1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Tivo's explanation on Mini pricing

Discussion in 'TiVo Mini' started by magnus, Mar 21, 2013.

  1. Mar 21, 2013 #1 of 111
    magnus

    magnus Tivo User

    2,506
    0
    Nov 12, 2004
    Texas
    Here is Tivo's explanation on Mini pricing. I agree with the author and still think it's a bit overpriced for what it is though. I think $150 (total price) would be more reasonable. But what do I know.... I can't even use it with my 2 tuner Premieres anyway. :)

    http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/03/15/tivo-explains-extra-charge-for-the-mini/?smid=tw-share

    http://reviews.cnet.com/digital-media-receivers/tivo-mini/4505-6739_7-35627726-2.html
     
  2. Mar 22, 2013 #2 of 111
    button1066

    button1066 New Member

    140
    0
    Sep 4, 2012
    It's a little too disingenuous for me. The TiVo Stream has no monthly fee nor do the devices running the TiVo apps. Windows Media Center Extenders have no fee (nor does WMC itself). TiVo Desktop has no fee. 'Because we need to make money' is the only logically correct answer but not correct from a marketing point of view.
     
  3. Mar 22, 2013 #3 of 111
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

    19,190
    25
    Jan 31, 2002
    Northern...
    Maybe they made a mistake by not charging a fee for using the Stream. Although I can't use one since I don't own any Apple products.
     
  4. Mar 22, 2013 #4 of 111
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

    3,507
    19
    Sep 19, 2006
    In the ATL
    Pretty much every review comes to the same conclusion regardless of how Tivo tries to spin it - it's 'because we can'.
     
  5. Mar 22, 2013 #5 of 111
    SullyND

    SullyND L:45-21 TCF Club

    8,630
    12
    Dec 30, 2004
    Chicago Burbs
    Do people pester DirecTV and Comcast to justify their fees? AT&T and Verizon? I just don't see why anyone feels there is anything wrong with "because we can". Don't like the fee? Buy lifetime, or don't buy a Mini. Seems pretty simple.

    If TiVo did not have a subscription fee, but only sold it for $250 I wonder if the griping would have been more or less.
     
  6. Mar 22, 2013 #6 of 111
    BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Active Member

    2,782
    9
    Mar 21, 2004
    Complaining about MSO fees is a religion.

    What's wrong with "because we can" is that it's Tivo's version of an arbitrary additional outlet fee. Fans/Consumers/The media hold Tivo to a higher standard than the nickel and dimer MSO's that they very commonly have strong, negative opinions of. Many people have chosen Tivo to avoid these MSO traps, but this is them playing the same game.
     
  7. Mar 22, 2013 #7 of 111
    compnurd

    compnurd New Member

    1,011
    0
    Oct 6, 2011
    They do Pester comcast about the outlet fee as but I completely agree with you. They call have fees and fees and fees for DVR usage, rental HW that is 10 years old and so on
     
  8. Mar 22, 2013 #8 of 111
    DaveDFW

    DaveDFW Member

    523
    0
    Jan 25, 2005
    Richardson, TX
    But providers like Charter, Comcast, Cox, and Time-Warner appear on lists of America's most-hated companies. Tivo is looking to the wrong role models if it wants to have happy customers.

    On their current track, no one will be surprised when Tivo finally succeeds in becoming just another hated company.
     
  9. Mar 22, 2013 #9 of 111
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

    3,507
    19
    Sep 19, 2006
    In the ATL
    Yep, that's pretty much the way I look at it. Oh well, as with everything Tivo all I care about is the total 'lifetime' cost, no matter what games they want to play to come up with it. And $250 is too rich for me right now.

    A lot of others are not liking how they break it down as can be seen from the comments in pretty much every review.
     
  10. Mar 22, 2013 #10 of 111
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

    37,509
    180
    Apr 17, 2000
    Nevada
    I think the reason they don't charge for the Stream is because they plan on building that functionality into the next gen TiVos and they didn't want to have that functionality equated to an extra fee.

    I think the main reason they charge a fee for the Mini is because they can. No matter how similar the equipment is they're not competing with Roku or Apple TV, they're competing with the Dish Hopper, DirecTV genie and similar cable offerings, all of which charge per box. As long as their pricing compares favorably to those options then they are OK.

    You may not like the TiVo Mini pricing, but it's unlikely you'd be able to find another "whole home" solution that was much cheaper. (a MCE HTPC with Ceton Echo might be, but also much harder to manage)
     
  11. Mar 22, 2013 #11 of 111
    magnus

    magnus Tivo User

    2,506
    0
    Nov 12, 2004
    Texas
    I think it would be a much easier pill to swallow for most... if Amazon, Netflix, Vudu, and 2 tuner support were there.
     
