have had to stop reading the BSG discussions because someone is dropping unmarked and unhidden SPOILERS, usually from info Ron Moore gives on his podcast.

Can we get some better moderator or self-moderating behavior here? :down: :down: :down:

AFAIK, there have not been any untagged spoilers...

seems to me you're just trying to start an argument...

how would you know that there are untagged spoilers if you have not listened to the podcast?...and it you did listen to the podcast, then nothing was spoiled for you anyway!

please keep in mind that people may make speculations about the future without knowing that the speculation was confirmed in the podcast...

[PJO1966]

She's already hooked up with Baltar and Lee. Maybe she had some feeling for the guy after he saved her life, but just getting a little action is not out of character for her at all.


Did I miss something? When did she hook up with Lee? We saw her imagining she was with Lee when she was with Baltar, but that was it as far as I can remember.

[Rob Helmerichs]

Did I miss something? When did she hook up with Lee? We saw her imagining she was with Lee when she was with Baltar, but that was it as far as I can remember.
Well, she lusted in her heart--maybe she's from Georgia. :D

[ronsch]

I was also a little confused at Boomer's conversation. I guess she openly told the resistance that she was a cylon? And she seemed pretty adamant when telling them cylons could not get pregnant...to the point that you have to doubt that she is.


She said Cylons couldn't get pregnant by another Cylon.

[PJO1966]

There's something that really confused me. The rebels are battling the Cylons as Starbuck comes out of the building. We see the injured Boomer standing behind the rebels. Then the ship appears and blows the Cylons away. Who's piloting if Boomer's on the ground? I was hoping that there would be a 2nd Boomer that the pregnant one enlisted in her cause. Six has mentioned that the Boomer model has always been defective. It would be cool if Pregnant Boomer enlisted a Battalion of Boomers to help the humans.

[7thton]

AFAIK, there have not been any untagged spoilers...

seems to me you're just trying to start an argument...

how would you know that there are untagged spoilers if you have not listened to the podcast?...and it you did listen to the podcast, then nothing was spoiled for you anyway!

please keep in mind that people may make speculations about the future without knowing that the speculation was confirmed in the podcast...

No, I'm not trying to "start" anything...honest. I just took post 29 to be an untagged spoiler. Maybe I'm misreading it and it's mere conjecture?

[latrobe7]

There's something that really confused me. The rebels are battling the Cylons as Starbuck comes out of the building. We see the injured Boomer standing behind the rebels. Then the ship appears and blows the Cylons away. Who's piloting if Boomer's on the ground? I was hoping that there would be a 2nd Boomer that the pregnant one enlisted in her cause. Six has mentioned that the Boomer model has always been defective. It would be cool if Pregnant Boomer enlisted a Battalion of Boomers to help the humans.

I didn't see a Boomer on the ground, I went back and watched in slow-mo, but still no... :confused: There is another resistance fighter who is female with dark hair... I think Boomer was flying the ship.

BTW, I dont think they should trust any Boomers (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=3142658&&#post3142658), much less a battalion! :)

[Anubys]

No, I'm not trying to "start" anything...honest. I just took post 29 to be an untagged spoiler. Maybe I'm misreading it and it's mere conjecture?

it reads to me like post 29 is pure guessing...sorry if I came off as an a** :o

PJ...are you sure Boomer was with the rebels? I don't recall seeing her...another theory is that Helo piloted the shuttle (unless he was with the rebels as well!)...

[7thton]

it reads to me like post 29 is pure guessing...sorry if I came off as an a** :o


OK, maybe I misread it. I though post 29 was saying the Moore said in a podcast that Starbuck had....

...an implant put in her by the cylons.

But if you're saying post 29 was just a guess, then my bad. :o

[jwjody]

Anybody thinking about collaborating with rebel-Cylons or a good-guy-Boomer; please shake yourselves. The only good Cylon is a dead Cylon. Galactica Boomer proved that. No matter how much she thought she was human, or wanted to be human, or wanted to side with the humans; she was still at the command of her deeper programming that seems automatic, unconscious and beyond her will. How could a Cylon prove their loyalty? Galactica Boomer blew up a whole frakkin’ basestar, then turned around an shot Adama.
Well Galactica Boomer didn't know she was a Cylon. She suspected until Baltar lied to her about the Cylon test. Caprica Boomer knows she's a Cylon and might not have the hidden programming since she wasn't made to be an undercover spy. But to knowingly seduce Helo.

But you could be right and Caprica Boomer (or now new Galactica Boomer?) could still be undercover and do some bad stuff.

So which Boomer, or do they all, get the memories when they die? So the Boomer going to Galactica might know that the other Boomer was in love with Chief but she won't feel the same? And now Chief will see Boomer again, but she'll be in love with Helo carrying his child! Ouch.

I guess I was kinda right! Boomer did steal Starbuck's ride and came back, THEN got a Cylon raider and got them off the planet!

J

[Thaed]

I thought at first the Dr. was Gunn from Angel.

[5thcrewman]

Anybody going to disuss what Jefferson, Rousseau or Locke would have had to say about Starbuck in her undies?!? :p

[Anubys]

Caprica Boomer may very well THINK she's on the humans side but then a secret programming will kick-in at the right time for the cylons...

can't wait for the love triangle on Galactica ;)

[getbak]

Anybody going to disuss what Jefferson, Rousseau or Locke would have had to say about Starbuck in her undies?!?

"Hubba hubba!"

[lordrichter]

Not much in the way of undies if you ask me...

[Amnesia]

What was that "heavy raider" anyway? It seemed as though it was just a ship, not a Cylon itself. Not sure why the Cylons wouldn't have put an intelligence in it, though...

[tanstaafl]

I still get puzzled over some of the small, seemingly inconsequential, changes between the original series and the new one.

Currently, it's the change from "triad" to "pyramid." In the original series, the game with the ball Starbuck was playing with the professional "pyramid" player was called triad. Pyramid was the card game Starbuck was always playing in the officer's lounge (not sure what they call it in the new series, but I've seem 'em play it).

