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Tivo Series 3 - Bad capacitors in power supply

Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by johnsom, Jul 25, 2011.

  1. Matterhorn

    Matterhorn New Member

    3
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    Jan 23, 2013
    I thought the unit was connected to a UPS, but it isn't. It's on a rather large surge protector that is behind our TV unit, so I thought it was a UPS. I don't own a voltmeter, but I will see if I can get my hands on one. Is there a list of problems that I can start to eliminate? I am pretty sure that it is not the hard drive. The rebooting continued after installation of a new hard drive. When the problem of rebooting started several months ago, I noticed that it happened a lot when we used NetFlix or Amazon. The unit would freeze or reboot. Then it started happening with TV shows, and has been rebooting more frequently. Now, we can't watch anything for more than a minute or two before it reboots.
     
  2. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    If the reboots are getting closer and closer together, that pretty much rules out random blips on the incoming AC wires.

    You should go ahead and run the manufacturer's diagnostic long test on both the old drive and the replacement, but unless there's something going wrong on the TiVo's motherboard itself, which I definitely am not going to be able to diagnose long distance, I suspect the power supply getting increasingly flaky, almost certainly due to "capacitor plague", even if they aren't showing visible signs of it.

    Click on my user name and search my comments for the last month and you'll find at least one long one where I detail how to measure the voltage on the +12 and +5 lines, both with and without the drive hooked up.

    Also, you can remove cable, cable cards and network connections and anything else plugged into the back panel except the power cord and a composite video lead (yellow RCA jack) to simplify what's drawing power and see if that makes a difference in how often the reboots happen--if it gives you more uptime, then it's almost certainly the power supply.
     
  3. rickertk

    rickertk Not quite new Member

    1,484
    0
    Jan 23, 2002
    Suburban...
    So I'm fairly sure this is affecting me as well. My Series3 (2006, OLED display) went into a reboot loop this morning - it would take the kickstart codes but not actually start the kickstart routines. I unplugged it for the day. This evening, I just get ticking from the power supply when plugged in, and the fan doesn't power on. (I have the case off, so I'm sure of where the ticking is from). By feel, 3 of my capacitors have a bulged top - C401, C402(? I can't see the label, but it's immediately adjacent to C401), and C701. From the sounds of it, I need to get a Torx T8 (I have a 10, and several larger sizes, but not an 8), and I could probably stand a beefier soldering iron if I wanted to try replacing the caps myself - for that matter, where are people buying caps?

    Keith
     
  4. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
    2
    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    ATTENTION CAPACITOR REPLACERS

    Electrolytic capacitors have polarity markings for a very good reason, be careful not to install the new ones backwards.

    So far I've seen people mention getting Low ESR caps from Mouser, digi-key, their local Fry's and on Amazon.

    If you're near Raleigh, I can hook you up with a guy...

    Also badcaps.net and lcdalternatives.com warrant your consideration.
     
  5. HerronScott

    HerronScott Well-Known Member

    2,791
    29
    Jan 1, 2002
    Staunton, VA
    Keith,

    Check out my post 61 in this thread. I got mine at Digikey.

    Scott
     
  6. rickertk

    rickertk Not quite new Member

    1,484
    0
    Jan 23, 2002
    Suburban...
    Thanks, I just placed an order with them. Your catalog #s were not in stock, so I had to navigate my way through to something that looked about right (match to capacitance and voltage, decent rated lifetime, right style for putting onto the board. Hope I get something workable.

    Keith
     
  7. HerronScott

    HerronScott Well-Known Member

    2,791
    29
    Jan 1, 2002
    Staunton, VA
    Keith,

    Other than the specs you mentioned, they other key requirement is a low ESR rating.

    Scott
     
  8. rickertk

    rickertk Not quite new Member

    1,484
    0
    Jan 23, 2002
    Suburban...
    On the Digikey site, does - in the ESR field indicate low, or not available (if you know)? If that indicates low, then I should be ok. If not, then I'm not sure what to go with.

    Keith
     
  9. rickertk

    rickertk Not quite new Member

    1,484
    0
    Jan 23, 2002
    Suburban...
    Woohoo! My Tivo is back up and running, having replaced the 3 apparently failed (all bulging) capacitors in the power board. I way overpaid for shipping for the capacitors (especially since Digikey's estimate was way lower than what they charged) but still out less than I would be for a board, and I have that sense of accomplishment. I don't know about anyone else, but it was much easier getting a new cap soldered in than it was getting the old ones out - maybe that's where a better desoldering braid would have been most useful.

