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Tuners 5 and 6 Not Authorized

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by speedy2, Aug 25, 2013.

  1. Dec 25, 2013 #761 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
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    Dec 5, 2013
    Exactly, I had one mini sitting right next to the roamio, and you're absolutely correct! The mini will tune to the v58 channel displaying on the Roamio at the exact same time!

    This is really pointing to a Tivo issue. I tried to open a ticket, but was told that it was 'a comcast issue with firmware and until they update the firmware, there is nothing Tivo can do'.
     
  2. Dec 25, 2013 #762 of 1187
    jwbelcher

    jwbelcher New Member

    489
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    Nov 13, 2007
    Orlando, FL
    And after you rebooted with 3 tuners, you still had v58 errors? Most folks have reported some relief by reducing tuner count.
     
  3. Dec 25, 2013 #763 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

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    Dec 5, 2013
    Yes, and to top it off, I even removed -everything- except the roamio, and still had v58 errors on many channels. It's random too. I can 're-tune' the channel and it will work (occasionally, it's hit or miss really)

    This is my second roamio too, the first was having the same issues, and more. This is driving me nuts, and Tivo says it's a comcast problem with the firmware.
     
  4. Dec 25, 2013 #764 of 1187
    Jed1

    Jed1 Active Member

    1,260
    16
    Jun 18, 2013
    Frackville, PA.
    Unfortunately I can not come to your home and troubleshoot the wiring in your home. 95% of the time issues with cable TV equipment occur with poor wiring, F connectors, splitters, and amps in the customers home.
    Here is a link to an explanation to a simple problem with splitters that most customers never realize:
    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=9945789#post9945789

    Here is a video explaining this:
    [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yk6qQF7tdzU[/media]

    A simple explanation to MoCa filters:
    [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7yknwV1YME[/media]

    Here is a bunch of videos on basic cable TV signal topics to help you understand how easy it is for things to go wrong.
    http://www.youtube.com/user/EBETraining/videos?shelf_id=1&sort=dd&view=0

    What you need to do is get a good Comcast technician to come to your home and thoroughly inspect your wiring in your home for any issues. As you can see by these videos a lot can go wrong and since you do not have a cable TV analyzer to check for these issues you should hold off blaming TiVo or the CableCards until your wiring can be verified to be good.
    Also would I be correct that you have a splitter at the back of the TiVo in order to use the tuning adaptor. If so this can be an issue also. You can be experiencing to much insertion loss topped with return loss and isolation issues from the splitters you are using.
    Insertion loss:
    [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXgifiaDnLM[/media]
    Return loss:
    [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vf1Y46XfnWI[/media]
    Isolation:
    [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_ssUqsROAg[/media]

    Once you can verify that the issue is not with the infrastructure then you can move onto the hardware.
     
  5. Dec 26, 2013 #765 of 1187
    nooneuknow

    nooneuknow TiVo User Since 2007

    3,554
    0
    Feb 5, 2011
    Cox Cable...
    Excellent write-up, Jed1! :up:

    I've watched these those videos from time to time, and even though I have, I often forget a few things.

    While I can't say they have helped me to "fix" anything, directly, or given me any "AHA, that's it!" moments, they are still good to watch every so often. You will never consider going "cheap" on splitters (including expensive ones that are cheap on the inside), once you have absorbed the what these videos contain. I was already long past this, as the only splitters that ever worked correctly for me, actually were given to me from Cox trucks (and I generously tip the kind ones who let me raid their supplies, knowing that to find and buy an equal splitter, would not be easy, or cheap, locally, via retail sources).

    What these videos have done for me, is to explain why my Cox market insists things be done in the way that they are now done, which includes banishing attenuators, and instead utilizing more splitters and terminating any leftover ports, as a result of adding more splitters. While they use those VERY tamper-resistant terminators, I have the tool for installing and removing them. Lately, it seems they've realized using those customer-resistant terminators can lead to more calls, as people want to add new devices. So, they have recently, in some cases, began using the standard, easily-removed terminators.
     