  12. Mar 22, 2013 #12 of 111
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

    37,509
    180
    Apr 17, 2000
    Nevada
    Why? None of those services are available on any of those other devices I mentioned either. Except maybe the HTPC/Echo.

    Try to build a whole home DVR from any MSO that has those features and a host DVR with less then 4 tuners. It's not possible.

    The problem is not what the Mini is, it's what people expected it to be. People were expecting a simple streaming box, akin to a Roku, with the ability to stream TiVo recordings. Instead they got something more akin to the extenders offered by the MSOs. Look at the price comparison thread. A TiVo+Mini is very similar to the prices you pay for a comparable MSO offering. So the only thing off here was people's expectations.
     
  13. Mar 22, 2013 #13 of 111
    bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

    3,687
    4
    Oct 31, 2007
    Yes...

    But this is a tough one. Unless you have a P4 device today or are willing to purchase a P4 at the same time, then the Mini isn't a viable product for you.

    Frankly, the offering gets so complicated that I almost think TiVo has put themselves into a bad PR black hole.

    - It has a service fee, only to market it competitively priced with the rest of their product line.
    - It doesn’t offer the same OTT services as the parent systems
    - It doesn’t work with 2 tuner Premiers, because it would be terribly confusing to the average user to either have all their tuners co-oped or have live TV completely unavailable on those systems.
    - It doesn’t have dynamic tuner allocation so you loose a tuner.

    So many decisions seem to be based more on marketing and message control that technical limitations that I can see where it gets very frustrating.

    I do think it is a good product and it will mature and fit nicely into the ecosystem - eventually.
     
  14. Mar 22, 2013 #14 of 111
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

    37,509
    180
    Apr 17, 2000
    Nevada
    All of this will work out eventually. All indications point toward the next gen TiVos having a minimum of 3 tuners (probably 4), even ones that support OTA. Once those are available they will discontinue the current 2 tuner boxes and all confusion about which TiVos will or wont work with a Mini will go away. By that time they should also have dynamic tuner allocation working to avoid that part of the problem.

    As for the OTT services... Netflix is the only one missing right? I assume this is some sort of business issue and not a technical one since the Mini runs the same Air apps as the main TiVo. It could be that TiVo is having some issue on the business side, with the revenue sharing or whatever, that is causing them to disable Netflix until it's sorted out. That could get resolved at any time, or not at all. We'll just have to wait and see on that.
     
  15. Mar 22, 2013 #15 of 111
    bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

    3,687
    4
    Oct 31, 2007
    Is it rude to quote yourself? :)

     
  16. Mar 22, 2013 #16 of 111
    HarperVision

    HarperVision TiVo's Italian Cuz!

    5,275
    3
    May 14, 2007
    Paradise...
    I don't really get all this "it won't work with my 2 tuner blah blah blah" because when you compare it to other service providers offerings like Dish and DirecTV, you can't use the Joey without a Hopper or a C31 Genie Mini Client without the Genie Host now can you? They of course CAN access the recordings from those older gen DVRs, just like the mini! I am coming from DirecTV and I didn't hear them complain it didn't work with their older generation HR24, 23, 22, 21 DVRs. It's new technology, and it marches on.

    Well, I do kind of get it, but it just seems like a pessimistic "glass half empty" type of thing. Being away from TiVo for the last few years, I can say this mini is what may bring me back because I really didn't like the whole home solution and costs of using multiple full fledged TiVos.
     
  17. Mar 22, 2013 #17 of 111
    BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Active Member

    2,782
    9
    Mar 21, 2004
    Tivo misdirected us 10 months ago by saying full 2-tuner support would come once the tuner allocation issue was resolved, and then never updated us on this until now. So the complaint is fair. They're at fault for screwing up those expectations.
     
  18. Mar 22, 2013 #18 of 111
    SullyND

    SullyND L:45-21 TCF Club

    8,630
    12
    Dec 30, 2004
    Chicago Burbs
    Did they?
     
  19. Mar 22, 2013 #19 of 111
    BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Active Member

    2,782
    9
    Mar 21, 2004
  20. Mar 22, 2013 #20 of 111
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

    37,509
    180
    Apr 17, 2000
    Nevada
    Really when? We may have speculated that here on the forum, but I don't think we got much information at all about the Mini or how it would work directly from TiVo.

    We like to speculate a LOT here on the forums. It's not TiVo's fault if we get it wrong.
     

Share This Page