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TiVo Suggestions in the UK - Update

Discussion in 'TiVo Series 1 - UK' started by TiVoPony, Sep 29, 2008.

  1. Sep 29, 2008 #1 of 546
    TiVoPony

    TiVoPony New Member

    2,194
    0
    May 11, 2002
    Alviso,...
    Hi all,

    As I'd mentioned here, we've been investigating why TiVo Suggestions have stopped recording for our Series1 UK customers.

    We now believe this to be due to recent changes in the program data supplied by our provider. While these data changes are necessary and allow the continued recording of your favorite shows, they are incompatible with the TiVo Suggestions feature. As such, TiVo Suggestions will no longer be available as a part of the TiVo Service for Series1 subscribers in the United Kingdom.

    We appreciate all of the support that you've demonstrated over the years for TiVo, and are disappointed that an alternative could not be found. The version 2.5 software is simply incompatible with the new data format we've had to adopt (the new format was necessary as the old format had run out of headspace...there was no room to assign id's to new programs). These identifiers are largely abstracted by the service to prevent this sort of dependency, unfortunately TiVo Suggestions in that early software depends on the actual raw data format (which has now changed).

    Thanks again for your patience as we've worked through identifying the root cause of this issue. Although this situation is regrettable, it was out of TiVo's control. Fortunately, all other core TiVo features are unaffected by these changes.


    Bob Pony

    MOD EDIT: PLEASE NOTE THAT SUGGESTIONS ARE NOW FIXED
     
  2. Sep 29, 2008 #2 of 546
    andyjenkins

    andyjenkins New Member

    258
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    Jul 29, 2001
    England, UK
    I hate to be the pessimist here, but this is sounding ominous.

    Reduced service, but no reduced monthly subscription. Why? because TiVo know no-one will cancel over lack of suggestions.
     
  3. Sep 29, 2008 #3 of 546
    Automan

    Automan Ex TiVo User

    4,184
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    Oct 29, 2000
    South...
    Can we then please have the option to buy a new UK model to replace our old Series 1 units?

    Automan.
     
  4. Sep 29, 2008 #4 of 546
    mikerr

    mikerr TiVoCentral.co.uk

    2,598
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    Jun 2, 2005
    Up North
    :thumbsdown::thumbsdown::thumbsdown:
    A sad day indeed :(

    Thanks for at least letting us know the situation that forced this.

    Meanwhile networked users can use my suggestions hack which schedules its own suggestions based on your thumbs.

    Non-networked users can buy one of my preconfigured drives with it already on :D

    I'll be developing this further now since its will be our only method of regaining suggestion functionality.
    Stay tuned folks !

    Mike
    www.TivoCentral.co.uk
    ________________
    Lost suggestions? Get the new suggestion engine !
     
  5. Sep 29, 2008 #5 of 546
    digital_S

    digital_S New Member

    587
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    May 15, 2002
    Kent/Scotlan...
    Cheers for the update Bob. :up:
    If our version 2.5 is incompatiable, would it not be possible to send out a nice shiney new version to allow the new data format to run on our TiVos?
     
  6. Sep 29, 2008 #6 of 546
    TiVoPony

    TiVoPony New Member

    2,194
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    May 11, 2002
    Alviso,...
    Unfortunately an update for those boxes is not in the cards.

    Pony
     
  7. Sep 29, 2008 #7 of 546
    digital_S

    digital_S New Member

    587
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    May 15, 2002
    Kent/Scotlan...
    Oh Bob, not what we want to hear!! How to lose friends or what :p
    Seriously though, unless a manufacture is willing to take on a new box etc, it doesn't look good for us :( (Whilst you lot across the pond get all the new boxes and updates you require!)
     
  8. Sep 29, 2008 #8 of 546
    Nero2

    Nero2 New Member

    421
    0
    Aug 22, 2005
    UK
    TivoPony (Bob),

    Thanks for the update. As a poor sap who has been faithfully paying my monthly sub for more than I’d care to mention I am very disappointed and feel somewhat cheated.

    Fair enough that any subscribed service provider can legally change the service that they provide, in this case I will be cancelling my monthly sub. To ask a last question, given the ongoing problems with re-enabling UK subscriptions, if I cancel my monthly sub and then wish to re-enable will I be able to do it?

    A sad day indeed.

    Thanks
     
  9. Sep 29, 2008 #9 of 546
    TiVoPony

    TiVoPony New Member

    2,194
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    May 11, 2002
    Alviso,...
    I'm sorry you feel cheated, hopefully the years of service your TiVo has provided you have been worthwhile. It sounds as though that is true, it would be a shame to throw your system out due to this.

    Regarding the account issues, we believe those have been (or are very nearly) resolved. Here's the link to my post:
    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=6723649#post6723649

    I hope you'll stay on with us, even though the box is a bit long in the tooth, those Series1 systems are solid machines.

    Pony
     
  10. Sep 29, 2008 #10 of 546
    TCM2007

    TCM2007 New Member

    3,947
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    Dec 25, 2006
    So they ran out of TMSIDs, and had to move from it being a 16-bit to a 32-bit integer (or something like that). I suggested that the way things started appearing under the wrong Season Passes might be linked to this - sounds like it was, and they started to re-use TMSID numbers, causing problems.

    I wonder if a hack might be created to reassign new TMSIDs to incoming data in the range that our S1s can understand? Or to otherwise edit the guide data back into the old format. Of course I don't have an active TiVo any more so I can't try it!
     
