Mac Users lack Tivo togo support

[TheSlyBear]

Yes, as puppy76 pointed out, since you can run either or both of Windows and OS X on the Intel boxes I don't see that there's any market need for one that would only run Windows.

[macrob]

Hell could freeze over. Anything's possible. Actually, if Apple really wanted to rock...

;)


Hell has already froze over, the day Apple released iTunes for windows... anyone remember apples website from that day ?

[TydalForce]

Apple won't ship Macs with Windows.

Likewise, I don't believe we'll see "Built-In Emulation" to natively run Windows applications.

Why? Because even if they did do that, even with Apple's talent and genius, they'd still be Windows applications. And a Windows application wouldn't "fit right" within the Mac OS.

And it would be too good of an excuse for the developers to not write Mac OS native software. Why write better-coded, better-fit Mac software when they can say "Oh, we wrote it for Windows. You can run that. Live with it"

Boot Camp will get better. Parallels will get better. Development will get better and easier. Everything will improve.

But Apple won't "give you" Windows compatibility at the application level like that.

[Fofer]

Boot Camp will get better. Parallels will get better.

Don't forget CrossOver! So far, I'm impressed. The compatibility list will grow. But it's serving my (admittedly minimal) needs very well right now. I just "installed" Internet Explorer 6.0 on my Mac.

[ccooperev]

There are now rumours out there that Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) will have DVR capabilities (akin to Windows Media Center) with the ability to stream that to iTV. This would be an interesting scenario. This might of course create a viable alternative to TIVO.

[Bighouse]

But you can buy one to use exclusivly for Windows now, and it would be somewhat pointless if they started just selling Windows PCs. I'm sure as a last ditch thing they might, but probably their market share's only going to grow with their current hardware.

Yeah, that ipod thing is amazing!

[Bighouse]

Well, I hope that Tivo gets the software ported and released for Macs soon...and one day maybe, if fortune smiles on me and Steve Jobs ever decides he wants to see Apple conquer the computing world, there will be a Macdows for me! :)

[Fofer]

There are now rumours out there that Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) will have DVR capabilities (akin to Windows Media Center)

With Apple-supplied hardware for the video tuning/channel changing?

[Bighouse]

Yes, as puppy76 pointed out, since you can run either or both of Windows and OS X on the Intel boxes I don't see that there's any market need for one that would only run Windows.

BB,

I can see a HUGE market need/share for an Apple that only ran Windows. See, I must run the Windows OS for the appliations I have to use and train/teach on. AutoCAD isn't written for a Mac platform any longer. I've always loved the look and style to the machines AND the interface for a Mac. I even just like the industrial design/fit and finish on them too. They're very, very, very sexy machines.

PC's are, for the most part, butt ugly boxes. A machine that you plunk down a lot of cash for should do what it should do, and it might as well look 'darned purdy' while doing it too.

So, if Apple made a truly Windows based system I'd buy one...me and lots and lots and lots of other people who're in the same boat.

Cheers,

Robert

[TheSlyBear]

I can see a HUGE market need/share for an Apple that only ran Windows. See, I must run the Windows OS for the appliations I have to use and train/teach on. AutoCAD isn't written for a Mac platform any longer.

You can do that now, today, on any of the Intel-based Macs.

Why sell one that can't also run OS X?

[geekmedic]

I recently ran across these two articles. Although the first is concerning, the second gives us Mac users a slight bit of hope:

http://www.pvrblog.com/pvr/2005/04/tivo_cfo_no_tiv.html

http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2006-01/tivotogo-for-mac-lives/

[cwoody222]

Those articles are from April 2005 and this past Jan, respectively.

[geekmedic]

Those articles are from April 2005 and this past Jan, respectively.
Yes, what's your point? I know it's been a little late to get the Mac software out.

[cwoody222]

Point was that a) it's old news that we've all seen before and b) it's hardly "hope".

[Fofer]

Well, I do have to say, while it's old and all, seeing the Mac (alpha? beta?) at CES actually working on a Mac gave me the only glimmer of hope that we'll see this functionality on our Macs... one day.

[geekmedic]

Well, I do have to say, while it's old and all, seeing the Mac (alpha? beta?) at CES actually working on a Mac gave me the only glimmer of hope that we'll see this functionality on our Macs... one day.
Agreed. That's why I posted it. Nevertheless, there will always be naysayers. We'll all be happy when TiVo-to-Go for Mac is released.

[cwoody222]

All that demo really shows is a TiVo interface for gettings files from the Mac.

The DRM is the problem on the Mac and there's nothing in those demos that shows that those files were protected and that TiVo had made any progress whatsoever enabling Macs to deal w/ the copyright protection.

While the demo showed me that they were working on SOMETHING, the fact that it was 10 months ago and we still don't have anything tells me that it's pretty hopeless.

[geekmedic]

All that demo really shows is a TiVo interface for gettings files from the Mac.

The DRM is the problem on the Mac and there's nothing in those demos that shows that those files were protected and that TiVo had made any progress whatsoever enabling Macs to deal w/ the copyright protection.

While the demo showed me that they were working on SOMETHING, the fact that it was 10 months ago and we still don't have anything tells me that it's pretty hopeless.
I wonder what percentage of TiVo customers have Macs? I've seen a LOT of Mac users on these boards... devoted fans likely to take advantage of TiVo-to-Go.

[TydalForce]

i think the correlation between having a Mac and having a TiVo is relatively high... There have been a lot of comparisons between TiVo and Apple, in terms of brand loyalty and "premium" products, etc.

So the kind of person who would own a TiVo is the kind of person who would own a Mac (and vice versa)

So, if you want me to pull a number from my posterior, I'd say about 10-15% of TiVo users have Macs. Please note, that number is based on nothing more than speculation and making things up :b

[TheSlyBear]

So, if you want me to pull a number from my posterior, I'd say about 10-15% of TiVo users have Macs.

MacWorld puts the estimate at 15%.

[tonyf3]

TiVo should release TTG for Mac as Universal binary no later than Q1 07 or it's pretty much all over for them as far as the 10-15% of their Mac users. Apple iTV will quickly overtake, increase feature set, out develope natively on Mac hardware and software. Apple's boxes will in less time than this thread has existed make the whole Mac TTG thing moot.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/12/hands-on-with-the-apple-itv-prototype/

[dropd]

There are now rumours out there that Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) will have DVR capabilities (akin to Windows Media Center) with the ability to stream that to iTV. This would be an interesting scenario. This might of course create a viable alternative to TIVO.

Imagine the following scenario:

* A mac mini and/or an iMac with a multistream cablecard slot built into it and/or an option to tune OTA digital TV signals via a usb dongle (like the ElGato EyeTV Hybrid device you can get for only about $150 or so).

* DVR/"media management" software built into iLife that can record/store at HD res, but that will also auto-convert shows of your choice to iPod friendly resolutions and file sizes.

* iTV devices on any tv in your house that can't be hooked up to your mac directly.

a 24" iMac with a cablecard slot would be a pretty impressive little all-purpose box for a bedroom, for example.

If something like that ever came to fruition, I would absolutely dump tivo in a heartbeat.

[Lon]

Recently, I wrote to Elgato asking about future cablecard compatible products. This was the reply I received:

The use of CableCards on computers depends on the cable industry. In general, they are against it - they fear copying/sharing of content.

2007 might see limited solutions on Windows, from a few manufacturers like ATI. But, that means the whole computer has to be certified - you can't just go out and buy a CableCard "box".

A few years after that might see such limited access on the Mac. It depends on many things.

So, CableCard use on computers is uncertain. If it does happen in the next few years, there will be lots of limitations and DRM.
Not great news. :(

[dropd]

Recently, I wrote to Elgato asking about future cablecard compatible products. This was the reply I received:


Not great news. :(

Yeah, not great news. Though I will make the small point that Apple certainly has way more leverage than El Gato towards that end.

As we've seen with TiVo though, getting certified by CableLabs seems pretty hellish.

[Lon]

I will say this: that my question about cablecard support was answered the same day by a representative of Elgato Systems! Imagine, a company that considers communication with its customers important!

[CardiacKid32]

Since tivo is trying to get cable card corp approval for tivo2go and the eSATA port, I don't think you will see any new tivo desktop released except for maybe a minor bug fix update. I've been thru security audits and one of the first things that always happens is the reduction of scope (the amount of software which has to be audited). This is done to streamline and hopeful speed up the approval process. I believe that tivo already has a mac version of the tivo desktop with tivo2go enabled ready to go and you will see it after tivo2go for the series 3 is approved.

[Lon]

Let me get this straight: you say that just because of the approval process, TiVo has been holding back on releasing an already finished mac product? Isn't that a bit dishonest (not just to mac users but) with the CableCard group? It seems to me that the certification process deals with the box (series 3) and *its* software -- not necessarily other computers' software, especially if all the DRM coding to satisfy the CC group is done onboard the series 3. But then I know nothing of how this is done in reality.

[Budget_HT]

There may still be some technical hurdles to resolve. But, then again, there may only be political/business interest hurdles left.

We all know that perfectly good technical solutions can be hampered or held back by political or business interest issues.

[2farrell]

TiVo should release TTG for Mac as Universal binary no later than Q1 07 or it's pretty much all over for them as far as the 10-15% of their Mac users. Apple iTV will quickly overtake, increase feature set, out develope natively on Mac hardware and software. Apple's boxes will in less time than this thread has existed make the whole Mac TTG thing moot.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/12/hands-on-with-the-apple-itv-prototype/

And then TiVo's problems will be over.
They can do what they've done for the last two years but no longer pretend they care about Mac Users.
If iTV (or whatever it will be called) come out before TTG for Mac, I will either sell my TiVo boxes on eBay or junk them if it ends up being too much trouble.

[homertime]

TiVo should release TTG for Mac as Universal binary no later than Q1 07 or it's pretty much all over for them as far as the 10-15% of their Mac users. Apple iTV will quickly overtake, increase feature set, out develope natively on Mac hardware and software. Apple's boxes will in less time than this thread has existed make the whole Mac TTG thing moot.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/12/hands-on-with-the-apple-itv-prototype/



AHH someone finally said it... I wanted to...


This is so true. Amongst all the other things we COULD do right now - eye TV, external DVD burners, etc, this will be what brings Mac Tivo users away from Tivo...

[Fofer]

We all know that perfectly good technical solutions can be hampered or held back by political or business interest issues.

Of course. In this case, it's DRM. The "alpha" demo at CES was working on Macs (playing via VLC.) I grab files off my (hacked) TiVo's and play them just fine on my Mac using QuickTime Player (and the MPEG-2) plug-in. TiVoTool for Mac formats it nicely for the iPod/PSP too.

The thing holding up the Mac support is the DRM, a business interest issue.

[robreams]

So at this point, what's the best method for getting content from digital cable onto a Mac?

[macrob]

I grab files off my (hacked) TiVo's and play them just fine on my Mac using QuickTime Player (and the MPEG-2) plug-in.

What Kind of Tivo do you have? I looked into hacking mine, but found info stating that most of the series 2 Tivos are unhackable without replacing a specific chip on the board.

I would like to hack mine, but my soldering skills are not that good, so a software solution would be my prefferred option.

[Fofer]

What Kind of Tivo do you have?

A pair of HDVR2's, which are Series 2 DirecTiVo's.

[EwanG]

So at this point, what's the best method for getting content from digital cable onto a Mac?

If you're not worried about viewing it on the Mac, just backing it up to show on the Tivo again later, then you can use Galleon - which works on Windows, Linux, and the Mac.

If you want to view it on the Mac, your best bet is to play back the show, hook a cable to one of the other Tivo outputs, and do a capture to the Mac using a DV or USB capture device.

FWIW,
Ewan

[schalliol]

Wow, what a terrible method. Yes, I guess it's better than nothing, but boy is TiVo really frustrating its customers to make us go to such levels. I'm not sure why TiVo needs to keep plans secret.

[Fofer]

If you're not worried about viewing it on the Mac, just backing it up to show on the Tivo again later, then you can use Galleon - which works on Windows, Linux, and the Mac.

If you want to view it on the Mac, your best bet is to play back the show, hook a cable to one of the other Tivo outputs, and do a capture to the Mac using a DV or USB capture device.


Or hack the TiVo (if you can) and use TiVoWeb/TiVoTool to stream/download shows.

[ccoulson]

I can't believe it! NOBODY updated this thread in the past day? Oh, wait, I just did... ;)

C'mon Tivo, give us our TivoToGo for Mac! And give us TivoToGo for Series3! Oh, and give us multi-room viewing for the Series3!

[homertime]

Or hack the TiVo (if you can) and use TiVoWeb/TiVoTool to stream/download shows.


why would anyone want to waste their time & money by doing that when the company we are paying should provide support to all of its users?

[Fofer]

why would anyone want to waste their time & money by doing that when the company we are paying should provide support to all of its users?


:confused:

Perhaps the company "should," but as of now, they're not. And so rather than bitch and moan about it for two years (with nothing to show for it) I guess I'm just happy that there's an option that allows me to take matters into my own hands.

So I've got the best computer OS on the planet, the best PVR, and can transfer shows whenever I want. I hardly see that as a waste of time. Sure, in a perfect world, TiVo would offer this "officially." But they don't. And I hardly think that me hacking my TiVo will change that in any way. So I was just throwing it out as a suggestion, to other folks who might agree... life's too short.