The other one is the pronunciation of "till-eeum" instead of "tie-leeum."
Moore admited in one of the podcasts (I think it was the one for Hand of God) that they simply screwed up and confused pyramid and triad. By the time they realized that they had them reversed they had already aired episodes using the names and were stuck.

As for till-eeum vs tie-leeum, I just put that down as a po-ta-to/po-tah-to thing.

[Anubys]

I went back and checked...Boomer was not on the ground...Helo was...

Boomer was flying the raider and it's clearly the same one since her left shoulder was still hurt...

[oski87]

it's clear that there must be a connection with "our" earth...after all, we're supposed to be the descendents of the 13th tribe...so enough of the religion must be similar...

the OS went with ancient Egypt, this one is more Greek mythology...but the concepts of religion, exodus, Gods...etc. should be rooted in reality somehow...

I read not too terribly long ago that the OS was VERY heavily influenced by Mormon Mythology. The piece I read spelled it out, but that's not an area I'm too familiar with. If I can find a link I'll post it

[appleye1]

Moore admited in one of the podcasts (I think it was the one for Hand of God) that they simply screwed up and confused pyramid and triad. By the time they realized that they had them reversed they had already aired episodes using the names and were stuck.
I don't know about other people, but I wouldn't mind if they corrected it by just all of sudden using the correct names. Things like that really bug the crap out of me for some reason. So what if it was wrong in one or two episodes? Correct it now and it'll be a great trivia question in a few years.

[questfortruth]

What was that "heavy raider" anyway? It seemed as though it was just a ship, not a Cylon itself. Not sure why the Cylons wouldn't have put an intelligence in it, though...

It looked like the same type of ship that crashed into the galactica's abandoned landing bay, and allowed the toaster raiding-party to board her.

[aintnosin]

I don't know about other people, but I wouldn't mind if they corrected it by just all of sudden using the correct names. Things like that really bug the crap out of me for some reason. So what if it was wrong in one or two episodes? Correct it now and it'll be a great trivia question in a few years.I'd be more annoyed by them screwing up the continuity of this show just to maintain continuity with the old show. This is a totally new show and they can call their games whatever they like.

[aus]

Can you guys tell me how you're recording the episodes? Battlestar doesn't even show up on my Tivo when I do a search.

Also, is anyone recording it in HD on Universal HD? Thanks

[hefe]

Can you guys tell me how you're recording the episodes? Battlestar doesn't even show up on my Tivo when I do a search.

Also, is anyone recording it in HD on Universal HD? Thanks
Standard Season Pass. I don't know why you wouldn't be able to find it. You have the Sci-Fi channel?

The new shows haven't been on UHD yet.

[Anubys]

Not much in the way of undies if you ask me...

they were good undies...we needed a better close-up, that's all...let's hope it will look better on UHD ;)

[Rob Helmerichs]

I'd be more annoyed by them screwing up the continuity of this show just to maintain continuity with the old show. This is a totally new show and they can call their games whatever they like.
Exactly. There are a LOT more people watching this show who either never saw or don't remember the old show than there are slavish fans of the old show who would get upset over the names of the games. They would risk confusing and alienating most of their audience for the sake of soothing a few geeks--the same geeks who were screaming bloody murder that this show ever got made in the first place.

They came around then; they'll come around now.

[cheesesteak]

Originally Posted by aintnosin
I'd be more annoyed by them screwing up the continuity of this show just to maintain continuity with the old show.
The old show is dead to me.


This was the best episode of the season. There was some mighty fine acting going on.

[MassD]

Roslin's actions confirm, at least to me, that she IS turning into the meglomanic despot that I originally suspected. Using the phrase "use the religion card" isn't something that a true believer would use... to someone trully devote, that kind of attitude would probably be offensive.

Basically, she admits to useing people's faith as a means to manipluate them. She lost her advisor, and now she is losing Lee... you know, the dude she is 100% in debted to for her escape? She's drunk with power now. She isn't 100% commited just yet, but that part of her that is uncomfortable with her newfound status as a the Fleet's messiah erodes every time someone bows in her presense. She's turning total loony-tunes.

The shift in Adama's attitude is a bit surprising, but not totally unexpected. People who go through that kind of ordeal sometimes spend plenty of time thinking about life. He came to the realization that the Cylons are more than just toasters, and he is fighting a terrible internal struggle.

[Anubys]

Boy, MassD, tell us how you really feel!

Billy wasn't an advisor, was he? I thought he was an assistant of some sort...

[MassD]

Well, he started out just a gopher... But he turned into her right hand man. And he may have been her morale compass in some respects. Without his voice in her ear, reminding her to think right... she's turning into a total nutter.

And another thing.. :) Guess who is going to become her confidant? Zarek... He knows he got something going with her. Feed into her ego and get her all fired up about being the savoir... and then he can just manipute her to suit his own needs.

[speedcouch]

Hmm, I hadn't considered the scar as being a way to implant a homing device or a mental cylon. I was thinking either 1) they impregnated her, which shouldn't require a scar, 2) they harvested some of her eggs, or 3) they repaired the cyst on her ovary that Simon mentioned early on.

My theory is Starbuck is pregnant, but she won't know if it is Anders baby or a cylon baby she was "inseminated" with while she was in the hospital. That might explain the second scar. So the big conflict will be whose baby is it - Anders or a cylon? And God knows, a TV character wouldn't have an abortion these days (okay except Claire on Six Feet Under).

The fact Starbuck wasn't smart enough to crimp her IV tube immediately really bugged me. She already suspected the doctor was a cylon, so why did she allow him to keep drugging her?

Someone else here brought up the fact that this may turn into a religious war because the cylons are worshiping one God and the colonial fleet worshipping multi-Gods. That seems to be coming true with the comment about "our God wants us to be fruitful."