  6. Dec 26, 2013 #766 of 1187
    pshivers

    pshivers Retired!

    162
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    Nov 4, 2013
    Alhambra, CA
    From http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2566/

    The "Copy-protected content" paragraph is interesting to me as I am able to operate without any problems on Charter using firmware version 1.5.2-Fp.2401 on my Roamio Pro as long as I only have 5 tuners active. If I activate all 6 tuners within a few days or even hours, it varies, I start getting "V58 Not Authorized" errors again.

    Bottom line is the only way this will be fixed is with a firmware upgrade by Charter, there does not seem to be one forthcoming anytime soon. I'm not sure that Charter even updates firmware automatically. I say this because I installed a standard Roamio (4 -tuner) in my Sister-In-Laws room and the Firmware on the CableCard Charter provided is even older than that what is in my Roamio Pro. It has been up and running for over two weeks and the firmware release remains the same, (1.5.2-Fp.1601). Fortunately for me the 4-Tuner Roamio is happy with the older firmware. I've tried talking to Charter about upcoming firmware upgrades, but the Techs just shrug their shoulders and say they have no control or feedback on firmware upgrades.

    Jed1 - Thanks for those training video links! I had found the one on MoCA and it was very helpful, I'm going through the other videos now, very helpful in understanding why things work the way they do...
     
  7. Dec 26, 2013 #767 of 1187
    HarperVision

    HarperVision TiVo's Italian Cuz!

    5,275
    3
    May 14, 2007
    Paradise...
    Been there, done that. Excellent info, but it still doesn't explain why you can tune the channel with a mini, but not the host TiVo, when its using the exact same tuner for both devices.
     
  8. Dec 26, 2013 #768 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
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    Dec 5, 2013
    Same, I have all new cabling, all home-runs, no unused ports off the single splitter, tested and confirmed good by three technicians, one of which I think really knew his stuff. No tuning-adapter, and even a straight connection from the street with nothing else plugged in, the roamio will get random v58 errors. So, one of two things here, A: firmware issue on cablecard or B: Problem with software on roamio.

    The mini tuning in the channel fine and the roamio giving a v58 at the same time (also vice-versa mini w/ v58 and roamio good), point to the software on the roamio.

    Additionally, tuning six copy-protected simultaneously (confirmed with cci of 0x02) works fine.
     
  9. Dec 27, 2013 #769 of 1187
    HazelW

    HazelW Member

    284
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    Dec 6, 2007
    No. Va
    I have the exact same cablecard and problem you have. BUT, I finally set the Roamio to 5 tuners, turned on suggestions, and let it do its thing. Has recorded many shows without problems. Several times a day I cycle through the 5 tuners and do not get a V58 error. Give it a try.

    I do have a a premier backing up all the shows I really want, but have not needed it.
     
  10. Dec 27, 2013 #770 of 1187
    Jed1

    Jed1 Active Member

    1,260
    16
    Jun 18, 2013
    Frackville, PA.
    I have the security tools myself as they are used heavily here.

    One thing I forgot to mention is the possibility of ingress occurring at the frequency the MoCa band is operating on. This will be from the bands that cell phones operate on. I do not have a chart right now but I do know the up link and down link for the cell phone providers is operating in the MoCa band.

    Long term Evolution 4G from Verizon and At&t is operating right around 800Mhz and I am seeing some corrected errors on the channels in that frequency range. The cable TV industry has no equipment to check for leaks at these high frequencies, only at the FCC mandated VHF band. According to some white papers the 4G signal is picked up by the cable boxes and modems and sent up the distribution system to the first active where it is amplified and sent back down to the customers as noise. It is going to be very difficult to detect and isolate where the ingress is occurring. The cell phone industry wants to claim even more of the TV spectrum for cell phone use which is going to cause even more ingress issues at even lower frequencies.
     
  11. Dec 27, 2013 #771 of 1187
    mike-d

    mike-d New Member

    24
    0
    Dec 12, 2013
    Baltimore,...
    I have the Cisco with the 1.5.2 3001 firmware and occasional unauthorized errors. I just set my roamio to 5 tuners and will see what happens.
     
