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Stream Will NOT work on MPEG4

Discussion in 'TiVo Stream' started by gamo62, Jun 17, 2013.

  1. Jun 17, 2013 #1 of 217
    gamo62

    gamo62 New Member

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    Just a heads up. The Stream will not currently work with MPEG4 content. Our system uses MPEG4 for cable channels, and MPEG2 for broadcast. The only ones that will stream are those encoded in MPEG2.

    Not sure if TiVo is even aware of this issue.
     
  2. Jun 17, 2013 #2 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I wonder why they didn't consider this? I know MPEG-4 channels are rare in the cable industry, but they released an update to the Premiere software to support MPEG-4 channels long before the Stream was released. You'd think they would have added MPEG-4 support just in case. Unless maybe the hardware isn't capable of decoding MPEG-4. But if that's the case then it's a pretty major design flaw.
     
  3. Jun 17, 2013 #3 of 217
    Philmatic

    Philmatic Member

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    Are you absolutely sure about this? That seems like a huge oversight on TiVo's part.

    However, I know for a fact that the TiVo Stream hardware supports transcoding MPEG 4 streams, so if this is actually and issue, it would just require TiVo to issue a software update to fix the issue.
     
  4. Jun 17, 2013 #4 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Yeah it's been mentioned a few times. Most people only have a couple of channels that are MPEG-4 so it hasn't been a big deal. But apparently the OP's cable provider switched entirely to MPEG-4 except for local channels so it effects him a lot.
     
  5. Jul 5, 2013 #5 of 217
    daisyrunr

    daisyrunr New Member

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    Well this answers my question of why my stream stopped streaming a lot of channels a few weeks ago. We're also with Cinti Bell Fioptics. I have a Premium XL Tivo and my husband has an older Tivo HD Series 3. A few weeks ago his Tivo stopped working. He thought it was a cable card problem. The technician was out just a little while ago and said his Tivo HD Series 3 won't work with Cinti Bell Fioptics anymore because they switched to MPEG4 recently and my husbands older Tivo only supports MPEG2. Now I'm disappointed to find that my Tivo Stream I just got last Christmas is so limited to the channels I can still
    stream to my Ipad/Iphone.
     
  6. Jul 5, 2013 #6 of 217
    wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Ziphead

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    Pretty goofy, since it outputs MP4.
     
  7. Jul 5, 2013 #7 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    OK I know this is a huge nit pick, but FYI...

    MP4 is a container.

    MPEG-4 is a standard that contains a bunch of stuff including the MP4 container, a couple of video codecs and the AAC audio codec.

    MPEG-4 part 10, aka H.264, aka AVC, is the video codec.

    I know a lot of people use these all interchangeably, but it can be a bit confusing for someone who's not aware of the differences.

    In this case the Stream outputs H.264 video and AAC audio in a TS based format called HLS. (basically just a TS file chunked up into a a bunch of tiny segments for easy seeking)
     
  8. Jul 5, 2013 #8 of 217
    Bigg

    Bigg Active Member

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    That's really sloppy on TiVo's part, although I'm somehow not surprised. You'd think they would have figured it out, especially with a lot of interest at least about MPEG-4 on the traditional cable side, and MPEG-4 being a big deal on the FIOS side of the cable world.
     
  9. Jul 5, 2013 #9 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Yeah I really hope they're working on fixing this. A lot of MSOs are going to be looking at switching channels to H.264 in the next few years.
     
  10. Jul 6, 2013 #10 of 217
    wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Ziphead

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    Yes, I was too lazy to type more.
     
  11. Jul 6, 2013 #11 of 217
    Bigg

    Bigg Active Member

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    Yup. I hope Comcast joins in on the game. Seeing how they did analog reduction, they'll wait a bit, and then just go for it all the way to free up capacity without SDV.
     
  12. Jul 19, 2013 #12 of 217
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    As has been discussed elsewhere, how fast a cable co moves to H.264 will be partially dependent on how much of their currently deployed user equipment they would have to replace.

    I sincerely hope TiVo deploys an update to the Series 3 s/w.

    When I first read the title of this thread, I wondered if someone had a problem watching a replay of Super Bowl I or IV. :D
     
  13. Jul 19, 2013 #13 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Never gonna happen! The S3 platform is dead. The Premier has been out for 3.5 years and TiVo is on the cusp of releasing a new Series 5. There is no way they are going to dedicate resources to updating a platform that hasn't been sold new in over 3 years. Not to mention this is a problem that already only effects a small percentage of their customers anyway. Most cable companies don't use H.264 yet and those that do only use it on a small subset of lesser watched channels. Companies like the OPs that did a wholesale switch to H.264 are very, very, rare.
     
  14. Jul 19, 2013 #14 of 217
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    In light of the fact that they are in the process of deploying a fix to the S3 (and even supposedly S2's) to address the expired cookie problem, i wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the possibility. Especially considering the fact that H.264 support has already been deployed to the Aussie S3 platform and should be a fairly easy port.
     
  15. Jul 19, 2013 #15 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Even though H.264 was supported on the platform in Aus/NZ they would still need to beta test it here in the US before pushing the release out to unsuspecting customers. That requires resources and I just can't see them dedicating any of their resources to an 8 year old platform. Especially when they are in the midist working on a new platform.

    The fixes they're pushing out will fix the expired cookie and nothing more.
     
  16. Jul 19, 2013 #16 of 217
    lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Active Member

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    John's...
    I never claimed otherwise. I'm simply saying that your dismissal of any possibility of their deploying H.264 support for the S3 at some point is not supportable. It may be unlikely, but it is possible and none of has sufficient information to calculate the odds. The longer it takes for some major player to convert to H.264 in a big way, the less likely it becomes, but it never becomes totally out of the question.

    Let me ask you this - given the possibility that CableCARDs may be replaced by s/w enforced security, why should anyone buy a TiVo if TiVo may or not deploy a s/w solution to existing platforms if and when that day comes?

    In either of the above scenarios, you could end up with a really bizarre situation - S2s (and even S1s) would still work by utilizing a set top box while more recent TiVos would not.

    There are really 3 possibilities = I might die, the King might die, or the horse could learn to sing. :)
     
  17. Jul 19, 2013 #17 of 217
    Bigg

    Bigg Active Member

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    Most of the HD stuff out there is MPEG-4 compliant on Comcast. There are some older boxes, but it wouldn't be that big of a change.
     
  18. Jul 20, 2013 #18 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I have been with TiVo since the beginning and they have never in their history gone back and released a major update for a discontinued box. In fact the only precedent for this new S3 release is when they released an update for S1 units, many years after they were discontinued, to fix an issue with daylight savings. And that release only contained that one single fix, nothing more.

    As for the downloadable security thing... If that happens, and it's actually possible to update via software, then I expect TiVo to release that software for whatever the current generation box is at that time. If it happens next year then I would full expect them to release it for the Series 5 but not the Premiere units. If you don't like that prospect the I would avoid buying a Premiere right now.

    Dan
     
  19. Aug 24, 2013 #19 of 217
    hbmatt

    hbmatt New Member

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    Anyone heard an update on when TiVo will update the Stream to support MPEG4 video? My cable company also has most of the channels encoded with MPEG4 which means no steaming for me...
     
  20. Aug 24, 2013 #20 of 217
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    We know there is an update coming to enable out of home streaming, so maybe they'll also fix this while they're at it? We don't really know as they don't tend to discuss bugs like this in public.
     

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