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TiVo Mini Review Roundup

Discussion in 'TiVo Mini' started by Peter Redmer, Mar 12, 2013.

  1. Loach

    Loach New Member

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    Jan 11, 2013
    Omaha, NE
    I have as many tuners as I need. I've only allocated 1 tuner for live viewing on minis, because I'm the only one in our house that uses the minis for viewing live TV. I can't very well watch TVs in 2 different rooms at the same time. And 3 tuners is plenty for our household's recording needs. I'm not willing to pay Cox for more tuners that I don't really need.

    Paying 100% upfront is absolutely irrelevant to me. I manage my money well, so if I identify a product that I find value in and fits with my budget, I simply buy it.
     
  2. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Jan 31, 2002
    Northern...
    Where is my free DVR on FiOS? I've been with them since Summer 2007. I've asked more than once and the result is the same. When I ask about a DVR they said it will cost me $17 a month. That I could not get a free one. If I could get a free one I would have picked one up a long time ago just to have it for VOD. But the cheapest I could get it was $10 and that was just for a STB without DVR features. Which does work the same for VOD but is still not free. And whether a DVR or a regular STB, they are not worth me getting one unless it costs me nothing.

    EDIT: I just looked online again at FiOS. Not only is it still not free but the STB is now $12 a month. The DVR is still $17. But nowhere near free.
     
  3. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

    3,687
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    Oct 31, 2007
    I do not have a free FIOS DVR either. I was paying a monthly fee for a pretty nasty STB just to keep on-demand, but I ended up turning that back in as well. The button refresh rates were so bad you had to memorize the menu hierarchy and just click and walk away – seriously… I am sure it has gotten better by now, at least I hope it has.

    I do realize that some new customer packages have a DVR included as an incentive, but that is far from a universal option. I also do not believe that once you want to upgrade that "free" DVR in the future that it will be free.

    On the other hand - it is a generous loss leader from Verizon if you are a new customer.
     
  4. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    Dec 1, 2007
    I'm a FiOS customer, since 2007, and have a free DVR. I am waiting delivery of my "upgrade" DVR (also at no cost). I received via email the tracking number of that DVR upgrade today. I realize not everyone "can" or "did" get that. I cannot explain who does, and who does not. But the fact that some people can (and do) must be weighed just as heavily as the fact that some of us have reported great resale value of our existing Tivo equipment with lifetime. Or that some of us have never reported a device failure. Or that some of us have had multiple device failures.

    Again, saying this for clarity: I do no, will not, and have have, said that there are not situations where IF YOU SPEND OUT OF POCKET MONEY UP FRONT you can end up with a lower pro-rated cost per month with Tivo. That certainly can, and does happen. However, what many of you are apparently unwilling to admit in spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, is that it is just as possible to see scenarios where Tivo IS more expensive EVEN if you spend the up front money.

    I also think that people here are being extremely arrogant by diminishing the impact of having to pay that cash up front. Just because you, and I, are in a position where we find that to be acceptable and have the means, that is most certainly NOT the case for many many many people.

    I'll say it again. Obviously paying up front is not terribly relevant to ANYONE here. Otherwise, there would be nobody on this site because that's what Tivo requires. I could care less if it's relevant to somebody in this thread or not. What it IS relevant to is the general public, and let me assure you, the general public is what drives the market, and what drives whether Tivo remains viable or not. If you think the fanatics on this site could financially support Tivo, you are most sadly mistaken.
     
  5. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

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    Dec 1, 2007
    I'm very happy that you have as many tuners as you need, but that is meaningless. The facts in the comparison are that there are significant differences in the two systems that you are comparing. It means nothing to anyone else that you don't personally need those tuners that you lost. Others aren't making decisions based on your personal requirements. They're doing it based on theirs. That additionally goes for the paying up front part. As I've mentioned elsewhere, if we eliminated everyone on this site who could not "pay up front" the site would be absolutely empty. It is not our own personal capabilities we're discussing. It's the market.