This morning driving in, I heard Mr. Roboto by Styx and couldn't help but think of this show. :)

Cheryl

[Big_Daddy]

Roslin's actions confirm, at least to me, that she IS turning into the meglomanic despot that I originally suspected. Using the phrase "use the religion card" isn't something that a true believer would use... to someone trully devote, that kind of attitude would probably be offensive.

Basically, she admits to useing people's faith as a means to manipluate them. She lost her advisor, and now she is losing Lee... you know, the dude she is 100% in debted to for her escape? She's drunk with power now. She isn't 100% commited just yet, but that part of her that is uncomfortable with her newfound status as a the Fleet's messiah erodes every time someone bows in her presense. She's turning total loony-tunes.


I agree with RobH, that people are over-analyzing Roslin's actions. The military has taken over (with some violent repercussions) and she sees herself as the one to stop it. Moreover, she sees herself as humanity's salvation. Thus for 2 reasons she feels it's necessary to regain power. Thus it's a little of both - political and religious.

I think she used her religious beliefs because that was the one thing she could think of that would galvanize a large portion of the fleet quickly. AND she honestly believes it. HOWEVER, she did not apparently think through some of the consequences of her actions, but recognizes that she must fill the role as she's committed herself to that path.

What's interesting is the shift in social dynamics. We go from last episode's discusison of a democracy vs military dictatorship to a theocracy vs military dictatorship. In both cases, the people have to give up some freedom. Also, now there are two very strong pulls about which way to survive is most viable - the more pragmatic military approach, or the faith-based theocracy approach.

Oh, yeah, the farm stuff and Cylon information was interesting too :D. I'm glad to see they're starting to provide a bit more insight into the Cylon's motives.

[7thton]

Basically, she admits to useing people's faith as a means to manipluate them. She lost her advisor, and now she is losing Lee... you know, the dude she is 100% in debted to for her escape? She's drunk with power now. She isn't 100% commited just yet, but that part of her that is uncomfortable with her newfound status as a the Fleet's messiah erodes every time someone bows in her presense. She's turning total loony-tunes.
.

I totally agree with you here. When she said she was "playing the religion card" and then gave that crazy look and said "how does this thing work?", I told my wife that the dialog for that scene was just odd.....that it seemed unnatural coming out of her mouth. Prior to this she had always acted the "true believer" and at least gave the impression that she was reluctantly following what she though might be prophesy. Now perhaps she sees her self more as a leader who can use her religious credentials (whether they are legit or not) to take power from Adama.

[Anubys]

My theory is Starbuck is pregnant, but she won't know if it is Anders baby or a cylon baby she was "inseminated" with while she was in the hospital. That might explain the second scar. So the big conflict will be whose baby is it - Anders or a cylon? And God knows, a TV character wouldn't have an abortion these days (okay except Claire on Six Feet Under).


I really don't think so...you don't get a scar from artificial insemination...if my hunch is correct and they took her ovaries, Starbuck is going to be one ticked of B*itch hell-bent on revenge...I can see the writers using that angle coupled with Boomer/Helo/Chief triangle...

[cheesesteak]

I think Roslin had no choice but to play the religion card after Lee (rightfully) couldn't go through with the plan to publicly denounce his father. Adama scares the crap out of everybody in the fleet. Heck, he scares the crap out of me and I know he's a tv character. Roslin had to appeal to the peoples' faith in their gods to overcome their fear of Adama.

Does Galactica not have wheelchairs? Adama's walking around an awful lot for someone who was gut shot.

[Bierboy]

Actually - the most annoying spoiler for me was the title of the episode, which my tivo showed me before I even began watching...I never pay any attention to ep titles.

...This was the best episode of the season. There was some mighty fine acting going on.Agreed...the 60 minutes flew by. THAT's how I judge a great show.

[DVC California]

I liked how you could notice that the doctor called Kara "Starbuck" even though she hadn't told him that. Just enough to confirm (although I never really seriously doubted) that he was a Cylon.

I was fooled since the "doctor" knew so much about the resistance. When he first meets Starbuck, he explains how she was brought in by a pyramid player and even knew his name was Anders. He even went so far as to say Anders died, which he must have known would affect Kara.

Although the cylons would obviously know that there was a human resistance force; details on personnel, especially individuals, are unusual.

I'm thinking the Cylons must have some way of "downloading" memories from humans, similiar to what happens to a spylon when they die. Or perhaps they have a spylon plant in the resistance.

This would explain how the resistance got ambushed as they were just starting the mission. Perhaps they were specifially targeting to capture Starbuck.

[Amnesia]

Billy wasn't an advisor, was he? I thought he was an assistant of some sort...
What happened to him? You would think that he would have been taken into custody and questioned regarding the ex-President's escape...

[ovr8ted]

This would explain how the resistance got ambushed as they were just starting the mission. Perhaps they were specifially targeting to capture Starbuck.

I'm certain this was their objective from the start. As to the background info and Anders, makes one think, doesn't it? Of course, that info could also be had through surveillance techniques.

I noticed Boomer on the rescue ship platform also and was thinking, um, who is ready with the guns if Boomer is on the platform?? It couldn’t be a Cylon ship like the raider unless that “programming” could be altered to fight against its own kind and still be on autopilot.

With the fleet separated like this, one would think that rations, including fuel and water, would be at a premium now, and would require martial law to stay in effect, no? Sorry Adama, but that is why we love you (and fear you).

* As an aside, I just saw BladeRunner (again) the other day on TV, it was funny to see EJO as a pimp looking detective from the future *

[Anubys]

how about the ships that left the fleet to join Roslin? how does everyone on a ship agree/not agree to leave?

the only way that would work if the people who don't want to follow her would be allowed to leave the ship that is leaving...that didn't make sense to me...

[windracer]

Moore admited in one of the podcasts (I think it was the one for Hand of God) that they simply screwed up and confused pyramid and triad. By the time they realized that they had them reversed they had already aired episodes using the names and were stuck.
Ha, now that's funny. You would have thought Glen A. Larson or Richard Hatch would have caught that (esp. Richard, since he had to dress up in that ridiculous uniform a few times in the original series :)).