[trip1eX]

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4414408&highlight=visualhub#post4414408

[Fofer]

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4414408&highlight=visualhub#post4414408

Thanks for this link; it tells us about an easy way to enable TiVo-GoBack from a Mac. But it has nothing to do with TiVo To Go. So I'm not entirely sure why you've posted it in this thread.

[trip1eX]

Thanks for this link; it tells us about an easy way to enable TiVo-GoBack from a Mac. But it has nothing to do with TiVo To Go. So I'm not entirely sure why you've posted it in this thread.

Well thanks for your concern.

Obviously this 52 page thread has been totally on topic with every post dripping with info about Tivo to Go with never a mention of VisualHub or related Tivo features and I have cluttered it up with a totally off-topic post. Sorry.

For those that are waiting for tivo to go and want another good use for their tivo then check out visualhub. You can turn your tivo into a poor man's iTV.

[Fofer]

http://www.apple.com/downloads/dashboard/movie_tv/nowplayingtivowidget.html

[derekcbart]

New version:
http://www.dashboardwidgets.com/showcase/details.php?wid=281

[ccoulson]

Called Tivo support today and asked the latest status on TTG for Mac. I loved the reponse so much I just had to share it with rest... Her response was "we have been working very hard on Tivo To Go for Mac for over two years now, but Apple is making it very difficult for us becuase they keep updating Mac OS X every few months."

No folks, that is not a joke and that is the actual repsonse I got from a second level support tech...

Note to Apple: Please cease all development on Mac OS X and shut down Software Update - we don't want any more bug fixes, security updates, or other enhancements so that Tivo can finish their product. This *must* be why Windows XP has not been updated in so many years - look at the happy XP users that have had TTG for over 2 years now!

[Lon]

"we have been working very hard on Tivo To Go for Mac for over two years now, but Apple is making it very difficult for us becuase they keep updating Mac OS X every few months."

I am speechless!

[Ybot]

I am speechless!

Ugh, I am losing hope that there is a light at the end of the tunnel!!!

[Fofer]

"we have been working very hard on Tivo To Go for Mac for over two years now, but Apple is making it very difficult for us becuase they keep updating Mac OS X every few months."


That's absolutely precious.


I'm sure it was working just fine on OS X 10.4.7. And then Apple had to screw everything up by coming out with 10.4.8! :mad: :down:




:rolleyes:

[geekmedic]

That's absolutely precious.


I'm sure it was working just fine on OS X 10.4.7. And then Apple had to screw everything up by coming out with 10.4.8! :mad: :down:




:rolleyes:
10.5 is right around the corner.

[Fofer]

10.5 is right around the corner.

Yikes! That darn Apple, Inc. Always a moving target. Oh well, TiVo, just kick back and wait for them to stop innovating. Maybe that'll finally give you a breather to come out with compatible software already.

[tonyf3]

http://www.apple.com/downloads/dashboard/movie_tv/nowplayingtivowidget.html


I love this widget, been using it for quite a while. You can even download. You just can't play them. Damn you TiVo!

[tonyf3]

Called Tivo support today and asked the latest status on TTG for Mac. I loved the reponse so much I just had to share it with rest... Her response was "we have been working very hard on Tivo To Go for Mac for over two years now, but Apple is making it very difficult for us becuase they keep updating Mac OS X every few months."

No folks, that is not a joke and that is the actual repsonse I got from a second level support tech...

Note to Apple: Please cease all development on Mac OS X and shut down Software Update - we don't want any more bug fixes, security updates, or other enhancements so that Tivo can finish their product. This *must* be why Windows XP has not been updated in so many years - look at the happy XP users that have had TTG for over 2 years now!


The only thing they've been working hard at is avoiding communicating to us properly!

[timg]

The only thing they've been working hard at is avoiding communicating to us properly!

Actually, they've done a wonderful job avoiding communicating with us AT ALL!

I have a Series 2 with lifetime subscription, so I will continue to use it until it dies. But for anything new, it will not be a Tivo.

[Puppy76]

Yup. Tivo's just not making what I need, unfortunatly. A Series 3 with no Tivo 2 Go at all really kills it for me. I'm kind of resigned to trying Netflix once I run out of stuff to watch.

[double_d]

TTG doesn't work on a Mac, yet I have to run a Mac to get all the functionality I want with Tivo... read on

http://trialsoftheswitch.com/index.php/2006/09/23/tivo/

DD

[icurnvs]

Here's an email I sent Tom Rogers:
Tom,

I think it would be in your best interests to take a gander at the following thread:
(*Inserted URL to this thread, but these forums won't let me post links til 5 posts*)

There are 50+ pages of comments by people discussing the lack of Mac Tivo2Go support. If you'll notice, there are well over 100,000 views on this thread alone. It is easily one of the top viewed threads on the whole tivocommunity site. You've no doubt heard from other frustrated members of the TivoCommunity site. I'm a mostly happy Tivo customer. I'm lucky enough to have both a Mac and PC. I'd like to chuck the PC out the window, but there's one lingering app that I don't have on my Mac. Yep, you guessed it; Tivo Desktop with Tivo2Go support. You have a lot of angry users over there at that site, as well as many more happy ones I'm sure. The people who are looking for Mac support only want information other than the vague "We're hard at work on it! More to come!" To them, that's just a slap in the face. Are the technological hurdles you're facing that big that you can't let TivoPony (or yourself) give the Mac community a little information as to when the software will be released? As you no doubt know, you're going to lose customers to the "iTV". There are several in that thread that have already said that they will be ditching Tivo for the iTV when it's released. I'm not one of them. I, for one, will have both. The iTV and Tivo do two very different (and useful!) things so I will be nabbing both of them. Back to the point. You'll sure make a lot of folks happy if you can give them more information as to the status of this software. I just hope this email doesn't fall on deaf ears.


Here was Tom's response:
Your comments have fully registered. Thanks, Tom

[cwoody222]

Wow, he must have worked hard on that response... as hard as they're working on the Mac ToGo software.

Another slap in the face. Another friggin' joke.

I don't know why you even bothered... if TiVo had any desire to give Mac users the ToGo softwar, we'd have it by now. It's not coming. Ever. They're incapable of making it happen.

[murrays]

Here's a question:

I'm thinking of getting a Series 3 for our HD set downstairs and transferring our lifetime subscription from our Series 2. One concern is that we do most of our TV watching on the SD set upstairs and I’d miss having two DVR’s after the year of support for the old box.

Would it be possible to use a Mac to transfer SD .tivo files from a Series 3 (assuming future Series 3 support for TiVotogo) to a Series 2? What happens to a Series 2 when the subscription runs out? Will it still play files stored on the HD?

Basically, I’m wondering if I can use the Series 2 without a subscription to view shows recorded on the Series 3.

Thanks
-murray

[cwoody222]

I am 99% sure a Series2 can't do ANYTHING without a subscription. Not even trick play with live TV and certainly not 'advanced' features like be networked to your mac.

I think there's even issues with the MPEG formats between the two Series'.

I don't expect MRV or file compatibility between S2 and S3 units for a long time, if ever, sorry.


Anyone else correct me if they disagree or I'm just flat-out wrong :)

[Dennis Wilkinson]

Basically, I’m wondering if I can use the Series 2 without a subscription to view shows recorded on the Series 3.

Even if TiVo gets permission to turn on multi-room viewing from the OpenCable folks, and SD MPEG recorded on a Series 3 is compatible with the Series 2, a Series 2 can do nothing at all except trick-play live TV without a subscription.

So, regardless of how the two big "ifs" above work out, the answer is no.

If all you really want to do is watch the S3 in one of the two rooms, or watch the same programming in two rooms simultaneously, you could use a video sender of some sort (A/V baluns, or something like Terk's Leapfrog) to ship the SD video around.

[Fofer]

If all you really want to do is watch the S3 in one of the two rooms, or watch the same programming in two rooms simultaneously, you could use a video sender of some sort (A/V baluns, or something like Terk's Leapfrog) to ship the SD video around.

Using a modulator would work too... that's actually how I distribute TiVo to TV sets around the house.

For a better picture I've got my bedroom TV wired to my living room TiVo via really long s-video and audio (composite) cables.

I find this preferable to having to "wait" while a TiVo MRV's a show. Also nice that my bedroom doesn't have the "whirrrrr" of a TiVo keeping me up at night (I'm a light sleeper.)

But most importantly, since S3 doesn't do MRV (yet? ever?) it's a system that, as of today, will Just Work™.

[murrays]

Hmm, ok, I was afraid of that. Perhaps by next year there will be a way to use a Series 3 with an iTV (yeah, right!)

-murray

[gonzotek]

I am 99% sure a Series2 can't do ANYTHING without a subscription. Not even trick play with live TV and certainly not 'advanced' features like be networked to your mac.From the TiVo Support site (http://tivo.instancy.com/external/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=46FE914B-844D-4A19-B4F8-1022568DBDBF)(emphasis added by me): A TiVo Digital Video Recorder (DVR) is intended for use only with a paid subscription to the TiVo service. Without the TiVo service:

# A TiVo DVR has extremely limited functionality, e.g., pause, fast-forward, rewind, and slow-mo live TV.

# No smart, automatic-recording service functionality is represented or should be expected.

Note: Series1 DVRs manufactured before October of 2001 are able to make manual time-based recordings without TiVo service if they shipped with software version 1.3 or earlier.
I think there's even issues with the MPEG formats between the two Series'.Do you have a reference for this? I'm not aware of any discussions/investigations on the technical qualities of S3 recordings. If such exist, I'm interested in learning about the topic.

[cwoody222]

I thought the Series3 used MPEG-4. I see I'm wrong. It CAN do both MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 but currently records in 2. So I guess the formats could be compatible.

[cwoody222]

If TiVo really wanted to a) put out a good Mac product and b) actually communicate with Mac users they'd take a lesson from the good folks at Slingbox

http://www.pvrwire.com/2006/10/17/slingplayer-mac-public-beta-by-november/

[rworne]

Well, I was fairly quiet waiting news for TiVo2go for the Mac.

About 2 weeks ago I disconnected the TiVo and set up a MythTV box. I found the MythTV box is much more Mac-friendly than TiVo could ever hope to be, as well as supplying my videos in MPEG-2 or any other format I desire. Unlike my Series-2, I also get all my OTA stuff via a digital ATSC tuner as well as HD content too.

Now, I'm more disappointed at TiVo than angry, but the lack of new features for Mac owners was a real disappointment. The slowness of the box, which gets worse with every update is horrible (3-5 sec delays on the menus).

My only gripe now is that since I paid for lifetime, TiVo isn't losing a subscriber. Though if I ebay the box, it will prevent them from getting a new one, which is just as good.

Now MythTV has it's quirks and bugs - as well as being a chore to set up - but it certainly performs well as a DVR (and other things). The cost was roughly the same as a new Series-3, and does all the 3 can do and much more.

[donsullivan]

If TiVo really wanted to a) put out a good Mac product and b) actually communicate with Mac users they'd take a lesson from the good folks at Slingbox

http://www.pvrwire.com/2006/10/17/slingplayer-mac-public-beta-by-november/

I'm not sure I'd use Slingbox as an example of communicating well with their potential Mac customers. They are going through a majorly botched product rollout as it relates to Mac support. The new products they announced in September were advertised on the web site, in their press releases and on the boxes as supporting OS X. It turns out they don't and they can't tell you for sure when they will because there is no software. I made the mistake of trusting all of that information and got the box home only to find out I couldn't use it and had to return it. I've since learned that they've been promising this software since Macworld in January and have missed at least 2 other committments to ship a Mac client.

They've ended up having to pull nearly all the references to supporting OS X off of their web site because of misrepresentation issues. At this point they've become so shell shocked by the error they made they've essentially gone silent on the topic. In September the mac client was going to ship in week 3, then is was in october, then tech support said no sooner than Mid-November. Bottom line while we're told there is a private beta, NDA's (I'm assuming) would prevent any actual confirmation that it does indeed exist.

While clearly not as arrogant as TiVo's approach not nearly an example of a vendor effectively communicting with their customer base.

[cwoody222]

I didn't know all that!

That said, I still get the feeling that Slingbox is TRYING whereas I have fully believed for months that TiVo has no intention whatsoever of ever releasing a Mac product (regardless of what they imply here).

[Larshart]

Called Tivo support today and asked the latest status on TTG for Mac. I loved the reponse so much I just had to share it with rest... Her response was "we have been working very hard on Tivo To Go for Mac for over two years now, but Apple is making it very difficult for us becuase they keep updating Mac OS X every few months."


There is no way that all of Apple's incremental bug fix updates could be causing their programmers grief.

I've seen some screenshots of it being demoed at some shows. I wish they would just give it to us NOW and call it a beta! I could deal some crashes and bugs. :confused:

Better yet, why don't they Open Source it. Give it to the community and let all the programmers out in the wild help out.

What was that sound? Did you hear it? I think someone at the MPAA just dropped dead of a heart attack. :eek:

[icurnvs]

I didn't know all that!

That said, I still get the feeling that Slingbox is TRYING whereas I have fully believed for months that TiVo has no intention whatsoever of ever releasing a Mac product (regardless of what they imply here).


If you're so convinced and positive that Tivo is never going to support Macs, then why do you post in this thread almost daily? :p Wouldn't that be like beating a dead horse?
Admit it...there's still some hope left in ya.

