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tivo elite user experience log

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by gteague, Jan 19, 2012.

  1. Jan 25, 2012 #21 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    problem: needed to pair up cable card with new tivo
    fallout: n/a
    resolution: after two hour phone call, agent finally got cable card paired
     
  2. Jan 25, 2012 #22 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    problem: lost channels. reseating cable card didn't resolve issue.
    fallout: no channels whatsoever
    resolution: tw said this was because my new tivo was downloading guide data. called tivo who said this was bs, but in the middle of the call my channels came as suddenly as they went. but since reseating the cable card didn't resolve the issue as it usually does with my los (loss of signal/sync) issues, i can't really call this one a cable card fault.
    plan: monitor new tivo for cable card issues.
     
  3. Jan 25, 2012 #23 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    problem: lost channels. pixellated while i was watching, and then went to blank screen
    fallout: unfortunately, this means the tivo is most likely not the problem since this is the brand new tivo i installed early this morning
    resolution: reseated cable card
    plan: 'vendor meeting' conference call monday or tuesday arranged and coordinated at tivo exec level
     
  4. Jan 25, 2012 #24 of 373
    compnurd

    compnurd New Member

    1,011
    0
    Oct 6, 2011
    I think the "fallout" is something we have been trying to tell you for over a week now. You need to get a TWC tech at your house and not leave until it is fixed
     
  5. Jan 27, 2012 #25 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    status check: check of dvr diagnostics to see how the levels are looking
    parameters 0,1,2,3:
    sig strength: 93,92,87,94
    snr: 37,36,34,37db
    rs_uncorrected: 5079,4694,5132,5120
    rs corrected: 32,537,59,21
    cc uptime: 133112s / 2218m / 37h
    plan: 'vendor meeting' conference call tuesday 1500ct coordinated at tivo exec level
    note: the big surprise here is that the uncorrected errors have come down more than an order-of-magnitude from over 100k to what you see. corrected errors have come down from the thousands to the double digits. my guess as to why is that we had about an 18 hour spell of thunderstorms the last two days with cable and internet outages and perhaps the repair or the simple act of disconnecting and reconnecting things improved connections.

    can someone check under the cable card menu, cable card pairing screen and see if, at the top of that screen, they have a notice that says to '... start cable service for this device, please contact your cable provider'? i currently have service or i wouldn't be getting any channels, but i'm curious as to whether that screen is a red herring or not.
     
  6. Jan 27, 2012 #26 of 373
    rcobourn

    rcobourn Registered Snoozer

    735
    1
    Nov 10, 2004
    Phoenix, AZ
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Jan 27, 2012 #27 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    yep, bogus. thanks mucho!

    /guy
     
  8. Jan 28, 2012 #28 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    status check: check of dvr diagnostics to see how the levels are looking
    parameters 0,1,2,3:
    channel: 740,766,004,104
    sig strength: 85,92,95,94
    snr: 34,36,38,37db
    rs_uncorrected: 5836,5230,5179,5660
    rs corrected: 24667,30,16,562
    cc uptime: 220225s / 3670m / 61h
    plan: 'vendor meeting' conference call tuesday 1500ct coordinated at tivo exec level
    note: 61 hours is as much sync'd time as i've ever logged in the 6 weeks i've been tracking. one very odd thing is that, under the account_and_system_information | dvr_diagnostics it lists tuners 0,1,2,3 and then cable_card_1. all the times before on the original elite i had before this replacement one, when i've looked in the cable_card listing it has said 'oob_signal_lock: yes' and then given me an 'oob_snr' reading (which is usually 40). now it says 'no' in oob_signal_lock' and the 'oob_snr' field is blank. could i impose on someone to check this setting on their box and see what it says? i don't know if you have to be on time warner, have an elite, and have a tuning adaptor or not, is the only problem with interpreting comparisons.
     
  9. Jan 28, 2012 #29 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    problem: los (loss of signal/loss of sync with cc]
    resolution: tried removing coax from cable signal input. didn't work. reseated cable card and channels were restored.
    status check: check of dvr diagnostics to see how the levels are looking
    parameters 0,1,2,3:
    channel: 740,766,004,104
    sig strength: 83,90,93,94
    snr: 33,36,37,37db
    rs_uncorrected: 6441,5251,5112,6210
    rs corrected: 174162,27,51,26
    oob signal lock: yes
    oob snr: 40db
    cc uptime: 768s / 10m / 00h
    plan: 'vendor meeting' conference call tuesday 1500ct coordinated at tivo exec level
    note: last 'run' was over 60 hours, but the problem has attacked again while i was asleep, as it tends to do for some reason. perhaps activity helps keep it synced although it has locked up while i was watching on at least a couple occasions. note that the 'oob signal lock' i was asking about is now 'yes' and there is an snr figure for the entire cable card, so i have no idea what that section of the dvr diagnostics is telling me since it seems to work either way.
     