[ovr8ted]

Good point! That would certainly give up to Galactica who was preparing to leave and so on. I want to know who gets to keep the coffee :D

[Thom]

People keep thinking that Starbuck's ovaries were removed....nope. Starbuck only had one scar on her far left side, which means that, at most, one ovary was removed.

From what I remember of the conversation (between Six and the doctor) that Starbuck overheard, they were testing her ovaries for compatibility. If they passed the compatibility test, they were going to do something with/to Starbuck the next morning, but they never got the chance.

I think the scar was from getting a sample from one ovary, not from removing the ovary.

[Big_Daddy]

I was fooled since the "doctor" knew so much about the resistance. When he first meets Starbuck, he explains how she was brought in by a pyramid player and even knew his name was Anders. He even went so far as to say Anders died, which he must have known would affect Kara.

Although the cylons would obviously know that there was a human resistance force; details on personnel, especially individuals, are unusual.

I'm thinking the Cylons must have some way of "downloading" memories from humans, similiar to what happens to a spylon when they die. Or perhaps they have a spylon plant in the resistance.

This would explain how the resistance got ambushed as they were just starting the mission. Perhaps they were specifially targeting to capture Starbuck.

I'd wondered the same thing. In addition to the doctor (Simon?) being a Cylon, I wondered if Anders was as well. And I still DO wonder... Although I suppose they could have pulled the information on the resistance from the woman they captured who was hooked up to the tubes that Starbuck saved/killed.

Either way, it doesn't bode well for the resistance should Starbuck ever return.

[Anubys]

I think the scar was from getting a sample from one ovary, not from removing the ovary.

I'm not a doctor so maybe one can help us here...

what is a "sample"? an egg? no need to open her up and leave a scar to get an egg out...

maybe they took one ovary...maybe I'm totally wrong...it just seems like the most plausible explanation given their interest and the scar...

I didn't hear the conversation between the doctor and Six...I though it was muffled on purpose...I'll go back and try to hear what they said...

[ronsch]

I'm not a doctor so maybe one can help us here...

what is a "sample"? an egg? no need to open her up and leave a scar to get an egg out...

maybe they took one ovary...maybe I'm totally wrong...it just seems like the most plausible explanation given their interest and the scar...

I didn't hear the conversation between the doctor and Six...I though it was muffled on purpose...I'll go back and try to hear what they said...


Right. That conversation is the key. I got the impression that as soon as she was healed enough from the gunshot wound, that she would be joining the other women in the "farm" room.

[7thton]

Right. That conversation is the key. I got the impression that as soon as she was healed enough from the gunshot wound, that she would be joining the other women in the "farm" room.

That's what I though too. I hit the CC to make sure what I was hearing was right.

[emeril2k1]

I also like how they're starting to get into what seems like a government vs. religion standoff. It'll be interesting to see how Adama handles it and how far both parties are willing to go to gain control.

It's more like Government/religion vs Military. The Military can't just declare that the Government is gone...

[markz]

I'm not a doctor so maybe one can help us here...

what is a "sample"? an egg? no need to open her up and leave a scar to get an egg out...

maybe they took one ovary...maybe I'm totally wrong...it just seems like the most plausible explanation given their interest and the scar...

I didn't hear the conversation between the doctor and Six...I though it was muffled on purpose...I'll go back and try to hear what they said...

Maybe giving her a scar was just the way for the writers to give her and others reason to question what happened while she was in the hospital. It might be just there to further a plot point like who's baby she may be carrying if she does end up pregnant. If she didn't have a scar, and then ended up pregnant, she'd just assume it was Anders' baby and we wouldn't have as much drama to discuss here.

[TAsunder]

Oh god, please don't let this turn into a scully baby x-files plot line.

[glumlord]

For some strange reason when they were panning out and Anders was walking and looking up at the ship I got the feeling he was a Cylon.

That would explain how they knew about him, and so much about the resistance.

Do we know how long Cylons have been planted in Human Society? How long was Six with Baltar in the Mini-Series before they actually took over the planet?

[questfortruth]

Ha, now that's funny. You would have thought Glen A. Larson or Richard Hatch would have caught that (esp. Richard, since he had to dress up in that ridiculous uniform a few times in the original series :)).

Larson won't be very helpful as a continuity advisor, between the old and new BSG.

He's too busy thinking up ways, to try and convince Moore to eventually cast his grandkids as a group of Galactican "colonizers," that will be surreptitiously inserted into the human population of Earth ;)

[5thcrewman]

No Farmer's Daughter jokes? :(

Old BSG vs New BSG question.
Did I miss seeing Cassie somewhere along the line and if we haven't will she come back as a man-hater or even possibly as a MAN?!

[aus]

Standard Season Pass. I don't know why you wouldn't be able to find it. You have the Sci-Fi channel?

The new shows haven't been on UHD yet.

hefe, thanks for the reply. All that shows up is "Battle Plan." I'll check again. I just activated this weekend. I'm new to the new Battlestar and want to catch the old shows on UHD and watch the new ones on Sci-Fi. Gotta catch up.

[hefe]

hefe, thanks for the reply. All that shows up is "Battle Plan." I'll check again. I just activated this weekend.

That may be the issue. New units can take a while to fully populate the guide data, I think. Try to use the guide and go to the Sci-Fi channel, then to Friday to find the title. In other words, try to get there manually instead of with a search. If you can find and select the program, you will be able to set your Season Pass there.

[tbone526]

For some strange reason when they were panning out and Anders was walking and looking up at the ship I got the feeling he was a Cylon.

That would explain how they knew about him, and so much about the resistance.

Do we know how long Cylons have been planted in Human Society? How long was Six with Baltar in the Mini-Series before they actually took over the planet?

