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Thoughts on Xbox One & Tivo

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by Ron DeGumbia, May 21, 2013.

  1. Nov 15, 2013 #41 of 257
    siratfus

    siratfus New Member

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    The tivo is always on and it'll be next to the xbox one, we can just use our tivo remote and change the channels, go to tivo menu, record, etc. There will just be a delay for all the commands.

    Is this assumption correct?
     
  2. Nov 15, 2013 #42 of 257
    JosephB

    JosephB Member

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    Yes, except that an engineer from the Xbox team has said the delay introduced will be imperceptible. He says he plays his Xbox 360 connected through the Xbox One passthrough.
     
  3. Nov 15, 2013 #43 of 257
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    IR Blasters = kludged up crappy setup. Always have been, always will. This passthrough functionality will be used by 0.001% of the gamer pop, and without the WMC extender code it's pretty much useless to me.
     
  4. Nov 15, 2013 #44 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    TiVo is pretty much the only retail DVR in existence. There is no way the MSO only DVRs from Motorola, SA, Dish, etc... are going to expose a control API. So partnering with TiVo to off a full control scenario would benefit both companies. It would give MS the ability to say they support full DVR functionality through the pass through, convincing more people to hook it up that way and leave it on all the time. And for TiVo it would potentially convince a few XB1 owners to dump their cable DVR and buy a TiVo instead.

    Now whether or not they'll actually do it I think depends on how much bad blood there is between the companies from the lawsuits.
     
  5. Nov 15, 2013 #45 of 257
    siratfus

    siratfus New Member

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    But then wouldn't those folks favor PS4 more? I think people who want the XBOX One will want to tinker with this stuff.
     
  6. Nov 15, 2013 #46 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    People aren't going to buy an XB1 over a PS4 just because of this stuff. Most people who favor the XBox platform do so because they prefer the online experience and/or the controller. This added stuff is all cool on paper, but I seriously doubt many users are actually going to be swayed over to buying an XB1 just because of it.
     
  7. Nov 15, 2013 #47 of 257
    Grakthis

    Grakthis New Member

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    How comfortable is it to wear tinfoil all day? I mean, it can't let much air through, so your head can't breathe very well... and plus, doesn't it make a lot of noise when you move around?
     
  8. Nov 15, 2013 #48 of 257
    Grakthis

    Grakthis New Member

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    So, I compared the PS4 to a PC and said "My PC is just flat out better." So I am not buying a Ps4.. yet.

    I compared the Xbox One to my PC and said "The XBox one does a whole bunch of media stuff, and the kinect voice control and motion control is cool..."

    And so I got an Xbox One.

    The superior gaming platform is the PC. If you don't like the extra stuff, there's no reason to get either console.

    edit: to be clear, I am not just talking about the video overlay... but that is ONE part of it. I am talking about the video overlay and the camera and the voice command, etc.

    i doubt I will use the one guide stuff, but you never know. Mostly I am expecting to just be able to use the side-by-side and other video overlay capabilities.
     
  9. Nov 15, 2013 #49 of 257
    JosephB

    JosephB Member

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    I think the evidence points to Microsoft not really caring that much. If it were that important to them, they would have 1) not dropped MCE support 2) probably not sold off their Mediaroom division and 3) they could easily have partnered with someone like Ceton to sell a CableCard add-on tuner.

    If having a real, honest to god DVR fully integrated was truly important, they would have an add-on tuner, manage the recording and whatnot on the Xbox, and not give up the interface of that part of it to a third party. What incentive do they have to work with TiVo, giving TiVo control over part of the experience? What incentive would TiVo have, giving up just about the entire TiVo experience to Microsoft?

    Microsoft has obviously decided to give up on the vision of being part of the base TV experience and to focus on IP-delivered video content via app partners, especially since it's apparent that's the direction the providers want to take. They have FiOS and TWC on their boxes with zero additional hardware costs, zero installation hassles, and with the full cooperation of the video providers. Contrast that with the TiVo method which relies on a poorly supported system, openly hostile service providers that are only supporting it because of legal requirements, and involves significant hardware costs.

    There's currently a hole in the "app" delivery method, in that the TWC and FiOS Xbox apps don't have DVR capability, but I suspect those types of features (or immediate on demand access to programs as they air) is the eventual evolution of these applications.
     
  10. Nov 15, 2013 #50 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    PCs are not "superior gaming platforms". They're expensive, hard to maintain, and the online experience is no where near what even the PS4 can do. PCs can have vastly superior specs, and because they have more buttons they make it easier to play certain types of games, but there is a reason the PC is dying as a gaming platform. Most people value the experience more then the specs.

    In any case you're situation is unique. If someone was approaching this from a pure console gamer perspective they will typically pick their preffered platform based on the controler, the exclusive games and the online experience. People value the Kinect so little that they pressured MS to make it so it's not required to be connected to the XBox. If voice commands and motion control were so important to buyers why would they have lashed out against that requirement? I'm not saying the feature isn't cool and that it might sway the vote for some buyers, I'm just saying that for most buyers it's a gimmick and had no bearing on their decision.
     
  11. Nov 15, 2013 #51 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I agree. I'm just saying that the API exists and there would be some benefit to both companies for them to implement it. I don't think it'll actually happen though. Like you said they see the future as IP delivery. Having cable box control is just a stop gap to get people use to using their XB1 as a portal to TV.
     
