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tivo elite user experience log

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by gteague, Jan 19, 2012.

  1. Mar 5, 2012 #81 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    Problem: while i was at work, lost signal/sync and came home to gray screen and 'no signal' messages. also lost some recordings the previous evening with the message 'channel not active'.

    Fix: reseated cable card

    Note: this gave me a good excuse to call and pair up my sole remaining cable card. the tech (carlos) had the least trouble of any of the nearly a dozen techs i've talked to since i started this nonsense back in december. hope this bodes well for the success of this card, the latest of nearly 10 i've tried over the months since i got the elite. cross your fingers and let the monitoring begin ...
     
  2. Mar 5, 2012 #82 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    Problem: went to bed this morning with an optimistic attitude and a new cable card which i had gotten paired up in less that 15 minutes. woke up to 'channel not authorized' and no channels working.

    Fix: reseated cable card

    Note: i have asked tivo to contact the time warner install supervisor and come up with a troubleshooting plan different than just me spending hours per day trying to acquire and pair cable cards. i have little optimism left at this point, this is about the 8th cable card that's been paired up. and even when the card is working i get no enjoyment from watching the tivo since i'm having to bounce out of recordings every 15 minutes to check whether i still have livetv.

    /guy
     
  3. Mar 15, 2012 #83 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    i'm again beginning to be cautiously optimistic and perhaps the previous entry was an outlier. it was a '... not authorized' msg and not an '... unavailable' msg as the bulk of the others have been.


    ((867 324 / 60) / 60) / 24 = 10.0384722 [days]​


    that's tied or broken the record for the previous card which would normally work for 1-3 days but once did hold for 10 days. i notified tivo to stand by on contacting time warner for now, but it must be said that time warner did ignore my last request for cable cards back when i thought this card was going to follow the pattern of all the others yet again.

    i actually watched a full movie recording all the way through without bouncing back out to livetv to make sure i still had channels, so that's the first 'normal' viewing and use of this elite in 3 months.

    and even if my temporary problem is finally solved, there are still problems that are waiting to hit others. first, that the tivo elite would not work under exactly the same conditions that a tivo series3 was working under and, second, that time-warner north texas absolutely will not work with their customers to satisfy tivo's requirements.

    /guy
     
  4. Mar 20, 2012 #84 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    perhaps the last entry in the log? i sent the following to the tivo personnel i've been working with over the last 3 months:

    my 'root cause analysis' of this 'incident' would be that a subset of the overall problem has been solved by finding a specific sample (cable card) that would mate up to a specific tivo elite. still unresolved is whether the sample and quality variation in cable cards is the problem (and based on anecdotal evidence over the years i do consider this a huge, perhaps the only, factor) or whether the tivo does not have the flexibility to accept cards that are slightly or moderately or largely out of parameters and don't meet industry or agreed on specifications. the case against the elite cannot be dismissed because, as my particular situation showed, two of the elites would not work under the exact same environment and conditions and with the same cards as a series3 tivo. but against this is the undeniable fact that the cable company, as far as i can tell, never pulls any cable cards from their system unless they are physically damaged and seem to have no testing process of their own for them.

    but, based on no specific knowledge, i think that possibly those problems could be solved on your end by you guys via a hardware/manufacturing change or perhaps even a firmware patch. whether the expense of fixing it on that end or the pain of dealing with customers like me who are affected is worse, i guess the accountants get to decide. and usually, in my experience, they leave the customer service department to deal with such problems rather than re-tool or patch.

    but the real problem you guys have is having to depend on sales based on cooperation and compliance to agreed on standards from the idiots at the cable company. i hate to malign normal folks who are just trying to do their job, but the ones here at my cable company seem to have absolutely no training or resources whatsoever--i'm sure i've met many of them in a previous life passing a hamburger over a counter. worse, they have no escalation path to provide to the customer. i've worked on variations of help desks for many years and this is just beyond my comprehension--i've never worked for an organization that would leave the customer at a complete dead end like i was stonewalled for over 3 months. but, as i told you, this isn't even an anomaly as about 3 years ago when they rolled out tuning adaptors i was left hanging and had to contact the time-warner ceo to get anything done--that's how i had robert's (tw install supvr) info to begin with. as far as i can tell, short of a ceo summit, i doubt there's a thing you can do about this problem other than what you've done with me--tried to provide me as much support as you could and talk me down from putting nails in all the tires in their parking lot!
     
