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TiVo Mini Review Roundup

Discussion in 'TiVo Mini' started by Peter Redmer, Mar 12, 2013.

  1. atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    Well kind of. The review starts out correctly identifying that the Mini is not a stand alone product and that it is equivalent to a Dish Network Joey.

    After that I consider the review is somewhat of a failure. They just stated it wasn't a stand alone product and then go on to review it like it is a stand alone product - which to me means the reviewer doesn't know what he is reviewing.

    The Mini is part of a whole home digital cable DVR system. For the review to be useful to someone looking into a whole home DVR system the review needs to be reviewing the enter whole home system, not just one part of it that doesn't even function without the rest of the system.

    I got the impression that they don't actually care about whole home DVR systems at all as they decided without actually reviewing the "whole system" that the Mini would do nothing to bring new subscribers to TiVo.

    Frankly if someone had done a similar writeup about the Dish Network Joey and not reviewed it with the whole home Hopper DVR system everyone would have thought the review was a joke.
     
  2. HarperVision

    HarperVision TiVo's Italian Cuz!

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    Paradise...
    Well said and exactly on point!
     
  3. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    I felt differently. I thought it looked from the 'non-TiVo" perspective at general feature/function. It mentions the dedication of a tuner, the small amount of interaction, the fact that you can only see "that tuner" and not other XL4/P4 tuners, content across the devices, etc.
     
  4. sbiller

    sbiller Active Member

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    +1. :up:

    I just went back and re-read all the reviews that are linked to the gdgt.com review.

    Josh Goldman at Cnet provides the most balanced review which he has updated significantly since it was originally published. Ben (@bjdraw) wrote a good review as well. Dave's review is solid as well. Most/all of the remaining reviews reflect a fundamental misunderstanding of the product and incorrectly compare the Mini to a Roku or ATV.

    JMHO...
     
  5. atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    I am not looking at it form a TiVo point of view I am looking at it from what I think someone should be reviewing when they review a whole home DVR system point of view.

    The reviewer just wanted to talk to much about things that are just not part of whole home DVR system at this time. It was clear he wants a wireless system and one that centers around IP/Internet Streaming services. Nothing wrong with that but how does that help anyone understand what is actually available and what the differences are in the various whole home DVR systems currently being offered?

    In my opinion a good review provides details about the product being reviewed but also provides bench mark references comparing it to other competing products. This review did not do that because they really didn't want to talk about whole home DVR systems but appeared to be dreaming about some mystical product that doesn't exist.
     
  6. bdraw

    bdraw Member

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    I'm really not sure what you are talking about here. I said there were a few missing pieces but TiVo owners wouldn't mind waiting for them. I'm not sure what would be more accurate.
     
  7. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    FWIW, I actually thought your review was also pretty accurate - though I do think it reflects a far more "Tivo Centric" view. I still think that the PCMag review is also accurate, as it is viewing it from a "general market" perspective.

    I just don't think people adequately understand the difference.
     
  8. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    I think that's the point here. We don't agree on what constitutes a "whole home" point of view. Yours is Tivo centric. PCMag is not. You're not wrong. Neither are they. Different viewpoints.

    And that IS the point. 10 years ago, we wouldn't even be talking about Amazon streaming downloads, Roku, Hulu+. Do you really think those changes will not continue?
     
  9. sbiller

    sbiller Active Member

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    Actually I re-read your statement,

    I basically interpreted that you believe the Mini is inferior to Ceton's Echo, Dish's Joey, and DTV's RVU client. I can't really compare since I haven't used the other three and you have. I can say the Mini is an improvement over the majority of cable operator provided whole-home experiences.

    Sorry for the confusion. I'm editing the above post for accuracy.
     
  10. atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    A review either actually reviews the product being offered or they don't. This review was as much or more about wanting a different product as reviewing the one being offered.

    Sorry but Rokus have nothing to do with digital cable whole home DVR systems, just like a blu-ray players has nothing to do with a digital cable whole home DVR system, neither are DVRs or are designed to provide digital cable throughout ones home.

    Now if someone wants to write a review about different sources of video and includes a section on the hardware needed for each video source that is fine the hardware might even be a major factor in deciding which video source someone is going to use but that is not what this review was doing.

    I get that many people want TiVo to build something they are not building that is fine so do I. But the reality is they are building DVRs with some addition features and the Mini is part of TiVos whole home digital cable DVR system not something else. Either someone wants a digital cable whole home DVR system or they do not, if they do they can evaluate if what TiVo is offering is the best for them or not.
     
  11. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    We will have to agree to disagree. And the point is you have an opinion as to what the review (and apparently the product) should be. Others don't agree, including the person who reviewed it. The fact that you have a different opinion and viewpoint in no way diminishes the value of that review. You just don't like it. Part of that review just might have been a reflection that the reviewer thinks Tivo is missing the mark on where the industry and the market is going...... Hmmmmmm......
     
  12. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    In your opinion. In one respect it is inferior. That is, the requirement to dedicate a (now non-recording) tuner from the DVR. We hope that will be corrected. If it is, then I would agree that the Mini is IMHO better. Not until then. And only (again) if one is willing to overlook the investment necessary to use the Mini, which is not required for the alternative.
     
  13. atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    Does your cable provider offer a 4 tuner whole home DVR?

