HDMI FAILURE Poll - EVERYONE please respond

[unixadm]

Ok...

I know a lot of people have been bitten by the failed or deteriorated picture on the HDMI output.

I just got hit with it this morning (less than 2 weeks after getting it)

I am curious to see how many people had problems.

Since we probably represent a very good majority of the people who have purchased these over the past couple of months, I think the poll will be pretty accurate as far as percentage of failures (assuming that everyone answers)

Please post where yours was made and what date.

Mine:

Mexico
June 9th 2004

PLEASE DO NOT ANSWER IF YOU HAVE HAD YOUR HD TIVO FOR LESS THAN 2 WEEKS AND DON'T SEE A PROBLEM. WAIT UNTIL YOU HAVE HAD IT IN SERVICE FOR MORE THAN 2 WEEKS!

[sotapoppy]

Born 4-24-04 in USA

Bought from CC on 5/7/04.

HDMI port worked flawlessly until it died on 6/17/04.

D* is sending new unit.

FWIW my pic using the component connection is noticeably inferior to the pic using the HDMI to DVI connection on my TV.

BTW I'm the only one that has had an HDMI port failure. D* CSR told me so! :rolleyes:

[bbwebb]

BTW I'm the only one that has had an HDMI port failure. D* CSR told me so!

Funny...DTV CSR told me the exact same thing :)

[falstaffpac]

I've had mine for 2 weeks, but I'm reserving my vote for now. I've read in another thread that just before someone's HDMI went out, they temporarily saw a picture with "snow" on their television. I've seen this occurence twice now and it makes me shudder. It really makes me uncomfortable to read stories of people having no problems at all, then all of a sudden the HDMI goes out.

Does DirecTV offer any component protection plans with their monthly service? I've looked around their website, but didn't really see anything. I almost never purchase an "extended warrenty" option. But, given the reported failures and the price of this box, I think I would like one.

[tarmack]

I own two HR10-250's.....I have had a total of 4 delivered so far....2 have been returned....one due to a total hard drive failure.

Of the two now in service....1 has had a HDMI failure and is being held for replacement, voluntarily by me, until there is some sort of a physical hardware or software fix applied and known by DirecTV.

The other unit now in service is working like a champ...but that is only 1 out of 4.

All were born and bred in the USA....the only one that is working perfectly is a replacement from DirecTV and has a birth date of April 1. Go figger.

Tarmack

[Todd]

I've had mine for over 2 months now and so far it works flawlessly, aside from a few minor bugs in the software. Knocking on wood right now..... :D

[ChrisW6ATV]

Hi-

Since you want 'everyone' to respond, can you please add an item for "do not use/have not tested HDMI"? I have no compatible display, nor do I have any plans to buy one soon.

[jdpack]

Mine had a deteriorated picture on the HDMI output right out of the box. I was searching around for some HDMI compatibility setting on my TV. I have a Mitsubishi WS-65313. I was using the DVI input from a Samsung receiver up until I installed the TiVo. On one hand I am glad to hear this is a known problem, on the other hand what is it going to take to get it fixed.

[jakepratt]

This thread jinxed me. I posted that I had no trouble so far and yesterday...my HDMI connection died.

[Reaver3]

My first posting here, hope it works ok:

Had mine for 2 weeks tomorrow, works flawlessly, no problems at all. Seems very fast compared to my other SD directv/tivo units.

Doug

[NJChris]

I'd also like to know how many people that had failures were the DVI-->HDMI cable or the HDMI-->HDMI cable. I use the HDMI to HDMI cable and it's still working great.

[brahamt]

I'll try to connect it tonight and try.

[CHAS ZOSS]

Mine came yesterday, no problems with HDMI to Panny dlp.

[nuke]

Over 2 months. Works perfectly with my panasonic plasma.

[RMSko]

I got my unit about 8 days ago and it worked fine until yesterday, when all of a sudden the picture went pink. I was running HDMI to DVI and I switched to HDMI to HDMI and, although not pink, the picture was still all messed up. I then went to component, which is fine, although obviously not as good a picture as DVI.

For those of you swapping out units, are you getting new units with cables, etc., or are they sending refurbished units?

[Bill Broderick]

My first unit was made in the USA, I don't remember the date. I returned it due to a tuner problem, not HDMI. I had it for about a 1.5 months, and used the HDMI port for 2-3 weeks after getting a new TV. I had no HDMI problems.

I just received the replacement receiver, made in Mexico on May 27. So far there is not HDMI problem, but I've only been using it for 2 days so far.

[waxking]

Just hooked mine up today. I get flickering every 5 seconds on any channel through the HDMI/DVI connection. The flickering happens on over the air channels also. Component output works fine. My build was in June 2004.

[gatorbait]

June 2004 in Mexico goes down after one week and one day.

That is aggressively below average!

[ROBERTA]

HDMI FAILURE OUT OF THE BOX. NO VIDEO, BUT ALL OTHER OUTPUTS WORK. UNIT WAS ASSEMBLED IN MEXICO. I HAVE A SERVICE AGREEMENT WITH PEGASUS. I HOPE FOR A QUICK EXCHANGE.

[DonCo]

No picture at all with HDMI to HDMI connection and no picture at all with HDMI to DVI connection from the day I took it out of the box.

Made in USA April 27, 04.

Since I am using component output's which have no problem, I am holding off asking for a replacement from DirecTV (I have their service plan) until they have this fixed once and for all, as I don't want to get another defective unit as a replacement.

Still love the HD TiVo in spite of the HDMI problem though.

Don

[silversurfer]

Made in Mexico
5 June 04

Died 9 Jul 04

Replacement on its way...

[turls]

Mexico, June 9

HDMI to Sammy DLP DVI

Great picture so far, knock on wood

[gimp]

My HDMI failed today. I got one of the first ones. How long is the warranty? Do I call D* or Value Electronics? Will they send me a new one or do I need to return the existing one first? Think I will sign up for the D* equipment service plan :)

[unixadm]

If it is over 30 days old (which is sounds like it is), then most retailers will defer you over to the manufacturer to go through warranty service. Check in your manual. I believe that the warranty is 1 year. If you are going through manufacturer's warranty, you will have to send it out and they will repair it, or send you a refurbished one (or if you are lucky, a new one).

Mine died less than 30 days from getting it from Circuit City, so I just returned it and got my money back. They don't have any in stock, and don't know when they will have them.....but I've decided (mainly because of the number of failures) that I don't want a replacement until we hear definititively what the issue with the HDMI output is and that it is permanantly fixed.

Based off of this poll, there is a 27.8% failure rate not including those that have not tested their HDMI port. My guess is that about 1/4 of those are bad as well (or will go bad if put in use). This is just WAY too much.

I'll take the money and take my family to Disney World next month ;)

Guess it is standard Definition TiVo for me for a while. :(

[gimp]

Fortunately I got it from Value Electronics. Called them today and a new one is on the way. Value Electronics is G R E A T!

[Korkle]

One more to the growing number. My HDMI went "south" over the weekend. I had all the same visual experiences as everyone else. I switched over to Component. I got my unit from Value Electronics in the first wave 4/30/04). It worked fine up until the failure. I called VE and they said they would take care of it. I agree with gimp, VE has been great.

[ajlevine]

My HDMI went out at about 6 weeks. It was working perfectly, but now has a green cast to it. Component looks great.

I'm not going to get it replaced until there is a clear resolution to the problem. I don't want to go through the replacement hassle until I'm sure the problem is solved.

-Andy

[FlyingAvanti]

Got mine last night!

HDMI was "still born"!

Totally "PINK" picture.......

Component output works great.

DirecTV stated that an engineer will call me within 24 hours! My plan is to email him this thread, if he doubts my word........

[allenn]

Purchased CC 6/30
Arrived 7/2
Assembled 6/19/2004 in Mexico
Software 3.1.5-01-2-357
Dolby Digital 5.1 Day 1
Logos Day 1
Showcase Day 3
DVI Connection to Samsung 50" DLP

[Joe Jensen]

Unit installed 7/8, HDMI worked great. Used it for 4 days, worked great. Just returned from a 5 day vacation and now the HDMI has no blue, and little green. Component is great...joe

[drewcaplan]

Here are my symptoms, wonder if I have a bad HDMI port. Supposedly, according to the manual, if you plug in the HDMI cable then component is disabled. Component never disables for me. I get NO SIGNAL at all from HDMI most of the time. The exception is if I reboot, I get the "few more seconds" screens and the like, but then the picture goes away to pure blue (blank). I am using a DVDO HD scaler, connected with the DVI to HDMI cable to the Tivo. The scaler is then hooked component to my Sony XBR.

Thoughts?

[Dogen]

Originally posted by sotapoppy


BTW I'm the only one that has had an HDMI port failure. D* CSR told me so! :rolleyes:

I thought I was the only one. Why would they lie to me like that? :confused:

They also tried to tell me if the same thing happened again they wouldn't replace it and it would show that there was a problem with the tv, not the tivo. Right.

[Dan Herrmann II]

I was on the phone with D* for an hour yesterday. They told me the problem is with the way the hdmi card was not properly attached to the rest of the TiVo.

It took an hour, but they're sending me a new one.... (They were all very nice, but very busy).

They told me that this problem was affecting many, many HD TiVos.

[mfleming]

Just tried to use my new one. HDMI connection never worked at all. Component works. Made in Mexico.

[OmarG]

Still no sense of a permanent fix from D*? I've had a snowy-HDMI port (cuts out to a static/snow screen after a few minutes of DVI) since I got it and have been hoping a fix/hardware update would be announced before I give up my unit for another (potentially identical-problem-plagued) box.

I'm still waiting.

[mfleming]

Is there a way to know when this problem is fixed in new units? I'm thinking about waiting until they are all fixed first.

[pdoyle]

I received my unit 3 weeks ago from CC. HDMI has been great. Yeaterday it failed. :-(

Pat

[Korkle]

I just received my replacement box from Direct TV. One call to VE and the problem was taken care of. They (VE) contacted Direct TV and had the new one shipped out. I even got a prepaid FedEx label to ship the old one back.

[mfleming]

Who is VE?

[Moral Kiosk]

HDMI and ALL outputs failed (but I still get sound, oddly enough). Called Directv and they're shipping me a new one ASAP.

Love the box, but would prefer it didn't go bust after 3 months of use. Bizarro.

I have to give Directv some credit, they immediately offered to send out a new box. Despite this, I continue to be a happy Directv customer.

[litzdog911]

Originally posted by mfleming
Who is VE?

Value Electronics, one of the HR10-250 dealers well known here.

[snork]

I've waited my requisite 2 weeks. No problems on HDMI>HDMI to a Panasonic Plasma.

No problems, yet.

[sherlocc]

My unit was order number 111 from VE which dates me back to 4/22/2004. I have had no problems at all with the HDMI to DVI connection from the HD-210 to my Sony plasma. For those of you counting, that is more than 3 months without failure. I hope I don't have to retract this statement in the future.

[Dr_Death]

My original unit went back with a bad hard drive, replacement arrived with HDMI/DVI failing out of the box. Mfg. USA 4-30-04.

[Joe Jensen]

Hookd it back up today after a week and it is now working. I'm confused...joe

[paul01463]

I use the HR10-250 HDMI to connect directly to the HDMI input of my Panasonic plasma screen. The cable is a straight run with no HDMI-to-DVI conversions or any other modification. On start-up (from standby) the HR10-250 video has a pink hue, and the picture detail itself is very faint. Toggling the HR10-250 from 1080i to 480p and back to 1080i, either using the remote control or the HR10-250 front-panel controls, resolves the issue. The start-up sequence, plasma screen then HR10-250, HR10-250 then plasma screen, does not affect the problem. The problem does not occur when any other HDMI source is connected to the screen.

My first theory is that the problem my be related to how the HR10-250 copy protection views the HDMI. I seem to recall that HDMI forces the source and sink devices to validate copy-protection and establish a valid "session". Thus, turning the plasma screen off then on, corrupts the session, but the session is not terminated by the HR10-250 because it keeps the HDMI up while it is in standby. Toggling between 1080i and 480p forces the copy protection to renegotiate the session.

My second theory is my HR10-250 is simply buggered up.

[Toeside]

My HDMI port failed. Been in service since early May. I'm using component for now. What's the concensus; get it replaced now, or wait for a possible REAL fix?

I do want it replaced before the fall season starts. :)

Craig

[Mark Lopez]

For those who have their HDMI fail have you tried this? I ask because I thought I lost my HDMI too when I accidentally up buttoned to 480i and lost the picture (since 480i is not supported on my TV via HDMI) Subsequent up button presses no longer worked and thus the port apeared dead. After doing the following sequence all was well again. It was as if once the the TV reported that it was not a supported mode, Tivo locked it out totally. This was on HDMI to HDMI but might be worth a try.

1. Select 480i and connect to TV via s-video.
2. Connect HDMI to DVI cable to Tivo and TV
3. While still on s-video, go into menu and select 720p (or 1080i). You should loose the picture on s-video.
4 Switch TV to DVI (or HMDI) input and see if picture is back. If so, you should get prompted to press thumbs up 3 times.

[MichaelK]

Originally posted by Mark Lopez
For those who have their HDMI fail have you tried this? I ask because I thought I lost my HDMI too when I accidentally up buttoned to 480i and lost the picture (since 480i is not supported on my TV via HDMI) Subsequent up button presses no longer worked and thus the port apeared dead. After doing the following sequence all was well again. It was as if once the the TV reported that it was not a supported mode, Tivo locked it out totally. This was on HDMI to HDMI but might be worth a try.

1. Select 480i and connect to TV via s-video.
2. Connect HDMI to DVI cable to Tivo and TV
3. While still on s-video, go into menu and select 720p (or 1080i). You should loose the picture on s-video.
4 Switch TV to DVI (or HMDI) input and see if picture is back. If so, you should get prompted to press thumbs up 3 times.

interesting.

havent been around in a while (work got crazy busy...) so i just started reading here again yesterday after like a month. Saw this thread and was surprised. First explanation about bad daughter board connection made sense (I seem to recall someone very early one had an issue and opened the unit and jiggled the daughter board and fixed it?) And the snowy picture sure sounds like a poor contact. But then I say that a bunch of people have had multiple failures. Made me wonder if there isnt some interaction between particular tv's and the tivos that is causing this. Maybe there are a bunch of different issues...

MArk's post along with drewcaplan's here ->


Here are my symptoms, wonder if I have a bad HDMI port. Supposedly, according to the manual, if you plug in the HDMI cable then component is disabled. Component never disables for me. I get NO SIGNAL at all from HDMI most of the time. The exception is if I reboot, I get the "few more seconds" screens and the like, but then the picture goes away to pure blue (blank). I am using a DVDO HD scaler, connected with the DVI to HDMI cable to the Tivo. The scaler is then hooked component to my Sony XBR.

makes me wonder if some how the boxes dont get stuck on only allowing 480i or something else funny. Mark's box definately was stuck on that. I seem to recall that the first boot (few more seconds...) is 480i- so seems drewcaplan's box can do 480i but nothing else over HDMI?

and paul01463's box has an issue where he needs to toggle to 480p to force a synch. Maybe he is onto something about the copy protection? Is it possible that if the boxes dont think they have a secure connection that they revert to 480 (i or p)?

Very strange.

Luckily I have no issues so far - knock on wood. Had mine for a month or 2- fairly early from VE.

[Mark Lopez]

Originally posted by MichaelK
I seem to recall that the first boot (few more seconds...) is 480i-

I have to wonder about this. If I try to select 480i going from HDMI to HDMI on my Sammy DLP, the TV says 'unsupported mode' and I loose the picture as mentioned above. However, I do get a display the whole time I'm powering up, so I don't know whats going on. I guess I can do a reboot and (using the TV's info button) see what the Tivo is actually outputting on the HDMI during boot up. If it is 480i, then why does the TV give 'unsupported mode' if I select it later? Hmmm....

[paul01463]

I am convinced at this point that the problems seen with my installation are rooted in the copy protection issue. It would be worthwhile to find out from HNS how the unit'scopy-protection session is initiated and reset when the unit is brought out of standby. I will try to track someone down to explain this, but I suspect it's going to be a long road fraught with dead ends and frustration before I get a reasonable answer.

[mfleming]

Originally posted by Mark Lopez
I have to wonder about this. If I try to select 480i going from HDMI to HDMI on my Sammy DLP, the TV says 'unsupported mode' and I loose the picture as mentioned above. However, I do get a display the whole time I'm powering up, so I don't know whats going on. I guess I can do a reboot and (using the TV's info button) see what the Tivo is actually outputting on the HDMI during boot up. If it is 480i, then why does the TV give 'unsupported mode' if I select it later? Hmmm....

I too have a Sammy DLP (5063). My unit also did not work with the HDMI output, yet did with component video. For what it's worth I just wanted to throw out that when connected via HDMI, the HR10-250 lit up the 720p light as the connection. So it seemed like it had done some sort of handshake and understood that the TV was set to 720p (it's native resolution).

[Mark Lopez]

Originally posted by mfleming
I too have a Sammy DLP (5063). My unit also did not work with the HDMI output, yet did with component video. For what it's worth I just wanted to throw out that when connected via HDMI, the HR10-250 lit up the 720p light as the connection. So it seemed like it had done some sort of handshake and understood that the TV was set to 720p (it's native resolution).