  5. Mar 20, 2012 #85 of 373
    jrtroo

    jrtroo User

    4,065
    6
    Feb 4, 2008
    Have you ever considered sending this record to the parties that be over at the FCC and whatever local authority (Commission or even AGs office) you have?

    This could be fun on their facebook page as well.

    This is the best documentation I have seen, and demonstrates the slow burn that these issues have while TW notes there are "no issues" to authorities.
     
  6. Mar 20, 2012 #86 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    tksk @jrtroo. and i didn't even start this log until 1 month into the problem.

    i have been corresponding with an individual on the managerial team at tivo who is going to make sure this info gets to the appropriate party or parties.

    /guy
     
  7. Mar 22, 2012 #87 of 373
    Teeps

    Teeps Active Member

    1,665
    4
    Aug 16, 2001
    Torrance,Cal...
    gteague,
    I feel your pain...
    I've had continuous problems with my S3 since having to install a tuning adapter last July. The problem goes unresolved, save for a band aide countermeasure discovered over in the S3 forum.

    I was just about to buy an Elite until I read this thread.
    I refuse to spend 500 bucks on a new machine and run the risk of having more grief.

    I do commend your tenacity with regard to pursuing this problem. Not me, I would have demanded my money back.
     
  8. Mar 23, 2012 #88 of 373
    rogmatic

    rogmatic New Member

    177
    0
    Sep 17, 2009
    I love the Elite, but I have now had the exact same problem 2 nights in a row. Around 7 pm central (critical TV watching time) I have lost signal and the channels are recording in a scrambled form. If I reboot the tivo, the signal is perfect. This is not happening to my normal Premiere and never happened to my HD. No clue what is going on or how to address it.
     
  9. Mar 23, 2012 #89 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    Just curious, what cable system are you on? I'm on TWC. Thats pretty much the same time it happens to my Elite as well. Always during prime time hours when I record most my of shows. I try to manually reboot mine around 6:30pm or a little bit after that so its coming off a fresh reboot going into prime time. Also I'm on my 3rd Elite now as of this week. If I cant get this one to work soon I'm just going to cancel it for awhile until they get the bugs worked out.
     
  10. Mar 24, 2012 #90 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    isn't it strange that 7pm (at least here in dfw) seems to be the most problematical time? the very start of 'prime time', i think.

    as you've read in my other thread, i've finally got a cable card that works for days instead of hours, but back when i was having to check for signal every half-hour i always breathed a little easier when i made it past 7:30 or 8pm every day. i lost half of a good many half-hour shows due to having to reboot.

    /guy
     
  11. Mar 24, 2012 #91 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    That's why I usually do a manual reboot about 20-30 minutes before 7pm to get it all set up. I can make it thru the prime time shows and sure enough about the time the local news goes off I expect it to mess up and poof it does. I'd love to be able to schedule stuff while I'm gone or asleep, but forget that it never works out. I've gotten in the habit of when I get up in the morning the first thing I do is turn on the TV and reboot the Tivo so I can watch the morning news, all before I start the coffee goin. I would really love to get mine going for a few days at least, but my other 3 Tivos work great and I have no issues with them, so I've just been recording everything on them while I'm gone and then stream everything or transfer. It's sad I have to do that though, and here I got this $450 "gorilla in the room" just sitting there. :rolleyes:
     
  12. Mar 24, 2012 #92 of 373
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

    1,589
    2
    Jan 29, 2011
    SE Ohio
    Since the unit is always on and always recording, I assume it's not a heat issue, although I suppose some activities do generate a bit more heat than others. Failing (rebooting, scrambled video, whatever) after a certain amount of operating time could be a symptom of a memory management problem. Maybe some table overflows and steps on something. TiVo should have someone read through the code with that sort of thing in mind.
     