[rworne]

If you're so convinced and positive that Tivo is never going to support Macs, then why do you post in this thread almost daily? :p Wouldn't that be like beating a dead horse?
Admit it...there's still some hope left in ya.

Actually, it can be explained by this true story:

In Japan, there was a dog named Hachiko who waited for his master to return from work every day at the train station.

One day, his master died. Yet every day after that, the dog waited on the platform for his master to appear - and did so for the next eleven years.


That pretty much sums up TiVo's Mac support and the Mac faithful.

[cwoody222]

I want them to prove me wrong. But I don't think they will.

I bought a S3 and am selling my S2 now anyway so TiVoToGo for me is a moot point. Although I still think they should support Macs for all the other users out there.

[Fofer]

I bought a S3 and am selling my S2 now anyway so TiVoToGo for me is a moot point. Although I still think they should support Macs for all the other users out there.

It may be a moot point now... but I suspect you'll be hopping mad (again) when they eventually enable TTG for the Series 3... for Windows users only.

:eek: :o :(

[cwoody222]

Nah.

I honestly have no hope for S3 ToGo support due to CableCARD / digital rights issues. I don't blame TiVo for that one, though.

[chessplayer]

Actually, it can be explained by this true story:

In Japan, there was a dog named Hachiko who waited for his master to return from work every day at the train station.
Nice analogy. There was a very sad episode of Futurama based on this story. Actually, I feel betrayed by TiVo's deception on this issue, whereas I don't believe that the dog felt betrayed.

How vile it is of TiVo to continue to pretend to be working hard on Mac support, even after the CFO said years ago not to expect Mac support in the forseeable future. It took a lot of nerve for TiVo to deny the CFO's statement, and keep stringing Mac users along.

[davezatz]

Bottom line while we're told there is a private beta, NDA's (I'm assuming) would prevent any actual confirmation that it does indeed exist.

Sling gave me a demo on several Macs in their offices a few weeks ago, and I bumped into the crew at DigitalLife last week and they let me play around with the software on a MacBook. It exists, and the public beta will be available very soon - based on everything I've heard direct from Sling execs (not tech support rumors), I'd guess within 2 weeks we'll be able to download it.

Here's a pic I took at the Javits Center last Thursday:
http://www.zatznotfunny.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/10/sling-mac.jpg

Last but not least... I also chatted with the TiVo booth babe, who happens to be my press contact, at DL and was informed Mac TTG development continues. I couldn't get her to reveal a time frame, but she mentioned there could be an announcement sometime in the near future. Is the near future weeks or months? I'm afraid to speculate...

I'm glad to see cwoody won't be blaming TiVo for no S3 TTG. ;)

[cwoody222]

Lemme correct my statement ;)

IF TiVo has ANY TiVoToGo for S3 and even Windows, I'll be suprised. And won't blame TiVo if it doesn't happen.

But if TiVo has anything for Windows and then doesn't offer equal support for Macs, then the blame WILL lie squarely with TiVo.

[patdaddy]

why is it that you can download tivo to go recordings to an IPOD but only via a PC?
Now that is just wrong. Still waiting....2.5 years and counting.

patdaddy

[Fofer]

why is it that you can download tivo to go recordings to an IPOD but only via a PC?


The irony astounds, doesn't it?

And this raises an interesting question. If the hold-up is due to DRM issues and playback on the Mac (and we know it is) then what would the response be if TiVo ultimately announced:

"We've got TTG support for Mac now, but it only syncs to a connected iPod. Playback directly on the Mac is not implied/available/supported/etc."

Interesting compromise, and I wonder what the public's response would be. It's better than nothing, no?

[rworne]

The irony astounds, doesn't it?

And this raises an interesting question. If the hold-up is due to DRM issues and playback on the Mac (and we know it is) then what would the response be if TiVo ultimately announced:

"We've got TTG support for Mac now, but it only syncs to a connected iPod. Playback directly on the Mac is not implied/available/supported/etc."

Interesting compromise, and I wonder what the public's response would be. It's better than nothing, no?

Since the TiVo itself cannot transcode *and* neither can the iPod, that leaves the Mac as the transcoding solution.

The big catch point is the intermediate files. They *could* transcode directly from the encrypted tivo video to an iPod format using their own program and skip Quicktime/iTunes - true. Then the only thing you could play on the Mac is the iPod video - with the watermarking and all that crap. TiVo would have control over the whole process from TiVo download to the final iPod video.

All that would be left is people bitching over the downgrade from what was demoed more than two years ago - and having to pay for it.

[ZeoTiVo]

Last but not least... I also chatted with the TiVo booth babe, who happens to be my press contact, at DL and was informed Mac TTG development continues. I couldn't get her to reveal a time frame, but she mentioned there could be an announcement sometime in the near future. Is the near future weeks or months? I'm afraid to speculate...
wow, still the tantalizing but vague info from TiVo. Wonder if the Mac developer at TiVo has any hair left :eek:

[ccoulson]

The irony astounds, doesn't it?

And this raises an interesting question. If the hold-up is due to DRM issues and playback on the Mac (and we know it is) then what would the response be if TiVo ultimately announced:

"We've got TTG support for Mac now, but it only syncs to a connected iPod. Playback directly on the Mac is not implied/available/supported/etc."

Interesting compromise, and I wonder what the public's response would be. It's better than nothing, no?


Doesn't help me - I want to watch TTG on a Mac laptop...

[Fofer]

Doesn't help me - I want to watch TTG on a Mac laptop...

And I want a pony.

The point is, TiVo's dropped the ball for Mac users. And yet, I'd go so far as to say, being able to easily watch my TiVo content on an iPod would be better than nothing.

[pdxkevin]

I wrote an angry email the other night, and I actually received a response from the VP of Product Marketing for TiVo's retail products. I'm actually very surprised. I'll share what he had to say:

Dear Mr. ,

My name is Jim Denney, I am in Vice President of Product Marketing for TiVo's retail products. Tom Rogers forwarded your message to me. I wanted to thank you for your email and apologize for the delay in TiVoToGo for the Mac. I am sorry that you feel we have not paid attention to the Mac community. That is certainly not our intention. We are aware of our subscriber's desire to get TiVoToGo on the Mac. Believe it or not, we are actively working on the project and have been for the past year in various forms. Unfortunately, developing on the Mac platform has been a little more difficult because of its closed nature. We are working through the issues we have encountered. They are not simple to solve given the needs that we balance in TiVoToGo. We don't have a release date for the feature yet.

We have gotten ourselves in trouble in the past when we estimated it would be out by mid year this year, we obviously missed that date. In the interest of setting the right expectations this time we want to wait until the feature is actually ready. We are not ready to make that announcement yet. That is why our customer care representatives have been instructed to give the answer they gave you.


We can let you know when the feature is ready for launch. We are listening to you. Until it is ready, we appreciate your patience.

Jim

Jim Denney


I responded by suggesting that TiVo needs to work on communication; they need to do much better job of keeping us updated regardless of the news.

[chessplayer]

At least he replied, but how is it different than what we're used to:

TiVo: We're working hard.
Months pass...
Mac users: Any update?
TiVo: We're happy to say it will be available around...
Months and deadlines pass...
Mac users: Any update?
TiVo: It's hard work, but have no fear: we're still working hard.
Months pass...

Longwinded reassurances that they're working hard have very little credibility at this point.

By the way, does "have been for the past year" mean even TiVo admits they weren't seriously working on it in early '05?

[rworne]

By the way, does "have been for the past year" mean even TiVo admits they weren't seriously working on it in early '05?

Naw, I'm pretty sure he meant since TivoPony's announcement.

[errandwolfe]

I wouldn't be all that impressed. Two things of note in this e-mail that are a big deal...

Believe it or not, we are actively working on the project and have been for the past year in various forms. Unfortunately, developing on the Mac platform has been a little more difficult because of its closed nature.

1. "In various forms". Seems to me you are either working on it or you are not. My interpretation on it is sometimes they have 20 highly skilled programmers working on it and sometimes (most of the time) they have 1 retarded monkey with torrets syndrome locked in a basement with a copy of TTG for Mac and a Beige G3 tower doing all the work.

2. Developing on a Mac is hard because it is a closed system? Give me a freakin break, it is a MUCH more open system then Windows. Anyone ever hear of Darwin? You can get most of the non-GUI code of the OS for free, it is open source!

[davezatz]

While it's too bad Mac TTG isn't here, I do appreciate Mr. Denney's frank reply. Sling Media isn't a direct competitor, but their public beta of the Mac Slingplayer should be available in the next few days. They're late too, but they've done it quicker than TiVo including apparently building a Mac WMV decoder.

I think the lesson for both these companies is don't announce release dates for new platforms as there's bound to be issues you didn't anticipate. Also I think they've learned they need to take the Mac community a bit more seriously, it may be small but it's a vocal group with money to spend on technology.

[cwoody222]

I wrote an angry email the other night, and I actually received a response from the VP of Product Marketing for TiVo's retail products. I'm actually very surprised. I'll share what he had to say:

Dear Mr. ,

My name is Jim Denney, I am in Vice President of Product Marketing for TiVo's retail products. Tom Rogers forwarded your message to me. I wanted to thank you for your email and apologize for the delay in TiVoToGo for the Mac. I am sorry that you feel we have not paid attention to the Mac community. That is certainly not our intention. We are aware of our subscriber's desire to get TiVoToGo on the Mac. Believe it or not, we are actively working on the project and have been for the past year in various forms. Unfortunately, developing on the Mac platform has been a little more difficult because of its closed nature. We are working through the issues we have encountered. They are not simple to solve given the needs that we balance in TiVoToGo. We don't have a release date for the feature yet.

We have gotten ourselves in trouble in the past when we estimated it would be out by mid year this year, we obviously missed that date. In the interest of setting the right expectations this time we want to wait until the feature is actually ready. We are not ready to make that announcement yet. That is why our customer care representatives have been instructed to give the answer they gave you.


We can let you know when the feature is ready for launch. We are listening to you. Until it is ready, we appreciate your patience.

Jim

Jim Denney


I responded by suggesting that TiVo needs to work on communication; they need to do much better job of keeping us updated regardless of the news.

So basically nothing has changed.

In essense:

1) We're working on it - really! Believe us! We have been for awhile. We swear.

2) Building software for a Mac is hard. Wah! We didn't realize it would be this hard. :(

3) We thought it would be easier so we made a date. We missed it. By a lot. And over and over again. So now so you don't get your hopes up we're not going to give any timeframe, not even a vague one.

4) We do love the Mac community. Really! Please don't hate on us!

[Puppy76]

Hey, Mac support for Tivo 2 Go on a Series 3 and I'll still bite.

Not that I'm holding my breath for either.

[wdave]

http://www.apple.com/downloads/dashboard/movie_tv/nowplayingtivowidget.html
Anyone know if this widget works with the S3?

[cwoody222]

Nope

[wdave]

Nope you don't know, or nope it doesn't work?

[derekcbart]

No, it doesn't work. You need the Media Access Key from the TiVo and the S3 doesn't have one yet.

[murrays]

Hey, Mac support for Tivo 2 Go on a Series 3 and I'll still bite.

Not that I'm holding my breath for either.

If they have Mac Tivo 2 Go before the "free" year of subscription runs out on my S2, I'll be happy.

-murray

[Fofer]

If they have Mac Tivo 2 Go before the "free" year of subscription runs out on my S2, I'll be happy.

-murray

When does that year expire? Jus' curious. :cool:

[murrays]

When does that year expire? Jus' curious. :cool:

Well, since I haven't purchased the S3 yet, the clock hasn't started yet :o

A bit more prodding with my wife and I'll probably get the S3 next month :up:

-murray

[ZeoTiVo]

I wouldn't be all that impressed. Two things of note in this e-mail that are a big deal...



1. "In various forms". Seems to me you are either working on it or you are not. My interpretation on it is sometimes they have 20 highly skilled programmers working on it and sometimes (most of the time) they have 1 retarded monkey with torrets syndrome locked in a basement with a copy of TTG for Mac and a Beige G3 tower doing all the work. I think it means they have tried to approach the problem of providing enough copy protection on the Mac TTG side from various approaches. Basically on the Windows version you have to explicitly break the DMCA by doing something outside of the normal software. I speculate the holdup on Mac TTG is getting to the same result of making sure it is a specific DMCA violation if you get rid of TTG encryption. heck they might have had 3 lawyers trying to write a TOS that would cover it as one of the approaches.
2. Developing on a Mac is hard because it is a closed system? Give me a freakin break, it is a MUCH more open system then Windows. Anyone ever hear of Darwin? You can get most of the non-GUI code of the OS for free, it is open source! they did not mean open source or not. I think they meant how to make sure things can not happen such as simply copying the mpeg stream without touching the encryption during playback. Most likely hard to keep things like that from happening on a Mac that is not designed around such a concept.

[gonzotek]

4) We do love the Mac community. Really! Please don't hate on us!/nitpick: The Denney email didn't say anything about loving the Mac community. ;)

[cwoody222]

I was referring to:

"I am sorry that you feel we have not paid attention to the Mac community. That is certainly not our intention."

;)

[TydalForce]

A friend of mine just bought his first TiVo. He's a Mac user too.