Thats the set I have too. What I'm wondering is, if somehow the 'handshaking' gets screwed up as it did when I tried to go to 480i, does the Tivo then somehow then lock out the HDMI port totally. Do you still have the same Tivo? If so, can you try the steps I listed above?

[mfleming]

Originally posted by Mark Lopez
Thats the set I have too. What I'm wondering is, if somehow the 'handshaking' gets screwed up as it did when I tried to go to 480i, does the Tivo then somehow then lock out the HDMI port totally. Do you still have the same Tivo? If so, can you try the steps I listed above?

I sent it back. I spent three hours on it--tried all the different resolutions, hdmi-hdmi-dvi, tried to get someone at Samsun (hopeless) to help, tried both Pegasus and DTV (both pointed fingers at the other). I finally had to give up and once I read this thread I figured it was just a bad HR10 unit.

I'm really anxious to buy another, but I'm afraid to go through it all again until I know it's fixed. With the reports of how HDMI connections once worked for some, and then just went bad on their own with no changes by the user, it sounds more like faulty parts/production than some sort of configuration error.

[Mark Lopez]

Originally posted by mfleming
With the reports of how HDMI connections once worked for some, and then just went bad on their own with no changes by the user, it sounds more like faulty parts/production than some sort of configuration error.

It may very well be that there are faulty parts for some/most people. I just want people to be aware that it aparently is possible to 'kill' the port under some circumstances but yet be able to get it back.

[Mark Lopez]

Originally posted by Mark Lopez
I have to wonder about this. If I try to select 480i going from HDMI to HDMI on my Sammy DLP, the TV says 'unsupported mode' and I loose the picture as mentioned above. However, I do get a display the whole time I'm powering up, so I don't know whats going on. I guess I can do a reboot and (using the TV's info button) see what the Tivo is actually outputting on the HDMI during boot up. If it is 480i, then why does the TV give 'unsupported mode' if I select it later? Hmmm....

Well, I did a test. I rebooted and the Tivo powered up in 480p mode until it was done acquiring the sat. Then it switched to 720p that I normally have it set for.

Next I tried setting the up button to go to 480i again which is not supported on my set over HDMI. When I switched, of course I lost the picture, but this time I was able to switch back with the up button. Last time it got 'stuck' at 480i and I was not able to switch back until connecting via s-video and manually changing it in the menu.

What does this prove? Nothing. :) Well, it does prove that during the handshaking at boot up, the Tivo knows my set does not support 480i over HDMI so it goes to 480p. I am speculating that for whatever reason (glitch or bug) when I switched to 480i the other day, the Tivo decided to lock out the other modes. Perhaps it got confused because of the unsuported mode (i.e. didn't get the proper responce form the TV) and thought there was nothing connected to the HDMI port and turned it off.

Anyway, I done playing before I do break it. :)

[zamboni_dog]

Uh oh. I've had my HR10-250 just over two weeks. I appear to have a HDMI failure. I haven't read many descriptions of failures like mine though. I still get an image put it is "posterized" or "solarized" where there are only a few different colors that make up the whole image. Anyone else have this? My component video is alive and kicking though.

Rather than going through CC, I was thinking of calling D*. I want them to know the kind of failure rates here are unacceptable. (I also have audio popping that is very annoying. Anyone have that go away when they got a replacement unit?)

[grafals]

I bought a replacement cable just to check. It ain't the cable!

Mine was dead right out of the box. I guess I'm calling DirecTV!

:(

[grafals]

Originally posted by Mark Lopez
For those who have their HDMI fail have you tried this? I ask because I thought I lost my HDMI too when I accidentally up buttoned to 480i and lost the picture (since 480i is not supported on my TV via HDMI) Subsequent up button presses no longer worked and thus the port apeared dead. After doing the following sequence all was well again. It was as if once the the TV reported that it was not a supported mode, Tivo locked it out totally. This was on HDMI to HDMI but might be worth a try.

1. Select 480i and connect to TV via s-video.
2. Connect HDMI to DVI cable to Tivo and TV
3. While still on s-video, go into menu and select 720p (or 1080i). You should loose the picture on s-video.
4 Switch TV to DVI (or HMDI) input and see if picture is back. If so, you should get prompted to press thumbs up 3 times.

I tried. It didn't work.

[unixadm]

Originally posted by zamboni_dog
Uh oh. I've had my HR10-250 just over two weeks. I appear to have a HDMI failure. I haven't read many descriptions of failures like mine though. I still get an image put it is "posterized" or "solarized" where there are only a few different colors that make up the whole image. Anyone else have this? My component video is alive and kicking though.

Rather than going through CC, I was thinking of calling D*. I want them to know the kind of failure rates here are unacceptable. (I also have audio popping that is very annoying. Anyone have that go away when they got a replacement unit?)

That is the exact symptoms of mine at failure. Colors looked funny and looked almost like a negative. I went into menus and they were "solarized"....looked like when I put my digital video camera on one of the special effects modes.

I rebooted, and it never came back......NOTHING on the screen even during beginning boot stages. All other outputs worked fine, but nothing on HDMI no matter what I did.

Definitely a hardware issue, not a configuration issue, from what I saw on mine.

[buzzword]

Can I change my vote???

I originally voted no problems, and have had the machine since late April 26 (I was #207 on the VE list).

It's been working fine, until last week when my HDMI port died, just went blank.

I received a replacement machine, but the new one exhibits a different problem right out of the box. On the new one (mfg date June 26) the HDMI port outputs a picture, but displays 3 distinct bands of green tint across the screen <sigh>

It's back to the component video outputs while waitnig for another replacement.

[mfleming]

Man, this is so frustrating! Got my new Samsung DLP and cannot even watch HD TV! But, I'm still going to wait until the HR10 problem is fixed.

[cliff1371]

hdmi was DOA yesterday, what a JOKE! $1000 bucks and these clowns can't fix this problem. I am outraged!

[MrCoolDu4]

You can count me in too. HDMI worked for just over a month and now the picture is washed out pink. Being as its over a month, CC won't replace it and DTV is telling me to test it with another cable. I guess I'm supposed to buy one and if thats not it then take it back and get a refund. Although I did purchase with a AMEX card and I am wondering if they have purchase protection that I could use. Anyway, thats my story. Argh %#^@*&

[grafals]

With TIVO's stock down to about $5 per share and their new portable technology hung up in copyright protection red tape, I think this albatross is pretty important to them. This is shaping up to be really sad. They are struggling and this box sells like hotcakes for $1,000 per. Yet, there is no one else making or selling a competing unit, and the only one you can buy is inextricably intertwined with DTV and works perfectly . . . 75% of the time.

Is it any wonder TIVO's future is in doubt? :(

[cnr1089]

How do you tell where/when your tivo was made?

[t.b.]

Got mine 07/27/04 - I do not use HDMI, my PioneerE 610 only has component, but I took the box to a friend who has testing equipment and the HDMI AND Component Outputs are both sending Zero signal strength.

BTW- D* is out of replacement boxes at the moment. 7-10 days before they get their new shipment.

[davelogie]

Voted last night that I was having NO problems. Went upstairs and my wife was watching HDNet convention coverage from Mon. Suddenly I was getting flashes of black every few minutes. Seemed to go away but then I saw it once while watching another recorded show (SD). I've had the thing a few months.

Maybe I'm paranoid but is this a precursor to full failure? Never saw it before. Sat reception behavior is different.

I didn't get the DTV hardware plan but I have a one yr warranty, right? Figured I'd buy an extended warranty sometime before my yr was up. *IF* I do have a failure, do I contact DTV or CC?

Maybe this thread *is* a jinx. :)

Dave

[heathramos]

I got my hd tivo yesterday.

HDMI to DMI connection didn't work right out of the box.

D* is going to give me a replacement but they are backordered.

Will have to use component in the meantime.

[mfleming]

Has even one person here heard anything from any company that sells this disasterous unit as to what Hughes is doing about it?

[coreymcl]

Just received my HD DVR from Value Electronics today and both HD outputs are not working. Very disappointing considering I order this unit on 3/6/04.

[robnalex]

What are the common symptoms? I've had my HR10-250 for about 2.5 months, but my TV only had component in, so I couldn't test my HDMI. Today my new Panny Plasma arrived, and I get a total garbage from hell picture through HDMI- green bands, wild changing colors from hell. Sound familiar?

I have a 4-year warranty from CC, so like others, I may just wait until this issue has been corrected.

Component out PQ is stunning on the new Panny.

[wmforbm]

I just purchased the 10-250...I was using the HDMI-DVI cable...but I noticed the pic was interior...went to component and it seems ok.

[Dan Herrmann II]

My replacement from D* was also defective! Again - another friggin hour on the phone with clueless CSRs, and more anger at this product and DirecTV and TiVo. UGHHHHHHH!!!!



SHAME ON DIRECTV
SHAME ON TIVO


:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:


robandalex - Congratulations - you have yet another defective HDMI output. Time to get a new one - but wait - the "fixed" ones are crap too.

[llogan]

No problems, four different units tested and still in use.

[mfleming]

Originally posted by llogan
No problems, four different units tested and still in use.

In this environment, you can probably sell those problem-free units for $2,000! LOL!

[BarneyGoogle]

How about adding don't know where it was made?

Sent mine back before I checked -- I ONLY want to use

[cnr1089]

Ok, just got off the phone with Direct TV, they are sending me a replacement for my DVI problem. By the time I get my replacement unit, my Tivo will be about 2.5 weeks old. Would it be stupid of me to put the hard drive from my current Tivo into my replacement Tivo? Is it hard to do without making it obvious?

[Wild Wild West]

A few days ago when I turned on my TV, which uses a HDMI TO DVI cable to my TiVo, all I got was a blank screen. After some experimenting the only way I could get something on my screen was by pulling the power plug on the TiVo, waiting 30 seconds then plugging the power back in. At this time there was also no sound.

As the Tivo came up the TV screen showed the "Welcome, powering up" message for 2 to 3 minutes, again with no sound, then went blank again.

After several calls to D, all to no avail, they came up with the hard drive must have failed, you need to return it to your dealer (since it was less than 30 days in my hands).

I then tried something else. I pulled the HDMI cable and installed component cables and switched the TV to the component inputs, and guess what? It worked.

So on a hunch I went to the restart or reset screen and selected the top choice "restart the recorder". I then powered down the TV and the TiVo and changed back to the HDMI cable and selected the appropriate input on the TV and the HDMI has worked ever since.

I would be very interested in knowing if this same method helps any of you too, especially since most of you don't completely lose picture and sound, just experience a bad picture. Please respond with your results.

[cnr1089]

Oh, those with HDMI problems. Has anyone actually tried opening the box and "re-seating" the connection? According to DirectTV it is an unseated HDMI connected, is this something I can do? Or does it need more then that?

[cnr1089]

Ok, so I opened the box and "re-seated" the HDMI card, no go. I think there are faulty parts and they are trying to blame it on a moving part to blame the shipping rather then the actual box.

I guess I have to wait for my replacement:-(

[grafals]

Originally posted by Wild Wild West
I then tried something else. I pulled the HDMI cable and installed component cables and switched the TV to the component inputs, and guess what? It worked.

So on a hunch I went to the restart or reset screen and selected the top choice "restart the recorder". I then powered down the TV and the TiVo and changed back to the HDMI cable and selected the appropriate input on the TV and the HDMI has worked ever since.

I would be very interested in knowing if this same method helps any of you too, especially since most of you don't completely lose picture and sound, just experience a bad picture. Please respond with your results.

I tried that (resetting/restarting, changing cables, unplugging, etc.). None of that worked. I think I'm in agreement with those who have suggested a hardware failure or mfg. defect.

I haven't opened the case to poke at the connectors. I'd be curious to hear from anyone who has, since many keep suggesting its nothing more than a loose connection. But, I'm skeptical. Afterall, what are the chances that hundreds of boxes are put together with the same loose cable. Maybe we should be looking to see if all the defective ones were put together at 4:59pm on Friday, or immediately prior to someone's break!

My bet is it's a more severe design flaw or defect.

As for what to do, with boxes still selling on eBay for upwards of $1500, I wonder if I could sell this one for what I paid (or maybe even an extra hundred bucks or two) if I sold it as is and disclosed that the HDMI doesn't work. For those out there who don't use HDMI or DVI, it would work perfectly.

So, maybe I can make some lemonade out of this lemon? Any takers?

[grafals]

Originally posted by davelogie
Voted last night that I was having NO problems. Went upstairs and my wife was watching HDNet convention coverage from Mon. Suddenly I was getting flashes of black every few minutes.

That's not the TIVO, it's your choice of program! (JUST KIDDING!, Don't get mad!):D

[grafals]

Based on what I read here, I called DTV to tell them I had the problem and see if they'd just send me a replacement when they had one available (I'm using component vid w/no problems in the meantime).

As noted in some prior posts, I am the first person the supervisor has spoken with who has experienced the problem. I told him there are literally dozens of others reporting the problem and an actual poll shows about 20% to 25% failure rate. He dismissed it as unscientific and said that I should return it to the retailer. He was rather certain that the next unit wouldn't have the same problem.

At least I can take comfort in knowing that I'm the only one who has experienced this problem! ;)

[bandomir_m]

I'm a first time poster so please be gentle.

I also have just acquired the new HD TIVO, and am having DVI/HDMI issues. I'm experiencing the same issues as unixadm and zamboni_dog.
Have either of you resolved the problem ???

My component HD works fine, but the HDMI to DVI gives the posterized/negative looking pink image.

I'm feeding the DVI signal into a Dtronics DVI switch (which is HDCP compliant) and then to a Sceptre 30" LCD TV (also HDCP compliant).

I know that the LCD TV, and the DVI switch are HDCP compliant, and they function properly, because I'm also using a Samsung STB (SIR-T165) with the DVI output (set at 720P/1080i both resolutions work, but 720P is native).

I'd like to know the best way to resolve this as my 30 day window to return the unit to CC is going quick.


Thanks, Martin

[evdb]

After calling Tweeter to complain, they told me my HDMI to DVI problem was isolated. Hard to believe after seeing this forum.

I got my HD DriecTivo unit in June, the HDMI to DVI connection failed in early July, and I am still waiting for a replacement from Tweeter. DirecTV said I had to go through the retailer for warranty. Many posts dispute that.

BTW, I am now using the Component connection and it simply doesn't compare to DVI. I would never consider a set without DVI.

Is there a future for this box?

[unixadm]

Originally posted by bandomir_m
I'm a first time poster so please be gentle.

I also have just acquired the new HD TIVO, and am having DVI/HDMI issues. I'm experiencing the same issues as unixadm and zamboni_dog.

I'd like to know the best way to resolve this as my 30 day window to return the unit to CC is going quick.


Thanks, Martin

My resolution was to return it to CC and get a refund. I figure I will wait until I hear that there is a definite resolution to the problem before getting a replacement.

[Moral Kiosk]

Originally posted by unixadm
My resolution was to return it to CC and get a refund. I figure I will wait until I hear that there is a definite resolution to the problem before getting a replacement.

I called Directv instead of CC and they fedexed me a replacement box within two days. I figure I'll ride Directv for new boxes each time they fail, until they get it right. I don't trust Circuit City.

[Toeside]

Originally posted by grafals
I tried that (resetting/restarting, changing cables, unplugging, etc.). None of that worked. I think I'm in agreement with those who have suggested a hardware failure or mfg. defect.

I haven't opened the case to poke at the connectors. I'd be curious to hear from anyone who has, since many keep suggesting its nothing more than a loose connection. But, I'm skeptical. Afterall, what are the chances that hundreds of boxes are put together with the same loose cable. Maybe we should be looking to see if all the defective ones were put together at 4:59pm on Friday, or immediately prior to someone's break!

My bet is it's a more severe design flaw or defect.

As for what to do, with boxes still selling on eBay for upwards of $1500, I wonder if I could sell this one for what I paid (or maybe even an extra hundred bucks or two) if I sold it as is and disclosed that the HDMI doesn't work. For those out there who don't use HDMI or DVI, it would work perfectly.

So, maybe I can make some lemonade out of this lemon? Any takers?

I don't understand. You can get it replaced under warranty, so why would you want to try to sell something not 100% functional and deal with the headaches that would go along with it?

If you just want to sell it, get it replaced, then sell it.

Craig

[Watchguy]

I received mine on 8/3 Hdmi/dvi dead on installation. Blank screen on TV, Mitsubishi 65". Component output works fine. I have been using Sony Hi def receiver conecting through dvi with no problems. DTV tried to tell me that it could be a bad cable. I asked them to send a new cable along with my new tivo and they agreed. They would not admit there was any defect. When I told them that there were at least 200 failures reported the CSR said he could not comment. New one is on the way

[grafals]

Originally posted by Toeside
I don't understand. You can get it replaced under warranty, so why would you want to try to sell something not 100% functional and deal with the headaches that would go along with it?

If you just want to sell it, get it replaced, then sell it.

Craig

I was actually just kidding. But, since you ask, the concept is that if I can buy a box for $999, and yet there are people on eBay paying upwards of $1,400 for one, then I could (theoretically) offer to sell my defective box, I paid $999 for to one of those poor suckers (I mean discerning chaps), who is willing to pay a premium just to have one. My HDMI doesn't work, but if someone on eBay wanted to use component video and didn't care about HDMI, then he could buy my box for as little as $1,100 or $1,200 instead of the $1,400 or more some people are paying. Then he'd be saving himself a couple of hundred off of what some are paying, and I'd profit $100 or $200 by selling a defective box. Then I could buy a replacement later.