  10. Jan 30, 2012 #30 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    problem: lost 95% of my cable channels. ph number to cable company is fast busy error. i sincerely hope it's their problem rather than my problem this time. i did all my normal reset ritual and it didn't bring back any of the missing channels. [later note] it was their problem--never heard the cause, but recovered all channels about an hour-and-a-half later.

    note: conference call still set for tomorrow afternoon. i tried to get the cable company to get me some cable cards for that call, but they wouldn't/couldn't do it although they again promised to mail me a couple of brand new ones. they've promised that once before and never sent them.
     
  11. Jan 31, 2012 #31 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    just got off a call with tivo level2 and time-warner level3 support.

    we mostly did data gathering on the call today with a detour to restore my channels when pulling and replacing a cable card (which is how i normally 'fix' a sync loss) resulted in a loss of service. we spoke with tw level 3 who got the cable card working again in short order. unlike the many other techs at the pairing center, one thing i noticed was that this tw level3 tech was able to send reset signals to both the cc and the ta that were solid and nearly immediate.

    tw level3 tech suggested we replace all equipment (already done, except for needing more cable cards) and, if that doesn't work, then a return visit from time-warner field techs to (re)check signal levels and/or replace the 'drop' to my house. the problem i see with this is, again, my local cable company who, at the level i get to talk to them, would be unable to access level3's recommendations and act on them, but tivo thinks that they might be able to penetrate further than i [g] into their hierarchy if that becomes necessary.

    our plan of action (given that i have service about 98% of the time) is to wait until the end of the week for two new cable cards (evidently the card i'm using falls between the cracks of date of manufacture and we (including tw level3) were unable to place it precisely in any fabrication timeline) my local office has promised to mail me. if the cards do arrive i will contact tivo who want to be on the call when we pair up a new one. once we get a new one paired we will monitor for drop outs as we are doing now.

    if no cable cards arrive by monday, i am to call tivo back and he will assist me in calling the local cable company and hopefully get on the line someone who is aware of the fcc ruling that they must furnish me whatever new or replacement user-installable equipment that i request: <http://www.fcc.gov/guides/cablecard-know-your-rights>.

    btw, tivo confirmed that an 'rs_uncorrected' reading around 5000 is normal and the 'rs_corrected' reading should be under 100, although better in the single digits. they get these reading even on their lab machines with perfect signals.
     
  12. Feb 1, 2012 #32 of 373
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

    1,589
    2
    Jan 29, 2011
    SE Ohio
    If TiVo does any testing on "lab machines with perfect signals" they should see no corrected or uncorrected errors at all, in theory anyway. Maybe they mean they see a few errors even when testing with a good, clean antenna or cable signal. Certainly in the real world, there will be occasional errors. Lots of corrected errors may indicate a noisy signal, but it's uncorrected errors that cause glitches in the video or audio.

    But error counts are meaningful only when referenced to a time interval. I'm OTA only, and (depending on the station) I might average a corrected error every few seconds and several uncorrected errors during a typical show. OTOH, it isn't too unusual for me to record an hour-long show with no uncorrected errors at all, if reception conditions are really good.

    Sometimes several (say 50 or so) uncorrected errors seem to occur right after the TiVo has changed channels, with no further uncorrected errors occurring during the rest of the show and no noticeable glitches when I view it. That sort of anomaly may indicate that the initial burst of errors is due to the TiVo software being too busy to properly tend some part of the hardware, thus causing some sort of brief buffer overrun or underrun condition. If nothing like that occurs during steady-state recording, I guess I shouldn't worry too much about it, although it really shouldn't occur. I've wondered sometimes if more cache memory on the hard drive helps.
     
  13. Feb 1, 2012 #33 of 373
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

    19,194
    27
    Jan 31, 2002
    Northern...
    With the Elite you always have some errors when you first tune to a channel. This was not typically the case with the two tuner Premieres.
     