Don't recall about Six, but Adama mentioned to the chief that Boomer had been serving with them for two years.

[nowandthen]

[QUOTE=7thton]I totally agree with you here. When she said she was "playing the religion card" and then gave that crazy look and said "how does this thing work?", I told my wife that the dialog for that scene was just odd.....that it seemed unnatural coming out of her mouth.QUOTE]

I'm keeping my eye on the religious advisor to Roslin. She's always around the Prez and hasn't she been providing the Prez with her "medicine"? What do we really know about her? She is in a great position to manipulate the Prez. Every time I see her she looks like she is up to something. Then again maybe it's just me, I'm always afraid of too much religion in politics.

[Bierboy]

hefe, thanks for the reply. All that shows up is "Battle Plan." I'll check again. I just activated this weekend. I'm new to the new Battlestar and want to catch the old shows on UHD and watch the new ones on Sci-Fi. Gotta catch up.First five eps of season two are on SciFi starting at 7/6C on Tuesday, August 16.

[JimSpence]

Does anyone think that the Caprica Boomer may really be the original human Boomer? That the Cylons had brainwashed her to think she is a Cylon? Probably not, but that crossed my mind.

[Droobiemus]

Does anyone think that the Caprica Boomer may really be the original human Boomer? That the Cylons had brainwashed her to think she is a Cylon? Probably not, but that crossed my mind.

But what would that accomplish?

The Cylons can't reproduce. Tricking Boomer into thinking that she's a Cylon to help them reproduce doesn't help them any.

They wouldn't be getting a baby Cylon; just a regular human being.

[PJO1966]

Does anyone think that the Caprica Boomer may really be the original human Boomer? That the Cylons had brainwashed her to think she is a Cylon? Probably not, but that crossed my mind.


Didn't we see Caprica Boomer's spine glow red when she was with Helo?

[getbak]

Didn't we see Caprica Boomer's spine glow red when she was with Helo?

Yes we did.

[ccwf]

Didn't we see Caprica Boomer's spine glow red when she was with Helo? I've always thought this would be a more fun way of detecting Cylons than using nukes. ;)

[Anubys]

I've always thought this would be a more fun way of detecting Cylons than using nukes. ;)

I wonder what else would glow on the male cylons :eek:

:D

[gchance]

As for till-eeum vs tie-leeum, I just put that down as a po-ta-to/po-tah-to thing.

I agree here. People don't pronounce things correctly, to the point where they continue to pronounce them wrong after being TOLD they're pronouncing them wrong. President Bush and "nucular" is that way.

The point is that's how people speak. Some people say Chevron as "shev-ron", while others say "shev-run". Some people on the show say Cobol as "coble" (like cable), and others say "co-ball" (like the programming language). In fact, some people say Tigh's name as "tie", others say it rhyming with "tight". I think at one point someone said "teeg".

I think this is more realistic than having everyone say everything exactly the same way.

Greg

[Crrink]

I agree here. People don't pronounce things correctly, to the point where they continue to pronounce them wrong after being TOLD they're pronouncing them wrong. President Bush and "nucular" is that way.

The point is that's how people speak. Some people say Chevron as "shev-ron", while others say "shev-run". Some people on the show say Cobol as "coble" (like cable), and others say "co-ball" (like the programming language). In fact, some people say Tigh's name as "tie", others say it rhyming with "tight". I think at one point someone said "teeg".

I think this is more realistic than having everyone say everything exactly the same way.

Greg
According to Merriam Webster (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=nuclear&x=0&y=0) President's Bush and Carter do not pronounce the word incorrectly.
Crazy, huh? Just when you think you've got language figured out....

No entry for Tylium. :)

[Amnesia]

According to Merriam Webster (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=nuclear&x=0&y=0) President's Bush and Carter do not pronounce the word incorrectly.
Crazy, huh? Just when you think you've got language figured out....Talking about having the language figured out, what is that apostrophe for after the word "President"?

[markz]

Talking about having the language figured out, what is that apostrophe for after the word "President"?

I am not sure what it has to do with the President's bush or anyone else's bush for that matter! :D

[SparkleMotion]

I am not sure what it has to do with the President's bush or anyone else's bush for that matter! :DHuh? Wha? Did we get a woman president while I wasn't looking?!? :confused:

[hefe]

Huh? Wha? Did we get a woman president while I wasn't looking?!? :confused:
On BSG, yes, as a matter of fact...

[ovr8ted]

This thread has just gone "nucular". :down:

[hefe]

This thread has just gone "nucular". :down:

I think someone was just fission for an argument.

[ovr8ted]

I think someone was just fission for an argument.

I am very Pacific about what I say and how I pronounce it ;)

[Crrink]

Talking about having the language figured out, what is that apostrophe for after the word "President"?
Hah, nice catch.
I was using the general 'you' not the specific, in case you misunderstood the tone of my post.

[markz]

I am very Pacific about what I say and how I pronounce it ;)

Sounds like a few people need to take the "Joe Johnson Vocabulary Builder Upper" program as advertised on "Bob & Tom"! :D

[Anubys]

I guess this will from now on be the "let's get back on topic" post:

"Bondage Boomer". :D

[Rob Helmerichs]

I guess this will from now on be the "let's get back on topic" post:

"Bondage Boomer". :D
Bondage Boomer fall down go boom. :(

But we still have Knocked-Up Boomer.

And all their naked sisters...

(Whoops, they went boom too. But I'm sure there's still a world of Boomers somewhere out there, just waiting for us to discover them.

Sad, lonely Boomers.)

[latrobe7]

(Whoops, they went boom too. But I'm sure there's still a world of Boomers somewhere out there, just waiting for us to discover them.
Sad, lonely Boomers.)

I visit them nightly in the amusement park I call "Slumberland" :)

[Anubys]

I visit them nightly in the amusement park I call "Slumberland" :)

I thought I saw you there! as long as there's no sword crossing, we're ok ;)

[ronsch]

I thought I saw you there! as long as there's no sword crossing, we're ok ;)

Whatever you do don't cross the streams!