Get it?

(Just checked . . . I see them for $1,439 on eBay)

I wouldn't really do that, unless someone really wanted it and knew it was defective. I was really just kidding. But, I can never understand why people would pay that kind of premium rather than just wait a few months. I guess if you've got it, spend it. :confused:

[mfleming]

Man, if those poor suckers on eBay knew what they were getting for $1429!

[pbolya]

I just found this thread so let me summarize what happened to me. My HDMI was always acting up I just thought it was normal. When I woke it up most of the time it just displayed a gray screen until I changed channels or went to a menu. Lot of time just displayed snow for a couple of seconds etc. However 24 hours after I upgraded it it to 63 hours it went blank. I took it apart and finally fixed it with inserting a plastic separator between a metal pin and the HDMI card. See the full story with posted pictures here:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?postid=2113154#post2113154

[unixadm]

Great to hear pbolya....now if SOMEONE at DirecTV, Hughes or TiVo would admit that they are aware of such an issue and know that all new boxes have this resolved, then I will spend my money on buying a replacement!

[tropicaldreamer]

I have had three Mexican built unit failures out of three tries. I also returned all to CC. Waiting for a new Sammy to come out then try another unit. I do miss it already though.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by tropicaldreamer
I have had three Mexican built unit failures out of three tries. I also returned all to CC. Waiting for a new Sammy to come out then try another unit. I do miss it already though. That is exactly my problem. There is blood dripping down my unit. It is worries me that I had to do this fix and theoretically it could go blind again for no reason. I am missing the the Logos which is a really big deal in my family but I can not imagine living without this box anymore. The alternative to go back to SD is unacceptable. So I just keep my H688 in my right hand and the duck tape in my left while I keep watching HD TiVo.

Warning: This note contains violent images. Parental guidance is advised.

[wizman44]

I'm having the same problems with HDMI as everyone. It worked for 2 days and pooped out. I thought I was going nuts because no one I talked to had ever heard of it before, blah, blah, blah! I bought mine at Ultimate Electronics about 3 weeks ago. I decided to call their corporate offices to see if they had heard any news. I got the standard response of " no we don't have any reports or knowledge of a problem, but we'll keep record of your complaint." The other thing I can't figure out is, is the picture quality really better with HDMI as opposed to Component? All my electronics buddies and 1 guru say it doesn't matter. This seems illogical because then why would they put a HDMI jack on in the first place?
By the way, I bought a Mitsubishi 82" LcOS TV and am (was) using the HDMI-DVI cable to connect my awesome, huge, Mits.

[grafals]

Originally posted by wizman44
The other thing I can't figure out is, is the picture quality really better with HDMI as opposed to Component? All my electronics buddies and 1 guru say it doesn't matter. This seems illogical because then why would they put a HDMI jack on in the first place?


I'm not a guru so I will yield to anyone who contradicts me claiming to be one. But, here is my UNDERSTANDING based on what I have read. The key to quality for digital transmission is that it stay digital without any conversion as long as possible. If it is converted to analog and then re-converted to digital, there is probably data degredation. Or if it is converted to analog then transmitted by wire to a long distance away, there is probably signal degredation and noise.

The Component video out is the decoded digital signal coming from the box's digital to analog converter and going straight into the output of the TV (this is also why copy protect signals don't transmit via component or composite video). So, the transmission via the component video run opens the possibility of signal degredation and noise into the display. It is perhaps minimal, but ultimately not QUITE as good as if the conversion took place at the display source. Note also that a poor component cable can cause a poor picture, whereas even the cheapest of HDMI or DVI cable will still transmit a perfect picture, if it transmits at all. (i.e. don't buy Monstor DVI cables, they don't help).

On the other hand, the HDMI or DVI channel is a pure digital signal. It is faster in transmission, and the conversion takes place closer to the output, using the TV's digital to analog converter so interference is less of a factor.

Even so, what could potentially be a factor is if the converter in your TV is inferior to the converter in your receiver. In that case, you might actually get a better picture from the receiver.

Thus, I have expended all I know (or purport to know) on the subject. Don't take it to the bank (I'm not an electrical engineer). But, it is what I have read and been told. Anyone want to expand or contradict?

[MrCoolDu4]

I bought my first HDTivo at CC in June. HDMI out worked perfectly for 35 days and then saturated pink. CC only replaces up to 30 days so they told me to contact DirecTV. I did that and after jumping thru a few hoops, they sent me a new unit and......guess what ? No picture on the HDMI out......blank screen. I've been on the phone with them much longer than I wish to be and talked to many DirecTV employees who are semi-retarded. Lets see, one put me on hold for a second and 20 minutes later was still not back. Oh and then theres the transfer me to an extension that is busy.....I love that one. What recourse do we have ??? I didn't pay $1000 to end up with something I cannot use as I intended to because of someone elses error.

[robnalex]

Originally posted by MrCoolDu4
I bought my first HDTivo at CC in June. HDMI out worked perfectly for 35 days and then saturated pink. CC only replaces up to 30 days so they told me to contact DirecTV. I did that and after jumping thru a few hoops, they sent me a new unit and......guess what ? No picture on the HDMI out......blank screen. I've been on the phone with them much longer than I wish to be and talked to many DirecTV employees who are semi-retarded. Lets see, one put me on hold for a second and 20 minutes later was still not back. Oh and then theres the transfer me to an extension that is busy.....I love that one. What recourse do we have ??? I didn't pay $1000 to end up with something I cannot use as I intended to because of someone elses error. The next time you call DirecTV ask to be connected to the DVR Specialty Group.

[falstaffpac]

I wanted to share with you what I did to correct this problem. My results were based on pbolya's success discussed earlier in this thread. My HDMI stopped working after the addition of the TwinBreeze last week, I've since been using component. I decided to try a few things tonight. First I removed the screws anchoring the HDMI card and unseated the card from the circuit board. I then re-seated and tried applying pressure to different points on the card, none of which resulted in a picture.

I then straightened the anchoring pin and applied forward pressure on the card with a small screwdriver. When pressure was applied about 7/8 down the back of the card, the picture came on. I then took a small peice of metal and wedged it between the anchoring pin and the HDMI card. Presto, picture. My picture has been very stable since. I've unplugged the HDMI cable several times and always get a picture when I re-insert the cable.

I'm not trying to advocate that any of you do this, but for those of you who have already voided your warranty, I give you the solution which worked for me. Be very careful tinkering inside your Tivo if you have power going to it. I got a jolt when sliding the lid back on. I did take a picture so you can see what I did, but I can't get it posted. I will forward it to anyone who wants to see it.

Now, about those darn logos....

Cheers,
Falstaffpac

[grafals]

Originally posted by falstaffpac
My HDMI stopped working after the addition of the TwinBreeze last week,

Not that I'm not thrilled to hear this, but what about anyone whose HDMI died of "natural causes" and not due to an upgrade? I would like to hear from someone who fixed a failure from the factory in this manner. Is the rash of failures due to the same problem? Or is this fix only for those who accidentally jostle their board while performing an upgrade?

BTW, how long is the factory warranty anyway?

[pfdv]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by wizman44
The other thing I can't figure out is, is the picture quality really better with HDMI as opposed to Component? All my electronics buddies and 1 guru say it doesn't matter. This seems illogical because then why would they put a HDMI jack on in the first place?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Also, for digital displays like DLPs, the analog signal from the component video is converted back to digital to work the mirrors in the DLP chip. So you have an unnecessary conversion to analog and then back to digital. With DVI and a DLP TV it's digital all the way to...your eyeballs?

Francois

[falstaffpac]

Not that I'm not thrilled to hear this, but what about anyone whose HDMI died of "natural causes" and not due to an upgrade?

I feel I should clarify my statement. I do not wish to implicate the TwinBreeze as the cause of my HDMI failure, although I think it contributed to it. As you know, others have had their HDMI fail without upgrading. When placing the TwinBreeze into the Tivo, I bumped the HDMI card and I believe this is all that was necessary for it to stop working.

I'm happy with my TwinBreeze. I have used Weaknees products in the past and expect to in the future.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by falstaffpac
....
I did take a picture so you can see what I did, but I can't get it posted. I will forward it to anyone who wants to see it.

Now, about those darn logos....

Cheers,
Falstaffpac Falstaffpac,
If you PM me your picture I will post it for others to see. Also does everyone who has this issue are missing logos ? I am thinking that they where maybe playing with our TiVo's trying to fix some HDMI issue in the factory and than they reset it with clear and delete (which removes logos) before they sent it to the retailers. Now that fix is acting up. That is my conspiracy theory anyway.

Regards,
Peter

[pbolya]

Here is Falstaffpac's picture

[jeshaffer]

I have a 250 with what I believe is bad HDMI out of the box. The "support" person told me to try to find another cable and test it and call back if that does not work. Pic quality appears to be downrezzed like a high def background in 16 colors on a PC CRT. Do you believe this is indicative of a HDMI failure?

[Aiman]

jeshaffer, I have the same problem. Brand new unit just fired up last night.

The DirecTV CSR said that I had to get it replaced by the vendor, not D*. Sigh...

--Mark

[jeshaffer]

Thats interesting airman, D* csr told me to try a different HDMI cable and if that did not work they would ship me a replacement unit. I am sure I will be calling back this afternoon. I would call back again if you want a cross ship.

[jeshaffer]

Update for Aiman. I called back after the $130 cable did not work and they said I needed to exchange the HD Tivo with Circuit City. I said "This is ludicrous, I think I will just return it and then look at all of my options". Was placed on hold for a couple minutes and they said they would ship me a new unit instead.

I double checked to ensure that it was new and not a refurb. They ensured me it would be new. I will check the build date etc when I receive it. Also these are the things they offered me.

Mulitswitch
$150 credit
6 mos free HBO
3 mos free Showtime (3 more at $2 mo on a second call)
6 mos free HD package(had to mention reading about the HD activation on this one.
$5 off Total Choice plus locals for 6 months

I still have not activated this unit.

I am surprised that they did not offer anything else when I was so aggrevated about the HDMI problem. I will ask again when I call back to activate the new unit.

[robnalex]

Received my replacement from DirecTV today, built 7/6 Mexico, has logos. After going through the welcome screen the screen went black and my display indicated "no signal". My heart sank, as I was sure I'd gotten another one with bad HDMI. But I connected via component so I could see the menus, set up the up-resolution change buttons, plugged the HDMI cable back in, changed resolution from 480i where is was at startup and VIOLA! It works! The problem was that my display does not accept 480i through DVI. So when you get your replacement be sure to set up the outputs before you pronounce the HDMI out as dead. (Long thread- I'm sure this has been covered before.)

[videoholic]

Originally posted by jeshaffer
I have a 250 with what I believe is bad HDMI out of the box. The "support" person told me to try to find another cable and test it and call back if that does not work. Pic quality appears to be downrezzed like a high def background in 16 colors on a PC CRT. Do you believe this is indicative of a HDMI failure?

Same problem here as well.

Sent my info to Robert at VE and I should be getting a replacement from Direct TV. He took care of it for me.

You guys were saying you hope you get a new one and not a refurb. Wouldn't you rather have a refurb? At least it was looked at and fixed by a human.

[ericlhyman]

My unit was built on July 5. Where does it say whether it was built in US or Mexico? HDMI to DVI did not work right out of the box.

[ericlhyman]

Will signals actually be down-rezzed if the component out connection is used?

[Slardybardfast]

Just installed the HR10250 today. No picture from HDMI, nada, nothing. I do have a picture with component outputs. I have not activated service so all I am looking at is the startup screen. Manufacture date July 14 by manufacturer #400. No country of manufacture shown on the unit.

I am returning to local CC store.

Just wondering, do I need to activate the system to see something out of the hmdi output?

[Dan Herrmann II]

Well - I'm now on #3, and it too has a dead HDMI. Should I order #4 now, or wait till they figure out how to fix it (assuming it CAN be fixed).

Methinks it's time for DirecTV to recall these puppies and fix them.

You know what really stinks - when you call DirecTV they claim that you're the first AND ONLY person that has ever had the problem. After an hour on the phone, they finally 'capitulate' and send me another. (I have the D* protection plan). This has got to cost D* a lot of money to FedEx $1000 receivers across the country and back again.

Come on, DirecTV - fix the problem!!!


(By the way, HDMI, when it works, has a GREAT picture! Defintely better than composite - that's why we care so much)

[robnalex]

Originally posted by ericlhyman
My unit was built on July 5. Where does it say whether it was built in US or Mexico? On the box.

[robnalex]

Originally posted by ericlhyman
My unit was built on July 5. Where does it say whether it was built in US or Mexico? HDMI to DVI did not work right out of the box. Did you try it with different output resolutions? Mine was initially set at 480i, which my TV does not accept. At first I thought it was dead until I switched to component and changed the resolution out.

[Larry Chanin]

I've had my HD TiVo for all of 2-1/2 days, and all during that time the HDMI connection worked flawlessly.

Now, just a few hours ago the unit absolutely refuses to boot up. A number of others with both standard and HD TiVo have had this problem. Those with experience in this sort of thing speculate that we're dealing with a hard drive quality issue (as well as this HDMI quality problem).

The ironic thing about this is that throughout this hard drive failure I get a very nice video image via HDMI displaying a message saying "Almost there. A few more seconds please...", but then of course nothing happens. :(

Larry

[mjstonez]

I have had mine for 2 days. HDMI seems to work here and there but not constant....now I get a screen of snow then green, then snow....then green! Very dissapointed! I will hook up component for a few weeks and give DTV some time to maybe fix this......

[Chris Gerhard]

Have only had mine a few days but HDMI to DVI input on my XBR910 is working fine so I am going to keep it connected.

Chris

[dknightx]

I've got a slightly different problem than most:

If I take the supplied HDMI->DVI cable and use it to hook up to my JVC HX-1U projector, the Tivo will immediately reboot (as soon as the cable is plugged into my projector). It will go through the restart process and reboot as soon as it hits the "acquiring satellites" screen. This will repeat indefinitely.

If I unplug the cable from my projector, the problem goes away and bootup completes successfully (confirmed via component video cable).

By the way, my Tivo was working just fine for the past several weeks via the same cable to my projector. This is a recent problem (just last two days).

Is my HDMI output busted? Anybody else with similar issues?


-Dave

[lawnmowerdeth]

Two Questions:

1. I will be in the market for the HD TiVo next month. Is this DVI/HDCP output problem still prevalent? I bought my TV 6 months ago, along with the Samsung DVD-HD931 player with the built in 1080i upscaler, and have had no HDCP problems with it at all, so they can't blame the problem on the TV or cable.

2. My TV has only one HDCP input, does anyone have experience with the switchboxes I've seen available on the net, or any recommendations?

[vonzoog]

Got my new unit last Thursday and then this morning (Tuesday: just 5 days of use) all I had was "snow" on my HMDI connection. Still had sound. Started reading through this thread and decided to try a few things. The first thing that I tried worked. I unplugged the power to the TiVo and waited a few minute and powered (rebooted) back up. Everything is working fine again, for now.

I believe, by reading everything here, that the loose connection theory is most likely the issue. Causing total lost of DVI connection and/or loose enough that connection is lost and has to be reconnected by menu settings or rebooting the TiVo unit. Either way, this is not acceptable.

I have not voted yet since I have only had the unit for 5 days. I guess I will wait and see if the problem keeps reoccurring before I seek an exchange from D*. I don't want to open the box and take a chance of loosing my warranty.

Is it worth getting an exchange now and hoping that I get one of the "good" (3 out 4) units???

Any thoughts?

[sushifishman]

vonzoog,
Do you have a sony TV?

[lonestar2]

First HD DVR HDMI to DVI didn't work. Replaced by Directv and the connection works great except for the very bottom row on my Sammy 61" DLP not filling in. It instead has numerous rectangular boxes reflecting the picture. It's almost like a computer monitor that needs shifting down, but there is no shifting capability per Samsung rep. Any suggestions? Component fills entire screen perfectly, and even looks better than the DVI in some cases.

[vonzoog]

shshifishman,

No Sony. I have a Samsung HLN567W with the lipsync update making it a W1 model.

[Slardybardfast]

See my first post above.

I went through DirecTV troubleshooting over the phone with a second level tech. His conclusion was that the HDMI output was bad.

I returned the HR10-250 and the 5-year service policy yesterday to my local CC story. They lose ~$1200 and I lost 8 hours of my time with that crappy piece of s**t.

I hope Hughes suffers hugely from this debacle.

I asked the tech if they were offering an upgrade from the standard HD receiver to a TIVO unit (I purchased mine directly from CC). He responded that they are not offering such an upgrade at this time since Hughes is the only one making such a unit and that the unit is not reliable enough. He said that maybe around Christmas, the price will come down and the reliability would improve, then DirecTV would offer such an upgrade.

I am hoping that a standalone TIVO or SonicBlue ReplayTV with HD capability will hit the market in the next 6 months or so. In the meantime, I will be satisfied with my current ReplayTV 5000 series with an upgraded (larger) HD. Actually, when the ReplayTV is fed the component output from my current Hughes HD receiver (non-Tivo), the final product is very good: a little soft, but very good.

I will miss the capability of adding an external HD TV antenna, as the HR10-250 had 2 ASTC tuners for OTA HD reception.