  13. Mar 24, 2012 #93 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    See thats the thing, it doesnt reboot on its own, I have to manually reboot it to get the channels back. I've never had those random reboots like other people talk about. If I leave it on then it'll stay on forever that way, just no picture on the channels. My take on it is there is some conflict with the cable cards and tuning adapter models that TWC uses here. I had read somewhere else in another thread that the Elite uses a different type or brand of tuners than the other "2 tuner" Tivos. I dont know that for sure, but thats what I read here. Then theres all those RS corrected and uncorrected errors in the diagnostic screen, and everyone says thats normal, but none of my other Tivos have that on them. They are all at 0 errors. So I dont know what to make of it, but I'm on Elite #3 at this point and its getting old.
     
  14. Mar 24, 2012 #94 of 373
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

    1,589
    2
    Jan 29, 2011
    SE Ohio
    I realized you hadn't mentioned rebooting and edited my post, but you got there before I saved it. Your symptoms could still be caused by a memory management problem, but if nobody who's OTA sees the same symptoms then I'm inclined to agree with you that the problem is related to cable cards or tuning adapters. And since the new quad cable-only tuners in the Elite are presumably serviced by different code from that used in other Premieres, that may be where a bug was introduced. The greater number of errors seen by an Elite's tuner/demodulator circuitry actually worries me more, because that may require code optimization that could be a lot more difficult than just finding a bug causing the other symptoms.
     
  15. Mar 24, 2012 #95 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    Yeah I saw you edited it, no worries :)

    But I agree with you, I think its got to be something in the software, maybe a conflict of some kind that doesnt get along well with these tuners, then add these tuning adapters to it and it goes crazy. I can put one of my 2 tuner Tivos on the same line and the signal is perfect and after days of being on there theres not one error, but I'll go look at the Elite wherever I put it on the house and they just follow whatever jack I hook it to. The last one I sent back they said there were logs on it they can look at so I guess we will see. I'm just glad more and more people are buying them so maybe they can get out there and if enough people speak loud enough they will try to figure it out.
     
  16. Mar 24, 2012 #96 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    I was going to say, it seems like people on FIOS dont have any problems, and I think they dont use tuning adapters? I dont know, but I've never seen anyone say they had an issue and then say they were on FIOS.
     
  17. Mar 24, 2012 #97 of 373
    Teeps

    Teeps Active Member

    1,665
    4
    Aug 16, 2001
    Torrance,Cal...
    This is solution is nearly the same mickymouse bs I have to do with my S3. The difference is the tuning adapter has to be powered down (I use a $10 lamp timer from Ace Hardware) for 4 hours daily so the GC can complete. If GC does not complete, in a couple of weeks you start getting running out of guide data messages.


    From what I understand FIOS does not use SDV. They have big enough pipes so they can provide all channels 24/7.

    The tuning adapter is pure evil.
     
  18. Mar 24, 2012 #98 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    Amen! :D

    I NEVER had an one issue with Tivo's until TWC went to SDV.
     
  19. Mar 24, 2012 #99 of 373
    moyekj

    moyekj Well-Known Member

    11,151
    34
    Jan 23, 2006
    Mission...
    I've seen several, here's 1 long thread about it where OP is with FIOS:
    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=483987&highlight=fios+elite
    I've seen enough posts about tuning issues with Elite that it put me off buying one. The fact that they switched to new Maxlinear-based tuners means there is a learning curve ahead to fix any issues.
    What's more worrisome is in these threads people say if they use same coax and connections for a Series 3 in place of the Elite there are no issues which points the finger squarely at the Elite.
     
  20. Teeps

    Teeps Active Member

    1,665
    4
    Aug 16, 2001
    Torrance,Cal...

    And, TiVo has yet to admit a problem exists.
     

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