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Tivo is blaming V53 error on SNR ratio?

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by barrett14, Oct 21, 2013.

  1. Dec 18, 2013 #61 of 112
    DigitalDawn

    DigitalDawn Member

    181
    1
    Apr 26, 2009
    Jupiter, FL
    My guess is that it was the cable card and not the TiVo.

    Glad the new hardware is working now.
     
  2. Jan 16, 2014 #62 of 112
    Keddie

    Keddie New Member

    2
    0
    Apr 10, 2009
    Just got a new Pro as I'm switching back to TiVo and the box gives me V53 errors all over the place. Signal Strenght is 93% with SNR around 36-39 and TiVo CS is also blaming the provider. Interesting note I did not get the same errors with Frontier FIOS as the provider but now have issues with Comcast. We are in the process of moving to Comcast due to the lack of On Demand with FIOS but now I must reconsider.

    FIOS signal was 98% with SNR of 40-42 and didn't appear to have the problem. I'll put it back onto the Frontier signal tonight to see if the errors come back.
     
  3. Jan 16, 2014 #63 of 112
    ahwman

    ahwman Member

    236
    1
    Jan 24, 2013
    Are you using a tuning adapter? If so, Motorola or Cisco?
     
  4. Jan 19, 2014 #64 of 112
    Cap'n Preshoot

    Cap'n Preshoot New Member

    72
    0
    Apr 25, 2011
    Katy, TX
    I don't have a T/A. However I have the V53 errors frequently. My signal strength was 90% and SNR was 36. Today I put a 10db pad inline which dropped the signal strength to 82% and 33db SNR. I'll run like this for a while & report back. :)
     
  5. Jan 21, 2014 #65 of 112
    shrike4242

    shrike4242 Member

    276
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    Nov 30, 2006
    Saint Louis, MO
    I had this come up when troubleshooting a Tivo Premiere whose tuners had gone belly up (numerous V58 errors with a paired CC + TA, channels that should have been SD were being tuned as their HD versions and other oddities) and Tivo suggested that having a 36-38db SNR was an issue and that it was running too hot. They suggested putting a 2-way splitter in-line to the Tivo to cut down the SNR as they wanted 32-35db.

    What's a good source people have found for in-line attenuators instead of using a splitter?

    One option I've found by random Google search:
    http://www.markertek.com/CATV-Headend-Interface/RF-Attenuators/Pico-Digital/PPFAM-3.xhtml
     
  6. Jan 22, 2014 #66 of 112
    c3

    c3 TiVoholic

    3,067
    0
    Sep 8, 2000
    Silicon...
    eBay, for <$4 shipped.
     
  7. Jan 22, 2014 #67 of 112
    Keddie

    Keddie New Member

    2
    0
    Apr 10, 2009
    So line tech came out again and found the signal to my Tivo was too weak. After adding an amplifier to the line the V53 errors are gone but now I still have pixelation all over the place. WTF is going on here?
     
  8. Jan 23, 2014 #68 of 112
    simon7

    simon7 New Member

    45
    0
    Mar 26, 2008
    So... replaced the Roamio, 4 sets of cable cards, and a tech visit, yet I'm still having the same problems. I really messed up not dumping the whole Roamio concept within the first 30 days. And, previously, I had three working Premieres/HDs on the same lines for years. WTF?
     
  9. Jan 23, 2014 #69 of 112
    ahwman

    ahwman Member

    236
    1
    Jan 24, 2013

    I completely understand your frustration as I've been dealing with a very similar issue among others since I purchased my Roamio Pro. There are many people having these types of issues and TiVo is going to have to find a fix as this is simply unacceptable to deliver a product to the masses that doesn't function correctly. At this time, TiVo is working with my cable company to resolve my tuning adapter issues which forces me to power-cycle my TA every few days as I keep losing all of my SDV channels. My cable company has been able to review the log files from my TA and can prove this is a TiVo issue - so perhaps this will prompt TiVo to FINALY accept responsibility for the problem and take the necessary steps to resolve it. Think back to the days of suggestions not recording with a TA attached and TiVo blamed the cable companies for blocking tuning requests (too funny). Low and behold they finally pushed out a patch to fix the problem. Hopefully this will play out the same way...
     
  10. Jan 23, 2014 #70 of 112
    rogmatic

    rogmatic New Member

    177
    0
    Sep 17, 2009
    There is no question that the additional tuners cause issues with the signal. The HD is rock solid. The Premiere is pretty good. The Premiere 4 tuner has major issues. I am curious whether the 6 tuner Roamio is an improvement on the 4 tuner Premiere or it if it is just worse. Any thoughts?
     
  11. Jan 23, 2014 #71 of 112
    shrike4242

    shrike4242 Member

    276
    0
    Nov 30, 2006
    Saint Louis, MO
    So, just to make sure I'm not over-thinking the issue on my end, if I'm getting 37-39db SNR on all of my Tivos, would I just need to add a -6db attenuator to each of them so I can drop the SNR down into the "preferred" 32-35db range?

    Options I've found so far:
    http://www.markertek.com/CATV-Headend-Interface/RF-Attenuators/Pico-Digital/PPFAM-3.xhtml
    http://www.parts-express.com/in-line-coax-cable-tv-signal-attenuator-6-db--180-390
    http://www.smarthome.com/7802/Signal-Strength-Attenuator-Pads-6-dB/p.aspx
    http://www.3starinc.com/drop_in-line_attenuator.html

    My Premiere XL4 has been a little odd and very seldom gets random V53 errors, though I've not had enough time with my Roamio Pro to see any evidence of it yet.