[robnalex]

With respect, I really don't understand the "all or nothing" philosophy. Sure, it would be nice if so many of these units did not have the HDMI trouble, but what's the big deal? My HDMI was bad and D* exchanged it for one that works. If this one goes bad I can exchange it again or just wait, since I seem to get slightly better PQ with component anyway. Why would I want to give up the fabulous ability to record HD over a minor inconvenience?

[pbolya]

Originally posted by robnalex
With respect, I really don't understand the "all or nothing" philosophy. Sure, it would be nice if so many of these units did not have the HDMI trouble, but what's the big deal? My HDMI was bad and D* exchanged it for one that works. If this one goes bad I can exchange it again or just wait, since I seem to get slightly better PQ with component anyway. Why would I want to give up the fabulous ability to record HD over a minor inconvenience? I agree. It does not cost a thing to replace it. I know it is a lot of hassle but this thing is a beauty when it works and if you payed $1000 for this unit you must want it bad so why give up?

I could not return it because I already upgraded the unit. I waited 45 days with the upgrade to see if it has any problems and on the 46 days one day after the upgrade I had the HDMI blackout (which I fixed myself). Actually I probably could have restored to the original disc and pretend I never opened it but I had so much set up/upgrade done.

EDIT: Also if you trust the poll above only 2% has multiple boxes failed. By the way if you have a bad unit do not wait for the 2 weeks to report it in the poll. That waiting period is only to state your unit is good.

[grafals]

Originally posted by robnalex
With respect, I really don't understand the "all or nothing" philosophy. Sure, it would be nice if so many of these units did not have the HDMI trouble, but what's the big deal? My HDMI was bad and D* exchanged it for one that works. If this one goes bad I can exchange it again or just wait, since I seem to get slightly better PQ with component anyway. Why would I want to give up the fabulous ability to record HD over a minor inconvenience?

While I think like you, I do UNDERSTAND the mindset. If this were a $50 item and had some glitches in it, people could live with it. But, the fact is that if you took a poll, I bet a lot of people on this thread spent as much or more on this than they did on their HT Receiver! This is a big chunk for most people to spend on an electronic component, much less on one that works as promised about 75% of the time! Just ask our wives!

But, the flip side I ask myself is this . . . if this first iteration of the HD TIVO box had been released WITHOUT HDMI, would I have bought it? My answer was yes. But, that didn't stop me from returning the broken one for a fully functioning one.

By the way, I got the replacment yesterday, HDMI works and yes, there is an improvement in picture quality on HDMI over Component. I can only guess that those reporting equal or better video on Component have TV's which do a worse job of converting the digital signal than the integrated TIVO converter. The SONY GrandWEGA comes to LIFE with the HDMI/DVI plugged in! Man, this was what made it worth $1,000 and all the aggrevation!!! Yes Virginia, DVI IS better!

Now, excuse me while I resume my chanting . . .

"My TIVO will not break," "My TIVO will not break," "My TIVO will not break," "My TIVO . . . . . . . . . .

Oh yes, I should mention that I think I found the solution. I bought the xtended wty on the replacment. CIrcuit City charged $89 for 5 years, thus the total cost of the new now indestructible unit is $1,088. Not that bad considering that they replace in home guaranteed in 7 days and you don't return the old til the new arrives!

Now, back to my chanting . . .

[Slardybardfast]

_____________________________________________________
With respect, I really don't understand the "all or nothing" philosophy. Sure, it would be nice if so many of these units did not have the HDMI trouble, but what's the big deal? My HDMI was bad and D* exchanged it for one that works. If this one goes bad I can exchange it again or just wait, since I seem to get slightly better PQ with component anyway. Why would I want to give up the fabulous ability to record HD over a minor inconvenience?
_________________________________________________________

What can one think of a complex, multi-functional Hughes product with such a poor reliability record? I know what I am thinking. What is going to go bad next? When I had the HR10-250 for a 2-day period, not only did the HDMI not work out-of-the-box, but I had a connector failure also. When I removed one of the composite RCA cables, the entire cylindrical metal ground conductor pulled out of the chassis. I was able to push it back in place, but this is not the quality that I expect of an item costing a grand +.

If you want to pay DirecTV a monthly fee to backup the reliability, then go ahead. Every time you get a replacement for a defective unit, you lose the use for 1 to 2 weeks. You lose your Tivo saved programs, all settings, etc. If you think this is fun, then get a Hughes HR10-250 quick, so the fun can begin.

[robnalex]

Originally posted by Slardybardfast

What can one think of a complex, multi-functional Hughes product with such a poor reliability record? I know what I am thinking. What is going to go bad next? When I had the HR10-250 for a 2-day period, not only did the HDMI not work out-of-the-box, but I had a connector failure also. When I removed one of the composite RCA cables, the entire cylindrical metal ground conductor pulled out of the chassis. I was able to push it back in place, but this is not the quality that I expect of an item costing a grand +.

If you want to pay DirecTV a monthly fee to backup the reliability, then go ahead. Every time you get a replacement for a defective unit, you lose the use for 1 to 2 weeks. You lose your Tivo saved programs, all settings, etc. If you think this is fun, then get a Hughes HR10-250 quick, so the fun can begin. No question- I wish the thing were better built (I too had one of the connectors come out), but where else am I going to get a HD DirecTiVo receiver right now?

As for replacement, I have the 5-year CC plan also, and can replace it as often as necessary at no cost to me. The question is: Do I want to sit and pout about the quality of the unit and do without until something better is available? No way! With the exception of the HDMI failure (which is of little consequence, since I can use component), both units have performed to my complete satisfaction and I am delighted to have one. It is by far and away my most treasured electronic toy!

[Larry Chanin]

Originally posted by robnalex
With respect, I really don't understand the "all or nothing" philosophy. Sure, it would be nice if so many of these units did not have the HDMI trouble, but what's the big deal? My HDMI was bad and D* exchanged it for one that works. If this one goes bad I can exchange it again or just wait, since I seem to get slightly better PQ with component anyway. Why would I want to give up the fabulous ability to record HD over a minor inconvenience?

Hi Rob,

Many of us are early adopters and are used to a degree of early bugs. However, your comments seem to assume that the problems with the HD TiVo are confined strictly to the HDMI problem. From what I can tell from my own experience and from reading the experiences of the on-line TiVo community, is that the Hughes devices suffer from fundamental hardware quality issues throughout.

I had my first TiVo, an HD TiVo, for two days. I was greatly impressed with the picture quality on the HDMI/DVI connection. I was quickly becoming addicted to the "TiVo Experience", then after two days it died. No, not just the HDMI connection, everything. It won't boot up, and I'm not alone.

In stark contrast to the Hughes TiVo, as an early adopter, I purchased RCA's first HD satellite/OTA receiver. This receiver had it's expected early bugs, but they were all firmware related. In addition RCA was responsive in listening to the on-line community and not only quickly corrected the problems with automatic download updates, but incorporated some very helpful useability improvements as well.

The early consumer voting is coming in on this and other on-line forums and by all accounts Hughes doesn't seem to be coming anywhere near RCA in aggressively addressing very serious overall quality problems with their device.

Larry

[mole]

Originally posted by lonestar2
First HD DVR HDMI to DVI didn't work. Replaced by Directv and the connection works great except for the very bottom row on my Sammy 61" DLP not filling in. It instead has numerous rectangular boxes reflecting the picture. It's almost like a computer monitor that needs shifting down, but there is no shifting capability per Samsung rep. Any suggestions? Component fills entire screen perfectly, and even looks better than the DVI in some cases.

I have the Sammy 56" DLP and had the same problem at the top of the screen with one of my OTA channels. I recorded the test pattern from HDNet and sure enough, the picture wasn't centered. Local Sammy authorized repair was able to center the picture just fine and it was covered under the original warranty. I would guess the 61" should have the same capability.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by grafals
While I think like you, I do UNDERSTAND the mindset. If this were a $50 item and had some glitches in it, people could live with it. But, the fact is that if you took a poll, I bet a lot of people on this thread spent as much or more on this than they did on their HT Receiver! This is a big chunk for most people to spend on an electronic component, much less on one that works as promised about 75% of the time! Just ask our wives!

But, the flip side I ask myself is this . . . if this first iteration of the HD TIVO box had been released WITHOUT HDMI, would I have bought it? My answer was yes. But, that didn't stop me from returning the broken one for a fully functioning one.

By the way, I got the replacment yesterday, HDMI works and yes, there is an improvement in picture quality on HDMI over Component. I can only guess that those reporting equal or better video on Component have TV's which do a worse job of converting the digital signal than the integrated TIVO converter. The SONY GrandWEGA comes to LIFE with the HDMI/DVI plugged in! Man, this was what made it worth $1,000 and all the aggrevation!!! Yes Virginia, DVI IS better!

Now, excuse me while I resume my chanting . . .

"My TIVO will not break," "My TIVO will not break," "My TIVO will not break," "My TIVO . . . . . . . . . .

Oh yes, I should mention that I think I found the solution. I bought the xtended wty on the replacment. CIrcuit City charged $89 for 5 years, thus the total cost of the new now indestructible unit is $1,088. Not that bad considering that they replace in home guaranteed in 7 days and you don't return the old til the new arrives!

Now, back to my chanting . . . That's not what I ment. I agree that this is a very expensive machine and people rightfully so expect that it works all the time (let's put the early adapter argument aside). It is a tremendes hassle to set all the config up again and losing recordings are unexpectable. What I ment is that $1,000 is a lot of money for 95% of the people to buy this unit. Therefore they must want this unit really badly. In fact most of us where waiting for years for this to come out. In that respect why would you give up your dream machine (we all agree that there is nothing quite like it in todays market) just because there is a small chance that you need to repeat the CSR ordial and the re-setup (lose recordings) one (or more times). If you are afreaid that it will go wrong after the 90 days just by the warranty from D* and you are covered for life. I am pissed of at all this ordeal and I am definitely angree that I payed $1,000 for a piece of equipment that I need to patch up but I would not give it up even if I would need to return 10 units and set it up 10 times (I would start to record everything on my SD box too though). On the conrary I can't wait for the price to dropp to $600 so I can afford another 63 hours unit.

I have a Sony KE42XBR910 Plasma (I wish Sony would have made the HD TiVo as I am sure none of us would have these issues) and I like the output of the DVI much better than the Component but I do agree with your assesment and I would have bought the TiVo even if it would only have Component outs. Besides the small quality difference what really bugs me with my component output is that it is way darker than the DVI. I know I could change the settings on the TV but than all others (like SD TiVo) would be too bright.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by Larry Chanin
Hi Rob,

Many of us are early adopters and are used to a degree of early bugs. However, your comments seem to assume that the problems with the HD TiVo are confined strictly to the HDMI problem. From what I can tell from my own experience and from reading the experiences of the on-line TiVo community, is that the Hughes devices suffer from fundamental hardware quality issues throughout.

I had my first TiVo, an HD TiVo, for two days. I was greatly impressed with the picture quality on the HDMI/DVI connection. I was quickly becoming addicted to the "TiVo Experience", then after two days it died. No, not just the HDMI connection, everything. It won't boot up, and I'm not alone.

In stark contrast to the Hughes TiVo, as an early adopter, I purchased RCA's first HD satellite/OTA receiver. This receiver had it's expected early bugs, but they were all firmware related. In addition RCA was responsive in listening to the on-line community and not only quickly corrected the problems with automatic download updates, but incorporated some very helpful useability improvements as well.

The early consumer voting is coming in on this and other on-line forums and by all accounts Hughes doesn't seem to be coming anywhere near RCA in aggressively addressing very serious overall quality problems with their device.

Larry Larry,
you are right about that. There are way too many problems and D* is horrible in recognizing or even admitting them (good in replacing the units though once you pass the CSR's ). Every time another member calls in with the same problem it is always an issue they never heared about. D* customer support went downhill ever since they took over the support from TiVo years ago. Why are they so slow on putting out upgrades is beyond me. The Standalone TiVo's never go wrong because by the time you notice it a quarterly upgrade already fixed it. Why can't D* release 4.0 or at least acknowledge and communicate the root of the common problems we have?

[robnalex]

I repeat, with the exception of the hdmi failure, both units I've used performed beautifully and met all my expectations. The box does exactly and reliably what I want it to do. I'm delighted to have one. Someday, when a better unit is available I will buy one.

[Larry Chanin]

Originally posted by pbolya
Larry,
you are right about that. There are way too many problems and D* is horrible in recognizing or even admitting them (good in replacing the units though once you pass the CSR's ). Every time another member calls in with the same problem it is always an issue they never heared about. D* customer support went downhill ever since they took over the support from TiVo years ago. Why are they so slow on putting out upgrades is beyond me. The Standalone TiVo's never go wrong because by the time you notice it a quarterly upgrade already fixed it. Why can't D* release 4.0 or at least acknowledge and communicate the root of the common problems we have?

Hi pbolya,

I got a little taste of DIRECTV " technical service" and decided to try my retailer for a quick replacement. They responded quickly, said they were out but should get some this week. I can only hope.

As I was saying there's a big difference between software problems and hardware problems. So I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Hughes to fix things as quickly as RCA did.

You are absolutely right that DIRECTV should take a much more active role in communicating with their customers. It would save them money in the long run.

Larry

[grafals]

Maybe the problem is obvious. Everyone agrees that if Sony built this unit, it would be virtually problem free. Just who are these Hughes people?! What products do they make that we depend on? Satellites you say? Well, I say, so what? Look at all the Satellites that blow up on the launch pad! Satellites work in the cold, quite vacuum of space. Has a 2 year old ever tried to stuff a peanut butter sandwich in a Satellite? I think not! What business do these clowns have trying to make a serious piece of consumer electronics for use in consumer homes?! Give me a Sony, or Toshiba, or Onkyo. Are we buying a $1,000 electronic component equivalent of the Packard? Is this the greates scam in history for an electronics manufacturer? If KLH sold a set of speakers for $1,000 would you buy them? Have the people who brought us Packard Bell computers, secretly opened up shop under a new name making aerospace technology and DVR's? These are the great mysteries that haunt this this thread! :D

On the more serious side, I'm not totally convinced that it's not a software or firmware glitch. I read the threads about brackets touching. But still nobody has said that they fixed the DOA anomaly by adjusting the card have they?

Is there something that makes us believe this won't be fixed with a patch in the not so distant future?

My solution remains to buy the warranty and let Circuit City fight my battle for me. When they get burned enough on these units, THEY will take up the charge with Hughes.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by grafals
Maybe the problem is obvious. Everyone agrees that if Sony built this unit, it would be virtually problem free. Just who are these Hughes people?! What products do they make that we depend on? Satellites you say? Well, I say, so what? Look at all the Satellites that blow up on the launch pad! Satellites work in the cold, quite vacuum of space. Has a 2 year old ever tried to stuff a peanut butter sandwich in a Satellite? I think not! What business do these clowns have trying to make a serious piece of consumer electronics for use in consumer homes?! Give me a Sony, or Toshiba, or Onkyo. Are we buying a $1,000 electronic component equivalent of the Packard? Is this the greates scam in history for an electronics manufacturer? If KLH sold a set of speakers for $1,000 would you buy them? Have the people who brought us Packard Bell computers, secretly opened up shop under a new name making aerospace technology and DVR's? These are the great mysteries that haunt this this thread! :D

On the more serious side, I'm not totally convinced that it's not a software or firmware glitch. I read the threads about brackets touching. But still nobody has said that they fixed the DOA anomaly by adjusting the card have they?

Is there something that makes us believe this won't be fixed with a patch in the not so distant future?

My solution remains to buy the warranty and let Circuit City fight my battle for me. When they get burned enough on these units, THEY will take up the charge with Hughes. It is a hardware issue. I bet if you stick a plastic piece between the pin and the HDMI card most of those would be fixed. I know mine and at least 5 other people who have followed my ways and gambled with $1,000 has fixed there units. It is not clear at this point weather it is a separation of the pin and card or the actual fact that the plastic piece pushes the HDMI card ever so slightly toward the back but it definitely fixes the issue. By the way the negative kind of discoloration happens when the card is pushed downward. It is definitely a hardware issue. Maybe they didn't factor in the 10G or the presence of air (or smog in most cases). I just wish my HD TiVo would be Sony just like My DirectTiVo and my Standalone TiVo.

[vonzoog]

pbolya,

I have a Sony SAT-T60 that I did a hard drive replacement on. I got the hard drive from Weeknees. The replacement was simple to do. The SAT-T60 had a "warranty" seal on the back of the unit that voided the unit if broken. This was of no issue to me since the unit was over 3 years old at the time.

My question to you is this. I don't seem to have a "warranty" seal on the HD10-250 unit. If I open this unit is there some kind of hidden seal? In other words, can they tell that the unit has been open, thus voiding the warranty? Is this a simple repair? I saw your pictures and someone else's pictures that were put on this thread.

My "snow" picture returned again this morning and was fixed by doing a "power unplugged" reboot again. This is happening every 24 hours now. D* has been notified and I am up to level 3 tech support and waiting on a return phone call from them.

Should I get them to replace the unit and hope that the replacement unit is "ok", which I have a bad feeling will be the same way? Or should I try my own repair? Are you that convince you have totally solved the HDMI problem.

Just like to hear any honest opinion.