  14. Feb 1, 2012 #34 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    the tivo tech confirmed my suspicion that the uncorrected errors were equivalent to crc (cyclic redundancy check) errors in the telecommunications field (where i've worked for decades).

    any state change on a serial line will show crc errors on the csu/dsu or on the router 'sh interface' screen. we call these state change errors 'clumps' and they are of no concern unless they increment after the state change. typically i issue a 'clear counters' command to reset them to zero, then check again every hour if i have suspicions of a circuit taking errors.

    so the conclusion that i've reached is that tivo seems to be the same--these errors are of no concern unless they increment by a significant amount without any 'state change' such as tuning a new channel.

    and if the analogy holds completely true, tivo is most likely right in saying they see these errors under lab conditions. in my lab, even a simulated 'perfect' t1 that is looped back to the source will show errors if there is a state change of any kind.

    /guy
     
  15. Feb 2, 2012 #35 of 373
    larrs

    larrs Movie Fan-Addict

    1,011
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    May 2, 2005
    DFW
    If you read my earlier post, this was the reading that kept popping up on my screen on the diagnsotics pages. It now looks like the copy and paste someone else posted. I really believe you have the same issue I did.
     
  16. Feb 2, 2012 #36 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    @larrs: i re-read your post and it didn't seem to make any mention of that '... start cable service ...' screen. regardless, i read everything pertaining to the issue and i took your info into serious consideration--every time i called to have a card paired i would ask them if there were any other fields they could look at that might have a bearing on the card signal dropping out. i've had at least 6 calls with two different centers now and you'd think that even with the ratio of incompetents to actual techs, if that were the case, someone would have noticed it by now.

    but the conference call with tiro on tuesday was with a level3 tech. now, for all i know the call might have gone to the same center i've been calling, but both me and tiro asked that every aspect of the card settings be looked at considering the long history of problems i'd been experiencing.

    the good news (so far) is that i haven't lost the cable card sync since that call 48 hours ago. but the cable company has 'gone down' with both full and partial outages since then and those outages might have 'reset the clock' on the cable card problem both times and i can't count the 48hrs uptime as significant.

    also, despite the cable company promising to mail me cards, i haven't received them and am beginning to think i was an idiot for even considering for a second that they aren't, taken as a whole, a group of lying, incompetent idiots. one of the last things i can try is to drive to a tw location and try to talk them into giving me a cable card, but they have refused in the past and refused to let me speak to a supervisor even though i'm standing in their office.

    /guy
     
  17. Feb 2, 2012 #37 of 373
    Wolfowitz

    Wolfowitz New Member

    5
    0
    May 19, 2007
    I'm having the same problem as you are. I've got a Tivo Series 3 that works perfectly, but my Tivo Premier Elite is having the same problems as yours. I reboot it and it works for about 8-20 hours, then it starts getting heavy dropouts and eventually just turns to black screen and says "not authorized to get this channel". Even the recordings get the dropouts. I'm with Verizon Fios (no tuning adapter). I find myself manually rebooting the Elite right before important shows are about to record (just as insurance).
     
  18. Feb 3, 2012 #38 of 373
    gteague

    gteague golftango

    520
    0
    Apr 1, 2007
    dfw (euless)
    problem: tivo re-booted. first reaction was that i was running a kmttg job at the time and that can sometimes cause problems. but now it's telling me that my external storage is missing.
    resolution: i've unplugged and replugged the ext drive on both ends and restarted the tivo by pulling the plug and i'm getting the same error again. going to shut everything down and try again. [note: came back up after 3 tries. very worrying. the cable card issues only cost me 12-24 hours of missed recordings, losing my external storage could deep-six all my recordings.]
     
  19. Feb 3, 2012 #39 of 373
    MeInDallas

    MeInDallas Member

    910
    0
    Jul 31, 2011
    Dallas, Texas
    I'm doing this same thing on mine now. It'll go anywhere from 2 to 6 hours and then heavy pixelation, then everything goes black. I reboot and everything is back to normal again. I have 2 Tivo HD's and have switched the cards and tuning adapters all around and paired them all back up again. It doesnt matter what cable jack I move the Elite to in the house, the problems follow the Elite wherever it goes while the Tivo HD's never stutter, with no errors on the cable cards. The people at Tivo suggested getting an attenuator to bring my SNR down a bit, so I got several sizes to see which one might help. They were only a couple of bucks each. So far nothing is working. I get a few good recordings but the ones I really want to see that air once and never again, of course those are the ones that get screwed up. :rolleyes:
     
  20. Feb 3, 2012 #40 of 373
    Wolfowitz

    Wolfowitz New Member

    5
    0
    May 19, 2007
    Oh yeah, forgot to mention, I've tried swapping in multiple cablecards and various attenuators, nothing helped.
     

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