  12. Dec 28, 2013 #772 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
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    Dec 5, 2013
    Well, I let it ride on five tuners all day today, and still receiving v58 errors on random channels. Today, about 5 channels would not tune on the roamio, but would on the mini's throughout the house. On one mini, seems about 15 in a row would not tune, but would on the roamio.

    Does anyone suggest swapping the cablecard out? (I have four of them standing by)
     
  13. Dec 28, 2013 #773 of 1187
    AdamNJ

    AdamNJ New Member

    387
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    Aug 22, 2013
    Dunellen, NJ
    what card and firmware do u have? sorry if u said it recently, i haven't been keeping up with this thread since it's not very active anymore.
     
  14. Dec 29, 2013 #774 of 1187
    pshivers

    pshivers Retired!

    162
    1
    Nov 4, 2013
    Alhambra, CA
    If you have a CC with firmware ver.152.2401 on it, I'd give that a try with 5 tuners active...
     
  15. Dec 29, 2013 #775 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
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    Dec 5, 2013
    1.5.2.3001 SA Card PKM800

    This post has all my details.
     
  16. Dec 29, 2013 #776 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
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    Dec 5, 2013
    I had two, but when plugged in they automatically upgraded.
     
  17. Dec 29, 2013 #777 of 1187
    pshivers

    pshivers Retired!

    162
    1
    Nov 4, 2013
    Alhambra, CA
    That sucks, but it is what the cable company is suppose to do. In my case apparently Charter does not automatically upgrade CableCards. I have two Roamio's (Std 4 tuner and the Pro) and am running different firmware on the CC's, 152.2401 and 152.1601.

    I think about halfway through this thread there is mention about the 152.3001 FW also being a problem for 6 tuners... TiVo states 152.2801 will work with 6 tuners and the general consensus in this thread is the best solution is for the Cable Companies to upgrade to 153.1101
    Wish I could be more help but like me we are at the mercy of our cable providers. The only good news for me is that Charter has me were I can get 5 tuners with no errors....
     
  18. Dec 29, 2013 #778 of 1187
    AdamNJ

    AdamNJ New Member

    387
    0
    Aug 22, 2013
    Dunellen, NJ
    Try 4 tuners.

    I know according to the original tivo support page article, 1.5.2.2801 was 'good', although we know some users had v58 probs with that, 1.5.2.3001 and 1.5.3.0601.

    We know that 1.5.3.1101 is confirmed good 100%. Originally i had a non 6 tuner cap. 1.5.2.1401, but I was okay with 5 tuners. I also remember that people said 1.5.2.2401 was worse and only 4 tuners would work..
     
  19. Dec 30, 2013 #779 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
    0
    Dec 5, 2013
    I've tried four, and three, same issues. What's weird and I know works, is I can set each of the six tuners to watch different encrypted (0x02 CCI) channels and flip between all six with 'live tv' button, and all six work. However, when randomly changing channels, I'll get the v58 error on random channels, tuning up and down and back, it will magically come in. Also, with a mini sitting right next to the roamio, I can tune to a channel and get v58 error, but on the mini (or viceversa) it comes in fine. Sometimes I get big blocks of channels (10-20) that will show v58, then tuning back to them, some are good, some are not.

    It really is a hit or miss type thing. I don't think it's the lack of six tuner support on the cable card. The Comcast X1 devices seem to not have these issues with channels, and they support up to 8 tuners
     
  20. Dec 30, 2013 #780 of 1187
    jntc

    jntc New Member

    114
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    Dec 5, 2013
    I'm assuming (which is a bad thing) that being able to view 6 encrypted channels on the 6 tuners indicates that 6 tuners are supported.

    So,

    1) Could the v58 issues be firmware 'bugs' (have to wait for new firmware - good luck with that)

    2) Could the cablecard be bad?

    3) Could this be a TIVO issue with tuning the card properly

    (NOTE: I'm not using a TA or SDV)
     

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