Thanks,

vonzoog

[mfleming]

Originally posted by vonzoog
pbolya,

I have a Sony SAT-T60 that I did a hard drive replacement on. I got the hard drive from Weeknees. The replacement was simple to do. The SAT-T60 had a "warranty" seal on the back of the unit that voided the unit if broken. This was of no issue to me since the unit was over 3 years old at the time.

My question to you is this. I don't seem to have a "warranty" seal on the HD10-250 unit. If I open this unit is there some kind of hidden seal? In other words, can they tell that the unit has been open, thus voiding the warranty? Is this a simple repair? I saw your pictures and someone else's pictures that were put on this thread.

My "snow" picture returned again this morning and was fixed by doing a "power unplugged" reboot again. This is happening every 24 hours now. D* has been notified and I am up to level 3 tech support and waiting on a return phone call from them.

Should I get them to replace the unit and hope that the replacement unit is "ok", which I have a bad feeling will be the same way? Or should I try my own repair? Are you that convince you have totally solved the HDMI problem.

Just like to hear any honest opinion.

Thanks,

vonzoog

Relatedly, do the Weaknees HR-10 products have the HDMI problem? Since they open them up to upgrade the hard drive, are they also fixing this problem as suggested in this thread (if it really works)?

[Slardybardfast]

I opened my HR 10-250 before returning it to CC. I searched for seals and could not find any. I thought it unusual that there were none.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by vonzoog
pbolya,

I have a Sony SAT-T60 that I did a hard drive replacement on. I got the hard drive from Weeknees. The replacement was simple to do. The SAT-T60 had a "warranty" seal on the back of the unit that voided the unit if broken. This was of no issue to me since the unit was over 3 years old at the time.

My question to you is this. I don't seem to have a "warranty" seal on the HD10-250 unit. If I open this unit is there some kind of hidden seal? In other words, can they tell that the unit has been open, thus voiding the warranty? Is this a simple repair? I saw your pictures and someone else's pictures that were put on this thread.

My "snow" picture returned again this morning and was fixed by doing a "power unplugged" reboot again. This is happening every 24 hours now. D* has been notified and I am up to level 3 tech support and waiting on a return phone call from them.

Should I get them to replace the unit and hope that the replacement unit is "ok", which I have a bad feeling will be the same way? Or should I try my own repair? Are you that convince you have totally solved the HDMI problem.

Just like to hear any honest opinion.

Thanks,

vonzoog Vonzoog,
honestly if you already at level 3 and you do not mind setting it up again and losing the recordings I would have them replace it. Contrary to popular belief not every one of them has this problem (yet). There is no guaranty that my "dirty" fix will work with every box and there is no way of telling if it will stop working after a while (not o mention the chance to electrocute yourself or cause more damage to your TiVo. Now that I am done with the disclaimer sort of things I have to tell you that there is no seal that will be broken if you open your TiVo and as far as I can see the only way for them to tell if you scrape the screws holding the cover of the TiVo (unless if you hit the inside repeatedly with a hammer). I used the proper tools and took the cover off 4 times already (who's counting) and I can not see a difference on the screws. On the other hand if you are the adventures type and you try to fix it (maybe still return it regardless of the outcome) we can see if this works for all TiVo's even the ones that has never been open before the problem. Right now the only people did this fix is the ones already opened the case due to an upgrade and for all we know the fix worked for us because the problem was resulting from hitting something while installing the bracket. I doubt it dough as I had signs of HDMI acting up before I did the upgrade (I thought it was normal to display gray screen when it wakes up until I change the channel or 2 seconds snow when I start to play a recordings). Even though every now and than I still get the 2 seconds snow before it starts playing a recording from the now playing list (which does not bother me much) knock on wood I had no problem with the HDMI picture ever since I installed the plastic piece.

Regards,
Peter

[pbolya]

Originally posted by mfleming
Relatedly, do the Weaknees HR-10 products have the HDMI problem? Since they open them up to upgrade the hard drive, are they also fixing this problem as suggested in this thread (if it really works)? I love to hear from Weaknees and PTV Upgrade or people using the TiVo's they upgraded if they experienced this problem but I doubt that they would ever do this sort of fix. They are more professional than that. This fix is a"poor mens" solution. They are not even upgrading a unit that has issues and doubt that they even using HDMI.

[vonzoog]

Thanks pbolya,

My wife has already told me that no matter what happens, we paid $1K for it and it better d***well work. I am going to push for the replacement. Mean while I may take a look under the hood to see if your modification works.

Thanks again for all of your information and pictures. You seem to be actually on to a real solution for a fix (the HMDI board being out of position or loose). All of the other theories may be correct, however, at this time no one can say that any of them are right.

Later,

vonzoog

[bxs122]

Originally posted by jdpack
Mine had a deteriorated picture on the HDMI output right out of the box. I was searching around for some HDMI compatibility setting on my TV. I have a Mitsubishi WS-65313. I was using the DVI input from a Samsung receiver up until I installed the TiVo. On one hand I am glad to hear this is a known problem, on the other hand what is it going to take to get it fixed.

Mine has been on for less than an hour and HDMI worked for five minutes before going out. I am very upset by this, particularly after waiting 6 weeks and spending 1000++.

[bresslerz]

I finally got my HR10-250 after 5 weeks of waiting and the HDMI output did not work out of the box.

I plugged it into to my brand new 53 inch HDTV and the screen was very dark, with some barely noticeable colors.

I switched to component and it works fine.

Would DirecTV send me a new one and then I can send this one back or do they force me to be without a receiver for a while?

[lonestar2]

They sent me a replacement very promptly and you put the old one in the shipping box. The new one worked for the HDMI to DVI connection

[robnalex]

I'm noticing faint horizontal lines and pixel "blotches" (for lack of a better term) on black backgrounds when using hdmi/dvi. When I switch to component these issues are gone.

[bxs122]

Originally posted by robnalex
I'm noticing faint horizontal lines and pixel "blotches" (for lack of a better term) on black backgrounds when using hdmi/dvi. When I switch to component these issues are gone.

Are you seeing this only on std broadcast and the tivo menus? Or are you also seeing this on HD content as well?

[robnalex]

HD content.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by bresslerz
I finally got my HR10-250 after 5 weeks of waiting and the HDMI output did not work out of the box.

I plugged it into to my brand new 53 inch HDTV and the screen was very dark, with some barely noticeable colors.

I switched to component and it works fine.

Would DirecTV send me a new one and then I can send this one back or do they force me to be without a receiver for a while? bresslerz,
D* would send a replacement first and let you return the bad one afterwords but only if it brakes after 30 days. Since yours where bad out of the box you have to return it to the retailer you are bought it from for a replacement. Wether they require you to be without the box for a while (most likely) or not is up to them. Unless of course you wait a month and tell D* that it is just broke after the 30 days.

[Chris Gerhard]

The HDMI failure rate is certainly a big problem. As of this date 2/7s of the people using HDMI are reporting a failure within a few weeks. I have no idea how many of the failures are not related to a bad TiVo but are a result of bad cables, bad DVI or HDMI input on the monitor, or incorrect test of the connection. I also can't guess how many of the 5/7s that don't have a problem will develop one soon. I am in the 5/7s without problems and there is no sign at this early stage anything is wrong with mine but with 29% reported failure rate this soon, I would not be surprised if a problem shows up in the future. I would guess the chances are if no problem is evident in a few weeks, no problem will ever occur but only time will tell.

Chris

[robnalex]

There is probably also a small percentage of users who are wrongly assuming that their unit is DOA because the unit is initially set to an output resolution such as 480i that their display will not accept. In this case, one has to switch to component (or s-video or composite), complete the setup (don't have to activate) and then test the hdmi/dvi with different resolution outputs from the HR10-250 before pronouncing the unit DOA.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by Chris Gerhard
The HDMI failure rate is certainly a big problem. As of this date 2/7s of the people using HDMI are reporting a failure within a few weeks. I have no idea how many of the failures are not related to a bad TiVo but are a result of bad cables, bad DVI or HDMI input on the monitor, or incorrect test of the connection. I also can't guess how many of the 5/7s that don't have a problem will develop one soon. I am in the 5/7s without problems and there is no sign at this early stage anything is wrong with mine but with 29% reported failure rate this soon, I would not be surprised if a problem shows up in the future. I would guess the chances are if no problem is evident in a few weeks, no problem will ever occur but only time will tell.

Chris Chris,
not quite true. Mine went dead about 45 days into it. Of course I have to mention that I did an upgrade 24h before it died so it might have been nocked out of place a little bit during the upgrade. However I was able to fix it with inserting a plastic piece between the HDMI card and a pin. I guess it pushes the card back in line. Other people reported that there's went numb after 30 days without ever opening the case. I do not want to cause a panic though. it is definately a problem but I guess we all have 90 days before the warranty runs out and if you think it is a problem you can always buy the warranty from D* for an excellent service for only a couple of bucks a month. They may not know how to build a working unit but they sure got the replacement procedure perfected.

[Chris Gerhard]

Originally posted by robnalex
There is probably also a small percentage of users who are wrongly assuming that their unit is DOA because the unit is initially set to an output resolution such as 480i that their display will not accept. In this case, one has to switch to component (or s-video or composite), complete the setup (don't have to activate) and then test the hdmi/dvi with different resolution outputs from the HR10-250 before pronouncing the unit DOA.

Yes, that is exactly what I meant by an incorrect test.

Chris

[mfleming]

I had returned mine to CC a month ago. I swore I'd wait until I know they are all fixed, but I'm getting ansy! Got my new HD TV and want to utilize it!!! So, if I were to go and purchase another one now, considering I've got a good chance I'll have to return it, where would everyone suggest I buy it? Someone who will continue to replace them without a hassle, and someone who will send me the new one before I have to send the old one back. DTV?

Thanks.

[Rcam10]

Yes, back in April I posted that by putting pressure on that card, in just the right way, I was able to keep it on. I had read where a few people claim putting hard pressure on top of the unit brought it back on for a second or two, so that certainly sounded like a connection problem.

So, as someone that works on electronics, of course I had no problem going into the unit, and found out in mine the HDMI board was extremely sensitive to any motion. I even removed the main board that it plugs into, and soldered a few points just for the heck of it.

I also twisted the HDMI board in all kinds of ways, driving my PJ crazy because the signal went from off, on, green, negative, snow ect. constantly, as I moved it around.

Yeah, found a perfect spot after awhile, and was able to use it until I got CC got more in stock. But its my opinion that you will be lucky if it doesn't return. I played with that area over about a week, and thats a really sensitive connection problem.

Also, thats the type of thing that rarely stays fixed, by doing such stuff. Another thing is that most likely if it gets jarred much at all, it will probably start back up, and the next time pressure in the same spot won't keep it on. Well, thats what I've found to be true anyway. Its going to vary from unit to unit also of course.

It seems to me, having that type of plug in socket is just asking for trouble.

[ChromeAce]

I just voted in the poll this morning that I have had NO PROBLEMS with my unit, which was bought on Ebay for $1200 and upgraded with a PTV kit with a 2nd hard drive (250GB) giving me about 70 total hours of HD recording capacity. I enjoyed TWO MONTHS of defect-free HD TiVO use on this unit. I view HDMI out on my Sony VPL-HS20 which has HDMI in. However I had NOT REBOOTED IT this entire time and NOT MOVED IT. I think this is a key clue to what is going wrong.

After I voted in the poll this morning, I decided to re-arrange my system a little and while keeping the HR10-250 on, moved it carefully off the stack, added a DVD player to the stack, and moved the HR10-250 back on top of the stack.

The **** hit the fan.

First, I had no audio coming out of the digital audio port. I could get my usual picture on HDMI. To fix the audio, I decided to reboot.

When I rebooted, I got the startup screen "almost there" over HDMI. Then I got the skittles balls, but there was a slight green tint to the text, as if the skittles had been sitting on the shelf awhile...

Then all of a sudden I get a frame full of static, then black, then static... repeating forever.

I unplug and reboot again, and this time no HDMI at all. I go into the menus using the s-video output and try turning on HDMI but get nothing. I reconnect the HDMI cable and nothing.

Simply by MOVING IT or REBOOTING IT or BOTH... I have screwed up my HDMI.

Apparently, it is a very sensitive little card. Motion can mess it up. Heat probably messes it up, which would explain why it goes bad for some people over time.

My PTV upgrade kit did not come with a fan, but it was running fine with 2 hard drives for 2 months. Didn't seem hot really.

So now I guess I will open it up and wedge some metal against the card to see if I can stabilize its connection to the motherboard.

If I can't, I'll try to get DTV to replace my unit. I hope the fact that I bought it on Ebay has no bearing. And I assume I can't transplant my modded drives into a replacement unit as the content is tied to the motherboard isn't it? How do I transplant the upgrade?

What a nightmare...

[Todd76]

Originally posted by robnalex
There is probably also a small percentage of users who are wrongly assuming that their unit is DOA because the unit is initially set to an output resolution such as 480i that their display will not accept.

I would think that any TV with a DVI or HDMI input would accept all four resolutions.

[paul01463]

Originally posted by Todd76
I would think that any TV with a DVI or HDMI input would accept all four resolutions.

My Panasonic plasma only accepts 480i and 1080i on its HDMI interface

[pbolya]

Originally posted by paul01463
My Panasonic plasma only accepts 480i and 1080i on its HDMI interface Lots of HD TV displays do not accept 480i over HDMI and some TV's oly accept 720p or 1080i but not both. My Sony plasma accepts all 4 resulutions.

[jlas75]

HDMI video is NOT working on my DirecTV HR10-250 DirecTV with TiVo...Sysytem information says it's "not connected"...

Component video works. Any suggestions on how to fix this? Or, do I have to return it for a new one? Please advise....

[erehm]

I received an HD Tivo from Circuit City (CC) a couple of months ago. It's connected as follows:

CONFIGURATION...

[HD Tivo HDMI Output]-->[Scaler DVI-HDCP I/O]-->[PIONEER Plasma PDA-5002 DVI (no HDCP) input]

Almost immediately, the HDMI output would cut out every 1-3 days. The channel that I left the receiver on was somewhat random, e.g., HDNET, HDNET Movies, HBOH, HBO (SD), SciFi, etc. I never watched a PPV event. (It's my understanding that only DirecTV PPV events invoke HDCP....am I wrong?)

SYMPTOMS...
[list=1]
The HDMI output would cut out, i.e., either a black or snow picture.
Usually the digital audio would still be active.
Commands via the remote control would work for 10-20 key presses and then be non-functional.
The Format button on the front panel was non-functional.
[/list=1]
TEMPORARY FIX...

I would power cycle the box (either by yanking the power cord or cycling the master switch on my power conditioner). It always came back...

..until one day it didn't, i.e., the HDMI output was no longer functional. I looked at the Status screen and it said "HDMI Status: HDCP Disabled".

REPLACEMENT HAS SAME SYMPTOMS...

I called DirecTV and got a replacement. Less than 3 hours later, same problem. The screen had turned to snow. Power cycle again fixed the problem.

DIAGNOSIS?

So do I have the HDMI failure problem? Or is this the expected behavior of a system where the DVI display is not HDCP capable? I.e., after so many HDCP "transgressions", the HDMI port turns itself off?

[ChromeAce]

My running theory is that all the HDMI cards, manufactured by Hughes, are defective and should be recalled immediately and replaced.

From the accounts so far and my own experience, I believe the defects can remain dormant indefinitely until the card is slightly disturbed by:

1. motion
2. heat
3. vibration
4. changes in HDCP status in program content
5. changing display output resolution
6. solar activity
7. moon phases
8. butterfly sneezes

Obviously it is completely unacceptable. I think we deserve to hear from DirecTV on whether or not

1. they admit to the problem
2. they have found the cause
3. they have a solution
4. how they plan on implementing the solution

I wouldn't even know where to start a campaign for this kind of thing but since most HR10-250 users are here, this may be a good place to organize a demand for action.

[grafals]

Originally posted by SonyPlanet
Obviously it is completely unacceptable. I think we deserve to hear from DirecTV on whether or not

1. they admit to the problem
2. they have found the cause
3. they have a solution
4. how they plan on implementing the solution

I wouldn't even know where to start a campaign for this kind of thing but since most HR10-250 users are here, this may be a good place to organize a demand for action.

I have to think that DTV is extremely sensitive to the problem at some level since every unit that goes back to CC or some other retailer and every unit that they replace directly is money out of their pockets. If someone hasn't gone into their returns whse and noticed a large stack of returned $1,000 units, I'd be mightily surprised. And, I suspect that as the problem becomes more known w/out a resolution, the probability grows that a Samsung, or RCA unit will come out and clean their clock soon. Of course, no matter who produces it, Hughes will get revenue from the licensing. But be that as it may, they can't help but be getting notice in the only place that gets their attention, their wallet.

I doubt you will EVER get an admission or acknowledgment of the problem. To do so would put them on the hook to repair/replace EVERY unit, defective or not. You will probably see a quiet fading of the problem as new units come out that don't continue to report the problem. That way, the people not using HDMI and those not experiencing the problem won't have claims against them, until enough time passes that the claim is cut off by the warranty expiration.

I doubt that most HR10-250 users are here. Despite short supply, there are many thousands in the market place now. I would bet that for every 3 or 4 posts to this thread reporting a problem and a return to DTV, there is at least one person with the problem who is content to switch to Component and live with it, not knowing that this thread or the problem exists on a regular basis. Based on what I'm reading, I can't imagine that failure rates could be less than 50%. The problem is too consistent. If there is a mfg or design defect, and the mfg process is the least bit controlled, then one would expect every unit shipped to have a similar problem at one stage or another.