[latrobe7]

OK, anyhoo, back to the regular scheduled discussion.

Here's one I don't think anyone else has mentioned:

I thought it was interesting when Tigh was questioning Chief (in "Resistance"), when Chief was denying he was a Cylon, and he said "My father was a priest; my mother was an oracle"

Something tells me that will resurface later somehow...

[Anubys]

that's a good catch about the Chief...I didn't remember that...

what I didn't understand is why accuse the chief of being a cylon...I could understand accusing him of being a collaborator...Tigh is just stupid...spies don't date each other so if one's cover is blown, they take the other one with them!

[Rob Helmerichs]

what I didn't understand is why accuse the chief of being a cylon...I could understand accusing him of being a collaborator...Tigh is just stupid...spies don't date each other so if one's cover is blown, they take the other one with them!
Yeah, but when it comes to Cylons, they're ALL pretty stupid, and I think that's on purpose. Remember, they still mostly think of the Spylons as simple machines, even though they're medically indistinguishable from humans. I think the anti-Cylon prejudice in the humans on the show runs so deep, they just can't imagine that somebody could be close to a Cylon and not know--hence the suspicion of the Chief.

Adama is the only one still on Galactica who has shown a whiff of common sense concerning the Cylons...

[gthassell]

Does anyone have a copy of The Farm that they could burn onto DVD for me? I'd be happy to PayPal or send you a check for costs + a bit for your Time.

I'm in Chicago and got stuck with the SciFi going to All Digital mess, so I missed my BSG, SG-1, and SG Atlantis last Friday night. (if anyone has the SG episodes from last Friday as well, I'd greatly appreciate it.)

And, as luck would have it, wasn;t able to get the new digital box working with TiVo until after The Farm Re-ran last night.

Thanks,

Todd

[TheNumberSix]

Since BSG is higher in my SP list than Rescue Me, last night my Tivo wanted to record a BSG rerun (the S2 marathon) instead of the all-new Rescue Me! Damn you, TiVo!

Luckily, I was watching TV right at 10 PM and noticed the TiVo wanted to change to the wrong channel. I swooped in and manually fixed it.

[SparkleMotion]

You should set your SP options to "First Run Only" to avoid that.

[Royster]

She said Cylons couldn't get pregnant by another Cylon.

Something dosn't make sense here. We still don't know why the Cylons attacked and wiped out most of the population. And they still attack every time they see a non-Cylon. (I have a hard time calling the BSG people "humans".) Why?

If the new models are their future, then they need the people around. Wouldn;t it have been better to have a stealth invasion and have Gaius knock up Six without blowing up Caprica? What is the point of this war and why does it continue?

[SparkleMotion]

They seemed well-prepared to find plenty of breeding stock among the survivors on Caprica....

[Rob Helmerichs]

I still think there are two (at least) factions among the Cylons--the Kill Them All faction, and the We Can Use These Cattle faction.

[ronsch]

Has anyone else seen the mini-feature on the women of BSG in this week's TV Guide?

[Kevdog]

I still think there are two (at least) factions among the Cylons--the Kill Them All faction, and the We Can Use These Cattle faction. How about a third: the "I really want to BE human" faction.

[latrobe7]

Has anyone else seen the mini-feature on the women of BSG in this week's TV Guide?

NO!! Are there pictures?! :D Is it worth checking out? Will this cause my Boomer-lust to flare up?

[latrobe7]

Something dosn't make sense here. We still don't know why the Cylons attacked and wiped out most of the population. And they still attack every time they see a non-Cylon. (I have a hard time calling the BSG people "humans".) Why?

If the new models are their future, then they need the people around. Wouldn;t it have been better to have a stealth invasion and have Gaius knock up Six without blowing up Caprica? What is the point of this war and why does it continue?

Yeah, that is a good question. I mean how hard would it be to get random guys to impregnate Boomer and 6 on Caprica before the war? Heck they could have sent one of each to every city on the planet and no one would be the wiser.

Hmm, maybe there is something to the "Cylon faction" theory...

[latrobe7]

that's a good catch about the Chief...I didn't remember that...

what I didn't understand is why accuse the chief of being a cylon...I could understand accusing him of being a collaborator...Tigh is just stupid...spies don't date each other so if one's cover is blown, they take the other one with them!

Yeah, but when it comes to Cylons, they're ALL pretty stupid, and I think that's on purpose. ...I think the anti-Cylon prejudice in the humans on the show runs so deep, they just can't imagine that somebody could be close to a Cylon and not know--hence the suspicion of the Chief.

Yeah, I think there is going to be a witch-hunt/McCarthyism type angle coming soon.

[ronsch]

NO!! Are there pictures?! :D Is it worth checking out? Will this cause my Boomer-lust to flare up?


Yes, there are pictures. I wouldn't go so far as to buy one but look for the cover with Sela Ward on the front and turn to page 46 while waiting in the line at the grocery store. The Boomer and Starbuck pics aren't bad but it's #6 that will generate the lust. Does one find it difficult to believe that she's a former Victoria's Secret model?? :D :D

[latrobe7]

Yes, there are pictures. I wouldn't go so far as to buy one but look for the cover with Sela Ward on the front and turn to page 46 while waiting in the line at the grocery store. The Boomer and Starbuck pics aren't bad but it's #6 that will generate the lust. Does one find it difficult to believe that she's a former Victoria's Secret model?? :D :D

Excellent.

[lordrichter]

Something dosn't make sense here. We still don't know why the Cylons attacked and wiped out most of the population. And they still attack every time they see a non-Cylon. (I have a hard time calling the BSG people "humans".) Why?

If the new models are their future, then they need the people around. Wouldn;t it have been better to have a stealth invasion and have Gaius knock up Six without blowing up Caprica? What is the point of this war and why does it continue?


Those that survive are the strongest. Evolution in action.