    And the facts of the market, as it exists today, proves emphatically that the requirement to pay up front is a constraint and that people in general simply do not appreciate or endorse it. There is no argument on this planet that gets around that fundamental truth.
     
  6. Loach

    Loach New Member

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    Jan 11, 2013
    Omaha, NE
    There are inherent differences in any comparison of two products that are not commodities. You're extrapolating your own opinions to the entire market. Your opinion apparently is that everybody needs 6 tuners. That's just objectively false.

    I've simply provided a data point based on my individual circumstances. Although it's possible to get up to 6 tuners with Cox's WHDVR system, many customers are not doing so, because they don't want to manage 3 DVRs and don't need 6 tuners. The Cox WHDVR users that I know have two 2-tuner "master" DVRs and 1 or 2 extenders - so they have the same 4 tuners that I have. And by the way, if I wanted 6 tuners, I could have added a 2-tuner Premiere instead of one of my Minis for an additional $300 with lifetime. That would increase my breakeven period from 29 months to 36 months. Whoop-dee-doo.
     
  7. lessd

    lessd Active Member

    7,698
    5
    Jan 23, 2005
    CT
    The biggest reason friends of mine don't use TiVo are as follows:
    Hassle factor with Cable Cards VS cable co. DVR no Cable Card hassle
    Unit stops working for any reason, must call TiVo or me VS just call Cable co and it will get fixed at no extra cost.
    Upgrades with TiVo requires selling on E-Bay, or having me sell it for them on E-Bay VS just call the cable co and get a free upgrade.
    Price is not any issue for my friends, at least in terms of TiVos cost to that of the cable co DVR, my friends (who do use TiVo) and myself use TiVo because we like the product, and the record time can be upgraded (by me again).
    We all use Lifetime service and use the TiVo for 3 to 7 years, then sell them on E-Bay to fund a large part of the purchase price of newer TiVo models.
    Because of the cable card hassle I don't talk up TiVo anymore to my friends as I don't want to take on any more TiVo responsible for others, I now have five of my friends using TiVo that all I want.
    IMHO I don't think price is the biggest factor in TiVo not selling more units, except for some on this form nobody can figure out the cost of a cable co DVR as some are free, some have special deals, some people pay $ 7 to $9 per month for each extra cable card and A/O cost, I pay $1.15/month per card, (no A/O cost) don't know why but friends have the same cable system and pay $6.95 per card per month (after the first if no cable box) so cost is so different for everybody I don't think anybody can do a accurate costing between TiVo and a cable co DVR setup that would apply to most people.
    Another factor is power usage, the TP uses about 25 watts, the Mini used about 5 watts, and some cable co DVRs use 45 or more watts, each watt cost about 10 cents per month (at 15 cents per KWH), so in my case at one time I had 7 Series 2s in my home at 45 watts each = 315 watts, now I have 3 Q4s and a Mini (still have 7 tuners) and I am using 80 watts, that a savings of about $23 to $24 per month in power for me.
    YMMV
     
  8. cherry ghost

    cherry ghost Active Member

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    Sep 13, 2005
    Chicago
    I didn't think Cox had a 4 tuner host, only 2. Maybe it's new.
     
  9. moyekj

    moyekj Well-Known Member

    11,151
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    Jan 23, 2006
    Mission...
    Last I checked their "Whole Home" DVR was only 2 tuner as well (and only 500GB). The only reason it gets "Whole Home" distinction is because of MoCA connection to client set top boxes. But last I checked you could not even have 2 "Whole Home" DVRs talking to each other which is just stupid. On top of all that they charged for a truck roll installation of "Whole Home" DVR to make sure your coax + splitters, etc. can properly support MoCA and it wasn't cheap either.
     