The fix for DTV is going to be VERY costly. If you want to make trouble for them, don't call DTV, call the rating agencies that track Hughes stock/debt and point out that Hughes is apt to take it in the shorts for this. Especially if they miss production goals for the upcomming Christmas season, which I'm sure they plan to gear up for.

[grafals]

Originally posted by mfleming
So, if I were to go and purchase another one now, considering I've got a good chance I'll have to return it, where would everyone suggest I buy it? Someone who will continue to replace them without a hassle, and someone who will send me the new one before I have to send the old one back. DTV?

I bought the 5 year gty from Circuit City for $89. THey claim that they will ship the replacement in 5 to 7 days, and you don't return the old one until the new one arrives. THey also claim that you can either return to local store or they will pay shipping. Lastly, they point out that if they have to repair/replace 5 times in 12 months, you will get a full replacement with the latest equipment, even if the new equipment is a newer or updated model. Thus, you have kind of a "most current technology" guaranty. I actually "cashed in" on that gty when I bought my 1st big screen about 10 years ago. It was a ProScan floor model I got for 1/2 MSRP. It broke 5 times in about 6 months. So, I got a brand new one that was vastly better than the one I bought. I paid about $2,000 for a brand new $5,000 TV. I had a friend who managed a CC store. His advice, "always buy the wty if it's expensive or new technology. Those usually pay off." He was right in my case. And, this unit is both expensive AND new technology.

If I understand right, the DTV xtended warranty is a monthly payment of a few dollars. It continues as long as you pay, and ends when you quit. So, if its $2/mo, then in 60 months, you would have paid $120. But then again, it would, I believe, cover ALL of your equipment, including the dish and LNB and your other receivers right? On the other hand, if its $3, then the extra $90 would just about pay for a new SD DVR or LNB. Maybe somebody w/ the DTV xtended wty could chime in and provide the specifics for us all in terms of costs, benefits and quality of service. In fact, it might be a useful thread to start for everyone to give xtended wty info from various retailers and DTV.

[grafals]

The forum moderator should consider revising the poll to include a category to recant a vote for no failure. So, if I vote no failure after 2 weeks, then it fails in 4, I can let everyone know. Then, you could subtract those votes from the no failure votes for a more accurate count. I'm becomming suspicious that the actual failure rates MUST be much higher than what the poll indicates. Thanks to standardized parts and assembly lines, if 100 have the defect, then it seems logical that 1,000,000 would have the same problem. Otherwise, you'd have to conclude that the mfg process is inconsistent enough that it wouldn't be logical that so many people would experience such similarities in the first place. (Isn't that chaos theory?)

I'd also drop the don't know column because it makes it appear that the failure rate is lower than it is. Since your only testing the HDMI, if the HDMI isn't used or the participant doesn't know, then that column is irrelevant. You only want to know the "works" versus the "don't works", not the I don't knows, right?

[nash0r]

Purchase: 08-14 at Ultimate Electronics
Manuf Date: 07-28 in Mexico

HDMI port dead out of the box. Decided to return for money back and wait for an official fix or a different model from other manufacturer. Not worth the crapshoot at this time :(

Was using the HDMI->DVI cable with a Samsung DLP TV.

[Slardybardfast]

After being very upset with the DOA performance of the Hughes HR10-250, I returned it to CC for a refund; promising myself that I would not purchase another unit until the problem was fixed.

I could not keep my word. I ordered another unit from CC online and I just installed it. Guess what? No HDMI output. Again, tech support could not help me.

Varying the resolution does not matter. No output at any resolution.

This really sucks.

OK, I see some posts regarding reseating the daughter card or wedging a piece of plastic some where. I have not seen any details of this or pics. Could someone please give me details on how to remove the card and reseat it.

Thanks

[pbolya]

Originally posted by Slardybardfast
After being very upset with the DOA performance of the Hughes HR10-250, I returned it to CC for a refund; promising myself that I would not purchase another unit until the problem was fixed.

I could not keep my word. I ordered another unit from CC online and I just installed it. Guess what? No HDMI output. Again, tech support could not help me.

Varying the resolution does not matter. No output at any resolution.

This really sucks.

OK, I see some posts regarding reseating the daughter card or wedging a piece of plastic some where. I have not seen any details of this or pics. Could someone please give me details on how to remove the card and reseat it.

Thanks Do not remove the card in fact do not even touch it. There is a metal pin right next to the card. make sure that it does not touch the card by wedging a separator in between them. Do not make it too tight. You do not wan tot break that pin. Also make sure you are calm and grounded (do not do it right after you talked to a CSR). If it works give us your picture (both before and after). This is my original story with pictures (almost a month now and still works):

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?postid=2113154#post2113154

Of course it might have been that I bumped the card during the upgrade to 63 hours and that is why it went dead and your "virgin" TiVo(s) have another problem altogether but it is worth a try (just make sure you open it with the proper tools so they can not tell from the screws that you opened it).

I hope it helps.

Regards,
Peter

[TriscuiT]

Just bought a JVC HD52Z575 and an HR10-250. The JVC looks beautiful. Hooked up the DTV box via HDMI and things were fine. Set the peanut remote to work the TV volume and power then shut the TV off via the remote to test it. After waiting for the lamp to cool down I turned the TV back on and got SNOW then GREEN then SNOW then GREEN.... You get the idea. HR10-250 made in Mexico with a June build date. Nothing like spending $4500US and not being able to make the pieces work the way they should.

[ChromeAce]

I would like to know if ANYONE has duplicated the results of the plastic spacer fix. I suspect it's a freak occurrence that may or may not be related to the inserted spacer at all.

As for DirecTV, I don't know, but I would guess they don't make any money on the boxes. They just use them to sell more subscriptions, their cash cow. The incoming bad boxes won't cost them anywhere near $1000 each. Most likely they will refurbish all of them with new HDMI cards and get them out to selected customers for free in exchange for an HD package upgrade and a 2-year contract commitment.

Clearly they were under the gun to release this new product, which had already been delayed. Now we know why.

Can we get G4/TechTV to interview a PR rep and pressure him with possible negative publicity? Isn't that how these things get fixed quickly? Dateline does it all the time.

[falstaffpac]

I have duplicated pbolya's results. I believe pbolya said he knows of 4 others who have had success with this. I wedged a small silver peice between the pin and the daughter card with the pressure point about 7/8 down the length of the card. I've not had a single problem since.

[jlas75]

I am now on my second HR10-250....same HDMI problem (No picture!!!). So, I am watching through component video until it is fixed.

Quick question....Does anyone have Comcast Cable HD and DirecTV HD? If so, which pictures looks better? I found that High Definition in Comcast looks a lot better than HD in DirecTV. Any reason why? Both are hooked up with the same component cables (monster) and set to 1080i. I did a test with the baseball game last night on ESPN...Comcast's picture was noticably better!

[Toeside]

I just called in for a replacement. He said it should be here in 2-5 days, but they could be backordered.

We'll see.

Craig

[erehm]

Originally posted by erehm
SYMPTOMS...
[list=1]
The HDMI output would cut out, i.e., either a black or snow picture.
Usually the digital audio would still be active.
Commands via the remote control would work for 10-20 key presses and then be non-functional.
The Format button on the front panel was non-functional.
[/list=1]
TEMPORARY FIX...

I would power cycle the box (either by yanking the power cord or cycling the master switch on my power conditioner). It always came back...

..until one day it didn't, i.e., the HDMI output was no longer functional. I looked at the Status screen and it said "HDMI Status: HDCP Disabled".

[/B]

Sorry to be pushy, but does anyone else have any symptoms like this, i.e., HDMI output stops working periodically but a power-cycle clears it up (at least for a while)?

/eric

[ChromeAce]

Originally posted by jlas75

Quick question....Does anyone have Comcast Cable HD and DirecTV HD? If so, which pictures looks better? I found that High Definition in Comcast looks a lot better than HD in DirecTV. Any reason why? Both are hooked up with the same component cables (monster) and set to 1080i. I did a test with the baseball game last night on ESPN...Comcast's picture was noticably better!

No such thing as a "quick question", especially an off-topic one... but I'll reply anyway...

Good obervation. When comparing the over-the-air NBC HD feed of the Olympics with DirecTV's HD feed, over-the-air is also much better. That's DirecTV compression for ya. I think it varies based on what kind of bandwidth is needed on the other channels at the time.

[ctauber]

I just hooked up my new HR10-250 to my new Toshiba 52HM84 last night. It is my first use of the HDMI connection for either piece, although I have used the DVR for 3 weeks without incident. Every time I turn off the tv and turn it back on the picture loses all color except for green & a pinkish purple. Rebooting the DTV/Tivo unit restores the color. This does not happen when using component video cables, only the HDMI. Is this considered a HDMI failure? Has anyone else experienced this?

The Toshiba manual has the following recommendation in reference to HDMI or DVI connections:

1. When turning on your electronic components, turn on the TV first, and then the HDMI or DVI device.
2. When turning off your electronic components, turn off the HDMI or DVI device first, and then the TV.

Is this the source of my problem?
Since the HD DVR doesn't turn off I cannot comply with their recommendation. I just won't reboot every time that I turn on the tv but would like to have HDMI capabilities. Any suggestions?

[pbolya]

Originally posted by ctauber
I just hooked up my new HR10-250 to my new Toshiba 52HM84 last night. It is my first use of the HDMI connection for either piece, although I have used the DVR for 3 weeks without incident. Every time I turn off the tv and turn it back on the picture loses all color except for green & a pinkish purple. Rebooting the DTV/Tivo unit restores the color. This does not happen when using component video cables, only the HDMI. Is this considered a HDMI failure? Has anyone else experienced this?

The Toshiba manual has the following recommendation in reference to HDMI or DVI connections:

1. When turning on your electronic components, turn on the TV first, and then the HDMI or DVI device.
2. When turning off your electronic components, turn off the HDMI or DVI device first, and then the TV.

Is this the source of my problem?
Since the HD DVR doesn't turn off I cannot comply with their recommendation. I just won't reboot every time that I turn on the tv but would like to have HDMI capabilities. Any suggestions? Sure it does (turn off). If you have a harmony or MX remote you can have a dedicated button to turn it off (like I do-no macro just streight IR code) or if you use the original peanut use TiVO+Page down to get to Standby and than press select. To turn on you can use either TiVo or Live Tv (some others will also turn it on).

[ctauber]

Originally posted by pbolya
Sure it does (turn off). If you have a harmony or MX remote you can have a dedicated button to turn it off (like I do-no macro just streight IR code) or if you use the original peanut use TiVO+Page down to get to Standby and than press select. To turn on you can use either TiVo or Live Tv (some others will also turn it on).

Thanks for the tip. I am a recent convert from Ultimate TV and misunderstood what standby was for. Unfortunately using it did not solve the problem. The picture still comes on green and pink upon restart of the tv. Any ideas?

[Slardybardfast]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by pbolya
[B]Do not remove the card in fact do not even touch it. There is a metal pin right next to the card. make sure that it does not touch the card by wedging a separator in between them. Do not make it too tight. You do not wan tot break that pin. Also make sure you are calm and grounded (do not do it right after you talked to a CSR). If it works give us your picture (both before and after). This is my original story with pictures (almost a month now and still works):

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?postid=2113154#post2113154

Of course it might have been that I bumped the card during the upgrade to 63 hours and that is why it went dead and your "virgin" TiVo(s) have another problem altogether but it is worth a try (just make sure you open it with the proper tools so they can not tell from the screws that you opened it).

********************************

Well, I insulated the copper/brass-spring card-tensioner to no avail. While I was at it, I removed the daughter card and reseated it to no avail.

So there it is. The second 10-250 DAO.

[Slardybardfast]

Originally posted by jlas75
HDMI video is NOT working on my DirecTV HR10-250 DirecTV with TiVo...Sysytem information says it's "not connected"...

Component video works. Any suggestions on how to fix this? Or, do I have to return it for a new one? Please advise....
******************************************
See my post above. I am on my second 10-250 receiver with a DOA HDMI output .

I could find no mention of any connection status in my system information window. Could you please confirm that you have a report of the 10-250 output status available in one of your menus and which menu location is it?


Thanks

[Toeside]

Originally posted by Slardybardfast
******************************************
See my post above. I am on my second 10-250 receiver with a DOA HDMI output .

I could find no mention of any connection status in my system information window. Could you please confirm that you have a report of the 10-250 output status available in one of your menus and which menu location is it?


Thanks

It's in System Information. Same screen that shows Software version, IR code, internal Temp, etc.

[jordanz]

Made in Mexico - HDMI produces what looks like only 256 colors or something. Box keeps rebooting too. Component works fine. New box is on its way from DirecTV.

[jbrychka]

My HDMI output just died as well. Purchased June 28th.

[cocoon]

I received my HR10-250 last night and connected it with the hdmi cable to my Toshiba 46H84. The HR10-250 was made in Mexico July 2004. I'm not sure if my problem is the HDMI failure that this thread is for. I'm not even sure if this post belongs here or AVSforum...


Ok so heres my problem

When switching between Svideo and the HDMI inputs on the TV the HDMI input comes out with the colors wrong blue becomes green and most everything has a purple tint. I can correct the problem by temporality changing the output resolution of the HR10-250.

Putting the HR10-250 in standy mode does not correct the color problem when i turn on the TV. It just seems like a real pain to have to mess with the resolution mode every time I wach tv.

So my question is something wrong the Toshiba 46H84 or the HR10-250 or is this as good as it gets with this equipment?

thanks

[jlas75]

i don't think it's your tv...i think the hdmi port on the tivo unit is defected. directv / hughes needs to correct this...

[ctauber]

Originally posted by cocoon
I received my HR10-250 last night and connected it with the hdmi cable to my Toshiba 46H84. The HR10-250 was made in Mexico July 2004. I'm not sure if my problem is the HDMI failure that this thread is for. I'm not even sure if this post belongs here or AVSforum...


Ok so heres my problem

When switching between Svideo and the HDMI inputs on the TV the HDMI input comes out with the colors wrong blue becomes green and most everything has a purple tint. I can correct the problem by temporality changing the output resolution of the HR10-250.

Putting the HR10-250 in standy mode does not correct the color problem when i turn on the TV. It just seems like a real pain to have to mess with the resolution mode every time I wach tv.

So my question is something wrong the Toshiba 46H84 or the HR10-250 or is this as good as it gets with this equipment?

thanks

I have the exact same problem (see post above). Today I received another unit and the HDMI connection did not work at all! I'm starting to feel that I aam lucky to be able to color correct with the res mode.

[mjstonez]

Yep, Just got my replacemt receiver and DOA HDMI! I'll wait a few months and then call D* for a replacement under the 1 year/parts waranty. I can live with component! JVC Dila only has one HDMI anyway. I would rather get the DVD to that anyway.....ho hum.

MJ

[ChromeAce]

Don't hesitate in returning your defective units! The more DirecTV gets back, the more likely they are to pay attention and stop sending us defective units by solving the HDMI problem.

[cocoon]

woohoo! ~maybe~

Called rapid satellite which after being on hold for about 15 minutes transfered me to DirecTV hold time about 30 minutes got transfered to technical support
spoke to someone named Mike he said the HDMI port was a known issue and they are tracking customers with this issue. He offered me 2 choices get it replaced immediately or be flagged as one of the customers with this issue and they would contact me when they find a solution to this problem. Being impatient and wondering what have i got to lose at this point I opted for them sending a replacement I mean all of the HR10-250 cant be defective can they?

Either this seems like a big improvement on DirecTV's part from saying problem was as an isolated case to now being a "known issue".

[jlas75]

that's interesting b/c everytime i call driectv, tech support usually has no idea about the HDMI problem. in general, i think directv phone support / customer service is very weak...

any idea why directv doesn't offer the lifetime TiVo service anymore? i think is cost about $300. i'd rather pay the one time fee than have to pay an extra $5 every month for the TiVo service.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by jlas75
that's interesting b/c everytime i call driectv, tech support usually has no idea about the HDMI problem. in general, i think directv phone support / customer service is very weak...

any idea why directv doesn't offer the lifetime TiVo service anymore? i think is cost about $300. i'd rather pay the one time fee than have to pay an extra $5 every month for the TiVo service. When they made the 1st D* boxes TiVo was running the customer service on all boxes and it was great. I bought a lifetime TiVo service then on my SAT-T60. Later D* took over customer support and the support is getting worth every day. They have no idea about anything. I wish I could call TiVo more with my Standalone TiVo as I love TiVo's customer service but this thing never breaks :D Now D* is telling me that my lifetime service which I paid $250 is not honored anymore and if I ever lower my subscription from the ~$80 premium package they will charge me the monthly fee :mad: Since I reshuffled a couple of channels in my lineup (and increased the monthly by $2 I might add) they did not want to wave the monthly fee when I activated my HD TiVo. I called 4 times before I got a CSR that accepted the fact that even though I do not have the exact premium package my monthly is actually higher than the premium package. I found that since they are so incogsistent it is much better not to argue but hang up instead and call again untill you get a CSR that is willing to help you..