    A TWC whole home DVR (only 2 tuners) and 2 STBs offers the same amount of tuners as a Premiere 4 and 2 Minis regardless how you setup tuner sharing. As far as I can remember everyone who has said what their cable provider provides has indicate they only have dual tuner whole home DVRs.

    Regarding paying up front or monthly that is a personal preference. However with credit options and monthly or lifetime service options Tivo purchasers have choices, cable equipment renters do not.
     
  14. moyekj

    moyekj Well-Known Member

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    Mission...
    Supposedly Q1 of this year (which is just about ending) Cox was going to launch a 6-tuner, 2TB whole home DVR solution with capability for individual user profiles and viewing on mobile devices:
    http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2013-01/new-coxcisco-guide-shows-promise-reveals-kinks/#
    Of course it's still vaporware as I haven't seen any other info on it but since the Satellite companies and U-verse already offer 4+ tuner solutions they have to try and keep pace.
     
  15. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    No, VZ does not at this time. You're quoting TWC and your contract, and I am aware of VZ and my contract as well as Comcast. As stated before, since at least a good deal of VZ customers have a first DVR free for life, then a second DVR can add 2 more tuners easily. Then, the STB's provide tuners in addition to access to content stored elsewhere.

    Regarding payment, that IS a personal preference, however you are far too cavalier with that attitude. Many people have limited means or don't want to tie up credit cards with such payments. Further, when doing that you have the worst of both worlds. You are committed to Tivo, but still making monthly payments, at the same time as remaining responsible for repairs. It is NOT the same as a month to month, no obligation, capability to add, subtract, or simply eliminate that equipment at any time.

    From a monthly service option, it is very very hard to find a measurement that allows Tivo to not be more expensive if you stay that way. Plus, you're STILL locked into a minimum of a one year obligation. So no matter what, with Tivo you are locked in. With MSO you are not. Period.

    I find it interesting that so many are unwilling to recognize that not everyone is as fortunate as they are, or that not everyone values the Tivo relationship that much. Tivo - and MSO DVRs - consume disposable income. Many - if not MOST - people are not willing to have a long term commitment of such a size in this matter. For that, I assume I don't need to provide backup data, as the pure gross sales of Tivo compared to the combined DVR lease numbers of the MSOs, would kind of point in that direction, no?
     
  16. HenryFarpolo

    HenryFarpolo New Member

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    Verizon currently does not offer a 4 tuner DVR, and nothing resembling the TIVO MINI. They do offer a whole home DVR, but you need a full sized HD or DVR box to use that application.

    With the implementation of their "Media Server", Verizon will be offering six available tuners, and small satellite boxes. This will happen this year, hopefully.
     
  17. cherry ghost

    cherry ghost Active Member

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    Since Cox doesn't have a 4 tuner host, the number of tuners is the same
     
  18. atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    Well several people with VZ here have posted they do not get a free DVR and a Person just posted he is getting one for 1 Yr. So I have no idea - frankly people with access to VZ are very lucky competition is a great thing but last I saw VZ had less than 5 million cable customers and has all but stop expanding so there are not that many lucky people compared to the 100 million plus house holds in the U.S.

    Well commitments are not that unusually satellite is 2 years some cable companies require them now also to get the best deals, my phone company requires 1 year for their DSL or phone deals and charges a disconnect fee.

    maybe you are maybe you are not depends on where you are and what is going on at the moment. Really does not matter to me as I would give up TV before I gave up a DVR so being able to turn one in would be of no value to me. The reality is most people are not giving up pay TV and if they value a DVR are not going to give that up either.

    My belief is that people who value DVRs are going to have a DVR for the long term. Of course not everyone values a DVR but the people I know with DVRs have no thought of giving them up so long term commitment or not they are going to pay for them long term.
     
  19. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    And people here posted that they didn't pay the full $499 for lifetime when they didn't have a qualifying box, and others (according to Tivo) do. Don't understand the point. Things are different in different places . Up front costs remain the same no matter what.

    Who cares of "commitments are not than unusual". The point is that the commitment for Tivo is pretty heavy. Up front investment PLUS service costs. And the alternatives don't. I'm not saying that makes Tivo terrible. I'm saying that regardless of "your" personal opinion, it is a factor, and one that is not in Tivos favor.

    And your reality is flawed. What you state is your opinion. Not reality. More people ARE giving up pay TV. Entertainment is fundamentally changing as we speak. The younger generations are choosing to give up home phones in favor of a single cell phone, pay cable in favor of online content, etc. It is even changing the face of advertisement. Who knows how it will end up.

    And your belief is for you - not for the general public. Here are some interesting links that illustrate actual data, as opposed to the common viewpoints often shared on this site. We are NOT representative of the general marketplace. Also, note in much of this, the term "DVR" also includes game consoles with the ability to record entertainment content, and is NOT restricted to what we consider DVR (ie, Tivo or MSO DVR).

    http://www.deloitte.com/view/en_GX/...d210VgnVCM2000001b56f00aRCRD.htm#.UVZA3N3D9wE

    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/study-pay-tv-industry-sees-422987

    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/nielsen-5-million-zero-tv-427247

    Looks like analysts, data, and trends do not support your position here.
     
  20. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    The number of recording tuners, you are right. I misread the way you posted it. I had 3 time 2 for tuners. I'm assuming you mean one dual tuner box, and 3 STB, correct? That does change it. You do have the ability in that scenario to have more different channels displayed at one time, but that isn't likely a real advantage.
     

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