The world of Mac users is expanding. Bigger market every day. And we do love our TiVos. Lets hope they surprise us soon

[Puppy76]

They seem like such complimentary products too. Especially ironic since 1) They support the iPod. 2) They use Apple technology for their networking stuff, and 3) They're using a Unix-like OS.

[2farrell]

Well here we are in what could be termed late 2006 and still no signs of TTG for Macs.
They blame Apple and everyone else for the hold ups but themselves.
We haven't seen any proof (pointers to filings, documentation or otherwise) so how are we to now believe TiVo is telling us the truth.
Track record shows they just dangle the Carrot, but we can no longer see the Carrot.
Until someone comes on this forum and shows any Beta pictures on a Mac or someone from TiVo comes on this Forum with a release date (and sorry, early, mid, late some year or other don't cut it anymore), I'll just believe TTG on the Mac is dead and TiVo are liers to try and convince us otherwise.

[Fofer]

Until someone comes on this forum and shows any Beta pictures on a Mac


http://community.livejournal.com/tivolovers/253645.html

http://www.megazone.org.nyud.net:8090/Photos/CES2006/TiVo/SMALL/TTG-Mac-1.JPG

[cwoody222]

How 'bout some RECENT pictures!

I've looked at those a ton of times and I just realized... isn't it weird that NONE of them show playback?

[gonzotek]

How 'bout some RECENT pictures!

I've looked at those a ton of times and I just realized... isn't it weird that NONE of them show playback?There's a window showing a "Playhouse Disney" logo in the background of some of them, also a program info "Little_Einsteins_Farmer_Annie_DISNP_..." that appears to be the active playlist item in one. They also show the files as plain mpegs, not .tivo files(ergo they had mpeg2 playback working months ago). In any event, static photographs of playing video are boring. I would have preferred seeing the program directory, config panes, and/or preference files, vs. seeing a picture of a disney show.

[davezatz]

I imagine the shipping version will playback differently than the one shown at CES. I assume they had unencrypted MPEG-2 files on the drive to be played back via the shown VLC (since QT is notoriously bad with MPEG2).

When Denney said "We are working through the issues we have encountered. They are not simple to solve given the needs that we balance in TiVoToGo." I assume the needs he is referring to are keeping the file encrypted while on the Mac (as it is on the PC) to protect the content owners (and/or to protect themselves from the content owners). They probably want to build an engine that decrypts the file on the fly (leaving the file itself locked down) during playback as they do on Windows. Then it'll be up to us to figure out how to bypass it... ;)

[tonyf3]

I imagine the shipping version will playback differently than the one shown at CES. I assume they had unencrypted MPEG-2 files on the drive to be played back via the shown VLC (since QT is notoriously bad with MPEG2).

When Denney said "We are working through the issues we have encountered. They are not simple to solve given the needs that we balance in TiVoToGo." I assume the needs he is referring to are keeping the file encrypted while on the Mac (as it is on the PC) to protect the content owners (and/or to protect themselves from the content owners). They probably want to build an engine that decrypts the file on the fly (leaving the file itself locked down) during playback as they do on Windows. Then it'll be up to us to figure out how to bypass it... ;)



There is something about using the words "Shipping Version" and "TiVo ToGo Mac" after 2 years that just feels like a bad tease.

[Quevar]

ZeoTiVo wrote: "I think they meant how to make sure things can not happen such as simply copying the mpeg stream without touching the encryption during playback. Most likely hard to keep things like that from happening on a Mac that is not designed around such a concept.
You mean like you can on a Windows machine with the Direct Show filters. There are methods posted all over the internet about how to strip the DRM off the .tivo files. The only caveat is that you have to be on a Windows machine to do it, presumably because the Tivo software actually does the decrypting and then the file is saved with no DRM left.

[Fofer]

I imagine the shipping version will playback differently than the one shown at CES. I assume they had unencrypted MPEG-2 files on the drive to be played back via the shown VLC (since QT is notoriously bad with MPEG2).

How so? The files I grab off my hacked DTiVo's play perfectly fine in Quicktime Player with the MPEG2 plugin. No glitches whatsoever.

[ZeoTiVo]

You mean like you can on a Windows machine with the Direct Show filters. There are methods posted all over the internet about how to strip the DRM off the .tivo files. The only caveat is that you have to be on a Windows machine to do it, presumably because the Tivo software actually does the decrypting and then the file is saved with no DRM left.

ah - but all of that is specifically doing something extra to bypass the encryption. The simple programs out there for .tivo files on wondows actually subclass a directshow filter class to pull the mpeg through vs the typical push the mpeg to a player the filter does normally. The other method essentially uses commercial software to do the same thing but it is a multistep process that is not the normal use.

This keeps TiVo or Microsoft off the hook and anyone who starts to do damage by sharing out too much stuff or whatever can be forced to stop under DMCA provisions so the copyright holder has a simple method for enforcement.

My understanding is that a Mac was designed to be easy to work with first, so it is possible that by doing standard things you can save the .TiVo file to an unencrypted mpeg file. TiVo has to find a way around that to feel safe from copyright holders.

[davezatz]

How so? The files I grab off my hacked DTiVo's play perfectly fine in Quicktime Player with the MPEG2 plugin. No glitches whatsoever.

Aside fromt he extra cost, it doesn't handle all MPEG-2. It's been talked about here on the forum and the web at large...

From Apple's FAQ:
http://www.apple.com/quicktime/mpeg2/faq.html

Can transport streams be played?
The MPEG-2 specification defines two forms of data streams, program streams and transport streams. Each is optimized for a different set of applications and environments. The QuickTime MPEG-2 Playback Component will play program streams, which combine audio and video streams that share a common timeline and are suited for applications with software processing. Playback of transport streams, which combine audio and video with independent time bases, is not supported.

Can the QuickTime MPEG-2 Playback Component play back AC3 audio?
No, MPEG-2 files containing AC3 audio cannot be played back with the QuickTime MPEG-2 Playback Component.

Can I use the MPEG-2 Playback Component to de-multiplex (i.e., de-mux) multiplexed streams?
While multiplexed streams can be played back with the QuickTime MPEG-2 Playback Component, de-multiplexing of these streams is not supported.

[Puppy76]

Apple needs to seriously update that. It's bad enough they charge for it. Seems like it could just use the same license as the DVD player is using (seems like it should be the same software too...)

[Dennis Wilkinson]

How so? The files I grab off my hacked DTiVo's play perfectly fine in Quicktime Player with the MPEG2 plugin. No glitches whatsoever.

It's a PITA to code for, because its different than everything else in QuickTime (when there's documentation for it at all, that is.)

Apple's own applications (the iLife suite, anyway) have very poor support for MPEG2, at least in part because of this.

[ccoulson]

Dual Tuner Mac DVR solution from Miglia:

http://www.macnn.com/articles/06/10/26/miglia.debuts.tvduo/

[gonzotek]

Dual Tuner Mac DVR solution from Miglia:

http://www.macnn.com/articles/06/10/26/miglia.debuts.tvduo/From the linked article:TVDuo is compatible with the DVT-T standard, and works in most European and Asian countries, according to Miglia.It won't work in the US.

[davezatz]

From the linked article:It won't work in the US.

details, details ;)

[2farrell]

http://community.livejournal.com/tivolovers/253645.html

http://www.megazone.org.nyud.net:8090/Photos/CES2006/TiVo/SMALL/TTG-Mac-1.JPG

That's the Pre-Alpha Version shown at CES earlier this year when we was told mid-2006 (if you read this link).
If it's in Beta now shouldn't someone from TiVo who frequent this forum (or not so frequent lately apparently) speak up and give us hope not all is lost?
It has to be at Beta 3 by now?

[cwoody222]

Who said it's in Beta now?

[Puppy76]

I think the next made up release date is entering alpha right now. The beta for the next made up release date could be in as little as 6 months!

[2farrell]

Who said it's in Beta now?
It was more of a question than an actual statement.
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
Any other company writing Software (barring Microsoft :p ) would have a pre-Alpha at least to the first Beta by now.....wouldn't they?
I would have thought TiVo could at least give us a rough road map.
At least then we would have something to go on as their silence is pretty much admitting nothing is happening.

[bitchysix]

I'm kinda floored that there is no alternatives for us Mac users. I mean, I pay the same as a PC Tivo subscriber, yet do not receive the same service. That blows.

[davezatz]

I'm kinda floored that there is no alternatives for us Mac users. I mean, I pay the same as a PC Tivo subscriber, yet do not receive the same service. That blows.

And what about TiVoToGo on my Ubuntu desktop? It's just not right! ;) Seriously, it's too bad TiVo didn't make this a priority and missed a publicly announced target. When all's said and done, I bet it will be over 2 years from the initial TTG launch (1/05) before we see Mac support.

[SullyND]

And what about TiVoToGo on my Ubuntu desktop? It's just not right! ;)

I want a DOS version for my 8086.

[cwoody222]

Slingbox now supports Mac

http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2006-10/mac-slingplayer-is-here/

http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/software/slingplayer-for-mac-os-x-officially-released-start-your-slingin-211244.php


TiVo? Still doesn't. But - they're working hard!!!

[rworne]

And what about TiVoToGo on my Ubuntu desktop? It's just not right! ;) Seriously, it's too bad TiVo didn't make this a priority and missed a publicly announced target. When all's said and done, I bet it will be over 2 years from the initial TTG launch (1/05) before we see Mac support.

No, the really sad part is that TTG came (1/2005) and went (Tivo Series 3) and Mac users never got support for it!

[schalliol]

It should come to S3, but I've still got S2 and I would be very happy to have a relase for it!

[geekmedic]

Maybe we can get the attention of the TiVo staff if everyone on here sends the CEO a letter and/or email every weekday until TiVo-to-Go for Mac is released.

I'm sure that will give them incentive to push the project ahead. I think I'm going to start writing a letter and sending it every weekday. Emails are too easy to delete.

[2farrell]

Maybe we can get the attention of the TiVo staff if everyone on here sends the CEO a letter and/or email every weekday until TiVo-to-Go for Mac is released.

I'm sure that will give them incentive to push the project ahead. I think I'm going to start writing a letter and sending it every weekday. Emails are too easy to delete.
And letters are too easy to put in the shredder.
I'd rather see some sort of petition or mass signed letter about how disgruntled TiVo owning Mac Users are with the Company.
The fact that this thread is longer (in time and length) than pretty much any other in the Forum has to mean we want this. It's time for TiVo to wake up and smell the flowers.

[cwoody222]

Nothing we do will matter. They know how disgruntled we are. They know how many of us there are.

They. Simply. Don't. Care.

[2farrell]

Nothing we do will matter. They know how disgruntled we are. They know how many of us there are.

They. Simply. Don't. Care.
Very Sad :(

[Fofer]

And letters are too easy to put in the shredder.
I'd rather see some sort of petition or mass signed letter about how disgruntled TiVo owning Mac Users are with the Company.

A "petition?" A "mass signed letter?"

Surely you jest.

[shelbel]

Individual messages actually carry more of a punch IMO than petitions, 'cause it takes more effort and motivation for each person to generate the message (paper, e-mail or otherwise). It indicates more conviction than a person seeing that someone has created a petition and saying "yeah, I could sign that."

That said, I think it's all moot. A lot of us have written/phoned TiVo to voice our frustration (some of us many, many times), and this thread has soldiered along. They know we're ticked off, and they know how many of us there are. That means that they know we're a small group, relative to the whole (sad, but true), and that most of us have kept the TiVo service despite our grumblings. Short of persuading the rest of TiVo subscriberdom to switch to Macs and then mobilizing them all to threaten to abandon TiVo unless TiVo provides a workable TTG, there's not much we can do, really.

[Quevar]

TiVo isn't going to get any more money from me until they do release TTG on the Mac. I have a lifetime. If I had a subscription, I'd drop as soon as the commitment was over. I bought mine before any of this was ever released, so it didn't affect my decision.

Now, I don't even talk to people about TiVo anymore. If people ask, I tell them it's not worth it and that they can get most of the same features from their cable companies DVR for cheaper or get a MythTV box. Or I just tell them to buy their shows from iTunes and it turns out that it's cheaper than buying cable and a TiVo (see my past post). It's going to be more of a problem when the iTV comes out. TiVo is loosing a loyal fan base and the word of mouth spreading is going to hurt them....

[2farrell]

A "petition?" A "mass signed letter?"

Surely you jest.
No, just peeved like everyone else here so never mind.
I wonder if this thread will make it to 2000 postings before TTG for Mac is released?

[geekmedic]

I wonder if this thread will make it to 2000 postings before TTG for Mac is released?

I'm sure it will.

[FreedMegabyte]

Scuttlebutt to follow-
The Mac mini was proposed to be Apple’s answer to it’s user’s interface to cable and broad cast TV. Preprograming recording, scheduling, internet access, lan and remote transfers and downloads. Everything TiVo has promised us. Has anyone else heard of this?

[donsullivan]

Scuttlebutt to follow-
The Mac mini was proposed to be Apple’s answer to it’s user’s interface to cable and broad cast TV. Preprograming recording, scheduling, internet access, lan and remote transfers and downloads. Everything TiVo has promised us. Has anyone else heard of this?

I'm not sure that Apple ever suggested that's what it was for, but many speculated it had good potential for that. I've actually got one that I'm using as a media PC myself with a couple of other software packages added to get close to TiVo and add a few other features it doesn't.