  11. Sep 29, 2008 #11 of 546
    a68oliver

    a68oliver Member

    431
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    Jul 15, 2000
    Crawfordsvil...
  12. Sep 29, 2008 #12 of 546
    Nero2

    Nero2 New Member

    421
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    Aug 22, 2005
    UK
    The machines certainly appear solid, shame about the support.

    Thanks

    Nero
     
  13. Sep 29, 2008 #13 of 546
    cwaring

    cwaring VM Tivo User

    9,015
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    Feb 11, 2002
    Knaresboroug...
    To the bitter end, Bob :)
    I guess they'll never record suggestions again too :(
     
  14. Sep 29, 2008 #14 of 546
    a_tivo_noob

    a_tivo_noob New Member

    213
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    Jan 1, 2004
    thanks for the (admittedly dreadful) news - if nothing else it's good to know where we stand - a lot of companies would drag something like this out and hope 'the user' forgets (or at least gives up!)

    I am knowledgable of databases, but know little about the architecture of them within the Tivo, but I am wondering if 'suggestions' are just a start, and are we soon to have similar problems with recording new programs / season passes, or is it a different kettle of fish?
     
  15. Sep 29, 2008 #15 of 546
    Glen

    Glen New Member

    175
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    May 9, 2004
    South Coast, UK
    Its very sad to read this! So basically what i have sitting under my TV is a glorified PVR! I'm, really fed up with TiVo not giving us a straight answer. Either they are stopping the UK service, or they are gonna update the hardware that i runs on. It does seem as tho our boxes are slowly going to become more and more incompatible, and slowly but surely, the features will disappear one by one. as the US and Oz customers get more, we get less and less. Seriously tho, apart from the snazzy GUI what sets tivo apart from other pvr's now? not much! Thank you TiVo for being upfront with us, and also thank you so much for leaving us out in the cold. SkyHD seems a lot more appealing today............
     
  16. Sep 29, 2008 #16 of 546
    katman

    katman New Member

    355
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    Jun 4, 2002
    East Anglia
    Sadly that looks to be the case but your statement is a bit harsh IMHO.

    Technology moves on and our Series 1 Tivos originate from the time that PCs were running Windows 98. Some people are still using Win98 and dont have access to features and even some hardware that people using XP and Vista do.

    Is it fair to hold back future development for a bunch of machines that would probably all have been replaced by now had we been given the opportunity to buy a more modern machine.

    I have two SKY+ boxes (one controlled by my Lifetime Tivo) and I have to say that I hate SKY+ with a passion. Tivo is definately the best bit of AV Kit I ever bought and as long as it continues to record my programs I will be happy.

    I turned suggestions off shortly after I first got Tivo because with all the family using it at the time it filled up with their choice of program. Since getting SKY+, Tivo has been MINE ALL MINE :)

    I recently upgraded the hard disk and decided to enable suggestions again just as they stopped working so although technically I have lost a feature, because I never really used it I dont expect I will miss it.

    I have had a few fouled up recordings due to wrong data recently but that has been the fault of SKY (Or Discovery/NatGeo) because the recorded banner agrees with what Tivo was trying to record... they just broadcast a different program :(
     
  17. Sep 29, 2008 #17 of 546
    TiVoPony

    TiVoPony New Member

    2,194
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    May 11, 2002
    Alviso,...
    We're not aware of anything that would interfere with the recording features you've mentioned. As I said, the software for the Series1 UK boxes (and all other TiVo DVR's) abstracts the program ID (TMSID) for the scheduling function. We don't use TMSID's, we use our own equivalent TiVo ID's for scheduling. Since TiVo ID's are under our control we don't anticipate this sort of issue impacting the standard recording functions.

    The algorithms used within the software for TiVo Suggestions (in version 2.5 software) unfortunately do not take advantage of this abstraction, they require the actual TMSID's (which have now changed format)...leading to the inability to create or schedule Suggestions on UK Series1 boxes.

    Pony
     
  18. Sep 29, 2008 #18 of 546
    a_tivo_noob

    a_tivo_noob New Member

    213
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    Jan 1, 2004
    cheers for clarification and further explanation Pony :)
     
  19. Sep 29, 2008 #19 of 546
    andonevris

    andonevris New Member

    22
    0
    Oct 23, 2001
    London, ,...
    Damn this is bad news. I'm still on a monthly sub and it looks like this might be the end for me and tivo.

    I'm hoping Mikerr or someone can write a decent suggestions hack.

    It would seem the fat lady is doing her vocal warmup......
     
  20. Sep 30, 2008 #20 of 546
    kitschcamp

    kitschcamp Tweaked and poked

    1,845
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    May 18, 2001
    Adelaide,...
    They are, and I love mine to bits - I've yet to find a PVR that works anywhere near as well and reliably as the TiVo does. But... they will fail, and also in these days of energy conservation the energy requirements for a set top box and a TiVo are quite high.

    There is a market out there for TiVo. I know my Swedish friends are incredibly jealous of the UK having one. By the look of the Nero/TiVo deal there is a possibility there for a new UK and "worldwide" option. I hope that comes off, because I know plenty of people who'd be rushing off to the website now to order it!

    Yesterday I was in a satellite store in Malmö, Sweden. I was getting spares for my dish. At the next counter a man was asking for advice about receiving British TV in Sweden. The man behind the counter advised him not to buy a Sky+ box but a normal Sky box and a TiVo... That says a lot.
     

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