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Tivo abandoning us cord cutters?

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by jgantert, Aug 16, 2012.

  1. Aug 17, 2012 #21 of 103
    BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Well-Known Member

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    I look at it this way: Tivo at best has sold only a few hundred thousand Premieres as it is to the broadest number of possible people -- digital cable, OTA, and analog customers collectively. That's been hard enough, even when hardware prices were under $100.

    Making a product specifically for the OTA 15-percenters alone is not likely to be worthwhile. It would also probably add as much as $100 to the retail cost if it were crammed into existing 4-tuner configurations. Tivo made a choice with their 4-tuner platform and it was the right one at the time.

    This could definitely be re-examined if something in the landscape changes (particularly, technology costs) but until then they did what they had to do.

    I do believe they'll continue to have SOME kind of OTA support.
     
  2. Aug 17, 2012 #22 of 103
    Teeps

    Teeps Active Member

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    OTA is very good where available. My S3OLED was connected to cable and OTA until they changed the DTV frequencies. Now it's just cable.

    "Cord Cutters" that brag about streaming; what will you do when the Internet provider throttles the connection or puts a meter on download data?
    The phone companies are already doing this...
     
  3. Aug 17, 2012 #23 of 103
    Tony Chick

    Tony Chick New Member

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    The DirecTV HR21 and later receivers support an external OTA tuner (AM21) that plugs into the USB. Technically, Tivo could do something like that
     
  4. Aug 17, 2012 #24 of 103
    L David Matheny

    L David Matheny Active Member

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    But the only difference between tuning OTA and cable signals is the frequency mapping and the modulation scheme. Traditionally both the tuner chips and the demodulator chips could handle both OTA and cable. Maybe some more recent chipsets can't tune OTA frequencies or (more likely) can't handle 8VSB-encoded signals, but my point is that handling OTA shouldn't require adding more chips but rather just choosing the right chipsets, which shouldn't add a lot of extra cost.

    I would certainly hope so.
     
  5. Aug 17, 2012 #25 of 103
    rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    That isn't true for the chips that TiVo uses in their DVRs. They are very specialized and require supporting decoding in the hardware chips themselves. TiVo can't buy an off-the-shelf tuner that would work with the lower powered CPUs they use.
     
  6. Aug 17, 2012 #26 of 103
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    The chipset is also a limitation, and is the reason the 4 tuner units don't support analog cable. The chipset can only encode two analog streams at a time. So rather then deal with asynchronous scheduling of analog stations they just disabled analog completely.

    Hopefully the next generation hardware will have a better chipset capable of supporting a wider range of tuner configurations. But I don't expect to see a new hardware platform for at least another year, so don't hold your breath.

    Dan
     
  7. Aug 17, 2012 #27 of 103
    hefe

    hefe Rebus Philbin

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    Brag? That's a weird choice of words. I'm a cord cutter now, but was streaming before I left DTV. Nothing to brag about, it's just something I use to watch some shows and movies.

    What will I do if/when I'm throttled? I'll watch less TV.
     
  8. Aug 17, 2012 #28 of 103
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    I've got a feeling we aren't going to be seeing any new analog cable capable units in the future.

    I'm sure the cable companies would like to see it go away.
     
  9. Aug 17, 2012 #29 of 103
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Well analog is left over from the 20th century. Digital is where it's at in the 21st. Plus it's more efficient and the cable companies have an easier time protecting their content. Over time the analog connections will be phased out from electronic devices too.

    Sent from my HTC ReZound using Forum Runner
     
  10. Aug 17, 2012 #30 of 103
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Unfortunately our cable company is not on that bandwagon yet. We still have about 35 channels that are analog only. Most have HD equivalents or are crap I don't care about (music stations or 24 hours news stations), but there are a few like Comedy Central, AMC and FX that have original programming I enjoy and can't get any other way.

    Dan
     
  11. Aug 18, 2012 #31 of 103
    lessd

    lessd Active Member

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    I would assume the OTA stations are far fewer than cable making the 4 tuner OTA not a must have product for most people, cable with what, 300+ useful channels and OTA maybe 16 in a big city five or six in other places.
     
  12. Aug 18, 2012 #32 of 103
    zob

    zob New Member

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    I get about 45 OTA channels in the DFW aera, thats alot more than 16. Had cable & satellite, over half of it wasn't worth a flip IMO. I can only get analog cable were I current live. So the new tivo 4 channel won't work for me.
     
  13. Aug 18, 2012 #33 of 103
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    You get 45 separate channels or 45 channels including sub channels? If it's 45 separate plus the sub channels that is certainly a lot to choose from.

    Sent from my HTC ReZound using Forum Runner
     
  14. Aug 18, 2012 #34 of 103
    loganasu

    loganasu I'm a lurker

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    Wouldn't that still come out to 45 channels to watch?
     
  15. Aug 18, 2012 #35 of 103
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    It depends on how you look at it. The sub channels are still part of the main channel broadcast. I can record the main channel on a PC and all the other sub channels are still part of that frequency. They will all be recorded as well and can be separated out later.

    Around here the sub channels are typically SD. I rarely watch SD. Even eleven years ago SD comprised lesss than half of what I watched from broadcast. Now(not counting upconverted Network content like Hells Kitchen), it extremely rare for me to watch any broadcast SD content.

    Sent from my HTC ReZound using Forum Runner
     
  16. Aug 18, 2012 #36 of 103
    S3-2501

    S3-2501 New Member

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    You may be able to do this on a PC (I'd like to know how you do that) but a Tivo is not capable of doing this. Each program requires its own tuner, so recording a main channel and a sub channel would tie up a two tuner Tivo. The Tivo also records only the audio track that the Tivo is set to when the recording begins. So if someone wants descriptive audio, commentary-free sports or Spanish audio, that needs to be set before the recording starts.

    The bottom line is that however you count the number of channels, there are plenty of ways that recording conflicts can occur on a two tuner Tivo receiving OTA broadcasts.
     
  17. Aug 18, 2012 #37 of 103
    unitron

    unitron Active Member

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    One man's unfortunate is another man's "they haven't gotten around to screwing me entirely yet".
     
  18. Aug 18, 2012 #38 of 103
    lessd

    lessd Active Member

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    45 HD OTA channels to watch ?? WOW I guess i was incorrect, do you get stations like Comedy Central, the History ch. ect. In the Hartford CT area we get about 7 english HD OTA channels.
     
  19. Aug 18, 2012 #39 of 103
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    The information is typically there in the data stream when it's recorded. The program/device just needs to be able to use it. My HD recorder I used eleven years ago could view the sub channels with all my OTA recordings of the main channel.

    ON the TiVo I can watch a recording and have audio choices when watching the recording, like descriptive audio. I have never looked at the alternate audio tracks on my Elites before. But I don't recall doing anything with those settings.
     
  20. Aug 18, 2012 #40 of 103
    jgantert

    jgantert Member

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    Looks like Hartford CT can get a lot of OTA channels.

    http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id=9900fa942eadd6

    25 are LOS alone, and that is before counting in subchannels. I would bet you can probably get 40 OTA channels, but that's just a guess without knowing anything about your location or DMA.

    Anyways, there's tons of OTA content out there, but the current generation Tivo's can only tune to two subchannels at a time. This is a real limitation, IMO.
     

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