It has an Elgato EyeTV500 which gives me OTA HD content to display on the HD display it's connected to. The latest version of that software includes a Front Row style interface that allows you to schedule a recording, play it back later and watch in real-time using the Apple Remote. It doesn't have features like Season Pass and the like but it's a start.

I now use a product called Media Center from Equinux in partnership with Front Row for nearly everything else. It can do most all of what FR can do except iTunes store content plus a little more. It has an interesting option for DVD's that allows you to copy the entire content of the DVD into a folder on the HD and then nagivate to it and get full function including menus and all of the DVD. I've copied a half dozen or so up there and it's a great way to just navigate to a movie and watch the full DVD experience. It also does IP stream from sites like YouTube and GoogleMovies in addition to access Flickr photo libraries.

Now if you add FR for access to protected content I can watch all of the shows and movies I've purchased from the iTunes store as well as listen to my music and look at the photos in my library on the TV.

I can easy dump the TV content from the EyeTV out to put it on a DVD, store it on my laptop to carry it with me when I travel, or dump it to iTunes to synch with my iPod.

Bottom line, it's not a complete TiVo experience but it's actually quite good and adds many functions this Mac user couldn't get from his TiVo (don't have my Series 2 any more). Certainly not a solution for everyone since it uses 3 different tools that you have to switch around between, but it gives me nearly all I'm looking for and most of it via the Apple Remote when I'm laying in the bed.

[tonyf3]

"Short of persuading the rest of TiVo subscriberdom to switch to Macs and then mobilizing them all to threaten to abandon TiVo unless TiVo provides a workable TTG"

I like this idea!
However, it's looking more likely that Apple Software and Hardware will eventually eclipse TiVo. It may take awhile, maybe 2 years. Oh, wait..how long have we been waiting for this? January should be interesting for TiVo and Apple.
That's Early 2007! for the Mid 2006 folks at TiVo headquarters.

[Unix_Beard]

Hey, its November.

[FreedMegabyte]

I'm not sure that Apple ever suggested that's what it was for, but many speculated it had good potential for that. I've actually got one that I'm using as a media PC myself with a couple of other software packages added to get close to TiVo and add a few other features it doesn't.

Thanks donsullivan! Kewl! Price wise, it sure is in the Humax ballpark. I saw this in a pod cast last year, Jobs was pictured standing next to a Mini and the castor was proclaiming he, (Jobs), was considering this. It will be interesting to see if that Apple ripens.

[ZeoTiVo]

A lot of us have written/phoned TiVo to voice our frustration (some of us many, many times), and this thread has soldiered along. They know we're ticked off, and they know how many of us there are. That means that they know we're a small group, relative to the whole (sad, but true), and that most of us have kept the TiVo service despite our grumblings.
I think TiVo does indeed know the demand for TTG on Mac and are doing what they can to get around whatever problems they encountered. Does anyone think TiVo does NOT want to give you TTG on Mac? I doubt a petition would tell them anything new.

[ZeoTiVo]

Now, I don't even talk to people about TiVo anymore. If people ask, I tell them it's not worth it and that they can get most of the same features from their cable companies DVR for cheaper or get a MythTV box. so if they have Windows then a cable company DVR is going to let them transfer shows or play their music or photos from any PC? sounds like bad advice to me. MythTv would certainly give them lots of flexibility as long as they are comfortable dealing with supporting it, if not again they do not have the whole picture

Or I just tell them to buy their shows from iTunes and it turns out that it's cheaper than buying cable and a TiVo (see my past post). It's going to be more of a problem when the iTV comes out. TiVo is loosing a loyal fan base and the word of mouth spreading is going to hurt them....
Apple is certainly making huge forays into download content and some major TV shows are on it. also the networks are starting to get hip to offering free downloads the next day. I do not think Apple will ever be much into offering a DVR though - why should they worry about the hardware and such when they have such a huge start on video download that does not need hardware to record it?

[chessplayer]

I got an eyeTV Hybrid a few days ago but the picture quality was terrible. Possibly the unit I had was defective, but I returned it and got a Miglia TVMax (http://www.miglia.com/products/video/tvmax/index.html) instead, and I'm extremely happy with it.

I also got a 500 GB NewerTech miniStack (http://www.newertech.com/ministack), so now I have a very pleasing combination of devices to go with my Mac Mini, matching in form and making a beautiful little tower.

It's been great being able to choose shows, organized in playlists, using my bluetooth mouse. Being able to edit out commercials or just extract clips. Being able to easily convert shows into various formats, free of DRM. Being able to share shows easily, archive them, and have complete integration with my Mac. Using the mouse to control playback, such as being able to click to immediately skip to any part of a show. And no monthly fee!

On the downside, some nice TiVo features like season passes and wishlists are not there, the TVMax can't control a cable box (I have analog cable though), and no HDTV support.

I cancelled service on 2 of my 3 TiVos in protest of the TiVoToGo deceptions, and am glad to finally have a viable alternative which, though not perfect, has many advantages of its own.

[geekmedic]

http://research.tivo.com/suggestions/2web519.htm

They now have an option for TiVo-to-Go for Mac. I listed it as my #1, #2, and #3 options I want to see!

[shelbel]

They now have an option for TiVo-to-Go for Mac.

...which is so incredibly depressing. If they've just added it to the list of options we'd like to see in the future, that means that it's not anywhere near release stage.

[SullyND]

...which is so incredibly depressing. If they've just added it to the list of options we'd like to see in the future, that means that it's not anywhere near release stage.

Or they got tired of hearing it, and clicking that option automagically sends it to the bit-bucket :eek: :D

[geekmedic]

Tivo "have" an option for TiVo-to-Go for Mac? Good grief. To think I actually have a doctorate!

[ljcaswell]

Yesterday, I bought my first HDTV.

Today, I visited my local Time Warner cable store and picked up my FREE upgrade to an HD compatible cable box, with DVR service (HD DVR no less), and will pay $6.99/month for the priviledge of using it.

Tomorrow, I am cancelling my Tivo service.

Sure, I won't get all those nice Tivo services like Suggestions (it never suggested anything I was interested in), or those "awesome" home media features (used them once to see what they were all about, then never used them again), but now I can record in high def...and hey presto, I can actually watch one channel and record another!!

Not for one second was I tempted to drop $800 (wow) on a Series 3, and pay $13/month for a TV Guide...let alone their new and improved rates. (My decision was made before they announced the rate increase.)

And, the icing on the cake...I've been waiting, patiently, for the ability to move shows from my DVR to my Mac...and been stiffed for over a year. I'll work something out with an EyeTV, or iTV, or whatever else comes along in the next few years. Tivo won't see one more $$ out of me.

How can Tivo treat their customers with such disdain and expect to retain them?

Tivo...you've simply got it wrong. You remind me of the Transit system in Toronto that kept seeing ridership decrease, so they increased their fares to increase revenue, only to wonder why ridership decreased even more, so they increased their fares again...etc...etc.

Goodbye.

PS - if anyone wants a gently used Series 2...I'm listing it on E-Bay cheap.

[geekmedic]

Yesterday, I bought my first HDTV.

Today, I visited my local Time Warner cable store and picked up my FREE upgrade to an HD compatible cable box, with DVR service (HD DVR no less), and will pay $6.99/month for the priviledge of using it.

Tomorrow, I am cancelling my Tivo service.

Sure, I won't get all those nice Tivo services like Suggestions (it never suggested anything I was interested in), or those "awesome" home media features (used them once to see what they were all about, then never used them again), but now I can record in high def...and hey presto, I can actually watch one channel and record another!!

Not for one second was I tempted to drop $800 (wow) on a Series 3, and pay $13/month for a TV Guide...let alone their new and improved rates. (My decision was made before they announced the rate increase.)

And, the icing on the cake...I've been waiting, patiently, for the ability to move shows from my DVR to my Mac...and been stiffed for over a year. I'll work something out with an EyeTV, or iTV, or whatever else comes along in the next few years. Tivo won't see one more $$ out of me.

How can Tivo treat their customers with such disdain and expect to retain them?

Tivo...you've simply got it wrong. You remind me of the Transit system in Toronto that kept seeing ridership decrease, so they increased their fares to increase revenue, only to wonder why ridership decreased even more, so they increased their fares again...etc...etc.

Goodbye.

PS - if anyone wants a gently used Series 2...I'm listing it on E-Bay cheap.
You should voice your opinions to Tom Rogers, TiVo's CEO.

[cwoody222]

While not having Mac TiVo To Go is bad and their new pricing is expensive, don't for a second think that your TW DVR will be as good as a Series3. I have one with Lifetime and it's awesome. I don't know what DVR you get from your cable company but ours is the SA8300 and it's a pure POS!

[ccoulson]

...Not for one second was I tempted to drop $800 (wow) on a Series 3, and pay $13/month for a TV Guide...let alone their new and improved rates. (My decision was made before they announced the rate increase.)...

Geekmedic- You're also saving an additional $7.80 a month... Didn't you just recently say you were going to write a letter to Tivo every workday until they made some progress on TTG? :rolleyes:

[geekmedic]

Geekmedic- You're also saving an additional $7.80 a month... Didn't you just recently say you were going to write a letter to Tivo every workday until they made some progress on TTG? :rolleyes:

Yea, haven't started it yet. I work too much. :(

[macrob]

5 Days without a post...

Mac users must be jumping ship.

While not devistating to Tivo, it's still gotta sting.

[cwoody222]

They. Don't. Care.

[2farrell]

5 Days without a post...

Mac users must be jumping ship.

While not devastating to Tivo, it's still gotta sting.
What's the point? It's like talking to a brick wall now.
Nothing will ever happen.
Tivo have got better things to do, like put larger ads in our faces :eek:

[Fofer]

Tivo have got better things to do, like put larger ads in our faces :eek:

And charge $800 for a Series 3. And raise the monthly subscription fee.

[timg]

Don't forget, they are hard at work making my Series 2 even slower to respond...

[EwanG]

It's not just the Mac users. I bought a Series 2 80 hour unit (my second) this spring with a lifetime, and fully intended to buy another Tivo each year for the next several years until we had a Tivo at every TV. Then Tivo stopped offering lifetime. Then they announced the price for the Series 3. Then it turned out the Series 3 doesn't support TTG and GoBack which are the main reasons I wanted some more Tivos in the first place.

So, I will not be buying another Tivo when I get a tax return this year. At the moment I'm trying to decide between a MythTV setup, an XBOX 360 Media Center setup, or an iTV.

Of course, I'm sure I'm not the audience that Tivo wants to sell to anyway. But I have to wonder what that audience is if I look at all these policies. Seems like they only want to sell high end units with a decent markup to folks who want a premium experience and are willing to pay for it. That may be the right audience considering the competition at the middle and low ends of the market now. But I doubt that's enough volume to justify a company the size of Tivo.

Oh well, FWIW and all that...

[animalism2]

Here's a theory that cuts Tivo a little slack. The fact that this is taking so long AND there are some tantalizing statements form Tivo to hang in there makes me think that they're planning something jointly with Apple - and the timing is going to coincide with the release of Apple's iTV. Even if they're not planning anything major together, I still think the timing of TTG or mac will coincide with the iTV because of some programming/DRM related issues that Apple is lording over Tivo. That's the theory I'm sticking with for now.

[Puppy76]

I don't believe that for a second. People keep saying "they're delaying it for Apple announcement X!!!" and it's just not true. It would be cool, but it's not happening.

Tivo dosen't have it out because they don't care about their customers. They don't have tivo2go on S3 because they don't care about their customers. With these price hikes and removing of features, stand alone Tivos are dead anyway. There's no way they can compete with Microsoft OR the cable companies.

[geekmedic]

Tivo dosen't have it out because they don't care about their customers. They don't have tivo2go on S3 because they don't care about their customers. With these price hikes and removing of features, stand alone Tivos are dead anyway. There's no way they can compete with Microsoft OR the cable companies.

That's not true. I'm sure TiVo does care about us Macintosh users. In case you haven't noticed, TiVo isn't a profitable company yet. It costs a tremendous amount of money to develop software for a completely different platform. Ideally, TiVo would have Windows, OS X, and Linux versions of TiVo-to-Go. It's just not feasible when you have a limited budget and limited programming staff.

I'm sure in due time we will have a Mac version of TiVo-to-Go. Like you, I am rather impatient awaiting it. Hopefully, it will come in due time, and I truly believe it will.

[blips]

Here's a theory that cuts Tivo a little slack. The fact that this is taking so long AND there are some tantalizing statements form Tivo to hang in there makes me think that they're planning something jointly with Apple - and the timing is going to coincide with the release of Apple's iTV. Even if they're not planning anything major together, I still think the timing of TTG or mac will coincide with the iTV because of some programming/DRM related issues that Apple is lording over Tivo. That's the theory I'm sticking with for now.

I don't buy this theory. Apple has absolutely no incentive to work with Tivo. Look at the iPod. It is a closed platform that Apple will not let anyone in and they control the market. I believe they want to control the living room themselves and they don't need Tivo to do it. How many iTV's (or whatever Apple is going to call it) do you think Apple will sell the first year? Then by year two. Compare that to how many SA Tivo users there are. My theory is Apple's iTV user base will be at least the size of Tivo's SA user base in two years and continue to grow at a rate after that, that Tivo will not be able to touch. Apple has no use for Tivo, unless they want to buy them out.