  10. todd_j_derr

    todd_j_derr Member

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    Jun 6, 2000
    Pittsburgh,...
    FWIW, when I signed up for FiOS in 2011 they had several "deals" for new customers w/2 year commitment. One was "free DVR for life". The one I took was "crappy SD box for life" plus a $545 prepaid VISA card. So, at least in that case I can put an upfront cost to their DVR.
     
  11. Loach

    Loach New Member

    376
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    Jan 11, 2013
    Omaha, NE

    They don't. You can have up to three 2-tuner DVRs which is the only way you'd get to 6 tuners with them.
     
  12. moyekj

    moyekj Well-Known Member

    11,151
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    Jan 23, 2006
    Mission...
    Which also means paying about $18/month for each and they don't even talk to each other.
     
  13. Loach

    Loach New Member

    376
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    Jan 11, 2013
    Omaha, NE
    You're right. I think the $15 Whole Home DVR fee applies separately to each DVR (otherwise the cost of a client box would be the same as the cost of another DVR at $8.50 per month, which makes no sense). So each Cox DVR costs $23.50 per month ($15 DVR service fee + $8.50 equipment rental) and each Cox client is $8.50 (equipment rental only). My previous analysis was essentially comparing a 2-tuner Cox WHDVR system to my 4-tuner Tivo setup.

    So the revised Cox WHDVR cost per month in my analysis to get 4 DVR tuners goes even higher:

    Whole home DVR service - $15.00 x 2 - $30
    WHDVR receivers $8.50 x 3 = $25.50
    Subtotal - $55.50
    Less - $1.99 for Cablecard
    Net incremental cost - $53.51
    Tax @ 7% - 3.75
    Total with tax - $57.26

    And with my Tivo cost of $1,191, my breakeven period is now ($1,191 / 57.26) = only 21 months!
     
  14. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

    1,404
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    Dec 1, 2007
    Wow, I'm not sure how you're making that math. My current setup with Tivo is well over $2000 including lifetime.

    BTW, if anyone is saying those HDs with lifetime are worth $300, I've had one on eBay. No takers at either a $250 starting bid or $300 buy it now. Auction ends tomorrow. Seems as though maybe the resale value is in fact dropping. Who knows.
     
  15. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

    19,194
    27
    Jan 31, 2002
    Northern...
    It cost you over $2k for a Premiere 4 and two Minis(all with lifetime)?

    It should be a whole lot less than that.
     
  16. Arcady

    Arcady Stargate Fan

    3,960
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    Oct 14, 2004
    Philadelphia...
    I can't find any lifetime TiVo HD boxes on eBay that end tomorrow and have a $300 buy-it-now price. Did you put the word "lifetime" in the title? If not, nobody will ever find it.
     
  17. jmpage2

    jmpage2 New Member

    1,951
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    Jan 20, 2004
    I sold a stock 160GB TiVo HD box in October for $300 + shipping on eBay. Last week (literally) I sold a 2nd one that I popped a $20 750GB WD drive in. That one sold for $349. It helps if you clearly state it has Lifetime AND you keep all of the original boxes and accessories.

    If you look at sold listings for TiVo HD, you will see that very few of them sell for much less than $275 if they are working.
     
  18. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

    1,404
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    Dec 1, 2007
  19. wmhjr

    wmhjr Well-Known Member

    1,404
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    Dec 1, 2007
    3 Tuners are insufficient. A single Premier XL with a mini is not a solution.
     
  20. Arcady

    Arcady Stargate Fan

    3,960
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    Oct 14, 2004
    Philadelphia...
    Oh okay, 1 day and 20 hours out. I guess I didn't scroll far enough.

    You have virtually no description, no detailed pictures, and no mention of any included remote/cables/accessories or original box. The one picture you do have shows the unit tossed into a dusty cabinet. To top it off, you have a stock 160GB hard drive.

    If you had about 10 more pictures taken in a clean environment, listed what comes with the unit (or doesn't) and threw a 500GB+ drive in it, you'd get $300 in a few hours on eBay.
     

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