[ovr8ted]

Those that survive are the strongest. Evolution in action.

In which case Giaus is the strongest, I mean, he survived a Nuke Blast and all, only protected by 6, right ;) I'm no scientist, but seeing as though the windows were shattered and the house blown to bits, seems sort of odd that he made it through, , ,

I'm going to agree with the different factions as well, toasters, kill all, use them, corrupted model (Boomer). Someone in a separate post mentioned "The Original" cylon spylon creator, hmmm, that's interesting.

[Anubys]

what I like about him hiding behind Six is that he crouched down...so instead of hiding behind her body, he was only hiding behind her skinny legs...thus exposing MORE of himself to the blast, not less!

[vman41]

Those that survive are the strongest. Evolution in action.

Strongest and the smartest, they are taking anti-radiation meds.

[TAsunder]

The blast might have been a halluciation of some sort.

[NoThru22]

gthassell don't you have bittorrent?

And about the glowing spine thing. I guess cylon women don't like to/can't do it doggystyle.

[markz]

And about the glowing spine thing. I guess cylon women don't like to/can't do it doggystyle.

From the looks of your avatar, neither do you! Sorry! Couldn't resist! :)

[JasonTX]

From the looks of your avatar, neither do you! Sorry! Couldn't resist! :)

Ok I never post but that was funny.

[5thcrewman]

No "Reverse Cowgirl" either! :(

[JoeyJoJo]

Wild speculation on Baltar. That scene from the mini-series has been bugging me for a while. There is no way that she could have protected him from a blast like that. So what if her only job was to make him think that she saved him from the blast. That his last conscious thought was that she somehow saved him from the blast so that his new body would wake up and not question why he survived. That's right I'm going on record saying that Baltar is a Cylon. But I'm not going to stop there -- I'm going to guess that he is also "God." "The Big Guy." "The Almighty."

Here's my take. Original Baltar is a genius who falls in leauge with the Cylons and creates the human models, including one in his own image to stay on Caprica and provide his cover.

Seems to make good sense from what we know:

Some Cylons think they are human.
Surviving a nuclear blast would be damn near impossible.
Baltar believes that he is God's Instrument.
Six is somehow "in his head."

Yep Baltar=Cylon=God.

Someone please remember this post when I'm proved wrong at some point in the future and throw it up in my face.

[Anubys]

Yep Baltar=Cylon=God.

Someone please remember this post when I'm proved wrong at some point in the future and throw it up in my face.

do we have to wait? can't we just tell you that you're wrong now and get it over with? :p

[IndyJones1023]

I still get puzzled over some of the small, seemingly inconsequential, changes between the original series and the new one.

You need to ignore the original series. Aside from some inspiration, this is a whole new creation. The occasion nod back to its roots is cute, but don't hold the old series against the new one.

Pretty good episode. I'll be glad to be off Caprica, though.

[JoeyJoJo]

do we have to wait? can't we just tell you that you're wrong now and get it over with? :p


Of course! But it will lack the punch when you can support it with an episode blowing my theory out of the water! That's where the fun begins.

[Solver]

A Six receiver?
A Father?
A Hero?
A Cylon?
God?
All of the above?

Baltar never did give himself one of those cylon tests, did he?

[jwjody]

Wild speculation on Baltar. That scene from the mini-series has been bugging me for a while. There is no way that she could have protected him from a blast like that. So what if her only job was to make him think that she saved him from the blast. That his last conscious thought was that she somehow saved him from the blast so that his new body would wake up and not question why he survived. That's right I'm going on record saying that Baltar is a Cylon. But I'm not going to stop there -- I'm going to guess that he is also "God." "The Big Guy." "The Almighty."

Here's my take. Original Baltar is a genius who falls in leauge with the Cylons and creates the human models, including one in his own image to stay on Caprica and provide his cover.

Seems to make good sense from what we know:

Some Cylons think they are human.
Surviving a nuclear blast would be damn near impossible.
Baltar believes that he is God's Instrument.
Six is somehow "in his head."

Yep Baltar=Cylon=God.

Someone please remember this post when I'm proved wrong at some point in the future and throw it up in my face.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=3132127&highlight=baltar#post3132127
I made the same suggestion a while back.
Something dosn't make sense here. We still don't know why the Cylons attacked and wiped out most of the population. And they still attack every time they see a non-Cylon. (I have a hard time calling the BSG people "humans".) Why?

If the new models are their future, then they need the people around. Wouldn;t it have been better to have a stealth invasion and have Gaius knock up Six without blowing up Caprica? What is the point of this war and why does it continue?
Part of it could be the religious aspects. Death to the infidels.
J

[5thcrewman]

Baltar = Baltar
6 = Lucifer
? = Count Iblis

[SparkleMotion]

Which one is Frankenberry?

[Stormspace]

Wild speculation on Baltar. That scene from the mini-series has been bugging me for a while. There is no way that she could have protected him from a blast like that. So what if her only job was to make him think that she saved him from the blast. That his last conscious thought was that she somehow saved him from the blast so that his new body would wake up and not question why he survived. That's right I'm going on record saying that Baltar is a Cylon. But I'm not going to stop there -- I'm going to guess that he is also "God." "The Big Guy." "The Almighty."

Here's my take. Original Baltar is a genius who falls in leauge with the Cylons and creates the human models, including one in his own image to stay on Caprica and provide his cover.

Seems to make good sense from what we know:

Some Cylons think they are human.
Surviving a nuclear blast would be damn near impossible.
Baltar believes that he is God's Instrument.
Six is somehow "in his head."

Yep Baltar=Cylon=God.

Someone please remember this post when I'm proved wrong at some point in the future and throw it up in my face.

I think your argument is sound. Yet if he's just a copy, the original must be god. The cylons enticed him to join them and being an opportunist he seized the moment and when along with it by creating a duplicate of himself from which all the others are modeled. The original creator of the Human Cylons would then be god. However there would be a tenuous relationship between the human cylons and the toasters since their ideology would be different.