[animalism2]

To clarify - I was envisioning a significant change in the DRM and Quicktime technology that Tivo must wait for. From Apple's end, those changes aren't going to be released until the iTV is released because that's the reason that Apple is making those changes. So Tivo's hands are tied until Apple allows this. Put another way, TTG for Mac and iTV would both be dependent on the same underlying programming and therefore must be released within close proximity to one another.

[Fofer]

Soooo very doubtful. Apple isn't working with TiVo on the iTV. No way, no how. They're doing their own thing, as elegantly and unencumbered by others as possible. As always.

[animalism2]

OK - I'm not making myself clear here - i apologize. I didn't say they're working together on the iTV. I'm saying that the iTV release will require some significant updates to Quicktime and DRM. Meanwhile, TTG for Mac is also dependent on that programming so they have to wait until Apple will release those quicktime updates. Don't let my "planning something jointly with Apple" line confuse you. I just meant they're planning the release of their respective products jointly because TTG is dependent on Quicktime updates.

[Fofer]

Now, now. TTG has been horrifically delayed, for almost 2 years already. Long, long before the iTV was even "teased" to the world at the last SteveNote! There's just no fathomable way the "iTV" can be used as the excuse here.

Sure, it may prompt TiVo to get off their ass and make something happen -- or it may cause them to just throw in the towel and admit their ineptitude in making something happen for Mac users -- but they are not silently strategizing with Apple for some joint iTV/TiVo project where TiVoToGo downloads suddenly start working on our desktops and our iPods.

[sobenski]

Ugh... This was exactly my worst fear when I saw today's announcement. Hellllooo??? One of the main reason people buy Macs is so they can easily edit their home movies! Duh!

I've been waiting for TTG for Mac for *years* now, and I think this has to be a sign that they Tivo is not serious about developing it. Even Microsoft's xBox 360 now has better Macintosh support! (Music photos, etc. are easier and faster to view, look better and are less buggy)

[animalism2]

aah - but the timing doesn't have to coincide with an iTV teaser, it just has to be dependent on Apple letting them in on the DRM, which keeps changing every iTunes release, of course. JHymn can't track it down anymore. So irrespective of any public announcement of iTV, Apple could still have been controlling the DRM required for a Mac/Quicktime TTG. The REASON they were controlling it so tightly earlier was an impending iTunes video store, and now it's iTV. Of course that makes it sound likely that Apple will NEVER let Tivo use Quicktime for TTG. But, the fact that Tivo says "hang in there" makes me believe it's just a matter of timing/alignment. And this theory is consistent with those observations.

We shall see in early 2007, which is my drop-dead date for "hanging in there". You have valid doubts, but I still like the theory.

[Lon]

animalism2, the trouble I have with your arguments is that there is absolutely no requirement that TiVo use Apple's DRM on Macs. Windows users can move videos to their iPods -- no Apple DRM. Saying that Apple's changing DRM is the likely culprit is a straw-man argument.

[Fofer]

Of course that makes it sound likely that Apple will NEVER let Tivo use Quicktime for TTG.

It's not about letting TiVo "use Quicktime for TTG." What I think you meant, animalism2, is that Apple won't let anyone else use their Fairplay DRM. But so what? They have to piggyback off of Apple's work? They can't use another?


In other words, what Lon said.

[animalism2]

Yes - now we're on the same page and also using the correct terms. And I do see what you guys are saying. So going with Lon's good point, given that they probably feel that they have to use some kind of DRM - possibly due to cable-labs regulations or something, what DRM might they use instead? And is it possible that despite the delays, they still feel that using Apple's DRM offers certain advantages that are important to them? Don't ask my why, but I'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt. I'm pretty patient. TTG for Mac seems like a bonus to me, not a right. I chose a Mac knowing that that meant certain software limitations but knowing that it also brought certain software advantages from Apple.

[Puppy76]

I'm sure in due time we will have a Mac version of TiVo-to-Go. Like you, I am rather impatient awaiting it. Hopefully, it will come in due time, and I truly believe it will.

In due time? It's been nearly two years!

[tonyf3]

I don't buy this theory. Apple has absolutely no incentive to work with Tivo. Look at the iPod. It is a closed platform that Apple will not let anyone in and they control the market. I believe they want to control the living room themselves and they don't need Tivo to do it. How many iTV's (or whatever Apple is going to call it) do you think Apple will sell the first year? Then by year two. Compare that to how many SA Tivo users there are. My theory is Apple's iTV user base will be at least the size of Tivo's SA user base in two years and continue to grow at a rate after that, that Tivo will not be able to touch. Apple has no use for Tivo, unless they want to buy them out.



I think you'll see an iTV demo in its final form and moniker at January's Macworld in SF.
At that time, TiVo will either have something to release for us or not. If not, I'll go with the above theory of Apple dominance in the living room within 2 years.

[pdxkevin]

FYI:

http://www.tuaw.com/2006/10/25/no-release-date-in-sight-for-tivotogo-for-mac/

[pdxkevin]

I wanted to share with you all what Dan Moren, a writer for Macworld's Gadgetbox, says about TiVo, and the company's recent press releases:

"Sometimes watching TiVo, the company, is like watching someone play pin-the-tail-on-the-donkey. They keep getting so close, and then missing completely, oftentimes colliding with a brick wall."

http://gadgets.macworld.com/video/tivo_broadband_video_deals_sti.php


My thoughts exactly, especially this past week.

[Unix_Beard]

Does anyone from Tivo come to this forum anymore? What is so wrong about at least addressing the issue? Its been so damn long many of us wouldn't be surprised if Tivo said it was dropping any further development on Mac TTG. At least we'd all know where we stand and could move on.

I never bought the claim that Tivo was stringing us along to keep our business but it seems more and more true given the silence of Tivo's PR people.

C'mon Tivo. Macs and Tivo were made for each other.

[cwoody222]

hahahahaha.

They. Don't. Care.





Supporting Mac's is beyond Tivo's abilities..

and they could care less

[pdxkevin]

The Better Business Bureau:

www.bbb.com


It's time to take some action.

[geekmedic]

The Better Business Bureau:

www.bbb.com


It's time to take some action.
You can't complain to the BBB for them not delivering software to the Mac. Many companies develop software for Windows and not the Mac.

The BBB will do nothing with your complaint, so save your time (and theirs). All you will get is a letter stating that there is nothing for them to do and suggesting that you contact TiVo directly.

[pdxkevin]

OK, Karnac.

[errandwolfe]

You can't complain to the BBB for them not delivering software to the Mac. Many companies develop software for Windows and not the Mac.
Actually I wonder if they would get involved. I say that for two reasons. 1.) When I bought my Tivo I was told TTG would work on the Macintosh and there is nothing on the box that specifically says TTG will not work on the Mac. 2.) We are paying the same price per month as Windows users, but not getting the same features. In essence Mac users pay the same per month but do not get feature parity.

[SullyND]

Actually I wonder if they would get involved. I say that for two reasons. 1.) When I bought my Tivo I was told TTG would work on the Macintosh and there is nothing on the box that specifically says TTG will not work on the Mac. 2.) We are paying the same price per month as Windows users, but not getting the same features. In essence Mac users pay the same per month but do not get feature parity.

It doesn't say on the box that it doesn't work with Linux either. Linux users are paying the same price per month as Windows users, but not getting the same features. I'm still waiting for the DOS version to run on my 8086 in the garage.

[animalism2]

I had to chuckle a little at that line about as a "Mac user" being discriminated against for not being granted all the features as "Windows users." This is all in your perspective. You have to step out of your Mac-ness for a moment. Being a Mac User isn't a state of being like being a woman or being left-handed. Everyone out there who owns Tivo has the same functionality from Tivo Corp., including built-in free Tivotogo, compatible with Windows. As a "Mac user" there's nothing stopping you from using TTG except your own refusal to meet their hardware/software requirements.

And I say this as an exclusive Mac user (except at work) since 1985.

[chessplayer]

Being a Mac User isn't a state of being like being a woman or being left-handed. It is a state of being, just as being a TiVo user is a state of being. Not innate, but a choice. That has no bearing on whether TiVo has behaved abominably and dishonestly on this issue. The issue is with stringing people along with misleading statements more than it is with the business decision of whether to support Mac users.

[Fofer]

Yeah, at this point, anyone holding out for TTG native support for Mac is deluding themselves, and setting themselves up for disappointment.

Sorry to say it, but it's past the point of being ridiculous.

[tonyf3]

It's just a matter of time before a better Mac native application presents itself. Then they can have their windows users and suffer with them. They have forgotten their core beginnings with power pc and they will pay for it.

[Turtleboy]

I'm in favor of the Mac Tivo2Go as much as anyone, but I hate the stupid arguments. The BBB? We're paying the same amount and not getting the same features?

Are you people for real?

(Posted from my G4 powerbook).

[SullyND]

They have forgotten their core beginnings with power pc and they will pay for it.

I got a chuckle out of that.

[tonyf3]

I'm in favor of the Mac Tivo2Go as much as anyone, but I hate the stupid arguments. The BBB? We're paying the same amount and not getting the same features?

Are you people for real?

(Posted from my G4 powerbook).

Yeah, We are!
It's real simple. Discount my monthly rate for what they said they would provide their paying subscribers and didn't 2 years ago, and everyone will shut up. Or release the feature and have parity. If they do, increase the rate back to what it was. Nobody likes being BS'ed for 2 years actually 3.

[Fofer]

It's just a matter of time before a better Mac native application presents itself.

I'd say that TiVoTool is already that (provided you have a hacked TiVo, that is.)

It's a shame that I had to break open my box and hack the TiVo to bits simply to be able to add functionality TiVo should have delivered on their own long, long ago.

That said, if I wasn't able to hack my TiVo I probably would have abandoned it years ago, anyway!

[geekmedic]

tonf, you're with a news station. Do a news report on it. I'm sure if Tom Rogers has a camera thrown in his face asking tons of questions about it, it might persuade him to put some pressure on developing TTG for Mac. I've heard he lives in the Fairfield area.

[animalism2]

A news story? The BBB was one thing, but this clinches how out of touch with reality you people are. I've never heard such whining from spolied techno geeks in my life. I'm moving on to another thread...

[Fofer]

Thanks, animalism2.... it's probably for the best this way. I'm sure you put a lot of thought into your 10 other posts and all, but the truth is ... we "just weren't that into you" either.



:D

[Puppy76]

Thanks, animalism2.... it's probably for the best this way. I'm sure you put a lot of thought into your 10 other posts and all, but the truth is ... we "just weren't that into you" either.



:D

LOL! Yeah, I really have to wonder about someone like that. Thank goodness you posted, as I wasn't coming up with anything witty.

[tonyf3]

[QUOTE=Fofer]I'd say that TiVoTool is already that (provided you have a hacked TiVo, that is.)

It's a shame that I had to break open my box and hack the TiVo to bits simply to be able to add functionality TiVo should have delivered on their own long, long ago.

That said, if I wasn't able to hack my TiVo I probably would have abandoned it years ago, anyway![/QUOTE


I've been a little wary of cracking open my working TiVo's and Hacking them. Some hacks require unfettered access to a windows pc to complete the task. I think I reviewed your process a while back. I've since come into possesion of a dead TiVo (Hard Drive I think) might give that a crack since I'd have nothing to lose if I screw it up.

You thoughts Hobson.

[tonyf3]

I had to chuckle a little at that line about as a "Mac user" being discriminated against for not being granted all the features as "Windows users." This is all in your perspective. You have to step out of your Mac-ness for a moment. Being a Mac User isn't a state of being like being a woman or being left-handed. Everyone out there who owns Tivo has the same functionality from Tivo Corp., including built-in free Tivotogo, compatible with Windows. As a "Mac user" there's nothing stopping you from using TTG except your own refusal to meet their hardware/software requirements.

And I say this as an exclusive Mac user (except at work) since 1985.

I want you to remember your quote:
"Everyone out there who owns Tivo has the same functionality from Tivo Corp., including built-in free Tivotogo, compatible with Windows. As a "Mac user" there's nothing stopping you from using TTG except your own refusal to meet their hardware/software requirements."

Down the road your cable company is going to say sorry your TV does not meet the requirements of HD and you need to buy this digital receiver, or you wont be able to see TV at all. Let's see what you have to say then.
It's not free, it's not built in, it's a stand alone app developed exclusively for windows.

As a Mac user since '84 let me tell you what being a Mac user is about. Since you seem to have forgotten.

It's about Principles: Great Industrial Design, Great Intergrated Software and Hardware, Ease of use and support, A device that does more than the average PC out of the box. It's about Cool tools that enhance your personal and professional life if you choose.

Most poeple don't know any better. It's big brother at work pushing the brain washed Windoze world. But thats starting to change, even at big companies.

So give us all a break with the attitude. We're not as pissed about not having the feature as TiVo the company refusing to tell us what really going on, and why.

So we rant, rave, vent, and make our voices heard. They're listening, they're just not talking back to us. That's why this sucks.

[Fofer]

I've been a little wary of cracking open my working TiVo's and Hacking them. Some hacks require unfettered access to a windows pc to complete the task. I think I reviewed your process a while back. I've since come into possesion of a dead TiVo (Hard Drive I think) might give that a crack since I'd have nothing to lose if I screw it up.

You thoughts Hobson.