    I've seen posts by others on here that they think there's an internal amplifier inside of the Roamio Plus / Pro with the six tuners to help with signal issues.
     
  12. Jan 23, 2014 #72 of 112
    c3

    c3 TiVoholic

    3,067
    0
    Sep 8, 2000
    Silicon...
    No, an attenuator reduces both signal and noise levels, not the SNR directly. If the "strength" is at 100%, that may be too high. I dropped mine to around 95%. IMO, high SNR should not be an issue.
     
  13. Jan 23, 2014 #73 of 112
    shrike4242

    shrike4242 Member

    276
    0
    Nov 30, 2006
    Saint Louis, MO
    I think the strength for mine has been in the high 90% range (95-97%) when I checked on the Premiere XL I had that its tuner failed (wouldn't tune any channels correctly) and I know the Tivo rep I spoke with was fixated on the SNR being from 32-35db and that since it was 37-39db on that Tivo (and all of my other ones, as I checked later), it could have caused the issues with the tuner.

    How important is it to get the SNR down into the "preferred" range of 32-35db and what's the best way to do that if the signal strength is in the middle 90% range?
     
  14. Jan 23, 2014 #74 of 112
    c3

    c3 TiVoholic

    3,067
    0
    Sep 8, 2000
    Silicon...
    You can try dropping it to 35dB, but there is no formula to tell you the attenuator you need for it. I'm using a -16dB attenuator, and my SNR is around 34-39dB.
     
  15. Jan 23, 2014 #75 of 112
    shrike4242

    shrike4242 Member

    276
    0
    Nov 30, 2006
    Saint Louis, MO
    So, best thing to do would be to get a range of attenuators (a -8 db, -10db, -12db, -16db and -20db) and see which one gets it in the right range? Once that gets figured out, order more of the one that works best?
     
  16. Jan 31, 2014 #76 of 112
    Mark Rubin

    Mark Rubin Member

    106
    0
    Jul 20, 2002
    Jersey Shore
    Hi

    new Roamio owner here:

    I used to have Tivo service 8 years ago but gave up due to Cable card issues: I am seeing the same error: and I recall these cards are easily overloaded

    I am at 13 db value for attenuators now: most channels show 93-99 signal strength: if you see 100% you could be sending way too hot a signal to the box: they really should rescale the signal strength meter to be give more signal strength info

    I love the new box and hope I can get this resolved...
     
  17. Jan 31, 2014 #77 of 112
    Hyrax

    Hyrax New Member

    112
    0
    Sep 1, 2007
    I've been fighting this problem ever since I got my Roamio. I thought my TivoHD & original Premiere were the best things I ever put in my TV room, and just had faith that the Roamio problems were being caused by Comcast providing a bad signal. 6 visits by some very good Comcast tech, several cable cards, and one replacement Roamio later - I am now convinced otherwise. There is something wrong with the Roamio. It may be hardware, but I suspect it is in their error correction code.

    Watching the DVR diagnostics I'll see that it is possible for me to get tens of thousands of uncorrected errors in a few seconds. I believe these error bursts are the issue for me.

    Comcast admits their signal quality can fluctuate at times - which is kind of like saying the sky is blue. However, my old Tivos seemed to had no problem with those fluctuations. It seems to me that the Roamio just decides to take its bat and ball and go home whenever it doesn't like the signal. In its defense, the Roamio has 3 times the number of tuners it needs to deal with, so it is three times more likely to be blasted with bad data.

    I have watched live a TV signal severely breakup, go black, and a few moments later the 'Not Authorized' screen appears.

    I've tried the attenuator 'fix' and got my signal to the levels Tivo techs seem to want. With my signal at 88% and a S/N of 34 dB I get a lot more uncorrected errors, signal breakup, and eventually more V53 errors. In my experience, I get more problems if I lower the signal strength and S/N number using attenuation.
     
  18. Jan 31, 2014 #78 of 112
    Hyrax

    Hyrax New Member

    112
    0
    Sep 1, 2007
    I forgot to mention that I have been keeping track of the channels that tend to get the V53 errors first. I am trying to see if taking them off my channel list makes the problem go away. I noticed that some of these channels were still close to 100% signal even with an attenuation of 12 db. I removed a specific channel and the V53s have apparently disappeared - but it has only been a week.

    My thinking is that we need a way to attenuate specific frequencies...
     
  19. Jan 31, 2014 #79 of 112
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

    1,589
    2
    Jan 29, 2011
    SE Ohio
    I'm OTA only, but I've seen the same error-burst problem with my new Roamio. I think it may be due to poor allocation of priorities in the Roamio's software, with housekeeping tasks being performed in high-level code that takes too long and causes some hardware (like the tuner or demodulator chips) to not be serviced in a timely manner. It could even be as simple as inadequate disk buffering, although that seems less likely. Do your error bursts occur when you change channels or when a recording starts, with few errors occurring during the bulk of the recording? I've also had problems with a couple of strong local stations, but I haven't tried an attenuator yet.
     
  20. Jan 31, 2014 #80 of 112
    tatergator1

    tatergator1 Active Member

    1,523
    6
    Mar 27, 2008
    Columbus, Ohio
    Since you're on Comcast, what's your CableCard firmware version? Easiest way to get to it is by going to Seittings & Messages ->Account and System Info ->DVR Diagnostics and scroll towards the bottom of that page.

    Many Comcast regions are running very outdated CableCard firmware which leads to V53 errors and the like. This may be the root of your particular problems.
     

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