Long story short they want you to be a high paying customer forever. If they give you a lifetime and you go back to a $40 package or lower they lose a lot of money. This way at least they give you an incentive to stay at a premium package level as you can save up to $20 a month on DVR fees if you have multiple TiVo's. It is much likely that you will pay an extra $20-$30 for all the premium channels than an extra $40. For them it doesn't cost any more for you to have all the channels vs. having just the basic so the higher your monthly bill the better regardless what you are getting in return. If they would give you a lifetime for $300 they might lose $40 a month on some customers which would put them in the red in 8 short month. If you lower your package anyway they still break even in 2 and a 1/2 years.

This is also the reason why they give you free stuff (like subscriptions to HBO/SHOW or even credit to your account) when you buy the HD TiVo. If you are willing to stay at $80/month a $200 credit is only 2 and a 1/2 month subscription. If you can pay $1000 for a new TiVo it is very likely that you can and more importantly willing to pay above $80/month. Not to mention that you might subscribe to the very week HD package for $10.

[vonzoog]

I just got off the phone with D* "Advance Service Department". They seem to be the ones that handle the HD problems. Last week I reported that my HDMI connection was giving me a white snowy screen and could be fixed with a reboot of the system. They told me then that someone would call me back as a follow up. Today I call them to report the same problem and that I have not been called back.

Here is the NEW D* response to this issue. They told me that this issue has been recognized and that a "fix" is in the works at this time. I was told that the fix was going to be handle with a firmware update coming out "soon". They also say (again) that someone would be calling me back to explain what is happening. I told them I will give them a few more days for some sort of response and then I will be calling them back looking for replacement unit. They acted as if this was no problem.

FYI: Interesting that they claim they are aware of the problem and are currently working on a solution. Also that it will be handle by a satellite firmware download. I am sure that I am like the rest of you and don't know what to believe at this point. Just want to get this resolved and move on. Other than this issue, the HR10-250 is excellent in every respect.

[PRMan]

As some of you saw on another thread, I got my HD TiVo and the HDMI port was DOA. It was one of the last 3 at Costa Mesa and the incredibly weak box was 10% smashed (the other two were completely destroyed).

Knowing I could not get another one quickly and that I was travelling for the week, I just pressed down on the top of the unit (over the HDMI card) and it came on. I have had to do this a couple times now.

I now realize that when it goes to snow I can just change resolutions and it comes back. Costa Mesa has 30 right now if anyone else needs a replacement.

I am trying to decide if I should just wait past the 30 days for D*'s $7.99 warranty to kick in or whether I should just return it at Costa Mesa. If D* cross-ships it, I could swap the HDD, saving me a lot of time and saving my recordings that I missed while I was gone.

[ChromeAce]

Originally posted by PRMan
If D* cross-ships it, I could swap the HDD, saving me a lot of time and saving my recordings that I missed while I was gone.

Won't work. You cannot transplant hard drives from one DirecTiVo to another without losing all recordings. The recordings are encrypted to only play on the motherboard that created them.

When you transplant your drive, you will be able to run a "clear and delete everything" to setup the drive for use in the new unit.

[Registered]

My original vote was one USA unit with HDMI failure. I've since gone through two more USA units with HDMI failures. Mfr'd June 24, 25 and 28 (Thursday, Friday and Monday). Two were DOA, one gave me a few minutes of 16 color or less images before giving up.

The second one was really bad: the HD Tivo box was warped about a half inch -- would not lay flat on a level surface. Besides no HDMI, there were several bad image lines horizontally at the top of the picture.

When I called D*, I spent an hour on the phone with a CSR (my mistake, should have called Customer Retention Rep). Their thought was a bad cable and told me to buy a cable retail and try that. I balked, as the only cables I'd seen were M* $120 ripoffs. I insisted that D* guarantee to reimburse me the cost and they changed their solution to a service call, saying that the tech will have the HDMI-DVI cables.

I took off work for the morning service window and just before noon, the dispatcher called to say the tech was late. He showed up at 1, with an 8-12 window. He had no HDMI cables, saying D* doesn't provide the techs with those. The tech knew less than me about HDMI and the connections. He spent a lot of time asking me about them and finally concluded that the two HDMI/DVI cables I had were operational. I lost 6-1/2 hours of work for that.

Before I returned my first unit, I tried the fix that pbloya (sp?) offered, to no avail. The reboot route doesn't work either.

I'm going to hold onto the one I have and notify D* Customer Retention of the problem and that I have heard it is a 'known issue' with them and have them send me one when they fix it. Or, if it is indeed a firmware fix downloadable, I'll ask to be told about that. After my experiences with D*, I don't expect at all that they will follow through, so I will watch this thread for news and take care of it from my side.

Thanks to you all for the information.

[pbolya]

From what I seen so far there is two separate issues with the HDMI. One is dead out of the box and nothing you do will change that (firmware issue ??? hard to imagine). The other is that the card is not seated properly or will not seat properly. My method might fix this issue. If you push the top of the unit and the picture goes in and out that is a good sign that you have the formal and you have a chance to fix it. There is of course no guarantee that it will stay fixed but beats the horror of returning several boxes. By the way the only problem I saw ever since I did my fix is that yesterday while I was watching the Olympics suddenly the picture went black for 1 second and the unit rebooted. It really freaked me out but after 5-10 minutes I was back watching from the same point without any problems. Of course I missed 2x10 minutes as both tuner was recording when this happened. This might be there firmware issue they where talking about as a CARD seating issue should not reboot the TiVo (as it did not a moth ago for the entire time I was looking for a solution with the cover off).

[erehm]

Originally posted by pbolya
From what I seen so far there is two separate issues with the HDMI. One is dead out of the box and nothing you do will change that (firmware issue ??? hard to imagine). The other is that the card is not seated properly or will not seat properly.
I believe there is a third failure mode with HDMI that has nothing to do with DOA or card seating, namely, the HDMI "fails" periodically (on the order of once per day) and a power-cycle fixes the "failure". I am quoting "fails" and "failure" because the symptoms of this failure mode include a snowy screen (not black), possible audio output and possible (if temporary) remote control.

In my case, this periodic "failure" ended with complete failure.

Please post a reply if you have had this kind of failure. I want to know if I'm alone.

/eric

[videoholic]

My problem now is the screen is all red. Looks horrible. It's been broken since the day I received it on 8/4. Although the symptoms are different now. On day one it looked like I only had 256 colors. Robert from VE was supposed to be working on getting me a new one, but when I called Direct TV today they didn't know anything and told me to call where I got it from, but the first thing they would try is to send me new cables. So I'm stuck until Robert gets back with me.

Is it worth it for me to open the box and check the seating on the card or does that only work if the output completely fails?

[aenea]

Originally posted by erehm
I believe there is a third failure mode with HDMI that has nothing to do with DOA or card seating, namely, the HDMI "fails" periodically (on the order of once per day) and a power-cycle fixes the "failure". I am quoting "fails" and "failure" because the symptoms of this failure mode include a snowy screen (not black), possible audio output and possible (if temporary) remote control.

In my case, this periodic "failure" ended with complete failure.

Please post a reply if you have had this kind of failure. I want to know if I'm alone.

/eric

I've got the snowy picutre/fixed with a reboot thing going on right now. It started a couple of days ago. I'm pretty much resigned to it failing completley soon.

[videoholic]

Looks like Robert is going to check on it for me tomorrow. More power to him. THose tech guys are pretty tough to talk to. The dude kept asking me if I had a message on the screen. I don't know how many times I told him the machine was running fine it was just the output. UGH!!!

[Rcam10]

Originally posted by pbolya
From what I seen so far there is two separate issues with the HDMI. One is dead out of the box and nothing you do will change that (firmware issue ??? hard to imagine). The other is that the card is not seated properly or will not seat properly. My method might fix this issue. If you push the top of the unit and the picture goes in and out that is a good sign that you have the formal and you have a chance to fix it. There is of course no guarantee that it will stay fixed but beats the horror of returning several boxes. By the way the only problem I saw ever since I did my fix is that yesterday while I was watching the Olympics suddenly the picture went black for 1 second and the unit rebooted. It really freaked me out but after 5-10 minutes I was back watching from the same point without any problems. Of course I missed 2x10 minutes as both tuner was recording when this happened. This might be there firmware issue they where talking about as a CARD seating issue should not reboot the TiVo (as it did not a moth ago for the entire time I was looking for a solution with the cover off).

That was not my experience. My unit was DOA, and going inside, barely touching the copper clip on the back of the card, instantly brought the video back.

When you have a product with this many showing up with pretty much the exact problem, its almost aways the same defect causing it. There are always other problems that appear almost the same that isn't related.

I've personally saw two DOA HDMI units in April, and each one reacted the same way. I could keep it on, but I wanted one that (maybe) wouldn't go out one day, and refuse to come back by using the same type pressure on the card.

Pressing down on the top won't always bring it on either, because the second unit, which wasn't mine, wouldn't come back on doing that. I also saw another one last week, DOA, and yes, putting some pressure on the card bought that one on, but its acting up some, not wanting to really stay on.

[Toeside]

I called DirecTV 2 days ago, my replaced arrived today. That's GREAT turnaround for a replacement, I think.

THe new one works, and it has channel logos.

FYI, I looked at the system informaton screen and the GC and Indexing dates were March 3, 2004 at 3:31pm. Looks like these are old hard drive images, and even with a 3/3/2004 date of GC and index, they still have logos! The build date of the box is July 6, 2004, exactly 3 months after my original USA model.

Craig

[videoholic]

What did you have to tell them to get a new one? THe dude told me he wanted to send me cables.

[TonyM]

Originally posted by erehm
I believe there is a third failure mode with HDMI that has nothing to do with DOA or card seating, namely, the HDMI "fails" periodically (on the order of once per day) and a power-cycle fixes the "failure". I am quoting "fails" and "failure" because the symptoms of this failure mode include a snowy screen (not black), possible audio output and possible (if temporary) remote control.

In my case, this periodic "failure" ended with complete failure.

Please post a reply if you have had this kind of failure. I want to know if I'm alone.

/eric

Same here.

Also, it seems to only happen if I turn off the TV. I have a new JVC D-ILA 61" set and if I leave it on all day, the worst that will happen is the shading effects, like compression artifacts. However, if I turn the TV off, or change the input for more than a couple hours, chances are great that I will have audio, but Snow for picture.

My replacement unit should be here soon. The Directv rep was quite funny, he just about insisted that this website and this thread/poll did not exist. He insisted there was no widespread problem, and that the internet was full of lies from the cable companies... :confused: LOL.

I gave him the link to this thread, and the site. I hope he reads this, he needs an education. After a lengthy rant from me about how he was underinformed, he resigned from his post on the soapbox and ordered me a new unit.

[Dead President]

Initially they offered me a $100 credit to buy component cables. I agreed as I thought that t hey needed a software fix which I would receive in time. After reading this forum, I called and demanded a replacement. They agreed without a fuss and I received it within a few days. Interestingly the manufature date was the same as for my failed unit, but I might have got a refurb, who knows, it looks new and flawless. I have two HR10-250 units and the other one is fine . . . . for now.

[ericlhyman]

I received my replacement unit directly from DirecTV. It was manufactured on July 8 -- 3 days after my original one that had the HDMI/DVI problem. The replacement had a working HDMI/DVI; however, it also would not record anything, unlike the first one. The CSR-recommended fix of reformatting the hard drive did not help. They have now agreed to replace the replacement.

Another odd thing about the replacement unit -- the receiver ID number on the backplate did not work. It was not the one that showed up on the tv screen and that had to be used to get the DirecTV service operating. Also, under Settings, the Tivo service number that came up was
N/A 00000000000.

[videoholic]

Well mine is now completely dead. Still waiting on Robert from VE to help me. I've had this issue since 8/4 and I am no where closer to getting a new one than day one. I've been on hold now for 10 minutes with Direct TV. I've called them twice and they keep saying I have to go through who I bought it from. Well, I'm trying to do that, but it's been over two weeks and no one even has record of a problem with my unit.



EDIT:

Well I just got off the phone. over one hour eighteen minutes. spoke to 4 different people. Getting a new machine. Fingers crossed.

[Toeside]

I can't believe some of these calls are taking so long. I called from work, spoke with the Advanced tech group, call took 10 minutes. I told him that HDMI no longer works, but component, composite and S-video do. He said, OK, we'll send you one, but it could be back ordered.

Two days later, my replacement arrived.

Craig

[bskesq]

Just got my HD TIVO from Bestbuy.com. Pink screen with HDMI\DVI Cable. Component fine. Is this a dud that needs to go back? PAin in the ass for $1000. DOes anything work right out of the box anymore???

[ChromeAce]

Got my replacement HR10-250 from DirecTV. Works great. Before even powering it up, I transplanted the drives from my HR10-550. Connected ONLY the HDMI cable, turned my Sony VPL-HS20 on HDMI, and powered up the TiVo. Got a "Welcome" right away over HDMI. Switched to 1080i no problem. Powered down, rode the unit in a Hyundai Accent's front seat down the street to my brother's house, used his phone line for the initial call-in setup (I have Vonage VOIP only) and brought it back. Redid my Season Passes and after a few days all is well.

Either I lucked out and got a good unit or they found a fix.

The box looked a little beat up as usual, and they sent all the cables and remote and documentation since the unit was packed as a new unit for sale. The return instructions say "don't return the remote" so I guess I can keep the extra cables and remote? I don't wanna piss off DirecTV and obviously I don't want to be charged anything but will anyone in their receiving department really care if the cables aren't there? It's a defective unit! Plus, I deserve compensation for the inconvenience of replacement!

[Chris Gerhard]

Originally posted by SonyPlanet
Either I lucked out and got a good unit or they found a fix.

The box looked a little beat up as usual, and they sent all the cables and remote and documentation since the unit was packed as a new unit for sale. The return instructions say "don't return the remote" so I guess I can keep the extra cables and remote? I don't wanna piss off DirecTV and obviously I don't want to be charged anything but will anyone in their receiving department really care if the cables aren't there? It's a defective unit! Plus, I deserve compensation for the inconvenience of replacement!

According to this poll, about 5/7 work after 2 weeks so I agree with you, we are lucky to be in the 5. The cables are supposed to be returned as the HD TiVo will be refurbished and repackaged using the same cables. Apparently the remote is replaced rather than used. If you decide to steal the cables, will DirecTV do anything about it? I don't know.

Chris

[TonyM]

Unit # 2 is dead after 1 day of use.

Directv shipped it in the Tivo Box, and it was beat up pretty bad. This receiver doesn't even sit level on it's feet, I think the chassis is bent.

I had directv turn my old unit back on, and I am returning the bent replacement. I'll live with component for now, until they can fix this issue...

I am still debating cancelling my re-sub option and getting my money back for the receiver, but since I bought the receiver from a retailer, and I am out of their return policy, I wonder if I can get Directv to refund me for it and take this POS back, heck, the SD quality isn't nearly as good as my old Sony HD receiver that I was about to put on ebay.

:down: :mad:

[AbMagFab]

I've had mine since mid-April (first shipment), and the HDMI just went yesterday (solarization, pink, then black - pushing the top cover can sometimes bring it back to normal for a few minutes). I previously voted it was fine, but no more.

The only thing I did was move it a couple times, which involved plugging/unplugging the HDMI cable. I think these things are fragile, and the more you "fiddle" with them, the more likely they are to go.

Living with component until D* replaces it.

[mfleming]

Is there any other company with a similar type unit on the horizon?

[mfenster]

I ordered my unit from Circuit City on-line. Received it on Aug 4. HDMI was dead out of the box. Talked today to a local CC store. They ordered a replacement for an exchange. No hassle (if within 30 days of purchase).

[cocoon]

Well I got replacement unit today. Would of had it Friday but DirecTV sent it to the wrong state (city same name) so of course the box had some damage. This unit also made in Mexico July 6 this time instead of July 21 for my first unit. The return label was also missing one more thing to complain about

Same exact problem so I called DirecTV after being on hold for some time I spoke to "Jason" he claimed this was the first he had heard of the HDMI problem sigh... so he puts me on hold to find more information.

When he gets back he says they have no record of me calling about the defective unit in the first place. I eventualy commented on speculation about the HDMI card coming loose and he said had heard of that one so off to hold land I go...

Ok he said they dont refer to it has "HDMI failure" they talk about it as "HDMI card failure". I guess this is important for anyone else that will be calling DirecTV with this problem in the future...

They are sending me another unit this is getting old fast

All this makes me want to switch to Voom but they dont have equivalent of Tivo or as many channels for that matter.

[jordanz]

I got my replacement box today and the HDMI works (yeah!). A few things:

* This one seems to have new software or something. It auto switches between 480/720 when going between HD/SD TV. My old one didn't do that (unless I had something mis-configured).

* The image quality of SD seems a lot better on this unit.

* I have a DVI switcher and it doesn't seem to work with an HDMI to DVI cable. Damn!

[pbolya]

Originally posted by jordanz
I got my replacement box today and the HDMI works (yeah!). A few things:

* This one seems to have new software or something. It auto switches between 480/720 when going between HD/SD TV. My old one didn't do that (unless I had something mis-configured).

* The image quality of SD seems a lot better on this unit.

* I have a DVI switcher and it doesn't seem to work with an HDMI to DVI cable. Damn! What is your software version (you can find it in the system information screen) ?

[AbMagFab]

Originally posted by jordanz
I got my replacement box today and the HDMI works (yeah!). A few things:

* This one seems to have new software or something. It auto switches between 480/720 when going between HD/SD TV. My old one didn't do that (unless I had something mis-configured).

* The image quality of SD seems a lot better on this unit.