Just do it. It's worth it. Life's too short to wallow in complaints. I used a cheapie PC I had laying around, it took about an hour, and my TiVo is better for it. TiVoWeb, bigger HD, TiVoTool... it's all very good.

[pdxkevin]

You can't complain to the BBB for them not delivering software to the Mac. Many companies develop software for Windows and not the Mac.

The BBB will do nothing with your complaint, so save your time (and theirs). All you will get is a letter stating that there is nothing for them to do and suggesting that you contact TiVo directly.


You are actually very incorrect. It's all about the fact that TiVo has said they are working on TTG for OSX, which has been 2-3 years now. It's in writing that TiVo was to have that functionality available during the middle of this year. In the mean time, people are still paying their subscription fees to TiVo, based on this promise that hasn't amounted to a hill of smashed TiVo boxes.

If TiVo would have said from the start that they were not going to have TTG for Mac OS X; that's a different story.

Bottom line: TiVo has not honored it's contract regarding TTG for Mac OSX.

So for all of you that got a good laugh out of some of the above posts, stick all of your belittling and self-rightous remarks in your PCs and chuckle all you want.

By the way, thank for supporting us. I'm so glad you were able to help. With all of your hot air, you could work for TiVo.

[davezatz]

TiVo has not honored it's contract regarding TTG for Mac OSX.

Where can I find that contract? ;)

[geekmedic]

You are actually very incorrect. It's all about the fact that TiVo has said they are working on TTG for OSX, which has been 2-3 years now. It's in writing that TiVo was to have that functionality available during the middle of this year. In the mean time, people are still paying their subscription fees to TiVo, based on this promise that hasn't amounted to a hill of smashed TiVo boxes.

If TiVo would have said from the start that they were not going to have TTG for Mac OS X; that's a different story.

Bottom line: TiVo has not honored it's contract regarding TTG for Mac OSX.

So for all of you that got a good laugh out of some of the above posts, stick all of your belittling and self-rightous remarks in your PCs and chuckle all you want.

By the way, thank for supporting us. I'm so glad you were able to help. With all of your hot air, you could work for TiVo.
I tell you what... you go ahead and write the BBB. Be sure to post their response (or lack thereof) when you get one.

[Fofer]

Write the Better Business Bureau?

Yeah, that'll get TiVo off their duff, and get them to release TTG for Mac!

Pffffffffffft.



:p

[TydalForce]

in all seriousness, I wonder if the BBB could actually do something....

TiVo promised TTG for Mac users when it released it for Windows. They kept saying "coming soon" over and over again, until they finally set a date of Mid-2006. Then, they missed it, and are back to "coming soon"

Charging the same price, and making a promise that they have yet to deliver.

This might not be *that* crazy of an idea -- i'd say, give it a shot and let us know how it goes.

No use fighting about it; we're all on the same side here!

[geekmedic]

TiVo promised TTG for Mac users when it released it for Windows. They kept saying "coming soon" over and over again, until they finally set a date of Mid-2006. Then, they missed it, and are back to "coming soon"

Promised is different from stating. Promise is by contract, which I've yet to see. Stating is mentioning that you are working on it.

Do you think Microsoft has been held liable for the numerous delays its had with its many operating system releases? Do you think the Better Business Bureau does anything to them for it?

TiVo has not promised TTG:mac. Mac owners still get what TiVo has promised them: DVR recording on their TV.

I want TTG:mac just as much as you guys, but I think it's foolish to write the BBB. It's a waste of your time and a waste of BBB's time. Write TiVo's CEO and threaten to cancel your subscription. If people write Tom Rogers and threaten to cancel their TiVo service, then it will get his attention.

Personally I think TiVo's attention to lack of TTG:mac has already been made. The fact that they've posted it in their TiVo suggestions feedback form means they are working on it.

[Turtleboy]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the class action law suite (sic) in a while.

:rolleyes:

[Welshdog]

The BBB is run by businesses for businesses so they are not exactly consumer friendly. The best way to get something going is to call the consumer fraud division of your state attorney general's office. Might not get you any traction, but it's worth a try. Tivo will definitely sit up and notice when they get that phone call. You would of course have to have some sort of proof of the alleged fraud. That would most likely be screen grabs of Tivo's website showing where and when they made these "promises". Seems like I have seen some posted on TCF before.

You've got to know where to put the fulcrum in order to get the most leverage.

[chessplayer]

No use fighting about it; we're all on the same side here! Except for certain zealots who want TiVo to NOT support the Mac, to spite the people here who are venting their frustration with TiVo's atrocious behavior. One might think that people who don't care about this issue would just not read the thread, but some people seem to be enjoying the fact that TiVo keeps disappointing their Mac users.

I agree that complaining to the BBB is unlikely to help. It's best to voice your feelings directly to TiVo, and to consider the alternatives such as eyeTV. Goodwill and good communication on both sides is called for here, but at this point I see neither forthcoming from TiVo.

[errandwolfe]

The best way to get something going is to call the consumer fraud division of your state attorney general's office.

Surely out of all these people there must be at least one attorney who can give his opinion. I know if someone had the resources to start a class action I would definitely opt in.

The fact is Tivo has made numerous broken promises when it comes to TTG for Mac users. I see absolutely no reason why I should pay the same price per month when I do not get the same services as a Windows user. If Tivo is going to continue not releasing a new client then TTG should be an OPTIONAL service that can be taken off and drop my monthly fee say $1 per month.

Now as for Linux users, the bottom line is when they bought their Tivo's there never were any promises made to them for TTG functionality so that whole argument of well Linux users don't have it either just doesn't fly!

[SullyND]

I see absolutely no reason why I should pay the same price per month when I do not get the same services as a Windows user.

I must have missed the gun TiVo is holding to your head. Not happy with the price? Drop your service. I'm contemplating doing just that because of the new pricing. TiVo will notice you dropping your service moreso than a BBB complaint. Either TiVo without T2go is worth it for you, or it's not. I don't buy the whole "i'm paying the same price" argument, unless you're lifetime. No one is making you continue your TiVo service.

[geekmedic]

No one is making you continue your TiVo service.

Words worth repeating, in a bigger font.

No one is making you continue your TiVo service.

[davezatz]

The fact is Tivo has made numerous broken promises when it comes to TTG for Mac users. I see absolutely no reason why I should pay the same price per month when I do not get the same services as a Windows user. If Tivo is going to continue not releasing a new client then TTG should be an OPTIONAL service that can be taken off and drop my monthly fee say $1 per month.

I used to be bitter when TiVo raised monthly rates from $10 to $13 since I was only using OTA channels at the time. Surely those with digital cable were getting much more guide data than I was and even using an IR blaster, so they should be the ones paying more! Then I remembered we're all voluntary customers here. If we're not happy, we can leave (or write Tom Rogers as some suggested). Those locked into a year commitment might have an argument to be released based on missed targets, though Mac TTG service wasn't contractually promised.

I bought iLife a couple of weeks prior to the original TTG release assuming my Mac would be supported. Yeah, I'd like that $75 back. I made an assumption and TiVo didn't deliver. Crap happens and I moved on.

In the last six weeks I've spoken with two of my TiVo contacts regarding this topic and they've convinced me that they have people working on this and that development continues (and megazone snapped pics of a alpha version last January) - so there's no doubt in my mind it's something they plan on offering. As to when, who knows... My attitude is: I'll be pleasantly surprised when it finally gets here. (Though if they dilly dally much longer I may have traded my last S2 for another S3 by the time it's available.)

[cwoody222]

In the last six weeks I've spoken with two of my TiVo contacts regarding this topic and they've convinced me that they have people working on this and that development continues (and megazone snapped pics of a alpha version last January)

No offense, Dave, but what are these - the SLOWEST developers EVER?!?!?!

Bottom line: TiVo. Doesn't. Care. About. Mac. Users.

Get used to it.

That said - a BB letter and/or class action lawsuit are stupid pursuits that have zero merit.

[davezatz]

No offense, Dave, but what are these - the SLOWEST developers EVER?!?!?!

Bottom line: TiVo. Doesn't. Care. About. Mac. Users.

Get used to it.

That said - a BB letter and/or class action lawsuit are stupid pursuits that have zero merit.

Doesn't offend me whatsoever. :) To paraphrase Bill Parcels... you are what your record says you are. (You being TiVo, not you cwoody.) TiVo hasn't communicated in the forum on this issue in some time, so I did want to share what little I know for those looking for a glimmer of hope.

[Tivortex]

As a Mac user since '84 let me tell you what being a Mac user is about. Since you seem to have forgotten.

It's about Principles: Great Industrial Design, Great Intergrated Software and Hardware, Ease of use and support, A device that does more than the average PC out of the box. It's about Cool tools that enhance your personal and professional life if you choose.



Dude! You forgot the part about drinking the Kool-Aid. :rolleyes:

I've got a Mac and TTG would be nice but I'm not losing any sleep over it.

[donsullivan]

....TiVo hasn't communicated in the forum on this issue in some time, so I did want to share what little I know for those looking for a glimmer of hope.

I pretty much concluded after this post from TiVoPony back in September:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4330573&&#post4330573

that after getting burned by the mid-2006 committment (albeit an informal one) they missed, I anticipate they will not comment again on this topic until or if they deliver. They've botched this whole thing so badly it's hard to comprehend. I would not be surprised if that post is the last we'll ever hear from them on the topic.

I gave up and cancelled the service on my S2 TiVo back in September but continue to follow this dialog as an academic exercise. The clear reality is that outside of this forum, this feature, for this portion of the TiVo customer base is clearly not important to them.

There obviously isn't that much negative impact to TiVo outside of this forum for not doing this. It's not like we see the Mac community in an uproar about this feature not being available. Apple doesn't seem to be be bothered that this service is not available on their platform. All sorts of other new features are being added and we still don't see TTG for Mac.

It's pretty obvious that it's not coming. I'm just waiting for TiVo to admit it.

[tonyf3]

Dude! You forgot the part about drinking the Kool-Aid. :rolleyes:

I've got a Mac and TTG would be nice but I'm not losing any sleep over it.


Hey, I'm not losing any sleep over it.
They just piss me off. Today I saw an AT&T commericial offering what appeared to be the same functionality as Apples' forthcoming iTV, and it's not even out yet. What does that tell you? As far as the Kool Aid, I always thought of it the other way around. Masses of people, Blindly following Windows & Bill Gates sucked in with a bunch of empty promises and slight of hand.

[opie408]

Instead of all the belly-aching, bitching and moaning, let us do something about it! Why pose the question of why does tivo come up short on their promise for a MAC version of tivo2go, and form a collective of MAC users to assist tivo in development of a tivo2go MAC edition. Stop being the victim and take a proactive approach, the victim thing is not working 58 thread pages later?

[errandwolfe]

Instead of all the belly-aching, bitching and moaning, let us do something about it! Why pose the question of why does tivo come up short on their promise for a MAC version of tivo2go, and form a collective of MAC users to assist tivo in development of a tivo2go MAC edition. Stop being the victim and take a proactive approach, the victim thing is not working 58 thread pages later?
I think that is a brilliant idea! It only has a single flaw....the simple fact that Tivo will not communicate with us and tell us WHY there is such a huge delay. The fact is it is most likely not a programming issue at all but something to deal with DRM. Tivo has been EXTREMELY tight lipped about TTG for Mac. Every 6 months or so we simply get an "It's coming soon." They won't even say if they currently have a working beta. The last VERIFIABLE statement from Tivo was when an Alpha version of TTG was seen in January....almost a full year ago now.

Trust me half the people on this forum would jump up in joy just to get there hands on even a bug ridden beta! Tivo could have all the help they wanted, the problem is they don't want it.

[cwoody222]

Because. They. Don't. Care.

[TydalForce]

TiVo has a page somewhere where you can volunteer to beta test stuff for them... basically, you fill out a "survey" saying what kind of equipment you have so they know if you'd be useful in testing something new

They surveyed me once for a new feature that was going to come out (WPA), and I took the survey, but they didn't select me for the program. Oh well

Point is, most of us Mac users have probably signed up for that Beta program, and would be more than happy to play with TTG Mac. But as far as I know, none of us have been contacted.

http://www.tivo.com/beta to anyone who wants to sign up

[nightstrm]

TiVo has a page somewhere where you can volunteer to beta test stuff for them... basically, you fill out a "survey" saying what kind of equipment you have so they know if you'd be useful in testing something new

They surveyed me once for a new feature that was going to come out (WPA), and I took the survey, but they didn't select me for the program. Oh well

Point is, most of us Mac users have probably signed up for that Beta program, and would be more than happy to play with TTG Mac. But as far as I know, none of us have been contacted.

http://www.tivo.com/beta to anyone who wants to sign up
Good idea; I just signed up in hopes of seeing some progress on this front. While I have never been able to use the TTG functionality (first TiVo was a series 1), I think it would be a useful feature in the future.

[TydalForce]

I like playing with new stuff, so TTG-Mac or not, I wanted to volunteer

I figured also, the more people who say "I have a Mac" on the beta signup screen, the better -- a "show of force" if you will, or "strength in numbers" -- whatever you want to call it, it shows there's more of us (c:

[gonzotek]

But as far as I know, none of us have been contacted.TiVos beta programs are conducted under NDAs. If you are selected to participate in one, you are supposed to keep that information to yourself, so the general forum populace here at TCF wouldn't be aware of an ongoing Mac beta test, were such a program in existence.