    Keith
     
  10. Mikeyis4dcats

    Mikeyis4dcats Active Member

    3,728
    10
    Oct 2, 2003
    Looks like I'm joining the club. One of the smaller caps on my HD is slightly domed and I'm gray screened. Is there a "map" anywhere of the various caps on the board and the specs of each?
     
  11. HerronScott

    HerronScott Well-Known Member

    2,791
    29
    Jan 1, 2002
    Staunton, VA
    What are the part numbers and manufacturer of the power supply in your HD and do you have the number of the capacitor (Cxxx) that's bulging?

    Scott
     
  12. Mikeyis4dcats

    Mikeyis4dcats Active Member

    3,728
    10
    Oct 2, 2003
    The cap is number C31. Model ST7002-BW0G by AC Bel.


    Looks like it was actually a hard drive failure, as the original drive boots up, but I might as well replace the cap while I've got it open.
     
  13. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    Any cap that is not absolutely, positively perfectly flat on the top needs replacing, regardless of any other problems the TiVo might have.
     
  14. HerronScott

    HerronScott Well-Known Member

    2,791
    29
    Jan 1, 2002
    Staunton, VA
    That appears to match what's in my TiVo HD. Note that I've only replaced the capacitors in one of my S3 OLED's but while I was upgrading the hard drive in our TiVo HD, I wrote down the capacitor information for future reference.

    TiVo S3 HD capacitor list:
    Acbel Polytech: ST7002-BW0G
    TiVo PN: SPWR-00011-000 Rev B0

    C14 2200uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C222 P14402-ND $1.01
    C27 2200uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C222 P14402-ND $1.01
    C17 2200uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C222 P14402-ND $1.01
    C31 1000uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C102L P14397-ND $0.71

    C15 1000uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FM0J102 P12340-ND $0.51
    C20 470uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C471 P14383-ND $0.49 (Alternate: P15342CT-ND?)

    Can you compare these to what are in yours? It would be good to get someone that has replaced them in an HD to verify as well.

    Scott
     
  15. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC

    That thing next to C27 is probably C17, both of which are on the 5V rail, as is C20.

    C31 is on the 12V rail.

    More later, when I clear some bench space.
     
  16. Mikeyis4dcats

    Mikeyis4dcats Active Member

    3,728
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    Oct 2, 2003

    from what I see they appear the same, although I cannot see anything on C31 except "L42 105*C" "7508D 16v"


    looking on Digikey, I see EEU-FR1C102L P14397-ND listed as "ESR -". Does that mean it is or isn't low ESR?
     
  17. unitron

    unitron Active Member

    16,390
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    Apr 28, 2006
    semi-coastal NC
    Mouser says the Panasonic EEU-FR1C102L P14397-ND is low ESR

    My notes say C31 on the ST7002 is a 1000uF 16V, and it's across the +12V output.
     
  18. harry99

    harry99 dls956

    30
    0
    Aug 19, 2010
    After just taking Tivo deal to upgrade an HD to a Premiere 4 and get a lifetime on the HD for $99 - the HD stopped working within 4 days. Similar problem to another in thread where it starts powering up with Welcome Screen, and after 20 - 30 secs goes black and then starts up over again. Have a Hitachi 1TB drive installed 3yrs ago - haven't tested that yet. Don't see any bulging or leaking capacitors. Tivo support thinks power supply problem likely. Any thoughts on how to isolate the problem? Anything to listen for? Meanwhile I'll try to test the Hitachi drive.

    Thanks.
     
  19. Mikeyis4dcats

    Mikeyis4dcats Active Member

    3,728
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    Oct 2, 2003
    wow! are you me? Aside from mine crapping out about 2 weeks later, this is my story, including the Hitachi 1TB drive. I do have one cap with a very very slight bulge, but it was my drive that crashed.
     
  20. jrtroo

    jrtroo User

    4,065
    6
    Feb 4, 2008
    Yes- read this entire thread and test that hard drive. Others may recommend putting in the old drive and see what happens. Personally, I would test the Hitachi one before putting in the old drive to eliminate that as a possibility.

    Different drives have different current pulls and reactions to low voltage conditions. So I would not expose a known good drive to a potential voltage problem, if you could avoid it.
     

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