* I have a DVI switcher and it doesn't seem to work with an HDMI to DVI cable. Damn!

Can you confirm your software version on your HD Tivo, as well as describe how you know it's auto-switching between 720p and 480i/p? I think you might be getting confused with either the auto-pillaring setting on the Tivo or the HD OTA SD-in-a-box broadcasts.

[chris_h]

Originally posted by jordanz

* This one seems to have new software or something. It auto switches between 480/720 when going between HD/SD TV. My old one didn't do that (unless I had something mis-configured).



Hey, that got my attention! This sounds like you may have some sort of beta or prototype software running on the unit, with a native resolution mode enabled. Can you tell us some more details?

How can you tell it is autoswitching between 480 and 720?
What does the software version read in the system information screen?
What is the manufacture date of the unit?

[jordanz]

This all could be my own misunderstandings of how the HD DirecTivo box works.

Software version: 3.1.5-01-2-357
Man date: July 6, 2004
Box came directly from DirecTV

A big difference may also be that on the new box I'm connected via HDMI. The other box was connected by component because, obviously, HDMI didn't work.

On the old box, when I switched to OTA HD or Satellite HD, the picture would stay boxed in a 480 display unless I pressed the UP button to switch to 720. On the new box, SD channels display with letterbox panels but switching to OTA or Satellite HD switches into 720. Going to an SD channel switches back to 480 with panels.

[chris_h]

I think this may have to do with the ratio setting (to full/panel). It may also have to do with the source material containg panels or letterboxing. When playing the material, hitting up-arrow once will tell you what output format is currently being used. It is either 480i, 480p, 720p, or 1080i. Can you confirm that the actual output format setting is changing, as opposed to just the letterboxing or side panels?

I have the same software version as you, and I notice if ratio is set to "panel" then I get sidepanels on SD material, and HD material takes up the whole 16x9 screen. I suspect that this is what you are seeing also.
Please confirm.

[jking1024]

I just got my HD unit. Got it all configured, plugged in the HDMI-DVI cable, and had no problems. Until today. I was re-arranging the inputs on my tv (a Mitsu WS-65613) and suddenly the video is all blotchy, like the color resolution dropped to 8-bit, or something. There was some noise streaking in from the left side of the screen, too. *sigh*

I have software 3.1.5-01-2-357, also. The unit was made in Mexico, but I don't see a manufacture date anywhere. I bought it from Ultimate Electronics. They still have a couple units un-sold (miracle of miracles!), so they can swap me out.

Back to the store I go!

[jordanz]

OK - it was my misunderstanding. I have the new box in "panel" mode. I didn't know about this before.

[BTDT]

Originally posted by erehm
I believe there is a third failure mode with HDMI that has nothing to do with DOA or card seating, namely, the HDMI "fails" periodically (on the order of once per day) and a power-cycle fixes the "failure". I am quoting "fails" and "failure" because the symptoms of this failure mode include a snowy screen (not black), possible audio output and possible (if temporary) remote control.

In my case, this periodic "failure" ended with complete failure.

Please post a reply if you have had this kind of failure. I want to know if I'm alone.

/eric
Yes, I have this kind of problem. It started happening this weekend (about 2 weeks into use) where the screen went all white/pink (actually white with tiny speckles). Cycling through the input resolutions fixed the problem. A couple of nights ago the screen went white for a moment and then was fine for the rest of the evening with no intervention. Last night it went black then white/pink then black then everything was okay again.

My thought is that this symptom is a HDMI synchronization issue of some sort. It smells like something that *might* be fixable in a firmware or software update, much like the DD cutout problem was on the original D-TiVo units.

This thread in general seems to be covering a number of problems which I theorize are distinct problems rather than all being the same. I could be wrong and the "pink screen" is merely a precursor to a larger breakdown, but I can always hope that this is a software rather than hardware thing in my case.

[pbolya]

This is slightly off topic but nevertheless the right audience:

Today it was the 4th time that an HD show when I selected it from the now showing list it went straight to the do you want to delete page and when I said no it told me that nothing is recorded due to the fact that there was no signal. After trying several times with the same result when I start watching other shows and come back to this one later it plays it with no problem! Does anybody have the same issue?

My 63h upgraded unit was relatively problem free up to this point it only rebooted unexpectedly once and the plastic spacer fixed the HDMI issue (of course there are no logos). It is strange what is considered a relatively problem free unit these days. I also have to mention that it is recording and playing almost 300 hours a week in the last 4 weeks or so (stress testing the upgrade first and 40h/day Olympics in the last week and the half).

[AbMagFab]

Notice of delete/no recording right away - I've only seen this on very long HD recordings (e.g. 8-hour olympics). Seems to be a memory thing. If you have other modifications to your unit, try disabling them?

HDMI/Snow - That's just another part of the symptoms. When the HDMI fails briefly, and then comes back, it renogotiates with the TV. Some TV's display this as what I like to call HD-snow. This is part of the same series of events that eventually leads to failure. Try lightly banging the top of the HD Tivo. If this causes any sort of failure conditions (pink, HD-snow, solarization), then your card will be dying soon enough.

The HDMI card goes bad. Symptoms are:
- Solarization
- Pink
- HD snow
- Blinking out and then coming back, usually associated with one or more of the above

They are all related, and seem to be either about the HDMI daughter card seating, or the HDMI connection itself. In any case, if you see the above symptoms, I'd suggest you call for a replacement.

[pbolya]

Originally posted by AbMagFab
Notice of delete/no recording right away - I've only seen this on very long HD recordings (e.g. 8-hour olympics). Seems to be a memory thing. If you have other modifications to your unit, try disabling them?

HDMI/Snow - That's just another part of the symptoms. When the HDMI fails briefly, and then comes back, it renogotiates with the TV. Some TV's display this as what I like to call HD-snow. This is part of the same series of events that eventually leads to failure. Try lightly banging the top of the HD Tivo. If this causes any sort of failure conditions (pink, HD-snow, solarization), then your card will be dying soon enough.

The HDMI card goes bad. Symptoms are:
- Solarization
- Pink
- HD snow
- Blinking out and then coming back, usually associated with one or more of the above

They are all related, and seem to be either about the HDMI daughter card seating, or the HDMI connection itself. In any case, if you see the above symptoms, I'd suggest you call for a replacement. Yesterday's "delete screen right away" issue was of course an HD Olympics recordings (as I record 40h + 10 SAT-T60 hours every day) but it was a manual 4 hours recording. Previous errors where prior to the Olympics so it must have been less then 3 hours.

I do have snow and gray screen for a second every now and then when I turn on the receiver from standby or when I start a recording. Ones I am playing the show there is no HDMI related issue (with the exception of 1 time when the machine rebooted in the middle of a playback missing 5-10 minutes of Olympics recording on both channels). These symptoms where there from day one (2 month and running) and I was thinking that they are "normal HD side affects". Until of course I had the blackout 1 day after I upgraded it which I fixed by the spacer.

I have no doubt that with or without the spacer it will die eventually but since I already upgraded I do not want to go through the hassle of putting everything back and loosing all my recordings. Besides as I am hearing from this forum the replacement unit can be even worst.

[TriscuiT]

Every day I have to reboot my HR10-250 to get the HDMI to "talk" to my JVC HD52Z575. It works fine following the reboot (which occurs when I get home from work). Once I shut the TV off at night it clearly loses the connection at some point during the next 20 hours. Additionally, I have the component video connected as well but that never works once the HDMI has failed. I suspect the TiVo disregards the component outputs when it thinks it should be using the HDMI. Of course it could be something with the TV as well but considering the number of problems reported here I don't consider it to be very likely.

[Vizcaya]

I got my Hd Tivo on Monday, 2 hours after setting it up, I was using the HDMI cable , and was working fine. Turned off TV, came back 2 hours later, Picture was Pinkish, I reset everything, and still the terrrible picture. I hooked up the Components, and everything is fine.

I waited 2 days before I called DTV, They are sending a replacement. I didn't get any problems with the CSR, they did say there has been a issue with some units.

I will update when I get it.

Vizcaya

[AbMagFab]

HDMI pink = definite HDMI failure coming
HDMI solarization = definite HDMI failure coming
HDMI off/on = likely HDMI failure coming, or possibly TV/Tivo/switch communication issue
HD-Snow = possible HDMI failure coming, or possible TV/Tivo DVI communication issue, or possible DVI switch issue (if you're using one)

The HD-snow is a side effect of the digital HD resolution negotiation. Some TV's are better/worse at this. By itself, it's not an indication of HDMI failure. However when the HDMI starts failing, it will turn off and on, and will usually cause HD-snow in the process.

[panic 66]

Originally posted by TriscuiT
Every day I have to reboot my HR10-250 to get the HDMI to "talk" to my JVC HD52Z575. It works fine following the reboot (which occurs when I get home from work). Once I shut the TV off at night it clearly loses the connection at some point during the next 20 hours. Additionally, I have the component video connected as well but that never works once the HDMI has failed. I suspect the TiVo disregards the component outputs when it thinks it should be using the HDMI. Of course it could be something with the TV as well but considering the number of problems reported here I don't consider it to be very likely.

I also own an HD52Z575 and have the same problem. I had a Samsung HLP for about 2 months before exchanging it for the JVC. I did not start having the HDMI issue until I purchased the JVC. D* sent me a new receiver and it also has the HDMI problem. I figured I would try 1 more unit before resorting to using the component out until they figure out the problem. I hope it is just a coincidence and not an issue with the HDMI input on the JVC. My second replacement receiver is on the way.

[MrCoolDu4]

I just got off the phone with DirecTV and I have a new HD Tivo coming to replace my second defective unit. Both of them had HDMI problems. I hope they get it figured out, I mean it really doesn't do any good to send out units with the same problems. If it should happen again I am going to live with it if I can get a large credit. The purpose of this post though, is how easy it was to get a replacement this time versus when I called two weeks ago. I must have talked to four different people and not one would issue a replacement. They offered me a no cost service call which I took because I was getting nowhere on a second replacement unit. The charge showed up as $70 plus a -$70 resulting in $0 cost to me. I explained my problem to the serviceman and he was out the door in 15 minutes. Whats rather odd though, is when I just called, the DTV rep asked ME what happened with the service call. You would think they would have known.

[gr8reb8]

Originally posted by pbolya
This is slightly off topic but nevertheless the right audience:

Today it was the 4th time that an HD show when I selected it from the now showing list it went straight to the do you want to delete page and when I said no it told me that nothing is recorded due to the fact that there was no signal. After trying several times with the same result when I start watching other shows and come back to this one later it plays it with no problem! Does anybody have the same issue?


I am getting this as well. This is how I can re-create it.

I manually record a long, eight hours (Olympics segment) from channel 84. I start the manual recording at 4:00am and it ends at noon. Begin watching it the next day and get about half way through. Exit out from the program at about 4 hours in to it. Now schedule a recording of the next days program with the same times. Now, on the morning of the third day while it is still recording the next program (it started at 4:00am), when I attempt to continue watching the program that I was watching the day before and that I was about half way through, the Tivo will NOT let me see it and gives me the option to delete it. If I wait until the next recording that is in progress completes (at 12 noon), I can then watch the previous program with no problems.....

[ja1]

I too just had everything go psychadelic on me (solarization?) via HDMI. Had to remove the card when I contacted DirecTv on a billing issue and when I put it back in everything went goofy.

They are sending me a replacement. This has to be costing someone a fortune.

Question: I bought an extended warranty at Tweeter. If I call them when my new unit arrives and give them the new serial number, will they transfer over the extended warranty?

Thanks!

[AbMagFab]

Originally posted by ja1
I too just had everything go psychadelic on me (solarization?) via HDMI. Had to remove the card when I contacted DirecTv on a billing issue and when I put it back in everything went goofy.

They are sending me a replacement. This has to be costing someone a fortune.

Question: I bought an extended warranty at Tweeter. If I call them when my new unit arrives and give them the new serial number, will they transfer over the extended warranty?

Thanks!

Why didn't you call Tweeter for the replacement? I doubt they'll transfer it now...

[pbolya]

Originally posted by gr8reb8
I am getting this as well. This is how I can re-create it.

I manually record a long, eight hours (Olympics segment) from channel 84. I start the manual recording at 4:00am and it ends at noon. Begin watching it the next day and get about half way through. Exit out from the program at about 4 hours in to it. Now schedule a recording of the next days program with the same times. Now, on the morning of the third day while it is still recording the next program (it started at 4:00am), when I attempt to continue watching the program that I was watching the day before and that I was about half way through, the TiVo will NOT let me see it and gives me the option to delete it. If I wait until the next recording that is in progress completes (at 12 noon), I can then watch the previous program with no problems..... Every time I had this problem it happened before I watched the recording at all (maybe the pointer got messed up ?). The last time it happened it was like this: I set up a recurring manual recording from 1 am-5am on NBC HD(which is 4am-8am for you) and another one for 5am-9am (which is 9am-12pm for you). I created 2 recordings so I will not end up with an 8h HD recording. By the way the schedule is all messed up/missing for the Olympics HD. For 5 days (and for the last two days) it worked like a charm. But 2 days ago when I turned the TiVo on and both of those programs where already done recording (like 9:05 or so) I wanted to start to watch the 1am-5am one (for the first time) and it gave me that message. I than checked if the 2nd one has the same problem but it did not. So I started to record the HD feed again and set to record between 9am - 1pm (replay of 1am-5am) and started to record. Even though it was already 9:20am it was on the right channel so it had the last 20 minutes in the buffer. But at that point I went back to try again to play the 1am-5am recording and surprise surprise it started from the beginning and not have a problem with that or any other program (including the last two days 1am-5am programs) ever again. I am sure that this is a new software bug that had been introduced with the 3.1.5 release and we will hear a lot about it in the next few months.

[jb007]

I received a brand new HD TiVo from D* today that was built 6/04 (no USA or Mexico marking), to replace my first unit that had a bad hard drive.

When I connected the new unit with HDMI I got the polarization, mostly shifting red and green. I was able to run setup, but after a reset of the TiVo I received no video thru HDMI whatsoever. I did receive sound and was able to get a normal picture thru component cables.

Now, here's the twist: I still have my original HD TiVo with the bad hard drive, to be returned to D* and the HDMI works fine on that unit. So, I just remove the 3 screws in the back and swap out the HDMI card with the one in the replacement unit. But no picture!

My point is, that at least in my case, it's not the HDMI card itself, but the connection slot or something in the motherboard.

Ah, the mystery goes on . . .

[AbMagFab]

Nope, it's the HDMI card. They are very fragile. By swapping the cards, you probably busted the working one.

Second, that was a dumb move. If you were comfortable opening up the unit, you should have swapped the HD back into the original unit and then returned the new one.

[Flee]

I've had my HR10-250 for about two weeks now. I'm starting to see the deadful signs of impending doom. While watching a high def version of Silence of the Lambs that had been Tivo'd the screen flashed pink for about half a second. It's interesting to note that I had been pushing my Tivo pretty hard just prior to watching the movie.

[cocoon]

Got my 2nd replacement HD Tivo yesterday same old problem or annoyance. Ive given up maybe their is some incompatibility with these machines and Toshiba 46H84. Compared to the other problems seen on this forum mine is more of annoyance. I find the stretch mode for 480I/P better then the 720p or 1080i when watching SD sourced programs so I end up cycling through the resolutions anyway. Still having to cycle through resolutions or 4:3 16:9 mode every time I turn on the TV is damn weird and annoying. sigh...

[grafals]

Originally posted by Flee
I've had my HR10-250 for about two weeks now. I'm starting to see the deadful signs of impending doom. While watching a high def version of Silence of the Lambs that had been Tivo'd the screen flashed pink for about half a second. It's interesting to note that I had been pushing my Tivo pretty hard just prior to watching the movie.

"Clarice, do you hear that sound? It's the sound of the HDMI card screaming! Do you hear it Clarice?!"

[KalaPela]

I got my HR-250 last week and the HDMI worked for about 30 seconds. Whenever i plugged it up everything was red and black, after i wiggled the cable everything came in clear for a second then went black.

I just received my replacement Tivo about 2 hours ago, the HDMI was dead out of the box.

2 dead units so far, with my luck this may take a few months :)

[Vizcaya]

I returned my first unit, and have the replacement. Everything was fine while using the HDMI port until I changed the input source to the TV. Once I went back to see the HDMI video from my DTVHDTivo , the video was Pink, and seemed like the video was in 8 bit color. I was upset.

But, all is not lost. I ended up cycling through all the Video formats on the front of the Tivo, and the Video came back to normal. I went ahead and tried it a few times, and I was able to get the HDMI to display the video correctly everytime.

I have a 52H84 , Toshiba 52 DLP . Hopefully this helps some other users.

You can set-up the Tivo Remote to cycle through the formats, if you do not want to press the format button in the front of the Tivo.

Vizcaya

[beaster]

OK, mine case is a little odd. Had the unit for about 3-4 weeks, using HDMI -> DVI from the very start with no probs until this morning. Turn on the TV and the picture is all squiggly - looks like scrambled cable TV or something. I figured, OK, here we go, HDMI failure. Switched over to component and everything was kosher, so yep, same as everyone else.

But after a while the HDMI came back. Then it failed again. This time, instead of switching back to component, I cycled through to 720p and 1080i - they were fine! It's only 480i that's goofed up (so far at least). Anyone had theirs fail this way?

-Sean