[TydalForce]

First rule of TiVo Beta Program

Don't Talk About TiVo Beta Program

SHH!

[gonzotek]

First rule of TiVo Beta Program

Don't Talk About TiVo Beta Program

SHH!:D

[Daisey31]

I installed Tivo Desktop on my powerbook in Oct. I just noticed a folder that is empty, but is titled TivoShows. It is in my user file. I didn't put it there...Anybody else have this happen?

[TydalForce]

TiVo Desktop has a "hidden" Feature where you can send video *from* your Mac *To* the TiVo

It has to be encoded in a very specific format, but can be done

Hold the Command key when you click on the TiVo Desktop icon in System Preferences (I think?) to enable the Video tab

There's more information floating around the forum about it, and one of our enterprising members wrote a spiffy little program to automagically convert video to TiVo friendly format:

http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/21613

[opie408]

I think now that we have the wheels started in the right direction now. Let's keep it going, sign up for the beta tests, list in your profile that you are a Mac user. The power is in numbers and not in tear drops and belly aches. Instead of saying we are being neglected, lets be able to post a statement saying we were neglected!!!! MAC USERS UNITE!

[Fofer]

"Over? Did you say 'over'? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!"

[joelhilgy]

I installed Tivo Desktop on my powerbook in Oct. I just noticed a folder that is empty, but is titled TivoShows. It is in my user file. I didn't put it there...Anybody else have this happen?

Same here :eek:, I was going to post asking the same.

Throw the switch TiVo!!!

[errandwolfe]

TiVo Desktop has a "hidden" Feature where you can send video *from* your Mac *To* the TiVo

It has to be encoded in a very specific format, but can be done

Hold the Command key when you click on the TiVo Desktop icon in System Preferences (I think?) to enable the Video tab

There's more information floating around the forum about it, and one of our enterprising members wrote a spiffy little program to automagically convert video to TiVo friendly format:

http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/21613
Why why why would Tivo hide this feature?! To me the ability to upload video to my Tivo is one of the main reasons I wanted a new version of TTG. I do a lot of video editing, and the ability to preview it on my TV without wasting a DVD to burn a work in progress to. I have been having to first copy the video to a Windows PC first.

Tydal, thank you so much for offering up this little tid bit!

[TydalForce]

I think it is hidden because
- its the first release and maybe they're not done with it yet
or
- converting to the very specific format it has to be in isn't necessarily easy, and they didn't want to confuse people who just dumped videos into that folder

I tried it, but I got tired of waiting for the 1GB file transfer over my network :b~ Those mpeg2 videos are huuuuuge

[westside_guy]

Apple's upcoming iTV is recently rumored to handle "more than just streaming media from your computer". I know, I know - rumors... but still. I'm only paying Tivo month-to-month anymore. Apple knows how to do interfaces. If the iTV does do what Tivo does (or even just most of it), I'm gone. Tivo's had time to add another "feature" - the upcoming "would you like a commercial with that delete request?". Nice to know their efforts are going toward improving my experience as a customer...

[TydalForce]

I guess that partly depends on how invasive this commercial at the end really is

I wouldn't mind a snapshot of the product, and an extra menu option "learn more about this product" as long as

- its 100% optional
- it doesn't default to "learn more"

If it can bring in more revenue for TiVo Inc without getting in our way, then I'm all for it.

[blips]

Apple's upcoming iTV is recently rumored to handle "more than just streaming media from your computer". I know, I know - rumors... but still. I'm only paying Tivo month-to-month anymore. Apple knows how to do interfaces. If the iTV does do what Tivo does (or even just most of it), I'm gone. Tivo's had time to add another "feature" - the upcoming "would you like a commercial with that delete request?". Nice to know their efforts are going toward improving my experience as a customer...

As far as I understand iTV is it will be like the iTunes and the Apple airport express. It is just an interface from your computer to a TV. So you can see on TV what is stored on your computer. I don't get the impression that it will have a TV tuner or a Hard Drive. If you want it to replace your Tivo you will have to get a TV tuner for you Apple computer and have that act as your DVR storage unit. Then you can watch it on your TV through iTV. That is what I gather it will be, I can be completely wrong. To me iTV will not replace your Tivo, yet (depending on future enhancements).

[ljcaswell]

I can't post the URL, but check out thinksecret

Apple Computer's forthcoming iTV set-top box may include features beyond streaming content and could have an impact on video similar to what the iPod has done for music, Bear Stearns analyst Andy Neff told clients in a research note Wednesday.

Neff said he recently emerged from a meeting with Apple Chief Financial Officer Peter Oppenheimer and Vice President of iPod Product Marketing Greg Joswiak feeling "optimistic about the company's "continued innovation and twin drivers," referring to the company's competitively priced Intel Macs and compelling new iPods.

"Ultimately, Apple's goal is to create a product that customers would want (as opposed to creating new technology merely for the sake of technology), while focusing on areas where it can differentiate," he wrote. "Apple noted that it has a number of products currently in development that are likely to be introduced over several years."

Although Apple would not disclose additional specifications of iTV, Neff said the company highlighted that the device fits within its vision of simplifying consumers' use of content.

"Though details remain sketchy, Apple emphasized [the] focus of iTV [is] to improve user experience by leveraging its software expertise and implied that there may be features beyond the mere streaming of video content," the analyst wrote.

Apple has already acknowledged that the device will also be capable of streaming photos, music and podcasts. But during the meeting it also hinted at additional features such as an "internal hard disk drive for storage" and "advanced user interface software."

[Fofer]

I don't get the impression that it will have a TV tuner or a Hard Drive. If you want it to replace your Tivo you will have to get a TV tuner for you Apple computer and have that act as your DVR storage unit. Then you can watch it on your TV through iTV.

And what if you could use it to directly purchase, download and/or stream shows from the iTunes Store? Even if that content is "saved" on your computer, if the UI allows for full control in front of the TV, I'd still say it's treading close to TiVo territory.

Apple's Front Row software (and iTunes software itself) streams movie trailers beautifully. The experience is much better than what the Xbox 360 offers, for example. What if they did the same for longer shows?

Let's not forget, too, that the shows downloaded have no commercials. One day, if all my favorite shows were available for download from the iTunes Store, it might even be cheaper to "subscribe" to all of them, than paying for DirecTV or Cable for a package of channels I'm not watching.

Oh and for the record, we've been told the iTV will work with Macs and PC's.

[blips]

And what if you could use it to directly purchase, download and/or stream shows from the iTunes Store? Even if that content is "saved" on your computer, if the UI allows for full control in front of the TV, I'd still say it's treading close to TiVo territory.

Let's not forget, too, that the shows downloaded have no commercials. One day, if all my favorite shows were available for download from the iTunes Store, it might even be cheaper to "subscribe" to all of them, than paying for DirecTV or Cable for a package of channels I'm not watching.

Oh and for the record, we've been told the iTV will work with Macs and PC's.

Sounds promising. :up: :up: :up:

But downloading show from iTunes is a little too pricey for my budget. Maybe as you allude to some sort of way to subscribe it would bring the price down.

I use DirecTV not only for shows but I watch a lot of sports. So I doubt that iTV would be able to replace DirecTV for me any time in the near future. So I'm paying for DirecTV anyway and record my shows on my DirecTivo. But it would be nice if they had all my sports programming. That is when I could consider cutting out DTV.

[cwoody222]

TiVo. Doesn't. Care.

[Doc.]

Tivo Obviously is stuck in the stone age and doesn't realize that Apple is the computer that is going to be in everyones homes in the near future.

I guess that seperates a progressive company like Apple and Tivo.

[errandwolfe]

I think it is hidden because
- its the first release and maybe they're not done with it yet
or
- converting to the very specific format it has to be in isn't necessarily easy, and they didn't want to confuse people who just dumped videos into that folder

I tried it, but I got tired of waiting for the 1GB file transfer over my network :b~ Those mpeg2 videos are huuuuuge
Well if the video needs to be in the same format as when you transfer from Windows to Tivo then converting it is a snap. I use VisualHub to do the conversion and it works great.

[TydalForce]

There's a couple utilities that can transcode the video -- ffmpegx comes to mind -- and those work fine, its just a matter of knowing you have to do it, and knowing *exactly* which settings to choose so the video works when it reaches the TiVo...

The TiVo Desktop preference pane doesn't say this. It just has an option to publish the videos, point it to the appropriate folder on the hard drive, and go. Many users would probably just dump some video files into that folder, turn it on, and wonder why the videos didn't work...

I suspect that's why they hid it. Put it there for us geeks to play with, and expand on its functionality for a future release

[javabird]

Thanks for posting this, but I'm having trouble getting it to work. I enabled the Video tab just fine, and my TiVoShows folder shows up on the Tivo Now pLaying list. But I put some .Tivo files in there that I had previously downloaded from Tivo to my Mac over the network, and the the files don't show up. Do the .tivo files need to be given a different file extension or converted before they will appear?


TiVo Desktop has a "hidden" Feature where you can send video *from* your Mac *To* the TiVo

It has to be encoded in a very specific format, but can be done

Hold the Command key when you click on the TiVo Desktop icon in System Preferences (I think?) to enable the Video tab

There's more information floating around the forum about it, and one of our enterprising members wrote a spiffy little program to automagically convert video to TiVo friendly format:

[TydalForce]

Is your TiVo seeing the computer but not finding the files? Or are the shows showing up in the TiVo but not transferring? Any error messages?

I do seem to recall that... if you put new files in that folder, you have to go Stop and then Start the TiVo Desktop server (through the preference pane). I believe it takes an inventory of that folder on startup, and won't recognize changes on the fly.

[Dennis Wilkinson]

I do seem to recall that... if you put new files in that folder, you have to go Stop and then Start the TiVo Desktop server (through the preference pane). I believe it takes an inventory of that folder on startup, and won't recognize changes on the fly.

It will pick up changes, but only about once every 15 minutes, looking at the logs. Starting and stopping the server when you've added something is the fastest way to get them recognized.

While it doesn't appear to be necessary with MPEGs you transcode yourself, you may need to have the correct MAK entered in the video panel for .tivo files to work.

[Welshdog]

I have noticed in the Tivo Shows folder that when I convert a file using ffmpegx or Tivoizer that files called "filename.properties" appear along with the converted file. I assume this helps your Tivo find non .tivo files?

There's a couple utilities that can transcode the video -- ffmpegx comes to mind -- and those work fine, its just a matter of knowing you have to do it, and knowing *exactly* which settings to choose so the video works when it reaches the TiVo...
I also have had some trouble converting files (bittorented avi mostly). Tivoizer works sometimes, but lately has failed a lot. I used ffmpegx the other night and it worked perfectly. This helped me get the settings right:

Tivo file transfer specs (http://customersupport.tivo.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=4012D160-79C3-4238-96C8-A27B323D1413)

[FreedMegabyte]

You are actually very incorrect. It's all about the fact that TiVo has said they are working on TTG for OSX, which has been 2-3 years now. It's in writing that TiVo was to have that functionality available during the middle of this year. In the mean time, people are still paying their subscription fees to TiVo, based on this promise that hasn't amounted to a hill of smashed TiVo boxes.

If TiVo would have said from the start that they were not going to have TTG for Mac OS X; that's a different story.

Bottom line: TiVo has not honored it's contract regarding TTG for Mac OSX.

So for all of you that got a good laugh out of some of the above posts, stick all of your belittling and self-rightous remarks in your PCs and chuckle all you want.

By the way, thank for supporting us. I'm so glad you were able to help. With all of your hot air, you could work for TiVo.

I would not have purchased TiVo if they had not of had it in writing that they were committed to supporting TTG Mac OSX. I'm still waiting, but no longer patiently.

[javabird]

Is your TiVo seeing the computer but not finding the files? Or are the shows showing up in the TiVo but not transferring? Any error messages?

I do seem to recall that... if you put new files in that folder, you have to go Stop and then Start the TiVo Desktop server (through the preference pane). I believe it takes an inventory of that folder on startup, and won't recognize changes on the fly.

Thanks! I got it working and now I'm a happy camper! It needed my MAC address before the videos would show up.

[Quevar]

I would not have purchased TiVo if they had not of had it in writing that they were committed to supporting TTG Mac OSX. I'm still waiting, but no longer patiently.
I would have still got my TiVo, but I would not have the ill will toward the company that I now have. They never made a contract, but up until the point that TTG came out, they had supported the Mac equally and made no mention of the fact that it wasn't coming out for the Mac. I got my TiVo at Christmas two years ago, just before the lack of Mac support.

Fact is - I liked my TiVo better two years ago more than I like it now and I don't think I would buy one now. They keep adding a lot of features, but I care about very few of them. Each release slows down my TiVo to the point that it now takes several seconds to draw all menus when I interact with it. I have repeatedly told them, via their online feedback, about the features that I want and they keep coming out with other features that I do not want and slowing down my TiVo. My irritation with them continues to grow with each day of silence toward their Mac users and with each new release that slows down my system. Unless this trend reverses, I don't foresee TiVo getting any money from me (I have a lifetime and won't buy a new one unless they shape up) or my friends (cause I tell them about my irritations with TiVo). As a business that continues to lose tens of millions of dollars a quarter, they may want to start thinking about the business model and try to appease people that will soon be looking toward different options.