  12. Nov 15, 2013 #52 of 257
    JosephB

    JosephB Member

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    You throw out a lot of assumptions and declarative statements without any evidence. What evidence is there that the PC is a dying platform? Or that kinect is a "gimmick" in "most buyers'" mind? PC gaming is still pretty strong, and both the PS4 and the Xbox One will make a ton of money for Sony and Microsoft.
     
  13. Nov 15, 2013 #53 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    PC game sales have been on the decline for years. PC sales in general are also on the decline. Just do a Google news search and you'll find a hundred articles talking about it.

    The current Kinect has a resale value of about $6, for a peripheral. And when MS initially announced that the XB1 would require the Kinect to be connected at all times people freaked out. So much so that MS reversed their position. Obviously the masses see no real value in the Kinect. People may turn out to like it and change their mind, but I'm confident that very few, if any, day one console buyers are getting an XB1 over a PS4 solely because of Kinect or the HDMI pass through feature.
     
  14. Nov 15, 2013 #54 of 257
    JosephB

    JosephB Member

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    Was it 100% the absolute only reason I preordered an Xbox One instead of a Playstation 4? No, but it helped Microsoft's case.

    I'm perfectly OK (and I actually prefer) to use my TiVo remote to access my DVR functions, but on the other hand it is *really freakin sweet* to have an integrated guide that puts the IP video apps in the same guide as my favorite linear channels. It's also really sweet that if I'm watching TV and a friend signs into Xbox Live and wants to play a game, I'll see it.
     
  15. Nov 15, 2013 #55 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I'm wondering how useful this will really be? Based on the video I saw all it does is put a list of "popular" videos into the guide. Since IP video apps are non-linear it doesn't really fit into the context of the guide very well. And unless your tastes line up with what's "popular" then it's unlikely you'll find something you actually want to watch that way.

    Personally I think the way TiVo integrates IP video services in to search and browse is much more useful. I can pull up a show I'm thinking about watching and tell instantly if it's available via Netflix or Hulu. If it is I can pick the exact episode I want to watch, click it, and it will just start playing. Or if I want to browse I can pick up my iPad, find something I want to watch on it and just fling it to my TiVo for playback. (via DIAL)

    Honestly the XBox guide looks like it's mainly for those who watch live TV, and I personally never do.

    This I could see being useful for kids and single guys who can jump in and play at a moments notice, but being constantly bombarded by announcements while watching TV is not something that will have a very high WAF.

    Now I "might" enable this feature for Skype if I had family who also had an XB1. The Skype feature gets us to that Jetsons future where we can video chat with people through the TV, which is pretty cool. Although I usually look like sh*t when I'm watching TV so maybe I don't want to video chat on my TV. :D
     
  16. Nov 16, 2013 #56 of 257
    mikeyts

    mikeyts Stream Warrior

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    I think that the current rash of Xbox One ads will get some buyers choosing it over PS4 for Kinect-enabled features which have little to do specifically with gaming. Voice control and its ability to visually recognize people and log them in automatically and reference their gaming and entertainment "contexts" by command ("Xbox show my stuff") is compelling. Throw in a beautiful girl and you get something this :D.

    But you're right--few people who ordered early enough to get a Day One package were moved by the Kinect story, though there must have been some.
     
  17. Nov 16, 2013 #57 of 257
    HerronScott

    HerronScott Well-Known Member

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    At least based on my experience with my teenage son and his friends, I would say this is not the case at least with older kids. They rarely play console games these days and it's all PC online gaming through companies selling games like Steam (and my son does have just almost all the console systems sold in the last 15 years with the exception of the PS3).

    You mentioned in another post about PC games sales declining and I can see that being the case for retail boxed games but do those numbers include games sold through Steam and other online systems?

    Scott
     
  18. Nov 16, 2013 #58 of 257
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    All PC games sales, and PC sales in general, are on a decline. The only reason some stories claim they're holding, or even going up, is because they count people who play games on Facebook as "PC gamers". One piece of anecdotal evidence is the recent release of GTA5. It was ONLY for consoles. They plan on releasing a PC version eventually, sometime in 2014, but obviously the PC market isn't big enough for them to push the release out before the crucial holiday buying season. And sales figures of other major franchises available on all platforms almost always favor consoles by substantial margins.

    PCs are technologically superior for sure. But they have some serious issues which push consumers away. First off most PC buyers are shifting away from desktop PCs to laptops, and most laptops don't have hardware capable of even playing most PC games and offer no upgrade path to make them capable. Second a real gaming PC is insanely expensive. The video card alone can cost more then an entire console system. Add in the rest of the hardware and you're looking at 3x, or more, the price of a console. On top if that they're harder for developers to deal with. They're are millions of variations they have to account for when coding/supporting the game and the potential for piracy is significant. By contrast consoles offer a single consistent platform to develop for and built in piracy prevention.
     
  19. Nov 16, 2013 #59 of 257
    JosephB

    JosephB Member

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    I watch quite a bit of live TV, lately probably a little more than recorded content, though that might shift back over time. I think the "One Guide" integration of apps into the guide is most useful for linear streaming apps like WatchESPN or the TWC app. I think that is probably where they want to go with it.

    In terms of having the XB1 in the loop and always on for Skype, you can Skype with anyone, not just other XB1 users.
     
  20. Nov 16, 2013 #60 of 257
    HarperVision

    HarperVision TiVo's Italian Cuz!

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    I used to contract for the NSA. They and many other institutions, both government and private, bank on naive people like you who "ostrich up" and cram their heads in the sand. That's all I'm saying about this.....flame away ostriches.....or should I say, cattle, sheeple.........
     

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