It'd be interesting if the toaster segment have the same views on religion.

[Anubys]

While I have no proof, I will continue to maintain that the cylons have shown no ability AT ALL to clone an existing human...

Unless Baltar was never human in the first place...

[jwjody]

While I have no proof, I will continue to maintain that the cylons have shown no ability AT ALL to clone an existing human...

Unless Baltar was never human in the first place...
The word doesn't necessarily have to be clone.

They obviously can make human looking cylons. So all they need to do is make one that just looks like someone that already exists.

No biological cloning process needed.

J

[tbone526]

The word doesn't necessarily have to be clone.

They obviously can make human looking cylons. So all they need to do is make one that just looks like someone that already exists.

No biological cloning process needed.

J

It's more than just physical appearance, it's being able to transfer and replicate all the memories and experiences of an existing human into a cylon body. If they can do that, they've got a great avenue for insertion of spies. Otherwise, they need sleeper agents with good cover stories (such as Boomer being from an area that was wiped out or some such history).

[Anubys]

it took a minute to realize what was going on...tbone526 and jwjody's avatars are just similar enough that I was momentarily confused at why jwjody was having an argument with himself :o

everything we have seen so far points to the cylons only being able to make 12 distinct models...the only one with a "back story" is Boomer, and she turned out to need to be from a place where everyone was killed and they used the idendity of a child "survivor" to make up her past...that is a clear indication of their capabilities and their limits...

it's a sample of 1, but it's the only one we know!

[jwjody]

it took a minute to realize what was going on...tbone526 and jwjody's avatars are just similar enough that I was momentarily confused at why jwjody was having an argument with himself :o

everything we have seen so far points to the cylons only being able to make 12 distinct models...the only one with a "back story" is Boomer, and she turned out to need to be from a place where everyone was killed and they used the idendity of a child "survivor" to make up her past...that is a clear indication of their capabilities and their limits...

it's a sample of 1, but it's the only one we know!
Well, we don't know that they can only make 12 models. We know that so far they've only made 12.

I think it would be a stretch if Baltar is a cylon and there is an original leading the Cylons that made the spylons.

But, right now it's a stretch that Spylons can transfer their memories over great distances in a body that can't be told apart after an autopsy from a normal human being. Meaning they don't seem to have any electonic radio equipment built in. If we can accept that they have no electronic equipment in the body to accomplish that, then maybe it's not too far of a stretch that there is a way to program memories from a human into a Spylon.

J

[Amnesia]

They obviously can make human looking cylons. So all they need to do is make one that just looks like someone that already exists.
There's a huge difference between the two.

Any man and woman can make a baby, but to have that baby turn out to look like Tricia Helfer----a little more difficult.

[tbone526]

it took a minute to realize what was going on...tbone526 and jwjody's avatars are just similar enough that I was momentarily confused at why jwjody was having an argument with himself :o



Major difference in our avatars....the background in mine is my office, the background on his looks like he's out on a boat....sigh.....

[jwjody]

There's a huge difference between the two.

Any man and woman can make a baby, but to have that baby turn out to look like Tricia Helfer----a little more difficult.

Well, if you're building them and not raising them from a baby then you can build it to look like you want.

Right now we're under the impression that spylons were created looking like they do. Not necessarily born as a baby.

J

[danieljanderson]

But, right now it's a stretch that Spylons can transfer their memories over great distances in a body that can't be told apart after an autopsy from a normal human being. Meaning they don't seem to have any electonic radio equipment built in. If we can accept that they have no electronic equipment in the body to accomplish that, then maybe it's not too far of a stretch that there is a way to program memories from a human into a Spylon.

J

What Caprica Boomer knows of Galactica Boomers actions should shed some light on this aspect.

[Anubys]

Major difference in our avatars....the background in mine is my office, the background on his looks like he's out on a boat....sigh.....

I wasn't bragging about my great perception! :o ;)

I'm pretty sure that Six implied -- if not outright said -- that they can only make 12 models...while they never said WHY, I'm pretty sure the limit exists for some reason...it is a significant coincidence that there are 12 colonies and the search for the 13th continues...but right now, that's all it is, an interesting "hmmm"...

[Amnesia]

Well, if you're building them and not raising them from a baby then you can build it to look like you want.
Says who?

If they build them genetically, they might be able to ensure that Number 6 was tall and (naturally?) blonde, but that's about it. I don't think there's a gene for "überbabe"...

[Rob Helmerichs]

I got the impression (from what Boomer said) that they weren't built, per se, but grown.

I'm still not sure how to reconcile that with the transfer of consciousness from body to body, unless you end up with two Boomers' consciousness sharing one body...

And I still haven't abandoned the idea that they have a hive mind, or at least 12 hive minds, so that the transfer of consciousness is really just an uploading of knowledge to either the Cylon Consciousness or the Boomer (etc.) Consciousness.

[Anubys]

I think it's more of 12 hive minds, because Caprica Boomer had some knowledge gaps...if it were 1 mind, she would know everything (since she's not a spylon with different programming)...

of course, it may not be a hive mind at all...all I'm saying is if it's a hive mind concept, it's more likely to be 12, not 1...

[windracer]

You need to ignore the original series. Aside from some inspiration, this is a whole new creation. The occasion nod back to its roots is cute, but don't hold the old series against the new one.
I know, I know ... it's just hard to do. I loved TOS growing up. I have the collector's edition DVD set, and have been watching them recently, which is probably why I am noticing these things in the first place. ;)

[Waldorf]

Bump to top for those of us watching it for the first time in HD.

So yeah... there seems to be two schools of thought going on with the Cylons between complete annihilation of the human race and the farming aspect. Maybe the initial attacks were just to limit the numbers for easier picking and this is all part of the master plan?

Oh and just in case those fans of Grace Park are unaware: She did a layout for FHM/Maxim/Stuff at some point which was quite nice. Pics available via google image search. :)